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Hunky Dory

     Whenever the herd mentality lines up along a compass point leading to “permanent prosperity,” or a yellow brick road lined with green shoots, or something like that, I tend to see the edge of a cliff up ahead. We are now completely in the grips of the deadly diminishing returns of information technology.  The more information comes to us about How Things Are, especially from TV, the more confused or wrong the conventional view gets it.
      A broad consensus has formed in the news media and among government mouthpieces and even some “bearish” investors on the street that “the worst is behind us” in this tortured economy.  This view is completely crazy.  It will only lead to massive disappointment a few weeks or months from now, and that disappointment might easily transmute to political trouble.  One even might call the situation tragic, except a closer look at the sordid spectacle of what American culture has become — a non-stop circus of the seven deadly sins — suggests that we deserve to be punished by history.
     The reason behind this mass delusion is not hard to find: it’s based on wishing, especially the wish to retain all the comforts, conveniences, luxuries, and leisure that had become normal in American life.  These are now ebbing away in big gobs for most of the population — while a tiny fraction of the well-connected pile on ever larger heaps of swag, enjoying ever more privilege. Those in the broad bottom 95 percent were content as long as there was a chance that they, too, could become members of the top 5 percent — by dint of car-dealing, or house-building, or mortgage-selling, or some other venture enabled by easy credit and a smile.  Those days and those ways are now gone.  The bottom 95 percent are now left with de-laminating houses they can’t make payments on, no prospects for gainful work, re-po men hiding in the bushes to snatch the PT Cruiser, cut-off cable service, Kraft mac-and-cheese (if they’re lucky), and Larry Summers telling them their troubles are over. (If I were Larry, I’d start thinking about a move to some place like the Canary Islands.)
     Too many disastrous things are lined up in the months ahead to insure that we’re entering a new phase of history: The Long Emergency.
     Government at every level is worse than broke.
     Our currency, the US dollar, is hemorrhaging legitimacy.
     Inability to service old debt at all levels or incur new debt.
     Bad (toxic) debt lurking off balance sheets everywhere.
     The housing bubble fiasco is far from over.
     Commercial real estate fiasco just getting started.
     Unemployment rising implacably.
     So-called “consumers” unable to consume consumables.
     Crucial energy import supply lines fragile.
     Food supply subject to energy problems and climate abnormalities.
     A world full of other societies who would enjoy watching us fail and suffer.
     When The Long Emergency was published in 2005, I said then that the greatest danger this society faced would be its inclination to gear up a campaign to sustain the unsustainable at all costs — rather than face the need to make new arrangements for daily life.  That appears to be exactly what has happened, and it didn’t happen under the rule of some backward-facing, right-wing, Jesus-haunted crypto-fascist, but rather a “progressive” party led by a dynamically affable young man unburdened by deep cultural allegiance to Wall Street. Barack Obama has been sucked in and suckered.  “Change you can believe in” has morphed into “a status quo you will bend heaven and earth to hold onto.”
     Whatever else you might think or feel about Mr. Obama’s performance so far, this strategy on the broader question of where we go as a nation pulses with tragedy.  What’s remarkable to me, to go a step further, is the absence of comprehensive vision — not just in the president, but in all the supposedly able and intelligent people around him, and even those leaders not in government but in business and education and science and the professions.
     History is clearly presenting us with a new set of mandates: get local, get finer, downscale, and get going on it right away. Prepare for it now or nature will whack you upside the head with it not too long from now.  Attempting to maintain anything on the gigantic scale will turn out to be a losing proposition, whether it is military control of people in Central Asia, or colossal bureaucracies run in the USA, or huge factory farms, or national chain store retail, or hypertrophied state universities, or global energy supply networks.
     These imperatives are so outside-the-box of ordinary experience right now, that to drag them into the arena of politics can only evoke blank stares or nervous giggling. But whether we like it or not, these are the things that will really matter in the years ahead — not whether General Motors can ever make a profit again, or what Target Store’s sales figures are next quarter, or whether the latest high-rise condo-and-gambling complex in Las Vegas will be successfully marketed.
      Here, in the dog days of summer, it seems to me that the situation in the USA is so fundamentally bad, so unpromising, so booby-trapped for failure, that I wonder if there has ever been a society so badly deluded as ours.  We’re prisoners of our wishes, living in a strange dream-time, oblivious to the forces gathering at the margins of our vision, lost in a wilderness of our own making.
     Anything can happen now.  I certainly wouldn’t rule out international mischief as we arc around into fall.  The air is so full of black swans that the white swan now seems like the exceptional thing. Whatever else happens, it sure will be interesting to see the public’s reaction to Wall Street’s announcement of Christmas bonuses.  The folks at Rockefeller Center better be thinking about getting a fireproof tree.
My novel of America’s post-oil future, WORLD MADE BY HAND, is now available in paperback. I am at work on the sequel. 

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About James Howard Kunstler

View all posts by James Howard Kunstler
James Howard Kunstler is the author of many books including (non-fiction) The Geography of Nowhere, The City in Mind: Notes on the Urban Condition, Home from Nowhere, The Long Emergency and the four-book series of World Made By Hand novels, set in a post economic crash American future. His most recent book is Living in the Long Emergency; Global Crisis, the Failure of the Futurists, and the Early Adapters Who Are Showing Us the Way Forward. Jim lives on a homestead in Washington County, New. York, where he tends his garden and communes with his chickens.

393 Responses to “Hunky Dory”

  1. draffen August 3, 2009 at 10:02 am #

    No doubt you have noticed the price of crude going up in lockstep with the stock market “recovery”… Interesting that the news media is not making a big deal out of $70 oil this time around…

  2. TedC August 3, 2009 at 10:10 am #

    Watching the events of the last year – The giveaways to the rich, and the inability to get medical reform passed, has me thinking that we are just too stupid to continue.
    I think the ruling class is bailing out. They are grabbing all they can get, and preparing to hole up somewhere and ‘ride it out’. Peak oil, climate change, collapsing fisheries, etc. – Time to get out of Dodge. They probably hope that their children can emerge to rule in the future.
    I’m planning the same thing, except without the part where I screw everyone else in the process. And the ‘ruling over everyone else’ part.
    I don’t think New England / Upstate New York will be far enough away to survive the fall.
    Good Luck!

  3. so left i'm right August 3, 2009 at 10:12 am #

    IEA Economist Warns of Oil Shortfalls
    “I’m not very optimistic about governments being aware of the difficulties we may face in the oil supply,” – Fatih Birol

  4. marksmith1981 August 3, 2009 at 10:17 am #

    Ive got to admit, from over here in england, it looks more like jims comment of status quo being clung to all costs rather than change we can believe in…. trouble is, most everyone did believe we would get change – now it hasnt happened, what are we all doing about it? We should all be out in the streets – instead we’re still paying our taxes and bending over whilst the wall st and city of london gangs lower our trousers
    Liam Halligan in the Telegraph is calling for glass-steagall 2, alongside other honest commentators. The repeal of glass-steagall, legislation that had prevented financial collapse and depression for 70-odd years, both enabled the debt boom and the financiers to hold us over a barrel when it all went wrong. Yet the seemingly obvious step of re-instating this simple check on the financial system is not being discussed in the political mainstream – is it because the financiers currently own the political mainstream? simon johnson ex-IMF economist certainly thinks so. High time we took it back.

  5. wagelaborer August 3, 2009 at 10:19 am #

    I don’t know if we’re uniquely oblivious.
    Based solely on movie viewing, didn’t the French Court and the Weimar Republic have delusional people who thought that the good times would never stop rolling?

  6. Kenny August 3, 2009 at 10:19 am #

    I have noticed recently in reading newspapers, local or not, the repetitious pattern of page 1 good news touting the housing recovery or the economic recovery. Page 3 runs another story which pretty much contradicts totally the page 1 story. The latter story details the increasingly horrible tale of unemployment and the monstrous specter of millions who are now being booted off the rolls with virtually no recourse. While such contradictions seems obvious to me, no one around me seems to notice and few seem to be taking any action to protect themselves from what strikes me as a very scary thing. While I try to be objective in the face of future unknowns and dislike traversing the terrain in clothing soaked in doom and gloom, I’m faced with what seems to me an obvious fact: Damn it’s raining hard!

  7. wagelaborer August 3, 2009 at 10:23 am #

    It’s not a contradiction. As Jim points out, the increasing misery of the working class correlates with the increasing wealth of the top 1%.
    It has ever been thus. When corporations fire thousands of workers, their stock goes up.

  8. benlomand August 3, 2009 at 10:35 am #

    As a union member, my great hope is the working class will finally say enough is enough. We all have the same thing in common, exploitation by the faceless business class.
    And there are many, many, more of us.

  9. gantech August 3, 2009 at 10:40 am #

    I have been waiting for the other shoe to drop for so long I can’t believe it. I read Jim’s book when it was released. This slow unwinding of everything has taken much longer than I anticipated. This truly is the L O N G emergency.

  10. daisygrrl August 3, 2009 at 10:43 am #

    Is it any wonder that we’re being told by the media that everything is “Hunky Dory” when it is now openly discussed that the corporate owners of media outlets suppress business and political news and views that run counter to their other corporate interests?
    This jaw dropper was on the front page of the NYT this weekend: Fox and General Electric Reach Deal to End A Cable TV Feud.” http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/01/business/media/01feud.html?hp
    Anyway, it would have been a scandal and a jaw dropper back in the old days, when people were still smart.
    It seems the big boyz up the food chain started getting nervous that the Keith Olbermann – Bill O’Reilly fight was beginning to expose ugly truths about both corporate parents, in particular GE’s sales activities in Iran.
    Hearing this, one can only assume that both CNBC and Fox Business is hearing from their corporate bosses: talk about green shoots! talk about corners being turned! talk happy!
    As self-serving and mendacious as all three players in this story are (Olbermann, O’Reilly and the New York “they have weapons of mass destruction” Times, in this instance, at least, they were getting out some information in between their craziness. Now that’s over. And the others will take note.
    We are screwed.

  11. asoka August 3, 2009 at 10:44 am #

    * The oceans will shrink. Deserts expand.
    * Crops will fail; there will be massive starvation
    * Widespread emotional and mental collapse.
    * Increase in crime and violence.
    * Changing weather patterns.
    * War, pestilence, a worldwide plague
    * Mankind will disappear around the year 2001.
    These are the predictions made in the July 29, 1997 issue of the Weekly World News which carried a statement by a spokesperson of the International Association of Psychics saying 92% of their 120,000 members have had the same “end time” vision.
    CFN could become an honorary member, because, quoting from this week’s comment: “Anything can happen now. I certainly wouldn’t rule out…” “a few weeks or months from now” “disastrous things are lined up” “not too long from now” “soon” “might” “if” etc.
    Be very afraid.

  12. Andrew August 3, 2009 at 10:56 am #

    I think the next two things to watch for will be the fall flu season in North America, and exacerbated problems with the world food supply (e.g. how Ug99 has reached the Americas). Both of these events will be hard to gloss over on the front pages.
    Despite the fear and loathing, I’m starting to meet and chat with most of the folks within walking distance. For better or worse, at least I’m beginning to gain knowledge of the local neighbourhood. Who knows – maybe that’s how the critical mass to acknowledge the mess we’re in gets built up – perhaps blogs, articles, and media interviews, etc. are merely examples of diminishing effectiveness in dealing with rebuilding our lifeways.

  13. 3rd Generation August 3, 2009 at 10:59 am #

    I rarely disagree with Jim, however, King Obama is begining to look and act a lot like a young, trim Benito Mussolini to me 9ask Officer Crowley). A neat, well spoken (sometimes when Tel E PromtR is available) mulatto fascist. Should young Benito II continue his current arc, He, along with many of ‘his people’, may end up down-in-the-ditch just like original flavor Benito and his gang did after selling out to Dear Old Uncle Adolph (think Hitler = Wall Street for comparison purposes)did. A victim of his own hubris – judged, sentenced and hung (metaphorically speaking, of course) by his own people.
    Obama could easily be made to slink back to the South Side an abject failure where he came from and even Jackson and Sharpton will snicker…
    Have a Nice Depression. Palin-Franken in ’12?

  14. highrpm August 3, 2009 at 11:00 am #

    I cannot help but wonder what the effects the government’s long term bleeding-heart-for-the-poor entitlements have had on the current generation’s collective mindset. suddenly we all “have a right” to not suffer consequences of… e.g., look at the lunacy of “cash for clunkers” handout; who would have ever thought 10 years ago that the government would be subsidizing the purchase of new cars for its citizens? does the government ever go back and analyze the success/failure of said programs and scale back or jettison those judged failures?
    how many of the middle and upper class bleeding hearts have moved into government funded housing projects to live amongst the disadvantaged and down trodden with the purpose of and giving one-on-one support? (sounds positively evangelistic to me.) i would not want to enter the premises of most of these places i drive by that are 10 years–no, 5 years–or older.
    and now i express my narrow minded, biased and cruel hearted opinion: let’s stop the handouts and go back to the “survival of the fittest”. the real truth of obama’s racist statement about the disproportion number of arrests of blacks and latinos can be determined by stating the racial breakdown of folks living on the buttom rungs of our welfare programs.

  15. dale August 3, 2009 at 11:02 am #

    “Be very afraid” —
    Yes, even when and if the time comes that JHK is right, the timing of such change is impossibly difficult to predict. I would suggest the course of action most appropriate for people right now is pretty much the same as has always been; be wise with your money—-save, always keep a little food on hand, be nice to your neighbors etc.
    What’s going to happen and when is out of any of our knowledge or control.

  16. den111 August 3, 2009 at 11:04 am #

    Thanks again Jim, but they know what they are doing. Profits, Bailouts, and War. It won’t stop until the oil runs out.
    “No End in Sight as Britain Faces ‘Decades’ of War in Afghanistan”
    Govt Hopes to Compare Taliban to KKK
    “…it was going to take “decades” more for the war effort to “ward off the return of the Taliban and al-Qaeda,”

  17. Dave Eriqat August 3, 2009 at 11:05 am #

    I believe all this propaganda – and that’s what it is – about “green shoots” and the “worst is behind us” is simply intended to trick people into spending again, as if the problem is simply a reluctance to spend. After all, 70% of our economy depends on consumer spending, especially since the export of our industrial base seems to be accelerating! The problem, though, which seems to escape the CEOs who live in a rarefied world of unlimited funds, is that “consumers” are tapped out, and all those job losses they are experiencing are certainly not helping.
    Dave – Erstwhile Urban Wanderer

  18. Zev Paiss August 3, 2009 at 11:17 am #

    What has amused me the most with regard to all of this, is the fact that my local daily paper has decided to place the “funny section” right on the front page. I read about how the economy has bottomed out and signs of a recovery are just around the corner. That is surely wishful thinking to help slow the growing stampeed towards the exits when the theater owner finally tells people “yes there really is a raging fire in the lobby.”
    When I read about how some of the larger banks are starting to turn a “profit” I wonder if their accountants are taking into account the little fact that have received tens of billions of dollars from all of us.
    All in all it can be looked at as a very sad joke… the problem is that very few people are laughing.
    Hold on to your hats and tighten your seat belts cause it is going to be quite a ride.

  19. DontWorryBeHappy August 3, 2009 at 11:19 am #

    Oh Nation of Cluster Fuckers,
    Just drive your gas guzzer down to the AutoMALL and get yourself a shiny new something. The new car smell will make you forgit all
    your Gloom and Doomin thoughts. Hurry before the money runs out. Your wife will love you and yer kids will have somethin to play in when that thar petroleum is all dried up. Hell, why not buy a big ole van so if they foreclose on your yuppie mansion, you’ll have something to sleep in for a while.
    Jeez you guys are like turds in KoolAid. Drink up!

  20. Riddick's Ego August 3, 2009 at 11:31 am #

    I believe no person has a true “track” on exactly how, when and why the unraveling of the current Imperial status of the West shall proceed. Is this “Recession” merely a transitory cyclical phase of the capitalistic market system? Is the situation unmasking the fallacy of capitalism as organized robbery and pillage backed by force as opposed to plain pillage backed by mercenaries and armies prevalent from the Dark Ages through colonialism? Obviously, TPTB wish to remain so in all nations and at all levels and the use of symbolism and popular culture rallying points will be key to their survival through mass delusion.
    Interestingly enough, if what the IEA is now admitting is a serious, and unstoppable decline in oil production is anywhere near true; Jim’s Long Emergency may indeed be proceeding as predicted: that is, painfully and excruciatingly slowly. If a torture, the pain is only felt at some breaking point for each prisoner, thus, as one becomes unemployed, loses a family, house, PT Cruiser or whatever, only then does the LE truly kick-in for you. For some reason, perhaps mainly due to the media circuses and commercial neon lights, the masses don’t see the tsunami until it hits them personally. Thus, revolution is rather improbably at this juncture given that TV works fine, one can drive to the grocery and a game and movies are as violent and escapist as ever.
    So how does it play out? Nobody really knows, nobody. Perhaps we do grow back into a “Flip that House” mentality. But if the fisheries/climate change/nuclear proliferation/peak oil/solar flares (lack thereof)/2012-Mayan Calendar/pandemics/crop disease/debt/social security/health care problems are any indicators then we are in for a really bad time of it for real. History teaches us that everything, every nation, empire, civilization, and system will end. Ours will be no different. So personally one must decide where to make their stand, exactly what that stand means and then decide if they could really pull it off when the lights go out, the phone and internet dead, the gas stations empty and the nights get really, really dark and long indeed.

  21. seb August 3, 2009 at 11:35 am #

    G’day, JHK:
    How do I know if I have “herd mentality”? I like hearing people blame themselves for their problems. In this case, the *contract* I had with my country (like The New Deal, okay?) was violated. Even without knowing, you are in with investors; you are a de facto business owner when you thought you were just a homeowner with a job, they preyed upon you. I believe in holding up my end of the bargain, not protecting my family from robbers who operate with a pen, not in a police state. Love comes out of the end of a gun.
    If the other end of this contract is doing what they seem to be doing, all bets are off. It leaves me with a bad taste in my mouth.
    Every one of the two million prisoners in this country already rejected the conventional view. Did they get it right?
    I was just trying to stay free and pay my bills, but nooooo. Now I am angry. I am too old to start over. Every one of you former or current pot smokers without a record turned a blind eye as you smoked out as regards the others who got burned for TWENTY-FIVE YEARS AT A STRETCH! I saw that fucker Eric Clapton playing guitar on TV last night. I look at him and I see TEN THOUSAND FELONIES! If that is how you take care of your family while shattering my dreams, prepare for the worst. There’s hell to pay.
    Jocko says ”Yes”, and I believe him
    When we talk about the things I say
    She hasn’t got the faith or the guts to leave him
    When they’re standing in each other’s way
    You’re tripping back now to places you’ve been to
    You wonder what you’re gonna find
    You know you’ve been wrong but it won’t be long
    Before you leave’em all far behind
    ‘Cause it’s the new Mother Nature taking over
    It’s the new Splendid Lady come to call
    It’s the new Mother Nature taking over
    She’s gettin us all
    She’s gettin us all
    Jocko said ”No”, when I came back last time
    It’s looking like I lost a friend
    No use callin’ ’cause the sky is fallin’
    And I’m getting pretty near the end
    A smoke-filled room in a corner basement
    The situation must be right
    A bag of goodies and a bottle of wine
    We’re gonna get it on right tonight
    ‘Cause it’s the new Mother Nature taking over
    It’s the new Splendid Lady come to call
    It’s the new Mother Nature taking over
    She’s gettin’ us all
    She’s gettin’ us all
    -The Guess Who
    How to Make Methamphetamine

  22. piltdownman August 3, 2009 at 11:37 am #

    The point (and it happened years ago) when News Departments morphed from loss-leaders to profit centers, was the beginning of the end for any chance of honest, clear-headed journalism, particularly on television.
    Today, EVERYTHING is ruled by what will generate the best “numbers,” and that certainly isn’t going to be “bad news.” People WANT to be told everything is OK, so that’s what the commentators tell them. It’s sort of a meta-version of “mean people suck,” that popular, moronic concept that anything other than happy talk and positivism is evil.
    Add to this that most TV reporters (“talent”) are culled from the pretty class, rather than the smart class, and you have a recipe for frivolous news.
    And I might suggest that some of this “need to believe” is tied to the unrootedness that many people experience in our hyper-suburban situation. Without strong family ties, lacking casual community connectedness, TV news becomes a sort of “1984” Big Brother; always on and always ready to tell you what you want to hear.
    As to Obama and the rest of his administration? They are, to my mind, replaying the George Bush experience post 9/11. At that moment, Bush could have rallied a nation and possibly the world. But he and Cheney and their mendacious buddies just used it to forward their personal agendas.
    And now here comes Depression 2.0 and Obama is handed the same opportunity. He should stand up to Wall Street and read them the riot act, he should blast the lack of transportation options…and a million other things. But he doesn’t. At moments he seems just like Bush, minus the drawl.

  23. dale August 3, 2009 at 12:01 pm #

    reality check……

  24. ozone August 3, 2009 at 12:05 pm #

    The million-pound shit-hammer of karmic retribution is beginning its’ downswing. Absolutely deserved; think of all those denied the basics of survival in order to feed ‘Murka’s insatiable gluttonly. ‘Couldn’t have happened to a better bunch of clueless, uncaring assholes…
    Let the weeding-out begin; this is bound to be very ugly.
    Beware, prepare!

  25. jontradom August 3, 2009 at 12:21 pm #

    You misspelled “implaccably”.

  26. Kris7 August 3, 2009 at 12:30 pm #

    I agree with Jim about nature whacking us if we aren’t prepared. While water, shelter, food and safety are of utmost concern, in addition to those, we should be shedding personal crutches–like caffeine.
    And air conditioning. I don’t want the elderly to do without and perish, but maybe the younger, healthier set should be weaning ourselves off of it. We aren’t doing ourselves any favors by acclimating our bodies to something that may soon be pulled out from under us.
    If we have a choice to come down easy or go cold turkey, why choose to add “withdrawal” on top of the rest of the mess? We need all the focus we can muster.
    Karmic retribution, indeed.
    Working hard at http://www.sccworlds.com

  27. SOP August 3, 2009 at 12:32 pm #

    How bad is this Mass Delusion to” sustain the unsustainable at all costs “….?
    Read (and then weep) the following discussion on The Oil Drum:
    “How Much Natural Gas Do We Have to Replace Gasoline?”
    Clearly, the Peak Oil Crowd is celebrating the delusion that we can continue driving cars for another couple of decades using natural gas instead of gasoline.
    It’s clear the current Mass Delusion has firm control of not only the minds of our leaders, but also the minds of the supposedly informed and intelligent minority of citizens.
    I think it’s time to take a personal Long Emergency Vacation to my own personal Waldon’s Pond to wait until the Sleepwalkers are finished killing and eating eachother.

  28. ariel55 August 3, 2009 at 12:33 pm #

    Dear JHK,
    Thank you for the Monday morning “”wake-up call”!
    I need to have my sanity confirmed or I may “lose
    it” to the mass media propaganda machine! I actually enjoyed “Hunky Dory”. I may say that the next time someone asks me how I am…Thanks for the post!

  29. asoka August 3, 2009 at 12:40 pm #

    Den111 said: “Thanks again Jim, but they know what they are doing. Profits, Bailouts, and War. It won’t stop until the oil runs out.”
    Doesn’t the definition of a clusterfuck imply that there is no “they” and “they” are not intentionally “doing” anything?
    Oh, and I’m glad to hear war will end when the oil runs out. (I do wonder about those thousands of years of wars before oil came on the scene)

  30. bruciejo August 3, 2009 at 12:40 pm #

    Interesting NYT article yesterday on the extension of unemployment benefits! Required reading for every politician should be the 5 pages of comments! We are sitting on a time bomb, with the clock ticking!

  31. dale August 3, 2009 at 12:42 pm #

    I’m curious about the following quote from oil drum:
    “The U.S. currently consumes 390 million gallons of gasoline per day. (Source: EIA). A gallon of gasoline contains about 115,000 BTUs. (Source: EPA). The energy content of this much gasoline is equivalent to 45 trillion BTUs per day. The energy content of natural gas is about 1,000 BTUs per standard cubic foot (scf). Therefore, to replace all gasoline consumption would require 45 billion scf per day, or 16.4 trillion scf per year.”
    My question is; since gasoline (by my understanding) contains far more BTU’s than is burnt during combustion by a typical car, and natural gas is far more completely burned by the same method, are these figures accurate regarding relative replacement?
    Of course, there are several other factors which would seem to mitigate against a one-to-one comparison such as; you wouldn’t need to expend horsepower running air pollution gear, horsepower of cars could be dramatically less etc.

  32. david mathews August 3, 2009 at 12:46 pm #

    Well, at least JHK isn’t attacking Barack Obama in this post …
    This world ain’t perfect and it isn’t going to survive.
    The sooner it ends, the better.
    But Nature works according to her own schedule and not our own expectations.

  33. GeorgeHayduke August 3, 2009 at 12:54 pm #

    As always Jim, a bulls-eye to the heart of the American condition.
    A recent outing to a local street fair confirmed my suspicions that the “Average American” is a clueless, overweight, flag-waving idiot with plenty of me-too tattoos adorning their body, clothes strategically cut to show off those “tats” and little ability or inclination to deal with a potential Peak Oil shitstorm. I am guessing violence will be a big part of the upcoming settling out period. My only concern is that the raging mindless masses will do what so often happens and attack their one-rung-up-the-food-chain neighbors rather than those that really did the damage.
    Personally, I’ve lived outside the mainstream for years and most folks already view me as an alien when I have no clue and absolute apathy about who is winning on American Idol. While I have done all I can to prepare thus far, I plan on avoiding the crowds and the action as much as possible. A more nomadic existence may be the best route for getting through the purging of the masses. At least that’s what I’m figuring so far. Good luck to the posters here in dealing with the days ahead!

  34. melakon August 3, 2009 at 1:02 pm #

    Mr. Kunstler—
    I have read The Long Emergency and your weekly commentary and I really enjoy them. It might surprise you to know that I am a Christian (Jesus-haunted is I believe how you label us). It would be refreshing if you didn’t think there are only 2 types of Christians out there… the crypto-fascist Dubya supporters, or the Uber-Liberal Catholic Fr. Pfleger wannabees.
    Have you ever been on Medved?

  35. twessels August 3, 2009 at 1:15 pm #

    My local newspaper printed a report of Treasury Secretary Geithner’s recent foreign trip to market U.S. debt…apparently not too successfully either. Here lies the straw that will break the camels back. Last year Treasury had to sell roughly $3B of U.S. debt each working day to cover the Federal budget deficit and the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. So that came to roughly $755B in 2008. In 2009 the Federal budget deficit plus the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan will reach a total of $2.1T. If you do the math you will see that Treasury now needs to sell $9B of U.S. debt each working day. Everyone needs to triple down on U.S. debt in 2009 to keep the game going. Well, it isn’t going to happen as most of the likely sources for buying U.S. debt either can’t or won’t be able triple their purchases. This leave the Fed as the debt buyer of last resort. And if the Fed does get stuck with the tab it will be game, set and match for the U.S. and the dollar.

  36. ASPO Article 1037 August 3, 2009 at 1:16 pm #

    Tried to comment on BNET (Actual article on Fatih Birol warnings) but could not, so attaching this way…).
    The discussion included alternative energy/transport imperatives, as seen in Jim’s writings, Richard Heinberg, etc. Lots to see in the (Robert L.) “Hirsch Report to Congress on Peaking Oil”, and 2007 Update of same.
    Status quo railway net is certain part of Peaking solution set. Learn the territory with US Rail Map Atlas Volume (spv.co.uk) for your respective locale. Share with county planners, State DOT.
    Effective way to broaden the scope of railway rehab in an orderly way, recommission Army/Guard Rail Logistics units, providing pool of rail savvy personnel, and “foster parents ” for branchline rehab in respective areas of responsibility. Get Van Fleet’s rail logistics booklet from Association Of American Railroads (202-639-2100.
    Van Fleet writes in Dated but prescient (homeland attack, folly of import oil dependence, need for rail in disaster recovery -Katrina!-) little book, helpful for new generation National Guard office adjutants.
    Christopher C. Swan’s “ELECTRIC WATER” offers compendium or renewable and electric mobility methodologies. (peakoil.net) articles 374 & 1037 offer some guidelines for policymakers and local activists too.
    A note to the Gold Bugs and the survivalists: Govbernments always call in the gold on the way down, just a thought. Would a better use for hoarded wealth include investment in/ownership of robust victuals distribution network near your location? How would the younger partners vote?

  37. Funzel August 3, 2009 at 1:25 pm #

    cash for clunkers,bad deal.
    But when you compare the Bankster,AIG,GM and all the other corporate welfare programs,it’s a drop in the bucket.
    So before you obese,well fed republican,howler monkeys start with your propaganda,I suggest you learn what decency and integrity mean,while trying to be a contributing member of a civilized society.

  38. ChrisB August 3, 2009 at 2:02 pm #

    Hi Jim,
    Good Article. The bank bail-outs are causing all kinds of public outcry here in the UK.
    I was introduced to this blog by a friend, and have found your views both interesting, funny, and informative.
    Still, the mainstream media are starting to look at peak oil (well, at least one newspaper is):-
    Looking at the comments after the article, it looks as though the ‘peak oil is a myth’ brigade far outnumber the ‘oilers. God help us….

