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Intermezzo

      Unless your mobile home was blown all over the county on opening day of the tornado season, this must seem like an interlude of reassuring normality in the world’s convulsive wendings. The IED known as Greece has not quite yet exploded, loud as all the graveyard whistling that emanates from Europe might be. Even the invocation of a “credit event” by the notorious ISDA has seen a first-stage payout of a few mere billions – though you’ve got to believe that this is some kind of stage-managed dumb-show designed to conceal the fact that the whole credit default swap racket is a network of frauds. 
     Where I live, in the uppermost Hudson Valley, the peace and tranquility of the moment is overlaid by sweet spring zephyrs arriving about a month early. I hope that doesn’t portend weeks on end of 90-degree summer heat, but I have the consolation of not being in Texas, where that would be more like three straight months of 100-degree-plus heat. It must get tedious running in and out of the a.c.
     My gardening schemes which fermented all winter are finally going into action. Yesterday, I banged together the first two of ten raised beds arrayed geometrically in a forty-eight foot square foot formal vegetable and herb garden. I’ve done it before on a smaller scale at a different house in a different time when nobody except the clinically paranoid expected the collapse of civilization. I’m going to put in a not-so-formal patch of corn-squash-and beans outside of that in the manner of the people who lived here a thousand years ago, really just to see how it works, and I may also plant a monoculture patch of potatoes elsewhere.
     The “back forty” awaits the arrival of twenty fruit trees – mixed apple, pear, cherry, plus blueberry, raspberry and current shrubs – and two blight-resistant American chestnuts (not absolutely guaranteed blight-free). A mighty effort has been made over recent decades by valiant arborists to restore the American chestnut. It was this tree (Castanea dentate) which made the forests east of the Mississippi so prolific with game in the time before clocks arrived in North America. My back forty used to be huge lawn, with an above-the-ground pool decorating the middle of it. The pool is gone, thank you Jeezus. I’ll start with this set of fruit and see how they take to the soil here, and if they get going well I’ll get twenty more next year. It could add up to a really immense amount of fruit for one household. There’s always cider….
    Altogether I have about an acre-and-a-quarter of already clear land to experiment with. The rest is woodlot. The woods will require a lot of grooming and brush-hogging to get decades of “trash” out: rampant honeysuckle, Virginia creeper, box elder. There’s a lot of good hardwood in there otherwise, and I built a saw-jack set up to cut stove lengths. There’s enough in there to be self-replenishing with careful management. The house I bought last fall has a fireplace with a stove insert. The builder insulated the shit out of the place. The chain saw is off in the shop getting its battered old chain replaced. I have to learn how to sharpen the damn thing now. Cutting firewood is where you get a really vivid sense of the power embodied in gasoline. A couple of gallons will get next season’s supplementary supply laid in. In the past, and probably, in the future, this is a job that would be nearly impossible to do by yourself. 
     These days, except for highway repair and oil-drilling, there are few outdoor activities that require a gang of men working together. In the years ahead, household composition is going to change hugely for many reasons. It’s unusual these days to have a lot of children – considering population overshoot, it seems crazy to promote that – but people with something to offer in the way of skills and labor may have to join forces just to get the necessary day’s work done together. I’m sure that will have its consolations, even if it means you don’t get to have a 3,500 square foot house to yourself.
     The deer-fence installer just submitted his estimate. It was an eye-opener, but it has to be done and it’s a one-time thing. I could have done it myself in a half-assed way with plastic netting but this is not a time for half-assed measures. My place is like a petting zoo, there are so many deer on and around it. Left open, they would ravage anything I grow like locusts. And they had the easiest winter in memory – no snow on the ground all January and February, something nobody around here has seen before. Here it is March and they are still looking plump and ready to pop out lots of healthy babies. So I have to put a fence up around the garden and orchard part of the property, with gates into the woodlots. The fence has to be eight feet high because the white-tailed deer is a mighty leaper. It’s going to look a little like Jurassic Park. 
      Of course, if the USA gets into really deep socio-political shit, it’s easy to imagine the entire deer-herd of Washington County getting exterminated inside a couple of years by hungry, desperate jackers. The people I play fiddle with on Tuesday night, many of them boomer-age hippie homesteaders and master gardeners, remember thirty years ago when you hardly ever saw a deer. We could easily get to that point again when times get hard. 
     About a week ago, I stopped on a country road to take a leak. I stepped into the woods for a minute and then, stepping out, was horrified to see dozens of ticks crawling on my pants legs. I took the otherwise unused snow-brush to them. The really weird part is that it was only thirty degrees that day. Yet they were already active and right lively. This place is now the epicenter of the eastern Lyme Disease epidemic. I went to a party not long ago where at least fifteen people were currently in treatment, or had been more than once before, for Lyme. Some just couldn’t get rid of it. It is a wicked-ass illness, very difficult to get out of your system, and debilitating in myriad ways. It, too, was unknown around here thirty years ago.
      I honestly don’t know if my own little homesteading experiment at the edge of this sweet-but-beat little village is going to work out. I’m pretty confident about growing vegetables because I’ve done it successfully before, even in recent years when I was a renter sitting out the housing bubble. But it gives you something psychologically nourishing to do while the turbo-industrial world wends its way into the long emergency. Pictures to come on my website as the season wends where it will.
     Apologies for late posting today…time change and all….
____________________________

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About James Howard Kunstler

View all posts by James Howard Kunstler
James Howard Kunstler is the author of many books including (non-fiction) The Geography of Nowhere, The City in Mind: Notes on the Urban Condition, Home from Nowhere, The Long Emergency and the four-book series of World Made By Hand novels, set in a post economic crash American future. His most recent book is Living in the Long Emergency; Global Crisis, the Failure of the Futurists, and the Early Adapters Who Are Showing Us the Way Forward. Jim lives on a homestead in Washington County, New. York, where he tends his garden and communes with his chickens.

803 Responses to “Intermezzo” Subscribe

  1. kulturcritic* March 12, 2012 at 10:29 am #

    James – we are approaching lockdown in the land of the free: speech, assembly, elections, internet… we now realize it all was a dream. With more women and children gunned down in Afghanistan, and Obama looking to the Supremes to decapitate Bradley Manning for outing the truth, it seems like our days in the land of good and plenty are nearly over. In fact, the rampant individualism we have worshipped for centuries is also an illusion, and it must be overcome in a renewed communitas and economics of sharing. Otherwise, THEY WIN! Enjoy, Naturally Human. kulturCritic.
    http://kulturcritic.wordpress.com/posts/naturally-human-a-hypothesis/

  2. TrE March 12, 2012 at 10:33 am #

    When I was a youngun in the early 1980s, three social problems often presented on the nightly news were [1] what to do with all the garbage, [2] the burgeoning availability of street weapons, and [3] prison overcrowding. A neighbor proposed solving all three problems at once by building rafts of compressed garbage, populating these with armed inmates, and setting the barges adrift at sea.
    Watching the nightly news over the weekend, it occurred to me that our suburban paradise may in fact be this raft of garbage/worthless CDSes, that we’ve become its insane, well-armed inmates, and–to complete the analogy–that yes, we’re adrift in a sea of 3,500 foot houses.

  3. Cabra1080 March 12, 2012 at 10:48 am #

    Jim, good to see you are getting your vegetable garden setup – and growing something more useful than flowers.
    We hauled two loads of mulch from the local mulch pile for our raised garden beds. Got two rows of English Peas growing and one row of cabbage set out. Fruit trees are blooming and the birds are chirping – looking like a nice spring season (except for the rotating clouds).

  4. Jimmy Drinkwater March 12, 2012 at 10:50 am #

    Ticks and pests thrive unabated by this not quite winter and what I’m betting will be a quickly approaching long hot summer. In the meanwhile, climate change is still dismissed as ‘theory’.
    A visit to the NOAA Climate Prediction Center http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/ and a peek at the Drought Monitor page will yield an eye-opening swath of red across the whole southern half of the country indicating a northward advance of baked earth and dry watersheds. Some theory.
    http://altransbikes.blogspot.com

  5. Puzzler March 12, 2012 at 10:56 am #

    I wouldn’t be surprised to hear claims that the increase in deer and ticks should be blamed on Global Warming, oops Climate Change. I’m glad you’re not.
    Even with a chainsaw it takes an enormous amount of person power to turn trees into firewood warming your house, especially if you actually heat the house that way rather than merely supply a decorative fire in a fireplace. A woodstove insert is an improvement over an open fireplace, but to heat a whole house you need at least a freestanding woodstove, or even better a wood burning furnace.

  6. dublindan March 12, 2012 at 10:58 am #

    Hey Jim,
    Might I suggest you also plant a ‘Reliant Peach’… of all my fruit trees, it was the first to produce… and has done great every year here in the Monadnock region of NH. Secondly, check out the trailer for the upcoming ‘God Bless America’ flic… you’ll get a kick out of it… and might even want to comment too!
    Ciao, Dan

  7. Hugh Culliton March 12, 2012 at 11:01 am #

    Thanks for kicking my ass into gear WRT the garden & yard. Lots of fat & healthy deer up here in Ontario too. If they attack a garden though, they might meet Mr. Bow – not that he would ever break the law. There is the turkey hunt coming up. Those of us with a carnoveristic bend are looking forward to that. Maybe we could swaP a turkey for some cider! Happy Spring!

  8. John T Anderson March 12, 2012 at 11:03 am #

    Jim: I see you’ve decided to follow the advice of Voltaire’s Candide: “Il faut cultiver notre jardin (We must cultivate our garden),” which is the last sentence of Voltaire’s novel of the same name. It also gives you something to do while we wait for Israeli and/or American bombs to fall on Iran.

  9. mow March 12, 2012 at 11:04 am #

    you will need lots of wood to keep those mason jars full

  10. johngoes March 12, 2012 at 11:07 am #

    Funny you mention Texas heat and corn/squash/bean planting in the same post. Last year I double-dug a garden on a piece of land with the intent of trying out the indian corn/squash/bean planting method. Unfortunately, the record rash of 100 degree days and exceptional drought resulted in corn that never grew over knee high, beans that wilted at ankle high and squash whose blooms fell off leaving no fruit. That makes two years out of the last three with near record breaking quantity of 100+ days. Any naysayer of anthropogenic global warming has got their head in the sand (or up their ass!) If you think humans aren’t capable of destroying the world, just look at the rivers on fire in the ’70s and the ozone hole over the antarctic.

  11. noel bodie March 12, 2012 at 11:08 am #

    Jim, congrats on your new digs, we moved to our small farm 10 years ago and my only regret is that I didn’t do it 30 years earlier.

  12. old69 March 12, 2012 at 11:20 am #

    From:
    http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=178400
    Work Paradox ?
    In what sense does a healthy economy “Generate Jobs” ? What does that mean ? If the workforce presently employed in any nation is working effectively, is actually producing something, is achieving a “Result”, a “Product”, is “Solving a Problem”, is “Improving a Process”, is “Increasing the Amount of Goods (and Services ? But isn’t “More Services” a Negative Production ? who needs More Services ? the less Services we Have to Deal With The Better, Right ?)”, is “Continually Educating and Improving the Know How and Innovation and Whatever of a Society”, well how does that translate into More New jobs ? As in More New Jobs are needed, or changed, or whatever.
    But if more Jobs are needed or if they are substituted with other jobs but the result is “More Jobs”, then doesn’t that mean that all of the previous work effectively Produced A Big Fat ZERO ? Obviously there is great confusion amongst economists to what they actually mean by the words “More Productivity” and “Increasing Production and Economic Growth” and such.
    A really healthy economy would tend to generate fewer and fewer Jobs as it would need fewer and fewer jobs to satisfy all of its needs. It would actually be Innovating and Producing more as in “Higher Productivity” with less input (but the economist got this thing all upside down: they say More Jobs are Created if Productivity is Increased, a real Paradox, totally absurd and total Nonsense, but economists and their buddies can chant all the nonsense they want, nobody will ever challenge their “Wisdom”: but maybe what they really want to say is if more output is generated by fewer workers producing more and more efficiently than they can freely hire a lot of other workers to just goof around and put on the show that they are creating more jobs and such…).
    The only possible solution to this Paradox is that, of the 100 million Americans working, a very large part of them are not producing anything at all and are mostly breaking things up, producing Negative Production, Creating More Problems to Solve than Solving Any Problems and such. In a sense they are not Producing but Destroying only to rebuild it all over again and destroy it all over again and such.
    A Technological Economy naturally tends towards decreasing the amount of labor needed structurally, from the outset because it is applying Economies of Scales, Computers, Optimizations, it is applying Know How and Research and Innovation to get more bang for the buck so to say, to get more output with fewer inputs therefore generating more profits for the ruling class: and in fact the US corporations are sitting on hundreds of billions of dollars in profits, not even knowing what they can do with all of that cash anymore since the Technological Economy is mostly crashing the Mental Computer Programs of a Civilization that was used to scarcity and the necessity to work in very low productivity endeavors (like agriculture and such) for centuries and simply cannot come to grips with the fact that work will increasingly No Longer Be Needed, and will be needed less and less.
    But alas, this Civilization will do everything it can to keep on making believe it needs so much work: it will invent a never ending array of Fake Tasks that must be Done, Fake Work and Jobs, it will create jobs that are dependent only on the will powers of people deciding they need any capricious quirk just because, for no reason at all, it will create so many useless local tasks that exist only in virtue of given Status Relationships and Power Relationships between actors, not dependent on any real necessities, but just on fun and games where some workers will feel forced to work useless tasks for hours on end (it reminds me of a corporation that recently laid off hundreds of workers and they all said they were working many overtime hours and had so much work to do and so much pressure only to find out the next day that the entire corporation was a failed entity (or just changed their plans or whatever) and laid them all off in a jiffy, as if all of that “hard work” was a show, a make believe, a make believe where the workers really thought that they had all of this “Hard Work” to do (and they did, locally, they did within the boundaries of their very small local world, but only because they couldn’t see the bigger picture, or better, the bigger picture didn’t even exist, the entire organization was hanging on a very thin thread of some powerful person’s quirk Will Power, Power at its Purest so to say).
    This Stone Age Civilization will do everything it can to keep on making believe it needs so much work: it will create all kinds of reciprocal struggles between actors and corporations (aka Competition), it will constantly change the rules of the games, the laws, the new gadgets needed to simply make a phone call (if you don’t make the phone call with the latest iphone you simply won’t be able to make a phone call and such), it will increase conflictuality in all possible endeavors, a never ending array of “Choices” and “Contrasting Positions” on anything anyone wants to produce or create, an army of lawyers and an Internet full of Political and Ideological debates of all against all on all issues in a never ending waste of resources to produce nothing at all.
    We need to get rid of this Stone Age system and hand out Free Salaries to All, Cheap Rents, Build Millions of Rockets to Mars and Millions of Skyscrapers, we need to build Millions of High Speed Trains across the planet, we need to achieve and exploit all of the Resources of the Solar System, etc. Also get rid of the Environmentalists, Tree Huggers and Greens, Use Nature as Tool, it is ours to use, get rid of all of the Resource Scarcity Myths and Such…
    And especially: WE NEED TO CHANGE THE DESIGN OF OUR MAN BRAIN, CHANGE ALL OF THE NEURAL CIRCUITS, KILL THE FREE WILL GADGETS, KILL CONTRAST AND FIGHTS FROM THE ORIGIN OF SUCH A STONE AGE CONTRAPTION OUR MAN BRAIN IS.
    AN APE MAN

  13. old69 March 12, 2012 at 11:21 am #

    Postby nameta9 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:59 pm
    Also from:
    Also Check Out:
    http://instantsingularity1.blogspot.com/
    and good old:
    http://instantsingularity.blogspot.com/

  14. montysano March 12, 2012 at 11:22 am #

    “I stepped into the woods for a minute and then, stepping out, was horrified to see dozens of ticks crawling on my pants legs.”
    Here in north Alabama, there’s a wonderful place called the Sipsey Wilderness area. It’s an incredibly lush area of old growth forest, very reminiscent of the Pacific Northwest. It’s an inhospitable place in the summer, with ticks and venomous snakes aplenty. In years past, the backpacking season was November-March, when the ticks and snakes were gone for the winter.
    Now, the ticks never leave, and with several friends suffering from Lyme disease, we haven’t made a single visit this year.

  15. old69 March 12, 2012 at 11:22 am #

    Also from:
    http://instantsingularity3.blogspot.com/
    THE APE

  16. DeeJones March 12, 2012 at 11:23 am #

    Jim, good to hear about the gardening. Sounds like you are getting settled. Nothing quite like fresh veggies & fruit, especially if you have grown them your self.
    As for the ticks, perhaps you brushed them off your pants legs, but you will still have to check your body for one or two that may have made it to the nice, warm and blood flowing areas around the ‘naughty bits’, to quote Monty Python.
    Also, in a good mirror you will need to check your back, and remember what is a mole or freckle so you can spot a tic.
    If you see a ‘bulls eye’ mark on you, get to the M.D. asap, thats the sign of a Lyme tick bite. Ticks also inject a numbing agent, so you don’t feel the bite. You can use tweezers to remove them, the things about matches or oil are useless, you just end up with a dead tick burried in your skin.
    I have also read that guinea fowl love ticks and two will clean an acre and keep it clean of them.
    But chickens will do as well.
    Good luck, Dee

  17. steve-o March 12, 2012 at 11:32 am #

    Those of us with gasoline-powered toys such as chainsaws and weedeaters that feed on ethanol/gas/oil mixes are discovering we need new gas lines. Apparently the plastic in the gas line is susceptible to a chemical reaction that causes the line to become brittle and then break.
    Before you exhaust yourself pulling the crank rope, replace the plastic gas line on your implement. Don’t use old gas that has set up for a few months over winter.

  18. Smokyjoe March 12, 2012 at 11:33 am #

    I think you are doing the right things, JHK. Learn useful skills and don’t waste the day away tapping keys. Find community and teach self-reliance.
    We have to do what we all can, where we can. I spent the weekend getting a dam-spillway in shape, and then got some power equipment mended.
    Even as things get rough, we’ll have fuel for a long time at high cost and with unstable availability. Unlike running a car, a rural land owner doesn’t need more than a couple dozen gallons of gas or diesel to get through a season.
    I can imagine a new breed of Snake Oil salesmen appearing as things unwind, peddling “real gasoline!” from drums on his wagon. He’ll have a couple of armed guards, too.
    Will it be good? Depends on his reputation.
    Just in case, I’ll keep re-learning how to do get wood and move earth the older way, by hand. Even if we don’t end up there in my or your lifetimes, that sort of hard work beats any gym membership.

  19. Jimmy Drinkwater March 12, 2012 at 11:34 am #

    Less than 50% of confirmed Lyme disease cases display the bulls eye rash.

  20. Laura Louzader March 12, 2012 at 11:38 am #

    Congratulations on your garden and your acquisition of a suitable piece of property with a well-insulated house.
    However, concerning the wood stove.. well, let’s just hope like hell that we have another way to heat our houses, especially in the towns and cities, when the gas pipes start to cough and oil is at $300 a barrel.
    If you have a couple of acres of land with a wood supply replenishing itself, you might be able to cope. But you better take that fence higher and electrify it, and guard your woodpile with a powerful weapon, because I give this country as a whole about half a heating season in a mild winter before we have chopped down every growing thing more than a foot high to feed our stoves. There is NO WAY most people in this country are going to be able to keep themselves warm by burning wood. We’ll have to return to coal boilers, and just deal with the horrid air pollution and health effect thereof, which are rather better than freezing to death quickly.
    Let’s hope like hell that Curt Sorensen and other nuke pioneers can get the funding to build the Liquid Fluoride Thorium Reactor before the fossil fuel shrinkage makes these fuels too expensive to start alternative technologies or even build the nuclear plant we will need to electrify our transportation and replace gas and oil as heating fuels. I’m currently researching electric boilers in the hopes that these things have become economical enough that, combined with thorough winterization and really beefy insulation, they might be able to heat a city apartment building.
    If not, expect a steep, rapid die off of our population over the next decade.

  21. k-dog March 12, 2012 at 11:40 am #

    Forty years ago tornado’s had a ‘season’ in the Midwest and never happened in wintertime at all. In Minneapolis sightings were generally infrequent until June and by August the raging dust devils had all returned to their lairs. In the summertime a well organized community was always well prepared for any mayhem. Fatalities were rare. Only fools lived in trailer parks because they had no basements for shelter. Families had annual tornado drills and everybody knew to go to the southwest corner of the basement when trouble was seen. This usually meant that the family dog was the first one downstairs when trouble came. Sirens would blare atop police stations and fire departments. Radios would be tuned to local weather before any trouble started.
    Curiosity has been something I have been afflicted with all my life. I recall growing up looking for information in the city library about tornados because I wanted to know if there was a trend over time and if damage was getting worse. The answers I found was that while there were differences between decades things had not changed a lot in fifty years. Tornados were a summertime phenomena. I recall learning the 1930’s had seen some nasty summer twisters.
    In those days there was always plenty of snow in the wintertime to reflect heat and keep the thermal engine that fuels tornados at bay. Not so today.
    For years my stomach has always turned when radio announcers would add the obligatory disclaimer to their weather reports that this that or the other weather event was never caused by global warming. They usually say something a little more nebulous like ‘cannot be positively linked’ or some such bullshit but what goes between everybody’s ears is that there isn’t any global warming, don’t worry about it. Is everybody so afraid of loosing their jobs? I don’t think I have ever heard any weather event actually being linked to global warming in my life.
    Yet the truth is that every single weather event that happens is influenced by CO2 and other greenhouse gas emissions. Weather as we all know cannot be predicted long in the future. There is too much to keep track of, innumerable variables come into play as the deck gets shuffled by the sun, the seasons, and atmospheric composition over time.
    Imagine a pleasant warm sunny seasonally appropriate day. Could a day like this ever be caused by global warming? Well the answer is yes. If you are on a poker playing marathon and I walk into your room and shuffle the deck the royal flush you get dealt two days later has something to do with my shuffling. The weather deck has been shuffled by fifty years of excessive CO2 emissions. Nothing is the same as it would have been. Without fifty years of excessive CO2 emissions the warm sunny day could just as easily be a scorcher in the middle of a heat wave or a rainstorm. Nothing is the same as it would have been.
    Trying to claim that winter tornados are not the result of global warming is stretching things too far, at least for anyone over fifty, from the Midwest.

  22. wastelandmechanic March 12, 2012 at 11:43 am #

    Jim,
    I have manually split more than my share of northeast hardwood and can give you this advice – BUY A LOGSPLITTER. It is a simple gas engine that drives a hydraulic pump which moves a hydraulic cylinder that forces the wood against a wedge. You can wheel a small one around by hand. A big piece of oak with knots can fight you to the death if you try to split it manually.
    Also if you have any real big straight trees it might be worth it to sell a few to a sawmill.
    Dan

  23. jmoreycollins March 12, 2012 at 11:44 am #

    Nice change of pace this week–glad to hear what you are doing day-to-day to prepare for coming changes.
    I started my own first vegetable garden this year (all potted, as my landlord is heavily invested in his lawn). Sadly, my thumb seems to be black. Or maybe arugula just doesn’t like to live in pots?

  24. catman306 March 12, 2012 at 11:45 am #

    Here’s a deer fencing tip. Find some old chain link fence at the scrap yard. Lay the fencing flat on the ground about 3 feet from your new deer fence.
    Deer will not walk on the grounded chain link fence for fear of breaking a foot or ankle. Then they won’t be able to jump the mere 8′ fence. A twelve foot high fence would work but would cost considerably more. The old timers here in Georgia depend on the higher fences or ankle breakers on the ground so the deer can’t make a running leap.
    Good tip on using chickens or other fowl to eat the ticks.

  25. Neon Vincent March 12, 2012 at 11:46 am #

    I was wondering if springing ahead had left you behind. While I was waiting for you to post, I decided to take a nap. Good thing I did. I feel much better.
    I’m glad to read that you’ve been contemplating something positive, such as your own survival during the Long Emergency, and trying to do something about it. Good luck with the vegetable garden and the deer. The last winter I lived out in the country, the deer browsed so much of my cedars that I vowed that if I were still living there that fall, I’d get a gun and a hunting license. Lucky for the deer, I sold my house moved in May. That was 2006, the top of the housing market. Lucky for me.
    Over at Crazy Eddie’s Motie News, I’ve been following the effects of the rise in gas prices. One of the expected results is an increase in gasoline thefts of all kinds–drive offs, fraud, and siphoning. The latest gang of gas thieves in Detroit has found a new way–puncturing and draining gas tanks. I have videos embedded showing the results.
    In addition to rising gas prices, I have observations about the unusually warm weather, the anniversary of the combined earthquake, tsunami, and meltdown, and a contrast of Mitt Romney and George Carlin on grits. Happy Motoring–for now–from Detroit!
    http://crazyeddiethemotie.blogspot.com/

  26. Fissile March 12, 2012 at 11:46 am #

    “Of course, if the USA gets into really deep socio-political shit, it’s easy to imagine the entire deer-herd of Washington County getting exterminated inside a couple of years by hungry, desperate jackers.”
    Nope. If we had a real emergency, those deer would be gone in weeks, not years.
    Go have a look at the US Census statistics from the year 1790. Yes, 1790, the first year the US conducted a Census.
    The State of New Jersey had a population of about 250K souls back then (currently approaching 9 million). According to the Census of 1790, there were no wild deer anywhere in the state of New Jersey. Likewise, all the wild turkey and bear were gone as well. In addition, none of the old growth forest remained from the time Europeans first made contact.
    Now consider that all the above was done with primitive single shot firearms and muscle power — human and animal. People who think they are going to be able to “live off the land” during an emergency are kidding themselves. Still not discouraged enough? Google, “rabbit starvation”.

