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Katrina in Vermont

Note to readers: I’ll run an update at the bottom of this blog over the next few days.
*   *   *
      The same creeping nausea that followed the CNN ‘all clear’ sign in New Orleans six years ago happened again yesterday. Anderson Cooper seemed a little peeved that the lights didn’t go out in Manhattan, but then the remnants of Hurricane Irene stomped up the Hudson Valley and stalled a while and commenced to rip apart the Catskills, the eastern Adirondacks, the Mohawk and upper Hudson valleys, and then almost all of Vermont, not to mention New Hampshire and western Massachusetts, and I can’t even tell you much about whatever’s going on in Pennsylvania, Virginia, Delaware, and Maryland this morning. Connecticut, Long Island, and Rhode Island are in there somewhere, and surely there’s more than a few things out of place in North Carolina.
     This is nowhere near Katrina’s death toll of over 1800 souls, but the damage to scores of towns, businesses, houses, and basic civic armature is going to be very impressive as the news filters in later this week and the disaster is still very much ongoing Monday, even with the sun shining bright. Towns all over Vermont and New Hampshire are still drowning. The Hudson River is still on the rise. The Mohawk River is at a 500-year flood stage and is about to wipe the old city center of Schenectady, New York, off the map. Bridges, dams, and roads are gone over a region at least as big as the Gulf Coast splatter-trail of Katrina. 
     That story is still developing. A lot of people will not be able to get around for a long, long time, especially in Vermont and New Hampshire, where the rugged terrain only allows for a few major roads that go anywhere. Even the bridges that were not entirely washed away may have to be inspected before people are allowed to drive over them, and some of these bridges may be structurally shot even if they look superficially okay. There are a lot of them. If you live in a flat state, you may have no idea.
     The next story is going to be the realization that there’s no money to put it all back together the way it was. The states don’t have the money. The federal government is obviously broke, and an awful lot of the individual households and businesses will turn out to not have any insurance coverage for this kind of disaster where it was water, not wind, that destroyed the property. I don’t know what the score is insurance-wise along the mid-Atlantic beachfront towns – but remember, insurance companies were among the biggest dupes of the Big Bank mortgage-backed securities racket, and when the new claims are toted up they may find themselves in a bail-out line.
     This is a warning to America that the converging catastrophes of climate change, energy scarcities, and failures of capital formation add up to more than the sum of their parts in their power to drive a complex society into a ditch – no matter what a moron like Rick Perry might say. But, of course, political ramifications will follow. There will be a lot of pissed-off people in the Northeast USA. Maybe they’ll even start giving the grievance-bloated folk of Dixieland some competition in the politics of the bitter harvest. Oddly, the Siamese twin states of Vermont and New Hampshire are political polar opposites. Vermont, the land of Ben and Jerry’s ice cream, and other squooshy culture tropes from the attic of Hippiedom, is about as Left-progressive as it gets. New Hampshire’s license plate says, “Live Free or Die,” and that same draconian mood defines the state’s politics: hard Right. It’s like a few counties of Georgia shook loose and drifted north somehow. My guess is that the political rage will be about equal on both fronts, as folks are left stranded, or homeless, or without a going business they thought they had only a day or so ago. And my further guess is that their mood will afford some insight into the extreme impotence, incompetence, and mendacity of both major political parties. As I’ve said before in this space, think of these times as not unlike the convulsive 1850s, preceding the worst crisis of our history.
      Apart from the fact that the hurricane season is just gearing up, and that a procession of tropical storm blobs has commenced to pour out of West Africa, there is that other alternate universe of storms, brushfires, and fiascos called the fnancial system, which everybody sort of forgot about over the weekend. Well, it’s ba-a-a-ck this morning, too, and the financial weather was deteriorating sharply last time I looked. You can stick a fork in the Euro Zone. Bank of America is panhandling for spare change like a dying wino as it whirls around the drain. Nobody knows what the shadow bets on all this action is, but you can bet on one thing for sure: the counterparties can’t pay.
      Oh, by the way, anybody remember that we had an earthquake here in the Northeast a few days before Irene rumbled in? Probably not, unless part of your building fell off. God’s wrath, some might say, as we beat our path to a world made by hand.
Tuesday August 30
     God’s wrath, all right.  Michelle Bachmann said it, wouldn’t you know.
     Vermont got whacked badly, as did the northern Catskills. Whole towns drowned, localities cut off from the rest of the world by road and bridge washouts. Lots of buildings of all kinds lost. As is the case with these disasters, many people out there now who have lost everything, are poorly insured, and have no idea how they are going to carry on. It will be several more days before the scope or this thing is really comprehended. It lacked a single dramatic focus, the way that the Superdome galvanized the nation’s attention after Katrina struck, but I suspect the damage to the region is just as bad. 
     For excellent photos of flooding in upstate New York, go to the Albany Times Union’s coverage here. For coverage of Vermont, go to the Burlington Free Press.
     More tomorrow….
Wednesday August 31
     Some official recognition of the scope of Irene disaster is filtering up.
     From The New York Times this Morning: 
     It will be quite a while before we wake up to the long-term disruptions caused by roads and bridges that will take a long time to get fixed (some never).


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About James Howard Kunstler

View all posts by James Howard Kunstler
James Howard Kunstler is the author of many books including (non-fiction) The Geography of Nowhere, The City in Mind: Notes on the Urban Condition, Home from Nowhere, The Long Emergency and the four-book series of World Made By Hand novels, set in a post economic crash American future. His most recent book is Living in the Long Emergency; Global Crisis, the Failure of the Futurists, and the Early Adapters Who Are Showing Us the Way Forward. Jim lives on a homestead in Washington County, New. York, where he tends his garden and communes with his chickens.

527 Responses to “Katrina in Vermont”

  1. kulturcritic* August 29, 2011 at 8:55 am #

    Well James, after that earthquake on the East Coast, hurricane Irene was nearly a “no-show.” And we in the “first” First World care to hear nothing of the flooding this week in one of Pakistan’s most undeveloped districts that killed dozens and leveled entire villages. Well, Gaia may be giving us a breather here in the USA before she hits us with the big slam. However there is another type of storm brewing and threatening for October. It seems that some portion of the body politic is tired of the increasingly Totalitarian predilections of our imperial regime, and they are threatening to occupy DC and close it down until things change. In the meantime, enjoy my latest offering: Back In The USSR: The New Face Of Totalitarianism. Best, sandy – kulturCritic

  2. Leibowitz Society August 29, 2011 at 9:01 am #

    JHK is absolutely right that the damage which is being done may or may not be easily fixed. Even if we do come up with the funding this time, will our debt-ridden, collapsing empire be able to fund another round of reconstruction? At this point, there’s nothing to change the course of empire, only prepare ourselves and save our knowledge and ideas.
    Visit the Leibowitz Society at http://leibowitzsociety.blogspot.com/2011/08/to-prep-or-not-to-prep.html for more discussion on generational survival and long-term collapse.

  3. Newfie August 29, 2011 at 9:01 am #

    Is there any substance to rumours that Lloyd Blankfein’s cappuccino maker was washed away in the deluge and was last seen floating down the Hudson River out to sea ? That means it won’t be blasted to Uranus when the world financial system implodes and that spells the demise of the space program. 😉

  4. Norman Conquest August 29, 2011 at 9:06 am #

    I’m just glad that Jim is back online. If Irene had knocked out CFN, That would have been a catastrophe.

  5. WestCoast August 29, 2011 at 9:06 am #

    When someone whines about no job, no bridge, no infrastructure, just make sure to ask them point blank:
    “Would you rather have terrorists in our town”?
    “Don’t you think that bringing democracy to Iraq is worth a few sacrifices here?”
    “We need to give more tax breaks to Billionaires so that they can invest it in China”

  6. James Howard Kunstler August 29, 2011 at 9:06 am #

    was hoping to hear about Lloyd B himself, clinging to his beloved cappuccino machine as a riptide carried him off toward the Sargasso sea. Alas…. But the good news last week was the he lawyered up royally in anticipation of some possible criminal prosecution. We await the news!

  7. kulturcritic* August 29, 2011 at 9:07 am #

    Thanks James, I had no idea of the extent of damage in New England. The media doesn’t report such. And I am out of country, as you know. But, Gaia does seem to be converging with our other man-made catastrophes to create the perfect storm.

  8. judithweingarten August 29, 2011 at 9:07 am #

    This year has been one of the most extreme for weather in US history, with $35bn in losses so far from floods, tornadoes and heat waves. That doesn’t count Irene. Who, indeed, is going to pay for this?

  9. Tangurena August 29, 2011 at 9:08 am #

    I think we’ll see the Fed bailing out insurance companies this time. Or we’ll see what happened to insurance companies after Andrew: many going belly up and many of the rest just not writing new policies. The state of FL had to set up an insurance exchange as too many insurers just plain quit writing homeowner policies in the state. The insurance companies had been trying to undercut each other for years, like AIG did with the credit default swaps, and very few of the insurers had enough to pay out.
    As for Cooper, I think he wanted to see Katrina/London types of looting going on and he’s ticked off that he can’t get the photos.

  10. roberthildre August 29, 2011 at 9:08 am #

    While America and its local governments certianly have no money, we do have rescources and labor. At some point, people will get sick of waiting for the gubment or insurance companies to come to the rescue and just start to rebuild it their damn selves. This will be the day that we all start to realize that there really isn’t a daddy in the wings waiting to make things all better. I feel for the people in the Northeast that are getting an ass whipping from Irene, and I hope that all the media that missed the sexy story in NYC drive safely rushing to cover the tragedy where it actually is.

  11. tstreet August 29, 2011 at 9:11 am #

    Whether it could be helped or not, this “epic” hurricane was overhyped to the point that the news outlets lost some more credibility. So what, perhaps, but next time a lot more people may ignore the warnings. This isn’t to say that New England did not take a hit that just augmented the long emergency.
    Wall Street is all perky and happy this morning like nothing has happened or will happen that really seriously threatens the upward spiral to wealth for all.

  12. WestCoast August 29, 2011 at 9:12 am #

    We citizens will of course build it to ADA standards and will build the necessary and morally correct housing projects as well as assure racial and semantic fairness in all that we construct as well as
    assure the GIBLET Community full opportunity to lend their essential talents to the enterprise.

  13. GAbert August 29, 2011 at 9:15 am #

    Yes, a natural disaster as prelude to the Long Emergency. Good one James!

  14. PeteF August 29, 2011 at 9:20 am #

    The media reports the conditions at South Street Seaport, Central Park, and maybe the NYC airports. If there’s any time left over they get north of The Bronx.

  15. WestCoast August 29, 2011 at 9:21 am #

    Mr. K,
    Forget Lloyd and his cappuccino machine.
    As he is the son of a mailman, I want to know what his kids and their kids are doing.
    The old adage, “Shirtsleeves to shirtsleeves in three generations” has to be producing some interesting spawn these days. What exactly are the overfed, over “educated” kids of Wall Street doing?
    I’m sure there are the requisite number off in Malawi building orphanages or getting high school community service hours for massaging elephants in Thailand. (You can’t make up shit this weird, it’s actually happening ), but that’s temporary.
    The residual guilt that the next generation and the next are going to feel is something to already behold. From Seed Savers Exchange being taken over by the daughter of the Goldman Insurance Tribe to the many “artists” out there it is going to be an interesting ride.

  16. PeteF August 29, 2011 at 9:24 am #

    People are already sick of waiting. In one local (small) town a road washed out a few months ago, nothing to do with Irene. The local Supervisor had a few truckloads of gravel dumped to at least make it passable, and the heck with the State of the Feds. They sorted it all out later.

  17. Paul Kemp August 29, 2011 at 9:25 am #

    Shouldn’t we be focusing our attention on countering the idiocy of the political/social/commercial establishment, rather than reveling in its predictable failures? Okay, Jim, agreed that things are screwed up and being made worse by both Obama’s faction and the highjacked Tea Party — So where do sane, thinking people go from here?
    How can we, the people, bind together to do something other than wring our hands and gnash our teeth as we visit the Monday Morning Church of the Holy Clusterfuck? Let’s talk about solutions that WE can implement.
    BTW, I’ve always hear that hurricanes develop off West Africa, not East. Have the laws of nature been changed by Global Warming?

  18. wardoc August 29, 2011 at 9:31 am #

    “….the financial weather was deteriorating sharply last time I looked.”
    But wait, the well dressed talking heads on CNBC this morning said that things are looking up. They had pretty girls excited about the Dow getting ready to open up over 100 points. They even had the little munchkin criminal Grasso on to show us growth is moving along. These guys had on suits, they must be smart….right? They’ll fix everything… Right?
    Lock and load, while you still can.

  19. orbit7er August 29, 2011 at 9:34 am #

    The USA has PLENTY of money – over $1 Trillion wasted annually on endless Wars.
    Just the air conditioning bill for tents in Iraq and Afghanistan was $20 Billion last year.
    The military used 5.5 Billion gallons of fuel
    in 2010….
    The irony is this was in “Wars for Oil” as the
    Chinese make peacetime deals without shedding a drop of blood for access to Iraqi oil and oil all
    over the planet…
    So the USA HAS the money…
    Just stop the Wars!

  20. mountaingal August 29, 2011 at 9:36 am #

    Here in Vermont Irene was definitely not a “no show” as someone put it. We have been badly hit by the storm and the impacts will be long-lasting. We’ve lost many roads and bridges including covered bridges that have been around for quite a while.The road down from the mountain where I live is washed out. Businesses and homes are under water. The major news media is starting to pay some atention but pretty much if it wasn’t NYC nobody was too interested.
    It is going to take a lot to repair all of this and we are still getting over some major flooding that happened a few months back.
    I am glad I’ve got some loggers for neighbors, as they’ve cleared the downed trees and there is now another way off the mountain even though that is quite a detour. It does make me wonder how things would get if the roads just never got repaired some day.

  21. GAZ August 29, 2011 at 9:49 am #

    …next up for disaster is good ole’ So. Cal.! The southern section of the mighty San Andreas has not fractured for quite some time (middle section, Ft. Tejone 1857, northern section, San Francisco 1906, the southern section, probably somewhere by Palm Srings) but it’s going to make the L.A. riots (that I witnessed first hand, then moved to Oregon) look like a USC frat party gone bad. I have a cousin that is a commercial hard hat diver Unocal that has been replacing oil well caps in the Santa Babara channel for a year. Something down there under the sea floor is heating up and moving around. There has been a shitload of BIG earthquakes on the ring of fire the last couple of years and I think So. Cal is up to bat and mother nature is gonna throw a smokin’ fastball right at it’s head. “black swan” anyone?

  22. uncle slappy August 29, 2011 at 9:54 am #

    Hope all in the NE are recovering with no loss of loved ones. Just as a side note, to the first few posters who use JHK as a sled to promote their blogs off of, get a grip. I’ve never read yours nor will I ever!

  23. k-dog August 29, 2011 at 10:03 am #

    Schenectady off the map? It was a rather difficult town to pronounce. Maybe that won’t be a problem anymore.

  24. James Howard Kunstler August 29, 2011 at 10:04 am #

    Quite right: West Africa (brain fart). Corrected.
    But your censorious demand for me to take a more therapeutic tone in this blog is impertinent. If it has no value for you, read somebody e;se’s blog.

  25. lbendet August 29, 2011 at 10:09 am #

    Great post, JHK and looking forward to your additional comments as the ensuing damages reveal themselves this week.
    Yes, I understand that there was an earthquake a few days ago in Albany county after the one in Virginia.
    (did you feel the earth move under your feet?)
    A few issues come to mind, I posted this weekend a link to a pdf from a forum at the New School I attended in 2006 concerning how Fema functioned after being folded into Homeland Security and all that went wrong there.
    I feel that there was a real attempt by our politicians to utilize some of the lessons learned from the Katrina debacle and that the idea of minimizing deaths was foremost on their minds. I give them some credit for trying.
    The problem is you can’t control the variables no matter how much you would like to. You can never think of all that could go wrong.
    But here’s the problem. We don’t have a functioning economy where the government is being fed the proper revenues to deal with these conditions. So it falls on the shoulders of on of our 5 big monopolies in this country,namely the Insurance industry there to make a profit, cannot cope with the damages they are supposed to cover.–yeah, there are riders in insurance that don’t cover flooding.
    As I said last night to my guy, there are places that houses never should have been built, but developers and the population in general would never go along with careful planning to ensure that housing would not be built in low lying areas close to the water–guaranteed to be a disaster every time.
    Then there’s the question of generators. If I owned a home I would certainly plan for these weather occurrences. There are even solar power battery generators, that could at least help with keeping a light on and maybe a refrigerator going.
    Germany without a huge amount of sunlight at least created a pathway for people to individually set up solar energy in their homes. It may not be effective in running a home 24/7 but in a pinch it could at least make people less dependent on overhead wiring that goes down with every weather system that blows through.
    On another note: thanks for calling attention to the Taibbi article and one more thing.
    About BofA, my sister made a very good point after I blogged about the amazing returns Buffet got in putting up $5 Billion to bolster-up this loser. She asked me don’t you see that Buffet is a proxy for the Fed? He’s getting everything back that the govt. would be getting if they floated this deal, but right now the politics go against more bailouts, so the Buffet deal went forward. I give her kudos for that!

  26. bubbleheadMarc August 29, 2011 at 10:10 am #

    Congratulations on the most gripping essay in quite some time, not that I’ve been reading these all that long, maybe only a year or so. But still, you make it plain that our immediate world is being ripped apart partially owing to our own fecklessness. If we can’t afford to fix these catastrophes in the usual manner then there will be cries for the national guard to come save us all. Which of course could eventually lead to fascism. Around here in an equally hydrological environment, northeast Ohio, the local governments have already squandered their credit on absurdities such as $45,000,000 recreation centers for smaller suburbs with populations below 20,000, for instance. Where are they going to get the money to rebuild bridges when they get washed away or simply collapse through neglect?

  27. ozone August 29, 2011 at 10:10 am #

    “A lot of people will not be able to get around for a long, long time, especially in Vermont and New Hampshire, where the rugged terrain only allows for a few major roads that go anywhere. Even the bridges that were not entirely washed away may have to be inspected before people are allowed to drive over them, and some of these bridges may be structurally shot even if they look superficially okay. There are a lot of them. If you live in a flat state, you may have no idea.” -JHK
    Senor James,
    Thanks for mentioning this. I believe too many people take their transport infrastructure for granted. I’ve been attempting to justify the blessing-to-curse ratio of plentiful water supply for years and years.
    I suppose I’ve been hyper-aware of drainage/runoff patterns because it was the major factor in my excavation job description. When my wife picked this particular piece of ground, the perc. tests had been done and recorded. (I also observed many of the test sites remnants, noticing the fine gravel that had been unearthed.) The placing of the house carefully accounted for grade and material, including septic system planning. (Another thing no one thinks about because they don’t “see” it.)
    So, although we’re damn near immune to flooding on this place, the same cannot be said for 2 miles from here, where rivers and streams roar through the lower areas. The creeks, streams, rivulets, even bogs and swamp areas, all need outlets and the attendant culverts and bridges to route the roads over. In the local case, we’re pretty much screwed if the bridges wash away. I’ve seen a boatload of shaky “solutions” in my travels, so I can see where we’re headed. That’ll mean no more semi’s full of Wal-mart crap rollin’ down the road (or what’s left of it).

  28. RyeBeachBum August 29, 2011 at 10:13 am #

    Jim I am glad you and yours are safe, we did get quite a blow yesterday. fursure,
    As for New Hampshire and Vermont, both are Yankee bastions of self reliance, the folks on both sides of the Connecticut river are actually quite similar in that way, however at some point we took different paths, and our politics have outwardly manifested themselves in very different ways.
    We both have a history of Town Meeting Government a local political culture based upon consensus and collaboration. Why the difference? New Hampshire being so close to Massachusetts, the people from down south who had a antitheses to that state’s form politics moved here in reaction to their home state’s politics and became the polar opposite in a effort to avoid a repeat of that dysfunction.
    While in Vermont people from away, the Ben and Jerry type’s moved there not to avoid something as they did on this side of the river but to live the Norman ROckwell version of America that Vermont offered, and yes many of them were actually hippies, so much so that the old line Yankee GOP state became a kind of North American Switzerland,
    Although I prefer the more collaborative Vermont style to the more (recently adopted) confrontational political style in N.H., I would never live there, VT is after all on the wrong side of the river, even if NH has a million or so Massholes clogging up the roads and suburbanizing our beautiful country side with their mchovels.

  29. noel bodie August 29, 2011 at 10:14 am #

    Hey Paul, remember the difference between a problem and a condition, if you want solutions go to Transition Town movement, plant a garden, advocate for zoning that allows for walkable communities, etc. We know all this because of the writings of JHK.

  30. sooty August 29, 2011 at 10:17 am #

    A note about Vermont. Yes, we’ve got elected officials who can be counted on to vote progressively, but…we’ve got plenty o’redneck ATV-worshipping ignoramuses who worship the internal combustion engine and can’t put two thoughts together. It’s not all peace and love up here.

  31. vermonter August 29, 2011 at 10:18 am #

    Greetings from across the lake. Not a whole lot of wind, but it was quite a rain event…close to seven inches in my neck of the woods. I’ve been up all night keeping the pumps running to drain the water from the root cellar in my basement. As we had no power, the thing that saved me is the generator I installed last fall. Though it was an expensive item for me, I figured that the time was right given the increasing uncertainty with the climate, economy, and energy supplies. As Stoneleigh says, “better a year early than a day late”. Saved my butt. I would have lost a lot more than the cost of my generator. Cheers.

  32. danbyvermont August 29, 2011 at 10:21 am #

    Greetings to the rest of the clusterfucked nation,
    Jim, I live about a half hour from both manchester and Granville, up in the hills, and the road, culvert, and maybe bridge damage is the obvious residue of the storm. it will be intersting to see how long it takes to open some of them back up. the Danby Mountain Road, that goes down to Dorset is totally washed out at this point. The fellows on the town road crew are gonna make bank for a couple weeks at least I would guess working over-over time!
    It was great to see all the neighbors out yesterday helping each other pump out basements and build flood diversions. Something that worked real well was staking down square bales to divert water. We didn’t have sandbags and this worked just as well. it might not have if the water had gotten any higher. . .
    I am a farmer and am guessing that there could be a lot of crop damage out there. I sort of thought our popcorn would be flattened, but the field I looked at today seemed ok. . . I will check the other field later. not sure if the dry beans are going to survive being so wet, but maybe. here is a new adage: “a bean in the hand is worth five in the pod”.
    thanks for the moral support and snippets of sanity. and hopefully the nation makes an effort to find out how much tastier locally grown, heirloom popcorn is than cheetos (which are themselves so obviously superior to the doodles).
    Ok, time to make the rounds and scope out the rest of the damage.

  33. Karin H August 29, 2011 at 10:28 am #

    I think Irene performed admirably at its appointed task of Stimulating the Economy.
    The noise media reminded us over and over that, while we were being advised to evacuate, should we choose to stick it out we needed to gas up our cars, buy generators, have lots of batteries on hand, and stock that larder to the rafters.
    There were gas station lines worthy of the 70s, interviews of people standing in line for generators at Home Depot (product placement ftw!), giving us soundbites like “I’m #63 on the list, so I’m guaranteed to get one!”, and my local Stop & Shop in Nassau County on Long Island did $500,000 worth of business on Friday, where they usually do $300,000 per WEEK – and that’s just one store out of thousands.
    Consumerism and capitalism did a wonderful job of resource exploitation this past weekend – the citizens of the Eastern Seaboard proved a resource ripe for exploitation, with a little fearmongering to prime the pump.

  34. mow August 29, 2011 at 10:31 am #

    don’t forget the beer and cigarettes

  35. newworld August 29, 2011 at 10:38 am #

    And to think all you liberal types want to put the Manhattan buttholes in charge of your lives. Oh what irony to find out that “all is clear”, just call that the Sheppard Smith call of the day (the Katrina call from the Quarter the morning after it rolled thru).
    Sorry folks the Manhattan clique is an incompetant bunch that merely communicates the predjudices you all learned in college, nothing more. I’ll take Preacher Rick at least if a coyote needs a shootin’ he can shoot.

  36. piltdownman August 29, 2011 at 10:43 am #

    Jim –
    Thanks for connecting the dots on this — so that people can see, as homes and cars roil by in the rivers, that there are absolute, finite ways in which public policy actually effects them!
    It is the paradox of all the tax-cutting, smaller guv’ment types; they want everything — but they don’t want to pay for it. It will indeed be interesting to see how Vermont and NH deal with their separate but equal disasters….

  37. Smokyjoe August 29, 2011 at 10:49 am #

    I disagree with JHK here. Things will be “fixed” up North, as they were in the Gulf, but they won’t be quite as nice as they were before. Life will go on, a bit shabbier and patched together than before, and after the next disaster, when there will be even less money, shabbier still.
    Want the model to follow? Try the slowly deteriorating Interstate system of which the Eisenhower generation was so rightly proud.
    America is on its way to Second-World conditions, if we are lucky. Even in the elite suburbs, and perhaps especially there, with economic decline, unstable weather, and dwindling oil supplies, the US will just enter a spiral of shabbiness. We’d prefer a disaster out of a film directed by Emmerich. But we won’t get “2012.” We’ll just crumble slowly like the road system we use.
    The wild cards are not the weather, or even the long-term impacts of climate change. The wild cards are the maniacs on the Right like Perry and Bachmann, who wish to bring God’s good governance to the US of A.
    You want a perfect storm? Let these people come to power. Then you can stick a fork in all of us.

  38. Solar Guy August 29, 2011 at 10:50 am #

    Felt the Earthquake on the 2nd floor here, and was so utterly confused until I checked the internets?!? Such a weird eerie feeling.
    Installed another solar thermal system on our building this weekend, and should now be able to heat 50% of our 6,000 sq. ft. facility from sun, or at least keep us ~50-65° if gas lines were to fail for some reason…
    Headed back up on the roof now to put some PV panels in…
    And the most exciting news to put a jump in my step.. I took a leap of faith and became the solar sponsor for a dedicated 19 year old who is going to change the world with the best of intentions by riding a solar powered trike across the country…
    Some good advice is forget about the money. Forget about financial motivation. Follow your fucking heart you cluster fuckers.

  39. empirestatebuilding August 29, 2011 at 10:55 am #

    I heard Cokie Roberts on NPR this morning say that this is the 10th billion dollar plus natural disaster of 2011. I plan on voting for Rick Perry. I have had enough of climate change. He’ll put a stop to it lickity split.
    Aimlow Joe was here

  40. CynicalOne August 29, 2011 at 10:57 am #

    I hope you and your neighbors were prepared, with the necessities in place, before Irene came calling.
    This should remind us all of the importance of being prepared for anything and for a duration of more than a few days.
    All the best to and your fellow New Englanders. I have seen just enough photos to get an idea of the tremendous damage. I’ll wager the attention paid this by the MSM will be fleeting.

  41. ian807 August 29, 2011 at 11:02 am #

    As a Texan I am outraged. How dare you call Rick Perry a moron!? This is an insult to morons *everywhere* and I demand an apology!

  42. lsjogren August 29, 2011 at 11:04 am #

    The obvious outcome of the US and European debt crises is that CREDITORs are not going to get paid back.
    Since western nations have fiat currencies not backed by anything, and have moral codes that say debts are supposed to be paid, it would appear that the inevitable solution to the debt crisis will come by the US and Europe massively devaluing the dollar and Euro.
    In my view the scenario is considerable economic decline in the developed world, but not total collapse. Global confidence in the dollar and euro will ultimately be wiped out, and I believe the western world will be forced to adopt a hard currency standard. Yes, the gold standard that all the snooty neo-Keynesians are guffawing about, or something akin to it, will come about, because you can’t run an economy based on currency that is universally considered to be worthless.
    Some fear we are headed toward a global monetary unit (perhaps the “Globo”), as the globalists make use of the “never let a crisis go to waste” principle. Monetary union is impossible without political union, as Europe is proving, although the Europeans have probably years more of head banging to do before they are willing to accept that fact. So anyway, a world currency implies a world government, and even though that no doubt has a lot of appeal to globalists like Obama and Perry, it ain’t gonna happen.

  43. CynicalOne August 29, 2011 at 11:08 am #

    sooty wrote:
    “…we’ve got plenty o’redneck ATV-worshipping ignoramuses who worship the internal combustion engine and can’t put two thoughts together.”
    So they don’t all live in the South?
    GASP! 😉

  44. SDGreg August 29, 2011 at 11:16 am #

    The glorious MSM is fixated on damage on a road on a barrier island in NC, while pictures from New England show much worse damage to roads and bridges. Those New England roads and bridges served full-time residents and businesses, versus the NC road that served resort properties on a barrier island in a hurricane prone area where any structures should be minimal and mainly to support temporary access on the island.

  45. ctemple August 29, 2011 at 11:20 am #

    Has the tradition of the first poster on here typing First! gone the way of the pet rock? Kulture Critic and Leibowitz are laying down on the job.

  46. Teri Chace August 29, 2011 at 11:22 am #

    Remarks by my friend Brian in Otsego County, NY, may interest you and other readers of this blog:

  47. 3rd Generation August 29, 2011 at 11:30 am #

    Carnage, death, tragedy families ruined?
    Who cares? The Dow is up today.
    Screw everyone and everything else.
    It’s all abour RE election and Wall Street Bonuses (not in that order).
    and F*ck Anderson Cooper and the rest of the talking bobble headed media. May they burn in hell forever.

  48. Newfie August 29, 2011 at 11:30 am #

    OMG!!! Here comes another one! Tropical Depression Twelve is forming into a hurricane on more or less the same track as Irene (for now):

  49. steve August 29, 2011 at 11:31 am #

    Oh my, the sky is falling! The, oh so sophisticated and enlightened, Northeast has had some rain. Not only that, we compare it to the storm that devastated New Orleans. But, not to worry. The Great God in Washington has promised that the cornucopia of federal blessings will flow on the sophisticated and enlightened ones. He’s not going to be caught out like the hated Bush. Well, thank goodness, ole Rick is on the way.

  50. Phutatorius August 29, 2011 at 11:34 am #

    Grover Norquist and the TP bunch (or is it a wad?) will no longer have to search for a bathtub in which to drown government. They can drown it in Battleboro, VT or just about anywhere else in New England.

  51. bossier22 August 29, 2011 at 11:36 am #

    It was the same thing here with hurricane Rita. Everyone was still talking about Katrina. I guess white folks with chain saws make for boring TV news.

  52. Desertrat August 29, 2011 at 11:45 am #

    I worked as a professional engineer in water resource development in Texas in the 1960s/1970s. Studied storm records as part of reservoir design. Later, sat at the feet of Saffir and Simpson to learn about hurricanes.
    Texas has a history of one-day storm rainfalls of two feet or more. E.g., 22″ inches in three hours at D’Hanis, Texas, in 1922. Hurricane storms pretty much as bad as any but Camille of 1969. One storm at Galveston, around 1915, dumped a tad over five inches of rain in fifteen minutes.
    The storms of recent years weren’t all that bad in and of themselves. They just happened to hit developed areas with more buildings and people.
    Bottom line? Can’t escape Maw Nature forever.
    I won’t get into any argument about climate change or global warming. I’m just saying that the before and after of major fossil fuel use hasn’t shown any effect on storm intensity when one looks at storm history.

  53. marsyas August 29, 2011 at 11:53 am #

    Glad to hear New Hampshire is so rocked ribbed and won’t be expecting any federal help with its problems. That’ll ease the strain on the budget. I wonder if FEMA will turn the fire hose of federal money on damaged areas as in past years. I have relatives that got substantial checks for water damage they were not entitled to but it’s very difficult to oversee such a huge varied country with any precision and Obama lacks the crusaders zeal to take control of the beast. Unfortunately the right wing has trotted a cast of truly frightening specimens for our consideration. But to the Koch Brothers, these are exactly the sort that can be manipulated. Going back to feudal times won’t be easy, and many will be declared redundant, but Darwin’s law will prevail, whether we like it or not.

  54. Consultant August 29, 2011 at 11:54 am #

    Who’s going to pay for it? You and me.
    Just last month our Allstate homeowners insurance went up. Allstate sent us a letter and openly stated that all the disasters this year were causing them to up their rates.

  55. Consultant August 29, 2011 at 11:56 am #

    Next hurricane, I would really like all the people in the media who are criticizing the evacuations to go stand on a beach that’s directly in the path of the coming storm.

  56. daofirry2 August 29, 2011 at 12:06 pm #

    Jim, glad to hear you’re ok. I had been wondering if you would even be able to post anything today. I have family sort of near you, in VT and western CT, and they have not had a relaxing weekend… I am looking forward to reading what Bill McKibben may have to say about this, in the days ahead. His area of Vermont was absolutely deluged. From now on, locals may well refer to anything in the Ripton/Middlebury area that took place pre-August 28th as “antediluvian.”

  57. ozone August 29, 2011 at 12:35 pm #

    Ya know, I really despise “folks” like yourself who assume far, far more than they actually know. It’s a habit of the lazy-minded.
    …But I’d guess that would be another reason to root for a blustering, ignorant fuck like Perry. Jesus wept, man!

  58. Newfie August 29, 2011 at 12:46 pm #

    Michelle You-Know-Who says the earthquake and hurricane were warnings to America from the Almighty:
    Here’s the music to go with the article:

  59. bossier22 August 29, 2011 at 12:51 pm #

    Beer and cigs is what my parents bought during the cuban missile crisis. There wasn’t much point in anything else. i think they threw in some cokes for me.

  60. ASPO Article 1037 August 29, 2011 at 12:52 pm #

    Legacy railway names pop up in the news from the New England disaster theatre…

    “Raritan River Railroad”: Gen’l Offices, South Amboy, NJ.
    Stations listed in the September 1968 OFFICIAL GUIDE OF THE RAILWAYS…
    Mile 0 South Amboy
    Mile 2.0 Phoenix
    Mile 3.6 Sayreville Junction
    Mile 4.0 Parlin
    Mile 5.1 Gillespie
    Mile 6.4 South River
    Mile 9.9 Milltown
    12.3 New Brunswick
    SAYREVILLE Branch -Sayreville Junction to Sayreville 2 Miles
    SOUTH RIVER Branch – South River to Wright’s 1 mile

    100’s more local rail links in this and earlier OFFICIAL GUIDES. Transportation option so sensible even a world built by hand person would be able to do it…
    Jim, have you got your copies of “US Rail Map Atlas Volumes” from spv.co.uk show you can check these obscure points of rail transport connectivity? Anyone at big shippers like Wal-Mart and US Postal Service, Fedex, etc. have the slightest bit of rail savvy? FEMA?
    Reformed US Army/Guard rail logistics units were/are natural partners for the rebuild of these no longer obsolete rail connectors…

  61. wagelaborer August 29, 2011 at 1:17 pm #

    Bill McKibben was on Democracy Now today, tying the increasing storm severity into global warming, noting that we’ve always had storms, but increased temperature leads to more water and energy in the atmosphere.
    Amy also had the governor of Vermont on, who pointed out that towns that were built 200 years ago were built near rivers, to use the water for power and people.
    Homes and bridges that were built 200 years ago, and have stood since are now being swept away. To deny global warming is happening is to put your head in the sand. It’s easy to do, since deserts are also increasing.
    Living in a 200 year old town near a river doesn’t show the same irresponsibility that building a McMansion on the coasts does.
    Yes, we’ve always had storms. That’s why insurance companies used to refuse to insure houses built near hurricane prone coasts, until the federal government stepped in, in the 70s, to back up the insurance companies. We’ve seen an explosion of coastal building since then.
    We don’t have enough money to rebuild if you consider money to be a commodity, suitable for speculation and hoarding by the ruling class.
    If you changed money to be a public utility, the government could issue it to pay for public infrastructure, repair and switching to energy conservation and renewable energy.
    But, if you prefer to allow the destruction of the ecosystem and human society, as well as the mass exinction of multiple species, the death of the oceans, and the continuation of turning the Earth into an uninhabitable planet, because it’s profitable, then – cool! Because that’s what will happen if we carry on the way we are.

  62. The Mook August 29, 2011 at 1:20 pm #

    Living in the mountains, I deal with downed trees and rock slides whenever bad weather strikes. However, I must admit, it is better than what I face down here at work in metro Philly where I need to deal with roadblocks in the form of Nazi-like fire police. These idiots will be the first obstacle to get by when the s.h.t.f. Of course, most of them are doughnut eaters and it should be easy to outmaneuver the loudmouths.

  63. Jim in DC August 29, 2011 at 1:27 pm #

    The Huffington Post is giving the NE damage a great deal of coverage…

  64. messianicdruid August 29, 2011 at 1:28 pm #

    Mars, Jupiter and Saturn are closer to the Sun according to Rothschild:
    CERN scientists ar a bunch of racists:

  65. malthus August 29, 2011 at 1:33 pm #

    “There will be a lot of pissed-off people in the Northeast USA. Maybe they’ll even start giving the grievance-bloated folk of Dixieland some competition in the politics of the bitter harvest.” Well guess what. There are a lot of pissed off people here in the South West, North West and middle earth. We had to sit through hours and hours of the media talking head idiots telling us every little detail about the hurricane over and over again. I guess the big media people really think and feel that the interest in the United States revolves around the eastern seaboard and we living elsewhere in the country are lucky to hear about it. Over and over again. It is quite plane that this country with its corporate masters and the center of the universe wall street thinking actually believe the propaganda. The truth is this country in its present form of haves and have nots, the investor class, media fools, political criminals is to big to succeed. we have the fed throwing money at every thing and destroying the dollar in the process all adds up to failure. To bad it was a good idea built on hypocracy and wishful thinking. Yes it is interesting hear about what the planet has in store for us, but over and over again 24 hours a day? Like nothing else was news in the world except what was affecting the East. Pathetically funny.