  39. seb August 3, 2009 at 2:09 pm #

    He misspelled implacably, but since you corrected it wrong, you are way up the exponential on how much of an ass you are.

  40. sergei nechaev August 3, 2009 at 2:12 pm #

    yet another brilliant analysis by Mr. Kunstler. Interesting that there has been little attention paid in the English speaking world to the writings of Prof. Santiago Niño Becerra. His view that the “recovery” touted so widely now is a total fake-out is being taken seriously by elite circles in continental Europe, as this translation of an article in a leading Scandinavian business newspaper last week illustrates:
    Professor: Financial Crisis Will First Explode in 2010.
    If you think the financial crisis is beginning to recede, then think again. It will only seriously begin in 2010 – and will be brutal, if one believes Spanish economics professor Santiago Niño Becerra whose doomsday prophecy is now being taken seriously. The Professor’s bleak prophecy has been issued in book form and has become a bestseller in his home country and has attracted attention from outside Spain’s borders
    Farewell to the middle class and hello to a society composed of a tiny elite and an enormous underclass. That’s what’s awaiting us when the real crisis occurs in 2010. Right now we are still at the outer margins of this crisis.
    “We find ourselves in the ‘pre-crisis’ that will last from September 2007 to July 2010, a phase where it goes up and down, but mostly down. The stock market will fall and rise, the same with unemployment, and some – mainly politicians- will assert we are on the right track” the 58-year-old professor told berlingske.dk
    He has been called both “the prophet of the crisis” and “the fool on the hill” for his controversial statements. But according to the Spanish professor of economic structural analysis, what we find ourselves in is not a normal recession but a so-called systemic crisis, which will shake capitalism to its foundations.
    When the governments’ financial stimulus programs are exhausted, then the real systemic crisis will begin, he says.
    “The positive tendencies are due to the governments pumping enormous amounts of money out into the system. When there is no more left – when they can no longer finance their debt, then we will fall over the precipice. A global fall that will last at least two years and will not stop until all, as with a fire, is consumed. Then will follow a couple of years of stagnation before the economy slowly begins to grow again, but under a completely different set of conditions. It will be brutal and terrible […]
    When the crises’ fires are extinguished, it will have devoured much iof the social structure that we have in the West. Accodring to the Spanish professor, the middle class will have all but disappeared and society will consist of a small elite group called “insiders” and an enormous underclass, “outsiders”.
    “Among the outsiders there will be some who occasionally have work, or work part-time. A large group will be completely marginalized, while a minority of super-productive & highly-trained specialists will form an overclass” […]
    Ther future will show whether “prophet” or “fool” best describes this – under any circumstances- copntroversial professor.
    unauthorised translation of:
    Professor: Finanskrisen eksploderer først i 2010
    27-07-2009 14:04 af Johnny Minor Mørup

  41. SOP August 3, 2009 at 2:30 pm #

    I think if you read that thread you will probably find an answer to your question.
    But PLEASE understand – that particular Oil Drum thread is nothing more than another back-of-the-envelope/napkin calculation that has no meaning whatsoever in the ‘real world’ (no geopolitical considerations, no logistical considerations, no monetary-system collapse considerations, no “restricted for government/military use” consideration… etc, etc).
    It is meant purely as an excersize in intellectual masterbation. I believe the thread’s author, Robert Rapier, admits as much in one of is own posts in that thread.
    I think that the majority of Oil Drum regulars are now doing little more than complacently contemplating their navels as the world collapses in slowmotion around them.
    The Oil Drum will probably be renamed “Deck Chairs On The Titanic.com” in the not-too-distant future.

  42. cowswithguns August 3, 2009 at 2:56 pm #

    Great line: “Whatever else happens, it sure will be interesting to see the public’s reaction to Wall Street’s announcement of Christmas bonuses. The folks at Rockefeller Center better be thinking about getting a fireproof tree.”
    We could only be so lucky. I fear that even such an announcement would be unlikely to get the American cows motivated enough to try to take back their country.
    I hang around with a fairly educated, progressive group of people. But yet, any mention that the so-called green shoots are green for only the rich gets me a scolding and a pleading to “be positive.”
    If that’s their reaction, how are the NASCAR-loving, less-progressive masses going to react.
    They won’t, I’m beginning to fear.

  43. Davis Tucker August 3, 2009 at 3:09 pm #

    Now wait a minute. I read that natural gas article over at TOD as saying that “this isn’t an alternative either,” etc., etc., primarily with reference to the Boone Pickens plan.
    The Oil Drum is hardly rearranging deck chairs. They’re the most rigorous analysts out there, and they seem to be doing it because they give a shit about the direction of humanity.
    If you think you can do better, then by all means do so.
    However, I tend to think that we need to support the actors in this community, like JHK, like ASPO, like TOD, like Post-Carbon who are trying to inform and educate and help craft more sustainable systems.
    At least they’re doing something, which more than I can say about a bunch of trolls sitting around masturbating onto their screens.

  44. norlight August 3, 2009 at 3:12 pm #

    A real nasty situation left off the list of problems is the oncoming state budget deficits that are being masked or mitigated by the stimulus. It totals nearly $350B. There isn’t going to be much of anything left once the cutting really starts.

  45. 3rd Generation August 3, 2009 at 3:13 pm #

    Wow, SEB, now That is a Real humdinger: “Love comes out of the end of a gun.” Nice Gonzo sentence!
    as for Cash for Clunkers, now what could be More American? A cash bribe, a scam and a sceme, the program has it all… In a time of economic crisis, personal and household bankruptcies, skyrocketing unemployment, job insecurity and general malaise, take a running, servicable and most times paid for transportation device and entice by government bribery the rube/idiot Joe Six-Pack and Jane (boxed) Zinfandel to go BACK into massive debt to acquire a newer massively depreciating asset-transportation device, especially one not made in America, maybe a Hundai? Buy Now, Korea needs YOU. It’s Pure Fucking comedy Genius! Truly, and Purely American.
    I see lots of Love coming for America. Real Soon.
    America, turd world nation of nothing and serial nobodies. Seig Heil!

  46. asia August 3, 2009 at 3:16 pm #

    ‘ fairly educated, progressive group of people’
    educated does not mean insightful
    progressive means backward looking at this point
    others here today have already mentioned geitner, unemployment benefits running out,states tapped out
    republicans, dems.left dems that like Obama..all live in a fools PARROTdise

  47. marcyincny August 3, 2009 at 3:17 pm #

    If, as I’ve read, unemployment insurance runs out for 650,000 Americans next month surely there will be repercussions that no one can ignore?

  48. asia August 3, 2009 at 3:21 pm #

    ‘The reason behind this mass delusion is not hard to find: it’s based on wishing’
    NO,,,,its from indoctrination…via the media/rap/ads/ film/american idol/whatever

  49. keithishere August 3, 2009 at 3:21 pm #

    I have been a peak oilier for a few years and it’s been quite an adjustment in my thinking. The first issue to deal with is depression caused by the bleak facts of the situation. My depression lasted about a year. Next one has to adjust to is the fact that only bookish types who have a predilection for believing in mans folly and the collapse of society can accept the bleak truth of the situation. Most people prefer to rearrange their mental perceptions of facts rather than deal with them if they are unpleasant. It would all be a fascinating human drama if we had the time to adjust to the cornucopia of problems needing solution. But as it is the situation is rendered twice as horrible as it would otherwise be because human nature will keep its collective head in the sand until the die-off gets personal and hunger comes home. By then it will be too late to stop the early death of billions and all those who choose ignorance will have blood on their hands, perhaps their own.
    A similar situation happened in Nazi Germany.
    “First they came for the Communists, but I was not a Communist so I did not speak out. Then they came for the Socialists and the Trade Unionists, but I was neither, so I did not speak out. Then they came for the Jews, but I was not a Jew so I did not speak out. And when they came for me, there was no one left to speak out for me.”
    Dietrich Bonhoeffer
    I find the quote quite appropriate since there are so few willing to challenge a status quo which can only result in death if we don’t change our ways.

  50. asia August 3, 2009 at 3:28 pm #

    ‘gets me a scolding and a pleading to “be positive.” ‘
    does the term TAX N SPEND democrats ring a bell?
    some think ‘things’ can be fixed
    throw $$$ at the ‘ problem’

  51. zwick August 3, 2009 at 4:03 pm #

    Live by the sword, die by the sword. Once a society starts down the primrose path of “helping” or “fairness” it is heading straight into the loving arms of Socialism. Not that it’s a bad thing to be a Socialist (I am). But when that idea is perverted to serve the rich, as it has in Amerika, then it’s a bad idea. No, that is not a contradiction. If it’s Socialism you want, then go all the way. If it’s Capitalism, then, again, go all the way. This mess that we are currently experiencing now is the worst of both, to the detriment of the working and poor classes. It’s a lie. And the worst kind of lie, as it serves no one well, and will inevitably lead to a bloodbath in this country to rival all those that preceded it in history. The main feature of this bloodbath will be a race war. This is my personal nightmare. You want Capitalism? Good, then let the system totally crash, right now, and pick up the pieces and rebuild (and yes, there will be racial strife in this event). You will have Peak Oil with Capitalism, too, it just will be harder to deal with. Now, if you want Socialism, then have the control economy(the Government) take over ALL things, especially housing and food production. No racial strife because at least people are fed and have a roof over their heads. And you will have Peak Oil with a control economy, too, and easier it would be to handle. Folks, the path we’re now will only lead to chaos and bloodshed on a epic scale. Like Gerald Celente said…when people have nothing left to lose, they lose it. I know i’m pissing into the wind here, and it’s too late to do massive change before the disaster hits, but I figured it was worth pointing out.

  52. Ed Nauseum August 3, 2009 at 4:08 pm #

    David, help me understand how one posts pictures of the beauty in nature and then writes this:
    “This world ain’t perfect and it isn’t going to survive.
    The sooner it ends, the better.”

  53. draffen August 3, 2009 at 4:21 pm #

    Gantech, you are right, it looks at this point in time that the Long Emergency is unwinding slowly. Don’t let that fool you! There is a lot of built in “inertia” in the business-of-usual model of industrial society with its 24-7 media, jobs, school, soccer matches, government, etc. going about its usual business with a blind eye to anything beyond the immediate “foreseeable” future which is in effect a mirror of the recent past.
    The BAU model of industrial civilization is hitting some resistance, however and starting to lose some of that inertia. The unemployment, budget deficits, foreclosures, bankruptcies, etc. are the first layers starting to peel off this thing as it re-enters the sphere of hard reality. There are more layers to go and each layer gets more painful.
    The American dream is still holding on to diminishing returns and running through that pain hoping some magical “solution” will appear that will “fix” things and keep “economic growth” humming along for decades to come. The days are numbered though.
    At some point, almost certainly within the next five years we will hit one of those “tipping points” where everything goes over a cliff most abruptly and business as usual gets turned on its head. The week that the first “No Gas” signs appear at gas stations across the country and the electricity starts to blink out and the internet goes down unexpectedly we will know we are falling into the abyss. This thing has a l-o-n-g way to fall…

  54. messianicdruid August 3, 2009 at 4:23 pm #

    It seems rather improbable for one to “be very afraid” of ones situation while maintaining obliviousness in it, so given a choice few choose to terrorize themselves. The middle ground is simply to move off the train tracks.
    A good read here on the Waterfall Effect:

  55. dale August 3, 2009 at 4:30 pm #

    Apparently, the “Oil Drum” isn’t predicting collapse SOON enough for SOP. I don’t really have a dog in that fight, I just thought I’d find out if anyone on the doomer side was actually rigorous enough to question the extrapolation of figures being presented in that quote.
    Unfortunately, positions become so entrenched on these blogs, whatever the issue, that all too often disagreeing with anyone is a bit like talking to a “birther” about Obama’s Americanism.
    While the doomers here definitely make good points at times, their insistence that everything is cast in stone and they can predict the date of collapse down to the minute, tends to diminish their argument more than support it.
    Please try your best not to answer with a string of insults, (the all to often doomer response of the last few months), I’m trying to enjoy the absence of Rico and OEO for as long as it lasts, which I predict will not be long enough.

  56. SNAFU August 3, 2009 at 4:34 pm #

    Dale said “My question is; since gasoline (by my understanding) contains far more BTU’s than is burnt during combustion by a typical car, and natural gas is far more completely burned by the same method, are these figures accurate regarding relative replacement?”
    Modern computer controlled internal combustion engines expel very little unburned fuel in their exhaust, else they would not meet emission constraints. The efficiency of an IC engine (about 20%) is based on a number of considerations primary among them is compression ratio. Contrary to what may drivers think, octane rating reduces the burning rate of gasoline which allows an engine designer to increase the compression ratio. The higher the compression ratio the greater the efficiency of the combustion conversion to mechanical motion. In the US there are now two standard octane rating for gasoline 87 and 92; natural gas however, has an inherent octane rating of about 130. An engine designed with a high compression ratio to take advantage of the very high octane rating of natural gas could possibly produce an efficiency of 25-30% or more. NG produces fewer BTU per combusted pound than gasoline but as it is apparently priced per BTU it’s potential efficiency increase could render it more cost effective than gasoline in a properly designed engine. It is unlikely that simply converting the fuel delivery system on an engine designed to run on gasoline to to burn NG would produce economic gain. Likelihood is that if large quantities of NG were diverted to transportation use the price would rise rapidly.

  57. Poet August 3, 2009 at 4:37 pm #

    Jim, what you are describing is also known as magical thinking. Dreamers realize that it takes effort to make their desires happen–magical thinkers live in their illusions suppossing that if they just wish long and hard enough in their minds it will happen.
    Chris Hedges has written a thoughtful analysis of this culture titled “The Empire of Illusion: The End of Literacy and the Triumph of Spectacle”.

  58. dale August 3, 2009 at 4:43 pm #

    Good answer, so if I understand you correctly, the efficiency of the NG would be about 25% to 50% higher than gasoline with a properly built or tuned engine? (in terms of the comparison being made in the quote)
    I’m not making any claims based on that assumption, if my understanding is accurate, but it would be nice if the author of that quote had the scientific and intellectual honesty to include that fact in his post. That’s a big difference, and changes his quantities considerably.
    That’s the sort of thing that bothers me about too many of the doomer arguments, they are not intended to inform, but to convice, and with that bias, accomplish neither.

  59. John L August 3, 2009 at 4:49 pm #

    Oh this whole debacle is most carefully engineered.. as Machiavelli once said, “.. If you wish to deprive a people of their liberties, create the conditions in which they demand you do so…”. If one bothers to read some of the lit. on the various players, you’ll see the blueprint laid out, the predicted failure and the rationale for doing so. In the sixties, we “got” the big picture with “a little help” from our “friends” in altered states. Need the same perspective now to read between and above the lines to catch this one… but the game plan is there. Media is, as Chomsky says, there for “manufacturing consent”. If your looking to our lords and masters(economic) to tell you the truth about what is happening, good luck. People are actually going to have to “THINK” about this current economic reality! (Damn what a novel concept!).

  60. Chaz Valenza August 3, 2009 at 4:50 pm #

    Jim, Thanks for putting “consumers” in quotation marks. I state my case for remonstration against this pejorative term and the psychology it provokes on my website: http://www.WordsWillNever.com
    in a posting titled Big Greed’s Dream.
    Big Greed loves the fact that the aggregate noun for the U.S. population of all ages is consumers. Babies are consumers, showered with a swag bag of offers for goods and services at the moment of birth. The dying are the best consumers of medical services, for example.
    The term consumer makes you into nothing more than a machine that devours goods and services. It’s dehumanizing. It implies that you are indiscriminate and insatiable, a glutton with little redeeming value and you deserve the rawest of raw deals. The consumer as parasite.

  61. george August 3, 2009 at 4:53 pm #

    I can’t agree more fully with Jim’s comments about wishing and fantasy overtaking reality, especially from this jaded observer up here in The Great White Deluded North. Canadians are every bit as economically and morally bankrupt as their southern neighbors, but to listen to the national news media up here, you would think that prosperity was just around the corner. At least Americans had the intelligence and foresight to kick out those mentally-challenged Republicans in the last election. Canadians, by contrast, foolishly decided to stick with the status quo and pretend that the brain-dead Conservatives were better leaders than their blood brothers in the Republican Party.

  62. zzzzzz August 3, 2009 at 4:54 pm #

    “If, as I’ve read, unemployment insurance runs out for 650,000 Americans next month surely there will be repercussions that no one can ignore?”
    Not a problem. Unemploy ins. will be extended. One need only snap their fingers and it will be done.

  63. dave August 3, 2009 at 5:00 pm #

    “At least they’re doing something, which more than I can say about a bunch of trolls sitting around masturbating onto their screens.”
    but jerking off is fun; and i clean my screen at least once a day. why can’t we just be friends?

  64. dale August 3, 2009 at 5:06 pm #

    Reminds me of a book published in the late 70’s, “The Last of the Redwoods”, written to convince us that we must take drastic action now, to save the remaining stands. I’m not hearing a lot about that now, I suspect most people here think there will be Redwoods around long after humans are gone.
    Back then, I would tell people “don’t worry, there are still plenty of Redwoods left, they are not going to disappear”, a few would howl with indignation at my apparent insensitivity on the issue.
    What I learned from the experience was; if you want to get laid, don’t disagree with a woman who is conviced of an idea, no matter how unfounded her conviction might be. 😉
    This is not to say that PO or whatever your cause is, is not realistic or possible, I’m afraid PO (and very negative outcomes) are all too possible, but just keep in mind that such causes are ALWAYS over hyped, and we’re all capable of not seeing the forest for the …..redwoods.

  65. Danm August 3, 2009 at 5:19 pm #

    who would have ever thought 10 years ago that the government would be subsidizing the purchase of new cars for its citizens?
    The car has been subsidized for the last few decades. It’s not new.
    What’s new is that Americans are now on the verge of realizing that what they had was never pure free market capitalism.

  66. zzzzzz August 3, 2009 at 5:23 pm #

    Reply to earlier Kenny-boy posting:
    “The cost I was identifying for the suture anchor was comparable to your identification of a $25 charge for a 1 cent aspirin. Interesting that you consider yourself eminently qualified to make that contention but that I am not qualified to likewise assert that $500 charged for 10 cents worth of stainless steel wire with 2 cents worth of suture…”
    Correct, numbnuts you are not. I, as every person on this post have purchased aspirin. It is apparent that charging $25.00 for aspirin is out of line. You know nothing of the components used in your surgery. You merely cite a layman’s conjecture. It is based on nothing.
    “…remind me to never go to your mechanic. $36 for two spark plugs.”
    I said I paid $36.00 for a set, you fucking MORON. There are 6 in a set.
    “Get real if they lost as much on every Medicare patient as you propose there would be none accepting Medicare patients.”
    Hey, fuck-lips, I didn’t propose anything. I linked you to an article that stated that doctors are only compensated for 60 to 80% of their health services by Medicare. Dat da fact. Then you say:
    “Get real if they lost as much on every Medicare patient as you propose there would be none accepting Medicare patients.”
    Well pea brain, they do lose that much. They take Medicare patients in spite of that. Therein lies the proof that they are not all greedy cocksuckers. Guess you little theory doesn’t hold up.
    Then this:
    “…about half of my meager pension is altruistically used to compensate one of my neighbors to assist me with projects about the farm…”
    If you neighbor is assisting you what is so fucking altruistic about you paying him for his services? You think he should do it for free? You really are an ASSHOLE-A-TARD. Now STFU and go milk your neighbor, retard.

  67. zzzzzz August 3, 2009 at 5:28 pm #

    “It is unlikely that simply converting the fuel delivery system on an engine designed to run on gasoline to to burn NG would produce economic gain.”
    Not so. As NG burns cleaner, maintenance costs decrease and engine life increases.

  68. dave August 3, 2009 at 5:31 pm #

    man, zzzzz is hostile and dale’s a numbnut. somethings never change.

  69. zzzzzz August 3, 2009 at 5:45 pm #

    The only thing that never changes is your underwear, dave.

  70. Anne August 3, 2009 at 5:47 pm #

    Pretty right on, Jim. I read the Long Emergency when it came out, tried to get others to read it and had very little interest from many in my family. Denial is where it’s at for the masses. I just don’t get it, but then I’m an atheist. I’m all for facing the truth, however unpalatable, and making decisions based on reality. They, not so much.
    The main thing to remember, as I keep telling my husband, is that this is the LONG emergency. The status quo will indeed go on as long as they PTB can possibly sustain it or a facsimile thereof.
    IMO, the thing that will push us irrevocably over the cliff edge is when foreign countries stop propping us and our monetary system up. But they are loath to pull out since their own economies and welfare depend on us. It’s a circle jerk right now, but at some point no one’s going to be getting satisfaction anymore, with no hope for any goodies in the future either, at which point it will all fall apart.

  71. OilHasPeaked August 3, 2009 at 6:02 pm #

    “consumers” unable to consume consumables.
    lol Jim!
    Thanks for this weekly dose of sanity via CFN commentary.

  72. agirbizz August 3, 2009 at 6:05 pm #

    Jobs and occupations where people are paid for making and growing things that can be sold to other people at nominal but relatively dependable margins required.
    None of that, with widespread participation, and we wither. In lurches and spurts, but wither for certain.
    The “educated progressives” who have been shown to be so utterly disapointing in the conversations since it should have become evident this past September to anyone with a pulse and a few brainwaves just how precarious matters are want the fascade to remain, more than anyone.
    Who you’d have thought would be the most useful have been proven to be sterile of ideas.

  73. paulie August 3, 2009 at 6:31 pm #

    I feel the powers that be are not going to go softly into the night. I also feel it is not unreasonable to think the government will reinstitute debtor prisons to contain the soon to be gathering disillusioned middle class. The government will corral unemployed,gun owning, ablebody men, who have nothing left to lose, in a last ditch effort to control. It will be ugly for many years. Good luck to all!

  74. bahmi August 3, 2009 at 6:33 pm #

    Jim, week after week you offer this absurd notion that somehow the smartest president in our history, the upcoming world Messiah, is being duped. How wrong you are! This jackass, this pompous idiot that so many stupid Amerikanskis worship, plays some stupid game where he says everything is so E-A-S-Y because he’s simply too smart, smarter than any human ever on this Earth. His posse jumps from lily pad to lily pad, devoid of systematic inquiry and answers. He clearly lacks any semblance of courage in telling Americans that the jig is up and he has no answers. Play politics at our expense, in other words.
    To imply that Obama is somehow being duped is at best pathetic, and devastating at the worst. Obama plays the cards that are most politically correct for his reelection, and screw the country. As if his team of economists has all the answers. Won’t be long until Big Larry tells us he just took another job screwing up some other economy. Get over the notion that Obama is being taken advantage of. He’s not, he’s just too stupid to admit he’s taking the road to nowhere.

  75. Jaego Scorzne August 3, 2009 at 7:15 pm #

    The worst of all possible worlds is Socialism during Peak Oil with an Elite hositle to Whites in power. They will blame us for what greedy White and Jewish businesmen have done and seek vengeance. Fantasy? No, it happened in the Communist Soviet Union. Millions of White Christians were shot, starved or sent to Siberia.
    The people in charge hated Whites particularly Christian Whites. They wanted to own their own farms-enemies of the “people”-as if they weren’t people. Get to a “red” (conscious mind fuck on their part) state and get land. Invest in the three precious metals-gold, silver, and lead. And of course, learn to grow food and live on little.

  76. asoka August 3, 2009 at 7:17 pm #

    Anne said: “The status quo will indeed go on as long as they PTB can possibly sustain it or a facsimile thereof.”
    And that is a good thing because it gives all of us who are so convinced — that the long emergency has begun — time to prepare for the worst. We only have 46 years left.
    Find a community of friends, downsize housing (off grid preferable), and learn to grow food. Love, live, and laugh, but don’t procreate.
    It’s that simple…
    the good news is we do have time because “they,” the PTB, will sustain this house of cards until 2056, another 46 years before it all collapses. (The L_O_N_G process of exhaustion of oil supply that is the Long Emergency)
    Thanks, Anne, your post has given me happiness and inspiration.
    SOURCE of the 46 years left:

  77. Jaego Scorzne August 3, 2009 at 7:27 pm #

    Jared Diamond in his book on Cultures in Crisis says something similar. People have an unfortunate tendency to stick with what they know and when things get bad, they stick even harder. The Vikings Colony of Greenland was dying because the of little ice age ended their herding and farming. They could possibly have learned new ways of living from the Innuit who were coming south. But most of them kept doing what they knew and the colony failed. A few seem to have gone over to the Innuit; the other died in fighting with the Innuit-a warning to people who think that only Whites are territorial or engage in ethnic violence. Hundred were killed yesterday in Nigeria-does anyone think they wouldn’t kill Whites just as readily as they kill Blacks of a different group?

  78. moremi August 3, 2009 at 7:48 pm #

    Yes Anne it is the LONG emergency;these things don’t play out to any particular script or time frame and most people don’t want to exert too much energy trying to figure it out.The status quo will nearly always beat change that might be unpleasant or difficult so we live in hope that the glaringly obvious is just a mirage. Meanwhile the folks pulling the strings are either incredibly stupid or have a pretty good idea of how this all works out; but either way they probably figure that money talks and they’ll be well away when the s*** hits the fan

  79. SOP August 3, 2009 at 7:53 pm #

    Dave Tucker,
    I do not think you read the article in question. Please go do so – especially the “Conclusions” section – and then respond.
    Robert did NOT say, “this (natural gas) isn’t an alternative either,”. In fact he came to the opposite conclusion, that natural gas could displace gasoline for automobiles starting “today.”
    I was not being a “troll” – in the post you are responding too I stated the reasons I felt Robert’s article was of very poor quality (note- usually Robert Rapier’s work is excellent – this one was so bad TOD let it scroll off their front page already!).
    The main problem with Robert’s article, and the reason I think TOD is heading toward “rearranging the chairs on the titanic,” is that Robert did not even mention the wisdom (or lack thereof) of using a precious resource like natural gas for “happy motoring”.
    Like JHK said today: “What’s remarkable to me, to go a step further, is the absence of comprehensive vision … even those leaders not in government but in business and education and science and the professions.”
    Reading Robert’s article at TOD, it’s clear some people will do anything to continue the current delusion of “happy motoring.”

  80. gillslaw August 3, 2009 at 7:56 pm #

    $750 billion in ARM mortgages are due to reset between now and the end of 2010. But I’m sure all the people who signed those mortgages are prepared for their payments to skyrocket. Heck, they can live on their credit cards for a while until they get a better job. Oh wait, credit card delinquincy is at 11%, possibly 12% by the end of the year. Gonna be a blue Christmas for retailers.

  81. abbeysbooks August 3, 2009 at 8:08 pm #

    Don’t worry about all those years of war without oil They were considered the sport of kings. The first War I was the first industrialized war in history. Then it became a mass murder game.
    With the population declining for all sorts of reasons, it will seem absurd to start murdering people en masse. It will go back to tribal murder on an individual basis.
    Darwin will rule.

  82. SOP August 3, 2009 at 8:10 pm #

    Dale, you make too many incorrect assumptions…
    “Apparently the “Oil Drum” isn’t predicting collapse SOON enough for SOP. “
    First, TOD does not “predict collapse.”
    Second, the “doomer” you describe is a strawman I am not familiar with so I will leave you to ponder it by yourself.

  83. asoka August 3, 2009 at 8:20 pm #

    JS said: “a warning to people who think that only Whites are territorial or engage in ethnic violence.”
    Many races have engaged in ethnic and territorial violence. But most are amateurs compared to whites. Whites are supreme murderers.
    When the white man arrived in North America, there were about 5,000,000 native red indigenous people. After 20 years of European occupation, several wars and deliberate hunting and destruction of most of the buffalo herds (the Indian’s primary food supply)… this population dropped to only about 250,000 native Indians.
    When white Europeans landed in Australia, they killed over 40,000 native black aborigines in a deliberate campaign of genocide and slaughter.
    During World War I, over 21 million people died for no good reason. White on white violence.
    During World War II, over 50 million people died, also for no good reason. White on white violence.
    Dem crazy baldheads dropped dem fire bombs in Germany, dropped dem atom bombs on Japan, incinerating thousands of Japanese men, women, and the children, too, dem crazy white men.
    Ask yourself: Which RACE of human beings has proven itself to be the most aggressive, violent and harmful compared to other races of people?
    Which RACE has been involved in more killing and imperial military invasions and occupations of other countries than any other RACE?
    Which RACE most in need of Jah, “I and I”… rastafari… Positive vibration.
    With love, everything be Irie, Mon!
    Jah Love protect us.


  84. abbeysbooks August 3, 2009 at 8:33 pm #

    Jaego it is not race in the examples you used. It is industrialization merging with the aggression that leads to war. War has become industrialized, it is a factory of sorts.