  27. third_martini_banter March 12, 2012 at 11:48 am #

    Apropos of nothing in this week’s column, but of interest to CFN readers in general, is a book many of you probably already know of: “Republican Gomorrah: Inside the Movement That Shattered The Party.” It’s by Max Blumenthal, (son of Sidney, the Clinton White House staffer), whose name & writings I stumbled across last night.
    This young man made a splash a couple of years ago when Obama went to Cairo, when he put up a video on the Internet (http://maxblumenthal.com/feeling-the-hate-in-jerusalem/). It went viral, and shows a series of brief interviews of drunk and very stupid kids in Israel, denouncing Obama with the N-word, repeating the birther-and-Muslim nonsense, and accusing him of terrorist sympathies for daring to give a speech in which Arabs were portrayed as possibly less-than-monstrous.
    The Netanyahu-Likud axis has truly hijacked that nation, and some significant power blocs in our own, and Bibi’s open courting of the loony, Rapture-ready Right in America is doing immense damage. Let’s hope they don’t get their way and start WWIII by bombing and invading Iran.

  28. ozone March 12, 2012 at 11:50 am #

    Mr. James,
    Not to worry too much about giant quantities of heating wood if your place is small and open [internally]. I know you’ll be very cautious with the ol’ chainsaw (usually it’s the very young that get over-confident and cavalier about that machine’s nasty bite).
    As far as future heating goes, I’ve invested in a couple two-man bucksaws; guess we’ll find out who our [dependable] friends are, eh? ;o)
    Oh, echoing Dee’s thoughts about chickens or guinea fowl for tick (and other pesty insect) eradication.
    You’ve probably checked into Joe Palatin’s chicken-tractor ideas for moving fertilization and bug-eatin’. These can always be scaled down; after all, we aren’t going to be attempting to feed San Francisco from here in the NE. (I’m not sure why everyone seems to concentrate on PROFIT and mass distribution in these enterprises. Feeding yourself and those directly around you would seem to me to be enough of a challenge; any surplus being traded for items you don’t/can’t raise yourself.)
    Best of luck to you and the dirt with the growing of foodstuffs! (I’m slowly expanding my gardening areas and canning capabilities; probably should put a rush on some more. I get the distinct feeling that “time’s a’wastin'”.)

  29. Jimmy Drinkwater March 12, 2012 at 11:52 am #

    I share similar albeit slightly different observations from a different part of the country; New England.
    Fifty years ago as a kid I remember no one had an nor seemed to need an air conditioner in the summer. Critters such as Possums and Mockingbirds were something we’d heard of from the south but today are common here.

  30. Stephen_B March 12, 2012 at 11:52 am #

    On ticks, I’ll add that in eastern MA, I firmly believe it’s been the deer population explosion that has led to the tick problem. Some people say it’s the mice that lead to ticks and yes, it’s true that the ticks use the mice as hosts as well, but only when the ticks are nymphs.
    When I was a kid, we had lots of mice, but I never saw a deer/black footed tick. Now, we have lots of deer and ticks.
    For what it’s worth, I have been bitten many, many times. I’m talking 6 to 12 times a spring, but I’ve caught all the bites quickly and still test negative for Lyme. I feel great as well. Early removal, within 24 hours, and using hydrogen peroxide on the things, even before you pull them out, (but of course, after as well) seems to cut the infection rate.
    I detest mosquito products like Deep Woods OFF, but sprayed liberally over my footwear, pant legs, and most everything else (excepting my face), seems to encourage the ticks to drop off much more quickly and often too.
    Of course tucking one’s pant legs into one’s socks, and keeping the shirt tucked in as well, forces the little buggers to crawl all the way up to your head, before they find your skin and as I say, the repellent encourages them to drop off, beforehand.
    One last note on ticks – I haven’t noticed this mentioned anywhere, but I’ve noticed it – there is quite a drop off in deer tick numbers from about the 3rd week in July until the 3rd or 4th week in September. Last year I could go into the woods in shorts for hours at that time and never pick up a tick. I’m not sure what it is about the ticks’ life cycle that makes this so, but I’ve come to look forward to the freedom of that time.
    On the other hand, from snow melt to about June 1st, especially the first half of that time period, is a simply dreadful time.
    I’m slowly moving to a place I bought in northern Maine, in Aroostook County, and have yet to even see a deer tick there.

  31. DeeJones March 12, 2012 at 11:52 am #

    OH, BTW, the tics are really bad here in Costa Rica too this year, the local vet says its the worst he has seen a few years.
    If you have pets, you should use a good anti-tic on them like Advantage or Frontline, but you will still need to check them if they have been outside, as the tic meds don’t kill the tics until they have already bitten your pet. If the tics are really bad, you might need to ‘treat’ your yard with some kind of spray. Or get chickens.
    You will need to get your pet used to being checked out, especially in between the paw-pads.
    Check them every day, use a comb too.
    Keep your pets healthy & happy & tic free.
    Dee

  32. Hamster March 12, 2012 at 11:53 am #

    Buffalo Bird Woman described how the Arikawa grew the Three Sisters. There’s also a good description of various arrangements in Corn Growing among the Indians of the Upper Midwest, which is archived on line. It was written in the early 20th century by an extension agent whose name I forget.
    My own experiments kinda sorta worked. Buffalo Bird Woman and the extension agent both emphasize that it’s all about spacing and variety selection. The major points are: Allow enough space to get light to the beans, give the corn a good head start of several weeks, and pick a shorter pole bean. The most vigorous pole beans overwhelm the corn. The squash goes on the sides of the patches or in every fourth or so hill. Since the ground around here takes a while to warm up in spring, it takes a somewhat cold tolerant corn or transplants to work.
    One year I started Oxachican Green Dent in little trays and planted out each transplant with two pole bean seeds, in a wide bed, with potatoes and winter squash in adjoining beds. That worked. I had an inadvertent experiment when an over enthusiastic weeder pulled up the bean plants on half the bed. The corn with beans was a foot higher and heavier yielding than the corn without beans.

  33. DeeJones March 12, 2012 at 11:58 am #

    “Less than 50% of confirmed Lyme disease cases display the bulls eye rash.”
    But it pays to pay attention to your body.
    Did you know that no only do the tics inject a numbing agent, but the anti-coagulant they also inject may cause anything from a low-level allergic reaction to full blown anaphilactic shock.
    And the low-level reactions can be just as debilitating over the long term, especially if you are constantly exposed to them.
    Dee

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  34. Widespreadpanic7 March 12, 2012 at 11:59 am #

    Nice post Jim, a welcome, (and affirmative) change of pace!
    So right now, on this sunny warm New England day, about 100 miles south from where you’re at, I need to get out on my own property and begin turning over some soil with shovel & hoe …
    –WSP7

  35. DeeJones March 12, 2012 at 12:00 pm #

    “Apparently the plastic in the gas line is susceptible to a chemical reaction that causes the line to become brittle and then break.”
    Is it possible to replace with aluminum or copper lines?
    Dee

  36. CaptSpaulding March 12, 2012 at 12:07 pm #

    Good luck with your garden,Jim. You have touched on something which has vanished over time. Namely getting together with neighbors & making music. It’s a great way to establish a connection with people, and is a good social glue. I’m also reminded of neighbors getting together to harvest wheat way back when. Or helping to rebuild someone’s barn after a fire (not everybody had insurance back then). All in all, gardening, making music, good things to do in these horseshit times.

  37. ccm989 March 12, 2012 at 12:08 pm #

    I, too, am an avid gardener. I just spent the other day digging up another 12 x 8 section of the lawn for two additional vegetable beds. It is dirty, backbreaking work removing sod, shaking off the dirt and busting up the soil underneath. I am putting in 2 dwarf peach trees and will surround the beds with a perimeter of wire fencing that is only about 3 feet tall. To keep the innumerable deer out, I will string the top half of the posts with twine (something I saw done at Preston Farms, Rhode Island) which appears to work. Deer don’t like spiders and the twine apparently makes them think there are spiders lurking about. The wire fence is woven tightly enough to keep bunnies and chucks out but squirrels can still sneak in. Last spring, to avoid pesticides, I carefully put all of the apples in plastic bags with the end tips cut off to keep bugs off the fruit. It did keep the bugs off but the squirrels stole every last damn apple!
    Despite the general craziness of this world, I find time in the garden peaceful and productive. While other people prepare for the end of the world, I prepare for the future. And while I think JHK is completely right that fossil fuel will eventually dry up, we still have some time to get our own houses in order. And I will continue to garden even if the world doesn’t collapse mostly because its (dare I say) fun, cheap and provides the gardener with lots of fresh air and a convenient source of delicious food. Nothing quicker than picking dinner from the garden even if the grocery store is only a few blocks away. No GMOs, no pesticides, no migrant labor abuse, etc. The downside of gardening is that I have gotten Lyme’s Disease twice. The first time I was misdiagnosed with Rheumatoid arthritis which seemed weird as I only had it in one hand/arm (where I repeatedly told the doctor something had bitten me). It took a lot of insistence that I be tested before the correct diagnosis was found.
    One other thing I have learned and maybe every generation has to learn this – the radical right does not respect established law. Every woman I know cannot believe that the radical right is attacking our right to get safe, reliable birth control. And they will never stop trying to take that away from us. And it isn’t just birth control under fire, its voting rights, education and decent wages. So each generation must stand up for their rights or quickly lose them. Because once lost, we will never get them back again. And that worries me far more than any wild climate, economic collapse or gas shortage.

  38. k-dog March 12, 2012 at 12:08 pm #

    “Nope. If we had a real emergency, those deer would be gone in weeks, not years.”
    I agree, if we have a significant food supply problem given our population and armament deer won’t last a season before they become extinct in the lower 48. They may be pests now but people far outnumber deer.
    Years into the LE draconian consequences could be in store for anyone foolish and hungry enough to poach a deer. For deer poachers it could be a return to medieval style justice.
    This reminds me of a mathematical analysis I saw about the time ‘The Road’ came out concerning how long a cannibal society could exist before there was nobody left to eat. It isn’t very long, certainly not long enough to be the subject of a serious movie, not that ‘The Road’ was.

  39. Hammering Truth March 12, 2012 at 12:13 pm #

    We have a lot of deer in Michigan, but even the lottery winners can’t afford to eat: http://youtu.be/U_yyCOlwn28

  40. Casual Observer March 12, 2012 at 12:16 pm #

    Climate has been changing on the planet earth for a few billion years. It cycles repeatedly with warm and cool periods. Personally I rather like the warmth. Some scientists say we are due for another ice age anytime. I used to be convinced that “Global Climate Change” was something I should worry about but after watching the now famous George Carlin stand-up shtick, “The world is fine”, I stopped worrying.

  41. newworld March 12, 2012 at 12:21 pm #

    Lotsa luck with gardening, it is high art regardless what the tossers in NYC think.
    But as America becomes equal with Africa and we all want equality, America too will get its colorful warlords. West Africa has produced such luminaries as General Butt Naked and General Mosquito Spray, and I am sure America can produce General Neck Flames in the global race for equality.

  42. lostinthewoods March 12, 2012 at 12:22 pm #

    My Aunt’s mother-in-law lived at the head of a mountain valley in Montana. There was no electricity there and she was isolated three to four month each winter. She cut her own firewood by hand, fueling her cookstove and pot belly. She grew a hardy garden despite the altitude and short growing season. When a deer or elk ventured by to share the bounty it sometimes ended up on the drying rack or in mason jars. She burned candles or oil lanterns and played a pedal pump organ or read for entertainment.
    She was in her eighties when we met and died on her spread, well into her nineties at that point – still independent.
    That an elderly woman living alone can manage to be self-sufficient in a rather harsh and inhospitable environment (yes, there were resources that offered distinct advantages as well), then surely modern day pioneers can as well.

  43. k-dog March 12, 2012 at 12:23 pm #

    I have been in the Seattle area for more than thirty years. Locally I can attest to less wintertime snow and more rain as the years roll by.
    Our news mentioned that reduced snow pack could make for local water shortages in years to come. The news was also quick to point out that the change in our weather conditions might not be due to ‘climate change’ but could be the result of other natural phenomena.
    Whatever those are.

  44. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 12:28 pm #

    The cold stayed mostly up North in North America this year. Record snows in Alaska. The cold came down in Europe, both Western and Eastern. Hundreds froze to death in Eastern Europe and in Britain. But that happens ever year now in Britain for pensioners.
    The planet is cooling on the whole.

  45. The Mook March 12, 2012 at 12:30 pm #

    Jim, I think you are jumping the gun. You forgot to boil your sap for maple syrup and you should be digging leeks at this time. Don’t plant corn and tomatoes and such until Memorial day in your area. Use pine to boil your sap, not your hardwoods.

  46. caroline March 12, 2012 at 12:30 pm #

    The corn, beans, and squash people are still with us.

  47. tpverde March 12, 2012 at 12:32 pm #

    Great to see so many people expressing a zest for the simple, positive steps like home gardening in the face of such disturbing news worldwide.
    I’ve come to similar conclusions here in Costa Rica, where the internet can keep me depressed internationally while a vigorous dry season is fanning the flames locally.
    Hope springs with the sprouts in a protected shade house, the fruit trees that survived and are bearing buckets full and the new neighbors breaking ground, adding on and getting ever more into the fray of building and sowing a resilient community.

  48. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 12:35 pm #

    That started a few weeks ago when a Democratic Operative posing as a journalist (Stephanopolis) asked Romeny during a debate about banning birth control. No one was even talking about it.
    And now they’re trying to force us to pay for it via Obamacare. Sandra Fluke, one of the 1% by anyone’s definition, can’t afford her own birth control. If you believe that, you’ll believe anything. Buy your own birth control and pay for your own abortions. That’s the American Way not the Socialist State forcing people to pay for things they don’t believe in.
    Sad to say, this kind of shit works. Women are very easily manipulated. And if the TSHTF, you will have far bigger problems than the “Patriarchy”. In fact, women will be desperate for strong men to protect them.

  49. sooty March 12, 2012 at 12:35 pm #

    About firewood and climate change “theory.”
    If you’re not familiar with coppicing, it’s been done for about 1500 years in Europe. Broad leaf trees, when cut, send up shoots that become new trees. Properly managed, it’s sustainable and also produces pole wood for building, etc., and doesn’t require as much splitting. Check out “The Woodland Year” published by Chelsea Green. I believe CG will soon be publishing a thorough study of coppice best practices by permaculture experts Mark Krawcyzk and Dave Jacke. They’ve amassed tons of info!
    My 61-year-old squeeze can split wood better and faster than any machine–tested fact. It’s all in the swing. He does it every day–besides split wood, it creates a great back and shoulders.
    About climate change being just a “theory”: scientists use the word very differently than lay people. To lay folks it means a conjecture that could be false (e.g., “I have a theory about why the car quit”). To scientists, and I quote physicist Rich Wolfson, who recently explained this to me–feel free to use it on stupid people:
    “A theory is an overarching, solidly established, and coherent conceptual framework that explains myriad observed phenomena. Leading theories in science—relativity, evolution—have been tested over and over against reality and adjusted when observations conflict. ‘Theory’ is a strong word that denotes a confident and deeply grounded understanding of science. The fundamental physical principles that govern climate fall into this category. That is not to say we know all the details of climate processes and future climate, but it rules out claims that climate change has no anthropogenic basis.”
    O-tay!

  50. upstatebob March 12, 2012 at 12:35 pm #

    Good to hear someone planning his garden. The best defense against critters is a little terrier. -I still have a fence as backup.
    Deer ate all my cabbage before I put it up. Apples: the trees are a PITA but I have three. Forget pruning them in the spreading mode so popular in the past. The smart orchards keep them skinny now.
    Macs are tasty but too early and bug ridden. Find varieties bug resistant and late like the johnathan. The deer eat the drops if the dog doesn’t chase them away. Plant crops that give you the most bang for the buck and keep well in winter storage. -Taters, turnips,
    collards are extremely cold hardy and are at their best in late season when the veins turn white and tender. Can’t beat a hobby that feeds you. BTW, buy a wide kerf chain and bar for that saw
    and save yourself a lot of frustration.

  51. Solar Guy March 12, 2012 at 12:36 pm #

    I wish I had more time to ‘study’ gardening…
    Live in the moment. Enjoy everything.
    Our collective thoughts may in fact bring about our reality…

  52. k-dog March 12, 2012 at 12:39 pm #

    Yes, An excellent piece by the great one and I’ve had a similar epiphany myself.
    We don’t have to worry about the earth, she can take care of herself like she has for five billion years. To her we are a minor infection that will clear up all by itself, no treatment necessary. From the earth’s point of view we are no smarter than germs. The earth has only our actions with which to form an opinion and based on our actions we have demonstrated no more sentience then bacteria growing on a petri dish.
    The great thing about knowing that the earth can take care of herself is to know that we can now take the time to worry about people and sustainability of our species.

  53. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 12:39 pm #

    You need the anti-racism drug. Soon all Whites guilty of thought crime will be forced to take it.
    http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/feeling-racist-blood-pressure-pill-propranolol-may-open-223450211.html

  54. Peter March 12, 2012 at 12:41 pm #

    I’m using electric fencing and the horse tape to keep the deer out our garden. A significant financial saving and way less material. Plus, it is easy to move around. In addition I’ll be extending the use to keep pigs in.

  55. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 12:44 pm #

    I found the same. The beans are supposed to grow up on the corn, but they can very easily break it if the corn isn’t given a good head start.

  56. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 12:48 pm #

    Have you read “The Earth Abides” a beautiful Post Apocalypse novel? I turned Tripp onto it and he really “dug” it.
    How about Mushrooms for food and mind expansion?
    Decay can be growth. New Culture will flourish in the ruins of our cities. Watch “Escape from Los Angeles” for a visual expose of this theme.

  57. ofthehands.com March 12, 2012 at 12:51 pm #

    Congratulations, James! It’s good to hear you getting your homestead in order–or at least beginning the long, never-really-finished process started. While ranting about the end of the world and all the corrupt, political and economic shenanigans going on–which deserve some good ranting, indeed–is satisfying, doing good work is far more satisfying, and gives that good sense that you’re actually getting something effective done.
    Your notation that “it gives you something psychologically nourishing to do while the turbo-industrial world wends its way into the long emergency” is spot on. I wrote a little something along those lines back in January, after a somewhat depressing morning. I found that the best antidote to fear was simply to get to work. Repairing fence and dealing with a couple newborn baby goats helped to take my mind off the fear. It’s all about good work in the end. That’s really the only effective response to our troubles.
    Thanks for the great entry this week.
    Joel

  58. JCS Cycles March 12, 2012 at 12:53 pm #

    People that live in the ‘burbs are going to need to start learning to do all of these skills that have been taken for granted. When the grocery stores get emptied out, no more gasoline in the pumps – or too expensive for us 99%ers, it’s going to be a massive wake-up call. Better to learn how to do it NOW while there is time to learn. You aren’t going to be able to call up a lawn and garden service to do it for you. Biggest repair job in a bicycle shop? Changing a flat tire. Few can do this anymore, either. Sad, very sad.

  59. Steve knox March 12, 2012 at 12:54 pm #

    Jim,
    So it’s official, you are now a homesteader. Congratulations, and best of luck. Sounds like you’re starting off like we did, with fruit trees, raspberries, blueberrie, and grapes. Even though we’re pushing the limits with the grapes, we’ve had pretty good luck, with three varieties of wine grapes. The first year, I bought a maximum/minimum thermometer and recorded the hi’s/lows and length of growing season. It really helped. Have 2 varieties of peach trees, and they do very well. Again, good luck, and keep us all updated.
    Steve

  60. Mike Hunt March 12, 2012 at 1:02 pm #

    Out here on the West Coast I’ve been bitten a few times by ticks. A couple of times I had the bull’s eye response but never got Lyme’s disease.
    MH

  61. Jimmy Drinkwater March 12, 2012 at 1:24 pm #

    Get ready to be very busy then.
    http://alttransbikes.blogspot.com

  62. EthicsProf March 12, 2012 at 1:29 pm #

    Wikipedia offers the following on Lyme Disease: “An unusual, organic approach to control of ticks and prevention of Lyme disease involves the use of domesticated guineafowl. Guineafowl are voracious consumers of insects and arachnids, and have a particular fondness for ticks. Localized use of domesticated guineafowl may reduce dependence on chemical pest-control methods.[102]”
    Jim – hit up McMurray Hatchery to get some sweet new chicks to spruce up your new spread!

  63. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 1:32 pm #

    The million dollar question which no one is asking: can humamanure (shit) be used as a source of heat the way Hindus use cow manure?

  64. Prairie Dock Farm March 12, 2012 at 1:38 pm #

    Jim,
    Good analogy on using a chain saw to gage the energy in a gallon of gas…just remember 70some % of that energy went up in heat. Only about 25% got converted into power.
    I had the same reflection as you as I cut Box Elder for mushroom growing yesterday. Those three trees would have taken all day to saw by hand, and they were cut and waiting for inoculation in about 20 minutes. We live like kings on cheap energy.
    So a couple of suggestions from an old CSA grower…
    One, grow some shrooms on your farm. Stamets’ techniques are ridiculously easy and they work. Ask Karen how it’s done. We’ll be inoculating her beds soon.
    For ticks, try raising free range chickens or guinea hens. They keep our near farm mostly free of ticks, in a area that is also a Lyme disease hotspot. They’re fun and tasty too.
    Thanks for fighting the good fight,
    Greg from WI

  65. csafarmer March 12, 2012 at 1:38 pm #

    Good going on the garden, JHK
    Next step, let me suggest a small greenhouse (hoop-house) would be a wise investment. Sized for a small family, (500 or so sq ft) probably cost less than $2k all in.
    Properly sited, a hoop-house lets you get started gardening despite wet and wind; I’m just south of Ottawa Canada and most years I’m planting my (unheated) hoop house by end February/early March.
    Bonus, the deer have yet to figure out how to open the doors
    You can see a picture of mine here http://www.new-terra-natural-food.com/growing-plants-in-a-greenhouse.html

  66. Cavepainter March 12, 2012 at 1:44 pm #

    Makes me wonder what happened to the study reports posted on the internet by the public lands management agencies (USFS, BLM, NPS, etc.) back during the 90s; they are no longer anywhere to be found. Must have been pulled for putting too much of a scare on the public.
    Their conclusion was that in the event of another great depression all the flora and fauna of public lands would be wiped out in several weeks by Jeremiah Johnson wannabes who’d then start warring among themselves for the turf that they ‘d eventually make un sustainable for anything because after generations of city life they’d lost all knowledge and skill sets that would have allowed them to be good stewards.
    Moreover, the reports state that agencies wouldn’t be able to field enough agents to prevent this because they’d be outmanned and outgunned on every occasion.
    Being a child of the last depression I recall that most inhabitants of the small footprint cities of the age still had relatives living on nearby farms, so even with no employment they could rely on regular supply from those relatives of locally grown food stuff — quality better or as good as what urban YUPs today demand from their boutique markets.
    To use the wording in the reports, diminishment of fallback resources (wild game, fish, edible vegetation) has shrunk so much proportionate to growth in population that — unlike the last depression – hunting and fishing is not a practicable alternative to the unemployed for supplying family food needs.
    Then too, during the last depression the scale of most cities was so small that much of the inhabitants still had plenty of open landscape and waters within easy reach just beyond city limits, and not infrequently even on foot. During my youth I and most of my peers did just that; hunting and fishing was no more than quarter mile away.
    Looks like we’ve boxed ourselves into a real dilimma.

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  67. ikalberts March 12, 2012 at 1:51 pm #

    Congrats on living the country life and your endeavors to provide from the land. A few observations from a gardener who moved to the country four years ago. With modern varieties of vegetables the three sisters combo can be tricky. I’ve found it more productive to provide support for beans and squash and keep them separate. Butternuts will best resist the vine borer and keep well. A flock of guinea fowl can make inroads against the ticks. A gallon of gas will cut about two ricks of wood. The Brits make wood stoves with boilers that can send heat to several radiators. Why don’t we do that here? Finally, compost rules.

  68. Pam March 12, 2012 at 1:55 pm #

    Your fence will be more effective against deer if you lay 4-foot wide 2 in chicken wire flat on the ground outside of your fence.
    Also, leave some orchard trees for the deer so you will have some meat if you need it.

