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John Michael Greer is a widely read author and blogger whose work focuses on the overlaps between ecology, spirituality, and the future of industrial society. He published the Archdruid Report blog for many years, focusing on many themes that overlapped my own in The Long Emergency and Too Much Magic. He has moved on to a new blog, Ecosophilia, which explores spiritual and intellectual repercussions of the collapsing industrial paradigm. This conversation is based on his recent blog, “Hate is the New Sex.” He currently lives in East Providence, Rhode Island, with his wife Sara.

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About James Howard Kunstler

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James Howard Kunstler is the author of many books including (non-fiction) The Geography of Nowhere, The City in Mind: Notes on the Urban Condition, Home from Nowhere, The Long Emergency and the four-book series of World Made By Hand novels, set in a post economic crash American future. His most recent book is Living in the Long Emergency; Global Crisis, the Failure of the Futurists, and the Early Adapters Who Are Showing Us the Way Forward. Jim lives on a homestead in Washington County, New. York, where he tends his garden and communes with his chickens.

15 Responses to “KunstlerCast 293 — Hate Is the New Sex, featuring John Michael Greer”

  1. GaiaCracker August 17, 2017 at 12:31 pm #

    I think some of this podcast is spot on. I do think that identity politics and the holier than thou cultural shaming is problematic at times, but sheesh, one of Mr. Kunstler’s examples to back up his point is itself quite shameful. His reference to Emma Sulkowicz, a woman who was anally raped at Columbia, not believed (at least not enough for action to be taken), despite other women coming forward with similar stories, is not an example Kunstler should have used.

    And because of this attitude, women who have been raped (which is statistically over a quarter, and if you include unreported, it is probably between a third and a half…..oh, and less than 20% of rapes are prosecuted with less than 3% resulting in incarceration) are going to be unable to listen to any other point you make, no matter how valid they may be. And you wonder why there are so few female allies on the peak oil scene. In the pursuit of going after the leftwing PC culture, the right and others like Kunstler, have swung so far in the opposite direction, that not only have they become shamers themselves, but apologists for any and everything that white males get called out for.

    • Good point, if Kunstler can arrange Emma Sulkowicz to come on the podcast to discuss why our culture has no future I’d be willing to double my Patreon donation.

      I have zero doubts she would be unwilling to discourse as she is an artist and mass communication is her medium… as long as the subject of her rape story is completely excluded as a topic of conversation.

      Besides apocryphal stories, who knows anything of Sulkowicz’ views on anything. Just a constant fascinated rehashing of meaningless points of reference to a story no one will ever care much about disappearing into the void of internet past.

  2. thenuttyneutron August 17, 2017 at 4:34 pm #

    I graduated 13 years ago from a “good” university with an engineering degree. I don’t recall having extra time to make mischief because I was either in class, studying, working a part time job, and performing the bare minimum tasks required to maintain my health. Soon after graduating I was working a shitty job for 10 years that paid well. I lost track of time because I lived those 10 years of my life as a zombie working a rotating shift work schedule similar to the Dupont 12 schedule with tons of overtime. The only reason that my employer did not work me more than 54 hours average per week was because of Federal regulations.

    Look at the stuff going on today in our schools. I wonder how much of this nonsense going on in the universities today are the result of too many people with nothing productive to do in too small of an area. Maybe these kids need to have their ease of access to student loans, the modern indentured servant, cut and encouraged to get a job. It is hard to get into trouble when you are working to make a living.

    • TiredOfTheTreadmill August 18, 2017 at 9:19 am #

      Sorry, but your whole “I had to work so hard at being an obedient college student then work shitty jobs to cause trouble” shtick sounds just like the whole whiny victimization crap addressed in this podcast. I realize that a large segment of our society equates busyness to earn money as the most noble endeavour humans can accomplish. These are the people who yell “get a job” to anyone they deem as doing something nonproductive, a great sin to the busybodies. However, if all of this too busy working to cause trouble effort is going toward furthering the goals of “the greatest misallocation of resources in history”, as claimed by JHK, then is all of this busyness really noble?