  85. abbeysbooks August 3, 2009 at 8:51 pm #

    I can’t find a translation so I am responding without reading it. What I think he is saying through you is that a paradigm change is coming (Kuhn’s The Logic of Scientific Revolutions) so read him too.
    The slowness comes from those in power unwilling to change. And they won’t. It is just necessary for them to die off for the new paradigm to take over. Unfortunately they are going to take millions with them over the cliff.
    This is what we are seeing now. Obama just sold us on change. He’s an excellent salesman as McCain was in 2000. Both are salesmen. Remember Miller’s Death of a Salesman? It applies.
    Do not stock up on goodies that others will plunder. Learn to live off the land. Any city lot has weeds that are potentially good for eating. Dandelions anyone. Great greens and plentiful. Blossoms for wine. Any city has parks for foraging.
    The rural govts are even stupider than DC. The people in my rural red town don’t know how to garden. They are still digging or using a rotor and seven dust. They will cut their grass and leave it beside their burning barrel while the weeds in their garden proliferate and they are too lazy to weed.
    Last year I grew lots of food. I never had to water or weed once. Plant, pick and eat. I come from the city and have read hundreds of Organic Gardening and Mother Earth. Long ago it used to excite me to read them and I acquired the knowledge out of love. There are many people blogging on these things. For example lay those old lady illusion see through curtains you can pick up at yard sales over your beans and lettuce and what have you and the insects can’t get on them and feast. I told the people who garden and feed everyone at East Wind this as they were using seven dust. This was many years ago and I don’t know what the present gardening experts are doing now.

  86. abbeysbooks August 3, 2009 at 8:56 pm #

    Me too with the depression. It started with Toynbee, continued with Houellebecq and of course David Foster Wallace whom I will love forever. ane we know how he chose to handle his uncompromised perception.

  87. abbeysbooks August 3, 2009 at 9:02 pm #

    Ah the theme of Infinite Jest by David Foster Wallace.
    Behold the emergence of the Entertainment State!

  88. abbeysbooks August 3, 2009 at 9:04 pm #

    You are correct.

  89. abbeysbooks August 3, 2009 at 9:11 pm #

    The software is not nearly so clunky early on in this thread. Wait a few days and it will get worse.

  90. Chichura August 3, 2009 at 9:16 pm #

    I think we are playing on the beach while the tide goes out, picking up all of the sea creatures and fish, oblivious of the fact that a major tsunami is about to strike. The US government is broke and its lenders are getting sick and tired of the extravagance and arrogance. You will all come to remember cheap oil prices as being 100 dollars a barrel. We have a bankrupt government fighting two wars on borrowed money! Time is running out folks for the criminals in Washington! Get your pitchforks ready. Things are going to get really interesting, really soon!

  91. whitehunter August 3, 2009 at 9:16 pm #

    “Barack Obama has been sucked in and suckered.”
    Yes, but years ago.

  92. asoka August 3, 2009 at 9:43 pm #

    Chichura said: “You will all come to remember cheap oil prices as being 100 dollars a barrel.”
    In Iceland gas is over $8.00 a gallon… and still there are traffic jams.
    Chichura said:
    “We have a bankrupt government fighting two wars on borrowed money!”
    That is the way wars are fought. See Vietnam. See the Cold War. See Desert Storm. Eventually the money will be repaid. Or perhaps I should say: Eventually the money will be repaid!
    Chichura said: “Time is running out folks for the criminals in Washington! Get your pitchforks ready. Things are going to get really interesting, really soon!”
    Another soothsayer on CFN. Another morbid fantasizer about violence.
    Do you, too, have a crystal ball?
    The Long Emergency (the downside after Peak Oil) will last at least 46 years according to some estimates.
    “Really soon?” Really.
    How do you know? Maybe the debt will be paid down, the wars will end, and things will get really boring, really soon!

  93. Jaego Scorzne August 3, 2009 at 9:55 pm #

    Blacks think they have a right to attack and kill us-as is clear from Asoka’s post. The Hispanics feel the same way. It will be an existential decison when the shit hits the fan-fight these people and live or give in and die-either as a slave or as dinner. Another option is to flee to the Dakotas or Montana. There one will be away from minorities and after a few months most of them will be dead from disease and war and you might be able to go home.
    Genghis Khan and Tamerland each killed millions of Whites. Shaka Zulu killed hundreds of thousands of other Blacks. He would have killed millons too except his was a smaller and more primitive world.

  94. asoka August 3, 2009 at 10:12 pm #

    JS said: “Another option is to flee to the Dakotas or Montana. There one will be away from minorities”
    Duhhh… We can find Montana and the Dakotas…
    There is no escape from the heathen colored hordes!
    We have Mapquest!
    Montana non-white population: 8.0%
    Dakotas non-white population: 8.5%
    SOURCE: USA Census, 2000
    (percentages are probably higher now thanks to our fine Mexican friends)

  95. Jaego Scorzne August 3, 2009 at 10:16 pm #

    I found a good gardening book called “Gardening When it Counts” by Steve Solomon. From him I learned just how inferior the seeds commonly sold to the public are. Just like everything else in the public square-third class. I found some good heirloom seeds and am getting good results. When I broke soil, I felt an ineffable current of bliss rising from the ground into my body. It was if the Earth itself was pleased and was personally welcoming me. How much more noble than looking at Obama and feeling it in your leg like Chris Mathews. Apparently there have been problems at the rallies with women fainting and losing control of themselves. Obama is Pharoah-an incarnaton not of Amon Ra but of the gods of polical correctness. If he asked White People to kneel in his presence, they would do it.
    Anyway, I’m using an old Indian way of gardening in which you grow the “three sisters”- corn, beans, and squash. The squash keep the ground moist and free from weeds, and the beans can grow up the corn. To begin, you hoe the soil up into a hill and then plant the three crops around the perimeter of the hill. And you feritlize into the center of the hill so it reaches the plants gradually. They say that a good acre of this could provide food for a whole family for a year. It does add up to complete protein.
    Perhaps next year, I’ll cut my arm with a razor and bleed onto the soil before I plant-blood and soil are the roots of any people and their culture. And blood is the life! As Sonia Sotormayor says, “For our Race Everything, for other Races nothing”-the motto of La Raza, The Race.

  96. tcprdg August 3, 2009 at 10:23 pm #

    I’m pretty sure Kubler-Ross missed the Sheep-in-the-Headlights stage.

  97. Jaego Scorzne August 3, 2009 at 10:28 pm #

    We’ll be waiting for you “bro”. You all get lonely right quick without us it seems. Whereas we don’t need you at all…I’ll have to check those numbers-offhand I don’t think Montana or the Dakotas have that many Blacks. I hope not anyway. I love Pennsylvania and I’m going to go on a little vacation some time this month. I was planning to stop in Harrisburg, but then I checked it on city-data.com. It is about 50% Black. So I crossed it off my list. Who wants to go to a slum? Our fault of course. It always is. What you don’t get is that if Blacks can’t do any wrong, that’s another way of saying they can’t do anything right.
    Another hint: if you are in a strange American City, avoid any street called Martin Luther King Avenue or Boulevard. And the area around it. Every year Europeans get into trouble wandering into no-go zones like this. White Liberals, despite their rhetoric, avoid such areas like the plague.

  98. Vladmir Krappeshack August 3, 2009 at 10:31 pm #

    “It’s that simple… ”
    I’d expect that from a simpleton who has a laminated poster of Obama.
    What do you think will happen if things continue for 46 years in a similar vein to now? Food will get EASIER to grow???

  99. CaptSpaulding August 3, 2009 at 10:39 pm #

    People never accept necessary change voluntarily, especially if it is unpleasant The changes that are necessary will only happen when people are FORCED to change by circumstances. Anybody who understands human nature will see the truth in what I’m saying. If you see yourself as living the good life currently, nothing anybody can say will make you use less gas, shop locally, start a garden, get more self sufficient, etc. People regard Kunstler’s solutions as a “pain in the ass”, & the average person will ignore them in favor of living the same way they always have, remaining willfully ignorant of the facts. Reality, however, has a way of making things happen whether the SHEEPLE like it or not. Of course when that happens, the SHEEPLE get ugly because their cherished way of living has been taken from them.

  100. asoka August 3, 2009 at 10:39 pm #

    JS said: “As Sonia Sotormayor says, “For our Race Everything, for other Races nothing”-the motto of La Raza, The Race.”
    Sotomayor never said that. The organization La Raza never said that. Nice try. But you are repeating false propaganda. Don’t repeat what the herd is saying. Don’t repeat what the main stream media is saying. Do some independent research. Go to the source:
    “NCLR’s critics falsely claim that the statement “Por La Raza todo, Fuera de La Raza nada,” [“For the community everything, outside the community nothing”] is NCLR’s motto. NCLR unequivocally rejects this statement, which is not and has never been the motto of any Latino organization.
    NCLR’s work as a civil rights institution is about inclusion and participation in the American Dream, including extensive efforts to assist new immigrants in the process of fully integrating into American life.”
    National Council of La Raza

  101. asoka August 3, 2009 at 10:51 pm #

    JS said: “I’ll have to check those numbers-offhand I don’t think Montana or the Dakotas have that many Blacks.”
    Not that many Blacks: that many non-white minorities.
    And more every year… everywhere in the USA, greatest country in the world.

  102. Figaro August 3, 2009 at 10:57 pm #

    There may be many more of us but we totally lack the weapons for an effective counterattack. We do not control the media, we do not have privileged access to congress, and we do not have the financial resources to withstand a prolonged battle. When we buried ourselves in debt we made effective resistance through strikes impossible. No union worker dares risk his paycheck in these times,
    especially when his wages have been cut.
    If I believed in sinister plots I’d say that corporate America knew exactly what it was doing when it made easy financing so attractive. It was to usher worker peonage.

  103. jim e August 3, 2009 at 11:13 pm #

    -Replying to ASOKA
    “It’s that simple… ”
    I’d expect that from a simpleton who has a laminated poster of Obama.
    Reminds me of these lyrics fom CDaniels, Uneasy Rider.
    I ain’t even got a garage you can call home and ask my wife
    (I said would you beleive this man has gone as far
    as tearin’ Wallace stickers off the bumpers of cars
    and he voted for George McGoveren for president
    well he’s a friend of them long-haired hippie type pinko fags
    I betcha he’s even got a Commie flag
    Tacked up on the wall inside of his garage…)

  104. gday2u August 3, 2009 at 11:13 pm #

    Jim, quit beating around the bush, admit it already , these people are not stupid and clueless, they are EVIL.

  105. Cthulhu August 3, 2009 at 11:21 pm #

    46 years? We have 46 years to go before TSHTF?
    I read the article you linked.
    I quote:
    If world oil consumption continues to increase at an average rate of 1.4 percent a year, and no further resources are discovered, the world’s oil supply will not be exhausted until the year 2056.

    You really think that this means you have 46 more years of happy motoring?
    Exhausted means ‘no more’. Way before then, there will be less oil than needed. Oil will not suddenly stop like God turned off the faucet, it will decline as we approach 2056.
    At some point, TSWHTF. Long before 2056. This is what peak oil means.
    “Are We ‘Running Out’? I Thought
    There Was 40 Years of the Stuff Left”
    Oil will not just “run out” because all oil production follows a bell curve. This is true whether we’re talking about an individual field, a country, or on the planet as a whole.
    Oil is increasingly plentiful on the upslope of the bell curve, increasingly scarce and expensive on the down slope. The peak of the curve coincides with the point at which the endowment of oil has been 50 percent depleted. Once the peak is passed, oil production begins to go down while cost begins to go up.
    In practical and considerably oversimplified terms, this means that if 2005 was the year of global Peak Oil, worldwide oil production in the year 2030 will be the same as it was in 1980. However, the world’s population in 2030 will be both much larger (approximately twice) and much more industrialized (oil-dependent) than it was in 1980. Consequently, worldwide demand for oil will outpace worldwide production of oil by a significant margin. As a result, the price will skyrocket, oil dependant economies will crumble, and resource wars will explode.”

    I read your linked article, how about you read the rest of my linky? ‘kay?

  106. asia August 3, 2009 at 11:37 pm #

    dropping 100 dollar bills out of helicopters !
    meanwhile..where thigs already are hobbsian or draconian………………………………
    Was listening to the radio….china wants to increase its EXECUTIONS from 1300 a year to 10,000 yearly
    Supposedly govt will have a ‘ killing van’…harvest the organs to sell !
    And its at 13,000,000 abortions a year
    …I assume many of them forced…or so late as to not
    be ‘ abortions’ actually

  107. asia August 3, 2009 at 11:41 pm #

    or page one says ‘ economists say things getting better’
    but on page 10 or 20 it has figures…factual data,,,,,,not journalistic spin!
    however with this trillion $ giveaway I agree with JK..its like the usa is in some sort of ‘uncharted’ freefall

  108. asia August 3, 2009 at 11:45 pm #

    privatize profit
    put the loss on the public

  109. Amfan56 August 3, 2009 at 11:50 pm #

    Been reading for about a year now, but this is my first post.
    Please forgive me (or point me with a link) if this question has already been asked and answered–with all the recent reference to Matt Taibbi’s article on GoldmanSux, I’m wondering how to reconcile his conclusion about the Oil bubble last year with what I read here and in many other places; namely, that with the IEA report and several other sources indicating we’re already at Peak Oil, is Taibbi wrong in accusing GS of the $147/bbl price manipulation?
    Personally, I have no doubt they (GS) profited from it but since his article directly contradicts everything I know about where Peak Oil currently stands… I’d like to know what everyone else here thinks.

  110. Jaego Scorzne August 3, 2009 at 11:56 pm #

    Nice try chump, but take some Spanish. Raza means race not community.

  111. cowswithguns August 4, 2009 at 12:03 am #

    There’s a book out there that probably predicts what’s going to happen if the shit does indeed hit the fan.
    It’s called Escape from Freedom by the late Jewish/German sociologist Erich Fromm. It largely centers around the Nazis and how they came to power.
    Fromm’s theory basically goes like this: freedom is a good thing if you have to means to take advantage of what freedom allows you to do (what he termed positive freedom); but if you don’t have such means, freedom is scary (this, he termed negative freedom — one has freedom in theory, but not the economic means to take advantage of it).
    In societies where freedom is largely negative, people will choose security over freedom. Hence, escape from freedom.
    In some future world, if Goldman and its ilk manage to suck the last bit of wealth from America, we could have a leader weilding the power of the legislative, executive and judiciary. And it will be by consent of the people.
    By then, the dark-skinned folks will seem too scary to followers of J. Corzne, and the J. Corznes of the world be too scary for the dark-skinned folks to allow a separation of powers and that annoying freedom thing that can’t be actualized anyway.
    It’s all about fear.
    What we really need in this country is confucianism.

  112. asia August 4, 2009 at 12:05 am #

    The purpose of govt is to get paychecks to those that work for it,
    especially elected politicians
    doesnt matter if programs ‘work’
    obamas aunts an illegal who lives in govt housing
    draw yr own conclusions
    when the govt gives low income loans to 5 million illegals so they can get houses,,,well

  113. asia August 4, 2009 at 12:07 am #

    ‘Obama plays the cards that are most politically correct for his reelection, and screw the country. As if his team of economists’

  114. Jaego Scorzne August 4, 2009 at 12:16 am #

    Oh, ok I get it-it’s the Indians. The Dakotas have large Sioux populations and Montana has serveral sizeable tribes-Crow, Flathead, etc.
    Well many of these people are terrified of the changes. There are Indian Minutemen for example. Why? Because the treaties they made are with the US Goverment, not Mexico. There is no reason for Mexico to honor those treaties. They may well take the reservations for themselves. Indians are sacred cows to Whites. They are no big deal to the Mexicans who have lots of Indian blood. The Mexicans were enemies of the Southwestern Tribes such as the Hopis, Apaches, and Comanches. They are freaked out by the takeover down there.
    The Cherokee ruled a couple of years ago that Blacks were not part of the People. One of their great chiefs said, watch out for those freemen, (their name for Blacks, since the Cherokee once held them as slaves) they will suck us dry if we let them. Well that sure sounds familiar. Imagine Blacks harassing a poor people like the Cherokee who have troubles of their own. Have Blacks no shame?

  115. Jaego Scorzne August 4, 2009 at 12:24 am #

    I would love some Confucianism. Confucius lived during the period known as the Warring States. He idolized the China’s glorious past and thought hard how to get back to it. The first step he said was the “rectification of names”. This means to define the meaning of words and get everyone on the same page with those definitions. Words like “racism” and “anti-semitism” would go the way of the dodo because they’re shibboleths or boogey men words. They’re shut up or else words. Also phrases like, “it’s not chemical, it’s natural” could use some work. Likewise the words “democracy” and “love”.

  116. Johnny Rico August 4, 2009 at 1:13 am #

    Hey, Any good comments worth reading this fine Monday/Tuesday?
    I just can’t be bothered reading through all this repetitive shit anymore. I trust you guys.
    Jim’s piece was not his best in recent months. But he can email me if he needs pointers. In the meantime, I’m finishing up Ken Burn’s Civil War series, I’ve got two episodes of Entourage and one of “Hung,” to catch up on, I’m trying to jungle, I mean juggle, three ladies in a fair manor (or is that manure?) and I’m still ridiculously obsessed with finding a way to score a beer with Joe Biden at the White House.
    Did anybody see 60 minutes this week? Andy Rooney said for $47.50 he’d have lunch with a stranger. Was he kidding? I’d pay him twice that and pay the new 6.25% Massachusetts sales tax on top of it.
    I wanna meat, I mean meet his daughter Emily, she gets some real cool liberals on her show every week. I want Emily to introduce me to that reporter for the Worcester Gazette. I can’t remember her name, I’ve never read her, and I don’t know anybody that has ever heard of her, but she’s on TV every week and has opinions.. so hey, let’s do it.
    Plus, you make fun of Sarah Palin. That’s wicked hard. Let’s get married. You write articles nobody reads for an unknown newspaper which won’t be in business yesterday. You appear on TV all the time but nobody wants to give you your own show. Let’s have kids together. I’ll laugh at all your jokes about Republicans and you can name the kids. I Love You.

  117. Qshtik August 4, 2009 at 1:19 am #

    There will be some hard times ahead for some people but in the longer term it’ll be just a blip on the screen. No one posting here today will be killed by blacks or hispanics but I’m somewhat less certain about pissed-off white friends and family. More than likely everyone will die of natural causes (cancer, heart attack, texting while driving) around age 81 give or take. None will move to Montana or the Dakotas unless they’re fishing fanatics. Mr Scorzne will buy nearly all his food at the local Shoprite and the checkout clerk will be a pleasant Indian woman who arrived legally from near Mumbai 23 years ago. Never-fired weapons and “precious lead” will be sold by executors on Craigslist.

  118. seb August 4, 2009 at 1:21 am #

    I stole that saying. I traced it to Chairman Mao, “Politics comes out of the barrel of a gun.” From there it morphed into, “Love comes out of the barrel of a gun”, and then I got it misquoted. It was way before Gonzo the word. I believe the sayings of Chairman Mao were carried around by all Chinese after the Cultural Revolution, and that is a billion,…
    {I am quitting the use of the word for person (pl). I want to put in ‘penis’, but I will get a shift dislocation of one letter, making my code nonviable. I already subjected your first post to my compulsory letter-crunching, but it is hard to say for certain whether you keep thinking when you parenthetize. I had done that because of you mentioning Benito Amilcar Maria Mussolini as well as the hang. Someone accesses my blog dozens of times every day just to see this one post:
    Oddly, the post was two weeks before David Carradine’s death, it has his name in it, and it has a picture of Mussolini hanging upside-down. Carradine, it was later announced, was found dead hanging. I thought someone was pulling my leg, trying to send me a message, but why? Just because I dare to place chemistry recipes for manufacturing speed on the ‘net? A blog like mine is in the upper fraction but it is not going so far as to put the crimes of policemen with evidence; make a case. Not much, anyhow. Who are the absolutely most valorous penis* on the ‘net? Well, I would say the Chinks, the Iranians, whoever is in adopt-a-blog. They aren’t in this country.
    The sayings were carried around in a “Little Red Book”. John Winston Lennon wrote a song, “Revolution #1”. In it, he said, “But if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao, you ain’t going to make it with anyone anyhow”, since the book was not evocative, and a contemporaneous image of the times was young Chink marchers carrying pictures of Chairman Mao; always the same one. We wanted different angles, and we wanted rock stars, not old vaginas. The red book came back with a vengance when Mark David Chapman assassinated John Lennon carrying the other red book, “Catcher in the Rye”.
    The blacks or niggers, black back then, nigger forevermore, had an additional uncomfortable revolutionary movement alongside, so white radicals never meant a thing they were saying, and wanted to call a truce. It did not matter how many of us got shot. My own placydilic rapprochement held that penis did not die, but it died off, died out, or died away, like a train whistle to Johnny Cash. Life is a madcap illusion. “Nothing, Isreal”. I could not understand that one. Had the Ambassador to Britain asked John if he wanted more tea or scones? Had he been asked by his butler if there was anything else he would be requiring tonight before I go to bed? Tea, perhaps? They were we without the strait jacket. “I am you and you are me and we are all together” and I am just you with a mansion and burying your president as a shoeshine boy for my Beatle boots with a little colored rock and roll and some soul-satisfying Cuban Healing. The next fool with his finger on the red button snapped to the fact you don’t resurrect with your head blowed off, and the next, and the next, to today.
    * I am going to try “atheist people” all the time for people, and write it, “altruist penis”, since penis already could be plural. It has an ‘s’.
    In a second thought, I am posting people in pairs, penis and penises.
    You are now getting the third-thought edition.
    On fourth thought, I can normalize one usage with the follow-on word, ‘they’, by adding a letter: ‘but it’

  119. keithishere August 4, 2009 at 1:22 am #

    Talk of Confucianism is certainly better than the racial hatred manifest in some previous posts but I have an problem with Confucius. Wise as Confucius was he was not one who advocated a flat social structure. We are living in a word who’s problems result because we do not understand that we are in this together. We have had enough of rule by a privileged elite. It’s not about who dies with the biggest pile of food and ammo. It’s about how we as a people can cooperate and get through the years ahead.

  120. Johnny Rico August 4, 2009 at 1:33 am #

    “I think that the majority of Oil Drum regulars are now doing little more than complacently contemplating their navels as the world collapses in slowmotion around them.
    The Oil Drum will probably be renamed “Deck Chairs On The Titanic.com” in the not-too-distant future.”
    You “think”?
    Why the
    fuck would anybody care what YOU think?
    “not-to-distant future.” As in you have no idea how far your head is up your ass and have an even worse approximation as to when you will pull it out.
    TOD’s fortunes rise and fall with the price of oil. Rapier is the only one with his head screwed on half-right (though Dave Mathews will disagree).
    SOP, please, go find Matt Savinar, CFN has been out of your depth for probably 3 years.
    “Collapses in slow motion.” Wow. Such the wordsmith. Good plagiarism with the Long Emergency thing. Who would notice?
    Look up oxymoron (And please, no moron jokes,Doom … well, OK, but no more than three).

  121. cowswithguns August 4, 2009 at 1:38 am #

    I see your point. Though, remember Confucious didn’t just stress that people should accept their leaders as their superiors, he also stressed that leaders should be good, respectful rulers who treated their subjects well.
    If our country’s rulers (see: the financial elite) had followed that code, we wouldn’t be in the mess we’re in now.
    But they didn’t care about the country or the people they “ruled.” They cared about money.
    In an ideal world, Confucianism would be great, but not in ours.

  122. asoka August 4, 2009 at 1:44 am #

    Qshtik said: “There will be some hard times ahead for some people but in the longer term it’ll be just a blip on the screen ….. Never-fired weapons and “precious lead” will be sold by executors on Craigslist.”
    Excellent post!
    Excellent post from beginning to end. Rare perspective to counteract the heated emotions of hate and to counterbalance the incessant and unfounded prophecies of violent societal breakdown.

  123. Jaego Scorzne August 4, 2009 at 2:38 am #

    No brother-Hierarchy is the way. No child left behind means no child out in front. Even an amoeba has to throw part of it’s body out in front in order to pull the rest of itself forward. You do the same-it’s called walking. It’s a miracle of unbalanced balance. Inequality is the way. As Albert Schweitzer said to the Blacks in Africa, “Yes, I am your brother, you’re Big Brother.” He also that missionaries who tried the egalitarian approach were destroyed by the subsequent disrespect of the Africans. In many African Languages, the word for respect is the same as the word for fear.
    Egalitarianism is what Mao tried in the Cultural Revolution-taking mature educated men, doctors, engineers etc, and putting them out in the field like they were nobodies. The place they could have done the most for Society is the place they had trained for. That training in not available to all-most couldn’t make it. It’s only for the intellectual elite. Our own Cultural Revolution is affirmative action where qualified Whites are put down in favor of less qualified coloreds. It’s ruinous and there will be a reckoning.
    In good traditional societies, the obligations go both ways from inferior to superior and from superior to inferior. The big brother has to watch out for his little brother. The oldest son who gets the patrimony has to take care of his siblings after the Father dies. You don’t like all this because you feel inferior. As CS Lewis said, people who rave about equality always feel inferior. Of course, any social system should have some mobility to allow people to find their own level…If it’s too rigid then people will be miserable. China was both good and bad in this. At it’s best, it had the Civil Service Exam which allowed poor but bright boys to go forward. But at the same time, it never lived up to the mutal benevolence Confucius wanted. As once scholar said, “China is outwardly Confucian but inwardly Legalist”-this was a hard version of Machiavelli ivolving tortore of suspects, one law for the rich another for the poor, trickery, etc.

  124. Jaego Scorzne August 4, 2009 at 2:51 am #

    This has been a sad day for the forces of darkness. According to World Net Daily, Obama’s Kenyan Birth Ceriticate has been found. The same lawyer who defended a soldier who refused to go back to Iraq because Obama isn’t the President, will begin proceedings against him. Unfortunately, the Blacks will burn down the cities if he is impeached. Perhaps, it is for the best though. It would certainly unify all White Americans who have any decency and loyalty to America. Obviously that excludes people like Nancy Pelosi and Bill Ayers.

  125. Patrizia August 4, 2009 at 5:00 am #

    An economy (or “the economy”) is the realized economic system of a country or other area. It includes the production, exchange, distribution, and consumption of goods and services of that area.
    People are supposed to do the production, exchange, distribution, and consumption and the economists (and all the variegated bunch of politicians) have to write the user manual.
    It looks like we (the people) got the wrong one.
    And it also looks like that for them is not convenient changing it.
    They think that it is enough to change the color of the first page, or the index, or adding some “psychological” hints towards optimism.
    Yesterday I began (and couldn’t finish, too long and too boring) to look at a video which was talking about how our “animal” behavior can change the economy.
    A situation like the one of today presented in 29.
    In both people were “pessimistic” and that didn’t help recovery.
    In 29 they came out with a war.
    Will we need something like this to be able to get our jobs back?

  126. bahmi August 4, 2009 at 5:57 am #

    At this time, Obama is talking to some Saudi ambassadors about the Palestine/Israel mess. Obama is also talking to the strongman from Syria, Basher Assad. Two fine groups of people, we’d all agree.
    Proponents of Obama’s presidency love the sumbitch so much they forget just who the Saudi’s are. These are the same sandtraps who contribute tons of money to build mosques and madrassas throughout the world. Places that teach violent hatred for the US. That’s United States, guys. While we do billions of dollars of business with these guys, how does Obama play kissy face with those that plot our destruction? You don’t figure this President of ours leans toward Islam, do you?
    Every time you see Obama and his Israel hating Jews on staff, everytime you see him sucking up to his fellow Muslims, ask yourself if you think he deserves your adulation.
    Obama’s grand strategy is to de-nut Israel and jews worldwide. He played the Christian convert so convincingly during his campaign many Americans remarked how wonderful this was, a guy who “saw the light”. A real Christian, I mean, he told us so and “we” believed it. Now, he’s proud to be called Barry Hussein Obama. Why? Hey, it’s out in the open, yet so many anesthetized Americans are oblivious to the fact this guy is Public Enemy Number 1. Your tax dollars will be spent at your expense, not for your expense. It’s just more business as usual. Keep adoring him, he’s such a cool guy with a sharp Teleprompter.
    Barry hated our Weimar times, now it’s time for National Socialism. Wait until he reaches into schools. National obedience will be taught, even more homogeneity so all kids can think alike and be molded into nice little boy and girl socialists who follow the Great Leader.
    Rome burns while Barry fiddles,

  127. Johnny Rico August 4, 2009 at 6:16 am #

    “For those about to die, we call you a douche”
    -Black Sabbath
    Jaego, do you have any friends? Besides internet, racist Facebook buddies?
    I don’t necessarily agree with the legal system in the UK (I got problems with it), but it’s none of my business.
    I’m just saying. They sentenced one guy to 4 plus years and another to 2 plus years for what you are doing.
    But these guys were different from you. They had balls. They actually believed in their freedom and rights and shit and fled to the US. It didn’t work for them, but who cares, they are not Americans.
    YOU, on the other hand, I’m pretty sure, are a complete faggot. And when I say say faggot, I don’t mean gay, I mean pussy. And when I say pussy, I don’t mean pussy the vagina way, I mean coward.
    You aren’t actually smart enough to stand up for anything you are saying.
    You don’t read books. This is easily deducible.
    You wanna fuck with me?
    …well, you’re gonna hafta wait and watch. The scene I wanted to play (which OEO kindly remided me of) fortunately takes place at the junction of parts 9 and 10. So git some popcorn and sit tight while we fix the projector.
    You are a faggot. So is dale. It’s not a big deal. I’m gonna get him to fuck you and then make you suck his dick.
    Hint: drop the racist BS and I’ll make life a slight bit easier for you.
    Question: Why can’t you be a normal fairy and just dress up in stockings and stick flowers up your ass? What’s with the hate?
    OEO could see Sizemore’s genius. That may mean fuckall to you, but it means something to me.
    But then, I’ve always seen OEO’s genius.
    Spielberg would see it.
    If Eisenhower were alive today he would see it. Bradley. Monty (God forbid).
    Oh! But you’re fucking cool? Gimme a break, Kilroy.