  69. Laura Louzader March 12, 2012 at 2:07 pm #

    Would you rather pay for babies? I personally feel that all women on welfare should be REQUIRED to use contraception, which is much cheaper than paying for all their babies…. and the social problems their babies will cause over 60 years of life.
    $1000 a year for contraception vs $12,000 for a singleton baby delivery, or $40,000 for twins… up to $1,000,000 to deliver quintuplets.
    $1000 a year for contraception vs. $40,000 a year or more to incarcerate a violent criminal.
    $1000 a year for contraception vs $40,000 a year in welfare and housing benefits for somebody on welfare with 4 kids.
    $1000 a year for contraception vs the thousands of dollars per school kid in public schools that I and every other local taxpayer pays for.
    And do I have to pay for YOUR viagra?
    What this woman was talking about was the need for insurance to pay for contraception. I spend about $500 a month for health insurance so it damn well better cover my health care costs. And if I were still of reproductive age, I would damn well expect to get my contraception covered as long as I have to help pay, through my premiums, the costs of other womens’ litters of babies, plus all their pregnancy complications and their babies’ health issues.
    A woman who never breeds is MUCH cheaper to insure than one who does.
    As long as Ms Fluke has to pay for the babies of incontinent breeder sows, she should damn well get her contraception covered.
    Other people’s kids soak up a lot of my tax money and I get nothing in return but competition for jobs, housing, and scarce resources. And I have no choice about subsidizing tax deductions for middle class breeders or lower class welfare breeders, or paying health care premiums swollen by their costs. So you can damn well pay for contraception that is actually saving you mucho bucks, if you had sense enough to figure that out.

  70. Unconventional Ideas March 12, 2012 at 2:10 pm #

    I think a takeaway thought from Jim’s article today is the future is likely to favor the manually skilled. It’s also a good idea to make changes to ensure a high degree of physical fitness.
    No doubt, for many that will mean ditching the car in exchange for shoes and a bike.

  71. muddmike March 12, 2012 at 2:12 pm #

    “Nope. If we had a real emergency, those deer would be gone in weeks, not years.”
    Not only the deer, but any wild (and some not so wild)animal with meat. ground hogs, racoons, possums, geese, ducks, crows etc.
    Keep you puppies and kitties inside.
    Of course feeding them will be a problem. Slaughtering them in a humane way might be the best choice, if you can stomach it.
    Also, after this the number of insects will explode, when people have eaten all of the songbirds.

  72. ASPO Article 1037 March 12, 2012 at 2:13 pm #

    Jim’s garden project reminded us here in the Sacramento area about our dumbass local gubernators who closed our wonderful mulch plant about 5-8 years back. A “park” was a better use of the land, and the green waste is hauled to far away landfills by truck. Maybe now it gets burned (biomass)?
    Sacramento County generates 1000’s of TONS! of green waste, much of which used to be brought to an area between the old Southern Pacific tracks and the American river, where it would repose in giant piles. Churned occasionally, eventually resulting in wondrous brownish-black sweet-smelling mulch! All comers could get a yard or so for free, just show up with a pick-up or trailer…

  73. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 2:15 pm #

    Yes Labor wants to take as much as possible and give as little as possible. Capital wants the same. They are united in their desire for stasis, death. Why not replace people who don’t want to work or pay for work by machines? Why not be downloaded into a machine a la Kurtzweil?
    People who love Life and/or God see things very differently from either side.

  74. azgog March 12, 2012 at 2:19 pm #

    I think the Amish are correct in believing that we are closest to God (defined any way you wish) when working the land. But to think that backyard plots are going to substitute for the oil based industrialized, mechanized, fertilized cold chain system we have now is a fantasy. Especially when climate change brings us bigger storms, longer droughts and extended runs of 100 degree days to wilt or uproot all our efforts.
    Re wood heat: Even with the huge advantage of a working chainsaw its a lot of work and must be planned out a year ahead. Green wood is incredibly heavy, hard to split and won’t burn worth a damn. Try ringing a standing tree a season ahead and let it dry on the stump. (Ring it wide enough that the sap doesn’t run over and heal the break).
    Splitting with a maul is a high impact, dangerous and frustrating experience. I suggest an electric splitter – these only run(quietly)for the few seconds needed for each stroke, unlike a gas splitter that runs continuously. Very possible to run on a solar PV system with a big enough inverter. Same goes for an electric saw for bucking up the logs you have skidded in with your draft horse, ox or team of goats (good luck with that).

  75. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 2:24 pm #

    We need American (White) Women to start having more babies. All these other things are things we should foist on other races – as Planned Parenthood planned when it was under the capable hands of Margaret Sanger herself.
    But the moral question remains: why should Catholics and other Christains be forced to fund things they don’t agree with? That is the crux – which you very conveneniently left out. You see, I’m learning that all women argue in devious fashion.
    The Catholic Church in Boston was forced to close its child placement services when MA legalized gay marriage. Do you want a repeat perfomance on a grand scale? The Catholic Medical Establishment is huge. Do you want it closed? It can’t do these procedures nor can it insure women who are to cheap to pay a few dollars a month for the Pill. Helen, honey, baby, c’mon. Where are your Libertarian Principles? Your Homework: a complete rereading of Ayn Rand’s Atlas shrugged.

  76. sevenmmm March 12, 2012 at 2:47 pm #

    What a strange blog. Someone actually acting out.
    Did you receive all your SS up front or something?
    Well, all joking aside (maybe), my small potato patch – totally surrounded by wild plants – did very well. No potato bugs! I am still eating on them. Yesterday I slightly boiled some of the wild marble-sized spuds in salted water – and then fried them with onions – just before mixing them into a jiggly batch of scrambled eggs. Oh man, heaven on Earth!
    After while, should you actually have nerves near your skin, you will be able to feel them crawl on you the very second they grab hold.
    The little lyme carriers though are a bit harder to detect, so you have to “feel yourself” regularly. After while it gets to be a game.
    “Aha! I got you you little bastard”, right before you throw it on the woodburner, or crush its life on a rock.
    Likely spots to check are belly buttons, armpits, ankles, belt line, and head hair. Stay away from the groin area, that might distract you from tick checking.

  77. Harmon March 12, 2012 at 2:52 pm #

    Hamster wrote: “Buffalo Bird Woman described how the Arikawa grew the Three Sisters. There’s also a good description of various arrangements in Corn Growing among the Indians of the Upper Midwest,”
    Yes, and there is also strong evidence for a fourth “sister” — purslane. Purslane is a companion plant for corn and it’s deep growing roots provide a pathway for corn roots to get much deeper, faster and also is a very nutritious plant in and of itself. It also provides a mulching effect, shading the soil.

  78. Laura Louzader March 12, 2012 at 2:56 pm #

    OH please, Vlad.
    You’re REALLY saying we need more poor white people who can’t afford to educate or nourish their kids.
    Half the people in this country make less than $25,000 a year and the White Working Class is now becoming a badly lettered underclass with all the “ghetto” pathologies such as out-of-wedlock childbirths, rising high school drop out rates and violent crime rates, that we used associate with minorities. The reason for this is that the high-paying union jobs that underwrote the prosperity and manners of the fabled White Working Class of old are long gone, replaced by part time jobs, minimum wage, and “contract” work.
    There is no way people so reduced can possibly provide their kids with stable, decent homes. And to this mix you want to add MORE BABIES and drive more people into poverty? All that has to happen with most lower-middle-class families to make them lower-class families is one or two additional kids.
    Listen, I’m watching as families I know lose jobs, homes, cars, and any purchase on normal life at all. I see them living in motels, in SROs, and sometimes, on the CTA trains.
    And, believe me, when you end up poor and jobless, no want wants you or your children. If you, Vlad, are so eager to see white children born, why, you should be glad to help support a few of the tens of thousands of them in the custody of the DCSF whose parents can’t or won’t support them. Do you think it’s a good idea to add to their number?
    Even leaving race and class out of it, it is just plain bad policy to increase the population- in ANY demographic- while the resource base shrinks.
    Any woman who wants to survive now and ensure the survival of her existing children would be wise to limit herself to 2 children at the max and hope other women decline to breed at all, to give her kids a chance to breathe, never mind eat and go to school and perhaps have a nest egg to start adulthood with.

  79. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 3:00 pm #

    We’re on a highway to hell. I’m reading the original, unedited version of Stephen King’s “The Stand”. I read it every other year, with Pournell’s “Lucifer’s Hammer on off years. Have to get one’s head right. There’s already rats in the corn. Like these:
    http://12160.info/profiles/blogs/california-poised-to-require-gay-history-lessons?xg_source=activity
    And just a few months ago Wage mocked me for saying that Homosexuality would be taught in school. But did she really believe that?

  80. Grouchy Old Girl March 12, 2012 at 3:02 pm #

    Just had this wild thought that we should put Laura and Vlad together in a locked room to duke it out. We could televise it on pay-per-view and use the proceeds for a family planning clinic or perhaps an anti-racism centre.
    Just can’t figure out who’s worse, Vlad or Laura. Both espouse the most odious and disagreeable sentiments and together, paint a picture of the ugliest American stereotype.
    Again I give thanks to my grandparents who decided to live on the north side of Lake Ontario when they came from England a hundred years or so ago.
    Individualism is fine but it’s a lousy way to organize a society. Many Americans have forgotten the power of collectivism, where people work together for a common goal, whether that is their health through government health insurance programs, or a strong public school system where all our children, even the poor ones, have at least a chance of reaching their potential and giving back to the community as adults.
    We are all in this together and need each other to survive more than ever. It is people like Vlad and Laura who make our survival that much more difficult and painful. A pox on both of them.

  81. Anne March 12, 2012 at 3:02 pm #

    Speaking from our own experience, you will need to try a variety of fruit trees that bloom at different times. The last several years we have had our trees bloom early during periods of “unseasonable” warmth, only to have the blossoms/early buds all blasted by frost afterwards. Global warming is really fucking up the cycle. We are going to look for late-blooming varieties to try to compensate for this problem. Twenty trees would be more than enough – if you actually got fruit. We have not had much success with ours. Last year, for example, nobody around here got any apples at all. The year before was a bumper crop. So you will need to plan for dry years. Pigs and chickens are a good way to use up excess.
    Also re: chopping, I recommend investing in a good axe in addition to the chain saw. And learning to use it. Estwing makes a decent axe that is sharp and is all in one piece. I’m sure someone will tell you there are better and more expensive axes out there but I like the fact that this is all in one piece and made in the US. The two-piece axes have a tendency to fall apart if not maintained (something my husband, our family woodcutter, is not good about) If you do have to cut wood by hand, a good axe and splitting maul make a world of difference. My husband seems to think that splitting wood by hand is great enjoyment, and he is 60-something.

  82. grisowoody March 12, 2012 at 3:10 pm #

    As far as ticks and Lyme disease are concerned there’s hope – research at the field trial stage with chalcid wasps, fungi and nematodes shows that ticks are not immune to predatory organisms. In near future it may be possible to keep this nuisance at bay with biological agents.
    And, by the way: Don’t be too harsh on all the climbers and creepers in your forest – some of them flower abundantly and for many months. What about a couple of beehives though?

  83. Alannala March 12, 2012 at 3:11 pm #

    I was going to write there’s an app for that — but there’s a jig for that- chainsaw blade. Makes it easy to get the correct angle to dress the edge.

  84. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 3:11 pm #

    Note how she focused exclusively on the controversial racial part of my post – ignoring completely e rock solid question of rights and Christian Principles. Oh, deceit thy name is woman.
    I don’t want to pay for your whoring. Can you respect that? You will, if not now then later. Feminism dies on the Day!
    You don’t have to respect my Religion or my Racial Beliefs, but you will respect my rights not to pay for things I don’t believe in.
    There would be plenty of jobs for all those Whites if we kicked out the illegals. Why isn’t anyone talking about That? Well then have it your own way: those White Kids may be the soldiers of White Liberation.
    Notice how she says any woman who values her children…Where is the Father here? Oh you have the State so you don’t need the Father? The State may go away soon….Your paradigm is outdated. Woman and children are going to need a man again. Back to normal in other words.

  85. Bustin J March 12, 2012 at 3:15 pm #

    Hi Anne, ever done a cost/benefit analysis?
    I’m not suggesting there are better options than burning wood, however, burning wood releases toxic polyaromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs) which could give you or your husband lung cancer- not to mention the neighbors or the neighbor’s dog. Just saying.
    I’ve been doing a bit of figuring about wood heat. In the event of a full-scale meltdown of the world’s petroleum reserves and the impoverishment of most people, we’ll likely resort to burning anything thats dry enough to light, and in the process, plunge ourselves deeply back into the 19th century, just when we need to evolve rapidly to fix our carbon emission problem.
    Where I like electricity is around a dime per kWh. That is, for my humble abode, it requires about a half-kWh to heat the place to something reasonable that keeps the place from molding, per hour. So a nickel, for instance. Not too bad considering my place is about 180 sq. ft.
    What is my point? My point is, have you really considered the costs and benefits of using wood to heat your place? The hidden costs are things like shortened lifespan, or wasted time and energy, or the indirect effects of creating more carbon emissions.
    Aging 60 year olds do relish the exercise, I will grant that. However, chopping and splitting wood is not risk-free.

  86. Tim March 12, 2012 at 3:15 pm #

    Every time I hear the comments about guns and fences I think, OTOH, these folks have never walked before. How far are they going to get when things are disorganized before they stop? And if it’s winter? (I’ve got oh 8 guns… and several thousand rounds on hand, and both me and my girl are proficient, but I don’t see it happening.)
    I think being in a low density area is its own protection. The firewood isn’t going to get stripped if people have to carry it somewhere else – because if they still had gasoline they’d be using that for heating fuel.
    Same goes for hunting. Speaking as a NYC boy, born and raised, now in rural Albany County, I can tell you that me and my friends – all decent shots – went on literally years of PETA approved hunting trips (absolutely no wildlife was in danger) and that finally changed when my future father in law started giving me lessons. If well equipped and fed city people who already know guns and have vehicles and private land (I’ve got a lot, and it’s thick with deer) can’t pull this off for years, I don’t think the deer have too much to fear from most of the refugees. Actually, most of the people who would hunt already do… and as long as the power lasts will have some in their freezer.
    I’ll go further and say that most of the Brooklynite hipsters I’ve talked to about this are totally not thinking about going anywhere unfamiliar if TSHTF. It takes a year or two living up here to just acclimate to the cold and being in it – and sure helps if you bought the right clothing ahead of time.
    What I’d expect in a situation like that is a lot of road blocks… blown bridges… etc.

  87. Tim March 12, 2012 at 3:18 pm #

    And whenever you buy gas for small engines, as a matter of course put gas stabilizer in it. You’ll spend a lot less time pulling out spark plugs.
    I’m thinking primitive, omnivorous engines like my Ford 8N will be the wave of the future for a bit… should be possible to make it run on ethanol, for the occasions where that kind of energy use is actually worth it.

  88. Tim March 12, 2012 at 3:22 pm #

    Word I got from Cornell Ag on this was that if you put the beds relatively close together they also won’t jump if they don’t think they’ve got a good place to land. I’ve only got one of my 8 beds done (got the wood and compost on hand for the others) so that’s also my task for the spring, but I found last year that even with all of the deer we had, a dog that can get out a dog door in the middle of the night more than did the trick – for now anyway.

  89. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 3:25 pm #

    Large oil deposit found in Kenya. Just by coincidence, now we have to go fight in Kenya “for the children”. It’s a Kony Island of the Mind.
    http://www.counter-currents.com/2012/03/kony-2012-and-fifth-generation-warfare/#more-24496

  90. horseoutside March 12, 2012 at 3:27 pm #

    if you spread it inside your exterior walls, it helps with the insulation.

  91. steve-o March 12, 2012 at 3:37 pm #

    A few words about composts: herbicide carryover can occur in hay, manure, compost, grass clippings. Ask about what was used on hay for broadleaf control and what crops livestock have been fed. A whole family of herbicides known as pyridine carboxylic acids can end your gardening hopes. Picloram in composted hay/manure has destroyed commercial tomato crops. Vegetables sensitive to it are tobacco family members (tomatoes, bell pepper, eggplant, potatoes) and legumes (beans and peas). My tomatoes had grotesque leaves, few fruit; cukes too bitter to eat, beans never reached maturity. More info available from State Extension Services. NC, OH, & WA have good web pages. If you Google Picloram, that will get you started. Don’t trust the “Fact Sheets” from the herbicide manufacturers about longevity of the toxins.

  92. Zadeekah March 12, 2012 at 3:40 pm #

    Great to hear about your garden. I started mine a couple years ago, and you may benefit from what I’ve learned. First, about those deer. I live in a retirement community with a large family of free roaming deer. Like you, I first thought of a fence, but I like having everything open and a fence makes the place seem too much like one of those prisoner of war camps. I then tried something called Deer Away, a spray that did keep the deer away but had to be resprayed after every rain (which is just about every day in the Pacific NW). Then I found Plantskydd, which is also a spray and granules, and you lay the stuff down once or twice a year. The deer stay completely away from this place (I have about 50 fruit trees, bushes, and vines. I don’t expect the societal breakdown that you do, but I prefer fresh fruit and veges to the cardboard and paste and toxins of processed foods.)
    Another thing I would mention is about those fruit trees. I assume you know that some fruits are self-fertile, while others, like apples and most peaches require two of the appropriate kind? I would add plums, European if you like stuff that stays fresh, Japanese if you like sweet, juicy, and very short-lived fruit. Figs, also, almonds (a good protein substitute), pomegranate and persimons are beautiful ornamental trees as well as productive. In addition to blueberries, try gooseberries, goji berry, aronia, and grapes.
    As for veges, it seems a bit early for warm weather things like beans. You might want to start with some snow peas, beets, spinach and other cool weather things before going to hot weather stuff like tomatoes and beans. Start your potatoes now, in a barrel, cover with 3-4 inches of soil and straw, water, and when green shoots appear, cover again with soil and straw until you get to the top, then you can let the green grow; this way, every layer forces rooting (and thus potatoes).
    And one more thing, be patient. Live and learn. If one thing doesn’t work, wait a year. As for the raised beds, I too have them, but mine are three feet off the ground because at my age (70), bending over gets hard on the back. Have fun!

  93. Laura Louzader March 12, 2012 at 3:40 pm #

    Exactly what is “odious” about my contention that we are breeding ourselves into poverty and that anybody who gives a damn about her kids will stick to 2?
    That’s all I said.
    I hate to see what has happened to our white working class, just as I hate to see what continues to happen to our black working class.
    I am not a racist, in case you are somehow imputing that from the fact that I mention the White working class.
    I would so rather have see black people prosper. I don’t believe that there’s anything intrinsically inferior about any particular race or ethnic group.
    I only think it’s tragic that, instead of our poor minorities moving ahead by developing orderly habits, limiting their fertility, and helping their children ascend to the next level; that people who formerly led good lives have now joined the poor underclass and are developing the familiar “ghetto” pathologies that all people seem to develop when they fall from stable prosperity, to poverty and instability.
    What is so difficult to understand about that? What is “odious” about that?
    And, yeah, we need to restrict the egress of new people into this country because we are at the limits of our carrying capacity, not because there is anything wrong with these people. There isn’t. But if hordes of people like me tried to enter France, say, or even Mexico, we would be met with a lot of resistance.
    And to Vlad: As long as mothers have 80% of the responsibility for their children, they will have the most to say about how many are born. Dad should have the right to limit the number of births, but not the right to insist on them where the mother does not want to give birth to more kids.

  94. messianicdruid March 12, 2012 at 3:42 pm #

    James’ post reminded me of an auctioneer friend, serendipitously named Wendt, who visited the Mennonites of [ prophetically named ] Rich Hill in preparation for their 8th annual horse auction. That day they had assembled 92 teams of large, mostly blondish, draft horses to dig a pond. They completed the task in one day, and he said the pond was 16 or 17 feet deep. We commiserated about the rarity of teamwork among most folks and the worthy example these were setting. I am looking forward to seeing it [ half full ] in April. See you there?
    http://www.wendtauction.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=53&Itemid=48

  95. grisowoody March 12, 2012 at 4:01 pm #

    When I was a youngun – in the early forties – my dad taught me how to compost. I have been doing it ever since, successfully, in many places. My experiences with compost from public mulch plants are not encouraging, nowadays I stick to my own. It’s easy to manage the quality by careful mixing in of natural minerals (here it’s ground limestone, marl, or clay). Never had any complaints about unpleasant odours (but invite your neighbour to join, just in case). A great place for life: Frogs and blindworms hibernating in the fermentation-warmed patch underneath, millipedes hunting woodlice, etc.: Zoology lessons the easy way, my grandchildren like it!

  96. RyeBeachBum March 12, 2012 at 4:03 pm #

    Jim get a hydraulic splitter if you have not already, round here they go used for a bout 1K, also plant some Jerusalem artichoke, good to eat very nutritious and once they get going will last a long time in the garden, years even. Buy a Scythe and some sharpening tools for it and look into forest gardening. The crash is coming soon, any post could be the last, so good luck and see you in the funny papers.

  97. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 4:12 pm #

    Dog doors can be used by not dogs – say cat burglars with racoon eyes.

  98. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 4:17 pm #

    Don’t know if you’ve been monitoring, but Grouch, Helen, and Dee all want Whites bred out of existence into a kind of tan man or a “lovely cafe au late” color. So much for diversity, eh? The idea of diversity is used to destroy actual diversity. Very clever – not that these girls thought of it. They’re just well programmed. Women really are weaker vessels.

  99. Phutatorius March 12, 2012 at 4:33 pm #

    “Egress” means going out. I hope, among all this apocalyptic doom that some semblance of community spirit can be maintained.
    -Phut.

  100. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 4:33 pm #

    Jim Kunstler, Im wondering what you spend to heat yr place each year?

  101. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 4:37 pm #

    ‘I would so rather have [see] black people prosper. I don’t believe that there’s anything intrinsically inferior about any particular race or ethnic group.’
    Maybe you could do a ‘Margaret Mead’ and study
    Nairobi, if you do, get back to us as to what you find.

  102. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 4:42 pm #

    The Sina Loa Cartel is now infiltrating Australia!

  103. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 4:44 pm #

    ‘It did keep the bugs off but the squirrels stole every last damn apple! ‘
    Here in L.A. squirrels and possums will eat as many Figs off the trees as they can.

  104. scarlet runner March 12, 2012 at 4:56 pm #

    Interesting post. A word of advice about the ticks, Jim, from someone who has been dealing with tick bites for a long time:
    Early removal (within 24 hours) is key. Use your fingertips to grasp them, pull gently, and be patient. They will let go. You don’t want to crush the ticks. If you are lucky you will, after repeated bites, develop an itch response to any new bites. This will tip you off that you probably have to remove a tick.

  105. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 4:57 pm #

    Thanks, Its like public transit in Soviet Monika..
    I guess its Big Boss makes 200 or 300k a year, if not more.
    Clearly he doesnt ride the buses and he doesn’t listen to those who do.
    HERE IN THE ‘SUSTAINABLE CITY’…bah humbug.

  106. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 4:59 pm #

    Its best to not burn anything, unless you must.
    Cows have several stomachs and eat straw.
    Their dung is burnable.
    Is human? Maybe, better to put in or near a garden.

  107. Anne March 12, 2012 at 5:06 pm #

    Can’t recommend guinea fowl. They are noisy fuckers and they do not get on with the chickens. The chickens are much more important to the self-sufficient homesteader.
    Someone mentioned berries and that reminded me I wanted to advocate those as well. Even though fruit trees are struggling to produce for the last few years, we still get a LOT of blackberries every summer. Ours are the “wild” type but who cares? Yes, they have thorns and run riot but they provide a significant amount of free food. That’s going to be much more important that aesthetic concerns down the road.

  108. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 5:07 pm #

    Except Dear Laura that since the “great society’
    Blacks have tripled their US population.
    Under Obambi Black immigration and Muslim houses of worship have skyrocketed.
    So there.
    Whites worldwide are a smaller and smaller % of population.
    And far as I can tell of the 4 races only 2 invent things.
    Guess which 2?

  109. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 5:08 pm #

    ‘Exactly what is “odious” about my contention that we are breeding ourselves into poverty’
    That its a lie.
    We are warring, diversifying and governing ourselves there.

  110. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 5:14 pm #

    Catholic Medical Establishment is huge….
    Christians and Jews built hospitals.
    The churches of Jehovah Witness and Scientology
    put their $ into recruiting instead.

  111. Corey March 12, 2012 at 5:15 pm #

    Corey From DFW Texas writes:
    Hi, I read JHK’s blog every monday and most of the comments, I really look forward to it.
    One thing I’d like to request; for example Anna; you mention “in our area” and talk about your experience with fruit trees.
    We don’t know where you live; a lot of you make the assumption that we do. Perhaps you have said where you live in the past, but it’s hard to keep up with everybody.
    It should become a new internet convention to write what I did up at the top. Also, please use fewer acronyms. I had to look up “CTA” earlier for example. If the poster had said they were in the Chicago area, this would have simplified things much more.
    Trying my best to prepare for The Long Emergency!

  112. Anne March 12, 2012 at 5:26 pm #

    @Bustin
    My husband is cheap and wood is free for us as over half our acreage is wooded. Every year there are trees that are downed through natural causes or PGE maintaining the lines, so we have no shortage of free wood. I don’t think heating with wood makes sense for a lot of people but it is for us.
    We have a large high-ceilinged house that was mostly built in 1900. We’ve insulated very well and put in double paned windows but electric heat – even with the solar panels we also have – is not efficient in my experience. We burn wood in the kitchen stove and stay in the area during the winter. At night we heat the upstairs. Our heating system uses propane.
    As far as the health issues go, I agree burning wood is unhealthy. This argument bears no weight with my husband for reasons too complicated to get into here. But in the long run we’ll all be dead anyway.