  66. Cash August 29, 2011 at 1:34 pm #

    AMR, Myrtlemay, Eleuthero and others on last weeks’ discussion about snobbery, social class, pretension:
    I don’t like snobs giving people the high hat for the simple reason that it’s cruel (I’ve been on the receiving end more than once) but also because snobs don’t seem to realize how much of their perceived position in life is/was determined by tosses of the cosmic dice/blind luck/cold impersonal fate. But for a few twists and turns it could all have turned out otherwise.
    Nor do they seem to understand that they’re driving in a dense fog of events and circumstances that they don’t comprehend (nor does anyone else for that matter) and so as a consequence how close to the edge of the cliff they always are.
    One fuckup, one car accident, one job loss, one illness, one chance encounter and their life goes swirling down the shitter, the whole teetering popsicle stick contraption of money, career, family, robust good health gets blown to bits.
    As Myrtlemay once said karma is a bitch, she gives with one hand and takes with two. Wise words these. People may think they’re in control of they’re lives and to some extent they are. But in my experience, people get to the pointy end of the pyramid not understanding that the flying chunks of rock that life deals out could just as easily have hit them as the people that happened to be alongside them.
    I’ve seen guys on top of the world, broadly smiling, expansive, well connected. And then after a corporate restructuring, job loss, calamitous divorce and a heart attack they’ve gone from BMW and big house to no car and crappy apartment. And their “friends” and former associates of course make a display of solicitude but really think tough luck sucker never thinking that it could happen to them, that in a few years they could be in the same boat.
    It seems to me that fate randomly screws people. But sometimes it seems to me that people that act all superior and huffy are asking for it.

  67. Solar Guy August 29, 2011 at 1:47 pm #

    David is Amazing.

  68. messianicdruid August 29, 2011 at 2:04 pm #

    “It is the paradox of all the tax-cutting, smaller guv’ment types; they want everything — but they don’t want to pay for it.”
    We “ALL” don’t want everything. I understand that “You don’t get what you don’t pay for”, so I’d rather just pay for it myself, after deciding if I want it *myself* rather than paying someone else to decide if I want it or not, and taking a healthy percentage for the “service”. This is called “self-government”. A difficult concept for some, but certainly not a paradox.

  69. asoka. August 29, 2011 at 2:06 pm #

    Yes it is interesting hear about what the planet has in store for us, but over and over again 24 hours a day?

    Does your television have a channel changer?
    Does your television have an on/off switch?

  70. Smokyjoe August 29, 2011 at 2:20 pm #

    Ian wrote: “As a Texan I am outraged. How dare you call Rick Perry a moron!? This is an insult to morons *everywhere* and I demand an apology!”
    Yep, every state has its morons, religious and otherwise, and I actually *love* what I’ve seen of Texas. Y’all deserve better in the Lone Star State, whatever these Yankees say, than ol’ Preacher Rick.
    Perry is not *just* a moron: he’s a dangerously theocratic one. Anyone who thinks Earth is 6,000 years old left his brains in the 15th century.
    The age of the earth, like gravity or condoms that don’t break, ain’t no liberal corn-spiracy theory.

  71. piltdownman August 29, 2011 at 2:20 pm #

    m-Druid –
    Good luck with that. You going to build your own roads and storm sewers and fire brigade and all the rest? How does that work? Would New England return to the concept of multiple turnpikes and shunpikes? I’m serious here. How does that work, in a practical sense?

  72. messianicdruid August 29, 2011 at 2:22 pm #

    “…we have the fed throwing money at every thing and destroying the dollar in the process all adds up to failure…”

  73. pequiste August 29, 2011 at 2:25 pm #

    A little rain; some “shakin;” and Wall St is all happy: nothing to see here, please move along folks
    After the incessant barrage of media inducing fear and frenzy (I own no TV and I still couldn’t avoid the hysteria) Irene leaves us unfulfilled and wanting more. It is worth noting that the tropical storm that made its way in New England, while providing plenty of rain and damage, was just that – a tropical storm; a lightweight, not-too-serious kind of weather event. Katrina my butt JHK.
    And it still packed a wallop to our disintegrating infrastructure and morale.
    Can we conceive of the situation caused by a category 4 or better hurricane really hitting NYC and environs or a no-nonsense major earthquake to demolish Washington D.C.?( a sublime fantasy for many)
    The bulk of Americans (not CFN persons as evidenced by this blog), are, as JHK never fails to remind us ( thank goodness,) of the Dizneyfied subspecies, and their perception of these happenings constitute either more entertainment or an unwanted interruption to normal programming. All the while eagerly anticipating the kick-off of the NFL season with attendant comfortable ensconcement in front of monster LED TVs. No, nothing is going to change for the masses, the government, or the Wall Streeters pining for an extra few weeks in Southhampton before the real “work” season starts after Labor Day.
    You’d better buckle up good because when the real emergency hits there shall be chaos. Godspeed to all.

  74. Bustin J August 29, 2011 at 2:31 pm #

    Bill McKibben on Democracy Now! this morning, commenting that we have known what the climate effects of carbon pollution would be 25 years ago, and yet, our elected officials did nothing; the average citizen did nothing.
    Ignoring the entire population over the age of 25, I ask those of you between 16 and 25: do you really expect that the older generation will solve this problem, or simply give you the means to solve it? Or do you rather think they will stand in your way, obstruct, and generally make the situation worse?
    Caveat: No one under 25 reads this blog.

  75. Bustin J August 29, 2011 at 2:48 pm #

    I used to live in New Orleans. Every year we’d have a storm season. Saw several whoppers come through, flooding, ripping off roofs, boats floating down the streets, etc.
    Life was as it should be. Normal.

  76. budizwiser August 29, 2011 at 3:06 pm #

    I’ve never understood why so many vehicles are left in areas known to flood. I guess there is no way for people to cooperate and move them. I saw quite a few that appeared to be ruined in the North East.
    Weather news is always neat. Cheap to produce copy and visuals – no chance or need to spend big buck “learning” the story.
    Much like the news reports from Libya – I no longer feel like I can get any “real news.”
    Anything coming over MSM is taken with a healthy dose of cynicism.
    So -I hear it rained a lot in the East – too bad.
    Hopefully things won’t stink afterward – you know like NO.
    Hopefully everyone will be able to get a loan and rebuild.

  77. bearfoot August 29, 2011 at 3:20 pm #

    leave well enuff alone

  78. bearfoot August 29, 2011 at 3:36 pm #

    allstate raising rates to offset disaster losses? imagine that!

  79. ctemple August 29, 2011 at 3:40 pm #

    I think E is a very smart guy, really gifted, but, like many people on here, even Jim, he often seems to have a contempt for ordinary people. I see most Americans as being victims, more or less of their time and place. That doesn’t excuse completely everything, the climate change denial, biblical obsolutism, etcetera. There are a lot of eletists in the U.S that never shut up about ‘white trash, ‘rednecks’ but wouldn’t say nigger to save themselves. Frankly I get sick of that kind of shit, this ‘we are so superior’ mentality. Hell we’re all in the same boat really, if JHK is right about the Long Emergency, and I believe he is.

  80. asoka. August 29, 2011 at 4:05 pm #

    I see most Americans as being victims, more or less of their time and place.

    Seeing is a good first step. Taking action is a good second step.
    I am not as smart as E., but in the last three years (thanks in part to CFN) I have managed to simplify my life in the following ways:
    — learn how to build a small adobe house which utilizes passive solar
    — utilize permacultural principles to grow some of my own food
    — join a food coop to buy what I need to buy
    — become part of a community of friends, so I can help out when they are in need
    — pay off my debt (including the mortgage)
    — move my money out of Bank of America to a local community bank
    — reduce my income (so as not to pay for war)
    — become a vegan (so as not to support factory farm animal abuse)
    — reduce my energy consumption (so as not to support either wars for oil or Middle Eastern dictatorships).
    These are just some of the changes I have made in response to USA corporatocracy. I am happy with these changes.
    Energy contraction is an opportunity for improved quality of life.
    All it takes is to listen to Brother Marley: “emancipate yourself from mental slavery” and then act in nonviolent, independent, and interdependent ways.

  81. Pucker August 29, 2011 at 4:05 pm #

    JHK wrote: “Kemp–
    Quite right: West Africa (brain fart). Corrected.”
    What do “Brain Farts” smell like?
    How do you know when someone “Brain Farts”? Do they make a loud noise?

  82. Steve M. August 29, 2011 at 4:09 pm #

    Katia,- the next storm, may be forming now off Cape Verde – possibly too far out to affect anyone – but it could just as easily strike NYC in the middle of next week during Fashion Week and ironically turn the Big Apple into a place as unfasionbale and as damaged as Detroit. Katia is expected to be smaller than Irene but stronger.

  83. 3rd Generation August 29, 2011 at 4:14 pm #

    ” Cash | August 29, 2011 1:34 PM | Reply”
    WOW. Great Post! I have been thinking and unfortunately witnessing much of what you put into words the last few years.
    Any smug bastards thst think calamity doesn’t apply to them or their loved ones would do well to print your post out and re-read daily. Maybe twice daily…
    Attitude of Gratitude the order-of the-day for many, ME especially included. I have been so blessed with so much for so long it is easy to lose perspective IMO…
    Have a Safe and Prosperous week!

  84. Pangolin August 29, 2011 at 4:19 pm #

    Jim_ There’s nothing wrong with the Vermont infrastructure that a few Bolivian-style zip lines and some cargo bikes couldn’t fix.
    All that’s needed is a some heavy fence wire, some laundry line pulleys and a posthole digger. Instant bridge.

  85. asoka. August 29, 2011 at 4:28 pm #

    MD, you posted this (on CFN!) in your link:

    oil men are getting fat off the peak oil scam, another charade manufactured by the oil companies and gleefully embraced by phony environmentalists.

    Do you agree with Alex Jones that oil men and environmentalists are on the same side re: peak oil?
    Who does debunking peak oil really benefit?

  86. Pangolin August 29, 2011 at 4:35 pm #

    Cash_ When you’re right you’re right. I know a guy, electrical engineer, who made millions in 2000 in the computer business. In the ten years since he’s made one bad investment after another all the while living very high on the hog to the tune of a $25K/month lifestyle.
    His $2 million dollar house is now getting foreclosed and his new venture still isn’t paying salaries to the staff. I expect to hear that he’s selling laptops at Best Buy any day now.
    Life is a lottery and we need to be kinder to those who’ve drawn bad numbers. We can get pulled to the bottom in the space of a heartbeat or the popping of a relatively minor cranial artery.

  87. Pangolin August 29, 2011 at 4:38 pm #

    Asoka_ That all looks good on paper but if had bet on that lifestyle in Oklahoma you’d be looking at the bottom of an empty bowl right now.
    We need to retain trade and the capacity for trade simply to survive in the near future. That’s a cold, dry fact.

  88. Pucker August 29, 2011 at 4:40 pm #

    I see that Barack and Michelle have hung a painting in the White House that includes the word “Jigaboo”.
    According to the Internet, a “Jigaboo” is defined as: “The proper, polite term for a guy of color.
    A person who stands on a street corner yelling “sheee-it!” and “mo fo!” and “gimme some skee-in!”
    A person well-versed in the fine art of shuckin’ an’ jivin’. ”
    For the definition of “Shuck and Jive”, please see:

  89. wagelaborer August 29, 2011 at 5:02 pm #

    By the way, for those who imagine the FEMA fairy riding in and showering money on the undeserving disaster victims- here in the midwest, after the floods last spring, it was announced that FEMA would take applications for 3% loans for rebuilding.
    That’s it? Billions of taxes paid, and when catfish come swimming in your trailer, you can borrow money at 3% to – what? rebuild? When you could barely afford the rent on that singlewide to start out with? What are you going to rebuild?
    And the bankers get money at 0% interest? That you now owe the government for? Guess you can’t afford another trailer, with the kind of money you owe for the Bank of America bailout.

  90. Ixnei August 29, 2011 at 5:03 pm #

    “BTW, I’ve always hear that hurricanes develop off West Africa, not East. Have the laws of nature been changed by Global Warming?”
    You actually managed to troll the OP with this “correction”? Too bad your “correction” was incorrect (heard). That’s always a problem for the nitpicking critic, and even Qtab has gotten “fooled again” on occasion…
    Some food for thought: I’ll bet less people ended up dying during this storm, than would have died during a “normal” day, where “they” all would have been out guzzle-driving to shopping malls/etc, in their death-metal-coffins. How many miles do *you* “drive” each year – 8K? 10K? 12K? 15K? 20K? Auto manufacturers would like to know, for their “X year/Y miles” warranty (along with auto/life insurance companies)!!!
    I wonder how the storms are going to be next year? And in the 5-7 years after that, when we hit peak solar irradiance/sunspot max cycle? Are these large, dense, east coast cities “magnets” for hurricanes? Let me explain – these dense population centers are pumping out hot CO2 almost constantly (with a slightly lower outgassing at night). They are also concrete/asphalt jungles, resulting in typically 5-15’F hotter temperatures than surrounding “suburbs”. This heated CO2 and heated N2 (air) is expanding the local atmosphere, creating low density regions, which should be magnets for anything with some density (read: cold humid mobile vortexes).
    I wonder what the “programmers” for these hurricane prediction models have to say about global warming/atmospheric thinning? I mean, they nailed the original hurricane path prediction to within 10 miles, and their “90% confidence intervals” on path deviation were at least an order of magnitude too loose. Do they just collect their paycheck (bribe?), and then turn the other cheek in silence?!…

  91. wagelaborer August 29, 2011 at 5:10 pm #

    Damn, Ozone, you’re so advanced that I don’t even know what you’re talking about.
    But I’m glad that you and the rest of the East Coast Clusterfuckers are safe and sound and have electricity.
    I know you’re a fan of Phil Rockstroh’s, and I’m now his Facebook friend, and I think you’d like his comment today-
    “Well, Michele Bachmann, Pat Robertson, et al, if God was throwing a divine snit about the wicked, wicked ways of Sodom on the Eastern Sea Board, by pounding the ground with an earthquake and pummeling the land by hurricane, the eternally foul tempered sky daddy seems to feel as though there are much worse sins being perpetrated in, let’s say, North Carolina and Virginia, than on the island of Manhattan e.g. the hurricane hit more mega-churches than gay bars.”

  92. Neon Vincent August 29, 2011 at 5:12 pm #

    I’m glad to see that you’re safe, your power is on, and you’re connected to the internet so that you can keep all your readers informed. Looking forward to your updates on the situation in upstate N.Y.
    As for your readers, the number of comments is down from where they usually are at this time of the day and week. I guess a lot of them are among the 5-7 million without power along the East Coast. Here’s to hoping they get their power and internet restored ASAP.
    I like your observations about how Vermont and New Hampshire are the mirror image twins of New England. The only problem I have is that New Hampshire isn’t Georgia. What you have are most of the most economically conservative people in New England, especially Boston and its suburbs, collecting in one place. I know, my ex-roommate’s family is among them. They may be the most conservative state in the Northeast, but there’s nothing corn pone about them.
    Finally, I didn’t forget that there was both an earthquake and a hurricane in the same place during the same week. According to Discovery News, that’s the first time that’s ever happened in U.S. history. I blogged about that over at Crazy Eddie’s Motie News on Sunday. I also continued the saga of the maniac politician Michele Bachmann doubling down on her promise of $2/gallon gasoline, Paul Krugman thinks a fake alien invasion might be good for us, the effect of affluence on environmental impact, and other sustainability topics, all this past week at Crazy Eddie’s Motie News.

  93. anti soak August 29, 2011 at 5:15 pm #

    Obama refuses to deport Illegals, Including his relatives…SHUCKS n Jive!
    Is there anyone in Obama’s family that’s here legally? ..
    You have his illegal aunt living in government housing in Boston, and now you also have his illegal uncle named Onyango Obama arrested for drunk driving in the same general area.
    According to cBS Boston, the 67-year-old Onyango Obama was arrested on August 24 after police say he nearly ran his SUV into a police cruiser and later failed several sobriety tests.
    What a shock. Of course you probably didn’t hear about this sooner because of all the hype on hurricane Irene [ thanks fireandremitchell.com]

  94. malthus August 29, 2011 at 5:17 pm #

    Wow, So TV sets have an off switch, and a channel changer? Wow who would have thunk it? I am surprised you would even know that seeing you are busy building mud huts, and seeing those first and second steps. How else could you be an authoritarian jackass know it all that at least can go to bed at night feeling superior than most. Get off your high horse and join the rest of us fools down here in the trenches with the rest of humanity struggling against oppression from mutant business school robots and their mantra of continual growth.

  95. asoka. August 29, 2011 at 5:18 pm #

    Life is a lottery and we need to be kinder to those who’ve drawn bad numbers.

    Your electrical engineer friend did not draw bad numbers; he made foolish spending and investment decisions.
    I’m saying to make local decisions that result in a more sustainable lifestyle. It can be done.
    It works for me and my friends, but everyone is free to choose their lifestyle … until the larger transportation and trading networks break down and it is no longer possible to get a 2,000-mile-salad from California or 2,000-mile-apples from Chile.

  96. asoka. August 29, 2011 at 5:28 pm #

    Do you want some cheese with your whine?

  97. Ixnei August 29, 2011 at 5:46 pm #

    “Bond pricing is a critical issue for continued borrowing; if other countries stop buying our bonds (which is happening as we sit here), the US economy will COLLAPSE.”
    Here’s one thing I don’t understand: the week after the US credit rating downgrade and market crash, somehow 10-year rates dropped from 3% down to 2%?!? Shouldn’t the rate have gone up, as the rating was lower, so a higher yield would be required to entice bond investors to take on increased risk?
    Of course it becomes moot with the inflationary magical printing press, making money out of thin air. The 10-year rate seems to have recovered some, so something like 2.2% or so. Perhaps the “money movers” (Bank/brokerage investment firms, insurance companies, corporations) that control over 90% of market/investment volume did not want people moving out of stock/indexed funds, and cratering the market even more?!? But don’t we need China to buy another $trillion$ in bonds fairly soon?!…

  98. Vlad Krandz August 29, 2011 at 5:49 pm #

    That’s why Chinese peasants used to crouch in irrigation ditches during a good rice harvest yelling, “bad rice, bad rice” – they were afraid of being too happy and suffering the nemesis that inevitably follows such hubris. Also on a simpler level, it’s was an attempt to trick the gods into not punishing good fortune because they would hear only the “bad rice” chant and not look any closer.
    Your desire to bring in tens of millions of aliens in the “hope” that they will assimilate is incredible hubris. It’s like gambling one’s whole home and fortune on the hope of getting double 7’s.

  99. zaphod42 August 29, 2011 at 5:55 pm #

    Jim, Jim, Jim… don’t you understand. This is all good. Damage to property, well… it is G R E A T. So what if people are inconvenienced? A few unlucky souls pass to their reward. No biggie, Jim. Because, you see, it all adds to the GDP.
    G D P, G D P
    is good for our country.
    Even if it might kill you,
    It helps us stay with B A U.

  100. Ixnei August 29, 2011 at 6:05 pm #

    “I’m just saying that the before and after of major fossil fuel use hasn’t shown any effect on storm intensity when one looks at storm history.”
    Before and after major – when? You might want to take a look at atmospheric CO2 concentrations since about 1800 or so – it’s been going through the roof ever since the late 19th century industrial age began (~1860).
    How about quantity of storms? Is 10 “intense” storms every year, now, the same as 1 “intense” storm every 10 years, back then?
    Oh, just had to ask – has it started *raining* down there in Tejas, yet?!…

  101. malthus August 29, 2011 at 6:07 pm #

    as long as it is served in a mud hut and bought at the coop.

  102. progress2conserve August 29, 2011 at 6:15 pm #

    Thanks for this weeks work, JHK.
    Stay dry up there, don’t let a tree fall on your head, and don’t cross any damaged bridges.
    “This is a warning to America that the converging catastrophes of climate change, energy scarcities, and failures of capital formation add up to more than the sum of their parts in their power to drive a complex society into a ditch…”
    Add US population growth to the above list, James – just to make matters as bad as they can possibly be for us in the US – in another decade or less.
    One very important reason for the number of increasingly recurrent “100 year” and “500 year” floods – is development. Forest land and trees absorb torrential rainfall pretty well – roofs, parking lots, and agricultural land – not so well.
    Yet the US continues to grow at 1% per year, mostly due to immigrants and their children. That’s 100,000 new LEGAL immigrants every month.
    That’s 3,000,000 new souls in the US every YEAR.
    These are not sustainable numbers.
    These numbers WILL be reduced, sooner or later – by proactive choice – OR by physical constraints, floods, and pestilence.
    I prefer conscious and proactive choice, over the much less desirable alternatives.
    There are good organizations devoted to international population control and to reduction of immigration into the US. I will share some names and websites if someone asks nicely – or perhaps, if someone merely wants to provoke me – over this most important issue.

  103. Cavepainter August 29, 2011 at 6:21 pm #

    Ah yes,…..now the megalopolises of the East Coast find themselves to be in the same fix as Haiti and Somalia; awaiting rescue from regions that haven’t yet exceeded sustainability. You know, those regions that for decades have been snootily referred to as “provincial” (pejorative usage) by the east coast publicist – implying that rural folks were culture challenged. Does anyone visiting this site believe our nation will receive an “aha” awakening from Irene’s sweep up the coast?

  104. asoka. August 29, 2011 at 6:26 pm #

    Living in mud huts is noble. Why don’t you join me and the rest of the world where three billion people on six continents lives or works in buildings constructed of earth?

  105. Cavepainter August 29, 2011 at 6:32 pm #

    Ah yes,…..now the megalopolises of the East Coast find themselves to be in the same fix as Haiti and Somalia; awaiting rescue from regions that haven’t yet exceeded sustainability. You know, those regions that for decades have been snootily referred to as “provincial” (pejorative usage) by the east coast publicist – implying that rural folks were culture challenged. Does anyone visiting this site believe our nation will receive an “aha” awakening from Irene’s sweep up the coast?

  106. Bustin J August 29, 2011 at 6:57 pm #

    I don’t know about that CP. Keeping an eye on Tropical Depression 12 though (thanks Newfie).

  107. Bustin J August 29, 2011 at 7:06 pm #

    cesatmep said “There are a lot of eletists in the U.S that never shut up about ‘white trash, ‘rednecks’ but wouldn’t say nigger to save themselves. Frankly I get sick of that kind of shit, this ‘we are so superior’ mentality. Hell we’re all in the same boat really, if JHK is right about the Long Emergency, and I believe he is. ”
    Ehh? What are you talking about? I’m elite as fuck, and I have no problem with my dark skinned African brothers. And we can’t all possibly fit in a boat, we’re almost 324 million people!
    If black people- “niggers”- can’t do shit right then why is the 3rd richest country in North OR South America essentially a Black nation?
    The Bahamas has a per capita income of around $25,000- compare that to this list of US counties: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lowest-income_counties_in_the_United_States#100_counties_with_lowest_per_capita_income
    Also notice: all these counties are in the Southeast. What is it about the god damn rednecks??

  108. wagelaborer August 29, 2011 at 7:11 pm #

    Asoka, this is for you.
    I can’t believe that a self-described peace lover would be high-fiving Obama for his successful attack on a country of six million people. As if dropping 20,000 bombs onto these people isn’t an act of war.
    It was illegal and immoral, and the fact that it succeeded doesn’t make it anymore justified than when Bush did it to Iraq.
    Shame on you!

  109. Bustin J August 29, 2011 at 7:31 pm #

    Pokaeman said, “One very important reason for the number of increasingly recurrent “100 year” and “500 year” floods – is development. Forest land and trees absorb torrential rainfall pretty well – roofs, parking lots, and agricultural land – not so well.
    Yep. But still, increased water surface movement means increased erosion. At this scale, its difficult to imagine the cubic meter tons.

  110. Bustin J August 29, 2011 at 7:35 pm #

    All I know is Rick Perry is going to have a tough time selling his anti-climate change message in Vermont. Or Ron Paul telling people in NH to enjoy paying for their reconstruction. Or Michele Bachmann convincing America’s voting public that “God” is responsible.

  111. San Jose Mom 51 August 29, 2011 at 7:45 pm #

    I’m in total agreement with you in regards to Libya. The U.S. had no business bombing Libya. For me, it was Obama’s final straw. Wanna bet their new boss is as bad as their old boss?
    Changing topics, I’m ticked off because the biggest bitch I know (mom of one of my daughter’s friends) asked if I want to join her menopausal support group. What an icktastic idea….paying MONEY to spend time with whiney women.
    She’s a doula that thinks every woman should give birth at home. She breast fed her son until he was 5-years-old….ehh gad. She had “Rent Tent” parties when her girls started their periods. Horrid!
    Off to mow the lawn,

  112. lbendet August 29, 2011 at 7:58 pm #

    According to a number of articles I’ve run across, under Obama a drone attack has taken place every four days.
    Next stop Syria? Stay tuned…

  113. wagelaborer August 29, 2011 at 7:59 pm #

    What? You don’t want to celebrate the moments of your life? 🙂

  114. wagelaborer August 29, 2011 at 8:06 pm #

    It’s hard to guess what these SOBs will do next.
    We’ve been guessing Iran for years, and they up and bomb Libya. No matter that Ghadaffi tried to kiss and make up to them after 2003.
    The video I posted showed Wesley Clark naming the next targets, and Iraq, Somalia, Sudan, and Libya have already been attacked. Lebanon has been attacked by Israel. That leaves Syria and Iran, and we know that the US already has ties with “rebel forces”, called “terrorists” if they were targeting us.
    The drumbeats seem to be after Syria now. And it’s way more vulnerable than Iran.
    We’ll see. Here in the Land of the Free, where our only role is to watch what our ruling overlords do. And speculate over which puppet they’ll put up for us to vote for.

  115. progress2conserve August 29, 2011 at 8:14 pm #

    “Also notice: all these counties are in the Southeast. What is it about the god damn rednecks??”
    You’ve got statistical blinders on BustinJ.
    In other words your looking at mathematics – but your using your emotions to do it.
    Only 33 of those 100 counties were in the Southeast US. Yet you say, “all the counties are in the Southeast.”
    And, I’m happy for the Bahamians and their $25K incomes, Bustin – but there is a simpler explanation than “race,” or the lack thereof – of the Bahamians.
    The Bahamas benefits from a LOT of International (american?) Banking, from a LOT of (american?) tourism – and the Bahamas likely still benefit financially from a fair amount of International (US?) drug money.

  116. lbendet August 29, 2011 at 8:24 pm #

    Borrowing a word from Vlad, Syria is enabler of Iran.

  117. Bustin J August 29, 2011 at 8:31 pm #

    Thanks for that link. It sure looks like Libya is filled with ex?-military contractors and hardware.
    Just watched a quartet of videos of Rick Perry. If this guy is the Republicans’ great white hope… HAHAHA
    He has zero game to bring against Obama.

  118. wle August 29, 2011 at 8:32 pm #

    “bridges may be structurally shot even if they look superficially okay”
    could he SAY anything more unsubstantiated than this?
    ==because i can;t imagine what it would be

  119. jgregg78 August 29, 2011 at 8:33 pm #

    ‘New Hampshire’s license plate says, “Live Free or Die,” and that same draconian mood defines the state’s politics: hard Right. It’s like a few counties of Georgia shook loose and drifted north somehow.’
    Actually, if I remember history correctly, the migration is the other way around. The Scots-Irish settled in the northeast (hence the towns of Derry and Londonderry, NH) and then migrated south, where they became the ‘rednecks’ that so many love to hate.

  120. Steve in VT August 29, 2011 at 9:08 pm #

    I’ve lived and worked with a lot of those rednecks, and as much as I deplore their V-8 pickup-truck and 4-wheeler approach to life in the green mountains, I have no doubt most of them will be out in the next few days and weeks helping their neighbors dig out and rebuild.

  121. progress2conserve August 29, 2011 at 9:15 pm #

    “In other words your looking at mathematics – but your using your emotions to do it.” -P2C
    AANK, AAANK, AAANK – Grammar Error Alert!!
    How about if I said, instead, “In other words, YOU’RE looking at mathematics, BustinJ – but YOU’RE using your emotions to do it.
    And, yeah, South Dakota, Wisconsin, lots of places made your list that aren’t in the Southeast.
    And I think Texas may have had the largest individual number of counties in your “Top 100 Impoverished Counties in the US” list.
    Wonder if Mr. Perry will use this interesting piece of demographic trivia in his campaign for POTUS?

  122. mow August 29, 2011 at 9:18 pm #

    here is an update on new york state road closures :

  123. Steve in VT August 29, 2011 at 9:19 pm #

    I’ve got a running wager with my brother about which blow to the US economy will be the one that finally causes the entire structure to crumble like a sand castle at high tide. There was 9/11, of course, although the immediate cost wasn’t nearly as great as the eventual (and still growing) tab for the ensuing wars. Then there was Katrina; The gulf oil spill; The spate of killer tornados; Floods in the midwest and other areas; Massive drought in the southwest; And now, Emily wreaks havoc on New England, to the tune of billions more. Any guesses on how many more hits we can take?

  124. piltdownman August 29, 2011 at 9:31 pm #

    Steve –
    The amazing thing is that, despite all these “death blows,” we have yet to succumb. We are a nation of fat, lazy jerks, but also of strong, self-reliant folks. It’ll be interesting to see who wins…
    I don’t have a lot of faith in the currently aging “millenials,” but who knows…
    The funny thing about “disasters” is that they foment jobs. Someone will have to rebuild those towns and bridges and stores in VT and NH which have been ruined by the flood waters. And if I know New Englanders, they’ll do it!

  125. messianicdruid August 29, 2011 at 9:33 pm #

    “Good luck with that.”
    User fees for the things I use. Maintenance fees for the things I’ve already paid for, and use. Nothing for the things I don’t use.

  126. ozone August 29, 2011 at 9:39 pm #

    “Damn, Ozone, you’re so advanced that I don’t even know what you’re talking about.” -Wage
    Not a damn bit of it! ;o)
    Just your basic ditch-digger with lots of experience in digging cellar holes with attendant drains, installing septic systems, and grading lots and driveways.
    (Didn’t mean to be arcane. A “perc test” is just a small, 30″ hole dug with a post-hole digger to determine how fast water poured in will “percolate” or disperse through the soil. Then a “test hole” is dug by machine [or a lot of labor] 8′ deep so a certified soil engineer can examine the deposited layers of material to determine the septic design and its’ maximum depth. In the case of this property, test holes were punched all over creation, which showed intent to either build or mine for the material. I dug a test hole where I sited the septic for the engineer, and he was curious as to how far down the gravel went. I dug to 10′, then to 12′ and the stuff just kept on going! So “well-drained” is what we’s got. Does not bode well for water retention however; that’s why the raised garden beds containing denser and richer soil.)
    Thanks for the good wishes and the comment from “Rockin’ Phil”! Take care your own selves too; there’s gon’ be plenty weird times to go ’round, methinks. :o)

  127. myrtlemay August 29, 2011 at 9:45 pm #

    “We next story is going to be the realization that there’s no money to put it all back together the way it was. The states don’t have the money. The federal government is obviously broke, and an awful lot of the individual households and businesses will turn out to not have any insurance coverage for this kind of disaster where it was water, not wind, that destroyed the property. I don’t know what the score is insurance-wise along the mid-Atlantic beachfront towns – but remember, insurance companies were among the biggest dupes of the Big Bank mortgage-backed securities racket, and when the new claims are toted up they may find themselves in a bail-out line.”
    …from The King. Thanks, JHK, you nailed it once again. Was thinking the exact same thing myself this past day or so. In your own words, “what got us into this trouble – insurance companies, BB mortgage securities rackets…” The thieving degenerates should rot in prison for what they’ve done to bankrupt this country and its citizens.
    Some day soon there will be an accounting for all these shenanigans. And that day will be coming soon. The Information Age is upon us, for better or for worse. If your hands are found to be bloody, sooner or later you will have to answer for your crimes.

  128. cowswithguns August 29, 2011 at 9:49 pm #

    Have faith in the youngsters. I think there’s an ap for bridge building.

  129. Steve in VT August 29, 2011 at 9:49 pm #

    I have great faith in the ability of Vermont’s yeomanry (and government) to bring our state back from this disaster. But we’re a small state, with a population less than many nearby cities. What happened looks terrible under the distorting lens of the media, but it’s really small potatos compared to the loss of a major city or the poisoning of the gulf. I just wish we could keep most of the taxes we send to Washington to support military-industrial machine, and use it to repair our roads.

  130. Neon Vincent August 29, 2011 at 10:06 pm #

    “However there is another type of storm brewing and threatening for October. It seems that some portion of the body politic is tired of the increasingly Totalitarian predilections of our imperial regime, and they are threatening to occupy DC and close it down until things change.”
    Do you mean the “Enough is Enough” March, scheduled for October 29th? If so, keep talking about it. It could use the free publicity.

  131. Lovelock is Correct August 29, 2011 at 10:42 pm #

    You had Irene and in Australia we had Yasi and the Queensland floods which despite killing more than 20 people and wreaking $2-3bn damage in infrastructure, helped break our drought and at least our financial situation is not too bad. However when we wake up in the not too distant future and find that China no longer needs us as their iron ore, natural gas and coal quarry the proverbial SWHTF and we might find ourselves panhandling for spare Remnimbi.
    As we move into our summer season the biomass bounty derived from those excessive rains will begin to dry out and as we start experiencing those 43+ degree celscius days we will likely fuel another firestorm the likes we have never seen.
    Climate Change is a cop out word invented by crooked politicians and their fossil fuel lobbyists.
    Global Warming now there’s a description from the euphemism free zone I can relate to.
    Bring on the Yasi’s and Irene’s and start destroying more homes more infrastructure. Let it become more unbearable until the lumpen masses put down their cheesedoodles and vote for leaders who will lead by telling the truth.
    Bring on that world made by hand and lets get to our crisis point so we can start to rebuild sustainably, hopefully before the methane clathrates and permafrost release their deadly bounty. I won’t be holding my breath though…
    50+ degree celscius days will likely be our inheritance. But look on the bright side, the crop failures will cause cheesedoodles to retail at $50.00 per bag, resulting in the lumpen proletariat becoming somewhat more svelt and less wobbly.

  132. Ixnei August 29, 2011 at 10:50 pm #

    “As for your readers, the number of comments is down from where they usually are at this time of the day and week.”
    I noticed thatalso – hardly took any time at all, to read all the poasts.
    “Do you mean the “Enough is Enough” March, scheduled for October 29th? If so, keep talking about it. It could use the free publicity.”
    Me thinks me smells a Koch brothers’ teabagger! GL with that.

  133. Vlad Krandz August 29, 2011 at 11:29 pm #

    Why? Because Corporations set up there and rich Whites vacation there, maybe? Bustin, for a bright guy you really have your moments….
    Nothing to do with Blacks – NOTHING.

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  135. MADMAX August 29, 2011 at 11:35 pm #

    Screw Vermont. Vermont sold its soul to the devil when it opened its arms to the homosexual perverts running amok in the Northeast. Screw Vermont.

  136. Vlad Krandz August 29, 2011 at 11:37 pm #

    Here’s a review of “The Help” from the Political Cesspool. Minnie makes a pie out of her own fecal matter and feeds it to a White girl. Hilarious, right? Jesse Jackson used to spit in White People’s food when he was a waiter. No one seems to mind but Whites on the far right. Such nonchalance is decadence and leads to ever great outrages.
    Imagine at the outrage if a movie was made about Palestinian Maids doing this to their Jewish clients.

  137. daofirry2 August 30, 2011 at 12:01 am #

    Vermont isn’t all hippies, socialists and Phish fans. It’s a mixture of all types of people, like anywhere else. I went to school there for awhile, and I did the Big Brother program. I got to know the family of the kid I was paired with, pretty well. The dad was a truck driver, and the mom stayed at home watched the kids. They were just trying to get by, like most people.

  138. Godozo August 30, 2011 at 12:25 am #

    Interesting thing to note:
    Most of the disasters the past few years have been happening in the Republican areas. From Alabama to Texas to Oklahoma to Arkansas this year, the disasters have been mainly to the solid south.
    Hurricane Irene may be the first to happen to a solidly Democratic area. (as shown in the Electoral Colleges for the past twelve years, New Hampshire to a debatable contrary). And if some of the reactions on this blog are an indication as to what a large portion of the nation thinks, there will be nationwide celebrations when NYC finally gets hit (and proves unable to handle a hurricane, I’m guessing).

  139. Buck Stud August 30, 2011 at 12:35 am #

    Thanks Vlad for posting the link. Once I got past the racists, Jew haters, homophobes, and down right paranoids I came upon a voice of reason in Kay Moe:
    ” I find it hilarious how you say that in this particular film, no black was portrayed in a negative light, when the irony of the matter is that the blacks’ very status in society at that time was in ITSELF negative. Having old black men and women saying “sir” and “ma’am” to whites less than half their age was just ridiculous, just as paying someone to do easy, regular house duties was. And even if it wasn’t so distasteful, has anyone here thought that this whole argument could be flipped? Just as you are upset that blacks in the film were not portrayed in a “Negative Fashion”, I find it quite upsetting that you believe that most of the white employers back then were these noble, understanding CEO’s!”

  140. Vlad Krandz August 30, 2011 at 12:41 am #

    Yes, the kind of person who throws around the slur “teabagger” is what’s wrong with Vermont.