  128. Johnny Rico August 4, 2009 at 6:35 am #

    Someday, cooler minds will prevail.
    But for now, Sizemore rules SPR.
    And if you don’t like that analysis, you better get you movie review/history analysis on.
    Because the radar/medic dies scene is technically proficient with the changing out the barrels line.
    I’ve got problems with it, but you think I’m helping you out?
    I’m not a faggot like you, I spend too much time thinking about pussy. You fucking knejerkov (that’s a new Russian Word).

  129. Kiwi Nick August 4, 2009 at 6:41 am #

    The week that the first “No Gas” signs appear at gas stations across the country and the electricity starts to blink out and the internet goes down unexpectedly we will know we are falling into the abyss.

    Add to that water (especially in Australia).
    We will have a problem with every utility except sewerage. The truly disappointing thing is that telecommunications (especially the Internet) should be part of the new order, but the telecoms industry just isn’t interested.
    Want broadband in the (Australian) cities? Go away.
    I’ll elaborate more on this in a few day’s time.

  130. Johnny Rico August 4, 2009 at 7:05 am #

    Ehh? My biggest mistake was not feeding Viagra to Yarra.
    Kiwi Nick, no offense, but Yarra and MaryG were like Gods here a year ago. I take the full blame.
    …On the upside, I think Yarra would love you. I’m not an Aussie, but I’d vote for that fucker in a second in the US.
    Yarra is hardcore and funny as fuck. I’ll get him to come back to CFN soon. CFN…der…www.kunstler.com
    Mostly I weep over Dr. Doom. Actually, mostly I weep over Yarra. OH ! FUCK! Help Me, My Lord! No. It’s Doom and Remus. I’m a damaged individual.
    JHKs blog-switch was key, but it totally fucked my life. That’s cool. I never lost my bearings. Me and Zsa are cool. It just fucked my friends up. I’m just sayin.

  131. empirestatebuilding August 4, 2009 at 8:19 am #

    I do not yet see the anger you are seeing… I see people going about their normal lives and actually believing things will be back to normal soon.

  132. zzzzzz August 4, 2009 at 8:49 am #

    asoka -the-producers sez:
    “NCLR’s work as a civil rights institution is about inclusion and participation in the American Dream…”
    True but for Hispanics only. From NCLR’s site:
    “The National Council of La Raza (NCLR) – the largest national Hispanic civil rights and advocacy organization in the United States – works to improve opportunities for Hispanic Americans.”
    That being the case it can be said that La Raza is a racist organization in that it is only concerned with opportunities for Hispanic Americans. Thats a fact, Jack.

  133. budizwiser August 4, 2009 at 8:53 am #

    [How Things Are – My View]
    “The more information comes to us about How Things Are, especially from TV, the more confused or wrong the conventional view gets it,” writes JK this week.
    And the statement goes a long, long way in describing another facet, which is one of the most frustrating aspects of our impending, -or is it here – “long emergency.”
    With so many of our institutions turned against facing long-term problems as a result of their own short-term dollar gains – Congress indeed – has an interest in helping the nation with some form of mass halluciNATION. (Note the cute use of capitolization – coining of a new word to describe a money-grubbing Congress running the nation.)
    At this early point in our Nation’s fall from grace, the citizens of CF nation are left to ponder our true location with respect to Peak Oil, population overshoot and other miseries that mass-media outlets and our governors tell us are too distant to consider.
    My own perspective continues to suggest that there is little reason to even debate technology and its possible roles in ameliorating the effects of resource shortages so long as we remain so far away from sociological fixes to our corrupted government structures and mega-maniacal activities of corporate leaders.
    Beyond the absurd notion that some of our “leaders” will act in our interest while most of the legislature acts at the behest of their moneyed puppet masters comes a similar miss-understanding with respect to our collective media. Is it in our time to realize the endless hours of comical drivel being uttered by television news anchors is as ridiculous as old-time re-runs of propaganda footage from ‘40s Germany or Japan.
    After all, there is a “war” being conducted against the American people, and if the latest news from the front were really known, surely some people would mobilize to form a resistance movement, and perhaps even confront their enemies.
    Peak Oil, and food shortages and population over-shoot are all theoretically our eventual doom-bringers – but it is our Governments – that are acting in unison with the greedy, the selfish that are magnifying and hastening our impending dilemmas.
    And this is the reality, of the Long Emergency – the greedy remaining blind to a changing world, and the masses remaining blind to crimes of the greedy.

  134. zzzzzz August 4, 2009 at 9:30 am #

    I’ve stated this before but I’m going to re-post it here. One of the problems that is often posted here is that politicians only do what is necessary to get themselves reelected. This indicates a short-termed, myopic, tunnel-visioned outlook.
    In effect, our politicos refuse to do what is right for our long term good for fear it will impact their short term chances for reelection.
    How can we, as voters, counteract this? My plan is simple. Lets start a national movement to defeat every single incumbent, currently in office. The policy is totally party neutral, hence it is potentially a non-political, political coup. The point? It puts every cock-sucking office holder on notice. It makes the statement that, “We don’t give a shit about your being re-elected unless and until your actions, while in office, begin to address the long term difficulties facing our country and your willingness to take the heat that is necessary in facing them.”
    “What about the dilemma of throwing the baby out with the bath water”?, you may ask. What about good leaders that are trying to make a positive difference? Well, unfortunately, they will need to be sacrificed. In order to get the attention of elected officials form dog catcher to President form coast to coast, they ALL gotta go. The ones that have the gumption to overcome defeat and run again and demonstrate they have heard the discontent of the voters will possibly be welcomed back into the fold. But all will have been put on notice that enough is enough. And all who have replaced these incumbents will know that the only reason they have attained office is that their predecessors were making decisions based solely on their likelihood of being reelected and that that shit is no longer gonna fly.
    “NO INCUMBENTS” should be the battle cry at a poling place near you.

  135. georget August 4, 2009 at 10:20 am #

    “.. If you wish to deprive a people of their liberties, create the conditions in which they demand you do so…”.
    Take a look at this analysis from Charles Hugh Smith’s site.
    The writer nails it quite well.
    Warning!!!Kool Aid drinkers please ignore! Too paranoid for your consumption!!!

  136. wagelaborer August 4, 2009 at 10:28 am #

    It is, of course, impossible to predict the future with accuracy, but I can say with some confidence that the armed and ready to fight the powers delusion shared by so many will not play out the way they fantasize.
    The US government does not fight fair – it fights to win. Look at the drones blowing up people in Afghanistan and Pakistan. How do you defend yourself against that?
    I predict that there is no way that the US will openly send troops out door to door to round people up for the concentration camps. Too much resistance.
    Look at New Orleans. They wanted Black folks out of there, that’s for sure. Think how hard it would have been to actually try to get them out in ordinary times.
    But wait for a hurricane, which was bound to come. Call for an evacuation, but only allow people to leave by cars, making sure that the poor are stranded. Tell Amtrak that they can’t run the trains THAT WERE READY TO EVACUATE. Have armed police keeping people from walking out. Blow up the levees near the ghetto. Open up the Superdome and then lock the people in with no food or water for 3 days. Have the military guarding the roads into New Orleans so that help cannot get through. After 3 days of starvation and misery, watch the people eagerly board the buses without even asking where they are going.
    So, how do you do this on a national scale? Pay attention. They are announcing it.
    Pandemic flu. They are telling us that it is coming and will be like the one in 1918. How do they know this? Because they dug up a victim and replicated the virus.
    Do you think there will be armed resistance to curfews and military flu patrols? Whose going to Fight the Man when it involves exposure to a killer virus?
    If the american population gets restless, the flu will be just what the ruling class ordered.

  137. zzzzzz August 4, 2009 at 11:02 am #

    “If the american population gets restless, the flu will be just what the ruling class ordered.”
    You are a MORON without peer. If ONE and only one thing can be learned from the recent outbreak of swine flu it is that it respects no borders and “laughs” at any attempt to contain it. A person or persons would have to be almost as stupid as you to think they could use the flu to achieve anything other than people getting the flu. Try and get a clue.

  138. Cthulhu August 4, 2009 at 11:40 am #

    @ JR
    CTHULHU wants to know how Daniel Faraday got to Omaha Beach.
    @SEB, of the drug crazed rants:
    I read Brandon. Brandon was a fav of mine. You are no Brandon.
    That’s exactly how I voted last election; I think I’ll start writing “ELECT NO INCUMBENTS” on twenty dollar bills next election cycle.

  139. Jaego Scorzne August 4, 2009 at 11:48 am #

    Eisenhower was a tool of the Insiders. This is easily deduceable. He was promoted very quickly before far more qualified people. He was a friend of the Jew, Baruch. He was promoted for his shit eating grin and egg sucking ways. At the end of his presidency his conscience bothered him and he warned us about the Military/Industrial Complex. Who would know better than he-who was its slave? Like Churchil.
    You should care about those two, you should care about White Men everywhere. They are your brothers. If you have anything left over, you can care about other races after that if you want to. We live in an orderly universe and charity partakes of this order. Family first. Then friends. Then racial brothers and countrymen. Then people in other lands. In any case, a Nation should be all one Race. Then you wouldn’t get into alot of these conflicts. But since today everything is confused, one has to say the Race trumps Nationality.

  140. Qshtik August 4, 2009 at 12:14 pm #

    Mr Z,
    Weakest thing you’ve ever written. Why do you waste all these keystrokes on something you know will never happen in a million years? Seriously.

  141. Jaego Scorzne August 4, 2009 at 12:32 pm #

    Well what do you think should be done? You’re a great critic but what about some ideas? Doing nothing is not an option. You have sat on the fence so long you have splinters. You put your faith in the status quo but look around: it’s not going to last. It’s decaying rapidly. Men must act. You might say you’re too old, but hear this: one of the Minutemen at the battle of Lexington Green was 89 years old. He ambushed and killed three British Soldiers who were retreating back to Boston. He was shot and left for dead. He recovered and lived 10 more years. Your age should give you an advantage-less attachment to life and more willingness to die in service to your Country and People.

  142. Cash August 4, 2009 at 12:49 pm #

    If it’s any consolation, the US isn’t alone. Up here in Canada the pundits all say the situation isn’t as bad, our banking system is stable etc etc. If only. We’re projecting massive govt deficits, our bank balance sheets are crapped up with derivatives, we are rapidly de-industrializing, our household savings rate is zilch, the average household is massively overindebted, we are glutted with junk and cars and houses we can’t afford. Our business model is based on exports to the US but our currency is soaring vs the US buck and the US economy is deep in the mire. They say our housing prices won’t crash. More famous last words. Our central bank governor is a Goldman Sachs alumnus and that fact fills me with dread. You guys have a charismatic bullshit artist to lead you to hell, nobody is throwing their panties at our national leader but we’re going to hell too.

  143. QuietStorm August 4, 2009 at 1:48 pm #

    Stopped home for lunch and caught this on CNBC.
    Kilduff: Get Ready for $100 Oil – CNBC Guest Blog

  144. bahmi August 4, 2009 at 2:09 pm #

    Eisenhower had extensive experience working with General MacArthur, General Patton, and was noticed frequently and extensively by General Marshall, head honcho. To say he was a fluke is simply denying the facts, the realities. Ike was able to deal with cantankerous bastards like Bernard Montgomery, Brit field marshal, and others. He was well liked and capable. While there were probably others that were capable, like General Caleb Schwartz, General Frank Sausage, and General Claude Ballz, nobody could have gotten along as well as Ike with the wide range of personalities. Yes, he did have a fling with Cpt. Kay Summersby, his driver, but you would have, too. She was a doll and loved stars…on his shoulders. I doubt if she would have gone after you, you were probably a buck private after 3 years peeling potatoes. Ike was not a loser, you are because of your slanted memory, bias against a white man from Kansas, and failure to read literature about the World War 2 which we all know was waged against the Axis. Shame on you.

  145. asoka August 4, 2009 at 2:16 pm #

    ZZZZZZ said: “works to improve opportunities for Hispanic Americans.”
    That being the case it can be said that La Raza is a racist organization in that it is only concerned with opportunities for Hispanic Americans.”
    Oh, really? Any organization that works to improve the well being of its constituents, to be more educated, to be employed, to not be filling up hospital emergency rooms… that is racist?
    A rising tide lifts all boats my friend. La Raza is not preaching racial superiority. La Raza is not preaching racial nationalism or separation of races or segregation. La Raza wants hispanics to integrate and participate in the American dream. Integration is by definition not racist.
    Maybe you should revisit the meaning of racist.
    By your logic, the Chinese Americans Citizens Alliance is racist? The NAACP is racist? The Korean American Coalition is racist? The Japanese American Citizens League? The Irish National Caucus? The Sons of Norway? The German-American National Congress? The National Italian American Foundation? The Polish Beneficial Association? The French American Foundation? The British American Business Council? La Raza? Arab American Anti-Discrimination Commission? The American Indian Movement? Hellenic Advancement Council? I could name hundreds more.
    None of these cultural/educational organizations is preaching the superiority of one race over another.
    There are organizations that preach racial superiority and they are opposed to racial integration.
    Knights of the Ku Klux Klan, which specifically speaks of “the inequality between the White and Black races”…
    Stormfront.org has a “fifty-year plan to racially divide the Americas and create peaceful, sovereign, prosperous, mono-racial nations…”
    The National Socialist Vanguard whose goal is “to preserve the white race by total geographic separation of all races (by whatever means necessary).”
    The New Order, committed to build a “separate, all-white society”
    The World Church of the Creator seeks “an all-white world” and maintains “all of the progress in society has been due to the white race.”
    La Raza is not racist.

  146. bahmi August 4, 2009 at 2:20 pm #

    Some very good content in your words, thanks. People must get active in defending our way of life. yes, everybody is busy but we all have to do our parts. Our country is coming apart at the seems while Barry fiddles,

  147. Jaego Scorzne August 4, 2009 at 2:25 pm #

    Ever hear of Operation Keelhaul? Ike sent hundreds of thousands of Anti-Communist Russian Fighters and Refugees back to Russia-to almost certain imprisonment and death. Many of these men not only fought the Communists in Russia, but when that cause was lost (we stopped supporting them), they fought on our side against Germany. He betrayed far better men than himself. Just like FDR betrayed Prince Peter of Poland and other leaders of Eastern Europe. Now the British supposedly went into WW2 to stop the German invasion of Poland, but nether Churchill nor FDR had any problem giving it over to Uncle Joe. No, the whole thing was alot of crap. FDR, Eisenhower, and Churchill were creeps and sycophants of an early version of the New World Order.
    The only good thing the bum ever did was deport a million illegal Mexicans. But you’re probably against us doing that now times twenty or so. If so, you should be ashamed of yourself.

  148. asoka August 4, 2009 at 2:31 pm #

    JS said: “one of the Minutemen at the battle of Lexington Green was 89 years old. He ambushed and killed three British Soldiers”
    He killed three WHITE men… the bastard!

  149. Jaego Scorzne August 4, 2009 at 2:35 pm #

    Any of those White Organizations you like would have to take Blacks in. But Blacks never have to Whites in. A White member of Congress recently asked to join the Black Caucus and was refused-a clear example of racism and double standard. Whites aren’t allowed their own organizations any more, Blacks and Hispanics are. And again, Raza means Race, not Community. If they didn’t mean Race they wouldn’t have said Race. And the last part-“for other Races Nothing”. Does that sound very “American” as you fantasize America is supposed to be?

  150. asoka August 4, 2009 at 2:37 pm #

    bahmi said: “Our country is coming apart at the seems while Barry fiddles,”
    Compare the number of day of vacation taken by Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush.
    You will see that Barack Hussein Obama is an activist president who does not own a fiddle.

  151. Jaego Scorzne August 4, 2009 at 2:39 pm #

    You’d like to kill some Whites too. Wouldn’t ya?

  152. asoka August 4, 2009 at 2:55 pm #

    JS said: “And the last part-“for other Races Nothing”. Does that sound very “American”
    No, not American. And La Raza specifically denied it is their motto. You are repeating propaganda you have heard… which is common enough. But find where in La Raza’s writings they have said such an un-American thing. It was falsely attributed to them.
    Latinos & Hispanics are not a single race and therefore they don’t use the word “raza” to directly mean race as in skin color. They are referring to “the people” and not “the race”
    The Motto “Por La Raza todo. Fuera de La Raza nada” belonged to a 60s/70s radical Mexican/American student organization which did believe in returning land to Mexico. This group is not “La Raza” and has no affiliation with “La Raza”. This group was known as “M.E.Ch.A.” (Movimiento Estudiantil Chicano de Aztlan).
    La Raza is not a Mexican organization but rather an organization for all Latinos in this country similar to the NAACP. You may not be a fan of the NAACP, but I don’t think there are many of sound mind who would claim that they are racist just because their name doesn’t also say “& we don’t hate white people either”.

  153. asoka August 4, 2009 at 3:00 pm #

    JS asked: “You’d like to kill some Whites too. Wouldn’t ya?”
    I’ll trust in karma to handle white supremacists for their racist beliefs and their hateful actions. No intervention needed on my part.

  154. Qshtik August 4, 2009 at 3:12 pm #

    Have you ever noticed the behavior of 15 year old girls at a dance. They are pathetically insecure. They scurry here and scurry there in tight little groups. They cannot go to the bathroom alone. After a dance with Donny they must report in to the group. They cannot function without support.
    Mr Rico is a 15 year old girl. He cannot post unaligned. He must affiliate himself with others (such as ZZZZZZ) whom he imagines like him. I could copy off Exhibits A thru Z from his posts but you have surely noticed anyway. These would-be cyber-soulmates want Rico’s endorsement about as much as McCain wanted Bush’s.
    And Rico’s style is a lame attempt to copy the amusing drug-addled stream-of-consciousness employed by SEB but without the cleverness. Rico is like an ugly woman who ACTUALLY thinks she’s beautiful.

  155. Ed Nauseum August 4, 2009 at 3:32 pm #

    You should post a link to provide evidence of your claims, it might buy you some credibility.
    Here, I’ll show you how:
    I agree with Rico, you cite the books but have clearly not read or understood them.

  156. asia August 4, 2009 at 3:40 pm #

    ‘ a war.Will we need something like this to be able to get our jobs back?’
    didnt Bushy get us into 2….EIGHT PLUS YEARS AGO?

  157. dale August 4, 2009 at 3:43 pm #

    “Pandemic flu. They are telling us that it is coming and will be like the one in 1918. How do they know this? Because they dug up a victim and replicated the virus.” – Wagelaborer
    Wooboy……..this blog is getting crazier by the hour. Use to be Doom was the crazy paranoiac around here, but this latest groups postings sounds more like small talk in a Psycho ward. Good Luck out there, if this blog is any indication of the mental state of America we genuinely are in deep trouble, over and out.

  158. asia August 4, 2009 at 3:54 pm #

    ‘they dug up a victim ‘..to ‘study’ the flu
    WELL SCIENTISTS DID….and germ warfare does exist..and JK in TLE said Power elites killin off people has happened
    drw yr own conclusions

  159. observer August 4, 2009 at 4:00 pm #

    1.) My California neighborhood had a meeting a couple months ago about saving water, owing to the current drought. One suggestion was “pee in the garden” to avoid flushing the toilet (also saves sewage treatment costs). Others said it’s better to dilute urine 10-to-1 with water and use it as a (high nitrogen) fertilizer. I began peeing in a bucket and doing this–with GREAT results. Yellow leaves have turned deep green on my persimmon tree. Other plants are flourishing like never before in nearly 40 years of gardening. Now I hate to pee in toilets when I’m away from home–I’m wasting a valuable product!
    2.) Another idea is roof-water harvesting. My grandparents’ house in upstate New York, built in 1904, had a basement cistern that provided them with roof water (soft water, great for washing) for sixty years with no malfunctions I can recall. I am looking into economical water storage options, since I need 5000+ gallons for 6-7 months of no rain (10,000 gallons would be even better, but I don’t have a basement and don’t want something ugly). Yesterday I visited a neighbor who operates a small pump with a solar panel and one auto battery to move roof water around in his large city permaculture landscape. More ideas about stuff like this would be HELPFUL, unlike endless race talk.
    3.) Saturday our neighborhood gardeners had a vegetable/fruit exchange at a local park. About 30 people showed up. I thought all would be bearing zucchini, but the variety was amazing–and wonderful!
    4.) Homeopathy has been successful treating epidemics in the past. In a given epidemic, homeopaths try to find the “genus epidemicus,” the remedy most similar to the symptoms of the current epidemic. I recently had swine flu, and foolishly waited 6 days before looking online for the genus epidemicus. I found it, and happened to have the remedy–nux vomica 200C–on hand. I took it as instructed on the website of the homeopath who has been working on this effort. I could feel my sinus congestion clearing within an hour. By the end of the day I was symptom free, though I slept more than usual for a few more days.
    Homeopathic remedies are inexpensive, and keep indefinitely if protected from heat and sunlight. They are also powerful. If not used carefully, they can cause problems. But in the Long Emergency they may be very useful to those who know how to use them. Learning about them is worth the time investment needed for safe and effective administration.

  160. zzzzzz August 4, 2009 at 4:03 pm #

    “Any organization that works to improve the well being of its constituents, to be more educated, to be employed, to not be filling up hospital emergency rooms… that is racist?”
    If the organization is only promoting the betterment and advancement of a particular race than that would be showing a preference for ONLY that race. Sounds racist to me. La Raza by their own statement fits the bill. Sorry if the actual truth gets in the way of your impression of the truth.

  161. Funzel August 4, 2009 at 4:04 pm #

    asoka,I want you to be aware of calling a Caucasian a White Supremacists is considered an insult,like calling people niggers,kikes,spics,chinks,japs and rag heads etc.

  162. zzzzzz August 4, 2009 at 4:19 pm #

    Qshtik | AUGUST 1, 2009 1:47 PM | REPLY
    I’ve had an epiphany. Posting here is like casual sex with a slut … when it’s over there’s nothing left but post-coital depression.
    Buh bye (and don’t say “good riddance” all at once).
    Hey squished-dik,
    I thought you bid your adieu last week? Couldn’t stay away from the slut huh?

  163. Qshtik August 4, 2009 at 4:58 pm #

    That’s right … took one glance at the site … the slut had a great rack … and the ‘ol libido came right back. BTW, loved the “squished-dik” line. Your an asshole but a clever asshole.

  164. zzzzzz August 4, 2009 at 5:05 pm #

    “Your an asshole but a clever asshole.”
    Oh well at least I’m not just an asshole otherwise I’d be you.

  165. asoka August 4, 2009 at 5:21 pm #

    Thank you for your comment. I went back over my posts and do not see where I called anyone a “white supremacist”
    The closest I came was a remark in which I said there are people who preach racial supremacy, and I provided names of groups and quotes from their literature to support my comment.

  166. Jaego Scorzne August 4, 2009 at 5:29 pm #

    Ok, I believe you, sort of. But if Obama passed a law that forbade White Women from marrying White Men, but only Minorities, you would be all for it. You just want to miscegenate us out of existence-kill us with “love”.
    In any case, it will happen naturally even without such a law. As White Men are dispossesed though affirmative action, Oursourcing, and Insourcing, White Women will turn towards monied minorities. Women don’t like to marry or mate down but always up. Call it hypergamy. In natural competition, White Men would more than hold their own. But under these unnatural conditions, it bodes ill indeed. Good thing it’s all going to end or we might be in serious trouble. So let it all go and start anew. White Men make great Pioneers-we are the most individualistic of the Races. And of course, great soldiers as well if it comes that. It will.

  167. asoka August 4, 2009 at 5:38 pm #

    zzzzzz said: “Sorry if the actual truth gets in the way of your impression of the truth.”
    No need to apologize.
    You are just a bit confused about the concepts of race and ethnicity. La Raza represents all groups of latinos (who are from many countries and are of different races) which is why “raza” is better translated as “community” or “pueblo” or “people” rather than “race”.
    For example, in the last census 80% of Puerto Ricans classified themselves as White. So La Raza is promoting the advancement of white race hispanics and black race hispanics and all shades and colors in between.
    The Hispanic community is not a national group as it is made up by people from 20 nationalities. It is not a racial group since you can find White Hispanics, Black Hispanics, Asian Hispanics, and Indian Hispanics. Although they are mostly Catholics, they are not a religious group. You can also find other Christian Hispanics who are not Catholics, as well as Jewish Hispanics, Muslim Hispanics, Hispanics with African religious roots as Yorubas and Lucumies, and Hispanics practicing indigenous rituals as Mayans and Aztecas. La Raza is promoting civil rights for all Hispanics of all races.
    La Raza is therefore not racist.
    Sorry if facts are interfering with your preconceptions.

  168. asoka August 4, 2009 at 5:48 pm #

    JS said: “if Obama passed a law that forbade White Women from marrying White Men”
    Where does this paranoia come from?
    The very idea is outlandish, absurd, and ridiculous.
    Especially considering our president, Barack Hussein Obama, is from a white Kansas family and has zero animosity towards white men.
    You keep this up and I’m going to send you back to DSM-IV 300.1

  169. Qshtik August 4, 2009 at 5:57 pm #

    ” Well what do you think should be done?”
    About what?
    “You’re a great critic”
    Thank you.
    “but what about some ideas?”
    I have none. I don’t try to fix the world. I simply adjust to the world as I find it.
    “Doing nothing is not an option.”
    Sure it is … for me, usually the best option.
    “You have sat on the fence so long you have splinters.”
    No, I sit on a comfy lawn chair NEAR a fence.
    “You put your faith in the status quo but look around: it’s not going to last. It’s decaying rapidly. Men must act.”
    When Jerry Brown ran for prez a reporter asked “What’s the first thing you’ll do as president?” He answered “I don’t know … it’ll evolve.”
    “You might say you’re too old ……….. etc.”
    Not at all … except for having to get up at 3AM to pee.
    “Your age should give you an advantage”
    It does … if wisdom comes at all it comes with age.
    “less attachment to life and more willingness to die in service to your Country and People.”
    If I die in anyone’s service it will be my wife and kids.

  170. asoka August 4, 2009 at 5:57 pm #

    JS said: “In natural competition, White Men would more than hold their own. But under these unnatural conditions, it bodes ill indeed.”
    Here I have to agree with you. The white race is toast because they think with their little heads. Genetics is one unforgiving mothafoka.
    Not to say I think the white race will ever die out. Nor should it. Some whites should always be kept around as tokens, as a reminder of what few great (non-war-related) contributions they made.

  171. abbeysbooks August 4, 2009 at 5:58 pm #

    Great post and great idea. Urine works great. When I lived in my other house I used a slop bucket for everything. I poured it all into a compost container. You just keep layering it with dirt, leaves, grass clippings etc and don’t forget food. If you have a vita mix it will turn all your garbage into juice.
    Put the big container in the middle and it will leak goodness to all edges. In the fall cover the whole thing with spoiled hay. I take the rectangles, break them up into “books” and lay them in a brick laying pattern all over. The next year when you see a weed (one you don’t want) cover with a chunk off a “book”.
    Breaking it up into a loose pile that you heap on weeds doesn’t work so well. ((t is the close packing of the “book” that is so good.) It just slowly disintegrates (like the US) and rots into soil. And provides shelter for huge huge worms.
    The rainy season keeps it wet and in the spring just move some away to plant a seed or seedling. No digging, cultivating, watering etc. Plant, eat and watch it grow. If you for them to hear in the neighborhood. Songbirds wil come.

  172. abbeysbooks August 4, 2009 at 6:06 pm #

    Jaego you would have loved seeing the white ape Snowflake in Barcelona Zoo when he lived there. I saw him in the mid 70’s and he was a psychic wreck that day. When a big crowd formed to see him he jumped up on the ledge where he became invisible. Otherwise he was rocking like a severely autistic child and throwing up and then swallowing it. The black ape was having a wonderful time. Cavorting, playing for the audience and being charming.

  173. dale August 4, 2009 at 7:12 pm #

    You are carrying around with you your own personal little piece of hell. The extent that your warped and judgmental mind is your biggest enemy is probably apparent to virtually everyone on this blog. There is nothing that I or anyone else here can say to you that would harm you as much as you are harming yourself with your own thoughts.
    The Sufi’s (who may wind up saving Islam) have a tradition; our thoughts should pass through three gates. At the first gate, we ask “is it true?” at the second “ is it necessary or useful?” and at the third “is it rooted in love and kindness?” I’m not enough of a hypocrite to suggest that I always live up to this myself, But you man, you need something, and it sure isn’t the fucked up world view you’re walking and talking on this blog. You are the most twisted, poor suffering fucker that every posted here. I feel so sorry for you, For God sakes, get some help.