  113. Anne March 12, 2012 at 5:27 pm #

    Also, my neighbors are not nearly close enough for my wood burning stove to be a health concern for them. And in any case, they are all burning wood as well.

  114. DeeJones March 12, 2012 at 5:51 pm #

    Jim, finally, a good topic, with mostly good, on-topic responses.
    Can’t you see how much better your blog is when the posters stay on topic, rather than going off on some idiotic racist BS? You know who I am talking about. Why can’t you do something about these persons? You have seemingly banned people for much less.
    I know you have done it before. All the racist BS IS REALLY dragging your website down the pipes, I know many that no longer read it because the commentary is just so demeaning.
    I really would request that you state in clear terms just why you tolerate all the distracting racist BS, and why you continue to allow certain racist persons to hijack your blog and drag it in the mud of their idiotic and delusional minds.
    And this isn’t a matter of ‘free speech’, this is your blog, and the content really does reflect back on you.
    Thank you.
    Dee

  115. IntegralResearchSociety March 12, 2012 at 5:53 pm #

    It is always interesting to discover someone defending Catholic — and other Christains [sic] — rights to stick with policies that were “set in stone” when the population was a fraction of what it is now. It is really interesting — and all too common — to see someone defend these rights and then refer the reader to the work of Ayn Rand. Vlad, you might want to pull out your copy of The Ayn Rand Lexicon and give it a thorough review. For interested spectators, this discussion between Vlad and Laura is a classic case of a traditionalist and a postmodernist sharing their worldview. For more, google “Spiral Dynamics”.

  116. TRAD March 12, 2012 at 5:58 pm #

    You do not need the der fence, Collect human urine and spread it around the perimeter of the garden and the deer will not mess with the garden. Your urine will do.

  117. helen highwater March 12, 2012 at 6:08 pm #

    Thank you, Grouchy Old Girl, my sentiments exactly! I’ve pretty much stopped reading the comments because of the slime being spewed out by those two (and a few others).

  118. erikSF99 March 12, 2012 at 6:11 pm #

    “Out here on the West Coast I’ve been bitten a few times by ticks. A couple of times I had the bull’s eye response but never got Lyme’s disease.”
    Mike, that’s because West Coasters have been given a gift from Mother Nature: The Western Fence Lizard.
    http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/1998/04/17/MN65130.DTL&ao=all
    “Lizards Slow Lyme Disease in West
    Ticks bite them — and leave with purified blood”
    As Wikipedia summarizes: Studies have shown that Lyme disease is lower in areas where the lizards occur. When ticks carrying Lyme disease feed on these lizards’ blood (which they commonly do, especially around their ears), a protein in their blood kills the bacterium that causes Lyme disease. The ticks’ blood is therefore cleansed and no longer carries Lyme disease.
    From the SF Gate article: “The percentage of infected deer ticks in high Lyme disease areas such as Connecticut is 30 to 60 percent. But the percentage of black-legged ticks — the closely related cousins that carry Lyme disease in California — is only 1 to 2 percent.
    “In California, only about one in every 200,000 persons is infected with Lyme disease. In Connecticut, where Lyme disease was first discovered in the rural town of Lyme, the rate is 100 times higher.”
    I see that the Eastern Fence Lizard lives all the way up into Pennsylvania and Ohio. Maybe they’d like to switch out their fence lizards.

  119. helen highwater March 12, 2012 at 6:13 pm #

    Don’t give up on the arugula! It WILL grow in pots. Most people aren’t born with a “green thumb”, it usually takes some trial and error to develop one. Get a container gardening book from the library. It’s a bit different from gardening in the ground. Talk to successful gardeners in your neighbourhood. Make sure your pots have good drainage and at least 6 hours of sun a day. And some reasonably fertile potting mix.

  120. helen highwater March 12, 2012 at 6:19 pm #

    Nothing keeps out deer like a good fence. Urine might work but you’d have to faithfully renew it every time it rains, and not miss any places. With a big garden that could be hard to accomplish. Urine is better used as fertilizer, diluted with 10 parts water. Very high in nitrogen. Read “Liquid Gold” by Carol Steinfeld for more details on using this valuable fertilizer. Or see http://www.liquidgoldbook.com

  121. cameta March 12, 2012 at 6:26 pm #

    In Spain we have a terrible drought and the government’s solution is more of the same: channels, dams and diversions.
    http://www.aemet.es/imagenes_gcd/noticias/imagen_noticia_detalle/2012/02/PrecipG-01-12.jpg
    http://www.aemet.es/imagenes_gcd/noticias/imagen_noticia_detalle/2012/03/PrecipG-02-12.jpg

  122. trippticket March 12, 2012 at 6:31 pm #

    I see a lot of talk about community building, and I am certainly guilty of the happy cooperation talk myself. I want to toss out my perspective on this really quickly, though: everything we do in our culture is very, very, VERY deeply ingrained in our subconscience, and as Americans individualism is who we are. It’s true that we will absolutely have to work together to survive in a lower energy future, but transitioning from individualism to communal cooperation takes time. If we have time to make a multi-generational transition then we can do it, no doubt; if we don’t have that luxury we will surely fail at the task. We’ve tried, my wife and I, twice now, to live and work in a multi-family effort, and it is hard. When you don’t own the land it’s hard to plant and tend your fruit trees, and improve pastures, and take direction from the land-owner when you know better.
    History shows us that people are capable of banding together and working cooperatively in times of crisis, so maybe it would be best if we did suffer an unmistakable catastrophe to push us on our way. As it is, we all look like a bunch of crack-pots preparing for an Armegeddon that will never arrive. The sheer inertia of our cultural trajectory is keeping us from making useful, proactive changes in direction, at least at any critical mass. Being one of the ones preparing for a different kind of future, when that future isn’t really here yet, is difficult, but necessary, and I wish you all the strongest backbone and most resolute countenance in the face of the masses arrayed against you. Family is the worst of all sometimes. Don’t back down; they will eventually respect your foresight. You might even just save their lives.
    Work on community, it is going to be necessary, but don’t expect to be good at it right away. Just my .02

  123. ozone March 12, 2012 at 6:32 pm #

    Got sucked right in, didn’t ya?
    Goddamnit, LL,
    DO
    NOT
    FEED
    THE
    GUM’MINT
    TROLLS!
    Clear? It might be infuriating to keep it unchallenged, but give it a try, won’t you? We’ll all have a more on-topic discussion that’a’way.
    Alrighty then, thanks.

  124. ragingrockriver March 12, 2012 at 6:32 pm #

    Hi Jim,
    Don’t send your chainsaw to the shop to get a busted chain fixed! It’s easy to do yourself. Get 6 chains and learn to sharpen them yourself. Use the guide thingy you put on the file at first, but with some practice you’ll learn to do it faster without that.
    Stick with one or two low-kickback chains till you get good habits and confidence, then go to the more aggressive chain. Get a raker file to keep the bite correct as your chains go through multiple sharpenings. Be aware as you go, you have more control over the kickback characteristics, and when you get more aggressive do it slowly.
    Managing chains carefully won’t just keep your muscles from being overtaxed and keep you safer, it will also save on fuel. Retire the chain for sharpening as soon as you hit dirt or rock, that will save you a lot of work.
    Also, in my chaps I keep a packet of quick-clot in case I do something stupid. But I won’t. I don’t hurry, I wear steel toe boots, plan ahead as I work, and don’t pull the trigger without good footing.
    Find the nearest Game-Of-Logging sponsored chainsaw safety and felling class, and spend the day in the woods with them.
    Also, when they tell you wood heats you twice, they’re talking about your sweat cutting the wood. But that’s a lie, it’s really more like 5 times when you’re done felling, bucking, hauling, splitting, and stacking it. At least with that lifestyle you’re less likely to need the triple bypass that could be in short supply. (By the way, I split about a third of our fuel this year by hand by maul wedge and sledge, what a great workout!)
    Enjoy.
    PS to deal with deer, use some wide highly visible tape wrapped around some light fence posts about stomach high. Tie it loose enough so it wavers in the wind, and the motion will deter deer from jumping over it. Worked a good trick in our 60×30 foot plot last year.

  125. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 6:34 pm #

    Will gardens be poached to death as well?

  126. jeff z March 12, 2012 at 6:36 pm #

    You go James! Best of luck to you in your homesteading adventures. I had seen your photo essay re: your new town and wondered what that was about- this is the answer! I’ve associated you with Saratoga Springs for so long, it’s hard to imagine you pulling up stakes, but it sounds like you have a worthy project underway!
    Regarding Lymes disease- it’s no joke. I’ve had it and it’s hellish. The increase in deer ticks (Lyme’s preferred vector) has a lot to do with the increase in the deer population, and should follow the deer population down as it decreases in the way you suggested- which won’t be too long off.
    Antibiotics took care of Lyme’s pretty quickly for me, but I had to diagnose it. The doctors in SW Wisconsin, a hot spot for the disease, weren’t all that familiar with the symptoms 10 years ago, which surprised me. After a misdiagnosis, I had to go back to the clinic and ask the nurse for a Lyme’s test- which confirmed what I already knew.
    My own brand of homesteading is urban, albeit in a mid-sized midwestern city, not demographically unlike your part of the world. Stop by at http://eighthacrefarm.blogspot.com/ in case I have something to say that might be useful. Or just leave a comment with your name on it, which would be the high point of my week.
    Cheers. jz

  127. ozone March 12, 2012 at 6:37 pm #

    Another idea:
    http://ecorenovator.org/forum/biofuels/1304-human-powered-hydraulic-wood-splitter.html
    Now, get to work.

  128. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 6:41 pm #

    Rand is so yesterday!
    As far as yr ‘Christains [sic] — rights to stick with policies that were “set in stone” when the population was a fraction of what it is now’
    Yes 1000 years ago the world population was a fraction of what it is now.
    And the population explosion is not happening within ‘Christians’, most everywhere but there.
    [Central and South America excepted].

  129. ozone March 12, 2012 at 6:46 pm #

    Best gadget I ever purchased for the job:
    http://www.treestuff.com/store/catalog.asp?category_id=229&item=1396
    I just use a lumber crayon to mark the tooth I started on.

  130. Jim from Watkins Glen March 12, 2012 at 6:47 pm #

    Careful with that chain saw. The things can kick back. Think hard hat.

  131. ozone March 12, 2012 at 6:58 pm #

    Excellent advice, Steve.
    Thanks!
    (Although I have poor glacial soils, there has never been any “modern” farming practices used on this land or “uphill” from me in the vast woodlands. Starting from scratch isn’t easy, but we’re lucky to now have a lot of information about the composition of healthy soils and how to achieve them.)

  132. scott March 12, 2012 at 7:05 pm #

    Get some Guinea Fowl and some Chickens, they love to eat ticks and chiggers. Get some waders for when you want to go into the woods and spray your boots with Off or something. The first year is the worst reaction to ticks and chigger bites, I think your immune system combined with strict checking your body after being in the woods and the aforementioned preventative measures helps with the, “getting used to it”.

  133. ozone March 12, 2012 at 7:08 pm #

    Competed with the [inexperienced] bears for the blackberries last year, so I only made 10 gallons of wine; year before, 20.
    There’s a fun use for blackberries. ;o)

  134. trippticket March 12, 2012 at 7:10 pm #

    “but we’re lucky to now have a lot of information about the composition of healthy soils and how to achieve them.)”
    Promote that book, OP!!

  135. ozone March 12, 2012 at 7:11 pm #

    These work really well for me and the aminals too!
    http://www.ticktwister.com/
    (I’m also very cheap, as you might deduce. ;o)

  136. trippticket March 12, 2012 at 7:11 pm #

    “DO
    NOT
    FEED
    THE
    GUM’MINT
    TROLLS!”
    Jess says “LOL.”

  137. ozone March 12, 2012 at 7:16 pm #

    Ummmm, I’ll be sure to put you on my scroll-over Irrelevancy List as well.
    Thanks!

  138. scott March 12, 2012 at 7:19 pm #

    Chigarid for Insect Bites – .5 oz
    http://www.medshopexpress.com/10030075.html

  139. ajalugu March 12, 2012 at 7:22 pm #

    Here in SE Australia we have just had a complete non-summer: rain, cloud, cold days. Tomatoes and eggplants giving up and dying, the smell of mildew in the air. The climate’s going nuts.

  140. bubbleheadMarc March 12, 2012 at 7:25 pm #

    Congratulations on buying your own land. Nice change of pace from all the economics oriented columns recently. Maybe you could shoot some of those deer for the meat.

  141. trippticket March 12, 2012 at 7:26 pm #

    “Yes, they have thorns and run riot but they provide a significant amount of free food. That’s going to be much more important that aesthetic concerns down the road.”
    A more astute truism is difficult to come by. A garden that is productive, low input, and also beautiful is truly rare. But it is possible.

  142. azgog March 12, 2012 at 7:33 pm #

    To mark the first anniversary of Fukishima – as we in North America feel the waking of the garden and all its possibilities – this elequence from the disaster zone. Read it and weep. http://shuttomari.blogspot.com/2012/03/from-fukushima-we-change-world-sachiko.html

  143. helen highwater March 12, 2012 at 7:44 pm #

    Get some mason bees. Often poor fruit set is caused by poor pollination. The honey bees might not be around due to weather conditions, but mason bees are excellent pollinators. Around here mason bee cocoons and bee houses are available at all garden supply stores, or you can make your own mason bee houses wtih plans available on the Internet.

  144. zerotsm March 12, 2012 at 7:48 pm #

    I’ve been heating with wood during the coldest part of the year for over 10 years now. I have 40 acres of woodlot. We are on rocky soil, so trees rarely get a good foothold, so enough blow down in storms each year to supply the 6 cords that it takes to heat the whole house, very rarely have I had to cut down live trees. However last season it was so rainy during the cutting season (snow melt until June) that I had to purchase firewood. Hopefully this year will be better. I used to split by hand, but the year before last I rented a log splitter for the weekend. This winter was mild enough that I have a cord left over.
    If you got the space, and it sounds like you do, put in a bed of asparagus. It does just fine in cold climates. Give it a good head start by mixing cow manure 1:1 with the soil that you dig out of the trenches to back fill when you set your crowns It’s not too late to order them for your area. You won’t be able to take a full harvest for two years, but once established, the bed will produce for 20 years. I’ve expanded my bed so that some actually makes it into the house, because when I see the first spears come up I break them off and eat them raw right in the garden.
    For those wanting to plant “The Three Sisters”, heirloom varieties are available from Seeds of Change

  145. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 7:48 pm #

    s

  146. ozone March 12, 2012 at 7:54 pm #

    All good advice, and I’ll add: If you have a move over tumbled areas where there’s unsure footing of ANY KIND, shut the saw OFF; it’s not that much trouble to restart when within a stable area a few feet/yards close to where you need to work. Lazy people get hurt more often.

  147. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 7:57 pm #

    YOU
    ARE
    A
    MORONIC
    FOOL

  148. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 8:09 pm #

    The fetus trys to defend itself against the knife. Freedom? Your body? Of course – that’s what abstinence and birth control are for. I have no problem with them – nor does the Republcan Establishment. Of course, some Christians do.
    People are falling for the ploy played by the little Greek Midget. Women in particular. Obama’s rating are up. People are just too dumb and too easily bamboozled. Democracy is ridiculous if it means everyone.
    Rand is irrational too – like some Jews, she admired the beauty of Nordic body and mind. Yet the idea of Whites trying to save themselves horrified her. So passes the Builder Race or as the Chinese call us, the Dog Eyes. A brilliant race that left its footprints on the Moon but could not love itself enough to surive in a hostile world.

  149. ozone March 12, 2012 at 8:13 pm #

    Promote that book, OP!! -Tripp
    Huh? Wha-? OH!
    “Teaming with Microbes”
    (Note the spelling… ewwwww, teeming with bugs!)
    Stop it now!
    Here’s a link:
    http://www.amazon.com/Teaming-Microbes-Organic-Gardeners-Revised/dp/1604691131/ref=dp_ob_title_bk/186-8228325-9051157
    Ewwwww!
    (I said, stop it.)

  150. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 8:14 pm #

    Are those the same as carpenter bees?
    Laura hasn’t posted here in ages, hel. Why give her the credit for driving you off?

  151. ozone March 12, 2012 at 8:19 pm #

    The shape-shifter’s shift is on.
    Gotta put in their time. No typee, no payee (or foodee, porno-ee and shelteree, either).
    Don’t get distracted; important issues are front and center right now. Bullshit walks.

  152. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 8:24 pm #

    You dissapoint me Dee. I thought we were beyond this – running to the Teacher to tattle! Nobody like a tattle tale. I will continue to dip your braids in ink and use them to paint masterpieces.

  153. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 8:31 pm #

    Compost piles increase global warming. And even as doctors deny alchemy and deny the 4 elements, they use the language of alchemy – inflammation, etc.
    Indeed, it is the Tempter’s hour and you mock the Devil at your own risk. Never forget, as an Archangel he is more clever than a man can ever be.
    Mike says I work for the Vatican and you say Unk Sam. Care to debate him about this?

  154. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 8:35 pm #

    But what about Nicole? Are you REALLY supposed to be taking care of her, giving her a picket fence and Oldsmobile?
    One is reminded of John and Paul and the poor working class girls they left behind to live a life of glamour. You are a Rock Star of Permaculture.
    What is deep ecology btw and how does it differ? Just theory and not practice?

  155. Buck Stud March 12, 2012 at 8:37 pm #

    JHK writes:
    “About a week ago, I stopped on a country road to take a leak.”
    Good thing your career is established and your in the Fall(how about September) of life. Because a “Urinating In Public” ticket issued by some anal retentive cop is just the type of namby-pamby justice that can ruin a young man’s career before it ever starts.
    Laws like this are intended to turn men into bitches, squatting down to take a piss, or wearing a diaper to absorb the no water closet in site moment.

  156. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 8:42 pm #

    It amazes certain narrow minds, but more than one conversation can happen on this site at a time. I’m enjoying the practical stuff even if I don’t have much to contribute in this realm. It’s important (as is some (not all) of what I talk about) and I need to absorb it.
    Community? All real communities have jesters and they are both loved and hated. If they were only loved they wouldn’t be doing their job.
    Things are funny only when they contain at least an element of truth.

  157. Max March 12, 2012 at 8:57 pm #

    After listening to you for, last few years, I was shocked to find I was ahead of you instead of trailing,as were many others. Many of the Comments, have great suggestions.
    My 10Ft. Deer fence has been in two years, and works great. I use iron bar stakes instead of chicken wire on base but chicken wire is a very good idea. White flags on post are most useful when the fence is new, and not needed after deer get smart. My one American chestnut is 10 years old, and bought two more last year. My garden is a flower garden, not vegetables. It is a hillside with a great view of 50 miles of lake and forest.
    Vegetables are plentiful, with a lot less work.
    Glad to see you joining the work force. Maybe you will not be so hard on the”grasshopper people”, who may need your help in the future.

  158. trippticket March 12, 2012 at 9:30 pm #

    “What is deep ecology btw and how does it differ? Just theory and not practice?”
    To be honest, Vlad, I’ve never really checked it out. I would assume your second question to be near the mark. Permaculture is such a lifetime project that I usually feel plenty satisfied just trying to grasp its nuances, without the need to explore other paths. After I heard that story about Mollison I figured I was in the right place anyway.
    Just curious, by “Nicole” do you mean my wife, Jessica? I mentioned Nicole Foss (Automatic Earth) here once, and I think you took Nicole to be a reference to my wife. Fortunately, I married a woman who is very game for what we’re doing. Or has become game in the last 4 years, anyway. Good woman, with no need for a picket fence (much less an Oldsmobile). She very much prefers a blushing blueberry patch, as was evidenced on her face today as we toured the blossoms and early fruit set in the garden! A shame we have to start those roots all over again, although I can’t wait to be away from the sweltering heat, gnats, and oppressive conservatism. Have you checked out the demographics of Gilmer County, Georgia yet?

  159. thomas99 March 12, 2012 at 9:32 pm #

    I’m glad you’re doing what you’re doing, Jimbo (never too late to learn some new skills, right?). Maybe you’ll save the world…who knows?
    As you bust your ass on your new land, I doubt we’ll be seeing many more posts about your bucolic bike trips around Saratoga Springs.

  160. progress2conserve March 12, 2012 at 9:34 pm #

    Nice week’s work, JHK. Thanks to you, as always.
    Sounds like you’ve bought a pretty good place to try to ride out The Long Emergency. And I’m very glad to hear anyone getting fruit trees and gardens in place. Things like that take a little work, but they take a lot of knowledge and a LOT of time. You know the old saying – “the best time to plant a fruit tree was last year.”
    Lot’s of good comments this week two. Here’s my two cents:
    Concerning deer – an 8 foot fence is expensive overkill. There are a lot of ways to repel deer that are cheaper and more visually attractive. Now, if the fence might be useful for discouraging human intruders as years go by – that’s another matter.
    I think a shorter fence, or an electric fence, enclosing a canine would be a better deterrent – for both animal and human varmints. And I agree with the posters who suggest that deer won’t last long, at all, if food ever runs short. Too many little bags of birdseed, too many spotlights, and too many headshots at close range with a small caliber weapon – will make quick work of all sorts of wildlife populations.
    That sad eventuality will not take two years, either – more like two weeks, if hunger ever stalks the suburbs.
    Lot’s of good dialog on the thread this week.
    Lot’s of very prepared people with good ideas.
    I’ve got to pick up my own pace.
    Thanks for the encouragement, JHK and all!

  161. JonathanSS March 12, 2012 at 9:44 pm #

    Good comment. Before anybody gets baited, do a search of FPD, the Flamer Personality Disorder.

  162. progress2conserve March 12, 2012 at 9:47 pm #

    Bustin J –
    You usually get your chemistry and physics correct – but you’re off base concerning wood-burning.
    There are a lot of us in more rural areas, with easy access to wood – for whom wood burning stoves and heaters represent free heat, along with a fail-safe system in case the power grid ever goes down for more than a half-day or so.
    Besides, Bustin, you keep saying that wood is non-renewable AND that it contributes to atmospheric CO2. Both statements are untrue – given a timescale of longer than a decade or so.
    And electricity from coal is bad news – from a CO2 standpoint. And when the coal is gone – it’s GONE, man.
    I was shocked by this website:
    http://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/energy/question481.htm
    At your suggested 10 cents per KiloWattHour, BustinJ – every time you use $246.00 worth of electricity – you are DIRECTLY responsible for burning a TON of coal. And you are DIRECTLY responsible for adding 10 pounds of Sulfur Dioxide, 10 pounds of Nitrous Oxides, and about 4,000 pounds of CO2. Directly.
    I’ll keep burning renewable wood, for as long as I can sling the stuff around.
    Thank you, anyway.

  163. progress2conserve March 12, 2012 at 9:57 pm #

    Vlad – you disappoint me.
    I expect Republican Candidates to campaign against birth control. But you should be smarter than that.
    The cheaper the birth control, the easier the birth control – the more likely people without resources are to avail themselves of said birth control.
    Upper middle class and above women will always have access to BC and will always have access to safe abortions – until TH goes through TF.
    By campaigning against public funding of birth control, Vlad – you are campaigning FOR higher birthrates among those Blacks and Browns you fear.
    Nice counterpoints to Vlad, Laura L.
    I don’t understand why Grouchy and Helen are upset by what you said Laura. Some people –
    -actually MANY, MANY people, I’ve been seeing on CFN for the past month –
    Many people actively hate the truth, refuse to listen to the truth, and LABEL those who speak the truth RACIST or antisemitic. Strange. And unfortunate.
    Parallel conversations, Ozone – we can still talk gardens, chainsaws, and preparations. ;0)

  164. progress2conserve March 12, 2012 at 10:03 pm #

    “Lot’s of good comments this week two.”
    -p2c-
    Jeeze – sorry ’bout this folks.
    My grammur an spel chekers wuz busted, lot’s!