  141. Ixnei August 30, 2011 at 12:46 am #

    “Most of the disasters the past few years have been happening in the Republican areas. From Alabama to Texas to Oklahoma to Arkansas this year, the disasters have been mainly to the solid south.”
    You startin’ to sound liek that k00k Bachmann. Good thang it’s not a *global* effect, that we’re witnessing… [/sigh]
    As to *Ghad*, that vengeful m0f0, I have my doubts. After all, *He* gave us all free will – so why would *He* interfere?
    As to Mother Nature, that byotch is fsk’n pissed, and I have no doubt her wrath hast cometh (so to speak)…

  142. Vlad Krandz August 30, 2011 at 12:46 am #

    Good point: I agree. Slavery was bad for Whites too. Whites have to learn to do their own work.
    That doesn’t change the fact that Blacks have benifitted from serving Whites. Their numbers have increased drastically and they have attained a standard of living they could never have created for themselves. Too bad they aren’t big enough to have any appreciation for that. They are devoid of any humility whatsoever. The Slave dreamed not of freedom but of becoming the Master over Whites. Let them try!!

  143. Ixnei August 30, 2011 at 12:52 am #

    “Here’s a review of “The Help””
    LOL, you actually watched that flic?
    Even after it was advertized as nothing more than a slave labor/elite plantation set, circa the 21st century?!…
    LOL, I bet it tasted *splendiforous*ly!!!

  144. Vlad Krandz August 30, 2011 at 12:56 am #

    You’re identifying with Blacks again, Buck. You’ve got to fight it – it’s conditioning. Don’t you want to be free? Don’t you want your dignity back? Nothing is more pathetic than Whites who want to be Black or who kiss Black ass. Blacks feel the same as I do about this.
    Look at South Africa: Blacks came from all over Black Africa to get into the Racist State. They knew that Blacks were reaping the benefits of serving Whites. Their countries were shit holes – as Black countries always are.

  145. rocco August 30, 2011 at 1:07 am #

    Good Points JHK. The only reason in my area that we know of the extensive damage in NE is because of the many folks who attend college here from that region. The news groups were such idiots, I cannot wait to see the Daily Shown Version. On a happy note many of my right wing co workers are dreaming of Perry and Bachmann. Perry led an economic revial in Texas,thats what they say. The 10 year freeze dried can report, like the meats, butter was awful. It seems flour, rice, beans of all sorts, powdered milk are great, the rest yuck. Plant, and pray to Zeus.

  146. Vlad Krandz August 30, 2011 at 1:22 am #

    Why Ix, don’t feel bad – you should hire a Black Woman to make you a similar Pie.

  147. Buck Stud August 30, 2011 at 1:22 am #

    It has nothing to do with “identifying with blacks”. Are we discussing the film critique or something else, as in a segue way to generic racial strife? At any rate, I find it disingenuous that this “film critic’ and people like him are able to contextualize and defend the likes of a Christopher Columbus against charges of racial genocide based upon being ‘a man of his time’ ( not a false argument, in my opinion) and yet are seemingly unable to contextualize the historical reality of slavery.

  148. Pucker August 30, 2011 at 1:50 am #

    This is the staple diet of a large part of the human population of the planet:

  149. progress2conserve August 30, 2011 at 1:53 am #

    “…..are seemingly unable to contextualize the historical reality of slavery.”
    This film is not set in slavery times.
    Neither the film critic, nor Vlad, mentioned slavery.
    This film is set in the early 1960’s – nearly 100 years after slavery ended.
    Why are you bringing up slavery?

  150. asoka. August 30, 2011 at 1:53 am #

    “Perry led an economic revial in Texas,thats what they say”
    Except Perry doesn’t control world oil prices… he just benefited from oil going up during his term.
    Even so, he left Texas with a Billions of dollars shortfall in the state budget. Perry criticized Obama’s stimulus, but took $17 Billion of stimulus money to pay down the Texas state debt he created.
    Oh, yeah… he created jobs in Texas … the most poorly paid jobs (with no benefits) in the nation.
    Perry is good on being pro-immigrant. Texas economy depends of immigrant labor.

  151. Pucker August 30, 2011 at 1:56 am #

    This is the staple diet of a large part of the human population of the planet.
    Have any of you Clusterfuck-ups ever farted in the bathtub?

  152. Althea2w August 30, 2011 at 1:59 am #

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  153. jeloughrey August 30, 2011 at 3:44 am #

    Jim, you are on a roll for connecting the dots and predicting the demise of modern civilization as we know it. Thanks once again for an excellent post.

  154. Laura Louzader August 30, 2011 at 4:59 am #

    Someone on this thread asked how we are going to pay for the $35 Billion in damages from this little tropical storm.
    Put this number into perspective. We have shoveled $34.2 Billion into Fannie Mae and $51.7 Billion into Freddie Mac in direct government support to offset their losses from all the crap mortgages they bought. We could have built a substantial portion of a nice, modern Rapid Rail (NOT “high speed”}for that… and we also could rebuild Joplin, MO, or many other locales wrecked by natural disasters for that.
    Never mind the $117 Billion shoveled into AIG.
    Or the $200 Billion in TARP.
    Or the money shoveled into HOPE Now, or any of the other programs to offset losses from bad mortgages or help “struggling” home borrowers. We’re talking about $3 Trillion at least in bailouts and assistance pursuant to the credit debacle of the 00s… .money that has by and large not only not relieved the situation but has gone to help create more bad debt while keeping housing prices artificially high in many locales still.
    Let’s demand that money being allocated to Fannie, Freddie, the FHA, HUD, the major financial houses and other participants in the debt debacle and/or government agencies that had a major hand in creating it, be allocated to rebuilding civic infrastructure and lifeline support systems critically damaged by major natural disasters, as well as to help individual victims who were wiped out.

  155. Eleuthero August 30, 2011 at 7:25 am #

    I went to your blog, KC, and agreed that we
    are now living under “soft” totalitarianism.
    The Democratic and Republican parties are
    the two wings of the Mo’ Money Party. In
    other words, America has become a KLEPTOCRACY
    in which everything not bolted down goes to
    the first taker and the best scammer. All
    the multinationals give to BOTH parties so
    the nitpickers can quibble over whether, say,
    $1B from Corp. X to the Dems and $1.4B from
    Corp. X to the Republicans is worthy of discussing
    who is “most loved”.
    However, if there’s a “nit” I want to “pick” it
    is MY recurrent theme that, in a very real sense,
    we are getting the government we DESERVE. I am
    in a constant state of awe when I deal with
    agencies in ANY business whatsoever. One day
    my brokerage screwed up the records on which
    email address was my “official” email address
    without me having even visited their site. Next
    day, it’s some doofus from HR at my school
    about details of my health coverage they neglected
    to pass on before I retired. The day after that,
    a credit card issuer closed my account due to
    inactivity WITHOUT WARNING. Whose “bitch” is
    whose?? The SERVICE REPS, almost always paid
    at the rate of a Walgreen’s clerk, aren’t smart
    enough and/or willing enough to enter data
    correctly, double-check the accuracy of their
    work, or entertain the idea that people’s LIVES
    are affected by their conscience or lack
    Now, in 1965, service FAILURES were rare, greeted
    by kissing the customer’s ass, and profusely
    apologized for. But we ALL know how it goes
    down now … it’s YOUR fault for being ANGRY
    at the employee’s absolute disinterest in the
    accuracy of their work. Here’s where I am an
    equal-opportunity hater … I don’t care WHAT
    ethnicity these frontline people are, I want
    my bank accounts, brokerage accounts, health
    care accounts, etc. not to be fucked up every
    six months whereupon I’ve gotta DOG ‘EM.
    Now, it IS a “chicken and egg problem” about
    whether the low pay preceded the low conscience
    or vice versa. However, we are where we are.
    And when our fragile Republic’s service personnel,
    our “first contact” with many vital concerns, are
    USUALLY some sort of douchebag (there must be a
    hundred varieties … the fashionistas, the “my
    real job is artist”, the “I’m only virtuous for
    show in the biz world but … I BE BAD” people,
    the “I’m openly trashy to show you the futility
    of virtue” militants … I won’t bore you
    The mainstream people of the USA have simply
    dropped one or two levels of conscience and
    ADDED one or two levels of avarice. It almost
    doesn’t matter, in some very fundamental sense,
    whether we get Peeping Tom cameras, Internet
    censors, etc.. Before it even gets this
    creepy we are TOAST because it takes a middle
    class of much better demeanor and tastes than
    this to organize intelligent resistance, to
    be ACCURATE in their resistance (to do the
    research legwork) to their oppressors, in other
    words, to SUCCEED in recouping their liberties.
    The hyperbolically corrupt and stupid politicos
    are a mere mirror of their constituencies. Why
    should we expect otherwise?? People care more
    about their home value, their trinkets, and
    how they can use Optionetics from home than in
    how to BE BETTER PEOPLE.
    So, my supposition is that, through worship of
    vanity, stupidity, and greed, we have CREATED
    and NURTURED these traits at the highest levels
    because WE are THEY.

  156. lbendet August 30, 2011 at 8:01 am #

    Good points, E.
    But it’s not just the clerical class that is so remiss with accuracy.
    How about doctors. You know they guys that think they’re entitled to big money.
    My mother at the age of 89 and on heart medications went to see her cardiologist before undergoing cataract surgery. The Dr. said she was doing so well he didn’t need to see her for another year! Imagine that.
    Then she went for surgery and the morons gave her a water pill, cause that’s the standard CYA in this type of surgery.
    They clearly didn’t look at her charts to see what medications she was on. They couldn’t be bothered with specifics.
    So dutifully, she took the water pill and within three days her kidneys shut down and she started going through renal failure.
    She stayed in the hospital for two weeks so they could balance her water retention and in that time she had a pacemaker put in.
    She snapped back but her water balances were too hard to monitor and she died a few months later at the age of 90 of congestive heart failure.
    I have no doubt that she had a few more good years, but that one error destroyed her homeostasis and ultimately cost her her life.
    Oh, but that eye surgeon thinks he should be a millionaire! I’m sure he never thought twice about my mom.

  157. progress2conserve August 30, 2011 at 9:15 am #

    “MY recurrent theme that, in a very real sense,
    we are getting the government we DESERVE.”
    Yeah, no doubt, E.
    Part of the problem is that honest productive work – and the people who do it – have been denigrated and mocked for decades, simply because they choose – or are forced by life – to do honest and productive work.
    This attitude got worse in the “Greed is Good, 1980’s” but it began LONG before that.
    As an example, consider this statement from Buck Stud:
    “….just ridiculous, just as paying someone to do easy, regular house duties was.”
    Thus does Buck denigrate the honest work involved in doing “regular house duties.”
    Somehow – deep in the American psyche – honest labor, subservience, and slavery have become hopelessly conflated.
    And we wonder why front line employees sometimes act conflicted – or even a little bit pissed.

  158. Buck Stud August 30, 2011 at 10:10 am #

    As an example, consider this statement from Buck Stud:
    “….just ridiculous, just as paying someone to do easy, regular house duties was.”
    Prog, I never said that, it was a quote from one of the posters on Vlad’s link.

  159. progress2conserve August 30, 2011 at 10:21 am #

    I’m sorry about your mom, LBend – and especially about the circumstances surrounding her death. We all know we’re all gonna die – one way or another, one day or another – but none of us wants to see someone die “in error,” so to speak.
    My own mom had a minor heart attack, triple by-pass, pacemaker – and lived for 7 pretty good years after all of that. Several mistakes were made along the way that could have killed her, easily and quite literally.
    Everybody makes mistakes. Some people work in professions where mistakes can do harm. Many professions have “tightened up” the quality control over the past 10 years – using good equipment, good training, and a good system of checks and balances.
    Patient contact medicine seems to be – “lagging behind” – some other professions that deal with “life and limb” in important ways. Mostly, medicine seems to lack accountability for recurrent errors – that sometimes lead to death.
    On a personal note – for a while in college my major was known as “pre-vet, pre-med, pre-law, pre-life,” before I finally changed it to something that would actually give me a degree and let me get out of there (college).
    So I knew a bunch of people who were destined to become “professionals.” And I’ve kept up with some of them. And the doctors I know – have not been well served by many of the things that have happened to American medical practice.
    For the most part, these guys – after doctoring for 30 years, now – are making less money than they thought they would. And society gives them less respect than it used to give their father’s generation of doctor. And the Great Respect (and the big bucks) now go to the CEO’s and the Bean Counters in the medical INSURANCE and administration guilds.
    Weird, huh?

  160. Buck Stud August 30, 2011 at 10:26 am #

    I meant to say, historical LEGACY of slavery. I also should have mentioned Jim Crow, but it was late. The reason I mention these two legacies was because the “film critic” asserts that ” cultural Marxists” never tire of mentioning the Civil Rights movement.( And why do all these White Supremacist types always seem to look like they belong in the back row of a porn theater with Pee Wee Herman?)
    Anyway, legacies and lineage imbue humans with a certain sense of pride or a certain sense of failure – all those Scottish Highland festivals, for example. And even those antecedents who fought for the wretched, reprehensible side of a battle are held up for pride and praise a hundred and fifty years after the fact(i.e., the Southern blowhard proudly lionizing some Johnny Reb warrior in their blood line).

  161. progress2conserve August 30, 2011 at 10:26 am #

    “Prog, I never said that, it was a quote from one of the posters on Vlad’s link.”
    OK, Buck, sorry about that. But I assumed that you agreed with the ideas expressed – or, otherwise you would not have posted it. Right?

  162. Buck Stud August 30, 2011 at 11:29 am #

    Why do you feature one part of a sentence when the other is more indicative of the overall point. Below is what you featured:
    “ just ridiculous, just as paying someone to do easy, regular house duties was.”
    And this is what you omitted from the same sentence:
    “ Having old black men and women saying “sir” and “ma’am” to whites less than half their age was just ridiculous”
    Prog, you practice exactly what you accuse Asoka of doing: Impeding honest dialogue. And more and more I am coming to find you coy and evasive . For instance, the anti-immigration group you vociferously touted before it was suggested that it was infected with a racist tributary, is now offered up by you in a much more discrete and clandestine manner. And if it’s a new group, why not just state who it is, forthright? Perhaps I should refer to you as “The Great Dissimulator “ in the future ?
    Furthermore, I did not post and explicate every phrase, clause, sentence, or thought from the poster as evidence of unanimous agreement; I posted it because it stood relatively alone in a sea of bias and the general tenor was at least sane and lacking in racist fury.
    But I should have known that Vlad was not interested in discussing the film review itself; it was just the ignition switch for yet another drive down that muddy, furrowed road of racist misdirection. My bad and apologies to the board.

  163. MMM August 30, 2011 at 11:36 am #

    Vermont is SOL, just as the people in Missouri and Alabama were earlier this year. There just aren’t enough hapless welfare people standing around to rile up Anderson Cooper and Sean Penn.
    Home boy is gonna find out what it’s like being treated like a corn-pone.

  164. bossier22 August 30, 2011 at 12:07 pm #

    If the Bahama’s income is so great, why are you inundated with beggars and criminals when you step out side your hotel gate. Staying on the out islands like Guana Key you don’t see any of that though. Wonder how they weathered Irene.

  165. progress2conserve August 30, 2011 at 12:09 pm #

    You’re overanalyzing me and my posts, Buck.
    “For instance, the anti-immigration group you vociferously touted before it was suggested that it was infected with a racist tributary, is now offered up by you in a much more discrete and clandestine manner.”
    The reason I’m being “discrete and clandestine” is because I don’t want to lose another screenname to posting too many live links.
    And because the regular posters on here know about FAIR and NumbersUSA because I mention these two websites at least once a week.
    And because I don’t claim to be an expert on internet research – I think someone else might find even BETTER organizations than these two – especially if I leave the idea open for discussion – especially on a Monday.
    “Prog, you practice exactly what you accuse Asoka of doing: Impeding honest dialogue. And more and more I am coming to find you coy and evasive…”
    Whoa there, Buck – you really know how to hurt a guy! It won’t be long before Q comes sailing in, calling me “vagina” and agreeing with you.
    If I seem “coy and evasive” – – – It may be because I’m working through my own attitudes on race, work, and love – as I’m going along here on CFN.
    For example –
    I grew up in the EXACT time frame that “The Help” is set in. I had a black maid who kept me so my mom could go back to teaching when I was one year old. I loved that woman almost as much as I did my own mom. And she did honest work. And my mom and dad paid her an honest wage. And they even paid both shares of her Social Security.
    And to think that that loving woman would take her shit – and mix it in a pie, and serve it to me, or my mom, or my dad – EXACTLY like the woman in the movie –
    Is a very hateful idea.
    Yet, apparently audiences think it’s OK.
    What do you think about it?

  166. bossier22 August 30, 2011 at 12:10 pm #

    That was a reply to BustinJ

  167. San Jose Mom 51 August 30, 2011 at 12:11 pm #

    Today in the Mercury News is word that the city is going to destroy its Martin Luther King Library in downtown. The columnist states, “This is brutalism 101.” Not only that it has a mote around the bottom and it looks like a place to store ammunition. In 1970 it cost $4.1 million to build. It will cost over a million to bring it down.
    Apparently they are going to use the space to annex the convention center. Ugh…I’m sure it will be horrible….and why? It’s not like the business convention biz is going anywhere.

  168. asoka. August 30, 2011 at 12:27 pm #

    Could this be a sign the economy is recovering, so a bigger convention center is needed?

  169. bossier22 August 30, 2011 at 12:27 pm #

    I’ve been through two hurricanes in the last six years on the texas coast. I wouldn’t wish it on anyone. Even though I’m a red state redneck, my wife and I especially love New England. We are actually hoping for a ‘lite’ tropical event here this weekend. No decent rain in a while.

  170. asoka. August 30, 2011 at 12:38 pm #

    Wage, both the Iraq invasion and the Libya bombing were illegal and immoral. We agree on that. The killing of Iraqis and Libyans is criminal. We agree.
    All I was doing was comparing Obama and Bush with regard to removing dictators.
    I said Obama was more intelligent to involve NATO instead of going it alone.
    I said Obama was smarter to not risk a single American life, instead of Bush’s sacrifice of 4,500 American military.
    I said Obama was smarter to remove Gadaffi at a cost one thousand times less than Bush spent.
    So, yes, I am high-fiving Obama as an intelligent Commander-in-Chief.
    While I don’t agree with either one in initiating American participation in conflicts, it seems obvious that it is better to conduct war with less loss of life and at less cost to the nation Obama loves so much.

  171. Gus44 August 30, 2011 at 12:40 pm #

    So you’d rather have Texas buttholes in charge? Republican suckers are just as stupid as Democratic suckers. If a coyote needs shootin’ I’ll do it my fucking self.

  172. lbendet August 30, 2011 at 12:42 pm #

    Weird, huh?
    What isn’t weird about anything in this counter-intuitive system we live in. There’s no end to the distortions of a system turned in on itself deliberately to glean profits for a few.

  173. orbit7er August 30, 2011 at 1:07 pm #

    It takes 5.5 Billion gallons of fuel for our Wars,
    we are spending hundreds of thousands for every Predator Drone, and $20 Billion for air conditioning Iraq and Afghanistan.
    Somehow the Powers-That-Be running the USA can find money for that, $1 Trillion worth annually, but
    there is no money for Green Transit, solar cells or thermal heating in Florida, recycling, etc.
    My point is the enormous waste of resources involved in the MIC and Auto Addiction needs to be redirected ASAP to the Transition to a sustainable
    civilization and economy.
    Unfortunately it WAS real gasoline/diesel/jet fuel
    wasted last year in the endless Wars…
    It will never return…

  174. messianicdruid August 30, 2011 at 1:41 pm #

    “All I was doing was comparing Obama and Bush with regard to removing dictators.”
    I got news for ya, Bush ain’t running for re-election. Why don’t ya compare O’s policies to somebody that might make a difference?
    Answer: Progressiv­es and liberals may agree on many social issues but can’t support Dr. Paul. His ideology opposes government­s excessive interventi­on into the affairs of the people. Liberal/pr­ogressives are wedded to the idea of social justice, a term that to them means equality; that government must be used to redistribu­te wealth and dictate what ever they think is best for all. There is a very long list! One should not mistake liberal progressiv­es for the far left, who’s views are more radically socialist.
    Please tell me it ain’t so…

  175. bossier22 August 30, 2011 at 1:55 pm #

    Christopher Columbus had no clue as to the effect of his arrival in the new world would have on the western hemisphere. European germs conquered the western hemisphere. Neither the Europeans nor the indigenous peoples had any knowledge of what was going on. Were the Europeans bent on conquest? You bet. would it have been as easy without their secret weapon? No way. It was so secret they didn’t even know about it. read “Guns, Germs and Steel,” if you haven’t already.

  176. Newfie August 30, 2011 at 2:15 pm #

    Or learn about the Columbian Age in “What is America” by Ronald Wright:
    The beginning of TLE heralds the end of the Columbian Age.

  177. ozone August 30, 2011 at 2:31 pm #

    This is somewhat off-topic, but I guess our choice of who we’ll have lead us into the darkness does have some bearing.
    Mr. Paul had better be verrrrry careful. We’ve seen what happens with “advisers” wedging in their slimy agendas on the coattails of “populists”…
    The Grim[m] Tale of Dr. Fine and Mr. Fein:
    (These neocon/globalist assholes never go away voluntarily.)

  178. Cash August 30, 2011 at 2:35 pm #

    Your desire to bring in tens of millions of aliens… Vlad
    I desire no such thing. Who told you this?
    …in the “hope” that they will assimilate is incredible hubris. – Vlad
    I don’t hope for such a thing. I demand and expect it. By and large and thus far, as I’ve said in previous posts, these “aliens” have assimilated quite nicely within a generation or two of arrival. How do I know? By observing and by believing the evidence of my own eyes. I’m a living example as are millions of others in this country. Assimilation works. E pluribus unum is a damn fine idea.

  179. theroachman August 30, 2011 at 3:17 pm #

    I must say that I find the last sales bot very interesting. One would think the bots were smarter then the above one but in this case I think its a live human and they knew what they were doing.

  180. Buck Stud August 30, 2011 at 3:40 pm #

    Prog writes:
    “ Is a very hateful idea.
    Yet, apparently audiences think it’s OK.
    What do you think about it?
    I haven’t seen the film. The film is portraying a fictional event and the review of the film is a redoubling of an event as seen through the eyes of one with an obvious racial agenda. So basically were discussing the simulacra of a simulacrum, and yet “reality” was never folded over and “doubled” in the first place – it’s the fiction of film. What becomes hyper-real is that you seem to believe the interpretation of the film critic below.
    “While attending this movie I noticed that the audience was an equal mixture of whites and blacks, and both groups howled with equal delight as the white characters in the film were ritually humiliated and degraded. I wondered to myself what the response would have been if a white character had made feces pie and served it to an unwitting, credulous black character? Somehow, I think the audience response would have been different. “
    Prog, do you really believe all these chuckling white people are suffering from the “politically correct” hypnotic spell of the Hollywood Jewish film producer? Or is there something more nuanced, something more historically contextual that the howling white folks were reacting to?
    You seem to believe it is hate, but perhaps it was the one of the only forms of retribution for a people subject to centuries some of the most barbarous oppression and brutality ever racially inflicted on one group of humans from another. After all, looking cross-eyed at a white person in the South during the ‘60s might get a black person killed. So the black person, whose grandfather may have been lynched for no good reason, serves the white person a small plate of their own shit- Gasp. And the Hollywood producer [ Jewish, no doubt] manages to interject a little comedy into an otherwise tragic historical legacy- Double Gasp.
    And the morally upstanding white person, operating in a historical vacuum, demands that the victims of every form of reprehensible evil possess no real human proclivity for retributive retaliation. And not only that, but from the vantage point of moral superiority, minimize said historical oppressors contribution to the human need for a pressure release valve in the form of retribution. And not only that, but from the beneficent vantage point of morally superior historical oppressor, demand that the oppressed possess the culture, class, and forgiveness that might only be surpassed by Christ himself, or else be deemed hateful.
    There’s a shit sandwich being served, I will agree, and it’s not in some fictional film.

  181. progress2conserve August 30, 2011 at 4:54 pm #

    We’re talking past each other Buck.
    I’m trying to argue from the specific to the general – because I lived the specific. I loved my black maid. She took care of me for 7 years, 1956 until 1963, when we had to move because of my dad’s work. I played with her son and my family ALWAYS had a good relationship with her family – even years and years later.
    Now, regarding:
    “You seem to believe it is hate, but perhaps it was the one of the only forms of retribution for a people subject to centuries some of the most barbarous oppression and brutality ever racially inflicted on one group of humans from another.”
    That IS hate, buck, there’s no other way to describe it. At some point, the cycle of retribution and hate has to stop. I’m doing what I can to understand it, and to try to stop it – in my corner of the world.
    Part of that involves presenting the idea that not all whites in the ’60’s in the South – were hate filled racists whose children and grandchildren deserve a lifetime of shit sandwiches.

  182. Buck Stud August 30, 2011 at 6:33 pm #

    Who’s advocating continual shit sandwiches? If anybody is, it would be Vlad and his ilk who can’t seem to distinguish between a film portraying a particular timeline, the audiences response to it, and their own longing for segregation that denies the present day reality of a multicultural society.
    Let me boil it down. You enlist a mechanic to work in your area – no you capture him and force him to work without pay – and subject him to the most dehumanizing conditions possible, for years and years on end. You rape his wife, and you sell his children into faraway labor. Then one day you go back and offer a descendant of this mechanic a pittance to work (in comparison to the going wage of white workers) with a smile on your face. You believe yourself to now be kind and moral – you’re going to pay him to work on your car!
    The mechanic agrees but inside he is flipping you half the peace sign. And he also recalls the injustice – he was one the offspring who was allowed to stay on the mechanic plantation with his Pop. But he works on your car anyway, and along the way pours some sugar in your gas tank just for good measure. What a hateful guy.
    But not as hateful as the Hollywood Jewish film maker who has the audacity to portray and chronicle the above scenario via artistic license.
    And poor Vlad Krantz, so offended and indignant, perhaps he can provides some fodder for some future potential creative effort: ” The Pathetic Victim ”

  183. messianicdruid August 30, 2011 at 7:02 pm #

    Hey, thanks for that bullfrog thing, I think you found a snake in the grass.

  184. ozone August 30, 2011 at 7:55 pm #

    Hey, no problem.
    If I find ’em, I toss ’em out for perusal… whether they may support my bias or no. (Older “life” is a fine time to begin to learn things; much too little, much too late, eh? At least we’ll get some entertainment value out of these amazing incongruities that surrounds us! ;o)

  185. ozone August 30, 2011 at 8:21 pm #

    Wow, Buck!
    I applaud your taking on “the burning Issue” that exists in the fevered imaginations of the socially inept; it’s one that is the last bastion of the pissed-without-knowing-why. Could it possibly be a CLASS system that’s fucking these fuckers? (Oh no, my “own kind” would NEVER fuck me so hard that it hurt.)
    IM[slightly warped]O, this “terrible burden” will be one of very least of our problems as things begin to “shake out” in TLE. Sure, it will be focused on as a “real” schism when the great crumbling is in its’ initial rush (especially by the existing media as a divisive tactic of the oligarchs), but later it’ll be, “What do you have for skills, mate?”
    ——– (that guy) as victim, is just perfect! That is the only incarnation that they can get any traction from. Of course, it’s all bullshit, but what other quadrant will grant them a soapbox?
    Poor, poor, downtrodden white folk; sorry that all the good stuff was handed out to them “coloreds”, and the scales of justice are weighted wrongly.
    Again, good luck wid dis discourse, but there’s a definitive reason I will not engage these fools. As one of the minor knock-ons, [in future] they can’t be trusted! If they’ll turn on other humans for spurious reasons, what do you think they might do to you or me when things get REALLY tight and they feel you might be suddenly “expendable” and use the excuse of “racial-wrong-headedness”?

  186. ozone August 30, 2011 at 8:27 pm #

    ***”SURROUND us” (singular). Sorry… goin’… gone…

  187. ozone August 30, 2011 at 8:33 pm #

    Thanks, Mr. Kunstler, for the photo links.
    Check in to see how everyone is doing tomorrow.
    Stay incorporated til then, All!

  188. anti soak August 30, 2011 at 9:09 pm #

    ‘After all, looking cross-eyed at a white person in the South during the ‘60s might get a black person killed’
    And looking at a Black or Mexican in LA [especially if you are GAY] will get you killed today…
    ask Reginald Denny, Chandra Levy or 1000s of others.
    I mean 1000s.

  189. anti soak August 30, 2011 at 9:13 pm #

    40 million more people added over the next 10 years..
    Many of whom hate USA, Euro Culture, the English language, Christianity, Suth’nuhs etc.
    Especially Muslims…gawd dang.
    what gets to me is all the old Russians in LA.
    I assume they get ‘the dole’.
    Theres a building at 3405 [?] Via Dolce in Marina del rey………Owned by the Government but taken over by the Myfya…

  190. anti soak August 30, 2011 at 9:15 pm #


  191. progress2conserve August 30, 2011 at 9:17 pm #

    Buck, interesting post, but your time line is all wrong:
    “Let me boil it down. You enlist a mechanic to work in your area – no you capture him and force him to work without pay – and subject him to the most dehumanizing conditions possible, for years and years on end. You rape his wife, and you sell his children into faraway labor. Then one day you go back and offer a descendant of this mechanic a pittance to work (in comparison to the going wage of white workers) with a smile on your face. You believe yourself to now be kind and moral – you’re going to pay him to work on your car!”
    The man to whom you are referring as “you” was dead by 1890 or so. Yet, this “you” continues in the above paragraph – in the present tense no less – for nine more references to “you,” “your,” and “you’re.”
    No children have been sold into “faraway labor” since 1864 – yet the man called “you” is still responsible.
    Even though the grandchildren and greatgrandchildren of the African-American beneficiaries of the Civil Rights Act have walked totally free in America for 47 years –
    the man called “you” is still responsible –
    In other words, I, as a white guy – born in the South or in the US – can NEVER –
    NEVER – NOT EVER – be forgiven for Black Slavery –
    because my great-great-grandfather was “you.”
    Not. ever.
    Is that the way it is in your mind, Buck?
    Does this seem reasonable?

  192. anti soak August 30, 2011 at 9:20 pm #

    Whenever the Left encounters massive public skepticism regarding the benefits of homosexual marriage,
    open borders,
    global warming,
    Obama’s presidency,
    or whatever the liberal cause du jour may be, they can always depend on striking a sympathetic chord with mainstream conservatives and liberals alike by dusting off yet another reminiscence about the bad old days of segregation to remind us of how righteous liberals are.

  193. anti soak August 30, 2011 at 9:21 pm #


  194. Eleuthero August 30, 2011 at 9:24 pm #

    LB said:
    But it’s not just the clerical class that is so remiss with accuracy.
    How about doctors. You know they guys that think they’re entitled to big money.
    Point taken!! In denigrating our “service
    personnel class” I was most assuredly NOT
    saying that professional class was doing
    much better. My sense is that doctors are
    MUCH dumber than just a couple of decades
    ago … which is just a blip in historical time.
    I could write a lengthy missive about what has
    become of doctors, teachers, school admins,
    and engineers such as PROGRAMMERS for ten
    paragraphs. However, my overarching point in
    my post was, and is, that our politicians are
    diminished competence and conscience.
    And, yes, that DOES include the big money guys
    that the phone flunkies work for!!!

  195. anti soak August 30, 2011 at 9:24 pm #

    Far as ‘tearin down good Buildings’ its the same in Soviet Monica…Especially at the College, which has been called a ‘construction site not a school’.
    The leftist green creeps now have covered 4 huge fields in Plastic [astro turf]…Huge football sized fields.
    That the stuff soon starts to fray and send plastic beads into the bay doesnt matter to them…
    The contractor must have made millions.

  196. Qshtik August 30, 2011 at 9:25 pm #

    The Bahamas has a per capita income of around $25,000
    per capita
    by or for each individual person: income per capita.
    Bust, I find this HARD to believe. Picture this: a man, a women and their two little kids with a total income of $100K.
    I’ve been to the Bahamas a couple of times … AIN’T NO WAY!
    I’d even be surprised if “household” income averaged $25K.

  197. Cavepainter August 30, 2011 at 9:29 pm #

    Amazing;…….I never realized that spouting lofty ideals worked as incantation. What a relief that our nation is no longer confronting the otherwise implacable calculus of limited carrying capacity. Why hell yes – if that be the case – let all the world’s overpopulation seek refuge here in America. Crazy, selfish me; somehow I just didn’t have faith in another miracle like the one of Christ feeding thousands on table scraps.

  198. Eleuthero August 30, 2011 at 9:34 pm #

    P2C said:
    Somehow – deep in the American psyche – honest labor, subservience, and slavery have become hopelessly conflated.
    And we wonder why front line employees sometimes act conflicted – or even a little bit pissed.
    I don’t disagree with you but I don’t think low
    level employees EVER got THAT much respect and
    admiration even in 1965. Yet they did their jobs
    with conscience and accuracy.
    I’ve noticed in California that the “old school”
    practice of making your 16-year-old kid WORK in
    the summer seems to be rarer and rarer. When I
    was in my late teens I was a tire changer in a
    Sears Auto Center … a VERY physically taxing
    job. In other summers I was a janitor, a melon
    picker, and a caretaker in a dog pound.
    I think our entire society just got spoiled by
    the stock/bond/housing bubbles in the 1990s and
    the 2000s and when they couldn’t achieve “wealth
    without work” they just got PISSED. The young
    kids got pissed because Mom and Dad started to
    struggle and their fainting asses actually had
    to work. Mom and Dad got pissed of because
    their brokerage account and house stopped paying
    20% per year.
    We have become a degenerate nation because of a
    couple of decades of asset inflation and our
    “addiction” to it.

  199. progress2conserve August 30, 2011 at 9:38 pm #

    “IM[slightly warped]O, this “terrible burden” will be one of very least of our problems as things begin to “shake out” in TLE.”
    -ozone, on racial differences-
    Ozone, I hope you’re right.
    But I fear you’re wrong.
    Despite 47 years of the Grand Experiment known as racial mixing in America – the races are as stratified as ever. Look at any city in the US and you will find communities that are stratified by race and social class – but especially by race.
    Look at any lunch room at any racially mixed high school in America – and you will see racial segregation – as students, generally, CHOOSE to eat with their “friends.”
    Even look at the US military – a “showpiece” of racially mixed harmony if one EVER existed – –
    but look during off-duty hours, and racial segregation hasn’t budged very much since the 1960’s.
    People are tribal, generally.
    When placed under stress – they become more tribal, not less.
    JHK acknowledges these facts, in his TLE books.
    We can wish this were not so.
    Wishing will not change reality.
    Consider all possible realities, O3.

  200. anti soak August 30, 2011 at 9:56 pm #

    Thanks Vlad… P cesspool is A great SITE!
    Many of our political elite use the “Frankfurt School” ideology to run and ruin our society:
    To further the advance of their ‘quiet’ cultural revolution – but giving us no ideas about their plans for the future – the School recommended (among other things):
    1. The creation of racism offences
    2. Continual change to create confusion
    3. The teaching of sex and homosexuality to children
    4. The undermining of schools’ and teachers’ authority
    5. Huge immigration to destroy identity
    6. The promotion of excessive drinking
    7. Emptying of churches
    8. An unreliable legal system with bias against victims of crime
    9. Dependency on the state or state benefits
    10. Control and dumbing down of media
    11. Encouraging the breakdown of the family
    One of the main ideas of the Frankfurt School was to exploit Freud’s idea of ‘pansexualism’ – the search for pleasure, the exploitation of the differences between the sexes, the overthrowing of traditional relationships between men and women. To further their aims they would:
    • attack the authority of the father, deny the specific roles of father and mother, and wrest away from families
    • their rights as primary educators of their children
    • abolish differences in the education of boys and girls
    • abolish all forms of male dominance
    • declare women to be an ‘oppressed class’ and men as ‘oppressors’
    Munzenberg summed up the Frankfurt School’s long-term operation thus: ”We will make the West so corrupt that it stinks.”
    The School believed there were two types of revolution: (a) political and (b) cultural.
    Cultural revolution demolishes from within. ‘Modern forms of subjection are marked by mildness’.
    They saw it as a long-term project and kept their sights clearly focused on the family, education, media, sex and popular culture

  201. anti soak August 30, 2011 at 9:57 pm #

    ” look at the US military – a “showpiece” of racially mixed harmony if one EVER existed – –
    but look during off-duty hours, and racial segregation hasn’t budged very much since the 1960’s. ”

  202. Freedom Guerrilla August 30, 2011 at 9:58 pm #

    James is right. Made it up to the family farm along the Mohawk River, and it is nothing short of shocking to see the water levels that high.
    With all the focus on NYC and DC, few considered the NE water dumping zone… except Michelle Bachman maybe.

  203. anti soak August 30, 2011 at 10:00 pm #

    Ozone, I hope you’re right.
    But I fear you’re wrong………..WHAT WAS HE TALKING ABOUT?

  204. San Jose Mom 51 August 30, 2011 at 10:17 pm #

    You say in the good old days, sixteen-year-olds worked in the summer. A week after I turned 16 my dad told me to get a job. I worked at Sears as a cashier.
    But today their are no jobs for teenagers under 18. I know of three guys that looked all summer…out pounding the pavement. Nothing. One of our friends, who is 19, got a job bagging groceries a nice Italian grocery store–but his parents know the owners. That being said, he only got 8 hours of work a week.
    My son has experience as a sign waver. The summer before the 2008 crash he would go out to the very busy intersection of Almaden Expressway and Blossom Hill in a sandwich costume waving a Subway sign.
    He actually saw a want ad where they wanted applicants to have EXPERIENCE as a sign waver. You had to demonstrate your waving and spinning technique. Experience for a sign waver? What is the world coming to?