  174. abbeysbooks August 4, 2009 at 7:35 pm #

    Jaego is sorting through unfiltered information, judgments, feelings, and facts and they are really all mixed up.
    Bernard-Henri Levy and Houellebecq are both seriously questioning our elevation of tolerance to an unassailable sacred place. They both now question it and believe it is the cornerstone of the destruction of western culture.
    Both are French and the French have had big problems with immigration from Arab countries and awful terrorism that they have managed without war. As frightening as 9-11 was how about your local department store in a major city? The metro? and never knowing where they will strike next? Sort of like Iraq’s suicide bombers and our military fighting them. They are ghosts.
    Islam is a terrible primitive threat. It is a stupid religion. The sufis came to terms with the Islamic religion centuries ago. They are not a part of it. They are opposed to dogma of any kind.
    There are other major intellectuals who perceive our immigration problem as a catastrophe. It’s about cheap labor, that’s all. Our agriculture corporations require them but do we require these big food growers, distributors and poisoners of our environment and our food? Do we need cheeze doodles as JHK would say? Go see Food, Inc.
    And I just read they are changing the way Afghan farmers grow. They broadcast their seeds and our mid western military are teaching them to do it in rows for easier harvesting and better yields. You broadcast seeds to deceive the insects. In straight lines the bugs just keep marching. Now they are teaching them about insecticides, fertilizers, all which will ruin them as they have us.
    We are a nation of idiots, and most of them seem to be in power positions. Even Michelle’s organic garden at the WH can’t get them to think organic. It is to late to stop this mess.
    And think how those of us who have seen it since the 60’s at least and even long before (Wes Jackson of The Land Institute, Rodale,etc)feel at the continuing and increasing onslaught of stupidity. It’s not as if the info hasn’t always been there. It’s not as if people haven’t tried to be heard. It’s like talking to the birthers for crissakes. They can’t hear you. They will destroy the planet if they can’t be in power. If you don’t believe me go read Altemeyer’s research on Authoritarians in his book. It is terrorizing. The World Game at the end of it will show you just what we are all up against and we are not going to win. Trust me on that.
    Go read his ebook online or buy it bound at lulu.com

  175. messianicdruid August 4, 2009 at 8:33 pm #

    @asoka: Your 46 year period of grace is just a way to think you have put off the serious for someone else. It will work for those already in denial, and trying to pump themselves up with the good old days feeling, play a few tunes, and wish some more. People need to get their head out of their rectum in less than 46 days {you might make a case for 46 weeks} but what is real is the need to do it now, not sit on our hands on the back pew any longer.
    It reminds me of the scientists at NASA telling us about an asteroid that might impact the planet in 2029 {now you can go back to sleep little sleepy-heads – hit the snooze}.
    False hope is much worse than true fear, but this doesn’t even make that grade.

  176. orionoir August 4, 2009 at 8:58 pm #

    there’s a strong tone of morality to this piece, jim; i’m not sure i’ve noticed that in you before. my bias tends toward relativistic amorality, perhaps because i make fewer errors when i keep my eye on what’s going on instead of attempting to proclaim things right or wrong.
    i don’t think morality helps a damn bit when it comes to calling markets. the price of oil, especially, moves incomprehensibly, surely without regard to anyone’s analysis of what it should be doing. if anything, moral clarity is a handicap — andrew hall, for example, is the epitome of oppurtunism.

  177. Qshtik August 4, 2009 at 9:32 pm #

    “You are the most twisted, poor suffering fucker that every posted here.”
    Dale, your post is well said but at the moment JS is happy as a clam. For starters, all the attention is worth its weight in gold. The problem will come as he approaches the end of the line when the doubts and regrets set in with a vengence. Ever wonder about Popes on their deathbeds considering their role in 2000 years of bullshit?

  178. Dr. Doom August 4, 2009 at 10:52 pm #

    “Mostly I weep over Dr. Doom.”–JR
    Jesus H, JR, try reading your own blog once in awhile. I post over there a lot.
    Over here, all I do these days is get in pissing matches with dale and asoka. I admit I don’t have the stamina of OEO/zsazsa/fifi/aszasz/zzzzz. I couldn’t live in Cleveland, either.

  179. asoka August 4, 2009 at 11:07 pm #

    messianicdruid said: “False hope is much worse than true fear, but this doesn’t even make that grade.”
    I do not share your assessment that I am giving false hope. A 46-year-long emergency that progressively worsens until oil is gone (the rough downside of the bell curve) is not my idea of of any kind of hope.
    It is a brute reality and it is scary.
    The source I cited for the 46 year figure says:
    In the long run, an economy that utilizes petroleum as a primary energy source is not sustainable…
    Does that sound hopeful?

  180. messianicdruid August 4, 2009 at 11:19 pm #

    “Do not stock up on goodies that others will plunder. Learn to live off the land. Any city lot has weeds that are potentially good for eating. Dandelions anyone. Great greens and plentiful. Blossoms for wine. Any city has parks for foraging.”
    Wouldn’t it be nice if a few of us had the foresight to plant some pereniels and self-perpetuating “wild” plants. Do it now, conserve then help disperse those dandilion, wild grape, cat-tail and jerusalem artichoke seeds. You might also plant stuff animals like to eat, then eat those animals. Dig a pond, then stock it.

  181. asoka August 4, 2009 at 11:25 pm #

    “Your 46 year period of grace”…
    46 years is the blink of an eye in geologic time.
    We are in deep deep shit. No hope. No hope at all.

  182. abbeysbooks August 4, 2009 at 11:45 pm #

    http://www.landinstitute.com is Wes Jackson’s place which he has been doing big ag agricultural experimentation on for decades now. He was the inspiration for Rodale and their heirloom seeds are for perennial grains and inventing machines that will harvest them. No fertilizer, no watering systems, just restoring the plains (but not the Indians). They do much more in Salina KS and have a harvest festival every year.
    Shall we get a group organized to go this fall?

  183. abbeysbooks August 4, 2009 at 11:51 pm #

    Not for nothing did the greatest writer of his generation and more, commit suicide. I am speaking of David Foster Wallace, the writer of Infinite Jest, who forgot more about all this than any of us have altogether known.
    His Rolling Stones piece about McCain 2000 which he covered for them rivals and surpasses Hunter Thompson’s pieces.
    And you can buy the book or read it online at RS. I recommend it as an opening to Obama which it could also be about. Wallace takes you into his mind and its workings and you come out alive far wiser forever than when you went into that genius of a space.

  184. messianicdruid August 5, 2009 at 12:02 am #

    “NO INCUMBENTS” should be the battle cry at a poling place near you.
    You would have to define “incumbents” for most of the plebs. Just use my non-copyrighted version: RE_ELECT NOBODY, which I have been using since 1986. Problem is – it is still too complicated for most voters because they have watched too much TV to tell them who to vote for – {you know party lines} – or at least who to vote against. Duality rules the divided mind!

  185. messianicdruid August 5, 2009 at 12:08 am #

    “Shall we get a group organized to go this fall?” I’ll probably be walking. Fortunately it’s only a hundred miles from here. Swing by, I’ll help peddle. BUM315027..SLN

  186. abbeysbooks August 5, 2009 at 12:19 am #

    We could arrange to meet and I can drive us. If 75 year old ladies are OK with you. That’s me!

  187. Jaego Scorzne August 5, 2009 at 12:30 am #

    Thanks for posting that info about Nux Vomica as the remedy for Swine Flu. As I don’t plan to get vaccinated because of the mercury, I will definetly get the remedy. I’ll try the pee fertilizer too. But I don’t plan to stay in or near the cities during the Long Emergency. All over America there are people planting community urban gardens and getting ready to weather the storm, but it will be like expecting a sand castle to be able to resist the tide. So instead of investing more where you are right now, which sounds urban, you would be better off selling and going someplace much more remote. And how does race come into it? The more racially diverse an area is, the more likely it will descend into chaos and violence. The strongest communities are always uniracial-as Mr Kunstler portrays in his novel, A World Made by Hand.

  188. messianicdruid August 5, 2009 at 12:32 am #

    “The Hispanic community is not a national group as it is made up by people from 20 nationalities.”
    See how this sounds:
    The Caucausian community is not a national group as it is made up by people from 20 nationalities.
    And then read off a list of all the European Nations. Is there any reason one {a typical caucausian} cannot draw the same conclusions? ie: – I am non-racist because I am concerned about preserving the liberties of a majority of Americans.
    What I am really asking is: Why can’t Hispanics seek civil rights in their own countries, why must they immigrate to America to enjoy civil rights?

  189. ER1K August 5, 2009 at 12:34 am #

    It looks like 1932 again when Federal revenue fell off a cliff. (News story yesterday). In ’32 Pres. Hoover had to bail out failing states then tried to raise revenue with a National Sales Tax which was met with a near national Revolution.
    His only choice then was to raise the top tax rate from 20% to 63% on the rich. (Coolidge lowered it from 70% to 20% 10 years earlier which led to the stock market crash of ’29. )
    Time to now roll back the disastrous Reagan tax cuts (from 74% to 28%).

  190. abbeysbooks August 5, 2009 at 12:36 am #

    Because they don’t feel that they are able to accomplish anything where they came from. They are downtrodden, in poverty and depressed. the new place, the US,invigorates them, makes them feel possibilities.
    If you don’t believe me read Henry Miller. Or go to Europe in the winter and feel the centuries weighing down on you and come home in the spring and you feel you could do anything.

  191. abbeysbooks August 5, 2009 at 12:39 am #

    I have 40 acres-all paid for- here in the Ozarks with a possibility of 40 more if I can get the squatters out (and 2 houses). Near electric and water and telephone lines, although they aren’t necessary anymore.
    Plans? Homesteading is very hard work. Very hard. And it requires a lot of know how.

  192. ER1K August 5, 2009 at 12:40 am #

    Abbey, the Scandinavian countries are consistently rated the happiest countries on earth. Costa Rica as welll. The US is way down the list. They have a great social safety net so they have few of the overbearing worries that Americans do.

  193. Jaego Scorzne August 5, 2009 at 12:45 am #

    Thank you for finally admitting I’m right in the main: affirmative action=White Genocide. One could wish that White Women would have more loyalty, but they have been relentlessly conditioned since they were little kids that White Men are evil and Non Whites are good. In so many ads and catalogues you always see the same thing-a Black Man next to a Blonde Woman. And for the Black Man, the Blonde Woman-the “Whitest” Woman of all, is the ultimate trophy and symbol of sucess. And as I said before, it’s not just the propaganda, it also Woman’s nature to go where the money is. It doesn’t matter why White Men are down, all that matters is that they are and therefore should not be mated with.
    Thank you for allowing some Whites to survive when you become King, as “tokens”. Chris Rock says that some White Men should be kept around as breeding stock. We got keep Blacks supplied with those Blondes! You guys are all heart and I know you will forgive us when we do what we have to do. The next few decades will be the greatest trial of the White Race. We shall emerge a much stronger people shorn of our fools, idiots, and weaklings. They will either be dead or living with minorities. In any case, they will not be passing on their corrupt genes into our future.

  194. asoka August 5, 2009 at 12:47 am #

    MD said: “why must they immigrate to America to enjoy civil rights?”
    You have given the answer in your question. Why did the Italians, the Irish, the Germans, the English, the Poles, etc. immigrate in the 1700’s and 1800’s?
    To enjoy civil rights.
    Why do you want to slam the door shut now that your family has immigrated and is established?

  195. Jaego Scorzne August 5, 2009 at 1:10 am #

    Well what if it passes the First Gate, Truth, but not the Second Gate, Love, but it is necessary to talk about it? Sufism deals with the higher levels of Spirtual Life-the lower levels are dealt with by Shariah, the Law. And the Law of Islam, and Christianity, and Hinduism, teaches that you owe a debt to your Culture, Race, and to you Ancestors. Giving, Love, Charity? By all means, first your children, parents, spouse, cousins, friends, neighbors, town, city, district, country. People on the other side of the world? Sure, if you have anything left over. By definition, most people wont. And to make them feel guilty about this, to bombard them with charity kiddie porn is obscene. It’s Evil. Anglelina and Madonna aren’t models-they’re freaks. Angelina is actually a member of the Council of Foreign Relations, the evil group that has dominated our foreign policy for generations.
    The Sufi is a Son of the Moment. Nothing abides but His Face. Allah is recreating the Universe every instant.
    You didn’t think I would know about this stuff did you-poor White Trash Redneck me. I know about it and I love it-and many other Traditions as well. You are very presumptuous and need to eat a big piece of humble pie.
    The White Man has existed for at least fifty thousand years-since the days of the CroMagnon. And evolving-ten thousand years ago blondes and redheads arrived perhaps due to severe climactic conditons and also sexual selection. But now we are supposed just give away Europe and North America, and breed oursleves away with other Races? Not on my watch. Not if me and mine can help it. We have a duty to our Godlike Ancestors and to the Beautiful Ones who are not yet born.

  196. Jaego Scorzne August 5, 2009 at 1:33 am #

    No, I don’t think I would enjoy that at all. Or seeing regular hens pecking an albino hen to death either. One beautiful sight I did see where the sea met the land, is a crow and seagull having an aerial battle intertwing like the strands of the cadeucus. The yin and the yang. The Red Lion and the Green Unicorn. Finally, after many milliseconds, they separated and the crow being of the Earth went down and Seagull went up to explore the higher spaces where no crow goes. An apt metaphor for what should happen in the future. Nothing wrong with crows, they just can’t glide like angels. And angels can’t dance very well. Remember Blake’s Wisdom of Hell, “Oppositon is true friendship.”
    Ashoka is my muse. He helps define me by not being me. He make me more myself and I am eternally grateful.

  197. Jaego Scorzne August 5, 2009 at 1:42 am #

    Why? Because we have a full house. The same reason you can’t pour two gallons into a gallon container. You can try but you’ll make a mess. They’ll just ruin what they came here to find. America is phsically finite. Environmentalism, the great achievment of late twentieth century liberalism, is about limits. As a great French painter once said, “Genius is about knowing when to stop.” Your optimism is really just more American Hubris. And nemesis is coming on fast.

  198. asoka August 5, 2009 at 2:41 am #

    JS said: “Why? Because we have a full house.”
    Check out the population density of the USA. You will have to scroll down quite a ways to 177th out of 238 countries.
    We are not even close to having a full house.

  199. Kiwi Nick August 5, 2009 at 5:42 am #

    there is little reason to even debate technology and its possible roles in ameliorating the effects of resource shortages so long as we remain so far away from sociological fixes

    While I agree that sociological fixes are very important, technology is an absolute must.
    For a start, telephones and internet can reduce fuel use, and at any rate, the homeopathic types (including 10% of me) need the internet to view instructions for homeopathic treatments.
    I also vaguely remember (late ’80s) that troopers that stormed one of the Government buildings in Soviet Russia were stymied because the targets still had email. As one guy put it – “they had guns, but they forgot their wirecutters.”
    And didn’t someone else say the pen is mighter than the sword? The keyboard counts as a pen!

  200. rocco August 5, 2009 at 7:37 am #

    Thanks another great insight into the human condition of stool. I keep reading about the increase in child povery,illness,abuse all due to our failing ways and greed. I just finished watching Trade, the movie with Kevin Kline about the global sex trade of children, and how many partake for pure greed. Go to freetheslaves.net, JHK if you could touch on this some time, but being a former fan of Star Trek, and the positive future, maybe those crazy animal, earth right groups are right, mankind is sick, and maybe the world would be better without us. I urge all of your to prepare, and as the crazy strom appraoches rage against this child sex trade, join free the salves.net and let us go out fighting that at least one child is saved from man’s darkness.

  201. seawolf77 August 5, 2009 at 8:07 am #

    While I share your chagrin with our less than meritorious neighbors I believe you may be fundamentally flawed in your analysis. I see the descent happening far more loquaciously than even your comments describe. We have been zombified by the constant bombardment of advertising, the war of the sexes, the relentless pursuit of happiness, the iron fisted grip of pornography and masturbation, and a horrible diet of corn sugar based food. As prices rise, things slow, government spends, things pickup, prices go up, things slow blah blah blah right down the tubes. And you can bet in the end people are going to be sitting and standing around looking at each other and asking “What happened. Where did it all go? I thought things were getting better.” Look at the “Cash for Clunkers” program. That is their reaction to peak oil . Need I say more.

  202. seawolf77 August 5, 2009 at 8:08 am #


  203. Funzel August 5, 2009 at 8:53 am #

    Great,free liquid fertilizer.
    We’ve been using it for years,we have the greenest weeds(lawn) in the neighborhood.
    I use those 3 quart laundry detergent containers with removable spout.I have one at the bed site,one next to my computer and one in my work room,saves lots of steps,the carpet and flushing of very expensive water.
    Also saving rain water and the water from the RO in 550 gal tank that water is used for toilet flushing only.We use a 12v camper pump with automatic shut off,fed with power from our solar cells.
    Been working flawless for years.

  204. zzzzzz August 5, 2009 at 9:55 am #

    “The Hispanic community is not a national group as it is made up by people from 20 nationalities. It is not a racial group since you can find White Hispanics, Black Hispanics, Asian Hispanics, and Indian Hispanics. Although they are mostly Catholics, they are not a religious group.”
    Wow man. We are ALL Hispanics. So why the need for special representation, set asides, etc.? La Raza and all the rest of the Hispanic organizations should cease and desist immediately.

  205. zzzzzz August 5, 2009 at 10:00 am #

    “I couldn’t live in Cleveland, either.”
    Neither could I.

  206. asoka August 5, 2009 at 10:16 am #


  207. budizwiser August 5, 2009 at 10:18 am #

    It is impressive – to say the least – that most “news” outlets refuse to devote any thing more than a few seconds a night to the reality of America’s economic disasters.
    Two particular icebergs headed directly at the “S.S. America” are the increasingly lackluster Treasury Auction results and an increasingly dire straits “working Americans” are finding themselves in as unemployment compensations and other social assistance programs founder or cease altogether.
    I would expect like most “wartime” situations – our mainstream forms of media will offer ever more outrageous explanations for the bleak economic outlook, such as “American’s need to shop at Walmart and secondhand stores, and of course get “back to their roots” at the local church to excuse their “excesses” – which were previously manifested as a belief that if they worked hard all their lives they could own a home and a car.
    Yes, you disgusting American working people. You did this to yourselves. You charged things, you drove cars, you bought homes – this economic shit-storm is all your fault – so deal with it!
    Don’t expect the government to “help” you anymore. It did all it could – “cash for clunkers” is the last help you get……..
    And as a final insult – look for a national sales tax or some other regressive revenue schemes aimed at what’s left of the working poor.
    Watch for the onset of the “slanted” new casts – in the guise of human interest – the new whipping boy will become the hapless American consumer/borrower/worker. Wall Street? Its old news.

  208. Funzel August 5, 2009 at 10:25 am #

    Hey,Asoka,RACIST I don’t give damn what your so called latino communities are made of,i want these breeding hordes,eating up our paid for by Americans and mostly imported Food,out of here,pronto.We barely have enough food to feed our own unemployed and disadvantaged people,and don’t give me any of this shit you been spreading,these morons screwed themselves,now pack your bag and head back with your tribe to your beloved Mexico.

  209. Qshtik August 5, 2009 at 10:41 am #

    The following definitions are offered to assist other readers who may be confused:
    child povery: having to do with the Point Of View of children; also, having to do with the Privately Owned Vehicles in which children ride. (Not sure which Rocco had in mind.)
    crazy strom: an apparent reference to Strom Thurmond, segregationist and longest living U.S. Senator (Jaego Scorzne makes a pilgramage to his burial place annually)
    appraoches: No results found for appraoches.
    salves.net: A website dedicated to medicinal ointments.

  210. messianicdruid August 5, 2009 at 11:31 am #

    @asoka – You aren’t perceiving the differences in what is being sought, and what is being left. I’m defending liberty, you are defending “civil rights”. Liberty comes at no ones expense. You know, laizze faire: just leave me alone…
    Civil rights didn’t exist then, and liberty doesn’t exist now.

  211. wagelaborer August 5, 2009 at 11:49 am #

    Hey! Dale. I take offense to being called crazy for connecting the dots.
    Maybe in your world the US government is a benign institution looking out for the welfare of its people and the land we live in, but in the real world the military spends billions researching new and devastating weapons.
    Just because I pay attention to the drumbeats of corporate media, and assume that when they repeat a message continually, it means something, doesn’t make me insane.
    Just what do you reject? Do you think they didn’t dig up a 1918 flu victim and replicate the virus? I provided a link about that in my blog.
    Are they not hyping this new flu? Do we not hear almost daily about how it will be back in the fall in a new, more virulent form?
    Why can you not take them at their word?

  212. zzzzzz August 5, 2009 at 1:39 pm #

    “I take offense to being called crazy…”
    Why is that when you propose ideas which are crazy? You seem to think that someone would be able to release a flu virus that would have a predetermined outcome. That is not only crazy, that is rat-in-a-shit-house crazy.
    Haven’t you paid any attention to the recent outbreak of swine flu? It raced across the globe at break neck speed. Its still making its rounds. Any and all attempts to contain it have failed. So, how do you propose someone is going to release some sort of super flu that won’t end up killing the very people or the families of the people who release it? Are you truly this retarded?

  213. asoka August 5, 2009 at 1:40 pm #

    MD said: “Liberty comes at no ones expense. You know, laizze faire: just leave me alone…”
    So you don’t use any public roads?
    You don’t use the government postal service?
    You don’t have a fire dept. near you?
    You don’t ever want police services?
    You don’t eat food that is FDA inspected?
    You don’t use a public library?
    You don’t watch television or listen to the radio over airwaves licensed and provided by the FCC?
    You don’t receive any pension, social security, medicare, unemployment benefits?
    You don’t have a bank account that is guaranteed up to $250,000 against loss by the federal government?
    You don’t have need of any kind of educational institution? (that is not a loaded question)
    You don’t live in a country protected by armed forces?
    You just want to be left alone? …with your “liberty”? …
    … while everyone else pays for the safety and benefits and conveniences you enjoy while eating, driving, banking, watching television, listening to the radio, and posting to CFN, etc.

    Liberty comes at no one’s expense?

  214. messianicdruid August 5, 2009 at 2:07 pm #

    “Liberty comes at no one’s expense?”
    That’s right; perhaps I need to be explicite, At no one else’s expense. I am given fewer and fewer choices about all these “safety and benefits and conveniences” you list, while pretending to be describing “liberty”. The liberty I’m talking about does have one personal expense = eternal vigilance. That’s why it no longer exists for most of you “rights” junkies. You are busy hammering chains onto each others legs. Will you accept my “No Thanks” or do you need to be convinced?
    Why are you trading my liberties for your security {safety, benefits and conveniences}?

  215. Jaego Scorzne August 5, 2009 at 2:11 pm #

    Maybe the designers also designed a vaccine which they just happen to have available after the outbreak and are willing to manufacture and sell to differnet Goverments. Out of the goodness of their hearts! One conspiracy after another has come true over the last fifty years. Even orthodox historians are begining to accept that FDR knew an invasion of Pearl Harbor was imminent-he wanted something like that to get us into the war. And he had worked very hard to back Japan into a corner so they had to do something. And the Lusitania-the sinking of which got us into World War One-it is now accepted that is was filled to gills with munitions just as the Germans always claimed. The attempt to sink the Liberty by Israel-hasn’t hit the mainstream, yet.
    The sailors who survived were approached in their hospital beds and threatend with court martail, defamation, and prison if they ever breathed a word about it. Apparently Israel wanted to blame Egypt and get us into the war they were having at that time. A few years ago only right wing nuts said that America wanted to attack Iran. Then left wing nuts began saying it. Then a few of the more daring mainsteam journalists. And then suddenly everyone knew it and acted like they always had. Reinventing the past and giving no credit to those who knew first.

  216. asia August 5, 2009 at 2:15 pm #

    at one point in the 1990s there was a calendar for sale called:
    ‘america freedom lost’
    or something like that and had on each calendar square a note of a restrictive law passed somewhere in the usa ON THAT PARTICULAR DAY

  217. asia August 5, 2009 at 2:22 pm #

    you are a fool
    read frosty woolridge or JHK or anyone else who knows whats really going on
    CARRYING CAPACITY…….not space and ‘jobs’
    all the human 7? billion could be squeezed into texas or mexico…SO WHAT

  218. asia August 5, 2009 at 2:24 pm #

    any comments on Obamanations latest …
    ‘Look at the “Cash for Clunkers’

  219. dale August 5, 2009 at 2:44 pm #

    “the iron fisted grip of pornography and masturbation” – Seawolf

  220. B.B. August 5, 2009 at 2:47 pm #

    Jim, as most of us understand television and the light put on the gawdy and the deception.. The choosen of the righteous mindset are far less confused than people led astray by what they do not understand and have been threw.
    To be fair. It is certainly ok to absorb banks before the FDIC marks them and closes them. However do not you think this should be reported to the public? (SEE ABOVE THEY STILL PLAY THE SAME GAME) After all it is their savings and checking in those banks So much for the small people you should also be protecting ALSO.

  221. dale August 5, 2009 at 2:49 pm #

    On first reading, I assumed you intended to suggest that the government replicated the virus, with the intention to release it, if that is what you ment then….that’s batshit crazy, like the government bombed the twin towers crazy. If not, then I guess you were suggesting the government knows it’s a very bad virus and are not telling us, ……just a teensy bit paranoid. Sorry.

  222. Qshtik August 5, 2009 at 3:02 pm #

    Jaego, your posts are a VAST resource for a book I’ll be writing on paranoia once I work out some copywrite issues. They (your posts) are kinda the le brea tarpits of paranoia.

  223. asia August 5, 2009 at 3:13 pm #

    ..and 5 million got home loans
    also maybe ask catherine Fitts solari.com
    i mean that seriously

  224. Qshtik August 5, 2009 at 3:13 pm #

    B.B., two things:
    1. Do not write in all CAPS
    2. Brevity is the soul of wit.

  225. Qshtik August 5, 2009 at 3:22 pm #

    “When I broke soil, I felt an ineffable current of bliss rising from the ground into my body. It was (as) if the Earth itself was pleased and was personally welcoming me.”
    Awwww, Jaego’s gettin all warm and fuzzy on us.
    This makes me recall nostalgically my early teens around 1953-54 … I’ll try to keep it reasonably short. I grew up in south Jersey, about 7 miles as the crow flies from the heart of Philly. A quarter mile from my home was the last working farm (96 acres) in a region that a hundred years earlier was nothing BUT farms (hence “the Garden State”, I guess). It was known as Jarvis’ Farm. The tenent farmer’s full name was Clarence Victor Jarvis … is that a farmer’s name or WHAT?? He worked all those acres alone except for some occasional help from itinerant farm hands (badly in need of a bath and some dental work) or neighborhood boys like me, scraping together a stake to go shoot pool. Jarvis’ 93 year old mother cooked his “dinner” on a coal stove. (Imagine, I knew a person who lived during the Civil War.) Dinner happened when Jarvis came in from the heat of the mid-day and sat awhile exhausted in the shade of the back porch on a threshold stone worn by 200 years of footsteps. The thick hands resting on his knees looked like “distressed” leather. The scene was antebellum. His ancient mother in a dress and bonnet from Gone With the Wind wardrobe sprinkled grain on the ground for the chickens. I picked limas and tomatoes.
    Have you ever picked 10 bushels of beans and 25 half bushels of Jersey tomatoes in the blazing sun? I ask because I wonder if Jaego and all you other genteel weekend farmers with time on your hands know what your talking about … what your getting into. I can see you now, decked out in your on-line Sundance Catalog straw hat, your Nordstrom blue jeans and your Home Depot green fabric gloves with rubberized fingers and palms.
    I read to Jarvis’ ghost this line: “When I broke soil, I felt an ineffable current of bliss rising from the ground into my body” and it mumbled back through a mouth short on teeth, “who is this clown Jaego?”

  226. asia August 5, 2009 at 3:32 pm #

    if ya gonna write a book get a proof reader
    its ‘la brea’…weve been there

  227. Qshtik August 5, 2009 at 3:50 pm #

    Doctor, heal thyself: the first letter of a sentence should be in upper case and there’s an apostrophe in “we’ve.”

  228. zzzzzz August 5, 2009 at 3:50 pm #

    Efficacy of Flu Vaccines
    “In years when the vaccine strains are not well matched to circulating strains, vaccine effectiveness can be variably reduced. For example, in a study among persons 50-64 years during the 2003-04 season, when the vaccine strains were not optimally matched, inactivated influenza vaccine effectiveness against laboratory-confirmed influenza was 60% among persons without high-risk conditions, and 48% among those with high risk conditions, but it was 90% against laboratory-confirmed influenza hospitalization (Herrera, et al Vaccine 2006).
    A study in children during the same year found vaccine effectiveness of about 50% against medically diagnosed influenza and pneumonia without laboratory confirmation (Ritzwoller, Pediatrics 2005). However, in some years when vaccine and circulating strains were not well-matched, no vaccine effectiveness can be demonstrated in some studies, even in healthy adults (Bridges, JAMA 2000).
    It is not possible in advance of the influenza season to predict how well the vaccine and circulating strains will be matched, and how that match may affect the degree of vaccine effectiveness.”
    -Centers for Disease Control and Prevention

  229. asia August 5, 2009 at 3:54 pm #

    again you are a fool
    Haitians move to Miami because they are near starvation! Haiti overshot carrying capacity..and theres politics involved
    MD said: “why must they immigrate to America to enjoy civil rights?”
    the Irish, immigrate in the 1700’s and 1800’s?
    To enjoy civil rights.
    The irish due to potatoes…the highest yield crop on earth overshot CC, as is the earth / haiti/ etc
    and The irish circa 1850 to 1900 there was politics involved..the english were starving them off
    The immigration of 3? million irish over 50 years had to do with carrying capacity
    shutting the door on billions IS COMMON SENSE YOU FOOL
    ‘Why do you want to slam the door shut now that your family has immigrated and is established?’