  165. trippticket March 12, 2012 at 10:11 pm #

    I’ve become mentally disconnected with my garden here in south Georgia since we’re moving to the mountains in the north part of the state, but for a gardener it’s damn near impossible to not get excited this time of year, whatever the circumstances might be. My wife and I are journeyman medicinal herbalists and some of the new herbs we started last year looked really good on our garden tour today. The climatically-marginal ones, like valerian, calendula, and comfrey all look really nice this time of year down here in the sultry south. They will benefit from our move north. I have 8 varieties of fig that will not be making the trip with us, since they occupy the other end of the climatic spectrum, and it was somehow hard on me to see them doing so well. We’ll add a couple of them back in as we get warm, sheltered micro-climates developed. Pomegranates too, and maybe even tangerines (protected for the first 3 winters). Self-heal is an herb that is doing really well in our south Georgia garden, as is yarrow, wormwood, sage, thyme, oregano, lavender, and lots of mints. Rosemary could become a small tree down here, given enough time, I think. Catnip too. Bee balm and lemon balm did surprisingly poorly.
    Our foraging has also taken some strides – I put my first spring tonic tincture in half a gallon of brandy to soak for a month on Saturday – dandelion, burdock, curly dock, cleavers, and stinging nettles. I’ve been engaging in a little “sado-botany” according to some, by slapping my arthritic hip with fresh stinging nettles. I’m actually starting to enjoy the burn, and it helps immensely. Rubbing some crushed cleavers (Gallium) on the wound cools the sting. Funny how the medicine and its compliments can almost always be found growing at the same time.
    I grow increasingly convinced that the only “weed” on the whole planet is fossil fuel-powered Homo sapiens. The others are just unfortunate products of our ill-conceived management practices and prejudice. Although I still seem able to find a little hatred in my heart for Bermuda grass. It’s a special kind of weed, straight from Hell. Anyway, sorry for rambling, but I think it’s going to be important to have a better understanding of our place among the biota in a lower energy future, and if this long-winded prose helps one person I’ll count it a success.

  166. Jimmy Drinkwater March 12, 2012 at 10:29 pm #

    Even the man who knows must be right.
    http://electronickiva.blogspot.com/

  167. trippticket March 12, 2012 at 10:34 pm #

    “Are those the same as carpenter bees?”
    I’m just going to answer this one uninvited! No, not the same. The mason bees are 2, maybe 3 species, I believe, of native bee that live sort of solitary lives, raising only a few young at a time, and are great pollinators where honeybees tend to remain grounded in their hives. Buy a little mason bee house and mount it near your garden, add a few larvae in their shipping straws, and watch your fruit set improve!

  168. Buck Stud March 12, 2012 at 10:36 pm #

    This is an interesting link you posted. And it begs the question: Is an enlightened individual, or at least one who has opened his heart per traditional spiritual practices, capable of hostile racist attitudes such as what you occasionally display here on CFN? After all, doesn’t the wise individual who has truly opened his heart, search for ‘simile in multis’ as opposed to splitting the eyebrows and eyelashes of humanities greater facial structure?
    Still, wouldn’t it be marvelous if pharmacology could achieve with a pill what takes the Yogi decades to accomplish? Not unlike the little blue pill putting a lot of sex therapists out of business.

  169. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 11:03 pm #

    s? Did you mean for s for sustainability or for Sith?

  170. Nathan March 12, 2012 at 11:06 pm #

    Jim,
    That’s the most positive and perhaps one of the most personal posts I’ve ever seen you write! And it’s about time! Your World Made By Hand series shows you’ve spent a huge amount of time imagining (or is that reimagining?) what our future will be like, so it’s only natural that you should be setting up for exactly this future.
    Here in South Australia, several of my neighbours have deer fences – to keep their herds IN!
    I have quite a few kangaroos around my place, which is comforting. Kangaroo meat is very gamey tasting, but is very low in fat and therefore keeps for ages in a cool cellar compared to lamb or beef. Kangaroos also eat our native grasses without producing methane and without causing topsoil erosion. You’d almost think they were supposed to be here! Catching them requires a rifle though. They also are prodigious leapers and they can move extremely swiftly if startled.
    Photos of your homestead would be great! Have we seen you turn a new leaf, no longer raging against the inevitable but accepting of the future and have decided to be optimistic now?
    Our own plans are slowly moving forward. This last weekend we finally got the new windmill pumping irrigation water to a header tank from our dam. So now, we don’t need electricity to irrigate our orchard, vegies, chooks and sheep. One small step and all that.

  171. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 11:22 pm #

    That’s all taken care of by Planned Parenthood and other cheap clinics. Perhaps you misundersood me – I’m not against that so much as middle class women getting another free ride – or worse, the Catholic Medical Establishment being destroyed – or are you alright with that? I am against Obamacare in general, maybe you aren’t.
    How do you feel about the Agent looking in kids lunches in North Carolina? Or that they’re about to teach homosexuality in California? Or giving out birth control in the schools? Public Schools are finished – our values are just too disparate. We aren’t a Nation anymore. Sure give out the Pill for free or cheap at public clinics for those who qualify. I’d be in favor of voluntary sterilization with cash incentives for the hopelessly inferior as well. But let’s not give this stuff out like candy to kids or to women who can well afford it on their own.
    You enjoying hitting me on this issue because I am divided between Christian Charity and Nietzsche’s Overman. Believe it or not, I think we need both to make a true White Culture, but it’s not easy – especialy with so many submen or untermensch around. Thank you for the energy of your attack. I take it into my sphere and send you flying – like a birdie.
    Tell Laura I wonder if Dagny Taggert would depend on the Goverment for free birth control pills.

  172. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 11:26 pm #

    No I meant Nicole your ex-girlfriend. You indicated that she posted acerbic comments on your blog sometimes on how you are trying to avoid working by doing Permaculture. She sounded like a real charmer! I was just goofing on that.

  173. Vlad Krandz March 12, 2012 at 11:36 pm #

    Alchemy is clear: before things can be combined, they must be clearly separated or in terms of ideas, defined. So if you want to cross a German Shepherd with a Golden Retriever, fine. But before you do, appreciate exactly the particular qualities of both breeds – and understand what you are losing since the pups wont have any of these qualities in their purity or with the strength of the parents. Now apply this to the human races and my case is made.
    Or use the combination of colors in paints if you prefer. Some combinations or genetic crosses might be valuable or viable, and some just create mud. In the case of genetics, a valuable cross will take awhile with many culls. But you might create something good in the end. The Jomon or Samurai Class of Japan are large and fair skinned. They might have some White genes way back. If so, a succesful and beautiful cross.
    The celebrated hybrid vigor lasts one generation and then nothing – and the essential traits are lost. This is not the way to anything.

  174. Desertrat March 12, 2012 at 11:46 pm #

    Vlad, human waste has long been used as fertilizer. In Korea, for the rice. While the polite name is “night soil”, we referred to “honey buckets”, “honey pits” and “honey wagons”. When you are downwind from a honey wagon pulled by oxen, your nose is offended for a long, long time.
    Ticks? Powdered sulfur in your socks and maybe around your waistline. A wipe-down with a kerosene-soaked rag gets rid to the very-tiny seed ticks.
    Hardening and embrittlement of fuel lines? Buy ten feet or so of the proper size at a car parts store and keep it indoors in the coolest part of the house. It lasts much longer, then.
    Sounds like Jim is heading back to pre-WW II rural. That’s when my own learning process began. So now I know all this stuff and my body is giving out. 🙂

  175. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 11:51 pm #

    I just heard on Radio that the Japs are building 2 nuke plants in Vietnam!
    GO CAPITALISM!!!!

  176. anti soak March 12, 2012 at 11:54 pm #

    WAY BACK IN THE 60S Meher Baba wrote an essay
    ‘God In a Pill’ debunking such notions.

  177. messianicdruid March 13, 2012 at 12:23 am #

    “That is not to say we know all the details of climate processes and future climate, but it rules out claims that climate change has no anthropogenic basis.”
    Trying to prove too much. Its not that there is NO basis, it is that there is insufficient basis.
    A “scientist” might observe a car going down the street and notice that there were gases leaving the tailpipe. He might theorize that the exiting gases were propelling the car down the street. However a measurement of the thrust produced by the tailpipe would prove that it inadequate to actually move the car.
    It is the same with man’s input. It is insufficient to heat the whole solar system.

  178. messianicdruid March 13, 2012 at 12:28 am #

    “PS to deal with deer…”
    scatter large feline droppings. They will leave.

  179. CodyBear March 13, 2012 at 12:37 am #

    I’ve been tending an orchard (25 various fruit trees) for 10 years. Deer are not a problem. The squirrels are. Those varmits will spin an apple off its stem, take one bite and drop it. They do this sunrise to sunset.
    You’ll need a .22 and some practice. Otherwise when your trees start bearing fruit the squirrels will ruin your crop.

  180. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 12:38 am #

    Will gardens be poached to death as well?

    Oh there will be death, probably due to lead poisoning. Quoting from The Which of Hebron at the end of chapter Thiry-Two.
    “Take all these fellows down to the river road. Bullock told the versatile Dick Lee and hang them there at twenty yard intervals.”

  181. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 12:48 am #

    Thanks, I’ve had the Earth Abides on my wish list for a while and due to your suggestion I just found a used copy at a good price, $7.44 shipped.

  182. Bustin J March 13, 2012 at 1:11 am #

    Anne said, “But in the long run we’ll all be dead anyway.”
    Thanks for keeping “we” in your thoughts, Anne.
    Enjoy your warm home while it lasts.

  183. Bustin J March 13, 2012 at 1:12 am #

    PoC said “You usually get your chemistry and physics correct – but you’re off base concerning wood-burning.”
    Wrong, I am correct about wood burning. Coal burning is also shitty, thanks for pointing that out. Tip o’ the hat on that one.

  184. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 1:15 am #

    Yes the birds. My adult life has been lived in Seattle and I have been here a long time. Last fall I saw a Lesser Goldfinch for the first time. It was in my back yard and was so striking that I immediately had to get on line and find out what it was. It turns out the accepted range for the new immigrant had previously been about as far north as Portland and the south part of Washington State. It could be too early to tell but perhaps the range map needs to be changed.
    I had another similar experience recently.
    I have a very large California Redwood in my backyard I planted many years ago. Last week out my window and saw a Pileated Woodpecker on it. It was as big as a large crow and beautiful. Reading about it online I find that we are part of it’s normal range but as a forest bird it’s not usually seen in the city.
    Apparently it can make big holes in trees but my redwood has bark inches thick now so I hope it comes back.

  185. Bustin J March 13, 2012 at 1:22 am #

    It looks as though people aren’t going to change their minds about using energy to heat things.
    Too bad because they aren’t going to have a choice. The world is filled with people without woodpiles.
    We will pry your hunk of wood from your cold, dead fingers.
    The bottom line is that if one part of Earth’s population wants to use energy to drive the remaining people underground (literally) it had better be more powerful that the part of the population that has no interest in that happening.
    Your smoke signals will be seen for miles. You will have no chance.
    You’ll be spotted by aerial drones.
    We’ll still be making 9V batteries.
    We will spot you and we will send a clear signal to stop burning things.
    We’ll arrive wearing suits that heat our bodies, charged by advanced ribbon Mg-Li photocarbon suits.
    We’ll knock on your door.
    We’ll see through your walls, anyway, but, just to be polite, we’ll knock again for pitys sake.
    Of course, you’ll say, you were sorry about burning again. You’ll be glad we leave without disconnecting you from food water and daytime light services.
    We’ll be off over the hills to the next smoke signal.
    That’s how we’ll do it.
    OBAMANATION2020 (feat. Joe Biden)

  186. Buck Stud March 13, 2012 at 1:24 am #

    I’m probably going to make a point for you but here goes. Even in painting, before softening edges for the purpose of eye movement – enabling the eye to more easily move from one shape to the next; or “passage” as the Cubists/French might say – one should have a clearly defined shape; that is to say, one color and one value. In that regard, there is really no such thing as mud, only mottled colors trying to distinguish themselves as a true shape. But after a true shape is articulated, softening edges and creating texture/pattern/color vibrancy is not a problem. In fact, that is where beginning painters typically go astray when trying to create “painterly” paintings: they grasp for the “loose” effect and bypass the graphic, hard-edged structural underpinning.
    Black and white creates gray, and nature is comprised primarily of beautiful subtle grays that lean in the direction of this color or that. To test this for yourself, the nest time you’re at a stop sign compare the red of the sign to the surrounding nature; the chromatic intensity is overwhelming.
    Anyway, speaking of going astray, what was my point again?

  187. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 1:25 am #

    When wood decays it releases CO2 so using it for fuel instead is carbon neutral. A future industry built around growing and harvesting wood products for fuel would also be carbon neutral. Such an industry would be a closed system and probably should be part of the solution.

  188. JulettaofOhio March 13, 2012 at 1:43 am #

    The change of pace is much appreciated, Mr. Kunstler. I’m less depressed and paranoid with a well-written message of hope and getting something done.
    For The Mook, saying to use pine for boiling sap is interesting. I’m not trying to fight with you, I really want to know why it’s better. I don’t have a lot of pine trees, but I’d be willing to sacrifice one for more maple syrup.
    We heat with wood and have managed our woodlot pretty well with just three-four acres of woods. Of course, you have to run the tick gauntlet and, in Ohio, huge disgusting spiders. I’ve never seen so many spiders in my life.
    We invested in a log splitter (we’re both getting older) and it’s been a great help. After a certain amount of years, brute force is no longer an option.
    We also invested in a BCS “Harvester”, the very best rototiller we’ve had. It’s made in Europe, Denmark, maybe? and is strong, efficient and well-crafted. I’d really like to have a small Kubota for Ohio’s heavy soils, but it’s not in the budget.
    In case you’re wondering why we don’t sell some of our trees, we investigated a sale, but the buyer told me he had never seen so many trees in one place with that much damage from lightning. His, more or less, exact words were, “Lady, I wouldn’t stand out in your woodlot for a million dollars.” Since we’ve only been here 13 very long years, I don’t know Ohio’s climate that well. This was a strange winter after a horrible summer, although I brought in good crops, since I’m used to gardening in the High Plains. Am wondering if Ohio is turning into Kansas. My dad had so many truly dreadful tales of the Great Depression and the dust bowl, which marked me for life. He said the 50s were bad, as well, and I don’t know what I believe about climate change. The climate has always changed, and I’m much more afraid of the Loony Left than I am the Rabid Right.
    Good luck with your garden, Mr. Kunstler. We’re waiting for it to warm up a bit and dry out. Hate to say that since it will probably dry up this summer just like it did last summer which was depressing as hell. Coming from a dry climate, I truly LOVE rain.
    We have lots of deer, which wouldn’t last long in a famine. They have developed the grace and agility of a gazelle and are able to leap the highest fence. The idea of putting chain link on the ground is one we’ll try.We also have hundreds of groundhogs which are supposed to be about the cleanest meat you can get from wild game, so venison may be fought over mercilessly, but I’m willing to settle for groundhog.
    Good luck to all and Happy Spring!

  189. JulettaofOhio March 13, 2012 at 2:01 am #

    Also very interesting. I’ve only had good luck once with the “Three Sisters” planting. Used popcorn, Scarlet Runner Beans and Waltham Butternut Squash. Every other year was a total disaster.
    Also didn’t use a dead fish for fertilizer. Who would want one of Ohio’s glow-in-the-dark fish to fertilize your food?
    Does anyone know where to get Urea Nitrogen? Think that’s all we’re left with since Ammonium Nitrate is a big NO. I’ve searched the co-ops in two counties and they just look at me like I’m crazy. One of the co-ops offered to spray Anhydrous Ammonia, but recinded the offer after he found out we only needed it for two acres. Can’t blame him at these gas prices. Our land is completely deficient in Nitrogen (Why?) although we have sufficient amounts of the other two. I’ve planted beans, alfalfa, etc., with no results. Also, I used all the nitrogen on hand with the sawdust so it wouldn’t leach out the nutrients.
    We live on a lateral moraine with lots of glacial till and what I can only describe as “pot clay”. We’ve tilled in tons of sand and compost and rotted straw and sawdust, but I could still get out there and throw a pot with complete ease.
    Any ideas? This is the most frustrating piece of ground I’ve ever tried to “farm”.

  190. ceojr1963 March 13, 2012 at 2:07 am #

    I created the idea called Biowebscape, which is not something totally new, just a new word for a general mix of the things I do to get by from here till there. I have always thought that we’d be able to get by on what land we had, if we did a lot more combining all the good ideas and methods and have formed these ideas since I was in Grade school in the years just after 1976 when I was with my parents overseas living in Iceland. It was back in 2009 that the term made it’s appearence on the web, but it is linked to me and my writing blog which is http://dan-ur.blogspot.com But if you forget the blog’s address anyone can just google “BioWebScape” and get there from those links that show up. The internet being what it is, they will link to me almost forever, or at least till a lot of linkages crash due to some future event or events as the case will likely be to cause such a disconnection.
    I have been growing things from early childhood and was always looking under rocks or in trees for things even though for a while some of them made me run away scared of getting bitten and going to see doctors because of the allergies. I have had access to a chunk of yard for over 34 years and though it is not what it once was it is still filled with things that I had a hand in planting, and making a home for over the years.
    Someone suggested Jerusalem Artichokes ( Sunchokes) native to north america and I have had a self seeding patch of them for over 25 of this garden’s years. About 10ft by 10ft, they were pretty bad off last year with over 30 days of no rain, but they should still come back as we dug into the area and found some, but I decided to just let them reseed there again this year, while I do other things and I have been passing them out to people that have asked for them, from other areas where we grow them as well. The best storage place for them is where they grow, just be sure to leave a few small ones from each dig full.
    As the first designer in my own idea stream, I want to make sure I live as much of what I talk about as I can. I have stored over 400 gallons of rain water for this growing season. Last year we pretty much ran out, but this year I have added about 50 more gallons of storage is some large storage cases, used originally as part movers in a company my dad worked for, and we have a large supply of them, they have lasted a long time in the weather, the broken top ones becoming planters.
    One thing I wanted to really try to figure out, was why people keep building stick houses in the high wind zones? Haven’t they heard the story of hte Three Little Pigs? The hosue of bricks won out over all the others. Earth shelter or partial earth shelters would be a great way for half of tornado alley to rebuild and would cut down on heating and cooling and loads of other things as well. If the wind knocks over a house of sticks, build something that won’t fall over next time, it seems so simple I can’t figure out why it hasn’t dawned on people before now, in large enough numbers to make it a standing order kind of thing.
    I hate to invoke this, but maybe someone is telling you something? Heh.
    Good to see that more people are growing things, than sitting on their hands worrying about the future. The future will happen, be we here to see it or not. Birds fly and bugs buzz, but if you aren’t there, it don’t stop them much.
    I have been turning a lot of my plastic drink bottles into mini-garden pots and hanging them in various fashion on things that don’t get planted on a lot. Vertical spaces grow things just like horizontal ones, and if you don’t have land to have plants, you have walls and somewhere a bit of sunshine, and then you can grow things that way too.
    Everyone has a mini-climate, and you can tweak it a bit with your own landscape management ideas, and things you learn from others, so just do it and see what best fits for you. The more you grow the less you have to depend on a store shelf for your eats.
    Have fun and Be safe if you use power tools, I have access to almost everything I could ever need in that line, as well as more hand tools than I know what to do with, not that I will get rid of any of them. But knowing how to use and take care of the tools is an important lession to be taught, if anything breaks, you can fix it and if you can’t fix it, you have a spare waiting, I have tools that my grandfather used, before my mother was born 82 years ago. Tools and know how are what will save us in the long run, as well as being kind and loving to people.
    Charles.

  191. Bustin J March 13, 2012 at 2:10 am #

    JoOH says “We live on a lateral moraine with lots of glacial till and what I can only describe as “pot clay”.
    Any ideas?”
    Yes. Stop. You will never, ever, never, never ever, ever, EVER going to get out of that land what you put into it. Time or effort.

  192. JulettaofOhio March 13, 2012 at 2:12 am #

    How interesting you should mention “Earth Abides”. I’m rereading it after about a decade, and my outlook has certainly changed. Am about half way through and will finish it tonight. Have you read “Shut Down – A Story of Economic Collapse”? Not particularly well-written, but germane to today. Gives me incentive to tote that barge, lift that bale.

  193. JulettaofOhio March 13, 2012 at 2:21 am #

    Yep. It needs to be well-composted first and helps to have healthy contributors. In the Hippie days, we used to think the urine of young girls and teens was useful because of the estrogen. I potty-trained my daughter while using all her output for tomatoes, eggplant and pepper. They did beautifully, and so did we.
    Sounds really bizarre now, but it can be done and done well. In fact, there’s nothing like sewage (preferably your own) to break up clay and add trace minerals to the soil. Assuming again, that you’re healthy.
    Survival isn’t a dainty subject and you asked a valid question.

  194. JulettaofOhio March 13, 2012 at 2:36 am #

    Thanks for the reply, and I’m afraid you’re right. If housing ever revives around here, which seems doubtful, we are so out of here. Our fruit trees have done rather well, possibly due to the small reservoir of water under the 5-10 feet of till. Interestingly, we have (Ugh!) Black Sulphur water, and still have to apply sulphur to the blueberries and hydrangeas. Ohio has been an unusual experience, to say the least. Thanks again for reasonable and informative reply!

  195. Bustin J March 13, 2012 at 2:40 am #

    JuOh says “Also very interesting. I’ve only had good luck once with the “Three Sisters” planting. Used popcorn, Scarlet Runner Beans and Waltham Butternut Squash. Every other year was a total disaster.”
    Heres your problem. The colonialists planted varieties nothing like the heirlooms or hybrids of today, in soils totally unlike they are today.
    To do corns beans and squash correctly involves knowing how fast they grow. You get the corn and beans up first a good 8-16″. The corn and the beans must climb together.
    The question is, how fast will they grow. You’ll make guess with the store-boughts, sure, but will they perform?
    Throwing a dead fish in with it?
    You must be new to dirt farmin’ hon.
    For people like you I suggest a wholesale effort at indoor greenhouse and transplanting. You ain’t got the feeling for dirt farming. You are better off quittin’.
    You’ll get mixed results and then think you got it figgured out. Year after year.

  196. Bustin J March 13, 2012 at 2:48 am #

    For all of JHK’s chigger problem its a wonder he doesn’t just take out the deer himself.
    But then agin he’s city folk in the country.
    For the chiggers theres methyl bromide. Nowadays you spray your fields from unmanned drones. As for the deer, gun em down and burn the carcass, its the only way to get rid of the fleas.

  197. ceojr1963 March 13, 2012 at 3:02 am #

    JulettaofOhio, Your sawdust is eating the nitrogen up in the decomposition process, and plant some clover, white or red, keep it in the areas you aren’t farming as a path and soil keeper, it will come back year after year, or you can keep reseeding it if it does not. That will add a bit of nitrogen to your soils by the shear power of the clover drawing it out of the air.
    As another person up thread said, save your human urine and dilute to urine 1 to water 10 and use that as a local fertilizer, better than sending it to your local sewer processing plant to get wasted.
    You can grow comfrey to help you soil out, use it as a compost plant, cutting it back several times a season and letting it dig deep into your subsoils for the minerals.
    Your under soils are forest liter in the woodlot, but really they only grow a few years without total depeletion if they are cleared for farming, as the forest is a cycled system dead feeding the living and so on, with little input from outside the system.
    Sand and clay just makes harder brick, I have red clay over cracked weather Shale and limestone or whatever this area of the foothills of the Ozarks has in it’s foundations below the clay. I use mostly raised beds or containers as I can’t get the soils improved enough and Have tried for 30 plus years. I do a lot of letting the spring weeds grow and chopping them and adding them to the compost pile and moving out the older stuff from it as time goes by. I also try to keep as many plants in the yard as possible, as they are all related in a mixture that only God knows what they all are, but they will if I am watchful, teach me something about which sets of them do the best for each little area. I keep the active walkways as filled with the native growers like clover and the grasses that have self seeded into the ground as I can early on and wait as long as I can to let the clover have bee food and then I mow and compost that stuff too.
    Let the ground tell you what grows better there and then work with that, food comes in all sorts of plants not found in the seed catalogs, or the grocery isles, find out what ones your area grows from the older foraging folks, or local indian tribe if you have any around to ask. Other’s will have other advice, but I try to keep it simple and not do a lot tilling in the ground, it breaks up the soil bio-sphere a lot and kills things, I can’t buy in a shop to replace.
    Charles.

  198. JulettaofOhio March 13, 2012 at 3:06 am #

    Heating with wood makes sense for us, too, although I’m having a rough time trying to figure out to cook on a Vermont Castings “Defiant”. I’d love to have a regular wood cookstove upstairs and really learn how to use it.
    Our large house was built for passive solar gain, with the unfortunate error to not be placed at the correct angle. We have triple pane windows (13 of them downstairs, a real security hazard) but the builder forgot that the sun doesn’t shine in Ohio in the winter.
    So far, the wood stove takes off the chill and becomes uncomfortably hot downstairs. It has a catalytic converter and burns really cleanly, so I don’t feel guilty at all.

  199. JulettaofOhio March 13, 2012 at 3:12 am #

    Actually, a farm girl from birth. The dead fish was a reference to the Squanto story. I’ve never used a dead fish since everyone knows that’s a sure message to groundhogs to dig up everything. You can use fish based fertilizer or blood meal in the west, but not up here.
    Except for that difference, I appreciate what you had to say, and will give it another try just for the hell of it.

  200. JulettaofOhio March 13, 2012 at 3:20 am #

    Sorry, Vlad. I had orchards on my mind and was trying to figure out where to plant my two new “Contender”, northern zone, peaches.
    You asked if you can burn human waste and I just don’t know. Certainly Kansas and Nebraska burned buffalo chips, so maybe you can do the same if you have a primarily vegan diet, which we may all have after the game runs out. Plant based material will always burn, but I don’t know how well or for what purposes human waste can be used.
    There’s always the delicate question of methane. (strongly advising a meal of beans and chili peppers.) However, no one has yet harnessed the power of dairy cattle, so I know nothing about technique.
    Sorry again about my mix-up. I always look for your posts first, but jumped the gun on this one.