  205. Buck Stud August 30, 2011 at 10:53 pm #

    ” Even though the grandchildren and greatgrandchildren of the African-American beneficiaries of the Civil Rights Act have walked totally free in America for 47 years –
    the man called “you” is still responsible -”
    This movie is set in the ’60s, right around the time George Wallace was blocking a university entrance and canines( was anti-soak on a leash, making citizens arrest?) and fire hoses were set loose on African-Americans. In other words, the tail end of Jim Crow. So can we agree that, in terms of timeline, gradations of brutality and oppression were in play?
    I highly doubt the audience, including white people, is sanctioning this behavior in 2011 just because they had a chuckle; subtle minds are able to recognize the frailty of human morality when confronted with the overwhelming urge of vengeance and retribution, especially given a historical portrayal in the medium of film or the theater.
    So the larger question for me is why some fail to acknowledge/recognize the context of the movie narrative and misrepresent this context as a present day affirmation of one race serving another shit?
    Of course, that is not a hard question to answer when talking about self-serving racists with a twisted, psychotic agenda.
    So how do you feel about the assertions/declarations of the film critic, Prog?

  206. Golden Eagle August 30, 2011 at 11:06 pm #

    The pathetic neurosis of the CNN/eternal death watch on the approach of Hurricane Irene was the producers’ bet on the conditioned voyeurism gripp the american audience to do nothing but watch how man millions of fellow consumers (not citizens) suffer “an act of god” (not) if the storm maintain category 2 winds.NOT the NE megalopolis centric priorities in mass media (oK that supported the usual lets watch a disaster smoke millions voyeur treat). Even if it included themselves as they watched. Or includes them as the Gloabl Titannic sails speedily into the ice flow …..

  207. Golden Eagle August 30, 2011 at 11:13 pm #

    PS: Thanks to PBS providing momentary relief in the airing of Ernesto Cardenal reading from his newest book, Pluriverse .

  208. progress2conserve August 30, 2011 at 11:48 pm #

    “So how do you feel about the assertions/declarations of the film critic, Prog?”
    Buck, I feel that we have worn this thing out by talking about it – especially considering that neither you nor I have seen the film.
    We’re also trying to have an argument/discussion about historical context of historical actors. There is something about you that seems to infer that the oppressed in history were always good – while ALL members of the society that included the oppression were always evil.
    Maybe I’m off base and/or projecting things on to you that are undeserved. But there’s a lack of consideration of context – on the part of many posters on CFN – who identify ONLY with the victors of the American Civil War.
    As illustrated by this block of text from you, from earlier in the discussion:
    “And even those antecedents who fought for the wretched, reprehensible side of a battle are held up for pride and praise a hundred and fifty years after the fact(i.e., the Southern blowhard proudly lionizing some Johnny Reb warrior in their blood line).”
    “Wretched” and “reprehensible” indicate a certain prejudgement concerning historical context, I believe.
    And BTW, I’ve been saying for months that CFN tilts liberal and atheistic.
    It also tilts Yankee – now that I think about it.
    And someone is, even NOW, saying to himself – I wish Buck and P2C would JUST SHUT UP about the American Civil War – for Gawd’s Sake.
    Well, to that person – tough titty.
    But also consider that we’re still refighting the thing 150 years later – this means something.
    Is there a lesson for the modern US and our warlike interventions into the Civil Affairs of other countries?? I would say that there is.

  209. truthteller August 31, 2011 at 12:08 am #

    {Anyway, legacies and lineage imbue humans with a certain sense of pride or a certain sense of failure – all those Scottish Highland festivals, for example. And even those antecedents who fought for the wretched, reprehensible side of a battle are held up for pride and praise a hundred and fifty years after the fact(i.e., the Southern blowhard proudly lionizing some Johnny Reb warrior in their blood line).}
    I am happy to be a Southerner, BuckStud. Note the difference between happy and proud, if you will 🙂 Something that really angers me is that as a Southerner, you catch it from both sides . . . here, on JHK’s forum, Southern people are always pigeonholed as cheeze-doodle-munchin’, Nascar watchin’ brain-dead fucktards, regardless of our individuality (I’d venture to say that it takes folks of a certain level of intellect to even seek out a forum like this to begin with . . . after all, there’s shit on cable to watch, ain’t there? 🙂 You get this from the elitists of all races, no matter where you go or what you’re doing, if you happen to have a trace of a Southern accent. Ask Prog, but I imagine it’s worse for us women than it is for the menfolk 🙂
    Next, as a white person, in the South, you have a distinct possibility of catching hell from blacks as well, whether you consider yourself to be racist or not (me, I do NOT consider myself to be racist . . . I consider myself to be anti-hassle-fucking-bullshit 🙂 . . . I went to pay a parking ticket at the municipal court the other day . . . I was standing in line for an hour behind the same slacker video-game-playing-living-in-his-mom’s-basement standard white guy, and there were a couple of what I would consider to be “ghetto” women steadily cutting line (they just HAPPEN to be black . . . they were ghetto to the bone, regardless of their color . . . I guess similar whites would be called “white-trash”, a la Wild and Wonderful Whites of West Virginia :)~ . . . when I got near the front of the line, one woman said to the other, “oh, hell naw . . . you better NOT let that white lady cut in front of you!” And I turned and calmly said, “I’ve been behind this guy for an hour, and I am not cutting line as you have been . . . ask these other people you so rudely have been cutting in front of and see what they think about it.” The other people who were being dissed quickly affirmed my position, and they backed down, but not befor the “senior” ghetto lady with gold front teeth got really close up in my face and said, “Uh huh . . . oh, ok, Miss Lady . . . uh huh.” But she backed down. Probably because she sensed that I don’t take no guff and I’m willing to go to jail if necessary if I’m physically assaulted 🙂
    So, at home in the South, with my “people”, I’m kinda like Joe Bageant always talked about . . . you feel like you don’t quite fit . . . you’re intellectually superior to some, but on their wavelength culturally. And others who you may be intellectually equal to, you are “culturally inferior” to, evidenced by your cursed accent 🙂
    It’s a quandry, for sure, Buck 🙂 But personally, I don’t refight the Civil War, nor do I hold up as heroes some long lost Rebel ancestor. My people were humble Scots-Irish sharecroppers . . . we were more likely to be working side by side in the field with a negro, than to be owning any 🙂 Just a thought, just a playful thought.

  210. Buck Stud August 31, 2011 at 12:10 am #

    Well Prog, you didn’t answer my question. But I’m burned out on this anyway, and in no small part because your responses are so fractionated. But if you post any more thoughts on the Civil War etc., I will read with interest.

  211. truthteller August 31, 2011 at 12:30 am #

    {“ Having old black men and women saying “sir” and “ma’am” to whites less than half their age was just ridiculous”}
    I don’t know about saying sir and ma’am to people half my age, but as a Southerner, I was taught to say “sir” and “ma’am” to anyone who was my elder, regardless of their color. And now, these kids of all colors are saying “ma’am” to me! And I wanna smack ’em upside the head! :)~~ When did I become a “ma’am”, dammit? :)~ Perhaps when I hit 35? 🙂 Seems to be around then 🙂

  212. truthteller August 31, 2011 at 12:42 am #

    {And the morally upstanding white person, operating in a historical vacuum, demands that the victims of every form of reprehensible evil possess no real human proclivity for retributive retaliation. And not only that, but from the vantage point of moral superiority, minimize said historical oppressors contribution to the human need for a pressure release valve in the form of retribution. And not only that, but from the beneficent vantage point of morally superior historical oppressor, demand that the oppressed possess the culture, class, and forgiveness that might only be surpassed by Christ himself, or else be deemed hateful.
    There’s a shit sandwich being served, I will agree, and it’s not in some fictional film.}
    Jesus Christ, Buck. That makes a whole bunch of sense if you’re not one of the descendants of the fucks who did that shit to those folks 🙂 I was born in 1969, in ALABAMA, and I rode the integrated school bus with a whole bunch of these black children, and we got along fine. People tried to tell me that I should call them “niggers” and I never bought it. They were just people like me. That’s the way I grew up. I agree with every thing MLK ever espoused. I think I even posted “I have a Dream” here in a past week at one point. So I should be responsible for the sins of my ancestors? WTF? I’ve had this conversation with black friends, among others. I’ve asked them why it’s ok for them to call each other “niggers” if it’s not right for any one else to call them that . . . my perspective is that if it’s wrong for ONE, it’s wrong for ALL 🙂 They’re not down with that, for some reason 🙂 I’ve talked about reparations with my black friends . . . they think reparations should COME ON WITH IT . . . I’ve asked them why people who never enslaved them personally, should have to pay for the sins of their fathers . . . . no good answer for that either, except THEY SHOULD, because they OWE US! I have tried to delve, but people get MAD, as you can imagine . . . I consider myself fortunate that I have black friends that I care about and care about me in return, that I can even ask these questions of 🙂 Otherwise, they’d have shived me in my liver about 10 years ago already 🙂

  213. AMR August 31, 2011 at 1:47 am #

    The reason that experience, personality tests, background and credit checks and the like are required for menial temp jobs is that our recruiting class has become dominated by self-referential bullshit artists and low-level sadists. It is quite simply sadistic for recruiters to instigate stampedes, make applicants jump through needless hoops or subject them to demeaning procedures that have no bearing whatsoever on job qualifications. Through sheer repetition and thanks to our excessive ability to suffer fools and worse gladly, Americans have become inured to workplace procedures that are frankly beyond the pale and that would have European employees on strike in a matter of hours.
    We will probably very soon need additional public housing and laws providing for vacant houses to be seized by the authorities or legally homesteaded by the homeless. The alternatives will be massive homelessness on the part of people who have hitherto been materially secure, a very volatile situation, or some sort of mass imprisonment or conscription of the poor, which would have its own practical problems on account of its mightily pissing people off. The housing problem is much, much easier to address than the paid jobs problem. But at some point, if the basic material needs of the population aren’t addressed, our cities will burn.
    Never mind. Squatters recently set a vacant house on fire in Eureka, so that’s starting to happen already.

  214. Pangolin August 31, 2011 at 2:07 am #

    Still the same cranky worthless bastards trying to win the goddamn Civil War by typing. GET THE FUCK OVER IT ALREADY!!! You dumbshits LOST and lost hard.
    Guess what else you lost? Your lily-white majority because Southerners were too fucking stupid to unionize and protect their jobs and meat processors went and imported tens of thousands of illegals to replace citizens with workers rights.
    They’re here to stay suckers. The U.S. is better off for it too. For starters you can now get decent birria without driving to L.A..
    The “oh-look-shiny” media hyped the hell out Irene because it was an easy freaking story that was hand fed to them by the national weather service. Every 2-bit news station in the country sent reporters to the East Coast to do the stupid-human-in-the-storm gig. I guess it beats working for a living.
    Reading this crap I’m starting to believe the whack-jobs that think fluoride in the water is making us stupid. There’s a fuck-ton of evidence for that.

  215. asoka. August 31, 2011 at 2:13 am #

    Great post, Pangolin!
    Participatory democracy demands low-energy technology, and free people must travel the road to productive social relations at the speed of a bicycle. –Ivan Illich

  216. AMR August 31, 2011 at 2:27 am #

    Ha! One of my friends is looking forward to menopause: “I like the idea of not getting my period and feeling warm all the time. Sign me up, I’m down with that!”
    Another friend is very much like your frenemy from the menopause support group, except not a bitch. She is salty of tongue but pretty much sane, stable, responsible, decent and friendly. This girl is a doula, vocal home birth advocate and close follower of the lunar cycle, especially full moons. Some of the hippie ideas that resonate with her are a bit fringy, but she isn’t an extremist or a nut. She recently joined one of her good friends, a doula trainee and sex advice blogger, for a new moon women’s circle in Santa Monica. (Some things are beyond parody.) This friend of hers (who, to her credit, is much saner than most people who make public pronouncements on sex) has recently been chasing the holy grail of the old-time cycle–menstruation beginning on the new moon, ovulation on the full moon–that was standard in the days before artificial light.
    My thesis is that that sort of thing isn’t just hippie nuttery, but also American micromanagement of things that shouldn’t be micromanaged. An astounding number of Americans apparently think that a major obstacle to their self-actualization is that they can’t always take a shit on time. “Dammit, I was supposed to take a dump at 6:00 this morning, but it’s noon and I still haven’t gone! Not only that, I don’t have to go!” Laxative and stool softener sales in the US are out of this world, even in comparison to scatalogically obsessed Germany. The difference is that Germans mainly talk about their shit, while we micromanage ours.
    It fits in nicely with some of our other traditions, like play dates.
    Combine that with the conventional wisdom that bodily functions are supposed to be terrible embarrassments, especially for women, and we have a recipe for stupid neuroses that plays right into the hands of marketers. Consider some of the recurrent themes of Cosmo Magazine: “Omigod, I was in a massage parlor and my tampon flooded! The masseuse tried to discreetly tell me, but….” It’s a bit psychotic for a flooded tampon to be a mortifying embarrassment for a woman who is naked on a table while someone else is rubbing her thighs. That’s some serious cognitive dissonance. At the same time, the answer isn’t to go to other extreme by sitting in a circle and saying, “I am woman, see me menstruate!” (Unless one’s occupation involves menstrual porn, in which case saying that is smart business. There’s no way that menstrual porn isn’t popular in part because menstruation is considered so titillating and forbidden. Some Arabs get their jollies from ankle porn.) The better solution is to say, “Oops, I forgot to change my tampon. What, you think that’s weird? Grow up.” But that’s neither prudish nor salacious enough for Americans.

  217. Pangolin August 31, 2011 at 3:00 am #

    I’ll see your Red Tent obsessed doula and raise you a _nt-obsessed orgasmic birth filmaker. Why just go through a painful labor when you can go through a painful labor with a giant Hitachi vibrator buzzing the works like a fresh poured cement driveway.
    Don’t neglect to point a four-inch lens at the operating end the whole time to savor the moment later or at least post it on a perv-porn board.
    You want real crazy try this: http://youtu.be/3fJdnvQSOcA
    All of this crap is just endless variations on the global “Queen Bitch” contest that all women seem genetically compelled to indulge in. Women are either angling for Queen, manipulating their Queen or riding some Queens coattails because they can’t focus a social group around themselves.
    Dig around the internet a bit and you’ll find that teen girls the world over are cutting to the chase and just posting porn videos of themselves. Why beat around the bush when you can own men’s eyeballs with a simple expedient.
    Finally this Slutwalk stuff; this is a trend that is not going to end well. I expect escalation to proceed post-haste.

  218. ak August 31, 2011 at 3:17 am #

    Drawn and Quartered

    or is it

    Quartered and Drawn

    I’m positive all regulars would support that to be implemented on the Canadian Geese Whatever bot-maker {publicly).
    (I wish this site would add a ‘thumps-up/down’ button*, and dynamically adjust itself)

    *] -like fmr MW

  219. Eleuthero August 31, 2011 at 3:35 am #

    Pangolin said:
    All of this crap is just endless variations on the global “Queen Bitch” contest that all women seem genetically compelled to indulge in. Women are either angling for Queen, manipulating their Queen or riding some Queens coattails because they can’t focus a social group around themselves.
    It wasn’t too long ago that 99% of women, even
    in the USA and Europe, were too tied up with
    issues of household budgets and making ends
    meet to indulge in the Queen Bitch contest.
    I think the Queen Bitch phenomenon of which you
    speak has been vastly amplified in the last
    couple of decades. Talk to any lawyer you know.
    In virtually all in-court cases involving “he
    said, she said”, the man is found guilty mainly
    because he has a penis.
    Remember Tawana Brawley!! How long was she
    nattered at by lawyers before she ‘fessed up??
    The pendulum has definitely swung in terms of
    jurisprudence. If a woman gooses you at work,
    it’s to be taken as the sweetness and light of
    capricious femininity. Females fired or
    incarcerated for sexual harrassment?? Gotta
    be a very few anomalous cases.
    Men have to be REALLY careful about reining in
    their horny-dog proclivities in this society.
    If a nutter cries “rape” in your apartment, the
    law convicts the man FIRST and tries to find the
    facts LATER … at a very “leisurely” pace.
    This may sound misogynistic to the many fine
    women on CFN but I’ve got two lawyer friends
    who assure me that having a penis in 2011
    means you’re half guilty of all incidents with
    the opposite sex before you’re even read your
    Miranda Rights.

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  222. lbendet August 31, 2011 at 7:57 am #

    The past 47 years of racial mixing as you put it is not a total flop, though I agree there are still very strong vestiges of past segregation lingering both in reality and figuratively.
    I don’t think NYC is as segregated as you describe. Much of what you see is an economic striation more than a social one if you understand my distinction.
    I have worked and lived in many places where black and whites not only work together or live in close proximity, but interact and enjoy each others’ company, and sense of humor.
    It is naive to think that blacks have not entered the middle class and upper middle class in the last 47 years. I’ve worked with and become friends with blacks who have either married whites, or grew up with swimming pools in their backyards and there was plenty of commonality to draw from.
    I have also served on jury duty where blacks have not backed a person of their own race. In fact they were embarrassed by and were actively against the plaintiff and/or defendant.
    Although there is a history of unfairness in the justice system, I still saw attitudes and reactions that were based more economic standing than racial. That’s the truth as I’ve seen and experienced it although I’ve allowed people to say otherwise on this blog in the past.
    I felt this morning I should step up to the plate and counter some of these discussion, though I am loath to do it. The fact is that people write things here that may have never interacted with blacks, but make blanket statements about a whole race of people. It’s just not that simple, is all I’m saying. There are complicated issues, here concerning culture, money and having to navigate in a society that doesn’t accept or understand you.
    You have a President of mixed race, doesn’t that register with you? Could that have happened 47 years ago?

  223. ozone August 31, 2011 at 8:15 am #

    As the [human] world descends into utter madness, Big Dick Cheney is coldly pursuing his now-standard ploy of revision via teevee. I think Mr. Wilkerson is starting to like the idea of seeing Dicky in the dock at the Hague… Dicky probably would like to pre-empt those types of proceedings by giving false testimony over the “public” airwaves.
    He’s spinnin’ pretty fast, I think he’s finally scared. Good, hope he stays just that-a-way for the remainder of his miserable hidey-hole life.

  224. lbendet August 31, 2011 at 8:27 am #

    Ha, Ozone
    If only I were a writer, I would write a script for a horror film called “The Man with No Pulse” featuring Dick Cheney as the war criminal he is.
    Lying has become second nature to this man and he keeps fighting tooth and nail since he left office to spin his perverse memes for the record of course.
    Once you think it’s ok to lie a country into “preemptive” war, because the ends justify the means, you’re no better than any other monster.

  225. ozone August 31, 2011 at 8:44 am #

    …Oh, and that’s not to say that Col. Larry and Colon Powell don’t have a river of blood and a mountain of bones to atone for. I’m not forgetting that Wilkerson put together the text of Powell’s UN “presentation” on Iraq’s oh-so-potent stockpile of WMD’s.
    Nobody’s motives in this giant clusterfuck are pure as the driven snow. (More like, spattered with the driven shit.)

  226. ozone August 31, 2011 at 8:50 am #

    “If only I were a writer, I would write a script for a horror film called “The Man with No Pulse” featuring Dick Cheney as the war criminal he is.”
    Soon to be staged as a terrifying, off-off-Broadway production at the Hidey-Hole Theatre! ;o)

  227. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 9:36 am #

    So, I come home last night and my husband tells me that the neighbors have had their electricity turned off, so they ran an extension cord from our barn to their house to run their refrigerator.
    I think that this is a fire hazard.
    Does anyone more knowledgeable know?
    I am sorry that they are poor, but maybe they shouldn’t have run their air conditioner day and night if they didn’t have enough money to pay for the energy.
    This is the new America, too poor to pay for air conditioning. And having the damn security light (!) on all night.
    Watching Vermont flood, I have to say I don’t feel too bad about that.
    But I don’t want to burn down my barn because their electricity is off.
    So. Does anyone have an informed answer? Once again, my husband and I are arguing about energy!

  228. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 9:41 am #

    I hope no one misinterprets my comment about Vermont.
    It is horrible what is happening to Vermont. If it takes poverty to stop the overuse of energy in the US, thereby slowing global warming, and the attendant floods, fires, droughts and hurricanes, then I am OK with that.
    Perhaps there should be education, however, so it isn’t betweeen cooling your house to 70 degrees in the summer, and no energy at all.
    These people are really stupid, and they would have to have it spelled out to them.
    Not by me, though. I think they’re violent, also. The police and the parmedics were there last week.
    I’m thinking the TV should run some education on how to save energy.

  229. lbendet August 31, 2011 at 10:00 am #

    I mentioned the other day that there are solar powered generators out there for under $2,000.00. I know for some this is way too much though they prob. could charge it and pay slowly. Point is how can you own a home and not have some kind of back-up?
    It is tragic that the way of life as we have known it is slipping away from our ability to pay for it. There will be all kinds of norms we will no long afford, this is just the tip of the iceberg.
    Sorry about your dilemma.

  230. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 10:02 am #

    So you are seriously bragging that Obama is a more efficient war criminal!
    How nice that no Americans were killed in the destruction of Libyan society and the murder of thousands of Libyans.
    Do you realize that the “rebels” are slaughtering black Libyans? And also African immigrant workers?
    As Phil Rockstroh points out, do you really think that the dead Libyans, Pakistanis, Iraqis, Somalis, Sudanese, and all the others are OK with being killed, because it’s a smooth talking black President instead of a bumbling white one responsible?

  231. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 10:06 am #

    They don’t own the home. They rent it, but probably not for long. I’m guessing the eviction notice is coming soon.
    I live paycheck to paycheck myself. I have no generator backup.
    When the electricity goes out, I just make do. The advantage to living next to the sewage plant is that getting their electricity back on seems to be top priority.
    After our hurricane, the hospital’s electricity was back on in two days, and mine was back on in three days.
    Whoo hoo!

  232. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 10:19 am #

    I think that Glenn Ford says it well –

  233. progress2conserve August 31, 2011 at 10:25 am #

    LBend – Wage’s neighbors do TO have a backup plan; they sponge off of Wage.
    You’re a wonderful person Wage –
    Or an easy mark. Sometimes it’s a fine line. ;0)
    But I do love a good technical question about electricity, so here goes:
    Assuming that your barn is properly wired –
    And assuming that the circuit breaker/fuse on the plug that has the refrigerator extension cord in it is properly sized –
    And assuming that the extension cord coming out of your barn is in good condition and of a large enough wire gauge to carry the load without overheating –
    Then, if all these assumptions are OK – you should have a fire hazard near zero. The fire hazard may increase inside your neighbors house, though.
    But I’d still be careful with it.
    And most common outdoor-use drop cords are usually 16 gauge wire. That’s too small to run a refrigerator at a distance of much over 25 feet or so – depending on the size of the ‘frig.
    And LBend – I’m researching your New York City contentions. Interesting stuff!

  234. progress2conserve August 31, 2011 at 10:37 am #

    LBend –
    My response was to Ozone. He argues race won’t be a factor in TLE. I believe it will. So does JHK.
    But moving on to your contention about NYC. I will agree with you that the crowds one sees in Lower Manhattan, for example, look completely and joyously integrated. But, LBend, where do all of those people go to sleep?
    Above map is based on 2000 census data.
    NY City LIVING (as opposed to working) patterns look pretty well segregated by race.
    Here are the directions for the map key – which struck me as hilarious, for some reason:
    “To match his map, Red is White, Blue is Black, Green is Asian, Orange is Hispanic, Gray is Other, and each dot is 25 people. Data from Census 2000.”
    Comments at the bottom of the map are generally quite constructive, too.

  235. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 10:41 am #

    Thank you, prog, for the info. It’s my husband who’s the easy mark, though.
    I don’t know if any of your assumptions are true. I did have the circuit breaker box changed years ago, when the electrician was horrified to see a bird’s nest in the old one.
    But the particular plug that they are using? I don’t know. And it’s way more than 25 feet.
    And I’m worried about my baby goats chewing on the wire.

  236. progress2conserve August 31, 2011 at 10:42 am #

    Here’s LBend’s original comment about NYC, linked.

  237. CynicalOne August 31, 2011 at 10:44 am #

    “So you are seriously bragging that Obama is a more efficient war criminal!” – Wagelaborer
    I guess that’s what my Dad was talking about recently when he said “I’m sure glad we didn’t get involved in Libya.” wth???
    I worry about him. Seriously. Seems he’s now trying to fabricate a new reality.
    “As Phil Rockstroh points out, do you really think that the dead Libyans, Pakistanis, Iraqis, Somalis, Sudanese, and all the others are OK with being killed, because it’s a smooth talking black President instead of a bumbling white one responsible?” – Wagelaborer

  238. progress2conserve August 31, 2011 at 10:46 am #

    Put your hand on the wire and feel it while the ‘frig is running. If the wire feels much more than warm at your end of the circuit – personally, I’d unplug it, or else trip the breaker myself. Circuit sounds like it’s probably pretty close to being overloaded, anyway. (hint hint)
    And yeah – baby goats and electricity don’t tend to mix well – from what I’ve heard.

  239. anticapitalistcharley August 31, 2011 at 10:51 am #

    looking forward to hearing part 2 of your discussion with Richard Heinberg

  240. Cash August 31, 2011 at 10:55 am #

    I’m not sure what you’re talking about but if you’re looking to kick me for your fellow citizens’ fecklessness w.r.t. controlling their own borders you’ve got the wrong man. I’m not an American. You need to take issue with your own govts and elites for letting it go on.
    As far as immigration in general goes it has to have rational underpinnings. Importing people that need jobs while exporting the jobs that people need is a recipe for societal suicide. You won’t find me supporting such a formula.
    Immigration at a time when a country has a need for labour and the space and resource capacity for them is fine. Keeping the immigration floodgates open while you have a serious unemployment problem is LUNACY.
    Insisting that immigrants pledge their allegiance to your country, your people, your flag is imperative. Insisting that they drop their allegiance to the old country, old flag, old people is just as imperative as is insisting that they learn the ways of their new country and leave behind the old ways and old customs.
    What we have here is what I call “first and foremost-ism”. A lot of people here are too squeamish to insist on undivided loyalties. So, to these folks, as long as citizens are Canadian “first and foremost” it’s fine. It’s as far as people in a society embarrassed by its own existence are willing to go. And besides it shows how broadminded and morally elevated they are. None of this laughable ‘Murkan George Dubya Bush-ian e pluribus unum stuff for them. Never mind the reality of what’s been happening here for generations.

  241. CynicalOne August 31, 2011 at 10:57 am #

    So Wage, because your neighbors are likely wasteful with energy, likely unwilling to sacrifice their comfort and very possibly stupid as well, YOU are now supplying them with electricity to run their fridge? WOW.
    But that is the plan after all…from the “haves” to the “have nots”, eh?
    Sounds like they need some “tough love” but I understand your reluctance.
    Hopefully they’re on their way out.
    Good luck!

  242. CynicalOne August 31, 2011 at 11:02 am #

    “I’m thinking the TV should run some education on how to save energy.” – Wagelaborer
    I’m sorry Wage, too many people don’t want to educate themselves.
    They prefer to hold their hand out.

  243. Joyce August 31, 2011 at 11:52 am #

    It’s all my fault. I should have prayed harder.

  244. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 12:03 pm #

    I wish there were a “like button” on this thing.

  245. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 12:16 pm #

    I’m not very comfortable with racial things.
    Last night, one of my black co-workers asked me what a baby (that I had triaged 2 hours) before looked like.
    I couldn’t remember the baby, let alone what she looked like.
    So he said “Was she black or white?”
    I didn’t want to go all Stephen Colbert, and claim that I don’t see race, but I really couldn’t remember. Plus, her name was Miracle, which sounded like a black name to me, but was it racist to say so?
    It turned out the baby was white. So there you go.

  246. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 12:25 pm #

    But I think that black people have to put up with a lot of bullshit. Poverty, racism and police harrassment especially.
    Even people here who argue with Vlad frequently announce that he would never say his racist things in front of black people, the assumption being that he would get beat up, I guess.
    But I have seen black people very politely ignore racist comments. And when I was a band parent, and we went to one of our small racist towns, one of the black kids looked at a stand selling confederate flags and told me that that scared him.
    Of course it would, if he knew the history of lynchings in the South.
    Prog, you say that slavery was over a century ago, and that’s true, but lynchings were within the lifetime of that kid’s grandma.
    JHK and the rest frequently predict riots and marches on the Hamptons when TSHTF, but TSHTF for black people 30 years ago, and they very rarely riot.
    I agree with lbendet that what I call NAACP black people really don’t approve of what I call ghetto black people. I think that they feel that all black people are judged by a few, and I agree.

  247. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 12:30 pm #

    And I don’t think that living in the ghetto makes you a low pants wearing, gang banging person anymore than my living in a trailer park for many years makes me white trash.
    I have been door to door (campaigning) in the ghettoes around here, and most people are intelligent and polite, just to make myself clear.

  248. asoka. August 31, 2011 at 12:43 pm #

    Why don’t ya compare O’s policies to somebody that might make a difference?

    Please tell me which of the current candidates has a record of removing dictators and I will gladly compare their record with Obama’s record in terms of costs to taxpayers and American lives lost.

  249. asoka. August 31, 2011 at 12:50 pm #

    How nice that no Americans were killed in the destruction of Libyan society
    Wage, I don’t think so much in terms of nationality. In war everybody loses.
    On the other hand, I do not value American* lives any less than others.
    Given that criminals exist and wars will be carried out, I prefer a President, like Obama, who manages to destroy fewer lives. Bush destroyed 4,500 USA military through his bad decisions.
    *By “Americans” I include North America, Central America, and South America. All are Americans.

  250. asoka. August 31, 2011 at 12:52 pm #


    How nice that no Americans were killed in the destruction of Libyan society

    Wage, I don’t think so much in terms of nationality. In war everybody loses.
    On the other hand, I do not value American* lives any less than others.
    Given that criminals exist and wars will be carried out, I prefer a President, like Obama, who manages to destroy fewer lives. Bush destroyed 4,500 USA military through his bad decisions.
    *By “Americans” I include North America, Central America, and South America. All are Americans.

  251. Cash August 31, 2011 at 1:12 pm #

    Life is a lottery and we need to be kinder to those who’ve drawn bad numbers. – Pangolin
    You bet it’s a lottery. You have no say in who your parents are, what country they move to, what town and what neighbourhood they settle in, what school you go to, what teachers the school board hires, what kids live around you, what chicks you meet. And on and on. So much is blind chance. You get thrown into a vortex of events and circumstance and you get lucky or you don’t. So much of our lives are totally out of our control.

  252. DeeJones August 31, 2011 at 1:20 pm #

    What are you & hubbie discussing here? Just pull the plug. You can bet that your crack head ‘boors are running more than just the ‘fridge on that cord, probably the TV too at the least. Are you really willing to bet the safety of your goats & barn on it?
    Pull the plug! Then put a lock on the box they are hooking into. DO NOT let this go on much longer, or you will find yourself in a pile of trouble, and stuck with a huge electric bill too. What, you think they are going to pay you when you walk over next month and tell them your bill has now doubled or more, and you would like some payment from them?
    They are going to laugh in your face, and if you don’t pay the utility, they are going to shut your power off too. Then what will you do?
    Don’t be a twit.

  253. progress2conserve August 31, 2011 at 1:54 pm #

    Easy there, Ms. Dee,
    Being a “twit” can be a two way street, if one is not careful where one steps.
    Maybe those of us out in rural areas have to be a little more willing to help our neighbors – because one day it may be us that needs the help.
    And Wage’s neighbors aren’t going to get more than about 1000 watts of electricity through that wire, at the most. At $0.10 per KWH that will be about $2.40/day. Again, these are pretty much max numbers.
    So, personally, I wouldn’t want to let it go on longer than a week or so – and I sure wouldn’t let it burn down my barn – or let it perform a premature electric bar-b-que of one or more of my baby goats.
    And anyway – maybe wage’s neighbor is this guy below – and he’s going to pay his ‘lectric bill AND take Wage out to dinner tonight.
    Sorry for sticking my nose in your and Dee’s CFN business, there, Wage.
    I just thought this situation was funny enough to warrant jumping into it! 😉

  254. Pangolin August 31, 2011 at 2:15 pm #

    Wage’s neighbor is putting her house at risk for a fire. Should the power get turned back on the power company technician has no way of knowing that there is a power feed from wages barn. This could injure or kill said technician.
    More importantly there is a 50% chance that the power feed from her barn is out-of-phase with the power feed to her neighbors line. Should the neighbor have his/her power restored the voltage on that line could (50% chance) spike to 240 volts and most likely fry something along the line as soon as it’s connected to a neutral by some power using appliance. This normally takes place as an electrical fire.
    How do I know this? As maintenance manager for a property management firm I would get calls when the power was restored to apartments where people had been evicted. Typically the new tenant would plug in some appliance that would promptly explode. The previous tenant had been stealing power after a disconnect and had got the phase matching wrong.
    Tell your neighbors they have to haul their fridge over to your barn if they want to use your power.

  255. progress2conserve August 31, 2011 at 2:32 pm #

    “More importantly there is a 50% chance that the power feed from her barn is out-of-phase with the power feed to her neighbors line.”
    Pang, you deal with more sophisticated power thieves than what my suspicions would be for Wage’s neighbor.
    I envision Wage’s guys with the ‘frigerator, a little desk lamp, and maybe a hot plate – with each appliance taking its turn being plugged into the extension cord from Wage’s barn.
    Your power thieves are actually taking apart the breaker boxes in disconnected apartments and “permanently” wiring in the power that is being purloined from the next apartment over, or else stolen straight from the power company.
    That’s two whole different levels of theft/borrowing and (you’re right) two totally different levels of risk to power linemen and property.
    On a different note –
    EVERYONE ON CFN – who thinks they are so self-actualized and racially self-aware – – needs to try a mental exercise – with themselves playing Wage or her husband and the neighbors as:
    lower class?
    middle class?
    It’s just a thought exercise – graded only by yourself. But I’ll guarantee you that some of you WILL be surprised by the results.

  256. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 2:49 pm #

    OK, it is not true that I’m putting a lineman at risk?
    I LOVE linemen. Ice storms, thunderstorms, hurricanes, tornadoes – damn, if it was me, I’d wait inside and fix the lines later.
    But not them. My power almost always comes back on when the weather outside is still frightful.
    I’ll pull the plug right now if they are in any way at risk.
    But you think not?

  257. progress2conserve August 31, 2011 at 2:51 pm #

    One more thang, Pang –
    Do all of your racial analyses end as their bottom line – with you thinking about your belly?
    “They’re here to stay suckers. The U.S. is better off for it too. For starters you can now get decent birria without driving to L.A.”
    -it’s a Pang thang-
    First of all, I had to look up birria.
    It’s any of a number of meats, in a spicy sauce.
    Spicy iguana actually sounds pretty interesting.
    But I’d be willing to travel to get it.
    And chances are it will never be available in my little mountain town – now matter our hispanic %.
    But I’ll bet there were cultural relativists like you, thinking with their bellys – on the outskirts of Rome as the Huns poured it.
    Pangolin’s Roman ancestor: “Wow, man! Those damn Huns have stolen ALL of my slaves. And one of those Huns is over there having “nonconsensual sex” with my wife right now!
    “But I don’t mind, because now we can get Hungarian Goulash locally!”
    “Cultural Invasion ROCKS!!!”

  258. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 2:52 pm #

    I read your link.
    OK, Americans today are so sure of the power of Big Brother that they’re afraid to use found money!
    If the government fears the people, you have freedom.
    We’ve got it the other way around.
    And that isn’t my neighbor. I wish it was!

  259. progress2conserve August 31, 2011 at 2:56 pm #

    “I’ll pull the plug right now if they are in any way at risk.
    But you think not?”
    No – if the ‘fridge is plugged straight into to extension cord that runs straight to your place – then no power linemen are being put at risk in the situation as described.
    Your barn and goats may be at severe risk, OTOH.
    And I’d really have to look at it to be sure.
    When is that old boy getting out of jail for that concert, anyway? And how was your potato crop?

  260. San Jose Mom 51 August 31, 2011 at 3:07 pm #

    I’d let them use the power cord for a week. Set boundaries and tell them that will give them enough time to make other arrangements.

  261. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 3:13 pm #

    Well, I felt the extension cord, and it was not hot. One of my babies was standing on it, but not chewing on it.
    My potatoes didn’t work out so well. I only had some planted when the rains came. I bailed out 8 buckets of water in one day.
    Then I fell and injured my ankle and was laid up for 4 weeks, followed by my dog’s illness and death.
    I got a few potatoes, but most were small.
    However, I still have the bags. I thought all the potatoes were rotten, but some weren’t, so I’ve been planting them as I find them.
    And I have NO idea what “hilling up” means, so I’ve been throwing some of those old wood chips on them, hoping that is what they have in mind.
    It is very true that survival skills, as in gardening, die out very quickly.
    My Dad took a very strong dislike to farmers, when his coal mining daddy decided he’d rather be a farmer. They moved to a farming town, right after my Dad’s favorite brother got killed by a car, so he had no one to play with, and the farmer’s casual brutality appalled him.
    So I never saw either of my parents plant anything.
    Anyway, that good ol’ boy will be out of prison soon. In the meantime, they’ve made a documentary about him.
    Investment fraud? Are you kidding me? They threw a talented redneck into prison while the Wall Street assholes walk free?
    Yeah, there are class differences in the USA.

  262. San Jose Mom 51 August 31, 2011 at 3:17 pm #

    Joining a menopause support group is a sign that some women should get moving and find a job or some worthy cause and volunteer.
    My “frenemy” is the poster woman for this. Every two weeks, on the day that her maids come (no habla Engelska) she posts something on facebook like, “I feel like shit, I have to clean for my cleaning ladies :(.”
    She also has a gardener. Her three un-employed able-bodied teenagers should be cleaning the toilets, thank you very much.