  230. Jaego Scorzne August 5, 2009 at 4:29 pm #

    Well no doubt farming is hard work at times. Certainly harder than being a hunter gatherer. Most estimates say that they only worked 15 to 20 hours a week. Farmers worked more but not as much as the city dwellers of the industrial revolution. At each stage of man’s progress, his load of work has increased. Back in the twenties, they were saying how technology would free us from such long hours. There was movement in that direction, but greed and competition got in the way. Now the hours are getting longer again-for those who can even get a job. Our civilization will only justify itself when we can live simply and nobly like the ancient hunter gatherers. With advanced technology we should be able to do it. People who want to work more because they want luxuries or because they love their job would be welcome to. Competition? Sure, for luxuries and honors-not for survival.
    Now a large farm is more than a fourty hour a week job. But I will seek only a homestead-eneough acreage to raise my own food. That could be eneough for a man if it weren’t for the illegal property taxes. Also the health benefits of some manual labor in the morning before the sun is too strong or in the evening, are superb. Working in an office is death for the body. You are surrounded by plastic and steel and flourescent lights flickering so fast you can’t see it-but your nervous system is annoyed by this flickering. I want to stay in shape and be able to see my own genitals when I look down. Hunting would be good too, but present conditions mitigate against such a lifestyle. What joy it must be to kill your own meat and feel the life force of the animal flow into you. One would be remiss not to say a prayer for the animal’s spirit.
    Have you never felt the energy of the Earth come up into your body? What’s wrong with you? Go outside right now and walk on your lawn barefoot. And since you are an old man, are you meditating everyday on your own death? Do not the Psalms say, “Man born of Woman is of few days and full of trouble, he cometh like the flower and is cut down.” Visualize yourself as a dandelion and see the mower coming towards you-because it is.

  231. Poet August 5, 2009 at 5:08 pm #

    Actually, the idea of jest once upon a time was that the jester could say to the maximum leader by humor what no one else dared to utter seriously.
    But our culture is so beyond that we have gotten to the point where we are living in our illusions rather than uderstanding and rightly using them for the fantasy and momentary diversions they might offer.

  232. abbeysbooks August 5, 2009 at 5:10 pm #


  233. asoka August 5, 2009 at 5:19 pm #

    MD said: “Why are you trading my liberties for your security ”
    I’m sorry. I assumed you are living in the United States. You must be unfamiliar with the Declaration of Independence, which says:
    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
    UNALIENABLE RIGHTS. Liberty cannot be taken from you. Certainly not by illegal immigrants or liberals.
    The United States was founded on liberty that is unalienable. That is what it means to be American.
    But then I realized you must not live in the United States. Americans do not whine about how “others” are “trading their liberties”
    Liberty can’t be taken away. It is an UNALIENABLE right.

  234. abbeysbooks August 5, 2009 at 5:21 pm #

    They don’t seem to worry about the death of their families with tobacco,HFCS in almost all foods,contaminated soil,water, crops,people, animals and so on and so on. Why do you think they will look ahead to their families about a virus. They don’t think in consequences unless it is $. Really people don’t care. I read in Discover magazine years ago that some scientists were working on blowing up the moon. Seriously!
    It couldn’t happen to me!

  235. abbeysbooks August 5, 2009 at 5:28 pm #

    A book written in the early 50’s titled This Is Pearl accounts day by day and moment by moment the transcribing breaking of the Japanese Code used before PH. In this book lectured on by my history professor in 1954 shows clearly that we knew and that all our ships were put there like sitting ducks.
    Yes Hitler had to be defeated. But he could have been stopped just after he began by the English and the French. His generals were astonished he got away with it and so was Hitler. From Shirer’s Rise and Fall of the Third Reich. A minute by minute account of the days before 9-1-39.

  236. abbeysbooks August 5, 2009 at 5:37 pm #

    Slow down here. Houellebecq has written extensively in his novels about this subject of pornography and masturbation.
    He has said that sexual freedom has resulted in the takeover by capitalism into the arena of sexual choice. We have all become sexual commodities.The ugly, infirm, the old etc have been dropped out by the wayside. It used to be everyone who wanted could find someone, but now with sexual freedom paramount this is not the case. The winners are the young and beautiful. All others have to buy it and continue to pay and pay and be humiliated by unfaithfulness at best.
    The capitalism of sex has arrived. How do you like it?
    Durrell said it long ago. “Now that women have the pill they have become a commodity, like hay or corn, and are no longer an event, a serious encoounter, in a man’s life.”

  237. abbeysbooks August 5, 2009 at 5:54 pm #

    A bit of history:
    Pearl Harbor known about and let happen. Result War II
    Lusitania containing munitions and American passengers to attract sinking. Result War I
    Blow up of the Maine in Havana blamed on Spanish. Result Spanish-American War (an anarchist individual did it with no relation to any country)
    9-11 Twin Towers. Information ignored and refusing to hear Clarke’s warning. Result Bush II presidency saved by war in Afghanistan and Iraq.
    When deception works so well why change the plan?

  238. messianicdruid August 5, 2009 at 5:54 pm #

    “Liberty can’t be taken away. It is an UNALIENABLE right.”
    So, have we now established that “safety, benefits and conveniences” are not liberty? I just want to make sure we are on the same page.

  239. asoka August 5, 2009 at 6:44 pm #

    I’m not sure if we are on the same page or not.
    I am not whining about liberals or illegal aliens taking away my liberties.
    And I don’t have laissez faire fantasies dancing in my head.

  240. Urban_Underclass August 5, 2009 at 7:27 pm #

    We’re all DOOMED, DOOMED!!!!

  241. asoka August 5, 2009 at 8:03 pm #

    I didn’t realize things were so bad!
    How long before the Internet collapses completely and we can go back to using libraries and reading books?

  242. jerry August 5, 2009 at 8:44 pm #

    I have to agree with you. The green shoots are yellow and wilting because Obama, and Bush before him, gave away the Treasury to what was needed to reform our economy.
    The economy is not on the upswing but swinging slowly as it begins to further slow down. Corporate earning are horrible. Wall Street rallies because bad earnings are not as bad as predicted so let’s rally!
    There will be a new paradigm and that is that the last 25 years are gone for good. Those good ole days were an aberration. A fluke of Bubble Good Times. Now we are taking Bubble Bath.
    The cash for clunkers is still amounting to consumer debt. This is a bubble brewing. The American youth, for example in D.C., are spending but increasing their debt levels especially when they need to save it up for the days ahead. But they walk in the fog left by millions of other dreamers.

  243. Urban_Underclass August 5, 2009 at 9:48 pm #

    Well Asoka, the internet is designed to be pretty resilient, so what will happen is that as power grids go down and IT companies go bust individual servers and storage systems will fail or be turned off and we will have a new phenomenon, a shrinking internet.
    Once it starts to decay I would imagine that most of it will collaspe quite quickly, in the next few years I would guess, but as it has military and stratiegic importance I would expect that the internet, in some form will be around for maybe a decade or so.

  244. messianicdruid August 5, 2009 at 9:50 pm #

    “I am not whining about liberals or illegal aliens taking away my liberties.”
    But, you said, I can’t lose my liberty. It seems as easy for you to confuse warning with whining as it is for you to confuse liberty with security.
    Economic liberty involves each of us paying for our own “safety, benefits and conveniences”. When the money fails no one will be able to afford the price of security.
    Will you whine when your “safety, benefits and conveniences” have been alienated, legally?
    “Liberty comes at no ones expense. You know, laizze faire: just leave me alone…” Life, Liberty, and THE PURSUIT of happiness. The pursuit is up to each individual, unless he uses force, coersion or theft to attain it. These three methods always involve others, for some reason.

  245. asoka August 5, 2009 at 9:52 pm #

    UU said: “I would expect that the internet, in some form will be around for maybe a decade or so.”
    Do you have a source that substantiates that estimate of a decade?
    Do you really think things are going to continue for another ten years? That would be good news.

  246. Urban_Underclass August 5, 2009 at 10:02 pm #

    No source Asoka, no crystal ball, I used the word guess.
    But I expect the military will tough it out for quite some time, they have the weapons, the resources, the survival training, the numbers and they WILL have martial law.
    Stripped to it’s bare bones the internet is a military system designed to communicate by any and all means necessary.

  247. asoka August 5, 2009 at 10:25 pm #

    So you were really talking about “economic liberty” all along? That is not what you started out saying.

  248. Urban_Underclass August 5, 2009 at 10:35 pm #

    Asoka, I do not know what “economic liberty” is, maybe you could enlighten me.

  249. Jaego Scorzne August 5, 2009 at 10:40 pm #

    Hitler could have crushed the British at Dunkirk but he chose not to. He had a tremendous admiration for the Empire-he knew that the for centuries the best Nordic Blood had migrated or fought their way into England. He wanted Germany and Great Britain to be allies and form a bulwark against the rising tide of color and the under men or untermensch who were behind them. Even at the 11th hour an attempt at truce was made when Hess flew to Scotland. But the alcoholic bulldog Churchill wouldn’t see him. They kept him locked up for 25 years and then mudered him the day before he was to be released. An orderly told Hess’s son Wolf that the assasins were dressed as British Servicemen but had American accents.

  250. SNAFU August 5, 2009 at 11:09 pm #

    Reply to my little Zz posting that I inadvertently overlooked :
    “Correct, numbnuts you are not. I, as every person on this post have purchased aspirin. It is apparent that charging $25.00 for aspirin is out of line. You know nothing of the components used in your surgery. You merely cite a layman’s conjecture. It is based on nothing”
    Perhaps you consider yourself to be a layman; however, I do not consider myself to be in the same category with you, as I have extensive engineering experience in designing testing and certifying electronic, mechanical, instrumentation and pyrotechnic equipment for aircraft, rockets and flight simulators.
    You remind me of the personality type I categorized as the “technical charlatan” when I was working. They are blowhards who assert their superior knowledge about all things and denigrate anyone who disagrees with their bloviations. In Texas they are known as “all hat and no cattle” in the Air Force as “all cock balls and no forehead”. It is doubtful that you have had the insight or the capability to become what JHK has been recommending for sometime now “a jack of all trades”. Small time farmers, as I once was, have to become jacks of all trades because you can’t afford to have a Vet out when you only have 50-100 cattle and 10-15 horses, etc. you perform the majority of your own veterinary services; nor can you afford to hire mechanics, welders, electricians, carpenters, loggers……… at $25-$30 an hour you learn to do it all. Of course having degrees in automotive technology, astronautical engineering and graduate level courses in bioengineering and physiology come in handy as well.
    “I said I paid $36.00 for a set, you fucking MORON. There are 6 in a set.”
    My bad I thought you were driving a two holer. Ok so $6 per plug (by the way spark plugs are probably 10 times as complex to design and build as the highly vaunted, by you, suture anchors; no make that 100 times) and $75 per hour for your mechanic. Plugs probably cost him $1 each my mechanic, when I need him, will put in parts that I buy and he only charges $30/hr I think I’d move if I were you.
    “Hey, fuck-lips”
    Oh my I didn’t think I was that obvious how did you catch on so quickly? My bad again, of course it takes one to know one.
    “I didn’t propose anything. I linked you to an article that stated that doctors are only compensated for 60 to 80% of their health services by Medicare. Dat da fact. Then you say”
    And your intention for the link to the article was NOT to imply that you are vouching for the veracity of said article?
    “Well pea brain”
    My my my my my my I must be an open book to you Zz I did not realize that my minuscule brain size was so obvious I must remember to wear my Stetson.
    “they do lose that much. They take Medicare patients in spite of that. Therein lies the proof that they are not all greedy cocksuckers. Guess you little theory doesn’t hold up.”
    Au contraire my little Zz once again your abysmal lack of worldly experience shines through. About 5 years ago (three years prior to becoming eligible for medicare) my right knee was completely replaced in a local small town hospital. At the time my health insurers were BC/BS federal (oh and thank you again my little Zz for helping pay via your taxes). The hospital bill was a bit under $30K they accepted a bit under $14K from BC/BS, the surgeon’s bill was about $8.5K he accepted about $4K, the surgeon’s assistant’s bill was about $2K he accepted about $750 the gas passer’s bill was about $2.9K he accepted about $1.5K. I had to pay the hospital $100, the surgeon about $400, his assistant about $175 and the gas passers about $250 from my wallet. So the way my pea brain calculates it the hospital got roughly 47% of what it billed, the surgeon got about 52% of what he billed, his assistant got about 46%of what he billed and the gas passer got about 60% of what he billed. So the moral of this story is become a gas passer; no no no the moral is that it appears to this “numbnuts” that being compensated 60 to 80% of billable by medicare beats the shit out of being compensated 50 to 60% by health insurers such as BC/BS
    “If you neighbor is assisting you what is so fucking altruistic about you paying him for his services? You think he should do it for free? You really are an ASSHOLE-A-TARD. Now STFU and go milk your neighbor, retard.”
    My bad again my little Zz I should have explained that his IQ is quite possible in the same range as yours, no no let’s not be hasty his is probably a few points higher than yours but be that as is may I could likely hire a 10th grade drop out, come to think of it he is a 10th grade dropout, for half of what I pay him. My little Zz are you in need of some labor intensive employment? I can only pay about 8-$10/hr but I can turn you into a jack of all trades if you have the ass to do the work.

  251. SNAFU August 5, 2009 at 11:18 pm #

    “Not so. As NG burns cleaner, maintenance costs decrease and engine life increases.”
    Oh it’s my little Zz of the technical charlatan clan again. Right you are NG burns cleaner; however, unless you have been living on Mars, too little O2 in the atmosphere to enable the operation of an I/C engine, it is not unusual for today’s gasoline and especially for diesel powered engines to surpass 200K miles easily. How many drive their vehicles over 200K miles? Me me me me, 360K+ on my Ford E-350 diesel, how about you my little Zz? Tune-ups? I believe the “BIG” three recommend changing the plugs every 100K miles and the oil and filter every 5 to 10K miles depending on the use of petroleum or synthetic based oil and I doubt that fuel type will affect the life span of an air filter. Oh now I understand, my little Zz is maneuvering to get into Asoka’s good graces.

  252. asoka August 5, 2009 at 11:22 pm #

    UU, I’m sorry.
    The message I sent to you was intended for MessianicDruid, who used the phrase “economic liberty”.
    I also have no idea what he is talking about.

  253. asoka August 5, 2009 at 11:31 pm #

    UU said: “the internet is a military system ”
    Agreed. It had its start through ARPA for military.
    I would “guess” we have closer to 46 years of internet than 10 years of internet.
    Everything has become so dependent on it: banking, transportation, commerce, electric grids, government records, etc. that I’m surprised it has not been successfully attacked and brought down by cyber terrorists as a way to shutting down the whole country instead of bringing down two towers.

  254. asoka August 5, 2009 at 11:32 pm #

    DARPA = Defense Advanced Research Projects Administration

  255. asoka August 5, 2009 at 11:40 pm #

    DARPA was a government-run program. So, the government does not fuck up everything.
    DARPA did create the internet. The internet is proof that government-run programs work.

  256. jim e August 6, 2009 at 12:21 am #

    MRS. Abbeysbooks, As the most beautiful LADY, I ask you this question. What do you think of bicycles?

  257. Urban_Underclass August 6, 2009 at 12:23 am #

    Asoka, you wrote,
    “I’m surprised it has not been successfully attacked and brought down by cyber terrorists as a way to shutting down the whole country instead of bringing down two towers.”
    That’s my point. The internet is resilient, it has no center or main point to attack. It uses every available means to make sure its ‘packets’ of information are delivered. An individual website or server can be attacked, and this has happen but it seems take a lot of effort for little reward.
    10 years 46 years who can tell? Not me.

  258. jim e August 6, 2009 at 12:25 am #

    My top hat is “Bicycle Mechanic”

  259. jim e August 6, 2009 at 12:30 am #

    It is the CURE!

  260. headinthegame August 6, 2009 at 12:35 am #

    We are headed for some serious chaos. My latest theory. Barbara Boxer is Marie Antoinette. http://tinyurl.com/l2q7to

  261. jim e August 6, 2009 at 12:38 am #

    A man on a bicycle is more efficient than a bird in flight.

  262. Urban_Underclass August 6, 2009 at 12:42 am #

    I would imagine a bird on a bicycle is also more efficient than a man in flight 🙂

  263. jim e August 6, 2009 at 12:44 am #


  264. jim e August 6, 2009 at 12:48 am #

    There are so many excellent over 50 riders in my state and city. Nowhere is it better. Heart rate is 180 for over an hour.

  265. jim e August 6, 2009 at 12:50 am #

    And we do have a stars and stripe Jersey that rides with us!

  266. jim e August 6, 2009 at 1:06 am #

    When Olheiser plays there are two.

  267. jim e August 6, 2009 at 1:08 am #

    He is only 35.

  268. messianicdruid August 6, 2009 at 1:30 am #

    “So you were really talking about “economic liberty” all along? That is not what you started out saying.”
    You don’t remeber what I started out saying. I asked, “Why can’t Hispanics seek civil rights in their own countries, why must they immigrate to America to enjoy civil rights?” And you wanted me to think I answered my own question {so you wouldn’t have to} by asking, “Why did the Italians, the Irish, the Germans, the English, the Poles, etc. immigrate in the 1700’s and 1800’s?
    and answered your own question incorrectly with, “To enjoy civil rights.”
    No, they came here to enjoy Liberty, of various and sundry types. The civil rights movement didn’t happen for another half-century.
    My question remains unanswered, Why can’t these immigrants persue their “civil rights” in their own home. Wouldn’t you prefer to have your civil rights in your own country among your own people?
    If “civil rights” are lost in America, where will you go to restore them. If Liberty is lost in America, where will you go to restore it?
    asoka asked, “Why do you want to slam the door shut now that your family has immigrated and is established?” I didn’t say anything about slamming any doors. I am trying to help us determine why “civil rights” and now “safety, benefits and conveniences” cannot be found in the places were these immigrants call home.
    Would you {as an American} want to travel to Qinghai {for example} to obtain civil rights when you could have them in Iowa {for example}?

  269. jim e August 6, 2009 at 1:38 am #

    Are not central Americans, Americans? South Americans, Americans? And what is Caucasian? Do not most of the ” Illegals ” have more Indigenous blood than most of us?

  270. asoka August 6, 2009 at 1:58 am #

    MD, I think I’m beginning to see what your point is.
    Have you ever lived in a third world country, or traveled to places like the outskirts of Mexico City or Mumbai?
    It is easy for you to say “why don’t they stay home and change their own countries?” The possibility is remote.
    It would be like someone sayin to you, “why don’t your USA troops stay in their own country and get out of our country (Colombia, Iraq, Korea, Germany, Okinawa, etc.)
    You are just as powerless to make macro-changes in USA military policy as the immigrants are to make changes in their countries.
    It is much easier to go somewhere where civil rights already exist, where freedom already exists. A wonderful place where a majority of the population is white and elect an excellent black man president.

  271. jim e August 6, 2009 at 1:59 am #

    Mr. Kunstler, I intend to be a silent observer here until your group is READY TO EMBRACE CYCLING… They seem to be hiding behind that 40 hour work week.

  272. jim e August 6, 2009 at 2:11 am #


  273. bahmi August 6, 2009 at 5:58 am #

    Obama is an activist president. No, he doesn’t own fiddles, he owns aspirations of exercising freakish control over not just the US, but the world. He’s our first narcissist president, hooray for your choice. You probably love the witch Pelosi, too. Good for you, clearly you are a man of vision.

  274. Danm August 6, 2009 at 8:19 am #

    My own perspective continues to suggest that there is little reason to even debate technology and its possible roles in ameliorating the effects of resource shortages so long as we remain so far away from sociological fixes to our corrupted government structures and mega-maniacal activities of corporate leaders.
    At the beginning of trade we had barter. Then to increase the efficiency of trade, we created our monetary system.
    This monetary system is at the root of specialization. Technology depends on this specialization.
    If our monetary system implodes, technology will suffer because the whole trade process will go backwards.
    So all you optimists thinking technology will get us out of this mess better believe our leaders will be able to patch up this screwed up financial system.
    Meanwhile turbulence #2 is coming: CRE.

  275. messianicdruid August 6, 2009 at 8:33 am #

    “It is much easier to go somewhere where civil rights already exist, where freedom already exists.”
    But if you don’t bring or aquire the beliefs and habits that nuture liberty, in a generation it will extinguish. Our own children are failing to learn these things. Your initial response showed this confusion.
    When people consider force, coersion and theft normal methods of obtaining security, they are only kidding themselves. Hiring thugs on a macro level to do these things for you is still force, coersion and theft.
    Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness – if civil rights or “safety, benefits and conveniences” make you happy you are free to add them to your list and lawfully pursue them. I think these were written in order of importance.
    Economic liberty {property rights} cannot be enjoyed in a democracy because 51% of the people can vote to have 49% of the people for lunch.
    Can you see why asking {or coercing or forcing} people to sacrifice their own interests for the sake of others fails to motivate when their own happiness or liberty or life is in danger?

  276. Danm August 6, 2009 at 9:08 am #

    Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness
    Maybe the goal is wrong or ill defined.
    What is happiness? We are still trying to define it. How can you build something coherent, stable and long lasting when no one is on the same page?

  277. dale August 6, 2009 at 10:27 am #

    Regarding Pearl Harbor: As usual, the truth is a lot more prosaic. No one believed the Japanese had the capacity, the will or the audacity to attack Pearl. To give you some indication of the quality of military minds in those days, it was widely assumed, in high military circles, that the Japanese had such poor eyesight they wouldn’t have good enough pilots to be used on carriers. That’s right, it wasn’t a grand conspiracy, just the usual stupidity and over confidence.

  278. budizwiser August 6, 2009 at 10:53 am #

    JK – thought you would like to know – there is still hope for a sane approach to bringing rail travel back to the efficiencies of the past.

  279. messianicdruid August 6, 2009 at 12:34 pm #

    “What is happiness? We are still trying to define it. How can you build something coherent, stable and long lasting when no one is on the same page?”
    We need not define happiness for one another. Let’s work on the more important items first. What is life? Can we get on the same page on that? What is Liberty? Can we {asoka?} get on the same page with that?
    Happiness is an all encomapssing term, that’s why it was used. Let each define his own, according to his own station in life and the needs and wants of the moment.
    Can you be happy without life? Can you be happy without liberty? Can you build “something coherent, stable and long lasting” without them?
    If people don’t or won’t respect your life and liberty {and next we must talk about property}, why would you want to build anything with or even near them? Leave ’em alone.
    See, this is our last chance. There is no where else to immigrate to {unless you count iceburgs} to build a life with the protections of liberty, and the options of happiness.

  280. zzzzzz August 6, 2009 at 12:40 pm #

    Kenny boy sez:
    “I have extensive engineering experience in designing testing and certifying electronic, mechanical, instrumentation and pyrotechnic equipment for aircraft, rockets and flight simulators.
    You remind me of the personality type I categorized as the “technical charlatan” when I was working. They are blowhards who assert their superior knowledge about all things and denigrate anyone who disagrees with their bloviations.”
    Hey Kenny-boy, you are the one that thinks they have enough insight to assign what a medical implement should cost. You are the one claiming “superior knowledge about all things”. Based on fucking what? Do you have any idea of what a medical implement manufacturer most go through before a device can be placed in a human body? It is absolutely mind-boggling, the hoops that must be jumped through to gain approval. Your “extensive engineering experience” does not apply to medical devices. Even though you could logically assume that the device need not be complex and should cost “X” it doesn’t apply.
    Now ask yourself why medical implements cost so much. Well people can die if they malfunction. Thats a logical reason. But the example you cite (your shoulder-suture-anchor-thingy) probably wouldn’t result in death. So why does it cost so much? Because of overly intrusive governmental agencies. The same MORONS that gave us $1000 toilet seats in aircraft. And you want to hand healthcare over to these geniuses? Be my fucking guest. Think prices and quality of care are fucked up now? Stick around, paley.
    Per your neighbor you are helping out. Right on bro. That is a charitable act. You, as an individual have chosen to do so. Cool. No government interference. No papers, no forms no directives. This is how it should happen.

  281. zzzzzz August 6, 2009 at 12:41 pm #

    abbeysbooks sez:
    I read in Discover magazine years ago that some scientists were working on blowing up the moon. Seriously!
    Seriously? Ah, OK. What-fucking-ever.

  282. Urban_Underclass August 6, 2009 at 12:53 pm #

    Mr. Kunstler Sir,
    Do you want the bad news first or the good news?
    Okey Dokey, so given the nature of this blog, I will give the bad news first.
    The Bad News:
    1) There is only one copy of ‘A World Made by Hand’ in the entire Irish Public Library System.
    2) When I asked about ordering a copy the librarian hummed and hawed a bit and said, “Well the reviews aren’t very good.” To elaborate, “Good ideas but ponderous and long winded” and “a dismalist”.
    The Good News
    1) There is a copy of ‘The Long Emergency’ in my local library.
    2) I stood my ground and said that you were very happening with all this peak oil and stuff. So she relented and agreed to order a copy, which means that at a stroke I doubled the total number of copies of ‘A World Made by Hand’ in the Irish public library system.
    Keep up the good work!

  283. zzzzzz August 6, 2009 at 1:01 pm #

    Kenny sez:
    “Oh it’s my little Zz of the technical charlatan clan again. Right you are NG burns cleaner; however, unless you have been living on Mars, too little O2 in the atmosphere to enable the operation of an I/C engine”
    What the fuck are you talking about? Read on, kenny-boy:
    “The Advantages and Disadvantages of CNG Conversion Kits
    Compressed natural gas is one of the most viable alternative fuel options today. Natural gas has been used as fuel in domestic households for many years but it hasn’t achieved mainstream use as fuel for automobiles. So far, there is only one natural gas vehicle or NGV available to the general public, the Honda Civic GX. Unfortunately, the Civic GX is not readily accessible since it has a very limited production and availability.
    As an alternative to buying an NGV, car owners can also choose to convert an existing vehicle to run on CNG by retrofitting a CNG conversion kit.
    A CNG conversion kit is basically a set of components and tools that are installed in a vehicle so it can operate using both gasoline and CNG. CNG conversion kits usually come with parts such as regulator, high pressure tubing and fittings, pressure gauge, filling nozzle, hoses, hose clamps, closed loop fitting system, emulator, timing advance processor, fuel change over switch as well as the necessary wiring, straps and screws.
    The fuel change over switch allows the driver to switch from gasoline to CNG in just a flick of a button. CNG conversion kits usually do not include the CNG tank or cylinder as well as the cylinder valve. They are purchased separately from the CNG conversion kit.
    Using CNG conversion kits has several advantages and a handful of disadvantages too. For people who are contemplating on making the switch from purely gasoline-run vehicle to a CNG/gasoline bi-fuel system, knowing these advantages can help you make the right decision that is best for you.
    Natural gas is significantly less expensive than gasoline. The cost of natural gas can go as low as $0.64 a GGE or Gasoline Gallon Equivalent. In some areas, natural gas costs as low as a third of the cost of gasoline, on average.
    CNG is more eco-friendly than gasoline. Natural gas produces far fewer harmful emissions and hydrocarbons than gasoline.
    Using CNG makes the engine cleaner and more efficient. Unlike gasoline, CNG does not produce harmful carbon deposits when combusted. This results to a cleaner and more efficient engine as well as longer lasting spark plugs and catalytic converters. Oil changes are also minimized because of carbon deposits that contaminate the oil is eliminated.
    CNG is abundant in the US. The country has extensive natural gas resources and a well-established network of pipelines. Switching to CNG can help ease the country’s dependence to foreign oil whose price continue to fluctuate.
    CNG makes the engine run quieter. Because of the higher octane levels of natural gas, the engine runs quieter resulting to minimized engine nose.
    CNG tanks require storage space. If you convert to CNG, you may need to sacrifice some of the space in the trunk (for cars), truck bed (for pickup trucks) or behind the back seat (for SUVs). The CNG cylinder is also heavy but the added weight of the tank is offset by the reduced weight of a gasoline fuel tank that is near empty.
    CNG Filling stations have limited availability. Some areas in the US still have few filling stations and some places have none at all. CNG conversion is most practical and convenient for people living in areas with easy access to CNG filling stations.”
    Link here:
    Kenny, try not to be an expert on every topic as you are beginning to look like a MORON. I claim no expertise. I merely link to the experts. You are not, nor will you ever be, one of my links. That is all, jack-off of all trades.

  284. Jaego Scorzne August 6, 2009 at 1:08 pm #

    Great, the ultimate and inevitable end of PC: Whites don’t exist but other races do and they’re the real Americans. Our people defeated the Indians and created this country. Now Indians and Mestizos want to take it from us and claim all our incredible achievments as their own. It will never happen. They may ruin America but they will never control it or at least not the whole of it. The “Red” states will secede if they can and if they are not allowed to go, then a fourth generation style war (terror) will commence. There are already half a dozen seccesion movements-and they are talking to each other. The League of the South is in communication with the Vermont group. And if two groups this different can get together in the same room, you gotta believe that it’s something that has broad appeal.
    Ultra-Liberal Hatemongers may not be willing and able to define White People, but they sure can pick us out when it’s time to discriminate against us. This is how nationas fall: betrayed from within.