  201. Asianque18qx March 13, 2012 at 3:27 am #

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  202. Pucker March 13, 2012 at 3:34 am #

    “Atoms for Peace”
    United States introduced nuclear power to Japan under a veil of “Atoms for Peace”
    What’s the current condition of the Brown’s Ferry nuclear power plant in Alabama? (Go Bama!!!! Roll Tide!!!!! Bama Number One!)

  203. Pucker March 13, 2012 at 3:40 am #

    United States introduced nuclear power to Japan under a veil of “Atoms for Peace”
    Colonel Paul Tibbets, Jr.: “I named the plane after my momma “Enola Gay” because I knew that the mission would be famous.”

  204. old69 March 13, 2012 at 4:36 am #

    Human Nature ?
    So if “Work” is the “Effort to Solve Problems”, is the sequence of Informational and/or Physical manipulations necessary to reach a Result, to transform a situation, to achieve a Target, to navigate from a Starting Point Configuration (of Mass Energy ? of People ? Of Status and Power Relationships between People ? Of Energy Expenditures and Configurations and such ? of Matter Organized in Products ? Of the production of Products from some chunks of matter ? or the production of Steady State Repetitive Processes as in “Services”, or the repetition of Processes over and over again with slight differences, with new “clients” as in Health Care and Education and such ?) to an End Point Target Result Configuration, how many work events are necessary for a society as a whole ? How much work is really necessary to reach the Targets ?
    But are the Targets always Moving Targets and new invented necessities (after all, Education is a never ending endeavor, there is never enough that everyone must know, you can force them to learn an entire Encyclopedia (as in training (the “training myth”) the new unemployed for the new “Future Jobs” ?) and it still would never end, and the same with Health Care, there is never enough Physical Perfection achieved by the body, you can always keep on solving ever new sicknesses, nay, provoking ever new sicknesses with new drugs and solving those sicknesses by other new drugs creating ever new sicknesses, ever new tests, ever new “Psychological Sicknesses” (and here the sky is the limit as anything can be considered a deep Mental Sickness (actually our entire Civilization is one Huge Mental Sickness)) and such) ? Is that what is really behind all of the Information Economy and Services Economy ? A way to keep on creating new goals and targets and manipulations in order to keep people employed ? to Invent Work that is not really necessary, but must be created in order to distribute the free wealth the Technological Economy generates automatically but can’t give away freely as that would imply that “You Don’t Have to Deserve it Anymore”, now it is all a “Free Lunch”, the entire concept of work and the status and social relationships that have been built upon it would get demolished, would imply a much deeper Crisis in our Stone Age Civilization, people would all go through an Identity Crisis as work is our Identity, it would also mean that all the work you achieved up to now was not really necessary, a trick, a make believe, a show, just a quirk as imposed by power relationships and such, etc.
    The targets as real necessities to be achieved such as the most simple and basic needs such as Housing, Energy creation, some services, some products, some other items, etc. are not very many all said and done and can be performed today with very few people needed “to work” and very efficiently; if the real goal is only the basic targets you need very few people working. In fact our Technological Economy is all about Excess Capacity, we can do too much compared to what must be done, we are oversized as in an oversized workforce, an oversized technology and capability compared to those few basic puny needs we have, that is the basis of having built “Too Many Houses”, having too many products, etc.
    How can we really need 100 million workers in the USA working everyday 8 hours a day busy producing informational and physical manipulations to achieve so many goals ? how much time wasted is there really ? how much redundancy ? how much make believe ? how much is a show ? I fanthom quite a lot.
    The entire point is that if work is the solution to problems, then work would naturally keep on decreasing as we optimize and perfect the solution to problems we achieve, it would be less needed: and the real kicker in all of this is especially all of the emphasis put on Innovation, Research and Technology, which is exactly there to reduce all kinds of work, to reduce the necessity of new work and labor, not to create “New Jobs”. The success of the present and past work being performed is measured exactly in how much future work will not be needed anymore. The more people are working effectively and productively (as in Higher Productivity) the less future work will be needed as that is the goal of work: to eliminate itself, to need less of it, to solve problems ever better and once and for all so to say, etc. If work is the solution to problems then the more work performed the more problems are solved and the fewer problems are left to solve, the less work there is needed in the future, and the more work performed day to day and each day the less work will be needed in the future as more and more problems are solved once and for all and such, etc. Of course what is operating is so many people are creating new (or old and repeated over and over again just because, for fun, because they are bored, in fact boredom is what our Civilization is all about) temporary problems that must be solved therefore creating temporary work events by opposing their will powers and changing rules and choices and plans and such so as to never solve the problems “once and for all”, to never achieve a state of “Accumulation of Effort” as in something that adds up, the effort of so many workers that add up and accumulate in a result (a global collective result from a collective effort such as Rockets and Skyscrapers and such).
    That is why there are too many empty homes in the US (15 million ?) they did work “too much”, they did a good job after all and they got the same problem in a very different society and culture and such as is Spain and Europe in general: they too have too many homes built, too many empty homes, they “worked too much” and now it is all working against them.
    But this is because our Man Brain is based on all of its stone age mentalities of “Hard Work”, “You Have to Deserve It”, you must achieve, and especially the worshiping of Inequality, each Man Brain wants to feel Superior or Better or Deserving more compared to another, and Man Brain loves to fight, loves to express themselves, loves to Compete to see who is better ad worse, who is the Winner and who is the Loser and such.
    But we must radically change “Human Nature” by changing the design of the Man Brain. The excuse that it is “Human Nature” and that justifies it all is over now: it won’t work anymore, now we are advanced enough to hose this Stone Age Mentality of Human Nature, in fact we will design new Man Brains that overcome all of this, by direct manipulation of the neural circuits, crack open skulls, put new microprocessors in them that eliminate the Free Will gadgets and that obey my commands of building millions of Rockets and Skyscrapers and such, I want that, like a cry baby I want that and all humanity becomes my tool, only my Free Will, only One Free Will is allowed to command 7 billion machines and such. By the way, the hippies wanted to achieve this state of overcoming our Stone Age Man Brain by trying to change the culture and values of small groups of people (and also some religious sects and communists and such) but have always failed because the Stone Age Man Brain is hardwired to fight and compete and express their puny Free Wills against other Free Wills and such and it is this circuit that must be disconnected.
    Change Human Nature by changing the Man Brain. Our goal is to change Human Nature: it is not a given, it is not an invariant, it can be changed and we can throw away this Stone Age contraption, (just like the Christians always say Man is a Sinner, well he won’t be a sinner anymore because we will change the way the Man Brain operates). And in fact it is called Human “Nature”, exactly Nature must be hated and killed, kill Nature, there is nothing valuable about Nature, hate Nature with all of your guts, get Nature on the run real fast.
    TOBOR THE 8 MAN

  205. old69 March 13, 2012 at 4:45 am #

    Also check out:
    good old:
    http://instantsingularity.blogspot.com
    and
    http://instantsingularity1.blogspot.com
    Ok, it no longer belongs in the Rant House , ok …

  206. Pucker March 13, 2012 at 4:55 am #

    What are the CFNers thoughts on using a digging machine to create a cave to live in? I understand that some people do this in Australia (Cooper Peatty?)?
    A cave should be warm in Winter and cool in Summer. One could grow mushrooms in the cave. And seal up the entrance against marauding bandits. One could just throw one’s bones out of the cave entrance.
    And if a woman passes by, one could just club her over the head and drag her inside the cave by her hair.

  207. Vlad Krandz March 13, 2012 at 5:00 am #

    Yeah gray is a nice color. Gray squirrels thrive everywhere. They are displacing the native red squirrel of England.
    See? I field your distraction and quickly get right back on track. You are out at first.

  208. Vlad Krandz March 13, 2012 at 5:15 am #

    Is that a novel too? I read The Earth Abides several times as a teenager and never forgot it. Picked it up again last year. Truly a great work by someone who knew alot about the human heart and a fair amount about the Environment.
    No, survival aint dainty. We all have our sticking points that have to be overcome.
    The human “night soil” is probably best used as fertilizer as you and everyone seem to indicate. It was just an odd thought, but the cattle produce it much larger and more flammable quantities. The urine is a great idea which can be used right away.

  209. desg84t2 March 13, 2012 at 5:48 am #

    Réserver un hotel pour la destination Afghanistan

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  210. desg84t2 March 13, 2012 at 5:51 am #

    Campaign advertisements styled as mini-documentaries seem to be all the rage these days.

    Newt Gingrich released a 16-minute long video exploring his path from childhood to the presidential campaign trail, just days after President Obama’s? its own 17-minute documentary-style advertisement.

    Gingrich’s short film chronicles his life from childhood,louis vuitton pas cher, to his House speakership, to the present-day race for the White House.

    The video titled, “Rebuilding the America We Love,” touts the former House Speaker’s small-town roots, growing up in Pennsylvania, and features interviews with Gingrich, his wife Callista, daughters Kathy Lubbers and Jackie Cushman, as well as Deputy Campaign Manger Vince Haley.

    “I grew up in kind of an idyllic children’s background,” Gingrich says towards the beginning of the video.

    The extended campaign ad highlights his passion for animals and the zoo as a young boy and cites a trip to a World War I battlefield with this father as his reason for pursuing his future career.

    “I decided in August of ’58 that I would spend my life on three things: What do we need to do in order to survive as a free country, how would you explain it to the American people so they give you permission and how would you actually implement it,” Gingrich says.

    The video also aims to portray Gingrich as a man of family and faith, an important factor in a campaign where his marital history has been considered a potential vulnerability.

    Gingrich concludes the video telling viewers he is the only candidate that “understands how big the changes have to be for America to succeed” and the candidate with the most experience achieving “very large scale projects.”

    The political biopic comes days before he faces a pivotal test in Tuesday’s primaries in Mississippi and Alabama. The GOP hopeful has staked his candidacy on a strong showing in Southern states. Gingrich said Sunday he expects to win both primaries and stood by his vow to stay in the race through the convention.

  211. Pucker March 13, 2012 at 6:03 am #

    I’m now reading Alexander Solzhenitsyn’s “One Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich” about life a Soviet labor camp.
    It’s fascinating how by organizing people in a particular way and subjecting them to particular hardships that the rulers can dominate the prisoners’ thoughts, so that the prisoner’s thoughts are not their own.

  212. Pucker March 13, 2012 at 6:13 am #

    From Orlov’s blog:
    http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/
    “…when in fact a collapse in the Joseph Tainter sense can be advantageous, you know, in fact it could be that we are due for some financial, political and commercial collapse, but social and cultural collapse are things you would want to avoid at all costs.”
    Question: How is it possible to have financial, political and commercial collapse without social and cultural collapse? As Marx said: The economic substructure determines the superstructure.

  213. ffkling March 13, 2012 at 6:31 am #

    Laura, your argument is logical and persuasive; however, I am afraid that you are just wasting your time trying to convince “Vlad” who believes white people will be forced into taking anti-racist pills and global climate change is a fraud. As my grandfather used to say in regard to people like Vlad, “you can’t fix stupid.”

  214. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 7:05 am #

    Your question had me chase some links and I synthesized an answer.
    Joseph Tainter sees the relief of complexity as being good for humanity from a metabolic point of view. He sees reduction in complexity that does not directly benefit an individual as being harmful. A smart guy he has been looking into this for a long time.
    Financial, political and commercial collapse to some degree could therefore make for happier dogs by returning us to our natural state.
    However as you correctly point out via Marx. When dogs don’t have food and are hungry they are not happy. Growling bellies make for growling dogs. No economic substructure no superstructure.
    Because it’s no heading out for Eden brother no more trouble in my body or my mind when there ain’t no food to eat.

  215. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 7:18 am #

    Joseph Tainter would probably agree with the statement.
    The best thing we could do is dedicate ourselves to a low energy culture committed to zero population growth which values human needs and desires. A culture rich in humanity and responsive to the needs of its citizens consistent with sustainable principles. Only a culture that follows a low energy future of zero population growth can develop a surplus to provide the foundation for a social superstructure responsive to the needs of man and the pursuit of happiness.
    I can’t quote that, it’s me.

  216. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 7:22 am #

    Ivan Denisovich huh,
    Next time I’m casting aluminum spoons I’ll make you one.

  217. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 7:25 am #

    Join the K-dog write in revolution.

  218. 8man March 13, 2012 at 7:48 am #

    From:
    http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=141039
    From:
    http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=175202
    [quote]On the debts myth, remember money is a place holder, is a proxy for human relationships, there are no debts and there is no such thing as money, money can’t run out just like human relationships can’t run out, that is why they can “restructure the debts” aka “we can invent and do anything we want”, etc.[/quote]
    Also, consider Real Estate, Houses, Buildings, Offices etc. as Money. That is why the Chinese keep on building high rises and apartments etc. and why the USA and the EU have too many empty homes, built too many homes: to create a bank for money under the forms of Square Meters (or Feet) of living space in Constructions, since this is a primary necessity, you can use Real Estate and Houses as a Weapon, you can hike up the prices and punish the lower classes by making them pay more and more for something that should be virtually free to all today considering that housing is a standard and consolidated technology, etc. So Houses and Buildings is the Solidification of Money in Concrete Structures; instead of having the money sit in Banks, you use it as a weapon.
    Actually Money is used as a Weapon to Squeeze the Poor through Real Estate prices as in High Rents and High Housing Prices.

  219. 8man March 13, 2012 at 7:52 am #

    From:
    Real Estate as a Weapon
    http://instantsingularity3.blogspot.com/

  220. trippticket March 13, 2012 at 8:44 am #

    “A cave should be warm in Winter and cool in Summer”
    And musty and damp. Build a cob house instead. It’s about as cheap as digging a cave, works on the same earth-moderated thermal inertia, plus allows passive solar if positioned correctly, is dry and cozy, and is much more beautiful.

  221. 8man March 13, 2012 at 8:55 am #

    From:
    http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=178400
    From:
    http://instantsingularity1.blogspot.com
    Hey Busty, did you KILL HUMAN NATURE ? Did you finally shove it down the toilet Once and For All ? You Nature Lover and Tree Hugger, how can you be such a jacka*ss ? Kill Nature, Crack Open Skulls and insert a Microprocessor that gets rid of the Free Will Gadget. Hey Juletta, did you connect the Microprocessor in your Brain correctly ? Are the wires connected to the correct subsystems of pain/pleasure circuits, emotion systems and memory systems or did you make a mistake and now find yourself in the Twilight Zone, in a new Universe with New Laws of Physics, and Expriencing a completely new State of being and Existence ? Then keep on experimenting, change the circuits, change the program running in the Microprocessor, connect the Wild Symbols all over the Ball of Meat that is the MAN BRAIN, shove in Wild Chemicals and Wild Symbols, make it Go Crazy, make it Visit all the New Universes, which are many since the combinations of Signals, Circuits, Wild Chemicals and Wild Symbols are trillions upon trillions…(actually they are many times more: exponents of exponents like 10^10^10^10^10000, etc.)
    THE APE HAS TALKED ONCE AGAIN

  222. Bob Wise March 13, 2012 at 9:30 am #

    Good luck with your garden, Jim. I hope you are a more virtuous gardner than I. When we lived in Wisconsin and Illinois, I often planted a huge garden, with raised beds and double-digging to prepare the soil. But rarely did I do enough weeding and cultivating to bring the whole crop to fruition. You need to be at it almost every day, for 3-4 months.
    But in any case, you’ll have the joy of truly ripe tomatoes. Here in Florida, even with the best of care, they never seem to acquire their full flavor.

  223. ozone March 13, 2012 at 9:45 am #

    “Colonel Paul Tibbets, Jr.: “I named the plane after my momma “Enola Gay” because I knew that the mission would be famous.” –Pucker
    Now, if’n he’d named the plane “Enola Gay’s Apple Pie”, he would have had it covered!
    …As American as ________________ . (Along with atomic weapons and willing droppers of same, of course; it’s how the empire rolls, dude.)

  224. ozone March 13, 2012 at 9:52 am #

    For supper last night we had fresh carrots and parsnips that I dug up 3 hours earlier. Good gawd! Ain’t much sweeter than that kind of freshness after a winter of not-so-much fresh veggies. (The dormancy and cold concentrate the sugars over the winter.)
    Pulled the heavy mulch back, busted through a couple inches of frost, and there the tasty nuggets were. A springtime treat, to be sure.

  225. asoka. March 13, 2012 at 10:17 am #

    Anyway, sorry for rambling, but I think it’s going to be important to have a better understanding of our place among the biota in a lower energy future, and if this long-winded prose helps one person I’ll count it a success.

    It’s always a pleasure to read your posts, Tripp. I always learn new things from them and they help me in my permaculture evangelism. Feel free to ramble anytime … and good luck with your move.

  226. ozone March 13, 2012 at 10:32 am #

    Hey, Mr. K,
    I don’t know why you’d go through all that work, trouble, expense and learning curve, when you could just sit back and let the lucre roooooll on in! (You’d eventually have to move if they actually began drilling however; kinda fucks up the ground water and poisons the land with a brew of chemicals whose composition we’re not allowed to know or investigate. Immunity from the Clean Water Act; a gift from Big Dick Cheney.)
    http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-big-fracking-bubble-the-scam-behind-the-gas-boom-20120301
    McClendon’s a heckuva guy, doing a heckuva job, running Chesapeake [a heckuva fine company]; why not get in on the ground floor and git yer money fer nuthin’?
    Lookit these numbers, fer Krice-sake! The returns on this scam are more than good…
    “…In 2010, it pocketed $2.2 billion by selling land it bought in Texas for $2,000 an acre to one of China’s largest oil companies for $11,000 an acre. “That’s a five-to-one return on investment,” says Jeff Mobley, Chesapeake’s senior vice president for investor relations.”
    Eeeeeasy money, Bitches!

  227. DreamCycle March 13, 2012 at 10:36 am #

    Gardening has kept me sane for years. Last year, however, rolypoly bugs snapped off many of my seedlings and squirrels took single bites out of my usually plentiful butternut squash, which killed them or stunted their growth. The tomatoes took ages to ripen and things were generally anemic. This year I have already started cabbage, bok choy, eggplant, spinach etc. and will plant them when they are quite large, which seems to discourage some of the bugs. But since we in Northern Illinois are also having a remarkably early spring, we are warned that our bugs could be a big problem this year. On the up side, the Swiss chard, red cabbage and parsley that we covered with homemade hoop houses is doing great. Very interested to hear about everyone’s gardening experiences in the next few months..

  228. mikeO March 13, 2012 at 10:47 am #

    …james howard kunstler might plant the quick growing ROBINIA PSEUDOACACIA or locust tree, a native to his neck of the woods…these trees which make the best firewood, burn as hot as coal!…they’re legumes and improve the soil by transfixing nitrogen from the air to the soil AND the perfumed blossoms in june will inspire the artist in many ways…

  229. ozone March 13, 2012 at 11:17 am #

    DC,
    Speaking of “hoop-la” ;o), I found this excellent row-cover confabulation that I’m thinking of cobbling together:
    http://whizbangrowcover.blogspot.com/2010/01/all-about-whizbang-row-cover-hoop.html
    Plastic, plastic, everywhere. What did you say we might want to save all that black goo for?
    (Noooo, not plastics; let’s burn it all up motoring about the countryside… much more entertaining and freedom and democracy spreading. Drive on, Bitches!)

  230. ozone March 13, 2012 at 11:22 am #

    Mike,
    That is great burning wood. Densest wood I’ve run across for the purpose. I’ve only had it in quantity once, from a lot clearing we’d done.
    Watch them thorns! ouch

  231. Ultraman March 13, 2012 at 11:53 am #

    Re splitting wood.
    I’m halfway down the comments and I haven’t seen anyone mentioned how much easier it is to split at deep freezing temperature. I prefer using an ax, it’s a great work out. Not that using a wood splitter is a day at the beach.

  232. CaptSpaulding March 13, 2012 at 11:54 am #

    There’s an old lady by the name of Ruth Stout, who has written several gardening books sold through Rodale press. She says that mulch, lots of it, eliminates the need for weeding. I tried it a couple years ago, & loaned the book to a couple of different people, and they tried it as well. The consensus was that it worked well. Another advantage of heavy mulching is increased water retention in the soil. If you see some weeds sprout up, just do what Ruth does, add more mulch. Strangely, she is about 83, and likes to garden naked. Go Ruth.

  233. ninaXYZ March 13, 2012 at 11:56 am #

    When you get seriously into the firewood game you realize two things very quickly. First, its not a lone chore, second, its a year round effort.
    The trick is to build your supply in the spring andsummer so the wood seasons for winter AND you will need a supply of huge tarps for rain and snow.Best to gather some of your like-minded fiddlers for the cutting. Everybody is in on the take. Leave your cut wood in the forest until you can truck it home in a few loads, them the home person’s job is to sort by type, stack and be responsible for covering when the weather turns. That person also is the creative carrier (wheelbarrow suggested here) for what you need any day indoors. Indoors you will be replacing your fireplace grill repeatedly $$$ and discover how stupidly they are built now, first goes the bedwire, then the back rods melt. Be prepared to tend the fire every 15 minutes at least. Be prepared for your fireplace doors to come unhinged as overseas slave labor shows the fruits of indentured servitude and overseers’ whips. Be prepared to replace the fireplace back wall as it cracks and buckles. $$$
    This is not for sissys. You will need year-round dependable friends, a big truck for hauling, continuing freedom to cut where the wood is located and a careful person at home to keep the effort going, oh and frequent chain saw blade REPLACEMENTS.
    When you stash looks good enough to go, you are only halfway there. Keep going, plan a year ahead. Unseasoned wood won’t burn.

  234. Marta March 13, 2012 at 12:20 pm #

    Vlad Krandz really needs to get some help with his problems with women. It’s a shame to spoil good conversation with his female issues.

  235. ozone March 13, 2012 at 1:01 pm #

    Character is destiny.
    So, no worries; the laddie’s future doesn’t look to be all that influential (or procreative, unless some really repugnant circumstances come into the play of fate). All those precious genes; wasted by dint of the ideologies of death by societal suicide.

  236. Vlad Krandz March 13, 2012 at 1:19 pm #

    What help are you willing to give me?
    I’m not ruining the conversation here. Liberals just don’t believe in free speech for anyone but themselves. Ozone thinks anyone who doesn’t believe in his particular form of leftist anarchism deserves to be shot. And he hates anyone who believes in the rights of the unborn. And he calls me an advocate for the culture of death?

  237. Buck Stud March 13, 2012 at 1:22 pm #

    I think my elaboration and correction of your “mud’ analogy as it applies to color and painting went over your head. Not that it’s your fault; I could show it too you far more easily than write about it.
    Simply put, no color is inherently muddy. A brown gray in a Frank Stella painting might read very “muddy” while that same color in Van Gogh’s “The Potato Eaters” might be a highlight that is inherently colorful.
    But once again: to equate “muddiness” with color is false. Mud is a result of indefinite shape; a shape not composed of one color and one value.

  238. Vlad Krandz March 13, 2012 at 1:25 pm #

    Like Krishna to Arjuna, I ask you Zone, how did this unmanliness come upon you? We are eternal friends, skeletons are always smiling at each other – it’s the flesh that gets in the way. The flesh is like the weather – if you get up high enough it’s always sunny. Come up higher and see me in my true nature.
    But first you have to let go of your piece of shit leftist paranoia and hatred. All the littleness you see when you look in the mirror – that’s what gave birth to political correctness, hatred of Whites by Whites, the worship of the psychopath John Brown, Affirmative Action, the destruction of South Africa and Rhodesia, etc.

  239. rankinfile March 13, 2012 at 1:28 pm #

    My wife and I have been living the self-reliant life for most of the past 35 years. We live on 77 acres in Maine, most of it woodlot. We began planting an orchard 20 years ago and now have 70 or so trees: pears, apples, a dozen peach trees, grapes, raspberries, blueberries, apricots, 13 plum trees. We keep 50 hives of bees; we keep ducks for eggs. We heat our house mainly with wood we harvest from our land. We’ve learned to weld, do blacksmithing, plumbing, electrical, carpentry and minor appliance and outdoor equipment repairs. We tore apart and rebuilt a 180-year-old house, built outbuildings, planted herb and perennial gardens. We make our own wine, beer and cider. We raise our own chickens and turkeys for meat. We talk jokingly about when the house of cards that is the global economy comes tumbling down we will have to fend off the twinkie starved hordes from the cities. Our friends and relatives joke that when things go down the tubes, they’re migrating to our place. One thing we’ve learned: it’s a hell of a lot of work. Lucky for me I lost my job four years ago so I can put in a two days’ worth of labor every day on the farm. Oh, did I mention that we built two big greenhouses and do market gardening at three farmers’ markets and sell produce, honey, jams and jellies, herbal vinegars, mustards, duck eggs and more. . . In addition to confirming the amount of work involved in this type of lifestyle, it’s helpful to note that 1. There is no such thing as self-sufficiency. No one can do it all. People never did. 2. We’re helped tremendously by fossil fuels and electricity now. That might change. 3. No matter what you raise, whether it’s honeybees, apples, sheep (for 10 years), goats (same 10 years,) cabbages, or basil, there’s always something that wants to eat it or kill it. 4. An outside source of income makes the difference between hardship and comfort. In my case it’s my wife who brings in most of the green. I do the greens.
    Best of luck with the orchard, JHK. There’s always vension for Thanksgiving.