  263. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 3:18 pm #

    I don’t know if I mentioned it, but experienced gardeners around here tell me that potatoes don’t do well in this climate and soil.
    They say that sweet potatoes do well, so I planted some of them, and they do seem to be flourishing. Too bad I don’t like them.
    SJ Mom, that’s a nice compromise, but I think I’m unplugging it tonight, for the night at least.
    The refrigerator should stay cold overnight. I’m assuming that they won’t open it at night, and anyway, it’s cooler at night. I have a feeling that that may interrupt their TV watching, but it’s best not to watch too much TV anyway!

  264. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 3:21 pm #

    Back when I ran a local bookstore, the lead singer’s daddy used to come in with a self-published quarterly of local poetry and short stories, that we sold on consignment.
    That apple didn’t fall far from the talented tree.

  265. progress2conserve August 31, 2011 at 3:24 pm #

    “Your power thieves are actually taking apart the breaker boxes in disconnected apartments and “permanently” wiring in the power that is being purloined from the next apartment over, or else stolen straight from the power company.”
    -P2C, to pangolin-
    Folks, Wage’s neighbors could also cut off the female end of the drop cord from her barn and plug the bare wires directly into a socket in their house. Pang’s correct – that could electrify roughly 1/2 of the circuits in the neighbor’s house. And that would DEFINITELY put linemen at risk. Although – if linemen train up in Illinois to the same standard as Georgia Power, then:
    “It’s not dead unless it’s grounded,”
    are the words they live by – and they are never at really high risk from a situation like what Pang describes.
    It’s also known as a “reverse feed” situation.
    And it’s a big deal if you run a generator in power outages and hook it into your house wiring. Or if you generate solar (or other) power and sell it to the power company.

  266. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 3:28 pm #

    By the way, I’d already written about my neighbor, if anyone wants a hint for your thought exercise-

  267. asoka. August 31, 2011 at 3:59 pm #

    Wage, I love that song “Leave Poor Jesus Alone” … I love the pacing, the picking, and the words. It makes a good anti-Bachmann, anti-Dominionist anthem.

  268. Bustin J August 31, 2011 at 4:17 pm #

    Qoothpick said, “per capita
    by or for each individual person: income per capita.
    I’d even be surprised if “household” income averaged $25K.”
    You’re correct, it doesn’t make much sense. Per capita income is something the CIA referenced in their “World Factbook”.
    There is obviously severe economic stratification.
    Per Capita Income is a metric that doesn’t make sense. That is why economists love it.

  269. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 4:25 pm #

    Yeah, it was a good song.
    What did you think of the Glen Ford commentary?

  270. San Jose Mom 51 August 31, 2011 at 4:26 pm #

    Read your blog about the neighbor….the only thing the neighbor could manage to talk about upon meeting your husband were the well-hung goats?

  271. wagelaborer August 31, 2011 at 4:43 pm #

    Yes, and he was slavering.
    (It’s only one goat. I couldn’t take more than one billy.)

  272. Pangolin August 31, 2011 at 5:35 pm #

    P2C_ My ancesters WERE the huns on both sides. Mom’s a blue-eyed arab whose parents came from the British Palestinian Authority, now the west bank. Dad is fishbelly white due to his Ukranian-Russian grandmother.
    I can walk into any Jewish temple in the land and they automatically hand me a yarmulke. I also don’t have “round eyes” like western europeans do. I have to explain to people that i’m not jewish and double when I make borscht.
    The vietnamese around here are opening Pho restaurants and the Hmong barbecue chicken is to die for.
    Variety is the spice of life. We sit here in the U.S. because Christopher Columbus was looking for a faster way to get to India for the pepper and cinnamon spice trade. He came back with chiles instead.

  273. Ixnei August 31, 2011 at 6:24 pm #

    “Mr. Paul”
    That guy’s pro-life agenda completely flies in the face of his *supposed* libertarian ways. Me thinks he merely panders to the evangelical right wing bible-thumpers…

  274. Ixnei August 31, 2011 at 6:28 pm #

    “I must say that I find the last sales bot very interesting.”
    I believe I counted at least 3 different aliases, posting *one after the other*. Not sure why/how he still manages to poast such *BUY MY CLOTHES* drivel.
    Might have something to do with a *non-IP ban* spam enforcement agenda…

  275. Ixnei August 31, 2011 at 6:35 pm #

    “Older “life” is a fine time to begin to learn things; much too little, much too late, eh?”
    You’d be surprised what kinds of “tricks” you can “treat”, err teach an old dog. I taught my 10 yr old dog 4 new tricks at that time, which he nailed every time thereafter. Poor old guy didn’t make it past 13.5 years, tho…
    Now, as to the close-minded, stubborn, self-righteous human geezers, your mileage may vary (LOL!). Maybe try using their Medicare/Medicaid/Social Security payments against them – you might gain some ground that way (Zzz…).

  276. Ixnei August 31, 2011 at 6:48 pm #

    “Bust, I find this HARD to believe. Picture this: a man, a women and their two little kids with a total income of $100K.”
    Median versus mean. I’m shocked you couldn’t have figured this one out all by yourself.
    Mean is $25K – *GHAD only knows how low the median is ($3K? lower?)…
    And boyie! Your DOW just seems to be working *MIRACLES* right about now, given all the standard/routine data showing awful prospects…

  277. lbendet August 31, 2011 at 6:57 pm #

    But, LBend, where do all of those people go to sleep?
    In my apartment building, for starters and they can well afford it too!!

  278. messianicdruid August 31, 2011 at 7:04 pm #

    Does one require an “agenda” to be opposed to snuffing the unborn?
    What other buzz-word labels have you been taught for “pro-life”-ers, in case these don’t fit?

  279. Ixnei August 31, 2011 at 7:07 pm #

    What ever happened to Generally Accepted Accounting Principles (GAAP)? Have things been so deregulated, as to *IXNEI* even that basic principle?!…
    I’ve been wondering lately about the fed’s free interest rate loans, that the banks sell back to the govt at 3%. Think about this for a single moment – these banks are still leveraging @ 30:1 (50:1? 100:1?). Even uld-skul it was a 10:1 leveraging rate. So these banks get a loan equivalent to their underlying assets (2x? 5x?), and get a free 3% @ year’s end. At 30:1, this doubles their assets every year, on the taxpayer’s shoulders. Even with a *conservative* leveraging of 10:1, they double their assets, *ON THE DOLE,* every 3 years.
    LOL @ the taxpayers – where does this *LINE ITEM* appear in the annual budget?!… Hehehe!

  280. Ixnei August 31, 2011 at 7:46 pm #

    “6. The promotion of excessive drinking”
    Thx, Myrtle, for the *doctor’s orders*. I mean, Coco Chanel?!…
    Alcohol has been shown over and over, to be the bane of cancer, and other causes of *old age* death. Don’t expect *4 out of 5* dox to recommend it, however. LOL @ dox – once they get their liability/malpractice insurance paid for, it’s all a *NO BRAINER* Free For All (FFA) thereafter…

  281. Cash August 31, 2011 at 7:47 pm #

    I LOVE linemen. Ice storms, thunderstorms, hurricanes, tornadoes – damn, if it was me, I’d wait inside and fix the lines later. – Wage
    So Wage here’s one for the linemen.

  282. asoka. August 31, 2011 at 8:00 pm #

    Wage, Glen Ford is cheerleading for the Libyan Armed Forces. I do not cheer lead for either side, because I think killing human beings is stupid and does not really solve human problems or lead to peace. Absence of gunfire is not peace.
    Glen Ford said: “the Libyan armed forces maintained their unit integrity and personal honor” which makes him an apologist for killing done by the Libyan Armed Forces.
    I condemn Obama’s actions as criminal. I have said many times that Obama’s use of drones and aerial bombardment entitles him to be put on trial in the Hague for war crimes.
    But I feel for the 4,500 families of USA military sacrificed under Bush. I am glad military families have not suffered losses in Libya under Obama.
    I don’t want anyone (Libyan or USA) to lose a family member. I don’t want anyone (Libyan or American) to die or to kill.
    Bush engaged in wholesale slaughter and bombing of infrastructure needed by civilians. Obama has achieved policy objectives more intelligently, and no American lives were lost in Libya.
    That doesn’t justify killing Libyans. It’s just a fact that American lives were spared by Obama’s military strategy and Gaddafi is gone.

  283. ozone August 31, 2011 at 8:07 pm #

    …And the neighbors are:
    A.) Stupid, lazy-minded, ignorant
    B.) Smart, curious, well-informed
    Much more important in the FINAL analysis.
    I’ll say it again, FINAL… (after bullshit no longer talks, walks, balks, caulks, fills your so[l]cks, or holds the chalk).

  284. xhalor August 31, 2011 at 8:11 pm #

    Glen Ford said: “the Libyan armed forces maintained their unit integrity and personal honor”
    Then the F-18’s showed up.

  285. San Jose Mom 51 August 31, 2011 at 8:24 pm #

    C.) Brown, caring, college-educated (next door on the west)
    D.) Fratman and Barbie, white, clueless and inconsiderate (next door on the east)
    E.) White, single mom, mensa. (2 doors on the west)
    F.) White, lesbian, well-read lawyer. (across the street)
    G.) White, psycho, stacked. Went by “Oral Laurel” at Cal Poly.

  286. ozone August 31, 2011 at 8:25 pm #

    Mmmmm…. could be! ;o)
    If it saves a panda, is pandering okay?

  287. xhalor August 31, 2011 at 8:29 pm #

    I didn’t mean step on you, Asoka, but for some reason, inexperienced Americans really believe the precision bombing lie. Modern military hardware is absolutely ferocious. And I’m not talking about nukes. A few eggs are going to get broken.

  288. ozone August 31, 2011 at 8:29 pm #

    Perfect; hell of a lot of gradations and shades beyond what the outward appearance is, no?

  289. xhalor August 31, 2011 at 8:36 pm #

    I just tried “pandering” to Jack Cafferty on CNN. He wanted to know what the people wanted to say about Sarah Palin. My blog post queried “if Ms. Palin still believes in her invisible friend, does she feel the need to be purged of witchcraft AGAIN?” They wouldn’t post my response. Am I doing something wrong?

  290. Laura Louzader August 31, 2011 at 8:39 pm #

    I cannot bring myself to support Ron Paul because of his ant-abortion stance and his pandering to the Christian Right.
    It’s difficult to believe that a person can call himself a Libertarian while supporting an amendment to outlaw abortion. Since when does a half-formed fetus have more rights than the woman who is providing it with a free lease on her life systems?
    Paul should refer to Ayn Rand, who was an ardent supporter of abortion rights.

  291. ozone August 31, 2011 at 8:50 pm #

    Youse guys-es is crackin’ me UP! :o)
    …was McJack horrified or mystified? Suspicious minds want to know!

  292. xhalor August 31, 2011 at 8:56 pm #

    As long as you remain an undifferentiated group of cells no larger than a mosquito bite, I personally am inclined to go with the words of the late modern philosopher Bill Hicks. I paraphrase, if your name and phone number doesn’t show up in my White Pages, you don’t exist.

  293. Ixnei August 31, 2011 at 9:01 pm #

    LOL @ Queen Bee:
    How about that atmospheric thinning? Is it greater in city-centers? Questioning minds must *KNOW*!!!
    Do any of you care, that the solar max is 2 years away, and it will last 5-8 years?!… I thought *NOT*.

  294. xhalor August 31, 2011 at 9:10 pm #

    I just read Pangolin’s post. It’s one of the most brilliant things I’ve ever read here. If you will excuse me, I’m going to go cry now.
    Paul Wolfowitz

  295. asoka. August 31, 2011 at 9:50 pm #

    Excellent thought experiment!

  296. xhalor August 31, 2011 at 9:53 pm #

    Huh? Damn, James, if you need money that bad, I ‘spose I can cough up a $5.00 money order.
    …insanity is a relative thing.
    For example, all of my relatives are fuckin’ crazy.
    Until Later,
    Gore Vidal

  297. AMR August 31, 2011 at 10:36 pm #

    Stuff White People Like: Having Mexicans do the actual work.
    Or, as Tom Lehrer put it in his song “George Murphy” in 1964:
    “Should Americans pick crops? George says no,
    ‘Cause no one but a Mexican would stoop so low,
    And after all, even in Egypt the Pharaohs
    Had to import Hebrew braceros.”
    Lazy bums who complain about Mexicans not working hard enough are certifiable douchebags. My grandmother knew a very abrasive old man from church in Palo Alto who loved to butter up old ladies but was an asshole to pretty much everyone else, so much so that his own daughter married at the age of sixteen to get out of his house. The first time I met him, when I was about eight, he called me a snot-nosed brat to my face. The second time, when I was fifteen, he gave a commentary on the lazy Mexican construction crew that his neighbor had hired: “Come 4:30 it’s manana!” Because God forbid another person’s Mexicans don’t work according to one’s own idea of a fitting schedule for brown people. Fuck, the only option left would be to insult one’s social equals.

  298. xhalor August 31, 2011 at 10:48 pm #

    You just had to quote Tom. Makes me think about our Congress. Poison a pigeon? It just takes a smidgen.

  299. BeantownBill August 31, 2011 at 11:05 pm #

    Since 1900 we’ve had around 10 sunspot maxes and many solar flares. While increased solar activity can disrupt telecommunications and cause infrastructure damage, there’s never been a solar max that destroyed civilization or caused a mass loss of human life; also a lot of critical electronic systems are radiation-hardened. So although we could suffer some serious problems in our shrunken, electronic world, they wouldn’t compare to those caused by a large-area EMP. I don’t worry too much about it because the next cycle should be more or less the same as the last 10.

  300. xhalor August 31, 2011 at 11:08 pm #

    Biology vs. Divinity. Damn it, Snookie is on TV talkin’ about her Alien Abduction. I don’t have time for this shit. I have been looking for years. With all kinds of shit. I’ve never seen one. Nobody knows, the Trouble I’ve seen.
    Paul Robeson

  301. Ken Kurzawa August 31, 2011 at 11:19 pm #

    So… Rick Perry doesn’t believe in climate change? Good to know. Sorry to see the carnage in New England! 🙁
    I don’t see much hope in surviving if your predictions are true. There isn’t enough real community in this country and people have extremely delusional values. If a person is lucky enough to live in the right little corner of the country, things might be OK if the community there is strong and people can work together.
    I live in Southeast Michigan. A few people who live here might agree that it is not a stable situation. People are mad with anxiety. The road rage problem makes this painfully evident. I don’t even see moving up north as a real option. After a real energy collapse, zombie-like hoards would spill out of the sprawling former motor city’s suburbs desperate for food. Might be better to head INTO the city of Detroit. They have urban farms there now. Half of the land is vacant of buildings. Detroit may truly be the city of the future.
    The zombie thing might sound silly, but have you really looked at some of the people around lately? Have you visited a mall?

  302. AMR August 31, 2011 at 11:22 pm #

    Many of my Philadelphia drinking buddies have had summer jobs as lifeguards or regional managers at a pool management company. The ethical environment at this company is a terrible one. The owners take advantage of kids from well-to-do families to get away with not reimbursing their job-specific training and certification costs until after fifty hours on the clock. They and their managers bitch and moan about what slackers their guards are, as if they expect a bunch of rich teenagers earning walking-around money at below-market rates from a stingy employer to be models of discipline. For their part, a number of the guards fudge their timesheets, while their managers, who are salaried, fudge their mileage expenses, which are reimbursed at about half the Federal government rate.
    One of the lifeguard trainers at this company was demoted to low reserve status last fall after graduating from petty to epic fraud. This fellow is the boyfriend of a good friend and sometime date of mine. My friend is an all-around good girl, although she has sometimes been unethical or incompetent as a pool manager. Her boyfriend, on the other hand, always given off a shady vibe that I couldn’t quite articulate. For one thing, he and my friend got really hot, heavy and sappy in their romance, which seemed uncharacteristically shallow and foolish compared to my friend’s prior behavior around guys. He spoiled her in a truly ostentatious manner, sometimes with trips to Florida on a more than monthly basis. On several occasions mutual friends asked me whether I had any idea how they afforded it all.
    The answer was that the boyfriend paid for it with disability fraud to the tune of $30k, which the owner finally stopped by insisting that he be seen by a physician if he wanted additional checks. The boyfriend refused to go to a doctor because his wrist injury was either a minor, long-healed sprain or a total fabrication. But that’s not the best part. This dude, who is about 28 (my friend is 21), was caught red-handed because he and my friend posted multiple photo albums documenting their travels on their Facebook accounts, without even enhancing the privacy settings. Even more brazenly, the boyfriend asked one of the owners to give him his old job back after he had been put on reserve status following the discovery of the fraud!
    The generally unethical environment and brazen fraud by a sugar daddy boyfriend, however, aren’t responsible for the Twilight Zone environment at this company. The truly bizarre thing to my way of thinking is that a number of other employees are now pissed off at my friend for being disloyal to their employer! My sociopathic buddy recently compared her unfavorably to a problem guard, a classic mean girl who constantly stirred up needless interpersonal drama by being a gossipy bitch, saying that “at least she had some loyalty.” He has been calling my friend a “traitor” for taking a better-paid, lower-stress job with a competitor when she had hitherto been extremely ambitious and apparently loyal to the company that her boyfriend had ripped off to the tune of $30k. He was also disappointed that no one had believed the mean girl when she accused my friend of stealing supplies, yet he sees nothing wrong with the owners hosing every guard to the tune of over $100 annually by dragging their feet on reimbursing training costs.
    You have to be deranged to feel loyalty to a crowd like that.

  303. xhalor August 31, 2011 at 11:31 pm #

    Whoa! What about the Lifeguarding part? Once I had to drag a guy that weighed 100 pounds + more than me out of the Danube River. And this was some asshole I didn’t even like. Should I file a claim?

  304. BeantownBill September 1, 2011 at 12:21 am #

    I graduated college when the Vietnam war was raging, and my local draft board was really after me. Accordingly, I couldn’t land a job in my field because, even though I was degreed, I would still require a lot of specialized training, and what organization would want to invest a lot of money in me, only to see me go off to Vietnam?
    After many months of not working, I really needed a job badly, so I broke down and got a white-collar job in a very large office in a very large multi-national corporation in Boston.
    People today spoof and scorn the office cubicle workplace. I wish I had the luxury of a cubicle. Not one of us had one; we all had desks lined up one after the other in several rows on a huge floor. There was no air conditioning and we were in an old brick heat-sink of a building. Whatever the temperature was outside in the summer, the temperature in the office was 7-10 degrees warmer, with little or no breeze.
    We had to wear long-sleeve dress shirts and a suit and tie. Our hair couldn’t be long. Almost everyone else was a straight-arrow – and this was in the ’60’s. As long as an employee toed the company line, they were treated very well by management. The job was a soul-killer.
    I couldn’t conform, I just couldn’t. I let my hair grow long, I wore short sleeves in the summer and a ratty sports jacket.
    I was a good worker and performed my job very well. I was probably trying to get fired, but the company liked me for some reason I couldn’t really fathom. I thought that maybe it was because it was a waspy organization, it was a time of serious social unrest, and because I was Jewish, they didn’t want any repercussions.
    To make a long story short, I finally did get fired because I called my boss incompetent – he was. I swore I’d never work in an office again, and I haven’t.
    I guess I’m relating this story for 2 reasons: You seem to be a well-spoken young person, and I wanted to tell you that the bad working conditions you see today aren’t new. Soul-sucking jobs have been around for a long time (e.g., “Death of a Salesman”); and more importantly, that I can sympathize with what people are going through today, employment-wise (or lack thereof).

  305. xhalor September 1, 2011 at 12:24 am #

    A very long time ago, in a non-descript part of the Midwest, I was in a huge nightclub wondering why I spent so much money to see the Grand Funk Railroad. Even after factoring in the Mescaline state that I was in, frankly, GFR sucked. I wasn’t alone. Most of the audience were quite vocal in their inebriated dissatisfaction. Mark Farner foolishly challenged anyone in the audience to come up on stage and do better. It was like watching the parting of the Red Sea. And through the opening strode a confident Hippie. He hopped up on stage, grabbed Mark’s guitar, spun around and stunned us all with blazing Rock Guitarology. It was Alvin Lee. We didn’t see Mr. Farner for the rest of the evening. Choreographed? Hey! Don’t fuck with my fantasy.

  306. Pucker September 1, 2011 at 2:09 am #

    In the “Heinberg & JHK – The Podcast” advertisement at the top of this blog, is that a photo of JHK or Heinberg?
    What is a “Podcast” anyway? Does a “podcast” bear any relation to the “pods” in the movie “The Invasion of the Body Snatchers”?
    “James Howard Kunstler speaks to Richard Heinberg about The End of Growth on The KunstlerCast podcast.”

  307. Eleuthero September 1, 2011 at 2:44 am #

    Your commentary about the lifeguards just
    reinforces my general view that the current
    zeitgeist is such that employERS and
    employEES alike are trying to scam each
    other and, often, third parties.
    That was quite a tale of yours with a little
    bit and the disability fraud and interpersonal
    fraud (at your friend’s expense) merely added
    more spice to a very sordid yarn.
    And that’s exactly my point: The American people
    are always bitching about everything being ANYONE’S fault but their OWN. Who introspects
    about their own behavior before they point the
    prissy finger? As a result, we have a nation
    full of douchebags who don’t do their jobs well,
    lead shady social lives, try to scam insurers
    and other types of companies, and then cry like
    babies when THEY are the victim of the same
    fraud or misconduct they accuse others of!!!
    I have a feeling that this zeitgeist, this ethos,
    is a GLOBAL ethos because I hear lots of stories
    from friends in countries like Korea that make
    the whole damned country seem like a boiler room
    I feel deeply sorry for young people of honor who
    were taught the right things and who do the right
    things and often fall behind BECAUSE of their
    virtues. It’s that kind of a world now.

  308. Pucker September 1, 2011 at 2:52 am #

    E. wrote: “I have a feeling that this zeitgeist, this ethos, is a GLOBAL ethos….”
    Not down here in Gun Barrel City, Texas where our motto is: “We Shoot Straight With You.”

  309. Pucker September 1, 2011 at 3:14 am #

    “James Howard Kunstler speaks to Richard Heinberg about The End of Growth on The KunstlerCast podcast.”
    Two peas in a pod….

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  313. lbendet September 1, 2011 at 8:18 am #

    E & AMR.
    Morality and integrity are being undermined on all levels from the top 1% to government to international relations. It is no wonder why people feel the same inclinations in everyday life. After many years of entertaining people by putting the mob up as everyday people the ethos has to be affected. And cheating is the way to survive in this society.
    One thing I think I understand about human nature is that there are always those who maintain their inner integrity no matter what is happening around them, but for the vast majority, I cannot say the same.
    A week ago I suggested people look at the interview between Catherine Austin Fitts and Max Keiser. She described the mob mentality of how we do business nationally and internationally through physical threats.
    She for the first time described how she was poisoned, run off the road and found dead animals on her property.
    Why? Because she wanted to do her job with integrity and that no longer is allowed.
    After all, how can the Republicans keep saying government is bad if our govt. employees act with good intentions? Now they can disband the EPA and all other protection for the people, since these watchdogs are literally in bed with the industry folks that they are supposed to be overseeing.
    It’s clear at this point, that the social fabric is effected by this and reflects the nature of this plutocracy, now unabashedly out of control.

  314. asoka. September 1, 2011 at 9:49 am #

    “who do the right things and often fall behind BECAUSE of their virtues.”
    It has always been this way.
    If you only choose virtue because you expect to “get ahead” by doing so, your action would not be very virtuous.
    In the 1960’s my high school classmates went off to engineering schools, got good-paying jobs with defense contractors making weapons systems, and retired at age 55.
    I became a conscientious objector, refused to participate in anything war-related, got low-paying jobs, and could not retire until past age 62.
    Virtuous behavior does not pay in traditional forms of payment. But it did help in “getting behind” … which in an energy contracting environment is a blessing.

  315. asoka. September 1, 2011 at 9:54 am #

    My last post was in response to E’s post of September 1, 2011 2:44 AM

  316. sum8ayha123 September 1, 2011 at 10:53 am #

    Facebook Adds Electronic Signature For Public Pages

    Facebook Adds Electronic Signature For Public Pages

    Attempting to prevent or curtail rampant imposters and squatters, Facebook has introduced digital signatures for setting up Public Profile Pages. As opposed to user profiles, these are pages intended for businesses, brands, organizations do we look like Gossip Girls, and celebrities seeking to connect with fans and supporters via the social network. Kristen Nicole at AllFacebook.com says the reason could be the “massive large brand land grab” making it nearly impossible to tell who will be the official, authentic source and who is not. When creating a public profile page UGG DARK-COLORED TWINKLE BOOT STYLES DIMENSION SEVERAL NWOB EXCELLENT, a new “electronic signature” will be required (presumably provided by Facebook in advance). The person setting up the page also has to check a box saying they are authorized to create the page. Fake profiles set up by third parties have been a problem on social networks. One of the more publicized instances involved a woman posing as an Exxon PR staffer. It was soon revealed she had no affiliation with Exxon at all. To that extent, how does one know they’re following the real Jim Gaffigan on Facebook Measures like the digital signature seem intended to solve that problem. Not sure how they verify if this is really God’s Twitter account, though. Presumably the Real Deal would be able to bypass any silly human security device. Kristen Nicole s UGG ests a similar layer of security be used for creating Facebook applications. She mentions how Starbucks missed the boat by not officially creating a popular Starbucks app. Without a way to authenticate, companies, brands, and famous people are left in the awkward situation of either having to boot an imposter or squash an apparent popular supporter.

  317. Dasviking September 1, 2011 at 10:53 am #

    Stop the Wars and stop the Zombies!!!!!!!!
    This was in the Waco Tribune Herald, Waco, TX, Nov 18, 2010.
    Put me in charge of food stamps. I’d get rid of Lone Star cards; no cash for
    Ding Dongs or Ho Ho’s, just money for 50-pound bags of rice and beans, blocks of cheese and all the powdered milk you can haul away. If you want steak and frozen pizza, then get a job.
    Put me in charge of Medicaid. The first thing I’d do is to get women Norplant birth control implants or tubal ligations. Then we’ll test recipients for drugs, alcohol, and nicotine and document all tattoos and piercings. If you want to reproduce or use drugs, alcohol, smoke or get tats and piercings, then get a job.
    Put me in charge of government housing. Ever live in a military barracks?
    You will maintain our property in a clean and good state of repair. Your “home” will be subject to inspections anytime and possessions will be inventoried. If you want a plasma TV or Xbox 360, then get a job and your own place.
    In addition, you will either present a check stub from a job each week or you will report to a “government” job. It may be cleaning the roadways of trash, painting and repairing public housing, whatever we find for you. We will sell your 22 inch rims and low profile tires and your blasting stereo and speakers and put that money toward the “common good.”
    Before you write that I’ve violated someone’s rights, realize that all of the above is voluntary. If you want our money, accept our rules. Before you say that this would be “demeaning” and ruin their “self esteem,” consider that it wasn’t that long ago that taking someone else’s money for doing absolutely nothing was demeaning and lowered self esteem.
    If we are expected to pay for other people’s mistakes, we should at least attempt to make them learn from their bad choices. The current system rewards them for continuing to make bad choices.
    AND while you are on Gov’t subsistence, you no longer can VOTE! Yes that is correct. For you to vote would be a conflict of interest. You will voluntarily remove yourself from voting while you are receiving a Gov’t welfare check. If you want to vote, then get a job.

  318. lbendet September 1, 2011 at 10:55 am #

    Although you say you are responding to E’s post, I just want to respond by saying that these issues are more a question of people who operate with a moral standards, regardless of what they do.
    You offer a false choice between those who work as engineers for the military and those who drop out of the mainstream, as the only way to act with integrity. But there are people who do stand up for what’s right, though there are fewer and fewer.
    Those who have been replaced in government jobs,for instance, once acted in good faith with the people through the years were replaced by those who muck up the function of their jobs.
    They no longer act to protect the interest of the people, but in the interest of the businesses they were supposed to watch.
    What we have here is an extreme moral hazard in all areas of our system, now and everyone feels it–the stench is in the air.

  319. wardoc September 1, 2011 at 11:15 am #

    I agree that bond rates should have gone up.
    This is yet another anomalous market action that has plagued traders (and investors) for months.
    It’s possible that the plunge protection team (aka the president’s working group on financial market stability…..its real) may be manipulating rates, or one theory that’s out there is that despite the troubles with the $USD, the problems with the EURO are worse and thus there has been some very temporary flight away from the Euro and into the USD. My view on that is that both currencies are trash and will eventually collapse; but, we could see a rather interesting race to the bottom.
    On that note, the Swiss franc, which has usually been a good “hiding” place, recently dropped when they devalued their currency and pegged it to the Euro so Nestle et al could sell more chocolate in Europe at lower prices (no joke, it really happened that way).
    So, what we’re seeing is massive currency and market manipulation across multiple countries and regions. The last time this happened, I think, was right before world war II……Just a coincidence, of course. 🙂

  320. asoka. September 1, 2011 at 11:18 am #

    Lbendet, moral hazard arises means not taking responsibility for the full consequences and responsibilities of your actions, usually because you are well-insulated from repercussions.
    So, go off to war, instead of refusing to become part of the “defense” establishment in any way. Everyone will say “Thank you for your service.” It is socially acceptable. You won’t pay a price for socially acceptable behavior. (Killing civilians, or shooting children under 5 years of age in the head, be damned.)
    So, have your two “replacement” kids, instead of getting a vasectomy and forgoing family. Everyone celebrates childbirth. It is socially acceptable. You won’t pay a price for socially acceptable behavior. (Global overpopulation be damned.)
    So, eat your meat diet instead of becoming vegan or vegetarian or fruitarian. Society approves of eating meat. It is socially acceptable. You won’t pay a price for socially acceptable behavior. Killing animals be damned.
    So, buy your McMansion that requires exorbitant energy inputs for heating and cooling, instead of a small house or tiny house or condo. Buying a big house is a status symbol of success. It is socially acceptable. You won’t pay a price for socially acceptable behavior. (Energy consumption be damned.)
    Etc. etc. etc.
    Moral hazard just means thinking of yourself, and being approved of socially, instead of thinking of the seventh generation to come.

  321. Dasviking September 1, 2011 at 11:57 am #

    what seventh generation you talking about the way u think……
    “So, have your two “replacement” kids, instead of getting a vasectomy and forgoing family. Everyone celebrates childbirth. It is socially acceptable. You won’t pay a price for socially acceptable behavior. (Global overpopulation be damned.)”

  322. trippticket September 1, 2011 at 12:01 pm #

    Howdy, lads and lassies! Hope you upper Atlantic Coast types are safe and sound. We’re thinking about you down here in the dusty dry South, wishing we could take some of that water away for you!
    Got a great post this week called Problem Is, I’m Uneconomic. I know some of you will dig it. Stop by Small Batch when you get a chance.
    Hope all is well,

  323. ozone September 1, 2011 at 12:04 pm #

    Careful, careful, careful!
    Giving that person an excuse to blather on about their virtue and moral rectitude will lead to an onset of nausea from the sugary self-congratulations that dependably follow.

  324. newworld September 1, 2011 at 12:05 pm #

    IMO there are no answers coming from either “wing” of the political debate, it’s over. The political rhetoric today consists of “Whites are ‘racist'”, or “Obama is a stupid evil n****r”, and that is it.
    The ponzi is broken, and soon the welfare transfer payments will not be made (this includes medicare). Here in Illinois so far the welfare payments have gone out, but the “whites are racist” politics of loot em’ and displace em” of the far left towards white citizens is destroying the economic engine of a welfare state. it’s over
    Anyway you fine folks google up the ABC card video produced by a young black lady with a gift of satire, hilarious.

  325. ozone September 1, 2011 at 12:09 pm #

    Most all is a-ok here; our neighbors to our direct north are not doing so well. :o(
    Wish we could send you some of our over-abundance. Fungal profusion; it’s lovin’ it!
    Checking in on the blog. Thanks and be well…

  326. ozone September 1, 2011 at 12:56 pm #

    Good one, Tripp!
    Glad you threw in Jevon’s pair-o’-docs there; dance monkeys, dance… then make more monkeys. ;o)

  327. lbendet September 1, 2011 at 1:11 pm #

    Got it, O

  328. Buck Stud September 1, 2011 at 2:01 pm #

    Yesterday I was walking by an old Spanish Mission style church at about six in the evening. The steps leading up to the front entrance were maybe twenty five risers high and stretching a good thirty-feet wide. A group of about ten Mexican workers were using jackhammers on the steps for removal – an extremely loud, dirty job. At about nine o’clock I came back around again and all the steps had been removed and hauled off. The workers were sitting in the dark listening attentively to a fellow Mexican man who possessed the air and countenance of the boss. It was quite striking, after an extremely long day this meeting had more the feel of a coach reviewing strategy and performance than a gang of exhausted workers enjoying a ‘this Bud‘s for you’ moment. Or perhaps they were already making arraignments and plans for what surely would be an early rise the very next morning.
    Walking away, my how-impressive-was-that-thought was replaced with something more familiar and comfortable: Charles De Gaulle muttering ‘ just because the Chinese aspire to worker ant status doesn’t mean I will ’.
    Thank God for the French.

  329. Vlad Krandz September 1, 2011 at 2:16 pm #

    That’s the difference between Kohlberg’s Third and Fourth stages of Morality: in the third one talks the talk but tries to get away with shit if no one will find out about it. In the Fourth, one actually tries to live up to what one believes – even if no one is looking. After all, we are always “looking” – as is God.
    In the Fifth stage, one begins to question whether the morality of one’s given culture actually accords with the highest ideals of one’s own conscience or religion. Also one begins to realize that other cultures might be as good or better. Might not are. The “Green Meme” has reversed the natural bias and has mandated other cultures as superior and our’s as inferior. Sick. Sick. Sick.
    When the job is complete, one takes down the staging. But one doesn’t tear it down while workmen are still on it. Likewise, people in earlier stages of growth need the stability of conventional and culture centric morality. What has been done is criminal. And does it liberate? No, it merely creates a new tribal morality – one based on belief. Like Communism did. You can’t force people to become universal – that just changes the object of love – and hate. The flower will open (or not) when it does. Meanwhile life must go on. Let us return to loving one’s homeland and culture – a natural and healthy patriotism.

  330. Vlad Krandz September 1, 2011 at 2:29 pm #

    Prog: good points. Only ten percent of Southerners owned slaves. The rest fought to protect their homeland. So the vast majority of White Americans never had anything to do with it. They are free of the taint of inherited guilt – which liberals pretend to disbelieve but invoke mercilessly against Whites. Jews do the same.
    Rick Perry is a complete sellout on immigration. And he signed the hate crime bill intended to humiliate Whites. This man is another Jorge Bush or Bush 3. Naturally he is the favorite of the Limbaughs and Fox News. He must not get in. They give him endless coverage and then express surprise that his ratings go up. It’s called democracy. Ron Paul they hate since he might actually take them to task.
    Wage: believe it or not, many of the lynched Blacks were actual criminals who had raped or murdered Whites. And one third of the people lynched during that 75 or so year period where Whites. Never hear about that do you? What it means: this kind of rough justice was the unofficial system in some places – not racism. It began when Whites couldn’t get justice from the Occupying Northern Force and Blacks were killing and raping at will. Do I believe in it? Obviously it’s a vigilante system and must have made many terrible mistakes. But one must always remember how it came to be and the Evil that Evil created.
    The 1/3 ratio of White to Black lynchings is consitstent with modern statistics for serious crime. In fact, Blacks have gotten far worse and now commit a much higher percentage – more like fifty percent as opposed to thirty three percent. Leniency never works with Blacks as is now becoming evident. Their criminality exploed with Civil Rights and the Great Society. And now it is again under Obama and Holder.

  331. Vlad Krandz September 1, 2011 at 2:39 pm #

    We await the Man on the White Horse. Some call him Kalki, and others, the Mahdi. And Others call Him Christ.
    Whites need a Hero/Savior now. And no Man seems to be on the horizon. Nor would we follow such a One now – so far have we fallen. It may have to be God Himself.
    Look how they treated Rockwell, McCarthy, Mac Arthur, and Le Pen. We are unworthy of our Heroes.

  332. Nick Allen September 1, 2011 at 2:45 pm #

    It will be interesting to observe the reaction of these New Englanders over the coming days to see how they handle their isolation. If there are towns cut off without potable water in Vermont, how long do you think the people will patiently keep up their cargo cult waiting for the helicopters of bottled water, before someone realizes it can be distilled with some sheet plastic? In New Orleans it appears that no sense of initiative, self-sufficiency or awareness of alternatives to “the system” existed.
    Since our beloved Mr. Kunstler is often apt to be somewhat snyde about those of us in the South and West (I forgive you, just a yankee after all), I am interested to see if his own goldurned neighbors perform better. Let us know if we need to send some Brothers to help out!
    Brother Nick in Oklahoma

  333. Vlad Krandz September 1, 2011 at 2:52 pm #

    The “fetus” (baby) has the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. These are not consistent with having one’s skull pierced and brains sucked out.
    Roe v Wade established abortion on the basis of privacy. But what about the privacy of the baby in the womb? Does not he/she have the same right to not have their room invaded with deadly force?
    You must think this through again. There is no such exclusive right to privacy. Aren’t you glad you were not aborted?
    Men should avoid such women who have abortions. Anyone capable of such an act is dangerous.

  334. Vlad Krandz September 1, 2011 at 2:54 pm #

    I called up Minnie and told her about you. She likes you very much and is “holding back” to make you a big sandwich. After all, you’re White and deserve it!