      Coming from a family of workaholics and working with such people for decades, I have concluded that the vast majority of workaholics are the most boring, uncreative people on Earth. But they will be the first to drone on and on about how hard they work while condemning anyone and anything they consider sub par. Here’s your hero badge. Pin it on your chest already.

      • mow August 20, 2017 at 8:35 am #

        you must be a lot of fun during family reunions

    • JHK is right. Our society and culture have no future. So what did anyone expect?

      This generation was handed the baton and told to ignore the cliff they are running off.

    • Chori March 31, 2018 at 6:54 pm #

      I believe the college really matters. Only a handful of people achieve great success. I’m sure, the reason isn’t the lack of the college education. Mere mortals can use services like this that provide college assistance and they can be engaged with favorite hobby at the same time to succeed

  3. mtwilson August 17, 2017 at 5:21 pm #

    I am a US citizen, living outside the bubble of the American public (in Peru). Like JHK and JMG I am appalled at the lack of cogent, well articulated rhetoric (now called debate) going on in my homeland. The “PC” culture has polluted all aspects of political discourse in the US (both “left” and “right”) and in the wider western world to the point of gibberish.

    Living outside the bubble really provides a clearer lens with which to view this phenomenon, but I can’t help but to believe it is is all part of some contrivance to keep Americans and Europeans at each others throats while the real dismantling of western culture is afoot.

    Who raped whom (and I will put in the disclaimer that I believe rape to be a heinous crime that needs to be prosecuted with vigor) and what politician said what is a distraction of the most dangerous kind.

    We are at a critical point in human history where a relatively small cabal of corporatists, bankers and phony politicians are driving us over a cliff.

    Our attentions need to be fully and expressly placed on them and all that support them, the corporate media comes to mind.

    Thanks for the thoughtful discussion gentleman.

  4. Walter B August 17, 2017 at 11:14 pm #

    Another great podcast Jim, thank you. I do not know if you understand how difficult it is today to find intelligent conversations with other human beings, and for those of us who have a hard time finding these, your work is especially uplifting. Again, thank you.

  5. Prole No More August 18, 2017 at 11:57 am #

    The whole dynamic of political correctness, victimization, hate and social justice seems misdirected with horizontal targets of scorn.

    The reality for most American citizens is that their real tormentors are the 1% which are also known as Oligarchs, Plutocrats, Kleptocrats, Corporations and Banks.

    Until those afflicted wage their rage towards those in power and control, nothing significant will change.

    But then, the 1% know that as well and ensure agita is maintained with confusion reigning supreme.

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    • HappyMotorist August 19, 2017 at 12:14 am #

      As John pointed out, even though JHK kinda missed it, it is not the top 1%, it is the top 20%.

  6. chipshot August 18, 2017 at 12:52 pm #

    In complete agreement. If “the 99% vs the 1%” doesn’t become the lens through which we view politicians, elections and politics in general, then we have no hope. Most likely too late, anyway, but why not try?

  7. AHtheHumanity August 23, 2017 at 1:11 am #

    Thank you for this pleasant conversation between two reasonable gentlemen.

  8. David Donaldson September 16, 2017 at 5:52 pm #

    I write to take issue with a misleading statement made by Michael Greer, your guest on PC# 293. Greer stated that the tax code encourages job loss through automation by “allowing” businesses to amortize the cost of machinery. All business costs are either expensed or amortized. From a business’s perspective, costs that can be immediately expensed are preferable to costs that must be amortized, because amortized costs force the business to defer the expense to future periods. Costs associated with employment are immediately deductible, therefore, from a tax standpoint, it is more advantageous to pay salaries than to incur the cost of buying machines. So, Mr. Greer is incorrect. The tax code does not encourage automation.

    Greer goes on to point out that the tax code imposes many costs on hiring. I expected him to make the sensible argument that the government might wish to encourage hiring by amend the TC code by reducing those costs, but instead he argued that even more costs should be imposed on employers by adding a tax on employers who automate their businesses. Raising the cost of terminating employees will increase unemployment. That’s not my opinion; it’s what economists have found when they study the economies of countries that have passed laws making it more expensive or difficult to terminate employees. Spain is one example.


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