  240. Bob Wise March 13, 2012 at 1:43 pm #

    So Ruth Stout is still around! At 83, I guess she can garden naked if she wants. I tried her system as best I could, with various mulches — didn’t have a good source of hay. But it seemed the weeds always got started, and it took some weeding along with the mulching to keep the garden in shape.

  241. Vlad Krandz March 13, 2012 at 1:56 pm #

    Ok you’re changing the subject from my vision of life to a technical artistic point, as I alluded to in my response. So if you don’t want to talk about my vision, which you brought up btw, we can talk about mud. But let’s be clear that that is in fact what we are doing. You may be right about the point you are laboring to make and I may concede. It doesn’t mean anything about our first discussion since that is now offically over.
    Mud in itself, is soil in a waterlogged state. It typically has a certain unpleasant connotation because of the yuckiness and chill of falling into it and also the difficulty of traveling in it due to its cohesive quality. Nothing is bad in itself. I suppose it has a certain beauty in it which can be appreciated if you don’t have to struggle with it or thru it.
    As a layman, I find color very attractive. But as a arteest, you take pleasure in uncommon pleasures like appreciating the shades of mud. I can go there too sometimes, it all depends. Like I said, I can appreciate noir movies etc. But once I went to an opening of an acquaintance, and the canvas was just mud with very subtle shades of color woven in. Art for Artists. Like alot of modern jazz, music for musicians. I’m not against it, but it doesn’t do much for me.
    Mohammad and his Companions saw a dead horse. They exclaimed “how horrible”. But Mohammad said, “But look how white the teeth are”. So the moral? One can find beauty everywhere if one is in the right mood. I would feel sad for the horse and it would lead me to meditate on the brevity of life, the pain of death, my death, etc. This is all what I should do. More important than trying to find aesthetic pleasure in everything. But a Master who is Free, above life and death? Why not? Different stage completely. Are you a Master? Perhaps you should think about your own death sometimes and not always about Beauty? Just a thought.
    And grains of sand are many different colors when examined closely. But does that make the far view false? No. Different experience. Sandy color could be a valid image, though sands vary in different places.
    I suppose the unpleasant connotations of mud was why I used the image in the first place. That and the fact that I don’t find it attractive. You reversed that consciously or subconsciously since you find mud attractive or – at least you affect to do so so as to feel superior to the hoi polloi. So many artists are like this. In any case, White Babies go for alot of money on the market while you can’t give Non White babies away – except to Whites who are trying to feel superior and adopt one as a status symbol.
    Aesthetics are below morality in any case. And preserving the White Race is a moral endeavor of the highest moral importance. Even if you can’t grok this, the Grouchys who want us all to blend into cafe au late must horrify you. All artists love real diversity of form and color.
    Mud has been very important in military history. Many armies have gotten bogged down and destroyed.

  242. anti soak March 13, 2012 at 2:08 pm #

    Depends on the altitude.
    This tough lady lived on turnips and whatever else would grow in the Himalayas.
    ‘Cave in the Snow’: Tenzin Palmo’s Quest.
    This is the incredible story of Tenzin Palmo, a remarkable woman who spent 12 years alone in a cave 13000 feet up in the Himalayas.

  243. Vlad Krandz March 13, 2012 at 2:11 pm #

    But neither Laura nor her White Knight Prog addressed my point about the Catholic Medical Establishment. Do you people really want to drive the Church out of Medicine? Sure that’s a good idea?

  244. anti soak March 13, 2012 at 2:14 pm #

    Yes, then its the Govt thats got the power and the hospitals.
    From last weeks thread:
    Bill Mollison, the godfather of permaculture, once attended a lecture on “Deep Ecology” just to see what was on offer. After the talk he went up and asked the lecturer two questions:
    1) Do you garden?
    2) Do you drive a car?
    I think most people at this thread cant say
    Yes to #1 and No to #2.

  245. Vlad Krandz March 13, 2012 at 2:15 pm #

    She must be able to “Eat fire and drink light” as the Chaldean Oracle put it. Such a diet would not keep the ordinary person going or healthy or even alive.
    Milarepa just ate nettles. Therese Neumann the Eucharest.
    Self proclaimed Black Breatharians are always caught in KFC sooner or later.

  246. Laura Louzader March 13, 2012 at 2:26 pm #

    No, of course a person like Dagny would not support free birth control, but then she would not support lifelong welfare, or any type of corporate welfare, or any of the hairball of massive subsidies for this industry or that activity that we have erected in this country.
    I have always paid my own expenses and no one in my clan has ever been a welfare recipient. Hell, I couldn’t even get unemployment when i most desperately needed it because I had been an “independent contractor” in straight-commission sales (stockbroker). I’m all for rolling back the welfare state.
    So I’ll tell you what. I’ll be happy to see any subsidies for contraception ended on this condition ONLY, which is that ALL subsidies for corporations and all subsidies for business and trade, are ended. First of all, cut all props to the housing industry. If there is anything we don’t need to be subsidizing, it’s housing- we have done nothing but skew the market in favor of higher rents and prices while creating massive moral hazard and a vast overstock of shitty housing. Cut all government subsidies, whether data, local, or federal, for crap like sports stadiums owned by private teams and corporations, and cut transportation funding down to the highways, streets and roads necessary for defense, connecting cities, and utility maintenance and charge tolls on the roads. THAT will cut gasoline consumption tremendously. Cancel every goddam TIF that is nothing but a means to convey our property taxes to a connected corporation.
    In short, cut everything back to basic welfare for the truly needy who have fallen on hard times through job loss or medical catastrophe, and cut “defense” spending back to what is necessary to defend this country against invasion.
    Stop making the citizenry pay for a million things that are not only not what people would choose to support, but are pernicious and harmful, and THEN we will talk about cutting support for contraception.
    And, anyway, you’re talking off the point, because the dispute that has the press roiling is about making the medical insurers that charge a woman about $400 a month of her own money pay for an essential need like contraception. If my premiums help a guy get viagra then they damn well better help me get birth control. Ask any woman who is struggling alongside her husband to support three kids on the typical lower-middle class income if contraception is not an essential need, especially if she wants to maintain her marriage. There is NOTHING a typical husband who is teetering at the edge of possible job loss less wants to hear than that his wife is pregnant with a 3rd or 4th or 5th kid.

  247. Vlad Krandz March 13, 2012 at 2:43 pm #

    Little bags of bird seed? What mean you?
    I have two crab apple trees. What can I do with them? Last Fall, I started picking them up to toss and then decided to let them fertilize the soil and just spread them around the yard. Tried one, not as tart as I thought, definitely eatable in a pinch. But almost all of them had a worm in them. Now I have a bird couple camping out in my yard. I think they’re getting the worms that are coming out of the decaying apples.
    Is there an ecological way to get rid of these worms?

  248. Vlad Krandz March 13, 2012 at 2:51 pm #

    I think I can agree with all that. I realized long ago that you can’t change one big thing without changing everything. And getting from here to there is what separates the boys from the men and the girls from the women.
    But of course, the Left is too strong and with 100,000 new Democratic immigrants every month getting stronger all the time. Now they want to give illegals the right to vote. Otherwise, why not show a picture ID? You need one to get a library card…
    Now they want prisoners to vote. But these are the fast track. They’ll get there even without these innovations – the 100,000 per month and the prolific minorities already here will put them over the top.
    So I fear the work of Destruction begun decades ago must continue to its completion. Our hope is in bad Weather and our Fortitude fortified by our 2nd Ammendment implements.

  249. Bustin J March 13, 2012 at 2:54 pm #

    C.O too, says as well ” I used to be convinced that “Global Climate Change” was something I should worry about but after watching the now famous George Carlin stand-up shtick, “The world is fine”, I stopped worrying.”
    No, you stopped worrying because you did the calculus and your old ass will be 3 feet underground by the time the real pain and suffering begins.

  250. Bustin J March 13, 2012 at 3:06 pm #

    K2 says “When wood decays it releases CO2 so using it for fuel instead is carbon neutral.”
    Wood decaying is being digested by organisms which, among other things, produce CO2, but, as an aggregate group of organisms, their activity builds biomass and locks in carbon in their bodies. So wood ‘decaying’ is actually on its way to becoming embodied carbon, sooner or later, the substrate for new trees.
    Burning it just releases all the carbon into the atmosphere. There is no reciprocal cycle there. It is just wasted.
    And because a wood fire is typically inefficient, most of the energy is lost as well. It produces air pollution.
    It is still more efficient to run higher-efficiency boilers taking advantage of economies and efficiencies of scale and converting it into electricity. And fairly cheap as well.
    Not that it should be. The fact is people live in inefficient homes, too large by far, too individuated.
    But thats what the Home Builders sold us, a pile of shit called Suburbia.
    “A future industry built around growing and harvesting wood products for fuel would also be carbon neutral. Such an industry would be a closed system and probably should be part of the solution.”
    I live in the midst of such an industry and it is a fucking disaster. It is not a closed system. They have ruined a lot of good land and what they produce is a marginal product.
    They are going balls to the wall to build wood-fired power plants everywhere they can. These companies are the great Earth-rapists of the 19th century dressed up with a new logo, trying to sell us all on 19th century ‘solutions’.
    Its looking like its either Thorium reactors or back to a distinctly dirty past.

  251. Laura Louzader March 13, 2012 at 4:06 pm #

    You’re right, Bustin… it’s either thorium reactors, or complete desertification of this continent and Europe, and the die off of about 90% of the population.
    I’m glad for those posting here who own enough acreage that they can provide a wood supply for themselves barely adequate to keep their little houses barely warm in the winter.
    But there are 300 million plus people in this country alone, and there’s no way that this continent can provide firewood and or growing land for each one of them sufficient to keep them barely warm and fed.
    Burning wood in the house is just as dangerous to the health of the occupants as smoking cigars non-stop.
    People don’t understand that the reason we stopped burning wood to begin with and turned to coal, whale oil, natural gas, and finally oil is because our population had outrun our forests by the early 19th century. England was mostly deforested by the middle of the 18th, thus the move to coal and discovery that it produced much more energy. If the forests of Europe and North America couldn’t support a population a sixth the size of the current one, how far would it go now?
    I don’t regard the LFTR as a “silver bullet” that will “solve” all of our energy problems, but it’s the only prayer we have. Thankfully, Curt Sorensen at Flibe Energy is working on producing a commercial LFTR, and other people are developing other MSR technologies. These reactors will be much safe and vastly more economical than the big uranium reactors we use now, and produce almost no waste. As for the uranium fuel cycle, the AP-1000 reactors are infinitely safer and more economical than the old plants we have now.

  252. newworld March 13, 2012 at 4:25 pm #

    I want the poor and uneducated to be provided birth control and taught how to use it, and I want hi tech birth control for those with low IQs and mental illness, male and female.
    We now are stuck with the worst of both sides,the right using a church edict from the pre modern medicine era and a left marching to the tune of genocidal communism “we will overwhelm you whitey” and both incapable of rational thought.

  253. WestCoast March 13, 2012 at 4:44 pm #

    Don’t be so quick to haul away “trash”.
    That organic matter could form mulch piles after rotting for a year.
    Suggest an excellent website to learn about gardening here…
    http://www.verdant.net/food.htm

  254. Laura Louzader March 13, 2012 at 4:48 pm #

    I want birth control and sterilization for anyone, male or female, single or married, of any race or ethnicity or financial standing, who does not want or like kids and/or who feels for any reason that he or she cannot shoulder the burden of parenthood.
    I have known many people raised by parents who didn’t really want them or love them, and it is tragic. The money and prestige possessed by some of these parents couldn’t begin to make up for what they couldn’t give their kids in the way of love, emotional support, instruction in how to live and survive, and the sense of security and “rootedness” that comes from a loving family. And nothing is worse than growing up with a mentally unstable mother who has you at her disposal all day and makes it clear that she doesn’t love you and considers you a hindrance. Seems I knew many people with such mothers, women who should never ever have been near a small child. I have known people who pretty much raised themselves, with mothers who drifted in and out of institutions and who were not really present even when home, and fathers who made a point of being away from the house as much as possible because he couldn’t stand the home atmosphere.
    We have too many people who had kids only because they felt obligated to, or like they would be missing out on something, or to keep their marriages together, or because she wanted a little girl to dress up like a doll or he wanted his own basketball team, or to take care of the parents in their old age (hey, if they don’t WANT to take care of you, they don’t have to and they won’t, even in China), or because everyone else they knew was doing it.
    It’s worth spending a few dimes to keep children from being born to the mentally unstable or deficient, a rather large category that can include a lot of people who are competent in many other respects and who are not a danger to the public as a whole, only to the defenseless little people in their homes who can’t get away from them.

  255. anti soak March 13, 2012 at 5:19 pm #

    WOW. And now they share Nukes with Vietnam!

  256. rippedthunder March 13, 2012 at 5:24 pm #

    What time is dinner tonight? How the heck do ya grow carrots in that shitty glacial till up-country? I’m mostly gravel in the valley also but I do have a few choice spots. Speaking of wood, this is the shit the loggers go through to get the local box store some 2×4’s. Soot sucks, machines are cool, Driver is excellent, How long can this stuff last when the oil runs down.
    http://www.wimp.com/truckdriver/

  257. Listening Loud March 13, 2012 at 5:30 pm #

    I adore Jim Kunstler and his weekly musings on the absurdity of our country and the collective delusions some share at the cost of the future. Our Future. But I must say that I often walk away depressed. My own thing of course. I do not believe that it’s all dooms day because there is something afoot with a movement that sees that what we are purporting to go forth with: the same ole stuff, just ain’t gonna work. For instance this guy has something to say about it. And something both provocative and prophetic. http://sacred-economics.com/film/ Perhaps he and Mr. Kunstler could meet on Charlie Rose. Wow I would love that.

  258. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 5:35 pm #

    Pucker, I posted an interview with Joseph Tainter at k-dog if you’d like to listen to him. Later I’ll add the ability to download a raw mp3 so people can download a podcast. Navigate to video adventures for a listen.

  259. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 6:00 pm #

    All carbon in wood has been extracted from air and has been converted to sugars which are in turn converted to cellulose and other organic molecules which all together constitute wood.
    When wood is burned all the carbon is released. It is a closed cycle, if wood decays 100% it releases all the CO2. If wood is incompletely digested some CO2 is sequestered. If wood is buried in caves then all the CO2 is sequestered but it is going to take a release of CO2 to put it in the cave.
    The earth has had a closed cycle. Before man the CO2 content remained nearly constant for millenia despite constant depletion by photosynthesis.
    CO2 depleted by photosynthesis was returned to the atmosphere by bacterial decomposition at a one hundred percent rate less any increase in biomass. CO2 can be removed from the atmosphere by sequestering it in biomass but in a forest, over time all the wood decays. This makes a campfire in the wilderness carbon neutral, unlike the construction of a nuclear reactor.
    Peat bogs and coal beds are instances of natural carbon sequestration and when we use them we are releasing carbon that would not have otherwise entered the atmosphere, that’s the difference.
    Got wood??

  260. Pucker March 13, 2012 at 6:03 pm #

    “Atoms for Peace”
    They must mean “Peace and Quiet”, right? I heard that Fukashima is now a ghost town.

  261. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 6:04 pm #

    A short answer is that if bacterial decomposition did not release almost 100% of CO2 extracted from the atmosphere then photosynthesis would have rapidly depleted the atmosphere and none of us would be here in the first place.

  262. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 6:06 pm #

    And your glowing with humor.

  263. rippedthunder March 13, 2012 at 8:37 pm #

    When the Thorium reactors come on line how will we store the excess energy produced during times of low demand. There has not yet been forwarded a proposal for a flux capacitor to absorb the excess power produced when the demand is down. We will have to release the excess energy into the biosphere which will of course accelerate global climate change. We could always resort to the exthernium cyclometer to dissipate quarks through a series of external mini-mezzo particle accelerators but I fear that would only lead to a semi-plasma state of over excitement among the indigenous populations within ten miles of the cyclotron.

  264. charliefoxtrot March 13, 2012 at 8:59 pm #

    @ jim, and anyone else with tick problems: chickens; not guinea fowl- they make one of the worst sounds in nature and for collecting them, gorrilla tape…works especially on yhe little itty bitty teeny tiny seed ticks…keep a piece or two stuck to handy locations in the house for the random interloper…and they can live for a long time, so if you wanna break out the magnifying glass and tweezers and get yer torture on…

  265. rippedthunder March 13, 2012 at 9:32 pm #

    This would make the wood heat work go a little easier. This and a log truck and skidder. I’d level a hundred acres a week! Just kidding! I love my trees. I only cut the drops.
    http://www.wimp.com/woodsplitter/

  266. Buck Stud March 13, 2012 at 9:36 pm #

    Of course I appreciate diversity. But I simply see no danger of white people becoming obsolete,i.e., ‘bred out of existence’. So one again, I fail to see what you’re really railing against. In fact, what I see is whites and other ethnic becoming ever more segregated. Nowhere is this more true than at the level of K-12 education.

  267. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 9:39 pm #

    It will not accelerate global warming because what was euphemistically renamed ‘climate change’ in order to confuse what man has done with the Earths natural ebb and flow in temperature is driven by the the difference in how easily the Earth can dissipate solar energy. The less easily it can dissipate heat the warmer things get on the surface. Energy flow is actually always in balance no matter what we do.
    The amount of energy we receive per square meter on the earths surface on a sunny day is about 1000 watts, some energy already having been absorbed by the atmosphere. The total energy given by the sun dwarfs anything man produces or ever will. The ratio is a very small fraction of 1% percent.
    Production of energy by man has never been the problem, upsetting the solar balance is the problem.

  268. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 9:54 pm #

    On an industrial basis wood can be turned into charcoal and the distillate produced contains methanol which can then be used as a carbon neutral fuel. Organics are also produced which can be burned or used as a crude oil substitute in some applications. Charcoal produced can be used for biochar which enriches tropical soils and gives a wood fuel and biochar industry a footprint that is not carbon neutral but a footprint that actually removes CO2 from the atmosphere. Enriched soil can grow food or more wood.
    It is not the whole solution but it needs to be part of the mix.
    A write in revolution can make it happen.

  269. Buck Stud March 13, 2012 at 9:57 pm #

    The below linked essay is way beyond an art essay; it’s cultural criticism par excellence. If only Americans were reading Donald Kuspit instead of listening to Rush Limbaugh, Hannity and that guy on the left- what’s his name?
    Brilliant, profound essay:
    http://www.artnet.com/magazineus/features/kuspit/art-and-capitalist-spectacle2-8-11.asp

  270. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 9:59 pm #

    But nothing will happen unless you do something and this means YOU!!!

  271. Jim March 13, 2012 at 10:03 pm #

    Blight-resistant american chestnuts?? Seems like they’re making progress after all these years…unless they’re asian crosses.
    You’re a modern prepper, whether you admit it or not.
    Ever think of going on Jack Spirko’s podcast -thesurvivalpodcast.com ?

  272. rippedthunder March 13, 2012 at 10:13 pm #

    Hi K-dog, I know you know that post I made was tongue-in -cheek. Tell me you caught that or I am not writing your name on the ballot this November! I just came back from walking my two little buddies and the “pinkletinks” were going crazy. They are at least 3-4 weeks ahead of time. A good frost and a snowstorm will destroy them. I hope for their sake it stays warm, but I have seen 2 ft’ of snow here in April.

  273. Buck Stud March 13, 2012 at 10:13 pm #

    Just in case some don’t read the above posted essay – I presume most wont – here is a paragraph from the Kuspit essay.
    =============================
    ” Homo Spectator is socially, culturally and economically dominant, as the Situationist Guy Debord argues. For him it is not clear that Homo Spectator is Homo Sapiens. In the society of the spectacle, we live in fantasy not in reality, and we are unable to distinguish them. As Debord writes, “the spectacle proclaims the predominance of appearances and asserts that all human life, which is to say all social life, is mere appearance. . . it [is] a visible negation of life. . . a negation of life that has invented a visual form for itself.” “It turns reality on its head,” even as “the spectacle is real.” It establishes “the empire of modern passivity”: the “image of the ruling economic order,” it is “beyond dispute” and “demands. . . passive acceptance.” Where in an earlier capitalist stage, there was a “downgrading of being into having,” the current capitalist stage “entails a generalized shift from having to appearing: all effective ‘having’ must now derive its immediate prestige and its ultimate raison d’être from appearances.”

  274. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 10:17 pm #

    Yeah I knew. But you did have me going a little bit, I was thinking you better be pulling my leg.

  275. k-dog March 13, 2012 at 10:21 pm #

    Besides which it was an opportunity to educate somebody somewhere, at least I hope so. I’ve been of the mind that if the average public could understand science just a little bit better a whole lot of problems could get better real quick.

  276. Laura Louzader March 13, 2012 at 10:42 pm #

    How are we now storing excess energy produced by our current fleet of gigantic nuclear plants, gas fired, and coal fired plants?
    Given that my understanding of how utilities mediate the ebb and flow of power is incomplete at best, I gather that all the generating plants, including the nukes, are capable of generating power at whatever rate is demanded at the time, and that “excess” power generated at one facility is allocated where it’s need as utilities buy and sell the power according to demand.

  277. progress2conserve March 13, 2012 at 11:04 pm #

    This was an extraordinarily interesting post, BJ:
    “You’ll be spotted by aerial drones.
    We’ll still be making 9V batteries.
    We will spot you and we will send a clear signal to stop burning things.”
    -bustinJ-
    You could flesh this out into a pretty good yarn – something like “Farenheit 451” crossbreeds with “1984.” And Big Brother isn’t burning books – Instead, Big Brother is searching for private and unauthorized combustion in fireplaces and wood stoves.
    This has potential, BJ. Your climactic moment could be when 100,000 cold, starving souls fill a decaying old sports stadium. On the field – a small campfire waits. At dark, the fire is lit, and for the next three hours the crowd watches, silent and amazed, as the fire burns down to coals.
    ===========================
    On a more serious note – you’re still wrong.
    Wood is a RENEWABLE resource. Coal, oil, uranium, etc are NOT. Even thorium is finite.
    Wood is not. It just grows – like any other crop. Only the time scale (or really shitty forest management practices) make wood crops appear to be non-renewable to the unknowing.

  278. progress2conserve March 13, 2012 at 11:21 pm #

    “Little bags of bird seed? What mean you?”
    -vlad-
    Little bags of bird seed, spotlights, and small caliber headshots – was an allusion to meat hunting/market hunting/poaching – all of which practices could come to be known as “feeding your family by any possible means.”
    Some of my uncles and the other old boys in south Georgia told tales of having ONE or a few shotgun shell, a little corn, and some hungry younger brothers and sisters to feed in winter. They would plow a single furrow across a field, sprinkle a minimal handful of corn in the furrow – and then wait with the shotgun.
    When enough doves/robins/edible flying creatures landed in the furrow, they would clap their hands to flush the birds, and fire their single shotshell at the best time – downing as many birds as possible.
    I can also tell you tales, told to me, of fishing with dynamite, and – much more common – fishing “with a telephone.”
    Any of you know what that would refer to?
    Nope, wildlife won’t last long – if hunger stalks the suburbs.
    ======================
    As far as worms in your apples – I don’t know. I know commercial growers spray the hell out of apple trees. I’m not sure how they grow them “organically.” Someone besides me has to be more qualified to answer.
    Jump in here, somebody!

  279. progress2conserve March 13, 2012 at 11:35 pm #

    “But neither Laura nor her White Knight Prog addressed my point about the Catholic Medical Establishment. Do you people really want to drive the Church out of Medicine? Sure that’s a good idea?” -vlad to ffkling-
    First, Vlad, in the absence of Mika – who has apparently vanished with Bill in a cloud of self-referential, self-affirmative, and self-congratulatory Pixie Dust – I will begin by attacking the Catholic church and their PR arm known as the Republican Party.
    The Catholic Church and do WHATEVER THE HELL THEY WANT TO – until they collect taxpayer money, OR until the employee civilian and non-catholic persons in NON-religious positions, like doctors and nurses. At that point the Catholic church becomes subject to civil law like the rest of us.
    Besides, the Catholic Church is working hard for a world of 10,000,000,000 (that’s billion) people, all of them Catholic. The fact that these people live in unspeakable squalor, poverty, and degradation – just means more Souls in Heaven – for the Catholic chain of command.
    If you need advice on storing food –
    ask a Mormon.
    If you need advice on population issues –
    do NOT, repeat DO NOT, ask a Catholic.

  280. Vlad Krandz March 14, 2012 at 12:24 am #

    At last we meet the goold ol boy. Anti-Catholicism is the last acceptable prejudice.
    You may not know – the Catholic Medical Establishment is huge. Maybe Catholics aren’t well represented in your area. You went to school in Atlanta – but college kids typically miss alot. If the Church is forced out of Medicine, it will not be good, much chaos will result.
    Or are you against all Churches – except PC ones?
    Thank you for explaining about the bird seed. Makes sense.