  335. asoka. September 1, 2011 at 3:02 pm #

    My apologies to you and Ozone for bringing up global overpopulation, energy consumption, factory farming, etc. in personal terms, i.e., specific actions within our power that we can take.
    Let’s go back to talking about the important things like “the Fed,” “sovereign debt,” and “them” (name your conspiracy or group you want to blame), i.e., things outside our power that we cannot act upon at all.

  336. willow September 1, 2011 at 3:07 pm #

    Cargo Cult@! i love it.
    Yes I remembered a few snide Yankees–ants to our Southern grasshoppers–telling how they Are Prepared–watch us dig out of a snowstorm!! When LA lay bleeding.
    That’s the thing about the Black Swan. . .you never see it coming.
    Good luck to all–even Chris Hedges yells Run!
    The Dog Days are Over: Check.

  337. Nick Allen September 1, 2011 at 3:09 pm #

    @ Vlad: A fetus cannot recognize rights, therefore, does not benefit from them. While a fetus is technically living human tissue, it is not an individual with opinions, thoughts and emotions; it is an extension of a woman’s body, a growth, until it is born and separated. To prescribe the same “rights” to a potential person as one would give to an actual person is irrational.
    I was a candidate for abortion, but was adopted instead, and while I am glad for that circumstance, I cannot recall any memory of the period of gestation, therefore I do not feel I was an individual at the time.

  338. budizwiser September 1, 2011 at 3:41 pm #

    I loved the comment about the Waco story.
    The real “problem” for all of us is how to run massive social systems that can approach our differences of values.
    The author of “put me in charge” sounds good to most people. But like so many generalizations or big ideas – there are details that could prove considerably more challenging to execute.
    Some examples: “the balanced budget” amendment, “CAFE” standards for passenger vehicles, most of the United State Tax code.
    I’ve tried to – time after time – to steer the users of this web space toward a conversation about how to define a system that accounts for or otherwise defines the meaning of disposable consumption with regard to energy.
    This Clusterfucked Nation requires a shared perspective toward petroleum consumption and energy taxes and credits. The world’s societies will never transition to a less carbon-based energy consuming civilization is they cannot agree that the way we consume resources is as intrinsic to our lives as the values of good and evil.
    But I digress, back to the sophomoric racist , sexist bullshit.

  339. JD Moore September 1, 2011 at 4:45 pm #

    Tell me haw bad things were. The information was poor in regards to the damage from Schoharie Creek; the damage was nearly as bad as Vermont, and for much the same reasons, a narrow valley with steep slopes. They got 8-12 inches of rain over half a day or so. I got to Oneonta fine by 8 pm Sunday night and I could hear WCBS on skip so I was trying to keep track of any road closures or badly damaged areas. I got to Grand Gorge on NY Rte 23 and found out Rte 23 east and Rte 30 in BOTH directions were closed. Unbeknownst to me, the next town, Prattsville, had been destroyed by 20 feet of water. What I eventually found out was the NYDOT had closed ALL the Schoharie Creek crossings. It would affect travel the next day; I nearly ran out of gas looking for a place with electric power and working phones (necessary for credit card transactions, good thing I had some cash). I should have suspected something was up when I got to Cobleskill on I-88 and found out from the deputies that the town was under five feet of water. If I have known, I could have gone from Ithaca to Binghamton and taking NY Rte 17 and gone through the Catskills through the Delaware basin (The Delaware did not flood.) instead of going to Cortland and catching Rte 23. Western Mass. didn’t do too badly; Mass Rte 9 out of Pittsfield is a well-engineered road. There was little damage along the route all the way to Northampton.

  340. dimech September 1, 2011 at 4:58 pm #

    First time responder, long time reader.
    As I was driving to a eating establishment to add to my bellyfat on the way to a bi-monthly trip to buy cheap consumer goods from Walmart (not kidding). I caught hannity patting himself on the back for driving a hybrid Escalade. We all can now rest easy that all will be well in the World because Shawn has done his part.
    One other thing has anyone noticed the media blitz that the natural gas companies are putting on of how clean and wonderful they are, having watched Gasland I,m having trouble buying their vision of the future where drinking water is concerned.

  341. JD Moore September 1, 2011 at 4:58 pm #

    On a somewhat better note, I found out that Philadelphia, NY (the place that “invented” cream cheese) has a working hydroelectric plant. Since our esteemed JHK has commented on the closure of many small hydro plants in upstate NY, I thought I would make note of this. We need more of these back on the grid. There are remains of many such plants all through New England and upstate NY.

  342. anti soak September 1, 2011 at 5:15 pm #

    Thanks…when does this nonsense stop? JHK please take note.

  343. anti soak September 1, 2011 at 5:24 pm #

    ‘ I cannot recall any memory of the period of gestation, therefore I do not feel I was an individual at the time.’
    I cant remember My Past Lives, gestation and I cant remember the first 4 years of my life
    [with a few exceptions]…So we can disguss
    The Immortality of the Soul or Not, When Life begins etc.
    So what? Just a bunch of words, pro, con.

  344. anti soak September 1, 2011 at 5:26 pm #

    Jim, I see yr EOTM is not up yet.
    My suggestion….The 4 fields of Plastic in Santa Monica [astro turf].
    One of them is near the OFFICE OF SUSTAINABILITY.

  345. anti soak September 1, 2011 at 5:27 pm #

    Hahaha…Well Said.

  346. anti soak September 1, 2011 at 5:34 pm #

    I learned something last nite from a Lil Online Film….
    THE USA PRODUCES 30 BILLION PLASTIC BOTTLES A YEAR AND THE ‘DEAD ZONE’ is Now the Ocean…Its rapidly becoming a dead zone, worldwide.

  347. anti soak September 1, 2011 at 5:37 pm #

    What does the Link really Mean?????

  348. AMR September 1, 2011 at 5:54 pm #

    Points well taken. The Vietnam War forced a lot of young American men into really bad spots. However, my understanding has always been that there was a lot more de facto flexibility in the labor market for young men both before and after the Vietnam War than during it because there wasn’t the need to find pretenses to avoid being drafted as cannon fodder in service of dipshit CIA-backed governments halfway around the world. Also, there seems to be an awful lot less flexibility in the formal labor market today than there was in mid-twentieth century. The organization man got a lot of attention in the press back then, but the juggernaut of corporate centralization and homogenization and the capricious business licensing regimes that we see today weren’t nearly as pervasive.

  349. AMR September 1, 2011 at 6:11 pm #

    My friend’s boyfriend claimed that he put his wrist out of commission by mishandling a five-gallon container of chlorine. He’s in a totally different league from you, what with your pulling a big guy out of the Blue Danube and all.
    Another bit of absurdity is that although the owners of the pool management company brook or engage in all manner of petty fraud, they have started implementing a strict policy against fraternization between managers and guards, as though they’re commissioned officers and enlisted personnel in the military. This was started on account of my sociopathic buddy, who was a notorious Lothario around women who were his subordinates. Some of them liked it, some of them didn’t, and apparently some overly sensitive twits took vicarious offense because he was too affectionate, aggressive or whatever with the ladies while on duty and got into a serious, lasting relationship with one of them. So instead of telling female guards to give the sociopath a whack or call the office if he got out of line, they decided that kids holding down summer jobs may no longer have summer romances with supervisors or subordinates because a small, weird minority sometimes causes romantic drama.

  350. AMR September 1, 2011 at 6:28 pm #

    Actually, my doula friend is not obsessed with Red Tentery. What she seems to do most often on full moons is go rock climbing by the moonlight, usually with guy friends because most of her climbing partners are guys. Believe me, she gets along very well with guys and is overall very well adjusted. She can be fringy, but she is not a freak or a man-hating bitch as you’ve implied.
    As far as orgasms during labor, videotaping of deliveries and the like are concerned, that stuff isn’t necessarily perverted or quackish. If you want to see something really perverted and sadistic, take a look at the American practice of shackling prisoners to their beds during labor. There is nothing bizarre about a woman having an orgasm while pushing a baby through her vagina. It makes some anatomical and physiological sense. As far as the videography is concerned, people who get aroused by looking at films of women giving birth will find ways to get aroused from other things that serve legitimate sentimental or scientific purposes: pictures of mothers nursing their babies, human anatomy books, etc. Likewise, women who have exhibitionist tendencies will find ways to act on those tendencies, with or without Youtube vaginal dilation porn. If you want to take on a task that you’ll never complete, go on a crusade against wet T-shirt contests, Girls Gone Wild contests, drunks in hot tubs, and so forth. Or bitch about Victorian-era gynecologists using vibrators to treat patients for sexual frigidity. That font is a lot deeper and older than Youtube.

  351. Buck Stud September 1, 2011 at 6:31 pm #

    How does a writer keep a straight face when trying to sell fantasy as fact ? Shelby Steele writes:
    “ Since the ’60s we have enfeebled our public education system even as our wealth has expanded. Moral and cultural relativism now obscure individual responsibility. We are uninspired in the wars we fight, calculating our withdrawal even before we begin—and then we fight with a self-conscious, almost bureaucratic minimalism that makes the wars interminable.”
    Somehow, if the spirit of Curtis Lemay could reign, the outcome of these wars would be different? And even more absurdly, Steele fails to mention (perhaps he does not know?), that an essentialist philosophy (“back to basics“ ) is the dominant pedagogical creed in the current educational landscape. What Steele and the GOP propaganda machine won’t acknowledge, is the deleterious and paradoxical effect the economics of the Reagan Revolution has had on working families in America. The practice of contract labor and temporary hires – strongly implemented in the ‘80s by companies such as Coors Beer, etc, etc, – eliminated precious benefits and a living wage traditionally associated with a decent manufacturing gig in America. Inevitably, the two -parent income became, out of necessity, more and more prevalent. As a result, parents became less involved in school curricula and electronic gadgetry became the dominant after school companion in low to middle-class households all across the land. But none of this is hardly a revelation – anybody with a good pair of eyes and ears knows what’s been going down. On the other hand, perhaps Steele should congratulate the school systems ( of course it’s the fault of liberal union members) he loves to condemn; after all, you have to be an imbecile to believe this same old regurgitated political tripe:

  352. ozone September 1, 2011 at 8:19 pm #

    Sorry, the home page material changes nearly daily now.
    Here’s a condensed version of what they were yelling about Mr. Fein:

  353. progress2conserve September 1, 2011 at 8:43 pm #

    Buck –
    I’m impressed that you read the WSJ. There are things about this op-ed by Steel that I find insightful. There are things that seem a little over-hyped.
    I thank you for bringing Steele to the attention of CFN. He wrote “White Guilt” which goes to the discussion you and I were trying to have two days ago.
    “Throughout the years, Steele watched the era of white power transform into an era of white guilt, the underlying theme throughout Steele’s novel. Steele believes that the lack of time between transitioning from white supremacy to white guilt, ultimately led to the destruction of the civil rights era. According to Steele, since the transformation from white power to white guilt was presented to society with no cool-off period, the American people were not able to feel a sense of neutrality towards racism, and this is when bargainers came about: blacks in the political spotlight appealing to whites to take hold of white guilt and use it to their advantage.”
    -review of “White Guilt-
    YEAH, exactly. And by extension, not all whites in the ’60’s (1860’s OR 1960’s) were evil. And not all blacks were virtutous.
    Let’s make note that Steele is black, btw – the son of a black truck driver and a white social worker. And he was born in 1946, so he’s in a position to KNOW what he’s talking about.
    I think I like this guy.

  354. jackieblue2u September 1, 2011 at 8:44 pm #

    Kinda like “There but for the Grace of God go I” saying.
    Life is fragile and it can and does change in an instant.
    There IS such a thing as luck also. Timing, luck, etc.
    Snobs are not my type of folks. I dated one for a few months. Odd couple we were. He ‘wouldn’t wear it unless it had a CK or some other high end label on it’. So NOT my tye.
    I am currently reading a book, been staying off computer lately, I got this book at the Dollar Store, it’s called Trust Fund Boys. These guys, gay it turns out are trying to infiltrate The Hamptons, and they are actors, not successful, and getting older, and anyway they are acting snobbish now and hangin’ with the rich snobs, then they realize it isn’t all what it’s cracked up to be. They are con men. And it seems everyone is conning everyone pretty much out there in this book anyway.
    Well it is Entertaining to me, he has a really dry sense of humor.

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  356. progress2conserve September 1, 2011 at 9:07 pm #

    But, LBend, where do all of those people go to sleep? -P2C, concerning segregation in NYC-
    “In my apartment building, for starters and they can well afford it too!!”
    -LBend, concerning her corner of Paradise-
    You make your apartment sound pretty upscale, Lbend. And no one can try to make a coherent argument that folks with sufficient financial resources will not be freely allowed into any sort of upscale real estate, regardless of race, creed, and color. And especially as long as they don’t throw loud parties or park their BMW’s in the wrong parking spaces – hahhah.
    But, there are pressures in middle class and lower class housing – that you may not be aware of in your building and in your life.
    And lower class housing in NYC looks extremely segregated by race, a contention supported by the demographics map that I cited.
    I’m not seeing how that ever gets any better – as economic conditions in the US slowly degrade, and/or as TSHTF.
    Which is why discussions of race tend to occupy space on CFN, budizwizer. And Budiz, again, if you’ll elaborate on what you’re getting at in your posts – I’ll try to help you run with it – AGAIN.

  357. progress2conserve September 1, 2011 at 9:25 pm #

    Ozone, your points about neighbors are noted with general agreement. You and I may just have to agree to disagree about how the “tribal” nature of people is likely to manifest in TLE.
    You’re more of an optimist. That’s cool!
    However, given your choices of possible neighbors for my TLE community:
    “A.) Stupid, lazy-minded, ignorant
    B.) Smart, curious, well-informed”
    -ozone’s choices-
    as well as these interesting SJMom choices:
    “C.) Brown, caring, college-educated (next door on the west)
    D.) Fratman and Barbie, white, clueless and inconsiderate (next door on the east)
    E.) White, single mom, mensa. (2 doors on the west)
    F.) White, lesbian, well-read lawyer. (across the street)
    G.) White, psycho, stacked. Went by “Oral Laurel” at Cal Poly”
    Can I do a custom order, here?
    I’d definitely like all of my TLE companions to be from the Ozone “B” list.
    But can I add in one or two “G’s” from the SJMom list, too?? You know, just for variety? –
    – – – “The Spice of Life?” -Pangolin-
    A custom TLE group would be pretty cool, I think.
    I’m actually working on one, slowly, as we speak.
    😉 🙂 😉 😉 ;0) 🙂

  358. progress2conserve September 1, 2011 at 10:06 pm #

    “Prog: good points. Only ten percent of Southerners owned slaves. The rest fought to protect their homeland. So the vast majority of White Americans never had anything to do with it. They are free of the taint of inherited guilt…”
    Vlad, all true enough – but if slaveowning means Eternal Guilt, then there’s plenty of it in my family tree. At least one or two direct ancestors on both sides of my family owned slaves.
    I have the wills where slaves were transferred – by proper name – from father to son upon death of the father. These ancestors of mine can not be called EVIL, simply because they were born into a system that suborned slavery. Slavery had existed for ALL of human history.
    I have enough of the wills, deeds, documents, and family oral history – to be pretty sure that none of my family ever split up a slave family. There’s not even evidence of any sales of slaves at all. And I’m talking family farms, not huge plantations – so sales of slaves would be pretty obvious.
    And there is a quiet, overgrown family cemetery that I can walk any of you to, in woods still owned by a cousin. There, where the bodies of my white ancestors and their black slaves lie very close – for all eternity.
    There is evidence that some of our “freed men and women” lived nearby for all of their lives – ’till long after 1864. Some of them are buried in this family cemetery – who died AFTER being freed – yet returned to be buried with their black kin who had gone before. That has meaning.
    Slavery was wrong.
    But not every one involved with it was evil.
    Good people can do good –
    even if they are born in a bad system.

  359. San Jose Mom 51 September 1, 2011 at 10:25 pm #

    Trust me, “G” would make your life hell.
    Her husband does not pass the gaydar test, and goes off on vacations with his buddies to get away from her. Visually, she provides an excellent alibi for any guy who can’t come out of the closet.

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  362. Vlad Krandz September 2, 2011 at 1:44 am #

    As the Bible says, we are but the clay and He the Potter. He decides whether we will be fine pots of the finest clay or leaky, inferior vessels. Our job is to do the best with what we’ve been given – see Christ’s parable of the talents. Christian Gentlemen like Robert E Lee and Andrew Jackson did not hate or blame the Black for being inferior. As Jackson lay dying surrounded by his family and house slaves, he said that he would see them all, Black and White, in Heaven.
    But these gentlemen would never pretend that the differences between the races weren’t real or significant – or that they should be ignored just to be “nice”. That whole way of thinking is pure corruption and it has destroyed us. Again being of high lineage does not mean being good. Character is not inherited but earned. A humble Black Man (almost non existent now) will come out ahead of a gifted but arrogant White in the spirtitual race to the Kingdom.
    The Black Man has his gifts to be sure. Better with women than White Men for one. Every Black I saw with a woman today was with a White. The non stop propaganda that trashes us and exalts them doesn’t hurt either. In any case, we are headed for extinction at this rate. They obviously prefer our women to their own. Can’t blame them on that. Shouldn’t they be worried too? Well, they obviously don’t feel they have much to lose. And just as obviously, we do.

  363. lpat September 2, 2011 at 1:45 am #

    Gag me with a big ol’ wooden spoon. Give it the fuck up!
    Nobody would bother picking on the south’s past if you idiots would quite trying to defend it. Its past is indefensible. The poor damned freedman buried cheek by jowl with your ancesters probably just couldn’t, no matter how hard they tried, get the hell out of the south. If you had a clue about how the sharecropper system worked, how it tied labor to the land, you mightn’t make such stupid claims.
    And Jesus ain’t got shit to do with it neither, lady. Jesus was not about establishing a state religion where everyone was bullied into believing stupid shit.
    Dumbfuck privates get their asses shot off for plutocrats. That’s the nature of the world and of war. If anybody fought for the south thinking they were doing anything other than defending plantation owners’ property rights to own slaves, they were fools.
    However, most of us would be willing to move on. But if the south is going to continue to insist on defining itself by trying to justify its past, by right wing politics that Hitler would be proud of and Christianity that makes a mockery of the Enlightenment-formed Constitution, then war we shall continue to have.

  364. jackieblue2u September 2, 2011 at 3:08 am #

    Neighbors can be such a drag.
    Count your blessings.
    I have Nortenos and Surrenos across the street.
    I missed it the day the SWAT was there and arrested a few of them.
    It’s a really creepy apt. complex, just a few units, but always draws weird creepy types.
    Very interestin neighborhood. Not all bad. Just something for everyone. Whatcha gonna do?
    “They’re everywhere!” Inconsiderate people that is.

  365. Eleuthero September 2, 2011 at 3:30 am #

    You give way too much credit to your neighbors
    to call them merely “inconsiderate” or “creepy”
    if they are, indeed, Surrenos and Nortenos.
    is important. 🙂 🙂

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  367. Eleuthero September 2, 2011 at 3:41 am #

    Buck Stud said:
    Walking away, my how-impressive-was-that-thought was replaced with something more familiar and comfortable: Charles De Gaulle muttering ‘ just because the Chinese aspire to worker ant status doesn’t mean I will ’.
    Thank God for the French.
    Ah, Uncle Buck, … I love a good clincher
    paragraph. De Gaulle’s under-the-breath
    statement was nothing less than an INSISTENCE
    that we want CIVILIZATION, by God.
    Globalism has done nothing more than drag a
    large portion of the non-Asian middle classes
    downward into fearful peon status while creating
    PATHETICALLY small middle classes in China,
    Brazil, Korea, and other places.
    Globalism proudly says: “Raise 1,000,000 people
    worldwide into middle class status and lower
    300,000,000 from middle to lower-middle class.
    It’s ‘good for business'”.
    Globalism almost makes the “rapture Christians”
    look correct.

  368. Eleuthero September 2, 2011 at 3:55 am #

    Buck Stud said:
    What Steele and the GOP propaganda machine won’t acknowledge, is the deleterious and paradoxical effect the economics of the Reagan Revolution has had on working families in America.
    Reagan was not only the first President to run
    multi-hundred-billion dollar deficits but also
    the first to be under the thrall of the men-in-
    black who we now know to be PNAC. Remember the
    photos of Rumsfeld shaking Saddam Hussein’s hand?
    When he was our bitch, we couldn’t care less that
    he was a homicidal maniac.
    Of course, as regards your assertion about what
    Reagan did to the working family, the voodoo
    economics of his Administration started the
    inexorable trend toward increasing the already
    obscene wealth and power of the existing
    As an old school Conservative, I cringe in horror
    at the mention of this guy as a “great
    Conservative”. Barry Goldwater once called
    Ronald Reagan a “blow-dried pretty boy” and
    thought him to be substanceless. That he
    and Nancy had personal astrologers shows
    beyond a shadow of a doubt that they were
    also brainless twits.
    Goldwater actually got along with liberal
    interior secretary Mo Udall quite well because
    old school conservatives wanted to, well, …
    CONSERVE. Starting with Nixon’s closing of
    the gold window, the Conservative movement in
    America slowly morphed into an
    anti-Constitutional claque of loons who devalued
    the dollar, pulled all the restraints off of
    the monied interests, and slavered to get
    involved in foreign wars (Grenada? Panama? OMG).
    This is 180 degrees from “Conservatism”.

  369. Eleuthero September 2, 2011 at 4:05 am #

    Buck Stud said:
    “ Since the ’60s we have enfeebled our public education system even as our wealth has expanded. Moral and cultural relativism now obscure individual responsibility. We are uninspired in the wars we fight, calculating our withdrawal even before we begin—and then we fight with a self-conscious, almost bureaucratic minimalism that makes the wars interminable.”
    I dunno, Buck … I think Mr. Steele’s first two
    sentences are somewhat correct!!! Our schools
    HAVE become enfeebled since the 1960s and every
    international achievement test verifies this as
    I also think that moral and cultural relativism
    HAVE obscured individual responsibility and I’m
    prepared to back the assertion that the “average”
    person now has less conscience, more greed, and
    a poorer work ethic than the 1960s.
    I think Steele is BONKERS about our war-fighting.
    I mean, geez, even Mr. Rumsfeld called it “shock
    and awe” which doesn’t sound like military
    minimalism to me. So … we agree and we

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  371. xhalor September 2, 2011 at 4:53 am #

    Golf clap

  372. xhalor September 2, 2011 at 5:16 am #

    Did somebody say “racism”? I counted 4.

  373. xhalor September 2, 2011 at 5:32 am #

    For those of you who don’t know who Willie Dixon is.
    I beg you. Do not forsake your culture.

  374. xhalor September 2, 2011 at 6:30 am #

    One of the few things I expect from this reality; A RESPONSE! You made me look up the word “flabbergasted”. I dunno. Seems kinda’ simple to me.
    Humans saving other humans. I thought we were all on the same side.

  375. xhalor September 2, 2011 at 6:49 am #

    I have actually saved an original deep-blue stained Roberto Clemente 34 model Louisville Slugger. I pray (and I’m an atheist) that I will be allowed to take one (1) possession into the Afterlife with me (…if such a fuckin’ thing exists). After making my celestial introduction to the late Mr. LeMay, I plan to bash his celestial brains out with my one (1) allotted possesion.
    Anita Bryant

  376. lbendet September 2, 2011 at 7:34 am #

    Paradise? You make your apartment sound pretty upscale, Lbend.
    The building’s ok–not great. It’s got location and some amenities.
    What I was responding to is that you were not taking into account the areas where integration has worked and I did say in my first response to you that it was about economics and less about race.
    Of course there are big disparities still, nobody would argue that, but to say it is a dismal failure would not be correct either.
    I think I’m pretty much done with the discussion, though.

  377. lbendet September 2, 2011 at 7:57 am #

    Globalism proudly says: “Raise 1,000,000 people
    worldwide into middle class status and lower
    300,000,000 from middle to lower-middle class.
    It’s ‘good for business'”.
    Oh, indeed. I despise that Orwellian phrase the “Globalism raises all ships” –A real Clintonism, let me tell you. Who do they think they’re kidding as 90% of US citizens are sinking.
    Globalism means that those who are manufacturing overseas are no longer bound by the laws of the country they originated in. But they unleash legions of lobbyists representing not only our own businesses but those of other countries and it gets all mixed into our politics.
    That’s why nothing will be done about the needs of the people. To add insult to injury the Republican revanchists would like to turn back the 20th century. We are becoming the most regressive country on earth as we do away with environmental safety and that of food and pharmaceuticals. Good luck to all organic beings.
    The people in the top 10% aren’t feeling it yet, but trust me as more of us go broke, they’ll be the next victims, the robbery will keep hitting where the money is. This system is designed for that. It can’t go any other way.
    It’s really too bad that there are no real Conservatives who have a voice in this country. Pat Buchanan is too caught up in the Plutocracy to be real. And the Democrats are mostly Nixon Republicans.
    Ron Paul, at least wants regulations, since anyone with a brain knows that the Plutocracy is lawless and godless, no matter how they try to lie about that. Their culture war is a reaction formation.
    But RP has some inconsistencies too. And I’m afraid either for his life, if he really ever got anywhere, or that he would become subverted by the machine by the time he reached the WH.
    Fact is there’s not a individual to change this, only the group of the high powered who could turn this thing around and they have it too good to do that. They never lose no matter what they do.
    JHK was glad that Little Lord Blankfein had to get a lawyer–so what? Doesn’t everyone who gets into hot water. We’ll see what happens to Murdoch, trial and all.
    It’s unfortunate that this economic system has been in place all these years, it makes TLE that much harder on the country than it would have been.
    We no longer have the resources to deal with it. Uncle Sam has less money than these Plutocrats, even though they have a printing press.

  378. lbendet September 2, 2011 at 8:34 am #

    they have a printing press.
    I mean he (uncle sam)

  379. Buck Stud September 2, 2011 at 11:02 am #

    I agree with you about the philosophical dilution of conservatism [imbued with Libertarianism] as it was represented by a Barry Goldwater and not that of the far right evangelical Christian mode. Truthfully, there was no chance of a presidential fit for him; he was too unwavering and nuanced all at the same time. Not to mention a Johnson bid in the aftermath of the Kennedy assassination. And he was raked over the coals as a real Dr Strangelove type character in the 64 election. I have a signed copy of his autobiography “ Goldwater” with Jack Casserly (signed by Casserly).

  380. Buck Stud September 2, 2011 at 11:45 am #

    ” I dunno, Buck … I think Mr. Steele’s first two
    sentences are somewhat correct!!! Our schools
    HAVE become enfeebled since the 1960s and every
    international achievement test verifies this as
    I also think that moral and cultural relativism
    HAVE obscured individual responsibility and I’m
    prepared to back the assertion that the “average”
    person now has less conscience, more greed, and
    a poorer work ethic than the 1960s.”
    IMHO, the schools are a reflection of the society that envelopes it. The problem I have with the platitudes expressed by Steele and others from the political right is they marginalize this reality and demand that schools function autonomously. And , ironically, if cultural relativism and individual responsibility are lacking, why not encourage educational institutions to implement an existentialist approach in which the students design and structure their own educational experience? ( I am not advocating this, I’ve seen one episode too many of the Maury Povich show.)
    Kids don’t read enough and the reasons are multiple and varied. I happen to believe the neglect of reading is due to the overwhelming dominance of the electronic media revolution. And the little reading that students/kids do perform, is usually done under the threat of homework/lesson failure. In that regard, an existentialist approach, in which the yearning for the ends creates the structure of the means, promotes an auto-didactic love of learning. I recall as a kid eagerly anticipating the monthly arrival of the Time/Life book series that my mother ordered. I also recall riding the city bus downtown to spend a whole day at the library – this was fun! And because of certain interests and passions, I devoured books for hours on end. I learned how to do now antiquated research with aid of microfiche, etc, not because I needed the exposure for an academic requirement, but because it was the only way I was going to get what I wanted to read. But times change and so does technology. Books now compete against Xbox Live and the results of that contest are glaringly apparent.
    And how can we address the issue of failing education (as evidenced by faltering test scores) and allegedly poor teacher performance without a mention of mass illegal immigration and the language barrier? Look no further than Los Angeles and other similar municipalities for the brutal reality. But Mr. Steele wants to lay all the blame on “liberalism” and this strikes me as the cheap political posturing of the partisan.

  381. Buck Stud September 2, 2011 at 12:03 pm #

    *** And,… if cultural relativism IS A CULPRIT and individual responsibility IS lacking.

  382. San Jose Mom 51 September 2, 2011 at 12:24 pm #

    It’s interesting that Mr. Steele’s twin brother is Dean of the Department of Education at Stanford. Also of note is that Stanford set up a charter school in east Palo Alto (a hell hole) and staffed it with all kinds of brilliant teachers and support services to the families of the children. The Board of Education shut the charter school down because their test scores went way down…Below the levels of other neighborhood schools. Seems that plain old discipline and consequences work in slummy neighborhoods better than a place where kids can endlessly share their feelings.

  383. Buck Stud September 2, 2011 at 12:34 pm #

    ” Slavery was wrong.
    But not every one involved with it was evil.”
    Thanks for being honest about the history of your family in regards to slavery. And yes, I also believe people get swept away by the overwhelming tide of the times they live in and our not inherently evil. That is why I mentioned Christopher Columbus. Still, one doesn’t need a retrospective or rear view mirror to realize that subjecting another fellow human being to forced labor is wrong no matter the context. And the good book provided plenty of context for the supposedly pious to contemplate the moral nature of their economic undertakings. And yet the rationalizations persist: ” we were the good type of slave owner, etc, etc”.
    What the census records do not indicate is the people who did not purchase and use slaves but had the means to do so. For me, that might provide a real study in true morality. But again, I don’t want to come off as waving a moralizing finger; no doubt, complex situations existed that may have appeared superficially evil on the outside but were motivated by something far less sinister on the inside.
    I will say this: I have read enough of your posts to know that you do not typically lack for the exact, precise word. As Mark Twain might say, you’re not going ” to bankrupt the Arts of Language” in selecting the word “wrong” to denounce slavery.
    Jaywalking is wrong, and so is tossing a Ding-Dong wrapper from a traveling car at high speeds…but slavery?

  384. progress2conserve September 2, 2011 at 12:37 pm #

    “We have met the enemy and he is us.”
    -LPAT, paraphrased-
    “Nobody would bother picking on the south’s past if you idiots would quite trying to defend it.”
    You can not be this stupid, LPAT. JHK hardly lets 2 weeks go by without a southern slam of one sort or another. And people – even you, in this particular post – are constantly asking WHY, WHY the South insists on being and behaving the way it does.
    “The poor damned freedman buried cheek by jowl with your ancesters probably just couldn’t, no matter how hard they tried, get the hell out of the south. If you had a clue about how the sharecropper system worked, how it tied labor to the land, you mightn’t make such stupid claims.”
    Look, maroon, my dad, born in 1912 WAS a sharecropper. He nearly died from rheumatic fever due to malnutrition and lack of medical care. The South, white and black was left destitute by the Civil War. And the Great Depression hit much harder in the South.
    And the point of the story about the freedmen who remained with my family – was that, bad as slavery was – not every slave owner was Simon Legree. And LPAT, you and your oh-so-virtuous Southern Bashing Legions ALWAYS conveniently forget the complicity of Northern capitalists in the slave trade. AND you forget that slavery had been LEGAL in some of the NORTH – at one time or another. And that slavery was ratified into the very ” Enlightenment-formed Constitution” (tm LPAT) that you reference, yourself.
    Slavery was a absolute Fact Of Life through ALL of human history until the 1850’s – when it began to end. It would have ended without the death of 1,000,000 men – North and South – in the American Civil War.
    A Civil War that led -directly – to the present US belief that all problems can be easily resolved by going to war and killing enough people.
    Stop trying to cloak yourself in virtue that you don’t deserve.

  385. Cash September 2, 2011 at 12:54 pm #

    I would argue that cultural relativism is a culprit and individual responsibility is lacking.
    But there are signs of hope. In this place, whose politics are far to the left of those in the US, we had some events which were instructive in how far you can push the deconstruction of western civilization and also how far you can shove simple common sense over the cliff before people react.
    We had a provincial election in Ontario where the Conservative leader started pushing the idea for public funding of Islamic schools. Until he did this the Ontario Conservatives were running not badly in the polls. After he started pushing this idea Conservative support fell and they lost big-time. This election became about Islamic schools and Ontario voters voted accordingly.
    Several years ago the Liberal govt of Ontario raised the possibility of enacting Sharia family law for Ontario Muslims and established a commission to recommend how it could work. When the proposals were unveiled there was a shitstorm of protest not least from Muslim women. The Liberal premier of Ontario took note of the backlash and promptly shitcanned the idea and then banned all religiously based family tribunals.
    This same premier also inveiled proposals to reform how sex ed is done in this province ie teaching elementary school kids all kinds of neat stuff they need to know about sex like lubrication etc. There was a massive shitstorm of protest over this idea too and the premier took note and also shitcanned these proposals.
    But I guess not enough people noticed because I read that they did apparently managed to ban the use of the terms “mother” and “father” from provincial statutes. Apparently such terms are much too laughably Ozzie and Harriet for our hip, modern times. But I’m pretty sure that sooner or later someone will take note and reverse this absurdity.
    This isn’t an exact parallel but in the late 1960s our oh so hip and modern Liberal govt decided to get rid of the terms Royal Canadian Air Force and Royal Canadian Navy. Too cringingly colonial and imperial for their delicate liberal sensibilities. But just a few weeks ago the current Conservative govt re-instated the old names. So maybe in the decades to come some legislator will take note and do the same for those ancient terms “mother” and “father”.
    Our Liberal govt also got rid of our old flag the Red Ensign in the mid 1960s and replaced it with our current red maple leaf flag which the last (toweringly intellectual) Liberal Party leader derided as a passing imitation of a beer can logo or somesuch. Anyway I’m anticipating that we’ll get the Red Ensign back.
    What was wrong with it in the first place you ask? It had a Union Jack in the top left corner which offended Quebeckers and all other haters of things Anglo Saxon. So it had to go. But Quebeckers rewarded us for this and for making French an offical language and for electing party leaders from Quebec and for making the Quebec agenda our national agenda with a separatist movement and two refereda on secession. So now not many of us give a shit what Quebec wants. They don’t like the glorious old Red Ensign? Tough. As for me I’d like it back just out of spite.

  386. Cash September 2, 2011 at 1:01 pm #

    typos: official language, two referenda or referendums on secession
    It’s old age, what can I say.

  387. Islander800 September 2, 2011 at 1:04 pm #

    Be careful what you wish for – if you still live in Oregon, especially if somewhere near the coast, the Big One coming may be to a neighbourhood near you….
    The Pacific Northwest coastal area sits on a subduction zone that makes the San Andreas slip fault look like nothing. The last major quake along the northwest subduction zone was 311 years ago, was in the range of a 10.0 and created a massive tsunami that slammed the entire coastal region within minutes of the quake. They occur approximately every 300 – 500 years so you might say the next one could be due any time. When it does, it’ll be another 10.0 and the tsunami will wipe out everything at sea level from Seaside to Bandon. Think of the devastation in Japan and you have an idea.
    Like you, I’ve been thinking the Ring of Fire is unzipping, and this morning’s Alaskan earthquake isn’t very comforting…..

  388. asoka. September 2, 2011 at 1:23 pm #

    “Slavery was wrong.
    But not every one involved with it was evil.”
    That sounds like something a racist would say.
    It is also wrong to use the past tense when speaking of slavery. Slavery still exists in the South. I’m not speaking metaphorically. Slaves today are chained, shackled, forced to work, beaten, and shot. I am referring to disappearance, enslavement, and death. In the South, TODAY.
    Today it is being called human trafficking:

    the modern day manifestation of slavery with sexual exploitation and forced labor being the traffickers’ main goal. http://www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/border_security/human_trafficking/no_te_enganes/

    The only difference is today’s slaves are brown skinned immigrants. The sooner we grant immigrants full legal status, the easier it will be for them to fight their abusers.
    Slavery is evil and those involved with it are evil. Those who justify it are racists.

  389. Vlad Krandz September 2, 2011 at 1:42 pm #

    Interesting article about Corporate encroachmnent in the Islamic
    World. McDonalds is in Mecca – right outside the Kaaba. Mohammad Atta was outraged at skyscrapers in Allepo and Cairo. The author sees the relationship between the Zionism and the New World Order and how both are against Western Nationalism just as much as the Muslims are.
    They plan to play us against each other, profit off the conflict, and then take over whatever remains. Islam is against their fiat currency swindle just as Nazi Germany was. They MUST be conquered if the New World Order is to succeed.

  390. Vlad Krandz September 2, 2011 at 1:44 pm #

    Slavery still exists in part of Islam and Black Africa. Funny how you people don’t seem to mind that at all. Whose the racist here, hmmm?