  285. Qshtik August 6, 2009 at 2:04 pm #

    “Do not the Psalms say …….etc.”
    I think we need to recap how we arrived at this point in our conversation. A couple of weeks ago I lamented people’s (including my own kids) lack of understanding of compound interest. You replied that the implications of compound interest were so yesterday and what I SHOULD do is learn about the compound bow and read Lord of the Flies. I told you you needed to relax and smile at the first person you passed on the street ’cause life is short and you are no doubt closer to the end than the beginning.
    Now, in the last day or so, you have taken a new tack … with energy coming from the soil and entering your body when you stick a shovel in … gathering nuts and berries and saying a prayer for the imagined animal that you imagined you “slayed” for dinner and falling into preacherly sentence structure (“Do not the Psalms say”). I’m wise to you. I read this crap, lean away from my laptop and my eyes roll back in my head.
    Jaego, you have departed on a fantasy trip to some glamorized notion of remote Montana where you acquire a “homestead” (i.e. some ramshackle structure where some other poor bastard couldn’t make a go of it and the bank foreclosed), stay in shape planting beans in the cool mornings, and harvesting them before sundown. And in-between you do target practice in anticipation of brown hordes coming in Greyhound buses from Detroit to steal your crops.
    Let’s get real … you will do NONE of this. What you WILL do is stop off on your way home from work at Shoprite, pick up a can of Planters mixed nuts, a bag of grapes and a pre-cooked chicken. There will be no prayer for the bird but you’ll curse the long lines at the checkout. And you will do this because the segmentation of labor that has evolved did not make you a farmer but rather (perhaps) an accountant and those who did become farmers evolved into BIG CORPORATE FARMERS because of “economies of scale.”
    Further, you’ve got some pair of brass balls on you quoting scripture and warning ME about life being short. No, I warn YOU. Take all that summer soldier and sunshine spirituality and get yourself a shrink.

  286. QUINTERO August 6, 2009 at 3:23 pm #

    I tried clicking link and my PC crashed

  287. QUINTERO August 6, 2009 at 4:01 pm #

    politician = narcissist

  288. Jaego Scorzne August 6, 2009 at 4:21 pm #

    You sound angry, yes? Good. You’ve been disrespectful to me and now you complain about my brass balls. Anyway, anything is better than your usual smirking blase contempt for every concern people bring up. As long as you can laugh at something or someone who don’t have to take them seriously or be respectful. It’s all you. But even prostitutes have feelings and are people. Remember you compared posting here to going to a prostitute? Well yee-harrr, this prostitute just hit paydirt and got your wallet. And btw, the exercises I gave you are real and could have a good effect-if you could get out of your fucking head for just a minute and try them with an open mind. And as for me, I really am strange, no accountant I. And I do really intend to leave the cities and go to the boonies to get away from what’s coming. Crazy? Sure I’m crazy; crazy like a fox. How to undestand me in the future: when I sound serious, I may be laughing and when I’m laughing, I’m often dead serious. How can you tell? That’s the beauty of it, you don’t have to. After all, you can’t see my face. But what you can do, or at least you could, is reply to the content of what I’m saying. Agree or disagree. You don’t always have to disparage. Or don’t say anything at all. I will give you that option and leave you alone-as long as you don’t talk shit about me. Here we have a new begining. Your move.

  289. abbeysbooks August 6, 2009 at 4:41 pm #

    I am in love with bicycles and have always been. When I was in K my father brought home a tiny perfectly mechanical silver charm for my bracelet. A bicycle. I know that word in Italian but can’t spell it bichicletta.
    I seemed to be the first person in Philadelphia to use a bike for total transportation in 1968 I think it was. My German Shepherd Greta and I used to go everywhere together. Up and down the drive, South Street, West Philly for years. It was a ten speed white Peugeot and I loved it more than the charm.
    I made the first jumpsuit I ever saw out of rain repellent rip stop to ride in the rain and I rode in the snow to my classes and office and well, for everything. I felt it was the only way to get around in that city.
    I still have a bike but now I amin walking distance to everything here in my neon red town.

  290. run_dmc August 6, 2009 at 4:49 pm #

    I’m not sure where you come by the notion that Obama is a young man “unburdened by a deep cultural allegiance to Wall St.” From Soros to Dimon to Blankfein, his campaigns were bankrolled by Wall St. (Goldman Sachs employees were his top contributors in both primary and general election). His political compatriot and fellow Chicago pol and now Chief of Staff – Rahm Emanuel – is a former Chicgo investment banker and sucker-upper to GS for contributions. His White House is rife with former money-men and women.
    Obama has been tight with financiers and real estate moguls all of his political career. Maybe they were Chicago ones, but you don’t have to physically be on Wall St. to have the mentality. (Just ask Hank Paulson who started his GS career in Chicago).
    In fact, Obama is so wedded to this mega-business-is-good mentality that he lied in his memoir about his first job – claiming he was a consultant for an international consulting firm that advised multinationals when he actually was a copyeditor for a firm that wrote short newsletters on business topics.
    I’d say his burden was deep and his allegiance wide.

  291. abbeysbooks August 6, 2009 at 5:10 pm #

    At this point I want to clarify the term pursuit of happiness. This is paraphrased from Hannah Arendt’s book Revolution. The term pursuit of happiness was a colloquial well used term during the early days and Jefferson used it often. Perhaps he even coined it as he was writing about his own feelings in making the laws of a brand new country. Think about that for a minute. An entirely new country where all the hated and stupid laws could be dispensed with. He said he had never been happier in his life when he was involved in this exceptional endeavor.
    The early settlers started to draw up laws while they were in the boat coming over. They did feel that this was an exodus. They felt akin to the Israelites and Moses leading them out of the desert. They also knew the major problem that we are still dealing with today. And that is that the intervention of God giving Moses the laws blessed them and gave them credibility. Coming over on the boats it was men drawing them up and the fatal flaw is: If men draw them up, then men can get rid of them. When all the men drawing them up died, who would ensure that the laws remained in force? So you see the problem and why the far right must, I say must, bring God into the picture. God is necessary for them. If God doesn’t declare the laws on high, then they will not have to be obeyed, they can become extinct, men can ignore them etc etc etc.
    So in each settlement there emerged a man or men who were especially interested in this problem in meetings, became especially gifted in the laws and became sort of like leaders. Then when different settlements,villages wanted to meet with other communities about laws they sent these men to talk with their men. And so the House of Representatives began at the grass roots. (Still paraphrasing Arendt.) When it came to the Constitutional Convention there were all these men from all over who had spent years now in this intellectual activity. The Constitution was not handed down by the men we associate with it. It was handed up from the delegates at the Convention and the leaders we know, the wise ones, began to discuss and argue. A great account of this time is given in Gore Vidal’s Burr, the biography of the maligned Aron Burr. There was much infighting and threatened exits etc but they stayed with it and put it together. They also slurred each other the way people do on the internet but they accomplished what they were there for.
    And this is what was known as the pursuit of happiness. It had nothing to do with being domestically happy, being able to buy stuff to make yourself happy, or any of the bastardizations associated with the term today. It meant deciding the formal laws that people would live by in liberty in an entirely new world. How fragile it all seems now that Americans were able to do this, to shine a light into the darkness of hereditary rule, dictatorship, etc. Truly a pursuit of happiness.
    So this is a deconstruction of The Pursuit of Happiness. It is not about shopping and rising to the top of the wealth pyramid. It is exactly what many of us are doing with our keyboards. Make no mistake: we are the ones who got Obama in. And we are the ones who will get him out if he continues being a salesman instead of a statesman.

  292. abbeysbooks August 6, 2009 at 5:26 pm #

    Read and the deciphering minute by minute of the coded Japanese radiograms coming from Japanese ships before Pearl Harbor. It all will become quite clear to you. Here’s the link for half.com http://tinyurl.com/lwx3ps (5.00) and this link from Amazon which has better prices.
    http://tinyurl.com/lqm4dn starting at 1.99

  293. abbeysbooks August 6, 2009 at 5:29 pm #

    I have taught compound interest to elementary kids. Start with the law of 72. divide any interest rate into 72 and you will get the number of years it takes your money to double. Of course it works the other way when you owe money.

  294. abbeysbooks August 6, 2009 at 5:32 pm #

    If I forgot to mention the book This Is Pearl which the above links are for purchase.

  295. Jaego Scorzne August 6, 2009 at 7:04 pm #

    Swami Prahupada, guru of the Hare Krishnas, used to say, “deserve and then desire” in other words, then Happiness will pursue us. And of course posters earlier in the week were correct about the narcissitic obseesion that would be so alien to the Founders. They would be amzaed that someone could talk about rights but not about duties-obviously the kind of people who shouldn’t be voting.
    Where does the justly famous and importrant “freedom of association” come from?

  296. Qshtik August 6, 2009 at 7:51 pm #

    I don’t understand this reply. Are you sure it was intended for me?

  297. asia August 6, 2009 at 8:15 pm #

    what about Tony rezko..maybe im mis spelling

  298. asia August 6, 2009 at 8:18 pm #

    her write up on flu / vaccines
    shes very ‘ on the money’ GS money and has her on take on the flu
    what about CODEX ????????????????????????????

  299. Qshtik August 6, 2009 at 8:52 pm #

    When I first broached this subject a few weeks ago I said something like “Compound Interest has been called the 8th wonder of the world.” And I asked rhetorically “how many young people understand what this means?” The implication being that no one in their right mind would ever charge purchases on a credit card that they could not pay IN FULL at the end of the month. It’s the road to financial ruin as so many today are discovering. Make that first exception and its like William S. Burroughs who got himself off heroin and then declared to friends “I’m just gonna ‘Joy-Pop’ on weekends.”
    Another point (not mentioned by you or even the google definition for the “rule of 72”): The rule assumes interest is being compounded annually … but what about quarterly, monthly, weekly, daily and continuously? The doubling period grows shorter, of course.
    Anyway, I’ve spent a lifetime telling anyone who will listen that the secret to wealth is to spend less than you earn … a corollary to the interest on unpaid credit card balances issue.
    BTW Abbey, in deference to your age (I’m only 68) I’m going to let you slide on the whole discussion about the pursuit of happiness and all those grand conspiracy theories about PH and other wars. Suffice to say, I disagree vehemently.
    Please don’t come back at me with more proofs.

  300. Qshtik August 6, 2009 at 9:14 pm #

    “They would be amzaed that someone could talk about rights but not about duties-obviously the kind of people who shouldn’t be voting.”
    This implies there are some who SHOULD be voting. Again I catch you in inconsistencies. You are an avowed fascist. Dictionary.com defines fascism as “a governmental system led by a dictator having complete power, forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism, regimenting all industry, commerce, etc., and emphasizing an aggressive nationalism and often racism.” Where do you see a duty to vote in such a governmental system?

  301. Qshtik August 6, 2009 at 10:45 pm #

    “You sound angry, yes? Good. You’ve been disrespectful to me and now you complain about my brass balls. Anyway, anything is better than your usual smirking blase contempt for every concern people bring up.”
    You’re either playing dumb or you actually STILL don’t get it. I have revealed to you, in considerable detail, my mode of operation: I use mocking, scathing satire and sarcasm to deconstruct bullshit when I encounter it. I do it because it is very effective (just look at your reaction to my post). I was born doing this. So, am I angry? No … it’s an element of my technique. My stock-in-trade. Do you think I’m sitting hear grinding my teeth and typing furiously? Am I disrespectful … yes, I don’t respect what you stand for but more than that I don’t like your little rhetorical tricks (feigning spirituality) that suggest I’m too stupid to notice. And as to the “smirking blase contempt for every concern people bring up” I’ve made it crystal clear my philosophy of life is to take the world as I find it and adjust … not try to fix the world.
    “As long as you can laugh at something or someone who don’t have to take them seriously or be respectful. It’s all you.”
    Huh?? I have no idea what you’re saying.
    “But even prostitutes have feelings and are people. Remember you compared posting here to going to a prostitute? Well yee-harrr, this prostitute just hit paydirt and got your wallet.”
    I said “slut.” Big difference.
    “And btw, the exercises I gave you are real and could have a good effect-if you could get out of your fucking head for just a minute and try them with an open mind.”
    Again, brass balls. You’re giving ME exercises to improve myself. Well, here’s an exercise for you and I want you to report back when you’ve done it: Walk down the street and say with a smile to the blackest man you can find, “Excuse me Sir, can you tell me how to get to such-and-such street?” Forget about IQ. Forget about testosterone. Forget about the fact he may well be a “shiftless nigger.” Pretend you actually respect him. I’ve been addressing the lowliest of people as Sir or Ma’am for decades and you’d be amazed what happens. They act like I gave them a Nobel prize.
    “And as for me, I really am strange, no accountant I.”
    You’re ARE strange, you’re not an accountant and you’re no farmer either.
    “And I do really intend to leave the cities and go to the boonies to get away from what’s coming.”
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Stop intending and just DO it.
    “Crazy? Sure I’m crazy; crazy like a fox. How to undestand me in the future: when I sound serious, I may be laughing and when I’m laughing, I’m often dead serious. How can you tell? That’s the beauty of it, you don’t have to. After all, you can’t see my face.”
    Say what??? I have no idea what the frig you’re talking about.
    “But what you can do, or at least you could, is reply to the content of what I’m saying. Agree or disagree. You don’t always have to disparage. Or don’t say anything at all.”
    You’re reading my reply right now.
    “I will give you that option and leave you alone”
    More brass balls … YOU are going to give ME an option!!
    “as long as you don’t talk shit about me.”
    I stop talking shit when you stop deserving it.
    “Here we have a new begining. Your move.”
    Are you OK? You sound like you’re ready to break into tears.

  302. Jaego Scorzne August 7, 2009 at 12:31 am #

    Fascism is set of core principles-how they work out in practice is very flexible. I do believe in some degree of Democracy-for those who deserve it. So although Franco was a very fine man, his goverment was flawed in that regard. Washington was elected-but only by those qualified to vote-White male land owners. Those whould not exactly be my criteria, but at least they understood the need for quality control. Democracy as it stands now is mob rule-in other words, rule by those who control the mob. Probably the finest example of Fascism in the world today would be Vladimir Putin-although they don’t call themselves that-they meet most of the criteria. Once elected by the people, Fascism says that the man should be given a chance to rule. Like Obama with a kiss ass Congress? Yes, but Obama is a Communist not a Fascist. The two systems have centralization in common, but that is all. Communism rejects the past, tradition, private property, and independant nations. Fascism strongly endorses all of those.

  303. Jaego Scorzne August 7, 2009 at 12:52 am #

    Yeah I don’t think we would get along in person at all. Mockers aren’t high on my list of favorites. Sometimes it’s not eneough to acccept the world or our inner world. Sometimes one or the other needs changing. And that’s the whole purpose of this site: our system is failing to keep up with reality and needs to be changed. Your adapting to reality is fine-eveyone has to mangage their personal affairs-but it does not fufill the obligation of being a good citizen nor is it what this site is fundamentally about. If you talked about how you were going to manage during the Long Emergency you would be more on track, but you don’t believe in the Long Emergency. Neither does Ashoka, but at least he’s free from corrosive cynicism. I know, he’s too free.
    I don’t go around insulting Blacks. Not only is it dangerous, but it’s rude-which I abhor. I am pleasant and polite when I must deal with them. I like some of them, but I don’t pursue friendship since it would be inappropriate given what I believe. Sometimes I feel tension and sadness that this is the case, but that doesn’t change the situation. I can’t make them be smarter than they are, nor can I not believe what I know to be true. But for the most part it’s a non issue since I’m not interested in them. They would sure hate me if they knew what I believed-even though it’s not any worse than what alot of them believe about Whites.

  304. pojones August 7, 2009 at 12:52 am #

    Initial post by P. O. Jones (PO= Peak Oil or Pissed Off depending on whether I’m in a bad or worse mood)
    Mr. K:
    I’ve found most of your writing very informative. My only suggestion at this point is to lay off trying to be the Cassandra of our age by making such specific predictions about who, what, when and how things will happen as our civilization begins to peak.
    The current paradigm has expanded to the current state because of a complex flux of variables in the socio-economic model that defines this world economy and because such a large set of variables are involved, it is improbable that a precise scenario can be presented.
    The latest absurded from the Congress- Cash for Clunkers – is proof that we have our heads so far up our ass that we are close to acheiving perfect self-centeredness. I noticed in one list of eligible vehicles, the Hummer H3. LOL… the sensible thing to have done was for us to begin to realize that the Age of the Personal Auto is coming to an end. That we should drive what we’ve got for as long as we can and perhaps think about alternative uses for all those auto production plants. Also, besides all the cars being junked into a junk metal market that is already depressed, how many of these cars are being sold to people who are already debt overloaded? In a few months it will be interesting to see how many of the vehicles updainted in this deal begin to be repo’ed.
    Overall, I think that the predictions of “The Long Emergency” will begin to happen. But, the powers that be and the people who want their way of life to continue will continue to pull as many levers and strings as they can think of (and apply duct tape when necessary) to keep us from falling apart. It will eventually fail, but do not underestimate how long a determined, clever and (when necessary)mean group can keep a thing going even after all objective data would lead a reasonable person to conclude that the wheels should have fallen off a few miles back, the engine exploded and a certain percentage of our fellow citizens/passengers lying by the roadside dead.

  305. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 1:31 am #

    A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step. Do the exercise and report back. It may be a life changing experience for you and the black man.

  306. DontWorryBeHappy August 7, 2009 at 1:37 am #

    Well for goodness sakes boys, you all need to take a quiet time out and read All I ever need to know I learnt in Kindergarten.
    A little nap and some cookies and milk, hell who cares what order you do it. Just be kind. and be kinda just. and don’t forget
    Breathe In
    Breathe Out
    No go to bed and don’t forgit to turn off your computer cause DARPA is still watching you.
    The world won’t end tonight or even 46 years from tomorrow night.
    Get some sleep. Jeesh!

  307. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 2:46 am #

    “@ JR
    CTHULHU wants to know how Daniel Faraday got to Omaha Beach.”
    He could type and speak both French and German.
    Now let me axe you a question. How the fuck did you graduate high-school?
    Oh. It’s a LOST, time travel question. Yeah. You can’t fuck with me. Same answer. Thought you had me. Good try. One of the best ever.
    But since you ask, it has to do with the bomb.

  308. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 2:53 am #

    “@SEB, of the drug crazed rants:
    I read Brandon. Brandon was a fav of mine. You are no Brandon.”
    As somebody that was around for Brandon and actually posted when Brandon did, and as a huge fan of Brandon –
    You, Cthulhu, need to chill. SEB does just fine.
    If Brandon were here he would love SEB.
    Cthulhu – no offense, but STFU until you have earned respect. If you ARE Brandon, then Brother welcome back. But otherwise, you are just a noob, so put in your time.

  309. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 3:04 am #

    “Mr Rico is a 15 year old girl. He cannot post unaligned. He must affiliate himself with others (such as ZZZZZZ) whom he imagines like him.”
    zzz, awe, man this qshtik is too easy.
    Can you believe this motherfucker? he actually thinks he can fuck with us. next thing you know he’ll be going after asoka.
    Yeah. I am.
    I’m a 15 year old girl. and right now I wish your 16 year old son was fucking ME in the ass instead of that goat you gave him for his birthday.
    I bet your wife is wishing she was born in Afghanistan right now. You’re a real treat. Douche.

  310. asoka August 7, 2009 at 3:06 am #

    “The reality is this is a program that has been working. Consumers believe it’s working. Small business people believe it’s working. People who make steel and aluminum and advertisers … and everyone who’s involved in the larger economic impact of the auto industry believe it is working,” said Sen. Debbie Stabenow, D-Mich.
    “Cash for clunkers has been a proven success,” Obama said in a written statement issued shortly after the vote. “The initial transactions are generating a more than 50 percent increase in fuel economy; they are generating $700 to $1000 in annual savings for consumers in reduced gas costs alone, and they are getting the oldest, dirtiest and most air polluting trucks and SUVs off the road for good.”
    Senate supporters of the program hailed its effect on the auto industry – which had its best month in nearly a year in July – as well as its claimed environmental benefits.

  311. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 3:12 am #

    In the nighttime. This would be the dark hours. This is now. there are only two names. Well, three. Brandon. We wish his safe return.
    In the dark, there are only two.
    Dr. Doom and Johnny Rico.
    Dale is welcome. dale has paid his dues. It is getting to the point where most CFNers respect Dale for his blunt… his shear… his… I don’t know what to call it… Dale hangs. I’m not gonna say he is cool, but “he has hung.”

  312. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 3:25 am #

    “”Mostly I weep over Dr. Doom.”–JR
    Jesus H, JR, try reading your own blog once in awhile. I post over there a lot.
    Over here, all I do these days is get in pissing matches with dale and asoka. I admit I don’t have the stamina of OEO/zsazsa/fifi/aszasz/zzzzz. I couldn’t live in Cleveland, either.”
    Oh, well, fuck me.
    I’m jus sayin. We need your help. Not really. I just thought you might get a chuckle watching me and asoka and OEO kick the piss out of the KKK.
    I’ve been trying to delay it until you came. Set up the cameras.
    Join in anytime.
    OEO is the same OEO we have always known but only I have respected. You fuckers were just mired in the Democrat bullshit. I forgive you.
    Forgive me while I bust some Nazi skulls.

  313. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 3:32 am #

    I wanna reach out
    And touch the sky

  314. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 4:11 am #

    RU Fucking Kiddin me?
    OEO. Deez bitches seem to be challenging us. I’m jus sayin.
    I’m jus sayin. I ain’t going nowhere. Days a bunch a faggots anyways.

  315. budizwiser August 7, 2009 at 9:05 am #

    “cash for clunkers” – ?
    What cash? A broken bankrupted entity, the federal Government in this case, – creates a sort of bribery or kickback scheme to favor a select group of citizens engaged in an ever more unsustainable activity, namely, the owning and operating of a personal passenger vehicle.
    It’s a “win win situation, right?” Except of course for that one little group, hardly ever talked about, the “taxpayer.”
    Here’s a few questions, how will putting thousands of new cars on the road lessen our demand on foreign oil? My experience suggests newer cars are often driven more than older less efficient cars. And won’t these cars be lasting longer, competing longer for retail gas supplies, more years into the future?
    How much money is being spent to actually complete one of these transactions? How much in administrative costs? How much energy is used in having auto dealers dispose of “junked cars?”
    And finally, how can anyone justify “borrowing” the money for another “select group’s” well-being when the national debt is already unmanageable?
    Shouldn’t the funds for this program be generated from and provided for by the people “driving the clunkers” through gas taxes and fees levied on “clunker models?”
    I guess its all relative, this is pretty much like the drunken sailor putting a couple bottles of hooch on his credit card after being stripped of his car titles and his property deeds at the downtown Wall Street strip joints. Big deal.

  316. Jaego Scorzne August 7, 2009 at 10:27 am #

    OK, I did the exercise. The Black said hi, and I said hi, and then he asked me for change. I said I didn’t have any (lie) but told him that you could help him out. I looked more closely, and I realized that the “Black” was Barack Obama. Obama is just another Black bummin’ for change.

  317. B.B. August 7, 2009 at 10:53 am #


  318. dale August 7, 2009 at 11:02 am #

    I’m a pretty big student of history and in particular American history. I’m sure I have read dozens of books on this specific period of time, enough to have a good feel for how people and institutions functioned during that era. These same “American Government went along with Pearl Harbor” rumors started back in the revisionist era of the 60’s. If you had a broader understanding of that era, the Japanese, the American military and government, and specifically the time right around the attack, you would understand how nonsensical those charges are. As I mentioned before, the American top brass didn’t even think the Japanese could pull off an attack on Pearl. Furthermore “coded intercepts from the fleet” is complete bullshit since Imperial Fleet was following logical behavior during, and for several days before the sortie to Hawaii, and maintaining radio silence.
    It’s always amazing to me what people are willing to reject in order to believe some wild-eyed version of history written in a slim journal somewhere. I’m not sure what the psychology of such patterns of belief are, but it is definitely beyond logic. I know a retired dentist who thinks the moon is hollow, he has alluded to the possibility that aliens are using it as a base. You can’t make this stuff up, people are just nuts. One of the great unforeseen downsides to the internet is how much it promotes such nonsense.

  319. dale August 7, 2009 at 11:16 am #

    Saw the thing on tattoo removal, been waiting for that for years, where can I get a franchise? What about those folks with the Watusi earrings, what next, lip plates?

  320. dale August 7, 2009 at 11:20 am #

    Been waiting for those tattoo removal salons for years, where do I get a franchise? I’m not sure how they are going to fix the folks with the Watusi earrings, virtually guaranteed to make you ineligible for any job other than barista or bike machanic. What next, Lip Plates?

  321. asoka August 7, 2009 at 11:38 am #

    24.9% in 1933
    20.1% in 1935
    9.4% in July 2009 (down from June 2009)
    SOURCE: Bloomberg.com

  322. asoka August 7, 2009 at 11:50 am #

    Conservatives for Patients’ Rights is run by Rick Scott, the former head of Columbia/HCA, a for-profit hospital chain. Mr. Scott was forced out of that job amid a fraud investigation; the company eventually pleaded guilty to charges of overbilling state and federal health plans, paying $1.7 billion — yes, that’s “billion” — in fines.

  323. asoka August 7, 2009 at 11:59 am #

    Conservatives for Patients’ Rights is run by Rick Scott, the former head of Columbia/HCA, a for-profit hospital chain. Mr. Scott was forced out of that job amid a fraud investigation; the company eventually pleaded guilty to charges of overbilling state and federal health plans, paying $1.7 billion — yes, that’s “billion” — in fines.

  324. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 1:11 pm #

    “zzz, awe, man this qshtik is too easy.
    Can you believe this motherfucker? he actually thinks he can fuck with us.”
    Headline: Rico confirms Q’s contention … that Rico can’t go to the bathroom alone.

  325. asia August 7, 2009 at 1:14 pm #

    see ashokas:
    ‘well as its claimed environmental benefits’
    Those who have found JK blog mostly know better
    It takes alot of resources to make:
    a car
    a PC
    1000 ? gallons of water per pound of beef
    and no Pelosi wont be switching the house/ senate to natural gas
    thatd cost millions of $$$

  326. asoka August 7, 2009 at 1:30 pm #

    According to analysts at Action Economics, the boost in consumption thanks to cash for clunkers will cause “third quarter GDP to grow 1.8% rather than his previous forecast of 1%.” Thanks in part to the program, auto sales in July rose to an annualized pace of 11.3 million units, the highest since September 2008. And as the Associated Press reported, “if the Senate approves the additional money, it’s likely to lead automakers to increase production and bring back laid-off workers.”
    And then there are the environmental benefits. The Department of Transportation reported that “the average fuel efficiency of old cars traded in via the program is 15.8 miles per gallon, while new cars had an average MPG of 25.4.”
    As the Economic Policy Institute found:
    On average, total gas consumption will drop by 87 million gallons per year, and American consumers will use 22.2 million fewer barrels of foreign crude oil. The environmental impact of reduced gas consumption is considerable as well. We estimate that the program will result in about 850,000 fewer tons of CO2 emissions per year (3.4 tons per vehicle annually).
    The Cash for Clunkers program is definitely not the most efficient way to stimulate the economy or reduce emissions, if either was the program’s sole purpose. But cash for clunkers is worthwhile because it does both.

  327. asia August 7, 2009 at 1:38 pm #

    Clearly you dont have a clue
    its a debt based and bad loan burdened UNeconomy
    cash for clunkers obamnation

  328. asoka August 7, 2009 at 2:25 pm #

    You clearly are upset that the government run Cash for Clunkers program is so popular that it is succeeding.
    You can’t argue with success.
    I am thrilled Obama won the election, and the unemployment rate is declining, and we have a wise Latina on the Supreme Court, and a physicist in charge of energy. Obamanation is a success.
    The naysayers were predicting total economic collapse in February 2009 due to bank crisis, housing crisis, employment crisis, etc. etc.
    The naysayers were wrong on all counts.

  329. M. Kindl August 7, 2009 at 3:10 pm #

    “I wonder if there has ever been a society so badly deluded as ours,”: I thought of Chekhov’s,
    “The Cherry Orchard.” People borrowing money because they couldn’t believe in change. They were so certain of the absolute reality of their way of life that they refused to consider the sensible option presented to them at the outset of the play. The only “change you can believe in” is the change you make yourself. A world made by hand will be made by hand, locally, as Kunstler rightly says. The nature of the change (creative or not) will depend on the vigor and intelligence of the people doing the changing.

  330. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 3:24 pm #

    Asoka, Despite my enjoyment of the flattering words lavished by you on an earlier post of mine this week I must say your presentation of these raw unemployment numbers is disengenuous at best. Underlying data, collection methodology etc for 1933 vs 2009 is like apples and bananas. And the 9.4% (.1% better) figure does not represent net new jobs. Rather it is likely people so thoroughly discouraged that they get dropped from the headcount of the unemployed. Further I think you know this but cherry-pick your data to support your love-of-big-govt view.