  391. progress2conserve September 2, 2011 at 1:45 pm #

    “Slavery was wrong” -P2C-
    “I will say this: I have read enough of your posts to know that you do not typically lack for the exact, precise word. As Mark Twain might say, you’re not going ” to bankrupt the Arts of Language” in selecting the word “wrong” to denounce slavery.” -buckstud-
    Thanks, Buck, I think. (grins)
    Sooo – I looked up some synonyms for “wrong” for us:
    “condemnable, criminal, deplorable, reprehensible, vicious,base, immoral, misguided, mistaken”
    and I could easily say that:
    Slavery was condemnable.
    Slavery was deplorable.
    Slavery was misguided.
    Slavery was mistaken.
    That leaves – slavery was (criminal, reprehensible, vicious, base, or immoral).
    What you seem to want is one of these “harshest” possible synonyms for “wrong.” I can’t go that far – knowing what I know of the historical context for slavery in America.
    Remember that the Founding Fathers ratified slavery into the Constitution in 1780? – this means that slavery was considered completely “normal” at that time.
    And if you go on to view many of the Founding Fathers as criminal/reprehensible/vicious/base/immoral – because they suborned slavery – or because the actively engaged in it – –
    I don’t think that sort of historical revisionism is a good thing for the US, or for humanity in general.
    Also – if our Nation WAS criminal/vicious/immoral/whatever – for sanctioning slavery –
    Then we can never make it right.
    We can never apologize enough.
    We can never pay enough reparations.
    We can never have enough MLK Memorial Celebrations
    We can only die.
    And let others take over.
    Which is actually what some of the more strongly “non-white??” racists, around the Globe and in the US, seem to be requesting.

  392. progress2conserve September 2, 2011 at 2:09 pm #

    “Slavery still exists in the South.”
    -the resident impediment-
    ONLY in the South, I suppose.
    And his solution is not to prosecute the criminals who bring “brown” people into the US illegally and hold them against their will.
    It is to open the US border to anyone who shows up and asks for US citizenship.
    I refuse to deal with asoka. because he is never happy until one agrees that:
    1. La Reconquista of the US must be supported
    2. Sharia Law for females on US soil is good.
    3. A US of 600,000,000 is desirable.
    There is an argument to be made that slavery came to an end – worldwide – in the mid to late 1800’s, BECAUSE of the increasing use of machinery and fossil fuels – and not for “moral” reasons, or because of the American Civil War.
    It is interesting that “human trafficking” appears to be making a comeback as “peak everything” is putting pressures on World economies.
    Asoka.’s points 1,2,3 will hasten that day for the US and for the world.
    And bring about a more rapid return to human slavery. Asoka. wants to see slavery return.
    I wonder who he most wants to see enslaved?
    Based on his posts – I already know.
    Those who “deserve” enslavement the most, right?
    Shouldn’t have used those atom bombs on Japan,
    I suppose.
    I’m about through with CFN until Sunday evening.

  393. Vlad Krandz September 2, 2011 at 3:38 pm #

    Leibo: did I now predict that Judgement would be poured down on New York City? Will you not now repent or do you need to wait for the big one, the Extinction Level Event when Manhattan goes under the waves and the streets collapse into the flooded tunnels. Woe unto the Great City. When destruction comes, flee North and West. Do not wait though, you do so at your peril. Leave the City to LGBT’s, the Vulture in three piece suits, and the dark skinned workers and savages who serve and prey upon them.

  394. messianicdruid September 2, 2011 at 4:34 pm #

    ‘I’m about through with CFN until Sunday evening.”
    Me too, but between now and then the Apaches and Chiraquayaws will commandeer the mountains and lowlands of their fathers and warn all white-eyes to flee north and west.
    So I may be leavin.

  395. Bustin J September 2, 2011 at 4:48 pm #

    Ahhh, Friday, the day of the week in which the sandwich board types being to populate the MB.
    Kunstler: have you considered http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/simple-captcha/
    NYTimes business section today decries the failur of 3 solar panel firms in the US.
    Obama is a Republican in drag.
    And slavery is endemic. Who among us doesn’t have to pay rent? Do we choose to work? Or does the economy do the work of the boss-man in years past?
    Everyone is a ‘house nigger’ now. Everyone is a participant in their own enslavement. The only free people are criminals.

  396. asoka. September 2, 2011 at 5:10 pm #

    Message for Qishtik:
    Q, I want to let you know Bank of America is going down. Please move your money out now. Your sister in law’s credit union would be a safer place for your money.
    Bank of America has systematically and intentionally violated both federal and state laws in the sale of home mortgage-backed securities. Bank of America is now being sued by the USA government.
    I don’t want you to lose any money, Q. because I know how important money is to you. Please move your money out of Bank of America while you can.

  397. AMR September 2, 2011 at 5:53 pm #

    It’s time for another cynical outburst about those twin pillars of civilization, church and family. Oddly, I don’t use the “twin pillars” rhetoric sarcastically. Church and family are pillars of civilization. The problem is that sometimes one touches them and hears a disconcerting crumbling noise because they’re riddled with dry rot.
    Recently I’ve been testing the romantic waters, quite gently, with a local woman whom I’ve known for several years. We get along wonderfully. If there is to be a next step, it will involve proper unsupervised dates, and hopefully unsupervised sleepovers.
    The problem is that this lady has a convoluted mesh of church and family ties that have a very high chance of turning any romance between us into a gossipy clusterfuck, and I’m not about to put up with the drama. I get the distinct sense that her church, like many churches, tends to intrude into the romantic and sex lives of its members. Most of the intrusion in this congregation, it’s worth noting, seems to come from the laity, not the clergy.
    There is a very common meme in Christian circles that unsupervised visits between members of the opposite sex are verboten because they result in sex outside of marriage. No kidding. When these visits are between two lovers, that’s exactly the point. They want some time together, in private, to explore each other at their own pace, without a bunch of repressed church voyeurs peering in over the bedroom walls (that’s why we have the Internet, so that the urge doesn’t have to be taken out on one’s friends and family). They want to be each other’s “accountability partners” instead of being pestered by nosy, dirty-minded third-party “accountability partners” at church to confess their secret sexual desires and acts. Some of them would like to be accorded some fucking discretion. So, for a number of compelling reasons, would I.
    A large part of the Christian press is brimming with monomaniacal tall tales in which the fount of all drama, disorder and anguish is illicit sex. The panacea, according to these yarns, is to make sure that all sex acts are preapproved by church authorities. This is of course deranged hack sociology, not the stuff of a balanced, well-examined life, but there’s no reason for any of that to stand in the way of a good, righteous, thundering declaration of moral absolutes.
    Just offhand I can name two things that more reliably cause drama than premarital hanky-panky. One is dating in the tradition of Crosby, Stills and Nash: loving the one you’re with. Been there, done that, and I don’t recommend it unless it’s a really slow night on the town, you don’t know where your crush is hanging out and you’re ready for some serious awkwardness.
    A bigger source is families that repay jackassery with jackassery. This is exactly what has faced me for most of the past week as my dad’s family has converged to hold a hospice death vigil for grandma. Granted, our nerves are frayed, but none of the family jackassery inexplicably gushed forth out of nowhere. One aunt solicited me to overpost a classified ad in multiple Craigslist markets (the Craigslist software blocked the second post; I should have refused to overpost from the start because it’s rude and unethical, as it violates the explicit, clearly posted terms of use). One uncle went several days without bathing, and I could smell it more by the day. (Preemptively sitting shiva was no excuse: dad’s side of the family isn’t Jewish, and mom’s side left Russia baptized as Lutherans. This guy is just a dirty hippie who doesn’t bathe often enough.) Another uncle and aunt, both never married, live on other planets. They’re unbelievably crass, materialistic and improvident, yet pious, avowed Christians. The uncle is on the verge of becoming estranged from the family because he has hardly lifted a finger to care for his dying mother, retreating instead to his own Starship Enterprise Holodeck, where he can pretend that everything is normal and surf the Internet for new gadgets to buy on credit and further ruin his personal finances. Last night, the family nutrition fascists and red meat hounds had a demoralizing fight over the dinner menu. The night before last, my mom got ugly drunk and spent twenty minutes trying to bait the aliens by asking them whether they knew the parish witch who was my first day care provider and telling them a perseverative story about what a mean old proselytizing hag she was. I needed all my self-control not to directly confront her in front of half of the family and tell her to bury the hatchet.
    This quagmire has fuck-all to do with sexual self-control. It’s a completely different sort of volatile drama, a sort that catches most of the family values crowd off-guard because it doesn’t conform to their sexually tinged fixations.
    On second thought, it could have something to do with sex, but not in the way that the Moral Majority assumes. I wouldn’t have to put up with the full measure of family jackassery this week if I could skip the house from time to time and have a tryst with a nice, sensible Protestant gal.
    If wishes were horses….

  398. montsegur September 2, 2011 at 6:14 pm #

    Comment for Cash —
    Please see http://s1235.photobucket.com/albums/ff436/RadWil1903/ for photos of Bény-Sur-Mer
    Had not heard that Canada is going back to individual services.
    Canada is taking good care of the “sites” overseas from what I could see. A humbling visit.

  399. asoka. September 2, 2011 at 6:50 pm #

    Great photos to illustrate the stupidity of war.

  400. ozone September 2, 2011 at 7:05 pm #

    Hope you don’t mind, but your posting made me laugh. Perhaps that’s inappropriate, but dumbfuckery is so omnipresent these strange days, I can’t very well get incensed any more. Sure, it’s absurd; sure it should make me angry that people act so unjustifiably stupid; but I’ve slipped quietly into outrage-overload mode and simply cackle like a gimlet-eyed, certifiable whack-job when hearing of mythical pillars crumbling from beneath self-referential “citizens”.
    Ah, Madame DeFarge approaches… {girlish giggle}

  401. GAZ September 2, 2011 at 8:02 pm #

    Yea…Yea…I know all about the subduction zone, it’s the same kind as the one in Indonesia. I live in Bend. I’m more worried about winters (challenging to grow food year’round) and the occasional volcanic eruptions.

  402. Vlad Krandz September 2, 2011 at 8:42 pm #

    I sympathize with you. Christianity is Ascetic and most people aren’t, can’t be even if they wanted to be. It should never have tried to impose this kind of morality (of monks) on Everyone. As Charles Bukowski said, I don’t know if I’ll want to go back in until I’ve gone in once. Virgin Marriage: a joke.
    Other religions share this mania to various degrees.
    Have you considered Wicca? It’s kind of nothing but it’s easy going. You can’t deal with Christ the King, the Warrior, and the Dread Judge.

  403. Vlad Krandz September 2, 2011 at 8:44 pm #

    Soon you will be going hunting, hunting humans. It doesn’t come out of nowhere but of a slow subduction of our humanity by other humans. People are bad for other people – especially kids. Kids should be raised by Parents not put in Kid herds and shepherded by harassed professionals.

  404. Vlad Krandz September 2, 2011 at 8:51 pm #

    A man without a job is a bum. A man looking for a job is a beggar. A man who has a job is a slave. The hierarchy of egoic descent. Consider what Smohalla the Indian Visionary said: My disciples will know not work since men who work cannot dream.

  405. Vlad Krandz September 2, 2011 at 8:56 pm #

    Banks were forced by Barney Frank and Co to make loans to unqualified Blacks and Browns. Obviously many of these people had no intention of paying or at least had little chance of doing so even if they did. The Banks know about Black and Brown weakness and don’t loan to them unless there is evidence of capability and morality.

  406. Ixnei September 2, 2011 at 10:33 pm #

    “It was Alvin Lee.”
    Oh, hellz jYaH!!! Night of the Guitar!!! “Tax the rich, feed the poor! Til’ there are no rich no more…”
    Beany seems not to cop a clue concerning the multivariate global warming issue. Those morons claiming the global temps had leveled off during the first 9 years of 2000 are no longer going to have the excuse of the lowest solar irradiance/sunspot cycle min that had been recorded for almost 4 decades:

  407. AMR September 2, 2011 at 11:06 pm #

    Shit, Ozone, there’s no reason to apologize for finding that funny. Even I relished the crude entertainment value of my mom the militant atheist baiting otherworldly Christian materialists by repeating the same fucking screed over and over, literally sounding like a broken record–that is, once she had gone back to the motel for the night and I was the hell away from the crossfire.
    That’s one of the disadvantages of having a fairly high-volume home winery in the family. It helps liquor up the family abrasives, who didn’t need any help being arrogant in the first place.
    It’s like I’m a character in my own Jonathan Franzen novel and Twilight Zone episode.

  408. Ixnei September 2, 2011 at 11:09 pm #

    10 Years After (40+ years?), “Senators – “Stop the Wars!””
    I agree with you on the food stamps thing wholeheartedly – rice/beans/powdered milk – I love those things (but I’ve never yet been on the govt dole).
    I just saw a video about this woman with 6 kids (guess her race), who was hootin’ and hollerin’ about how her kids had nothing to eat all day (planning skills – GG ma!), and she couldn’t get her food stamps (this was right at the end of the debt ceiling fiasco). Total welfare mom – very disturbing.
    PS – why does the sci-fi channel have WWE Smackdown (was recording ST-TNG episodes)?!…

  409. Ixnei September 2, 2011 at 11:14 pm #

    Oh, and quite disturbing that this 6-child mother could have *EASILY* been a daughter of mine age-wise (except for the race)… So glad, 0 kids – I didn’t subject any humans to this incoming disaster “without their consent”.

  410. Ixnei September 2, 2011 at 11:38 pm #

    “the problems with the EURO are worse”
    I heard today the Euro markets crashed 3%, and their banks crashed anywhere from 6%-8%. JHK’s predictions seem to be coming true, concerning that “vacationland” in Euro…

  411. AMR September 2, 2011 at 11:52 pm #

    You’ll like these juicy tidbits, too:
    The alien aunt moved to Middle Tennessee a few years ago, ostensibly because God was leading her there. She settled in Williamson County, which is among the twenty or so wealthiest counties in the US thanks to all the country music stars and industry hangers-on who live there (my aunt once saw Nicole Kidman in a Franklin Starbucks). Actually, before God led my aunt to Nashville, he led her, her beater VW sedan and her depleted cash supply safely from California to Grand Rapids, where she spent a couple of weeks crashing with a friend and angling for gas money. She didn’t know whether Nashville was still “part of the plan,” but then, glory be, God (and His people) provided! More recently, she decided that the “plan” involved using Middle Tennessee as a “home base” for excursions to places including Northern Ireland. A year or two before moving to Tennessee she declared bankruptcy; since then, she has gone back into debt and spent months at a time flat broke.
    The alien uncle has Asperger’s Syndrome or something like it. He comes across as a socially inept college student who spends too much time playing World of Warcraft, except that he’s nearly at retirement age. One of the shirts he wore this week has a red biohazard symbol framed by the words “SOCIAL HAZARD–I WILL NOT CONFORM” and relevant biblical citations. This guy has one of the dorkiest T-shirt collections imaginable and drives the most unsightly Audi I’ve ever seen, a light red car with a gray replacement panel and another panel on which a patch of red has apparently been scraped away to reveal a light gray primer, as if the paint job was touched up by novice gang taggers.
    The really weird thing is that this car belongs to the only real gearhead in the family. But don’t worry, it’s only his final backup vehicle in case he has to sell the rest of his fleet, which has recently included two motorcycles and an F150. Just in the past week I learned for the first time, usually straight from the horse’s mouth, that he had bought the F150, three George Foreman grills, and a custom leather motorcycle seat. Consumer durable purchases that I knew of before included a label printer, an impressive array of cameras and lenses, several computers, a food-grade vacuum sealer (the other day, he insisted that it was better to repeatedly seal, open and reseal food with this device than to use Saran Wrap, as I was doing with a block of cheddar), and enough high-end audio equipment for a small professional recording studio. He was foreclosed out of his house a year ago because instead of paying down his mortgage he had taken out one line of home equity credit after another to buy all this shit. A few months later, he was evicted by a friend from church who had taken him in on an open-ended basis because he filled his own portion of the house with gadgets, then started letting crap spill over into public areas. Shortly after that, his girlfriend dumped him.

  412. Ixnei September 3, 2011 at 1:26 am #

    “Ahhh, Friday, the day of the week in which the sandwich board types being to populate the MB.”
    Begin? Ayup, reminds me of the Paris Metro circa ’83 – literally crawling outta da woodworkz, after 7PM…
    Not to mention 6969, and his clothing line that replaces skyscrapers to Saturn…

  413. AMR September 3, 2011 at 4:30 am #

    To follow up on the pool management story (the sociopath being the common denominator), here’s some dirt on the MBA program at La Salle, just down the 55 bus line from your old neck of the woods.
    The MBA program made the national wires a month or two ago when one of its star professors, Jack Rappaport, was suspended for giving students academic credit for attending a seminar at the Plymouth Meeting campus featuring a stripper roundtable discussion. There seemed to be four ethical problems at issue: that Rappaport had offered credit for an unauthorized seminar that had no bearing on legitimate coursework, that he had made students pay a fee to attend this seminar, that he had paid the strippers for their time without authorization, and the big one: strippers! Loose women who take off their clothes for money! God forbid!
    Here’s the thing: I twice sat in on classes with Jack Rappaport. The guy is crude and weird as hell, but he’s exceptionally aboveboard. He makes no effort to hide his true interests: strippers, horse races, betting, economic modeling and classical music. I shit you not. He simultaneously earned a BS in economics from Penn and a BA in violin performance from Julliard, and he hangs out in the underworld.
    As an indication of how popular he is on campus, I attended a classical recital that he and a cousin gave, with Jack on violin and his cousin on piano, both of them excellent musicians. This recital, which was advertised completely by word of mouth without so much as an informational flyer, filled a hundred-odd seat venue on something like a Wednesday afternoon at three. For quite a few in the audience it was the high point of the semester.
    There are good reasons to fire Jack, but also good reasons not to fire him. It’s practically impossible that the administrators didn’t know for decades how edgy he was; he is way, way out there, and totally unabashed. So it comes down to a cost-benefit analysis: do the costs of keeping him (bizarro first-person underworld tales, occasional shady curricula) outweigh the benefits (solid econ instruction, a very engaging lecturing style, a self-directed extracurricular program of classical music that dozens of young people adjusted their schedules to attend)?
    The ambient ethical environment at La Salle is extremely relevant to such an analysis. And let me tell you, that environment sucks. At least in the MBA program it does. I knew two foreign students, one of them fluent in English and the other barely able to speak it, who openly cheated during tests by speaking to each other in a normal tone of voice in their native tongue. Tellingly, I never heard any of their classmates complain that they were being unethical, although there may have been quiet, scrupulous students whose dismay I never heard. What I did hear was amusement at their exploits, presented as a highly entertaining, ultimately harmless sideshow.
    The student who couldn’t speak English twice tried to get me to effectively write papers for him. I flatly refused, telling him that I was glad to give him advice but that he had to write everything himself. At one point, I had to step away from the computer and tell him to take over the typing, because on the pretext of having me edit a draft he was sitting on his ass basically telling me to write the damn thing, and to hurry up because it was due in less than an hour.
    The topic of that paper was itself a Sweet-Jesus-on-a-Dinosaur moment: Watch the film “Gladiator,” then write an essay describing ways in which the protagonist shows leadership. I don’t give a damn what one’s colleagues are assigning; no self-respecting professor assigns fluff like that as master’s-level work. Period.
    The ESL student’s next paper at least wasn’t a joke. It was a research paper, of sorts, on an allegedly terrorist organization in the Middle East. Probably three quarters of the text consisted of large excerpts from a single published paper, but he quoted it properly, included citations and did the rest of the writing on his own, like a big boy. Final verdict: shitty, but basically ethical.
    I can’t say that Jack Rappaport is beyond the pale for an organization like La Salle. His musical activities are clearly edifying: unlike some of the coursework, his level of competence and love for the music can’t be faked. I can’t countenance the view that unbridled cheating, cake coursework and degree inflation are acceptable but ventures into the red light district are not. That’s one more institution whose judgment I have to take with a grain of salt.

  414. AMR September 3, 2011 at 5:11 am #

    Christ the Dread Judge is a pretty good summation of why I’m not a Calvinist. I can’t think of a time when I didn’t consider it a good idea to pray for mercy, not justice. Mercy is a virtue alien to Calvinism, although some Calvinists will say that it is not.
    Calvinists say a lot of astounding, ridiculous things. Jean Calvin was a radical who threw away a millennium and a half of apostolic tradition, yet I’ve known Calvinists who insist that they are part of an apostolic tradition as historically and theologically grounded as any. These people loudly proclaim sola fide and sola scriptura, declarations meant to consign the Catholic understandings of prayer for mercy, justification by works and holy tradition to the dustbin of history, yet they also say that Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy are highly valid forms of Christianity, exceeded only by hardline Reform theology.
    The weird thing is that I’ve known Calvinists for whom this is more than just Machiavellian politics; they actually believe it. The reverse rhetoric coming from Catholic leaders, on the other hand, I consider nothing but Machiavellian politics, its main purpose being to fight battles over abortion and, sometimes, other matters pertaining to sex. Regardless of its moral import, in point of fact the battle over abortion is being fought largely in the political arena, and the bishops know it.
    I have very little doubt that Catholics and Calvinists are merely foul-weather friends. Aside from an avowed faith in Christ, the only things they share are philosophical conservatism, sexual conservatism, and some scraps of liturgy. Their theologies and historical worldviews are polar opposites. Birds of a feather they are not.
    I don’t think Wicca is my thing. Paganism never resonated with me. Buddhism, perhaps, although that’s some heavy shit, so to speak. I did come pretty close to settling in at the United Methodist Church, but after I started spending time in Catholic and Orthodox churches, Methodist preaching started to seem flat, and the liturgy really flat. I’ll probably astound some Catholics by saying this, but I’ve come to be much more impressed with Catholic preaching than with the preaching at most Protestant churches. I’ve heard stories about Catholic priests who are useless as homilists, but I haven’t found any who really live up to the hype.
    As far as the impossibility of universal monastic virtue is concerned, it’s impossible to make such an enterprise work without loving the virtue. Hating the vice but not loving the virtue just makes for confusion, ambivalence and hypocrisy.

  415. happzcz52 September 3, 2011 at 5:35 am #

    On June 9, the HKSAR Government to auction two luxury residential plots, ultimately owned by Li Ka-shing’s Cheung Kong to HK $ 11.65 billion and HK $ 300 million respectively in the revenue of the two block SAC. Due to the auction block expensive, industry-consensus estimates before the auction is possible becomes the new King, Hong Kong, thus caused city-wide concern.
    On the afternoon of the auction scene, Hong Kong’s major developers Cheung Kong, Chinachem group, nanfeng, Sino Land, Wheelock, Kerry building, Chinese estates are all present. However, peoples attention on Hong Kong Island in mid-levels of borrett mansion block, failed to break the record auction price of HK $ 11.65 billion.
    Holder of the most expensive land in Hong Kong at the moment is with a March 1997 to HK $ won the plots of Sino land in Siu Sai Wan, Cheung scores ranked second for the auction. Wachovia Group Vice President Huang Jinkang reporter said after the auction, though mid block auction price lower than market expectations, but the luxury property market still has a positive effect on Hong Kong.
    According to the estimation of the auction price, prices of luxury flats in the urban area of Hong Kong over the coming years the annual increases of about 10%, while increases were at the mansion on the outskirts of higher, about 20% a year.
    Intense land auction on June 9, Elizabeth Sports Centre in Hong Kong, the developers put on one play. Mid borrett block shooting price of HK $ 9.5 billion, by Nan Fung holding a 16th first price, 5 persons took part in the auction. But later, mainly from the 26th issue of Cheung Kong Holdings and Sino Land, whose 18th competition, after 42 bids, eventually Cheung 11.65 billion Hong Kong dollars had been awarded to 22.6% higher than the asking price.
    Prior to that, markets estimated borrett road approximately HK $ 11.0152 trillion of the land auction price. Borrett plots of the original quarters of Hong Kong, can enjoy the sea views of Victoria Harbour, the land area of 113,000 square feet, with plot ratio of 3.86 times times, up to 435,000 square feet floor, feet an average price of HK $ 26,763, xujianzhong, low density mixed residential properties.
    First Pacific Davies said Chen Chaoguo, Managing Director, this is a rare luxury residential site in Hong Kong’s largest island, estimated completion in future priced at HK $ 33,000 to 35,000 per square foot. Block bidding in Ping Shan, Yuen Long are particularly intense shooting price of HK $ 130 million, there are 6 people to bid, bid 160, 26th, representatives of the Cheung Kong, licensing, and the 7th of the Chinachem group who took turns bidding eventually Cheung HK $ 300 million bid, 130% higher than the asking price.
    Previously, the market valued at HK $ 1.9 per cent. Chen Chaoguo, Ping Shan, Yuen Long site area of approximately 65,402 square feet of land plot, 1 time to plot ratio calculation, about 65,402 square feet floor. In price terms, that is, per square foot of floor price of about HK $ 4,587.
    Future development for the plain of low density residential properties, priced at HK $ 5,500 to 6,500 estimated feet.
    Victor Li said the same day, sold two plots are expected, plots the final transaction price reflects only the direct positive market conditions.
    Luxury continues to hot, in fact, Hong Kong’s luxury residential market has not cooled.
    Based on the information Research Department of Zhongyuan real estate, in May this year more than HK $ 12 million worth of property sale contracts were recorded in the register of 314 cases, total amount of HK $ 8.141 billion, HK $ 5.417 billion and 180 from April, had increased sharply and 74.4%, respectively.
    Luxury due to multiple developers in Hong Kong during the April sales new disc, so May a luxury hand trading following a six-month highs after 2010. In May and June, under the stimulus of the land auction, multiple developers in Hong Kong, jiahua international, such as Sun Hung Kai Properties, new world is gearing up to deploy sales luxury property projects. Centaline property Asia Pacific Managing Director Mr Chan told the reporter that, shoot the borrett massif 11.65 billion Hong Kong dollars, with the construction costs, each square in the future? NE numerous polder ru NI gives members of brick?
    Before they can obtain a reasonable profit. The last two years, people from the Mainland to Hong Kong to buy property there, Credit Suisse estimates that people on the Mainland in the first half of this year to buy Hong Kong a/f ratio will increase to 24.9% hand. Has recently been proposed to limit mainland people to buy flats, but the Central Plains, Group Managing Director Shih Wing Ching believes that, if Hong Kong is not a foreign investor buying property, property prices after the lost one of the important pillars, certainly cannot support.

  416. jackieblue2u September 3, 2011 at 5:43 am #

    Yes you are correct. Accuracy is important.
    They really are violent crazed sociopathic lunatics, who are ruining this neighborhood, and world. And they piss me the hell off !
    For some reason I was trying to tone it down, but yeah I didn’t describe them correctly.

  417. AMR September 3, 2011 at 5:56 am #

    I just came across another issue of “Guideposts.” Oooooh goody! I couldn’t find any particularly unethical ads–shit!–but there were some doozy stories. Like the one about a town in Alabama coming together over pie, complete with a pie recipe. And the story about the Army captain who used home leave to put on some more weight, get that slow-moving linebacker physique, and slick up his hair into something between a high-and-tight crew cut and a Mohawk. The family portrait showed him in this greasy ‘do next to his wife, a fat lady with a bright pink sort of Ken Burns bowl cut, and their young school-age son, who had a Hitler combover. Now, them thar’s some fine Americans, mein Fuhrer!
    From a literary perspective, though, the real keeper was the short-form memoir by the lady who somehow found a way to forgive her alcoholic brother-in-law for not following through on his promise to trim the blackberries. Because of this “last straw” of “betrayal,” she cut her fingers on the prickers and found herself bleeding in the oak scrub, yelling “Darn you, Steve! Darn you, Steve!”
    What a bowdlerized pile of shit. If that’s how she actually cursed at the reprobate, she’s whacked in the head. Actually, anyone who publishes shit like that without using an alias is whacked in the head. That’s the sort of writing that is only honorable when done by a mercenary. I might write garbage like that for money because it’s a riotously funny sort of insipidness. Just don’t put me on the food beat, or I’ll cover some disingenuous editor’s face with Jello salad.

  418. bubbleheadMarc September 3, 2011 at 5:59 am #

    Love your posts. Haven’t been commenting much of late because I’m stuck working 55 hours per week and don’t have a laptop with wifi to take to the barbershop to websurf in between brutal hack jobs.
    Yes, Calvinism is shit. Methodism is Arminianism, a reform of Calvinism which endorses free will as opposed to predestinarianism. Catholicism is far more sophisticated than either one of them. But Greek Orthodoxy is better than either. The problem with Orthodoxy is that they’re so fragmented along ethnic lines, clannish, and ossified in the retrograde orientation of constantly lamenting the demise of the Byzantine Empire. American converts to Orthtodoxy used to join the Antiochian Orthodox Church as it was the most progressive but then a massive wave of Arab immigrants starting demanding Arabic liturgies so that church has fallen into disfavor with converts.
    I hate to say it but I think you’d like Anglicanism the best, or what was called “Protestant Episcopal” until the ’80s when they simplified the brand to “Episcopal”. From a quality control standpoint I’ve found that they tend to have the best music, architecture, liturgy, and preaching, with a high percentage of their clergy educated at elite private institutions. But cradle Episcopalians have gotten pissed off at them for a variety of reasons such as sixty percent of their clergy currently being adult converts attracted to them perhaps owing to the relatively higher salaries they pay, although now that they’re so fractured their job opportunities are pretty much nil.
    But I now cast my vote for a sort of generic buddhism, as I’m convinced that it’s been demonstrated that Jesus never actually existed in any sort of literal or historical sense. I got these ideas from “The Pagan Christ” by Tom Harpur, and “The Jesus Mysteries” by Freke & Gandy. Both insist that the gospels are recycled Egyptian mythology, an idea picked up by Bill Maher in his documentary “Religulous”, and the evidence appears undeniable.
    There can be no doubt that Siddhartha Gautama, or Shakyamuni the Buddha, really did exist. After all, he was a nobleman, lived to a ripe old age, and had an extensive following during his own lifetime. He also made no outlandish claims for himself but merely taught that it was indeed possible to attain enlightenment. Orthodox Buddhism is bunk however, and to an equally absurd extent as Christianity. By Orthodox Buddhism I mean Theravadin as prevails in southeast Asia. Soto Zen Buddhism is the most congenial form of buddhism to me but is difficult to find outside of California. The temple closest to me is a Chinese lineage hybrid of Pure Land and Chan, attended exclusively by white people raised as Christians, although most of them are not the typical sort of aging hippies.

  419. Vlad Krandz September 3, 2011 at 1:10 pm #

    The Jews, a very historicaly oriented people, believe Christ existed. They gleefully take responsibility for his death in their secret books known as The Talmud. Of course they publicly deny it. Typical. Also typical, that Gentiles now believe them. Our Ancestors were made of sterner, better stuff. The Lutherans wont even publish Luther’s book, “The Jews and Their Lies”. Instead, these apostates devote themselves to “good works” like bringing violent, medevial, Muslim Somalis into the Midwest.
    Inability to believe in Conspiracies is a hallmark of Decadence.
    Face it, you don’t want Christ to exist. Forgive me, but I must say this is not only an error but a missing of the mark, a sin.

  420. Vlad Krandz September 3, 2011 at 1:13 pm #

    How do I order these fancy end of the world duds?

  421. Vlad Krandz September 3, 2011 at 1:15 pm #

    Just as I was about to fall into the pit, a hand grasped mine – it was the Hand of La Salle! The French have entered Toledo. The Inquisition is in the hands of its enemies.

  422. anti soak September 3, 2011 at 1:17 pm #

    Thanks…yes I know there are lotsa Somalis in Minnessota
    And JHK..can you ban the clothing merchants?
    No sooner do you ban Fabian then spam for clothing appears..fabians revenge?

  423. anti soak September 3, 2011 at 1:20 pm #

    And her Mom may have been a welfare witch and her Grandmom..No telling.
    Remember 50,000,000 are on foodstamps…
    Most I think because the jobs arent there.

  424. San Jose Mom 51 September 3, 2011 at 1:39 pm #

    Guideposts. I feel your pain.
    It reminds me of an incident of an aquaintence’s son who died of leukemia at the tender age of 6.
    Some lady–I’m sure she was doing her best to be of comfort–said to the mom, “God must have needed another angel in heaven.” THis paints a picture of a God that kills kids so he can have company in heaven.
    Guidepost subscribers probably imagine a God sitting on a cloud and keeping track of prayers. God thinks, “Hmmm, Betty got 72 prayers today. I guess I’ll cure her pnumonia.”
    That being said, we do pray in our family at dinner time. I consider it a small tool to expand awareness of suffering and to be grateful for the good in our lives. Thus we have free-form prayers–never the same.

  425. anti soak September 3, 2011 at 1:41 pm #

    Slavery was a absolute Fact Of Life through ALL of human history until the 1850’s
    Muslims in US have slaves…
    Slavery exists thru Africa..
    Clinton went to one of the worst slave owning black states and APOLOGIZED for slavery.

  426. Vlad Krandz September 3, 2011 at 1:51 pm #

    This is all half way house Liberal Christianity, a finger breadth away from atheism. The gloves come off, I must pound you for your (generic) Negro Worship. Read and be reprooved:

  427. Bustin J September 3, 2011 at 2:09 pm #

    A-mar said, “I’d like to … have a tryst with a nice, sensible Protestant gal but… this lady has a convoluted mesh of church and family ties.”
    A man’s prerogative in such situations is any species of lie, the white lie, the omitted truth, and my fav, the whopper. Any and all of these as the situation requires. All is fair in love and war.
    Take her out, get her drunk, accidentally end up back at your place, offer the back rub which turns into sex, and the day after, meet up with the church group or whatever and proudly exclaim that the both of you spent the evening in fervent and sober bible study and prayer. When she witnesses the raw power of your big fat lie she will go weak in the knees, deliriously happy to be with someone who knows how to handle the interface between personal and public life.
    This is all assuming that you care about her, that she is worthy of such, etc. And such worthiness will be exposed. For example, if she contradicts your whopper with the congregation, she exposes herself to be their vassal, incapable of acting on her own agency.
    But I would also strongly urge you to simply abandon such folly. People are generally tied powerfully to the habitual and ritualistic nature of their social habits and conventions. Its unlikely that she will exhibit any dynamism unless she previously possessed such.

  428. Buck Stud September 3, 2011 at 3:01 pm #

    “ For example, if she contradicts your whopper with the congregation, she exposes herself to be their vassal, incapable of acting on her own agency. “
    And in other situations there’s always the secret sign of the conspicuously absent wedding ring as proof of independent agency. One day, the seemingly committed married woman is making advances, although not overtly sexual, still intimate from the standpoint of personal space: the light brush of fabric on the arm or the touch of fingers on the hand; the longer than usual eye contact that is languidly terminated by fingers sensuously passing over lips to visually announce the missing wedding ring.
    Of course by the time Dumbo – the man – figures out that perhaps the flowers of May were offerings of temporal bloom, the never again vicissitudes of November will have sternly usurped the ambiance. And Dumbo will be left scratching his head and muttering some inanity about Venus, or even more likely, wondering where she found her wedding ring.
    Of course the wise man will play the role of Dumbo in a situation like this – it’s a win win: the man avoids a whole heap of trouble and grief and the woman gets to pretend she really is virtuous.

  429. Cash September 3, 2011 at 3:04 pm #

    Thanks for this Mont. I’m happy that you went there and I’m happy that those sites are being looked after.
    A while back there was a documentary series here called King and Country if I remember right. In it they recounted the experiences of a Canadian soldier named Will Bird who survived 3 years in the trenches in WW1 and went through some really dreadful fighting. He didn’t pass his luck onto his son though who was an officer in the Canadian infantry and was killed in France in WW2 the day after D-Day. When I heard that account I felt more sorry for poor old Will than his son. I think surviving was mostly a matter of blind luck.

  430. anti soak September 3, 2011 at 3:33 pm #

    No such thing as luck……cause and effect exists

  431. asoka. September 3, 2011 at 3:42 pm #

    Big government is good for small business:

    McClatchy reached out to owners of small businesses, many of them mom-and-pop operations, to find out whether they indeed were being choked by regulation, whether uncertainty over taxes affected their hiring plans and whether the health care overhaul was helping or hurting their business.
    Their response was surprising.
    None of the business owners complained about regulation in their particular industries, and most seemed to welcome it. Some pointed to the lack of regulation in mortgage lending as a principal cause of the financial crisis that brought about the Great Recession of 2007-09 and its grim aftermath.

    Republicans lie about “regulations” and “taxes” and “government” being bad for small business.

  432. Cash September 3, 2011 at 3:44 pm #

    Hi Pro,
    I wonder about people sometimes. The thundering denunciations you get about slavery and the subsequent treatment of black people seem to be from folks that are remarkably mute about their own and their ancestors treatment of American Indians.
    You know the old saying that when you point the finger at someone three point back at you. So when you’re condemned over your views on the South I wonder if it comes from people living quite nicely in green leafy prosperous neighbourhoods that used to be the abode of Indians whose ancestors lived there for 10-15 thousand years.
    And what about those Indians now? Marginalized and dispossessed. I don’t know about your Indian reservations but ours are third world shitholes out in the middle of nowhere.
    I cringe when I hear the righteous here screaming about Israeli treatment of Palestinians. To those people I would ask that they shut the fuck up because if they see fit to take up the cause of people in other countries other people might come nosing around this place and see what’s going on in our own back yard ie really bad stuff and a stain on our national honour. We have enough things cooking here to keep social activists busy for many lifetimes so leave people in other countries to their own devices.
    We made a small start in trying to right things. Harper, for all his faults, at least conjured up an apology from the House of Commons for some past wrongs committed against Canuck Indians which was something that past govts resolutely refused to do. Symbolic maybe but better than nothing.
    Is the situation of Indians on this continent hopeless? I would say not hopeless but a lot harder than it needs to be. As I’ve said in previous posts my elementary school principal was Indian. His kids were part of our neighbourhood gang. So it’s not impossible for Indians to have a decent chance here.

  433. asoka. September 3, 2011 at 5:28 pm #

    Keith Olbermann takes Obama to woodshed.
    Keith Olbermann is an objective reporter who takes on politicians regardless of party affiliation.

  434. xhalor September 3, 2011 at 5:52 pm #

    what about money?

  435. xhalor September 3, 2011 at 6:35 pm #

    Well, you sure as shit ain’t takin’ over Miami Territory, That was left for General Mad Anthony Wayne.

  436. xhalor September 3, 2011 at 6:46 pm #

    I really, really want you to contemplate the phrase “hunting humans”. I’ve had to do this. It’s taken me half an hour to respond to your post in way that doesn’t make me flip the fuck out.

  437. xhalor September 3, 2011 at 6:50 pm #

    Yo man. Thank you for thinking or our biology.

  438. trippticket September 3, 2011 at 7:14 pm #

    Cash, nice rant about the native genocide. I’m sure I’ll get charged with aspiring to be like the “noble savage” by someone for merely saying that what our ancestors did to them was beyond monstrous. I would bet that, if any natural wisdom remains in their culture, they might prove most adaptive in the years ahead of us. Good for them. I hope they are able to reacquire some of what was once theirs. Just like I hope Mexicans move into Asia’s garden;)
    Vegan: Indian word for “bad hunter.” Hehehe….

  439. trippticket September 3, 2011 at 7:25 pm #

    What I think is most important in this example, however, is the idea that we must not fall into the trap of thinking that we know best, that our beliefs are universal, and that we can get out of our mess by adhering to old doctrines. The colonists and pioneers were convinced that they were doing god’s will, that their actions were just, and that the natives actually were some sort of Homo indomitus, savages to be run out of town.
    We do a lot of that still these days, even if we now call our enemies Muslims, tree huggers, and fundamentalists, instead of Injuns and redskins. The pattern has subsided not at all in 500 years. Any chance we could all grow up one day?

  440. Vlad Krandz September 3, 2011 at 8:52 pm #

    He wants them to become just like us. He wants everyone to be the same – thus justifying his “metaphysic” that we’re all interchangeable. What a dreary view of life and one that leads to genocide. Why should Whites be preserved since Indians, Blacks, and Asians can become the new Westerners?

  441. trippticket September 3, 2011 at 9:09 pm #

    I assume you’re talking about Cash, because I believe nothing more than that people and languages and customs will diversify/balkanize as fast as the global system collapses. Whites will have theirs, as will blacks, and indians, and asians, and baptists, and catholics, and agnostics, and none will run monopolies over large swaths of the earth, probably ever again. Energy descent is a win for anyone who doesn’t pine for empire and globalization. You part of that group, Vlad?

  442. asoka. September 3, 2011 at 9:44 pm #

    “Why should Whites be preserved since Indians, Blacks, and Asians can become the new Westerners?”
    I think Whites should be preserved if they learn how to behave in a civilized manner. Westerners are inferior. They were dying of plague in their own Dark Ages when Chinese, Indian, and Islamic cultures were flourishing.
    Whites made up for their inferiority by inflicting violence upon the rest of the world through their systematic enslavement and colonization of non-white societies.
    We have no desire to become the “new Westerners.” Westerners have fucked up the world’s peoples and destroyed the world’s ecosystems through their completely immoral behavior. Westerners are the only people in the world to use atomic weapons against civilian population centers.
    The White record is nothing anyone should want to emulate. Whites cannot apologize enough for their barbarous behavior around the globe. Manifest Destiny indeed. Genocidal monsters! War mongers, murderers and slaveholders.
    Shame on you and your uncivilized “culture” that even today makes fun of vegans, tramples on millenarian religious values of ahimsa and love and bliss.
    Your so-called “western culture” reveals its ignorance and savageness through your customs like meat-eating. I have no concern though. Your karma is of your own making. Hare Krishna!

  443. San Jose Mom 51 September 3, 2011 at 9:55 pm #

    What do you call a militant vegan?
    Lactose intolerant.

  444. asoka. September 3, 2011 at 10:06 pm #

    Lots of WASPs gonna be surprised if they get to heaven and discover God is a chicken.
    Holy cow. Oh, I forgot. For you guys not so holy.

  445. asoka. September 3, 2011 at 10:08 pm #

    How many meat eaters does it take to change a lightbulb?
    None, they would rather stay in the dark about things.

  446. asoka. September 3, 2011 at 10:13 pm #

    What’s the best way to keep milk fresh?
    Leave it in the cow.

  447. asoka. September 3, 2011 at 10:21 pm #

    Tripp is a lacto-ovo-pesco-pollo-carne-vegetarian.
    Tripp didn’t fight his way to the top of the food chain to be a vegan!
    Look ’em in the eye. Slit their throats. Dress ’em and eat ’em. That’s how he does it. Right, Tripp?

  448. trippticket September 3, 2011 at 10:37 pm #

    Don’t forget “porcine.”
    Do what you want, I care not. I was just being funny!

  449. trippticket September 3, 2011 at 10:37 pm #

    Good stuff, Jen!

  450. trippticket September 3, 2011 at 10:47 pm #

    I assume your rant was intended for Vlad. Stop taking yourself so seriously. Your logic is certainly not without its share of flaws.

  451. AMR September 4, 2011 at 12:23 am #

    Great minds think alike. You hit a bunch of points that I’ve been considering, although I never thought about the efficacy of lying to the congregation in quite that manner. I much prefer discreet silence, anyway, and with this lady that’s not at all out of the question. This gal exercises an unusually large amount of free agency for a church lady, is pretty independent-minded, isn’t one to do much kowtowing and is, as you say, dynamic. These are among the things I like about her. I wouldn’t put it past her to rebuke the dirt-diggers and scolds with a blunt “mind your own fucking business.” Anyway, I’m playing it by ear and keeping all options open.
    It’s worth noting that the congregation in question doesn’t stand out as an epicenter of churchy fibbing. That honor apparently goes to the Full Gospel Tabernacle, where the wives look over their shoulders before scurrying for advice to the congregation’s only open psychologist. I’m not much interested in leading a double life with any of those ladies, not out of a sense of chivalrous honor but because I’ve dealt with Pentecostal ladies before and don’t care to do so again. A few years ago, when I attended the memorial service for a distant Pentecostal relative in the Poconos, the pastor offered to set me up with one of the single gals in his flock. I took a quick look around and realized that no amount of sexual receptivity was worth the trouble of interacting every day with people like that.

  452. AMR September 4, 2011 at 12:39 am #

    Hawt dayyum, that is cynical! Me likey!
    As far as the last paragraph is concerned, my plan in the event that I become Dumbo is to apply the Anne Sinclair standard: as long as she still seduces me…. Eh, “seduce” might be an exaggeration, but as long as there’s still a decent interpersonal dynamic and she allows me sloppy seconds from time to time, things are probably all right.
    There’s a big difference between slutty and bitchy. The two often coincide, but when they don’t the sex purity marriage counselors are totally nonplussed. As I see it, “ninety-nine problems, including a slut, but a bitch ain’t one” is pretty far from rock bottom in a marriage. Things can go very much worse. Cold monogamous celibacy looks like no picnic.
    Being Dumbo wouldn’t be my first time in a love triangle, either. There are minefields that I would much less like to navigate.

  453. AMR September 4, 2011 at 12:54 am #

    Reader’s Digest once ran a yarn to that effect, which I paraphrase here:
    A man came home early from a business trip to find his wife in bed, buck naked.
    “Hey, honey,” he asked her, “why are you still in bed at this hour? It’s almost one.”
    She sighed. “I don’t have anything to wear.”
    “That’s not true,” her husband replied, opening the door to her closet. “Look: you have a blue dress, a red dress–oh, hey Larry–a green dress.”

  454. Vlad Krandz September 4, 2011 at 1:21 am #

    You betcha! As Lao Tzu said, don’t even go over the hill – there’s nuthin to see. If you can’t make it here, you can’t make it anywhere.

  455. Vlad Krandz September 4, 2011 at 1:27 am #

    So why do the dark ones desperately try to get into our Lands? Because their own cultures are failures and shit holes. The White Man’s burden get ever heavier – the dark ones have no appreciation or gratitude. Brilliant White kids are sleeping in cars while Somali retards go to school to learn how to flush toilets and turn on the TV.
    We can’t shoulder you parasites much longer. You should have had some respect and honor. Instead yout tried to claim credit for our discoveries and ingnore our endless compassion and service to you – all the while bankrupting us with your brats and laziness.

  456. Bustin J September 4, 2011 at 3:18 am #

    $ said, “And what about those Indians now? Marginalized and dispossessed. I don’t know about your Indian reservations but ours are third world shitholes out in the middle of nowhere. ”
    Well, thats what you get for trading a couple squaws and skins for a piece of paper and a bottle of whiskey.
    In the US, tribal reservations have a sort of special economic dispensation and reservations are allowed latitude to sell goods duty free, otherwise illegal to possess or sell, or establish casinos, which many tribe shave done, that has generated a large amount of income for many tribes.
    As far as the existential wounds of native Americans, those feelings are bound up in what was lost- a way of life, and the rest of the territory that they believed could not be “owned” “bought” or “sold”.
    Trip sed, “Whites will have theirs, as will blacks, and indians, and asians, and baptists, and catholics, and agnostics, and none will run monopolies over large swaths of the earth, probably ever again.”
    Interesting perspective. Are you a southerner? From my perspective you leave out the “multicultural”… or just every enclave of heterogeneous people. And I’m thinking they might greatly outnumber the homogeneous enclaves. I don’t see how energy descent precludes large multi-A of cultural hegemony. For example, Welles will still be frying in that vat of South American poon-tang, where castes and colors intermingle. A turbulent Rocky Road pastiche of old and new world flavors with some Mennonite farming Jenks.

  457. Bustin J September 4, 2011 at 3:35 am #

    $ said, “And what about those Indians now? Marginalized and dispossessed. I don’t know about your Indian reservations but ours are third world shitholes out in the middle of nowhere. ”
    Well, thats what you get for trading a couple squaws and skins for a piece of paper and a bottle of whiskey.
    In the US, tribal reservations have a sort of special economic dispensation and reservations are allowed latitude to sell goods duty free, otherwise illegal to possess or sell, or establish casinos, which many tribe shave done, that has generated a large amount of income for many tribes.
    As far as the existential wounds of native Americans, those feelings are bound up in what was lost- a way of life, and the rest of the territory that they believed could not be “owned” “bought” or “sold”.
    Nowadays anybody and everybody is 1/64th Crow Siamese. I don’t see Injuns I see obese Asiatics in western drag. Fry bread is bread fried in oil- hasn’t anyone told them? They can’t hear the spirit of the wind because they can’t catch it climbing a flight of stairs. Poor motherfuckers- everybody envies them because they’re Natives. From here it looks like being made into a cartoon character, for reproduction on t-shirts, souvenirs and plastic trash. All the tribal officers look like house niggers to me, too. Something is sublimely ridiculous about a vest made of bone over a three-piece suit. They have Christian names and bust their teens for smoking the sacred pipe.
    The dynamics of cholera weren’t subtle. The die-off left vast tracts of land indefensible. The westward expansion was into virgin territories. Why the fuck would a post-modern injun want their fields back? Its got a drill rig parked in the middle and the river is a Superfund site.
    Fukushima Daiichi is a preview of the future: where everyone becomes the poor dumb injuns living in a superfund site within a reservation, probably run by a troll-like house nigger caste of petty bureaucrats.

  458. Eleuthero September 4, 2011 at 4:23 am #

    AMR said:
    The ambient ethical environment at La Salle is extremely relevant to such an analysis. And let me tell you, that environment sucks.
    La Salle’s ethical environment is being mirrored
    all over the nation. Most English teachers at
    the college where I taught said that it was
    obvious that around 70% of the papers were lifted
    directly from the Web, often so artlessly that
    they got caught.
    Here comes my mantra again … it’s a BEAR
    MARKET IN CONSCIENCE … worldwide!!!! Why
    should education be any different than banking
    or software (which has become the ultimate
    scam-artist field) or biotech?
    It used to be that “only” 90% of everything was
    bullshit but that 10% was sacred and vital to
    the continuation of civilization. Now, we’re
    in an era when 99.9% is bullshit. The human
    race is curving asymptotically toward … ZERO!

  459. ozone September 4, 2011 at 9:20 am #

    …Speaking of bullshit and bullshitters, I think it’s important to know who pulls the strings (and the pud) of Puppet Perry. Beware of Texans bearing “principles” and “ideas”.

  460. progress2conserve September 4, 2011 at 10:53 am #

    Nice post, Cash –
    Here’s my favorite part:
    “So when you’re condemned over your views on the South I wonder if it comes from people living quite nicely in green leafy prosperous neighbourhoods that used to be the abode of Indians whose ancestors lived there for 10-15 thousand years.”
    Yep, you are absolutely 100% correct!
    Even if y’all do spell “neighbourhoods” funny.
    It’s mind-boggling that all of the AMAZING brutalities of thousands of years human history can be ignored by folks who devote their entire focus to approximately 80 years of black chattle slavery – in the American South, between the ratification of the US Constitution and the end of the American Civil War.
    Truly mind boggling.
    What’s even worse is how this American Fixation, on these 80 years – leads to incredibly bad National policy on immigration and a few other social policies – (drug law enforcement, social welfare and child support laws are on the short list, here)
    Basically – FEAR OF BEING CALLED RACIST – stifles necessary public debate, and drives some really dumb decisions.

  461. progress2conserve September 4, 2011 at 11:16 am #

    “Christianity is Ascetic and most people aren’t, can’t be even if they wanted to be. It should never have tried to impose this kind of morality (of monks) on Everyone.”
    Yes, Vlad, I agree with you here. I’ve posted on this before, but it’s worth elaborating.
    There’s evidence that Jesus the Christ, Himself, was not terribly “ascetic.” The early church fathers, though, used the blunt instrument of the – VERY ASCETIC – Apostle Saul/Paul, to convert Christianity into an instrument of social control.
    And – this Pauline Christianity does not fit the genetics of the Pagan peoples who were the ancestors of White Western Man.
    And – any sort of ascetic religion – is not going to work as well in times of material abundance.
    So – Psychic Energy that should have been channeled into living and loving well – instead went into the angry proselytizing drive for Colonial Empire, and then into the US Neo-Conservative’s desire to make global policy using the blunt instrument of the US military.

  462. Vlad Krandz September 4, 2011 at 12:24 pm #

    So if Jesus Christ was wrong then He wasn’t the Son of God. So therefore you (we) are not Christians.
    The idea that Christ was married or had the hots for Mary Magdelene is an old Gnostic/Jewish slander – endlessy resurected by their Media attack dogs like Elaine Pagels in her books or the movie, The Last Temptation of Christ.
    Don’t try to put it all on Saul/Paul. Christ said if you even look on a woman with lust you have sinned. This is a high religion for the few. Everyone to become a Saint? Jesus Christ God – what do you want? You threw me in the ocean and then asked me not to get wet!

  463. Vlad Krandz September 4, 2011 at 12:33 pm #

    Agree. The Indians are doing just as good as anyone. They don’t REALLY want to go back to that – whatever THAT was or as if it was really possible anyway. When the collapse comes and chaos reigns, they with their kinship systems, rural way of life, and tribal police will do better than most.
    Yes they are the poorest group in America. So what – as you say, they have welfare and too much to eat.

  464. Buck Stud September 4, 2011 at 1:27 pm #

    May I remind you that all of this week’s slavery talk was a direct result of Vlad’s link featuring a review/critique/screed of a movie portrayal of the post-slavery South in the latter part of Jim Crow. Now, in an apparent attempt to absolve “ Johnny Reb Slaveowner” of horrendous acts of human and economic barbarity – ‘hey, who knows what any of us might have done in similar circumstances and had we had the means to own slaves, so let us not judge’ – you eagerly grasp Cash’s conflated offering of historical equivalency . Maybe Mr. Steele is onto something regarding “moral and cultural relativism” after all, eh Prog?
    After posting paragraph after paragraph of the aforementioned, you beg off when asked to provide your own thoughts on the critique that Vlad posted; the very critique that instigated the entire topic in the first place. (And along the way that goofy baboon formerly known as Asia has a tender moment in which he massages the ego of poor, old, marginalized Vlad – the poster boy of the fragile albino suffering the presence of those in the light.)
    You evade, dance, convolute, obfuscate; you’re Mr. Periphery Man, the great dissimulator unable and unwilling to face the core. You have, if I might observe, the makings of a very good politician.

  465. BeantownBill September 4, 2011 at 2:58 pm #

    You musta been in a very bad mood when you wrote up this post, Asoka. Despite listing correct points about the undesirability of our western civilization, as a whole your comments seem very disingenuous.
    The bad things of which you speak are human traits, not just westerners’. Tibetan monks rode roughshod over the citizenry in the 1800’s; Indians’ treatment of the untouchables was horrible; Muslim fundamentalists’ treatment of women (particularly in Saudi Arabia) is abominable; African leaders sold their citizens into slavery to Americans in the 1700’s and 1800’s; don’t forget the killing fields of Cambodia. The point is, just don’t rag on westerners, rag on humans if you must.
    We are a bloody, predatory species, and violence and inhumanity are rampant throughout the world.

  466. Bustin J September 4, 2011 at 3:30 pm #

    Must we dwell on the certainties of the past? It is poor sport.

  467. myrtlemay September 4, 2011 at 4:15 pm #

    I think you’ll find that Asoka is in a bad mood most of the time. You have to read between the lines of what he says. Upon close examination, I find his arguments to be inconsistent at best and inflamatory at worst. An example – he often spouts off on how the entire citizenry of the world should be able to join hands, embrace, and sing “Koombya” together, when a simple glance at the history of the modern world – take 1600 to today, as an example. Tribal groups in Africa were famous for ritualistic brutality toward many of its members who were accused of stepping out of what consisted of “acceptable behavior”. More than fifty years after the Norman Conquest, Eleanor of Aquitaine did her damndest to wipe out the Muslim population.
    As Cash said in not so many words, we humans are a collective bunch of rotten eggs, irrespective of color, creed, or national identity. And maybe because of this or despite this, humans have also done magnificent things, often under the directon of “god” or some similar positive driving force. I suspect that only age allows one to have gained such a perspective of how humans operate on a primal level. Either Asoka does not have this number of years/experience, or he chooses not to embrace it. The former can be forgiven. The latter cannot, in my opinion.

  468. AMR September 4, 2011 at 4:20 pm #

    Your broad thesis about the worldwide bear market in conscience is consistent with what I’ve observed in the world at large, but in spite of my screed against La Salle I don’t consider academia a very reliable gauge of ethical trends. I have anecdotal evidence that a number of schools, including prominent, prestigious ones, have had truly atrocious ethics through thick and thin, even at times when the ethics of society at large have been fairly strong.
    Take Harvard. Am I just imagining that the faculty and student body there are mindlessly devoted to high-hatting ninety percent of the United States and all but maybe half a dozen neighborhoods in Massachusetts? This disgusting attitude has been entrenched since at least the Gilded Age, when new money students sandpapered their Crimson Tide football sweatshirts in order to get that casually tatty, lived-in old money look (still, let’s look on the bright side: these insecure high-hatting victims had that old can-do DIY American spirit; they didn’t need Honduran garment workers to prestress their clothes!).
    It says something that these insufferable snobs, whose noxious, hateful attitudes beg for a plebeian beatdown from all quarters, have actually been accepted, if not actively recruited, for positions of national leadership. The proper response to such people is to tell them to fuck off and come back after they’ve come across a shred of gratitude for the people who keep Boston from being completely squalid and dysfunctional. Instead, their privileged bigotry, nepotism and cronyism are regarded as “good breeding,” allegedly an asset in “public service.” This is why the Kennedy clan, a rather trashy, reckless and cruel family that would otherwise have been local mobsters in Boston, are now “American royalty.” All they had to do was ape and brownnose the gentry for a time. That, and have money; admission ain’t free.
    My point is that this snobbery, whose acceptance bears very ill witness to American morals, is not a newfangled vice.
    Here’s another lovely bit of hypocrisy: the Ivy League, an athletic conference, doesn’t sully itself with anything as crude and anti-intellectual as the athletic scholarship. Fight fiehcely, Hahvahd, but only with scholar-athletes! That’s why low-IQ meatheads who are ready for some football get academic scholarships to Cornell, proceed to fail all courses but typing (D is for diploma), get expelled on academic grounds, and then get academic scholarships to play football (I mean, to study) at Penn the next year. Maybe I shouldn’t have put it in the present tense, but I do know that that sort of thing was commonplace in the ’60s, when my mom was an undergraduate at Cornell and tutored exactly whom I described; dude wasn’t the only one in his class, either.
    The deliciously futile thing is that I can’t think of any friends in Philadelphia who give a rat’s ass about Penn football. A lot of these people are avid Philadelphia sports fans who get really invested in ‘Nova basketball during March Madness, but I don’t think I’ve ever heard a peep from them about Penn athletics, or those of any other Ivy League school. I don’t follow Ivy League athletics closely enough to say for sure, but I get the feeling that the indifference is because the teams suck (damn straight that’s why the Astrodome is so empty, in any event). Ivy League athletics, especially football, have the look of a mediocre dog-and-pony show for wealthy donors, a vaguely sick joke played on gullible loyalists while savvy people who like the game follow Penn State (I’ve had enough experience with idiotic Penn State fans and dissolute living in State College to tune out that menacing scrum of bruisers when they hit the gridiron).
    Some caution is probably in order when discussing the increase in plagiarism. In the pre-digital age, an important fringe benefit that fraternities marketed to unscrupulous recruits was access to their private archives of stock papers. Those who bought into a frat and took whatever God-awful abuse it dished out earned rights to copy wholesale whatever they wished from the library and turn it in to unwitting (or, probably more often than most academics would like to think, witting) professors. Frats also helped their brothers arrange class schedules full of cake courses taught by unscrupulous professors. Rate-your-professor and paper mill sites have made these services free and open-source, putting fraternities through the same digital wringer as the newspapers (except that the frats badly deserved it). Online paper mills obviously make plagiarism much easier, but they also make it much easier to detect.
    That said, current ethics among American students are horrendous. The real solution to plagiarism isn’t technological but cultural, and hoo-boy, that’ll be a bitch to effect.

  469. myrtlemay September 4, 2011 at 4:26 pm #

    When I mentioned Eleanor of Aquitaine, I couldn’t help but remember the Katharine Hepburn movie, I think called “Lion in Winter” I also remember her in the movie were she plays a virginal prig in “The African Queen”. There is a scene where Humphrey Bogart responds to her complaints about his vulgarisms being only “human nature”. To which Hepburn, chin stuck out, nose in the air replys, “Nature is something we are placed on this Earth to rise above.” Sorry for the ramblings. It happens some times with me.

  470. BeantownBill September 4, 2011 at 4:29 pm #

    Personally, I’m sick and tired of seeing posts about racism, slavery, detailed descriptions of the foibles of various Christian denominations and discussions about characteristics of the Jews, in a stand-alone context. Given that this is a peak resource site, these postings don’t contribute to the dialogue.
    But I felt that Asoka’s post is relevant to the CFN milieu. Since “the West” is a major driver of world events, discussing its traits can yield insights into the possible nature of future SHTF scenarios. With this as a basis, it then becomes necessary to develop a balanced view of the rest of the world w.r.t. the West. This is why I posted about past events.

  471. BeantownBill September 4, 2011 at 4:32 pm #

    I agree.

  472. BeantownBill September 4, 2011 at 4:42 pm #

    “The Lion in Winter” was released in 1967 – I saw it in a movie theatre because it starred Hepburn and Peter O’Toole. They put on an acting clinic that should be de rigeur in acting classes.
    “The African Queen” (1951) is a wonderful movie. I’ve seen it several times. I always loved Bogie.

  473. myrtlemay September 4, 2011 at 4:42 pm #

    Cheating at Bryn Mawr was fairly common for the rich girls. Crib notes were written on everything from Bobby socks to shoe soles. It wasn’t uncommon for girls to wear white, long sleeved shirts to scribble on the inside of sleeves come final exam time. Mathematic and chemistry equations that should have been memorized were delicately recorded rather than studied had these girls actually paid attention in class.
    Almost none of the middle class kids there (like me) cheated, because we would not have even been there if we hadn’t proven that we had a great deal of brains to begin with (and a partial/full scholarship.) It amazed me even then to see the incredible waste of money rich parents spent sending their children to school when a majority of them (certainly not all) were there to pass the time, socialize, party, and husband hunt – no easy task during the war years.

  474. BeantownBill September 4, 2011 at 4:54 pm #

    Harvard Square in the mid to late ’60’s was what I’d call the Haight-East. It fit in so wonderfully with the times. I’d go every Sunday to walk in Cambridge Commons. Today everything has been bricked over, with typical shopping mall retail outlets. A real shame.
    What I have against Harvard is its economy curricula. While I despise the snobbery, I can live with it. But knowing that many Harvard MBAs put their Harvard economy professors’ theories to work, and were major contributors to the current Wall Street mess, that I can’t abide.

  475. myrtlemay September 4, 2011 at 4:55 pm #

    I cannot think of any movie Bogie made that I didn’t like. He made it all look so easy, just like Spencer Tracy. I’ve read books about Hollywood’s golden age and one thing I remember is that actors routinely joked that they all equally had a love – hate relationship with Tracy. They loved the guy, but hated the fact that he moved around on screen so effortlessly.
    I usually enjoy watching Hepburn, unless she resorts to her “mannerism” acting, something so many great actresses of her day often (to their discredit) did. That being said, she sure knew how to capture an audience’s attention while on screen.
    A week or so ago I was watching on TCM “His Girl Friday”, starring Cary Grant and Rosalind Russell. They just don’t write dialogue like that anymore …sigh!

  476. myrtlemay September 4, 2011 at 4:58 pm #

    Interesting (to me) aside is that Kate Hepburn was a graduate of Bryn Mawr. Many, many moons before me, however.

  477. San Jose Mom 51 September 4, 2011 at 4:59 pm #

    Very thoughtful post AMR. I don’t understand the draw of college sports. I have had an aversion to jock/frat types since I was 15. In college, I was asked to tutor a BYU football player in biology. I declined because I was taking 20 units, and I didn’t have any desire to deal with stupid jocks. This was a LONG time ago….back when Jim McMahon was quarterback for BYU.

  478. myrtlemay September 4, 2011 at 5:03 pm #

    Some of my college co-eds were amazed that no one ever came to our basketball games. Go figure!

  479. Buck Stud September 4, 2011 at 5:39 pm #

    Bill writes:
    ” We are a bloody, predatory species, and violence and inhumanity are rampant throughout the world.”
    So burn the history books – why stop there, just abolish the discipline of history altogether; the futility of the human condition is one constant repeat, thus, all human acts are morally indistinguishable from each other, past, present, and future – because they all tell the same story of war, conquest, and bloodshed. And assertions such as the below should stand uncontested, after all, this is the way it’s always been and always will be. From Vlad’s posted website:
    ” The Help illustrates this perfectly. Jews, the most liberal segment of the population, took over the movie industry by the 1920s, and although it was held in check for a while as a result of pressure from religious and patriotic groups, it wasn’t long before Hollywood began its march to the left in tune with the rest of the Jewish community. Today the victory is complete. All eight major movie studios have a Jewish CEO, (The Help is from Steven Speilberg’s Dreamworks), and all are predictable exponents of liberal “message” movies. Left-wing psychological conditioning is, and for a long time has been, the secret agenda behind Hollywood movies. ”
    So there you have it, Bill. We’re all the same really (except for those ingenious, diabolical Jews who are manipulating the less gifted and impressionable white folk [according to Vlad and film critic] via their liberal film exploits.)

  480. Buck Stud September 4, 2011 at 6:05 pm #

    I wonder what ” Left-wing psychological conditioning” entails? Is it to empathize and recognize the historical plight of certain segments of the population? Is it a concern for the present health care system, and the escalating costs of ever-more unaffordable insurance ( oh fuck that, it’s all collapsing anyway; besides, only socialists entertain such concerns)? Is it to militate against ” moral and cultural relativism “?

  481. BeantownBill September 4, 2011 at 6:07 pm #

    “So burn the history books…..”
    I think you are leaping to conclusions, Buck. I do stand by my conclusion about our nature. But I never said we’ll be stuck that way forever. My fondest hope is that we will mature as a species someday and transcend ourselves. History always has been and should continue to be a great teacher.

  482. asoka. September 4, 2011 at 6:57 pm #

    “all human acts are morally indistinguishable from each other, past, present, and future – because they all tell the same story of war, conquest, and bloodshed.”
    This is such a blatant grand generalization it borders on misogyny.
    Are you not familiar with the empire ruled by Ashoka in India? Ashoka was a sacred administrator who took a deep interest in foreign policy, religious tolerance, the administration of justice and humanitarian affairs. He is credited with starting one of the first hospitals in human civilization. He extended his concern not only to the realm of human beings, but also to animal life and the environment.
    We have not yet caught up to the enlightened rule of Ashoka. Ashoka was not a promoter of what some on CFN call “vapid spirituality” … Ashoka was not a dreamer who had no knowledge of the “real world” … Ashoka was a mass murderer, a conqueror, a man of war, who abandoned the path of violence and was transformed into one of the greatest humanitarians of his age.
    We could sum up the story of Ashoka with a single line from one of his edicts: “The sound of the drum has been replaced by the sound of the Dharma.”

  483. AMR September 4, 2011 at 7:04 pm #

    At least he wasn’t a pedophile, so the kids were safe. Snork snork.
    Sorry, I couldn’t resist.
    One time when I was headed to the shore with a group of my Philly drunks, one of them pointed out the window and said, “Look at that–he’s hung like a horse!” My response: “He IS a horse!” This same friend called me from Cape May on another occasion to say that his family and pretty much everyone else on the promenade in front of the Congress Hotel was staring at a pair of copulating pigeons on the roof. Lovely. Yet another reason to go out of my mind after more than eight waking hours at a stretch in Cape May, in case the pervasive saccharine Victorian sentimentality isn’t enough.
    One final nasty anecdote: Humboldt County has its own animal husbandry cult, the Council of the Sacred Horse. Its leader presides over ceremonies marrying other women to their horses. For reasons that I can’t quite comprehend, this lady hung out at the family church for a while, apparently without being counseled for sheer weirdness, and successfully glommed onto my grandmother, who at one point said that the horse whisperer “loves me more than anyone.”
    Some people need to get a date with a member of their own species.

  484. asoka. September 4, 2011 at 7:07 pm #

    Beantown’s is such a blatant and grand over-generalization, it borders on misanthropy

  485. San Jose Mom 51 September 4, 2011 at 7:10 pm #

    I played on a church girls basketball league, but it was very low-key (and low-scoring!) and we had fun. No one every got hurt–physically or emotionally. I played tennis in high school and college–but not on any league. Just batted the ball back and forth with friends. The only “sport” I’ve been injured in is hatha yoga. I did something bad to my knee, so I quit.
    On the other hand, my sister-in-law, is crazy for sports. She had an athletic scholarship at Oregon for volleyball. She totally messed up BOTH her knees–torn ACLs. Every ten years or so she gets a knee replacement and she’s only 50. She’ll be wheelchair bound by the time she’s 65. Her daughter (15) plays basketball in NORTH CAROLINA. It’s very competitive and last year she got a concussion and had to spend the night in the hospital. She was on the bench for weeks.
    I don’t know why they let her continue. Seems too dangerous to me–concussions are serious.

  486. myrtlemay September 4, 2011 at 9:14 pm #

    There are so many stories I could share with you about my once beloved Cape May. I’d be willing to bet that in some way, shape, or form, you’d at least know some of the old family names as I. The “characters” of the town seem like a distant dream to me now, so many years later.
    What I know about Cape May isn’t a lot. Before the Depression, it was a playground for the rich and upper, upper middle class. My family owned a huge summer place there on 32 Jackson Street. It is now turned condo, and they chopped up my magnificent old Queen Anne victorian into little slip-shod, “pseudo victorian suites”, that it bears little resemblence to the grandeour I recall as a youth.
    Mind you, as I have stated, my family was very much middle class. To have a vacation home in Cape May was not in any way shape or form the same status as having one in, say, Avalon, or Stone Harbor. Still, a lovelier spot I cannot remember. I’ve traveled extensively throughout my life, and sitting on that wrap-around front porch was the very essence of being in my youth. I remember crying my eyes out for being jilted the first time on that front porch as a pre-teen. Amos and Andy was playing on the old Philco in the living room…This was to be but one and only one in a series of lessons I’d learn about men in the ensuing 70 plus years…but I digress.
    Not that anyone freaking cares, but you can probably find my family’s old summer haunt by googling “The Puffin Cape May”. And so it goes.

  487. myrtlemay September 4, 2011 at 9:26 pm #

    In regard to my last post, many CFN’ers out there probably didn’t grow up in middle class burbs as I did. The houses all had front porches (pretty much) and all were rather close to the street. You could literally smell your neighbor’s breath by hanging over the front porch too far. And believe you me, Mrs. Smith knew every last thing that went through or past your front door. She and Mrs. Jones discussed what went on in your (and everyone else’s) home even before YOU knew it! All this over crocheting and needlepoint! When I later married and moved to the more distant suburbs, I thought I had escaped this sort of nosiness. I was wrong.

  488. asoka. September 4, 2011 at 10:30 pm #

    As Timothy Leary once said, when asked about Nancy Reagan’s “Just Say No” campaign:
    “It should be ‘Just Say No Thank You’! It’s terrible how they don’t teach good manners any more!”

  489. lpat September 4, 2011 at 10:41 pm #

    It is such a tired cliché among southern apologists to try to deflect guilt from the south by talking about the north’s sins, complicity, labor practices, &c., &c. Even if you’re twice the bastard I am, how does that make me any less a bastard?
    Slavery and Jim Crow depended entirely on terrorism, on organized, regular, systematic violence and brutality. Good people in the south. Sure. So what? Living in such a system requires complicity. Shut your mouth. Go along to get along. The best men and women in the world are going to be tainted living in that environment.
    The history and worldwide nature of slavery are irrelevant to the American argument. The moral consensus regarding slavery had shifted against it in the English-speaking world and much of the rest of the West in the years before the Civil War. The Friends and other abolitionists re-pointed the world’s moral compass; they moved true north. The south, however, would not be moved. The cost in blood and pain—to this day—is incalculable. Nothing can erase or excuse that.
    Like so many before you, you argue the south would’ve eventually ended slavery. When? One generation? Two? Three? “History is not your therapist.” It was the south that forced that moral choice on the rest of the nation at that precise moment in time. Not the other way ‘round.
    BTW, my credentials as a southerner are as pure and lily white as yours.

  490. asoka. September 4, 2011 at 10:53 pm #

    “Slavery and Jim Crow depended entirely on terrorism, on organized, regular, systematic violence and brutality.”
    Thank you for repeating this, but I’m afraid a racist like ProCon cannot hear it, nor understand the depth of American terrorism in the South.
    ProCon admits his ancestors were racist slaveholders, but they were not evil according to ProCon. He rationalizes and justifies slavery because it was “normal” (even though an anti-slavery movement existed contemporaneous with ProCon’s slaveholder ancestors.

  491. Vlad Krandz September 4, 2011 at 10:53 pm #

    So are you claiming that the Jews don’t control Hollywood? Or do you think it just doesn’t matter? If the first case, you’re a naif. In the second, you’re a fool who shouldn’t be allowed to vote.

  492. Buck Stud September 4, 2011 at 10:54 pm #

    I should have posted the [sarcasm on] qualifier, but I thought it was apparent that I was being facetious. On the other hand, if I was another poster I sure wouldn’t go out of the way to decipher my often times ridiculous posts 🙂

  493. Vlad Krandz September 4, 2011 at 11:02 pm #

    You’re missing his point: why isn’t equal time given to the Negro role as Slaver owners and merchants in Africa? And why don’t you people care about the slavery that’s still going on over there in some places and in parts of Islam? Your “concern” is a hate whitey trip – otherwise you would care just as much or more since these things are still going on. But you don’t and stand indicted by your own negligence.

  494. myrtlemay September 4, 2011 at 11:04 pm #

    I hereby dedicate the following oldie to all of you CFN’ers out there still posting, reading, or whatever: The Tokens – The Lion Sleeps Tonight. Give it a try. Sorry I can’t supply the link. You can Youtube it, if you wish. Worth the effort, I think. Cheers to all! MM

  495. Buck Stud September 4, 2011 at 11:10 pm #

    ” Brilliant White kids are sleeping in cars while Somali retards go to school to learn how to flush toilets and turn on the TV.”
    Nonsense. No, worse than nonsense: an out and out treacherous lie.
    Not that hardworking, studious Somali’s aren’t going to school, or that brilliant white kids aren’t ” sleeping in their car”.
    But show me one white kid who has been held back or marginalized because of a Somali student and I’ll show you the second coming of Vlad Krantz in the full splendor and regalia of white victim hood.
    Sorry Vlad, the alleged ‘by thy own boot strap’ ethos of hard core American capitalism doesn’t tolerate weenies and whiners blaming the other guy for their own shortcomings and failures.
    Didn’t Glen Beck teach you this?

  496. Ixnei September 4, 2011 at 11:40 pm #

    “… militant vegan? Lactose intolerant.”
    Not sure how I could go more than about 3-4 shots of hard liquor, without chowing down on some extra sharp cheddar!!! Not sure I really want to go back to beer, and that yeasty digestion…
    Q must be all beside-himself – what with the flaming me for taking a 10% penalty to withdraw my 401k “cash reserves,” as his market cratered that exact amount (whose prediction?). I put a huge chunk into solid silver (*YUMMY*), and it’s gone from 38 to 42 or more?!…
    I loved how all the 6969/sales poasts were deleted, up until about *5:35AM*. Apparently, still can’t ban the IP.

  497. myrtlemay September 5, 2011 at 12:10 am #

    Sometimes, but certainly not all or even most of the time, I wish I knew what the fxck you were talking about, you over-inflated egoistic bastard. And you’re welcome. The complement was well-deserved.

  498. anticapitalistcharley Septemb