  331. asia August 7, 2009 at 3:35 pm #

    THINK Q.O.L.
    quality of life
    Not numbers from the wall st journal or wherever
    numbers dont ‘prove’ anything especially as QOL collapses

  332. Nudge August 7, 2009 at 3:43 pm #

    Looks like the upcoming production of “The Long Emergency”, written by JHK, has got its first volunteers for the roles of Marie Antoinette & chums:
    August 5, 2009 –
    GOLDMAN Sachs boss Lloyd Blankfein has warned his employees to avoid high-profile spending, as The Post reported — but his wife evidently didn’t get the memo.
    Laura Blankfein and her friend Susan Friedman, wife of another Goldman honcho, Richard Friedman, caused a huge scene at Super Saturday in the Hamptons last weekend when they arrived at the event before the noon start time and balked at waiting in line with the other ticket-holders.
    “Their behavior was obnoxious. They were screaming,” said one witness. Blankfein said she wouldn’t wait with “people who spend less money than me.”
    Another observer said the women were so impatient, it was as if they were waiting on line for a kidney transplant instead of a charitable designer clothing sale.
    Friedman shouted at the event organizer, “You have lost so much money because of this . . . Why should we be treated like the $650 donors?”
    Sources said Blankfein and Friedman had bought tables with blocks of tickets going for $833 apiece, as did many of the women who were waiting patiently in line, happy to raise $3.4 million for the Ovarian Cancer Research Fund.
    In the end, the hot-headed duo got in at 12:03 p.m., three minutes after those who arrived before them.
    No word on how much of their husbands’ money they spent. But Lloyd Blankfein — wary of bad publicity over the big bonuses he and his colleagues expect to collect at year’s end — has called for an end to conspicuous consumption.
    A Goldman Sachs executive was quoted in yesterday’s front-page Post story, “[Blankfein] wants to make sure we’re not being seen living high on the hog.” A Goldman Sachs rep did not respond to requests for comment left at the offices of both Lloyd Blankfein and Richard Friedman.

  333. asia August 7, 2009 at 3:43 pm #

    ‘cash for clunker’
    AS IN

  334. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 3:53 pm #

    “Cash for Clunkers ……… You can’t argue with success.”
    Yes Asoka, I can argue with it. Take this short personal history: In the years leading up to my retirement in Feb 2006 I did lots of planning and worked all the overtime I could in order to accomplish several things: renovate the kitchen, make the 360th (final) mortgage payment on my home, make final payment on my 2002 Ford Focus, make final payment on wife’s 2003 Ford Escape. I planned well and by 12/31/05 I owed not a single penny. Now I have to chip in on $1B of “free” clunker money (plus $2B more on the way) to help pay for OTHER people’s cars. How is this fair?
    Again, I think you are perfectly aware of this downside to the program but choose not to mention it.

  335. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 4:24 pm #

    “I just thought you might get a chuckle watching me and asoka and OEO kick the piss out of the KKK.”
    Palpably insecure Jennie Rico has to tinkle … asks imagined cyber-buddies to go with her to potty. Buddies, tired of Jennie’s transparent macho facade, disassociate by way of silence. Jennie pisses panties.

  336. asoka August 7, 2009 at 4:37 pm #

    Qshtik said: “Now I have to chip in on $1B of “free” clunker money (plus $2B more on the way) to help pay for OTHER people’s cars. How is this fair?”
    The $2B is about two weeks of our occupation of Iraq. Did you support Bush’s $3T bombing, invasion, and occupation of Iraq? Were you cheering on our troops as they pissed away your tax dollars?
    Why does a small $2B for clunkers bother you when it is invested in the USA?

  337. asoka August 7, 2009 at 4:43 pm #

    The Three Trillion Dollar War
    The True Cost of the Iraq Conflict

  338. asoka August 7, 2009 at 4:50 pm #

    Asoka says: “A true recovery is happening with unemployment going down.
    Obama says: “As far as I’m concerned, we will not have a true recovery until we stop losing jobs.”
    Who are you going to believe: Asoka or Obama?
    I have Bureau of Labor Statistics on my side, but go ahead and side with Obama, if you must.

  339. zzzzzz August 7, 2009 at 4:58 pm #

    “OEO. Deez bitches seem to be challenging us. I’m jus sayin.
    I’m jus sayin. I ain’t going nowhere. Days a bunch a faggots anyways.”
    Nancy-boys of the highest order. Strike that…Nancy, Nazi-boys.

  340. asoka August 7, 2009 at 5:03 pm #


  341. zzzzzz August 7, 2009 at 5:27 pm #

    Cash for Clunkers? Fuck cash for clunkers how about cash for cunts? Namely that cunt of the century, Nancy Pelosi. The same little bitch that scolded bank execs for taking private jets to D.C. meetings appropriated 200 million for Congressional PRIVATE JETS. FUCK THIS CUNT AND THE CUNTS WITH DICKS that enabled this to occur.

  342. asia August 7, 2009 at 7:10 pm #

    How is this fair?????????? you ask…
    Well politics isnt fair.
    Long ago the biggest mfund was magellan at fidelity,,,jeff Vinik ran it and made the statement
    ‘ a billion here a billion there and pretty soon yer talkin real money’ !!!!
    Well Obama and his has upped the ante…
    now its
    a trillion here a trill there and pretty soon yer talkin real money!

  343. asia August 7, 2009 at 7:17 pm #

    ‘The Cash for Clunkers program is definitely not the most efficient way to stimulate the economy or reduce emissions,
    if either was the program’s sole purpose. But cash for clunkers is worthwhile because it does both’
    O GAWD………………….yes many of us here would agree with what i turned into the first paragraph above!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    The prez rather make the arrest of his friend front page news…hes not a leader…he knows how to spin things
    And Jim that disgusting pic that you have noting the TP Removal is goin public….I say yr getting too sarcastic in yr old age
    Yes in yr book you noted some thought we would all prosper by taking in each others laundry!

  344. asia August 7, 2009 at 7:27 pm #

    ‘Obama says: “As far as I’m concerned, we will not have a true recovery until we stop losing jobs.” ‘
    but when and how will ‘we’ stop losing jobs?

  345. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 8:04 pm #

    “how about cash for cunts?”
    Oh, please. She’s not even a woman.
    “You get one shot at a facelift. If it doesn’t work the first time, let it go”
    Look up “Pelosi Frank Luntz” in google.
    Frank Luntz is a douche who should be euthanized, for the simple reason that he missed his calling as a stand-up comedian.
    I think it was the second time I got banned from TOD. This comment was the reason. The Frank Luntz quote. That cunt, Leanan, banned me for mentioning that.
    Free speach for the dumb. Free fucking speach.

  346. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 8:07 pm #

    1. Would it be too childish of me to ask, do two wrongs make a right?
    2. Have I said something in any of my posts that gives you the idea I favor/ed the Iraq war?
    3. “A billion here, a billion there and pretty soon your talking real money.

  347. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 8:23 pm #

    I should probably clarify that.
    When I said Nancy Pelosi was not a woman, what I meant to say was it is some evil monster from outer-space whose sole purpose is to suck the life out of humans, particularly those of the American variety.
    I actually like cunts. I know cunts. And Nancy Pelosi is no cunt.
    -Tricky Dick

  348. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 8:32 pm #

    “Free speach for the dumb. Free fucking speach.”
    Jennie Rico is only 15. You can’t expect her to spell EVERYTHING right … like speech. Spelling is hard when you’ve just pissed your panties.

  349. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 8:41 pm #

    Who said “A billion here … etc” is in dispute. I always heard Everett Dirksen but Google says no. However, I’m almost certain it was long before Vinik took over Magellan from Peter Lynch.

  350. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 9:01 pm #

    Very Important Question
    Do YOU remember “turkle”?
    OEO remembers turkle. Asoka remembers turkle. Other than those two, there is nobody I can name who would have any idea what I am talking about.
    It is unlikely anybody here gave turkle any thought this week. Turkle was here just last week. Turkle posted a decent number of forgettable comments.
    Qshtik, you are the next “turkle”
    You are finished. Bye Bye.
    Somebody ragged on OEO recently (it was probably turkle) – to the extent, like – “hey, if you are so cool, why can’t you keep from getting banned for two seconds.”
    That’s exactly what makes OEO cool.
    He gets banned cuz he is cool. He is cool cuz he keeps coming back.
    You will never understand this. That’s OK. God didn’t will it.
    Turkle will of course present themself to defend themself.
    [Nobody gives a shit. Don’t waste your time]

  351. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 9:21 pm #

    “I have Bureau of Labor Statistics on my side”
    The BLS maintains an impossibly large number of indices. Even professionals cannot know how accurate they are. Use of their data is largely faith based. I speak from extensive experience. I worked 26 years for one of the largest defense contractors as a financial analyst and dealt with BLS data continuously. In negotiating contracts we chose data that supported our position and our customer, the Govt, chose data they felt refuted our position and supported theirs. It’s a game of cat and mouse. I tend to take BLS data with a truck load of salt … especially when it is first announced (pre subsequent adjustment). And remember “figures don’t lie but liers figure.”

  352. Urban_Underclass August 7, 2009 at 9:23 pm #

    On The Grunt Mr James Howard Cuntstler,
    I like my tattoos, I like my friends who have tattoos tattoos, you bourgeois f***wit.
    Really, all the problems in the world and you have to go on and on and on and on about this…it’s a lifestyle choice, like wearing a type of clothes, or jewelery. Get f***ing real.

  353. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 9:31 pm #

    “Qshtik, you are the next “turkle”
    Q pushes Jennie Rico’s buttons and Jennie not only pisses in her panties but shits in them too.

  354. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 9:52 pm #

    “I actually like cunts. I know cunts.”
    Finish the thought Jennie … it goes “I AM a cunt and I just pissed myself.”

  355. asoka August 7, 2009 at 10:02 pm #

    Q said: “I worked 26 years for one of the largest defense contractors as a financial analyst”
    So you worked with a “defense contractor” wasting taxes I paid. I suspect you also supported our troops as they pissed away billions our tax money in Iraq post 9-11. In any event your pension money is dripping with blood.

  356. Qshtik August 7, 2009 at 10:29 pm #

    “So you worked with a “defense contractor” wasting taxes I paid.”
    Asoka is annoyed that Q knows more about BLS data than he (she?) will ever know so Asoka tosses out a red herring to throw the dogs off the scent.
    Asoka’s argument is, in essence: “The unemployment rate is so going down … and besides, you’re ugly.” hahahaha
    P.S. Rico delenda est.

  357. graycrow August 7, 2009 at 10:33 pm #

    Do you do anything but comment on this blog? Get life.

  358. piltdownman August 7, 2009 at 11:16 pm #

    Thought some of you might enjoy this.
    Will Bunch is a pretty decent journalist from Philly. He gets it.

  359. piltdownman August 7, 2009 at 11:17 pm #

    Thought some of you might enjoy this.
    Will Bunch is a pretty decent journalist from Philly. He gets it.

  360. Max Headroom August 7, 2009 at 11:28 pm #

    Hah. T-t-tal-talk about getting a life. All day, every day, flitting about with electrons. And idiots.
    Of course people like b-bi-big government. And lowest common denominators. It makes life soooooo s-s-si-simple. Simple.

  361. Max Headroom August 7, 2009 at 11:53 pm #

    Ah-ah-ah reality. I find it interesting that my computer generated reality is becoming more your reality t-t-too. Too. Your movies, your money, your news, your social i-in-int-intercourse. Intercourse.
    I l-loo-looked into a bot franchise. Seemed like like a lot of work. Now that deal over at Goldman Sachs, now that’s a m-mo-money maker. Money maker. That my friends is some serious bit-flipping.

  362. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 11:53 pm #

    Qshtik –
    You have the rare treat of watching yourself dead try to survive.
    I’m making an Xvid film of this. Hilarious.
    Hitler did this. He hung people on meathooks that tried to kill him.
    How does it feel?

  363. Johnny Rico August 7, 2009 at 11:56 pm #

    How does it feel?
    To be on your own.
    Like a rolling stone.

  364. asoka August 7, 2009 at 11:59 pm #

    Q said: “so Asoka tosses out a red herring to throw the dogs off the scent.”
    No. You just admitted you were on Welfare for 26 years sucking at the government contracts tit, and now you want to complain about a $2B cash for clunkers.
    You have no moral standing.

  365. asoka August 8, 2009 at 12:05 am #

    Graycrow said: “Asoka,
    Do you do anything but comment on this blog? Get life.”
    As long as Clusterfuck continues to pay me to post here, I will continue to post.
    You seem to be reading and responding. Get life.

  366. Qshtik August 8, 2009 at 12:12 am #

    Asoka, Graycrow asked you this question: “Do you do anything but comment on this blog?”
    I would ask the question somewhat differently: Do you have a body of life experience to back up your pro-govt views or are you mearly a very good search engine jockey?
    I may be the only person on this blog (other than Abbey, who has reveaved a few tidbits about herself) to support my views with specific information about my life. I can understand not giving your name and address but beyond that what’s your problem?
    P.S. Rico delenda est.

  367. graycrow August 8, 2009 at 12:13 am #

    I totally agree with your comment.

  368. Max Headroom August 8, 2009 at 12:13 am #

    O-o-ok. OK. I get it now. There is no real growth in the economy, so the government is growing more t-te-teats? Teats.

  369. Max Headroom August 8, 2009 at 12:18 am #

    ‘delenda est’ Does she have a f-fa-facebook page? I try not to go over there unless I r-re-really have to.

  370. Johnny Rico August 8, 2009 at 12:28 am #

    We don’t care. I can’t speak for Asoka, but i will give it a try.
    This is CFN. We are HARDcore. We have “scene” everytang.
    RU fucking kidding us?
    I have stolen all the cool writers from this site because they are BORED. One of them. A “her.” She stole all of my writers cuz they were BORED.
    You can never fuck with me. Give it up.
    But you can try and play with me.

  371. Johnny Rico August 8, 2009 at 12:54 am #

    Dude- I’m just giving you this cuz I know OEO is asleep.
    Don’t press your luck. The Beasties will fly off the handle.
    I know OEO, just STFU, lemme calm him down.

  372. Qshtik August 8, 2009 at 1:31 am #

    “I like my tattoos.”
    Urban, the main problem with tattoos is their ubiquity. At one time a tattoo was a symbol of macho individualism. Today so many people have them that it is the un-tattooed who are the individuals. The tattoo crowd are sheep. The women all have little butterflies or flowers on their ankles or shoulders. The men have a band of barbed wire (or something similar) around the bicep. 25-30 years ago it was a black panther. In time the ink bleeds into the skin and it starts to look like shit. Also, if the tattoo is in a prominent place it can kill job prospects for certain kinds of jobs. Its no problem for bike mechanics or pool room counter clerks but beyond that ??? I have no actual data but I would bet that if you took the average annual income of people with tattoos and compared it with like numbers for un-tattooed people the latter group would be significantly higher paid. Your internet handle “Urban_UNDERCLASS” is no doubt a reflection of this truth. Only seldom would an un-tattooed person make a derogative remark to the face of a tattooed person but I can virtually guarantee that they are thinking “what an asshole.” Money spent on tattoo removal will skyrocket in 5 to 10 years. I’m sure Kunstler could express all this in a less mean-spirited way but these are the essential facts.
    For a while, one little gold earring for men was nearly mandatory to go along with the tattoos but I think that has begun to fade. How ’bout you? You still have an earring?
    P.S. Rico delenda est.

  373. Qshtik August 8, 2009 at 1:47 am #

    “you want to complain about a $2B cash for clunkers.”
    No, I want to complain about THREE BILLION cash for clunkers. Come on Asoka, your a smart cookie, you can add … $1B plus two MORE billion = $3B … right out of thin air for you, me and our granchildren to pay for.

  374. Qshtik August 8, 2009 at 1:48 am #

    Oops, forgot.
    P.S. Rico delenda est

  375. Qshtik August 8, 2009 at 1:52 am #

    Keep your youtube Jennie, I’m not interested.
    P.S. Rico delenda est.

  376. Qshtik August 8, 2009 at 2:00 am #

    Jennie … now come here and do peepee then put on some fresh undees.
    P.S. Rico delenda est

  377. observer August 8, 2009 at 2:00 am #

    A well-organized claque from the minority party (led by Big Med’s paid flunkies) is engaging in a campaign of shouting-down-the opposition-with-lies to prevent the United States from joining the civilized world and providing health care for all its people, thus SAVING the government–and us taxpayers–untold billions.
    Before joining the pissing contest on this subject, please read this article, so you have information as well as opinions.
    Although I have enjoyed reading 5 of JHKs books, and like his paintings, walking tours, & blogs, too, I may not read the comments again. I was looking for interesting ideas and useful information, but did not find enough of those things in the COMMENTS to justify the time spent. Adios.

  378. Qshtik August 8, 2009 at 2:10 am #

    “did not find enough of those things in the COMMENTS to justify the time spent. Adios.”
    I feel your pain Ob but there’s some assholes around here who’s bullshit needs deconstructing so we can get back to serious business.
    Stick around 5 or 10 years and maybe I can drive them off. I can be incredibly persistent. My mom always said I was STUHH BORRR INNN.
    P.S. Rico delenda est.

  379. asoka August 8, 2009 at 3:00 am #

    Q, you have no right to speak of deficits or grandchildren since working for a big “defense contractor” on the government TEAT you were running up Bush’s 7.7 TRILLION deficit.

  380. abbeysbooks August 8, 2009 at 4:41 am #

    Well maybe you can come up with a good reason why the entire American fleet of ships was sitting there in Pearl Harbor waiting to be sunk.

  381. Kip August 8, 2009 at 8:45 am #

    I have followed your blog for a few years now and have read The Long Emergency. You have found success as many other people have tapping into fears and insecurities that humans possess innately. Just in the last two decades, America and the world have gone through a series of revolutionary steps that are more dynamic than any other time in our history. Humans continue wage war, and Americans no longer feel secure in the island-like isolation of two great oceans. The digital age, the global economy, and clash of cultures challenge our understanding more than ever. The American collective psyche is more fragile than ever. It is in this insecurity that you find your audience and your profit. It seems very strange that humans flock to these end-of-times prophecies. Hollywood has made millions of dollars producing motion pictures that depict the earth being smashed with asteroids, Nostradamus has been validated through specious interpretations, horrific biblical prophecies still haunt our modern society, politicians become experts in earth science and seize upon the people’s fear of sudden climate changes, and you and others claim we will precipitously run out of gas. It is all very gloomy and depressing, and it sells itself to a very receptive and tractable audience. Nightly news programs and pulp media do not report good news because good news and optimism are not profitable. In reading your books and your blog, I can sense that you almost wish your prophecies would hurry and come true. Your predictions have been notoriously inaccurate. It must be frustrating for you that we don’t hurry up and be sent to chaos, decay, and our perdition. Your biggest fault, and the reason that your prophecies do not bear fruit, is because you greatly underestimate the American people and their resilience and pioneering ingenuity. Two decades ago you would not have heard of solar towers, airfoils towing great ships, bio diesel, telecommuting, wind farms, or 50 miles per gallon. You say there are no more great oil fields, but we keep finding them. We have vast reserves of offshore oil that is now cleaner for the environment than tankering 13,000 miles. You say we’re finished, but I say we have just begun a new age of enlightenment and innovation. American people love a good challenge as much as they love being scared by apocalyptic fiction. Perhaps that innate fear is what drives our sense of survival by keeping our edge razor sharp. Americans will ascend into Utopia, not into your dystopia.

  382. piltdownman August 8, 2009 at 10:11 am #

    Observer –
    You’re not alone. I usually read comments for the first 24-36 hours, before this place descends into adolescent anarchy and name-calling.
    I think Jim treads on dangerous territory when he extends his theories to social trends like tattooing, but that’s not to say that he is wrong. I think that most tattoos and piercings are a form of self-mutilation, not self-adornment. There are a raft of social and psychological theories as to why people do this, including a desire to be part of a certain social group or to gain “control” over one’s circumstances. Certainly, our long-established “living arrangement,” with all it’s myriad failings, is as likely a culprit as anything…and that’s why I think Jim is on target.
    On my way to work every day, I see this grossly overweight girl who is doing the entire “goth” thing; tattoos, piercings, darkened hair and all the rest. When I see her I always think; your life is over. Not even 25 yet, and there is nothing for you. No one is going to give you a job. The self-loathing is just too obvious.
    Of course, there are people who have jumped on the bandwagon and gotten tattoos just because they think it’s “awesome,” These are the people who respond and adopt every new hairstyle, clothing style and musical trend that comes along. The ones who talk about celebrities as if they actually know them…..

  383. Jaego Scorzne August 8, 2009 at 10:19 am #

    There are no “American People” anymore-just masses of deracinated, rootless Starbucks drones. One of them told me, “I love Mexico City-so I’m a Mexican.” So much for White Liberals. The Blacks and Hispanics are obviously not Americans, they just see America as a grab bag-they understand nothing of our History and Values and care even less. The few Americans left are despised by all the other groups-and outnumbered. Who are they? White Paleoconservatives. Paleo meaning old as in paleolithic, old stone age. Why is this prefix necessary? Because Conservatism was taken over decades ago by the so called NeoCons-Ex Trotskyites who saw Conservatism as an apt vehicle for thei political and ethnic agenda. Yes, they were Jews but now this dirty snowball has gathered all kinds of people who should know better-Catholics, Patriots, Evangelicals, etc. How did the Trotskyites do it? By dangling the idea of Empire and Booty in front of people’s faces. And of course, saving Israel from its deserved fate is a biggie too. Evangelicals for example, don’t care about Jews or Christian Palestinians, they just want Israel to grow so that Jesus will come back when it’s attacked. Such Humanitarians!

  384. observer August 8, 2009 at 4:32 pm #

    I lurked and saw Kip’s interesting comment, (making me wonder if this is my old grammar-school boyfriend Kip from Rhode Island). I was having similar thoughts last night–and I have already tested the theory that thought creates one’s reality and we can control our thoughts and thus (to some extent) our reality/environment. So my “adios” was to the doomer mentality as well as the comments crew. I think I shall remain a cockeyed optimist.
    But I have decided to contribute a few more parting shots. My gringo family has been in the USA since the 1600s.
    My father, like my favorite childhood radio hero, the Lone Ranger, had an Indian friend (an Ojibway from Canada) who sent us fish, once helped my parents paint our house, and received cash gifts from my Dad occasionally. He himself was a fishing guide; my Dad met him when he (the Ojibway) was 14. When I was four, we tried to find him in the Canadian woods, and I never forgot his house–you could see light between the siding boards. In Northern Canada, 40-below territory.
    My mother once told me that she had two prejudices, but she had made an effort (successful) not to pass them along to her children. I suspect that one was against Italians, but can’t be sure. The other I do not know.
    I have had black, Mexican, Chinese, Japanese, & Native American friends myself and have learned much from them–about all kinds of things. (I sang in a Black Gospel choir in a Baptist church for five years–best musical experience of my life, and no one read music). That’s why getting to know them was interesting. My daughter-in-law is Chinese, my cousin married a Japanese, another cousin married a Chinese, and they adopted a Korean–so there are many Asians and Eurasians in our 400-years-in-North-America family, in my generation and the following generations.
    When I was one of the first female cab drivers working the 4:30-pm-to-1:00-am shift in San Francisco, which I did for several years in the 70s, the black drivers taught me how to make good money and stay safe (and play dominoes!). The white drivers harassed me, reported me for bogus infractions, and generally did their best to make my life miserable. Guess who I liked better? And why?
    Since then, I have gone back to the land, developed animal husbandry, building, & food-growing-and-preserving skills, and have returned (of necessity) to small-city living. I have had many different jobs in many different fields, in addition to cab driving.
    I own my home and am debt free. I pay property & income taxes, and I am happy to have the services they pay for–with the exception of the military in Iraq and Afghanistan (but I don’t resent or blame the soldiers for being there!).
    Much of my 60-year-old home’s beauty is the result of the work of a few Mexicans (some citizens, some legal, some illegal) who labored with great skill and devotion under my direction. I am hugely grateful to them. Before I met them, I didn’t find anyone who could do what I wanted done for a price I could afford. I do not resent their presence, fear them, or wish they were elsewhere. I wish they had driver’s licenses, health care, auto insurance and steady work. I have never known any people who worked harder or better.
    Recently, though I am 65+ and on Social Security and Medicare, for which I am also grateful, I have still been working, have some cash, and was considering installing solar panels. My electric bill is so low that buying solar now is probably not cost effective. So I have been looking into plug-in electric cars, which I could charge with solar (or not–PG&E also offers a special low rate for car charging).
    At first I thought a neighborhood electric vehicle (NEV)would work for me, and I would keep my 7-yr-old Camry for road trips to see my family. But the NEVs have governors that top them at 25 mph. That is not safe on roads with a 40- or 45-mph speed limit. I drove one and it felt awfully small on the road, amongst the SUVs and pickups, not to mention delivery trucks & buses.
    I looked on EBay and saw some plug-in conversions of ordinary cars. Maybe that was a better idea? The more I investigated, the better it looked. Definitely a safer option. And there are shops springing up all over the country where American car guys are converting gas cars to plug-ins. Here is a new, local, small-scale, and eminently useful industry, and it’s HAPPENING. There are two such shops within 20 minutes of my house, one of which does only Priuses, making them plug-in hybrids that get 100 mpg or more.
    Electric motoring may not be quite as “happy,” because of the range and speed limits of electric vehicles, but it is possible–for those with a few extra bucks, of course. Plug-in conversions are not cheap. See below for more info, found on the EV Trading Post site. Great info in one well-written web page by a high-school teacher:
    Thinking about converting a gen. 5 (’92-95) Honda Civic? My $23 “CivicWithACord” DVD (57 mins.) shows ins and outs you’ll encounter converting the sedan; the del Sol, or the hatchback. Each runs 144V/18 batteries. Primary focus on component/instrumentation/ battery placement and other considerations. For more info, http://home.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
    To see what’s happening with electric cars in China, check out this site: http://www.alibaba.com/ There must be over a hundred different companies making cheap little NEVs. The wave of the future.

  385. asia August 8, 2009 at 5:06 pm #

    I dont..when i see the size of Tatts and the price
    I think Jim treads on dangerous territory when he extends his theories to social trends like tattooing
    That the BIG NEWS of the week is not USA is bankrupt but tattoo removal co goes public……yikes!

  386. asia August 8, 2009 at 5:30 pm #

    I read in Forbes or Fortune that they attribute it to Vinik
    In any case now JK says they talk a quad?
    1000 trillion?
    the whole wolrd economy is 50 trillion a year?
    a number i consider to be inflated….

  387. Kiwi Nick August 11, 2009 at 5:38 am #

    At this point I want to clarify the term pursuit of happiness.

    … and I would also like to speak to that term – but more to do with how today’s people read it.
    The fatal flaw, as I see it is the single word pursuit.
    This implies you have to go on a journey, or undertake a process, or do things, to get to this place called happiness. It implies you cannot be happy until you’ve done it/got there.
    To heavily summarise various self-help gurus: happiness is the journey, not the destination.
    If people will learn to be happy now there wouldn’t be so much drive to buy that McMansion or several Toorak Tractors (SUVs), or cell phones that can download AFL (Australian Football League content – or NASCAR content).
    And they wouldn’t mortgage themselves to the hilt – which is where most of the GFC trouble came from in the first place.
    Message to all Americans (and Aussies and Kiwis): be happy now. Ignore the advertising. Ignore the Joneses.
    Of course happiness will come and go (and yes I think it’s correct to be “not happy, Jan” when you leave work at 9:15pm and get home at 2:45am – yes this did happen to me). But on average you should enjoy laughing at politicians, seeing the funny side of morbid situations, and accept The Chaser for who they are.
    That’s what I did, and that’s why I’m still solvent today.
    Should the Americans have a referendum to change as follows:
    – life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness
    + life, liberty, and happiness
    within the Dec. of Independence?

  388. Kiwi Nick August 11, 2009 at 6:01 am #

    alternative uses for all those auto production plants

    Here’s one: build buses. And trains, trams, cable-cars, and ferries.
    One of Big O’s worst mistakes was to simply hand money over to Detroit. He should have handed over the money (*) and said “Build some trains, not cars”.
    (*) – he shouldn’t have forked out quite so much money.

  389. PeteD August 12, 2009 at 4:26 am #

    What a factual article. But aside from that, Have you heard this new cow song going around the internet? You know, the cow song which is supposed to be titled Hello Cow? Well, it’s certainly inane, and it begs the question of just how many drugs over what period of time a person would have to do to come up with something like that, but that aside, it’s become incredibly popular. It was on a Fox News segment (that surprisingly wasn’t trashing the Democrats, Obama – or anything that’s good for anyone, for that matter) about a dairy farm in Wisconsin where cows stand on waterbeds (really) and since then, people have been putting massive internet searches and payday loans to find out who made the hello cow song.

  390. PeteD August 12, 2009 at 4:28 am #

    What a factual article. But aside from that, Have you heard this new cow song going around the internet? You know, the cow song which is supposed to be titled Hello Cow? Well, it’s certainly inane, and it begs the question of just how many drugs over what period of time a person would have to do to come up with something like that, but that aside, it’s become incredibly popular. It was on a Fox News segment (that surprisingly wasn’t trashing the Democrats, Obama – or anything that’s good for anyone, for that matter) about a dairy farm in Wisconsin where cows stand on waterbeds (really) and since then, people have been putting massive internet searches and payday loans to find out who made the hello cow song.

  391. garman August 21, 2009 at 10:04 pm #

    Has anybody heard about the Bakken formation oil field, in montana and Dakota? It has apparently been recently reassessed by USGS, and said to hold more technologically recoverable oil than the whole Middle East put together.

  392. armando57jordan November 7, 2010 at 10:41 pm #

    Women AND GENTLEMAN. THE UNITED STATES DID NOT GO By means of A Increase IN THE Final 25 Years. WHAT YOU JUST WENT Via IS A -Credit score Increase-

  393. MovingLondon December 11, 2010 at 4:00 am #

    Mr. Kunstler should advise the President — he seems to have a better view of what’s in store for all us ….. the worse is not really over, and I don’t have to be an economist to see that!