  281. Vlad Krandz March 14, 2012 at 12:36 am #

    Whites once lived in Central Asia, Iran, India, and Asia Minor. All gone. Now and then there’s an occasion atavism or throw back and blue eyes show up. And all our homeland are under massive invasion. And we hate ourselves so much that we are letting it happen. How could we not go extinct?
    If I was talking about an endangered species you might take it seriously. Or even a variety of pear. But your own flesh and blood? Not a chance. It’s amazing you can’t see how crazy that is.

  282. progress2conserve March 14, 2012 at 12:40 am #

    I wouldn’t call this Prejudice, Vlad.
    I believe a Church should act like a Church.
    Operating zero-profit hospitals is a fine idea for a Church – when funded by donations to the Church – and employing only bona fide Church members.
    Of course, that’s not what the Catholics are doing here, is it? Far from it, in fact.
    Knowing Medicare, Medicaid, and the torrents of Federal US Governement money that is flowing into the medical system –
    I’ll bet you better than even money that the Catholic Church makes a large PROFIT on medical care in the USA.
    Care to do a little research, Vlad?
    I’ll pay the bet on PayPal.

  283. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 1:42 am #

    Gee P2C, Having traveled in Asia I have to say Most of the worlds Population is Non Catholic, Non Christian and is:
    3 ? Billion In Chindia
    1 Billion in Afrika
    1 ? Billion in the Middle East = 5 of 7 billion
    overwhelmingly non Christian, so much for yr projection.
    Black Afrika are set to double in population, due to whites giving food and vaccines.

  284. Bustin J March 14, 2012 at 1:55 am #

    too many people: life is a struggle.
    Too few? Too few I never knew.
    One things for sure: its Thorium fluoride reactors, electricity for heat, or its lights out planetary system.
    “Afrika” CAN burn us into the stone age.
    All of Nigeria’s oil, burned, will release methane clathrates.
    Nigeria’s oil is largely used to fuel midwestern Americans to and from Wal*Mart.

  285. Bustin J March 14, 2012 at 1:58 am #

    Poc: “I believe a Church should act like a Church.
    Operating zero-profit hospitals is a fine idea for a Church – when funded by donations to the Church – and employing only bona fide Church members.”
    This begs the question: do I want to live in a society where a Church can decide what a Hospital acts like?
    I don’t think so.
    Doctors don’t have to preform abortions. But if they refuse to treat the sick they can be disbarred.
    Thats why religion is left down at the Herbal and supplement stores. Plenty of religion there.
    Kinda works some of the time, just like religion.
    Its called a ‘Placebo Effect’.

  286. Bustin J March 14, 2012 at 2:14 am #

    PoCCer said “Wood is a RENEWABLE resource. Coal, oil, uranium, etc are NOT. Even thorium is finite.”
    Well, I’ll not quibble about what “Renewable” means.
    Suffice it to say the Slamon runs have not “renewed”. Neither have the forests. All of the old trees are gone. All of the giants. The rivers, dammed, the fields paved over, the flowers gone, the animals gone….
    Oh well, I guess I will quibble with it. “Renewable” is bullshit, just like “Recycling”, “Green Energy”, and of course, “Sustainability.”
    Each concept allows us to think we can still living like we did in the past.
    We keep making the mistake of thinking half-measures and contingencies are the key to avoiding disaster.
    Now. What is practical is not always possible, but when it is, it is plausible.
    Thorium is the answer, the mid-range solution.
    It keeps the lights on. You should be fighting for Thorium power.
    Obama should be embracing it.
    Of course, what Obama should be doing is unilaterally pulling out of all foreign trade.
    But thats another post.
    Until then, we’ll have to assume that Israelis, Chinese, Iranianss, Afghan, and Nigerians have far more stake in the direction this country is headed.
    America doesn’t have a foreign policy; it is a foreign policy. The policy is “I am the world’s doormat and housekeeper”.

  287. Bustin J March 14, 2012 at 2:43 am #

    K-dog says “Peat bogs and coal beds are instances of natural carbon sequestration and when we use them we are releasing carbon that would not have otherwise entered the atmosphere, that’s the difference.”
    Carbon neutrality doesn’t have any meaning in a model that assumes the fraction of total atmospheric CO2 is the main factor. (eg. we assume that atmospheric CO2 will continue to rise- and eventually, will reach a point where the wood isn’t going to grow back- because the Earth will be covered in pink slime and no humans will exist.)
    So you see, under the new model, not only is burning wood just as bad as other carbons, its even worse because our last decades will be spent watching the forests cut down and the skies filled with smoke.

  288. asoka. March 14, 2012 at 3:04 am #

    Even thorium is finite.
    This is a pretty meaningless assertion. Thorium is readily available throughout the earth’s crust. To say thorium is finite is like saying dirt is finite. Well, yeah, but so what? We’ll never use it all.
    Glad to see several posters supporting thorium, which I began pushing on CFN several years ago.
    Even Iran is supporting thorium reactors. A smart move since Iran only wants the energy produced and is not interested in developing nuclear weapons.
    Thorium is not fissile and does not produce waste which can be used in nuclear weapons, making thorium a wise choice for Iran, undermining all those who are so concerned that Iran might get a nuclear weapon.
    Iran is not interested in nuclear weapons, only in nuclear energy, so their embracing of thorium makes perfect sense. It is proof they are not going for a nuclear weapon. They get the energy but prove to the world they are not interested in weapons development.
    As to RT’s concern about too much electricity being produced by Thorium and what to do with the excess, I have a suggestion: Put the excess electricity to work powering desalination & water purification plants. The world needs pure water more than it needs petroleum.
    http://bit.ly/ya7lXf

  289. Bustin J March 14, 2012 at 3:40 am #

    The situation in Nigeria is grave. 150 million people and they’ve chopped down over half their forests since 1990.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09WnOdawQ3M

  290. tegmark March 14, 2012 at 5:05 am #

    From:
    http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=177834&start=25
    Planet of The Apes ?
    Time is infinite, the universe extends infinitely in space and time, therefore we are repeating a technological evolution that we already achieved in the past but slowly forgot, and each step of the evolution brings us to a more powerful technology enabling matter to do more with itself, to express itself and invent contraptions out of itself in ever more colorful ways and as the evolution goes forward it reaches a point where it starts to go backwards because it starts to forget some slight informational bits that it needs in order to continue to follow and navigate a given path, a given direction (but there are many directions, many parallel directions and such) so after a long time and after forgetting one bit every thousand years of information we reach the technology of 1950 so to say and start going forward again, or we may reach any mixed state of technological evolution some bits if 1950 some of 2300 some of 10 BC and so on, all possible combinations and mixes, all possible disjoint evolutions of technology given starting points with some parts more advanced than others and such.
    Or we may be always going forward but repeating the same pattern over and over again, like a biological entity creating electronic entities that then create other kinds until a given entity recreates a biological entity forgetting that it came from a biological entity a long time ago and after many intermediate technological steps, etc.
    Or Matter may reach the “Box of Matter” technology where it can assign the matter in the box any configuration imaginable, so as to be exactly equivalent to 1950 or 2300 or the center of a star, or a boat or a person, or an APE, or City or anything and the box can be of any size and can evolve in any way and you can assign it any configuration on the fly, just like a writing system just like setting a combination of bits in a computer and such. But since only the Reciprocal Information Relationships between various Chunks of Matter within the box create the essence of the experience matter undergoes within the box (and especially only the reciprocal informational relationships a Conscious Observer perceives counts, if matter doesn’t contain a self observing gadget within itself, which it may, nay, it does, we just assign any truth, it doesn’t matter, as matter won’t contradict itself, it just invents itself), then these Reciprocal Information Relationships can be mathematically equivalent to a much simpler and more efficiently Self Interacting Chunk of Matter (using much less matter then the full monty box of matter would imply, a bit like compressing information, using less information to create the exact same effect and such, therefore using less matter (maybe even just a few elementary particles, a few electrons and photons ?) to create the same simulated and virtual world (but all worlds are virtual and simulated)), it may be expressed within a much simpler organization of matter, maybe just with a few bits within a Microprocessor that can produce the entire experience of a person – society in 1950, nay, even a deeper and more real experience by just adding a few extra bits and such (the simulation and virtual reality is more real than the reality imitated, and can become deeper and realer to ever more degrees by simply adding bits, nay, our reality is just a lightly simulated reality, the real reality, the deeper, infinitely deeper realities can be assigned and achieved within informational relationship machines and such).
    But it may also be that everything is a memory chunk, every tree, pebble, every road and stone, every planet, wave on the ocean, all you see, and especially all of the combinations of all you see, no matter how random and disjoint is the memory of a past event for a given Modified Man Brain Observer capable of decoding the memory: the entire universe is just one long memory of past events for a given Observer, or many chunks of the universe are memories to given observers, and the delimitations and combinations and bits and pieces of matter used as observers and memories can be any at all, are any at all, etc. But then this recursive memory can be the object of other memories and the memories can be the observers (recursive as in the sequence of symbols (or sequence of items such as that pebble and the tree in Michigan and the ocean wave in the pacific that occurred in 1230, etc. can be a memory chunk for a given Observer made up of a car tire and a TV and a transistor somewhere…) S1 is the memory of an event A that happened 10 years ago, and the memory of when you wrote S1 is another memory slot S2 and the memory of when you wrote S2 is the memory slot S3 and so on) and the observers themselves can be assigned as the memories and so on, combining and mixing all and making all the objects and arguments of anything else as a function and any function can be any argument and so on. The Memory becomes the Observer which becomes the Function (event, (or single signal ?) or event experienced in a wildly modified mind partition from BRAINIUM) which becomes the New Memory Chunk for a New Observer Composed of a new Combination of Matter delimited in a given Chunk, etc.
    But if you can assign the Box of Matter to be anything at all, why do you need so much Memory ? Then just let the Box of Matter cycle through all of the combinations so the process, the repetitive patterns contain the memories within itself automatically and such…
    THE APE HAS TALKED ONCE AGAIN

  291. tegmark March 14, 2012 at 5:17 am #

    Also from:
    http://instantsingularity1.blogspot.com
    and
    http://instantsingularity3.blogspot.com
    AMEN.
    BEWARE OF THE MARK OF THE BEAST

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  293. tegmark March 14, 2012 at 7:48 am #

    From:
    http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=138414
    [quote=”Ken”]But, I think he’s on very shaky ground when he tries to show, that there is something ‘human’ that is not replicable in virtual. He believes that the reductionist foundation of computational AI is flawed. So, as you know reductionist believe we can deconstruct any formal system into its constituent parts, analyze the connections and reconstruct it to understand the system. Searle asserts, that two philosophic concepts make this near impossible when we try to make a virtual emulation of ourselves. First, the epistemic nature of humans. We can have knowledge of things. Second, the ontological nature of humans. We are existing beings. When we try to gain knowledge of our inner structure via reductionist methodology, the fact the we are applying the knowledge to ourselves makes it fall apart. Or more simply put ‘to be’ obstructs ‘to know’. This is a simplfied version of what he has written in at least two book at present. We can’t make a machine that has our qualities because trying to know the qualities we have dooms it because are subjects of those qualities. It’s very close to Goedel’s Incompleteness Theorem in mathematical logic. I believe Searle is wrong on this point. But, my msg has already gone on too long.[/quote]
    Just imagine the process in practice:
    1) We open a Brain and we start modifying it physically, we start changing, playing around and experimenting with new neural circuits or inserting new chips and signals and circuits and whatever in the brain “TO SEE WHAT HAPPENS”;
    2) Who is “SEEING WHAT HAPPENS” ? A different “External Brain”, so the external “Objective” Brain, the “Reference System That is Measuring the Modified Brain” is treating the “Brain Under Experimentation” as an “Object” as something “Different from Itself”;
    3) But at that point, the Measuring and External and Objective – Reference System Brain is no longer “The Same Thing” as the Modified Brain; it is studying something different. How different ? It may be infinitely different up to the point of being totally not related to the Observing – Objective Brain at all, the Brain “O” observing and studying the Brain under experimentation “M” may have no relationships at all with each other (but who or what can establish this ?), “O” and “M” may be totally disjoint, unrelated, “O” may be as related to “M” as a car tire is related to a mountain.
    4) So how is the Observing Brain “O” going to find out or know anything about “M” ? It must interact with “M” in some way but it must be sure that “M” is not lying, is producing correct data, that the subjective experience of “M” is really what “O” thinks it is, etc. But to be somewhat sure, “O” would have to merge into “M” or be connected to “M” in more than one way, and to be really 100 % sure “O” would have to be exactly “M”, but if “O” is “M” then it is no longer “O”, so maybe it could be an intermediate entity, a mix between “O” and “M”, but then it would be neither “O” or “M”, it would be something different yet.
    Conclusion: reductionism cannot be used to understand (?) the Man Brain, (in fact nothing can be used to understand the Man Brain ?) or can be used only very partially as long as the Man Brain being manipulated is not too different from the Observing Brain…or maybe reductionism can be used to understand the Man Brain ?
    8

  294. tegmark March 14, 2012 at 7:52 am #

    Also from:
    http://instantsingularity1.blogspot.com
    and
    http://instantsingularity3.blogspot.com
    AMEN.
    BEWARE OF THE MARK OF THE BEAST

  295. charliefoxtrot March 14, 2012 at 8:52 am #

    scrollover country like iowa

  296. ozone March 14, 2012 at 9:26 am #

    That was a pretty amazing escape. Wonder where that was shot?
    Anyhoo, for carrots and parsnips: raised beds, m’man, raised beds. I put down a long rectangle of 8-10″ dia. logs, then get out the maddock and pinch bar to pop out the rocks down another 6″ or so (lots and lots of rocks, and then there’s those dang rocks). Then it all gets filled up with composted manure, marginal “woods dirt” that has some organic content, and a bit of wood ash. That’s pretty much it, along with a spot with good exposure to the sun. We eat and can some of the carrots (around the outer edges, where they can get frost mushed), then cover the whole parsnip carrot bed with a couple feet of leaves and clippings for overwintering. (This turns into about 8″ of stuff after the winter beatings.)
    Those who wish to continue harvesting mid-winter need to put down a minimum of 3′ of mulchings to keep the frost out of the bed for digging. I just wait for “most” of the frost to disappear to pry up my treasures. With the mulching, it doesn’t seem to run too deep. Absence DOES make the heart grow fonder (and the taste buds sharper).

  297. ozone March 14, 2012 at 9:29 am #

    Say Charlie,
    What did you mean about placing Gorilla tape in “strategic spots” for the trapping of ticks? Sort of a flypaper idea? And exactly what would be a “strategic spot”?

  298. progress2conserve March 14, 2012 at 10:02 am #

    OK,
    Bustin J
    I have to say
    I’ve enjoyed our interplay –
    But hey, anyway – wood is a renewable resource, just like the carrots in my garden, although on a longer time scale. And your words to the contrary will not change the fact that using renewable wood for direct home heating – is more efficient and better for the Planet (at least marginally) than is burning coal, to produce electricity, to heat homes.
    NOW – you invoked Thorium Power to win your argument. Fair enough – when Thorium replaces Coal for production MY electricity, then I’ll agree electric heat beats wood heat.
    I said WHEN, by the way. I’m not sure CFN is the best forum for discussion of the arcane engineering issues that may or may not prevent or enable the development of commercial scale thorium-electric power plants.
    I’ll say the obstacles are formidable. India is supposed to have a working thorium plant by 2012. That gives them nine more months. We’ll see, shall we?
    Lightbridge (LTBR) is the only US company (publicly traded, anyway) that is a Thorium Power investment. I bought some LTBR about a year ago now. I’m down over 60% since I bought in.
    Watch LTBR. If it doubles or triples before this coming December – then maybe those Indians are onto something.
    This was interesting:
    http://spectrum.ieee.org/tech-talk/energy/nuclear/is-thorium-the-nuclear-fuel-of-the-future
    “I must note here that there are counter-arguments to these arguments and counter-counter-arguments to boot. If I listed them all it would just be turtles all the way down. Ultimately, we can argue all we want, but the proof will come in the most basic possible form—someone submitting a credible design to the US Nuclear Regulatory Commission or some analogous body. So far, that hasn’t happened. NRC spokesperson Scott Burnell told Spectrum that there “isn’t anything on our radar for a thorium-based reactor at this point.”
    -sally adee-

  299. greyghost05 March 14, 2012 at 10:14 am #

    I don’t know where you got that idea from. Deer will walk right thru human pee. It dosen’t seem to bother them and I can speak from my hunting expirences on this. Tests have proven this many times. You can check out some of this on the hunting shows on the Outdoor channels. Try hanging dryer sheets or girlie soap out by the garden. That was a tip I read in an old Organic Gardening mag back in the 70’s.

  300. ront March 14, 2012 at 10:16 am #

    By Mark Morford, SF Gate Columnist
    Wednesday, March 14, 2012
    And then the international think tank said, you know what? It’s still not working.
    All the green initiatives in the world combined with all your good intentions intermixed with a million heartfelt promises to do better, all the environmental summit agreements and all the solar panels and recycled toothbrushes and spending all those hours sorting plastic from glass and carefully rinsing your mustard bottles?
    Not helping. Or rather, not helping much, given how it appears we would need, according to recent measures, 1.5 Earths to sustain our current rate of consumption, and you can point to China and India all you want but they’re far from the primary culprits (that would be, of course, us) and anyway the odds are very good you’re pointing to them on your iPad and your smart phone as you sit at a fine cafe gorging on five times more food than the average Hindu eats in a year.
    more:
    Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2012/03/14/notes031412.DTL#ixzz1p6H3K4wt

  301. greyghost05 March 14, 2012 at 10:23 am #

    W T F ? You mean you just can’t just take a leak wherever or whenever the need arises ? I’ve seen people get out and pee on the side of the road on the westbound approach to the GW on I-95 because traffic was stopped cold. Once the 1st dude crossed the line, the highway got wet.

  302. rippedthunder March 14, 2012 at 10:24 am #

    Keep the pinch bar handy buddy! More rocks will rise to the service as time goes by. The damn things are like slow moving bubbles in a glass of fine champagne!

  303. rippedthunder March 14, 2012 at 10:27 am #

    Mornin” Aso, I hope you did not take my post seriously. If you did, I have an adobe bridge to sell you over the CT. River.

  304. progress2conserve March 14, 2012 at 10:38 am #

    Anyone interested in reduction of human population growth rates here?
    You should pay attention to Anti-Soak and Vlad on the one hand, and Helen and Grouchy on the other.
    Here we have the polar opposite bookends, that conspire unwittingly – to doom humanity to a creeping miasma of overpopulation and death.
    One bookend represented by Vlad –
    who, despite his fear of White being overwhelmed by Black and Brown due to demographics and birthrates – Vlad is opposed to free US birth control for all. Apparently, Vlad bases this on some squishy reasoning related to some squishy interpretation of Christianity and Patriarchy. Anti-Soak chimes in here, with his Religious Zeal in opposing All Abortions for All Reasons. Go figure?
    Then Grouchy and Helen jump up and down and all over Laura L – because Grouchy and Helen share a squishy sense of squishy “racism?” that says that any talk of helping poor women, or underpriviledged women, or stupid women, or handicapped women – reduce their outputs of children –
    All such talk must be STOPPED, in the world of Grouchy/Helen. Go figure?
    I don’t often agree with NewWorld, but he nailed US “policy?” concerning birth control quite well.
    “We now are stuck with the worst of both sides,the right using a church edict from the pre modern medicine era and a left marching to the tune of genocidal communism “we will overwhelm you whitey” and both incapable of rational thought.”
    -newworld-
    Damn well stated, nw.

  305. AllisonV12 March 14, 2012 at 10:48 am #

    Sorry…I find all this avant-garde yupsteader survivalist talk tiresome.
    To play that game you need to have a wheelbarrow of cash and some obscure type of job to have left the large city behind.
    But living in the city I try my best with a few 5 gallon black buckets and Tomato sprouts from Home Depot arranged along the cinder block wall of my own forty acres or more realistically forty square feet.
    The clock stop end times similar to the movies Postman or Mad Max wont work in this hood,no starting a fantasy blacksmith forge or bartering with my recently arrived Mexican immigrant neighbors,They barter food stamps as I look own sheepishly.I figure everyone will just go berserk when it gets rough and my home defense weaponry might keep them civil for few extra weeks before desperation cancels out common sense.
    So I figure with by expertise and garden produce I will have three or four weeks of produce before starvation sets in.

  306. greyghost05 March 14, 2012 at 10:50 am #

    I guess your little chunk of Ohio hasn’t been over run with Coyote’s yet. Here in SE Micgigan, I haven’t had a woodchuck on my farm for going on 5 years. I don’t know where they went,a buddy of mine says it’s the ‘yotes. They cleaned up the feral cats too. When times get tough like they are now,the der are the 1st to fall.

  307. youmouyixia March 14, 2012 at 10:53 am #

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  308. 8man March 14, 2012 at 10:54 am #

    From:
    http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=142131
    Let’s put this thing up on two feet:
    1) Science is rendered Obsolete by Philosophy, as philosophy will invent a new explanation for everything, a new kind of mathematics made up of the manipulation of words instead of quantities, such as “the square root of the word “thought” is equal to “space” multiplied “mountain” divided by “electron”” and such; And also any sequence of symbols meaning anything as deep as possible, infinitely deep such as £$H$%H%H&%H&& (which can also be a new design of a modified Man Brain, etc.);
    2) Philosophy is Always Wrong, Strives to be Always Wrong, Strives to Be Useless, has no Social Use, is Impossible to Understand, is Always Right, is totally contradictory, Strives to be as Contradictory and Confusing and Illogical as Possible, accepts all kinds of logical contradictions, strives to be as contradictory, chaotic and messed up as possible, lets you invent all you want, just because, for fun, and this very sentence is totally false and wrong, you are allowed to lie intentionally in philosophy, you are allowed to deceive and confuse, you are allowed to do anything you want as the person performing the act of philosophy is just playing games and wants to have fun, etc. in other words BE YOUR OWN BOSS;
    3) Invention is king in philosophy, the goal is to invent as many far out and incredible concepts as possible, invent the most illogical and unrelated relationships as possible, be crazy, be wrong, and in fact the limit of philosophy to truth is that it becomes a pure art form, an aesthetics game, it invents that which is pretty, colorful and striking aesthetically, etc.;
    4) There are no constraints in philosophy, you can say anything you want, do anything you want, associate anything you want, etc. It is outside of any possible reference system, any stage with respect to any ground point (comparison and measurement events) of any Measuring Device (another Man Brain design ?);
    5) The goal of philosophy is to be as incomprehensible as possible, to be as far away from any sense or truth as possible, to get people mad, angry and to let everyone abandon the discipline as it is superior to any Man Brain Design or Observer, etc.;
    6) Philosophy is exactly the opposite of all of the above, I lied, I fooled you all, ha, ha ;
    7) Sentence 6 is false;
    8 ) Philosophy cannot be communicated in any way to anyone, it is a completely 100 % subjective personal experience without any possibility of being communicated (not even to itself or the person thinking the philosophy), it is the pure breakdown of communication, even of communication of the philosopher with himself, there are no longer any symbols or thought paths or delimitations that can contain its contents, etc.;
    9) The very word “Philosophy” is just a place holder for something else: good luck trying to understand or figure out anything of the above, but actually just assign it as you want, just force anything you want, just deceive yourself, be delusional to the upmost, lies are sacred, tell yourself lies, ever deeper and more lies forever;
    10) Write anything you want for point 10, it all goes, it is all ok, also philosophy has proven all of our Science, Technology and all of our prior knowledge as being 100 % wrong in all Once and for All;
    11) I win always, like a cry baby I always win, I won, I won, there, I said it;
    12) Philosophy has solved all of its and all problems once and for all: “it is concerned with crucial questions that were insoluble but have now been completely solved by assigning the Magic Final Symbol as the Last Answer to All” ;
    13) I could go on and on now like “Hate Nature”, “Crack Open Skulls and Shove Wild Chemicals Inside Them to Reach New Universes with New Laws of Physics”, “Split the Sun to Grab all of its Energy”, “Kill Everyone and Everyone Should All Kill Each Other”, and so on and such, just read all of my past 1,400 posts very carefully, study them all very carefully inside out, forever;
    14) This post is worth a Big Fat Zero, I love to demolish the worth and value of anything (and anyone ? especially myself ?) by a simple free will decision event, especially the value of my own posts, so I always win as anyone criticizing them will find me on their side, always, hence I always win. I love to lose, I always lose, I am a loser. AMEN.
    From:
    http://instantsingularity3.blogspot.com/
    Interesting to see the difference between Theoretical Physics and Philosophy – Metaphysics:
    Theoretical Physics:
    Essentially states How far can we take logical and mathematical structures and still make them somehow be tied up to the real physical world, still have some kind of connection, even though very weak or indirect with physical reality ? An example could be Superstring Theory.
    Philosophy and Metaphysics:
    Essentially states How far can logical and mathematical structures be pushed operating on items as far removed as possible from the physical world, items as abstract, absurd and impossible as possible, hence having zero connection to the real physical world, but still being connected to each other through any form of logic, mathematical or thought processes and sequences ? An example could be the invention of a new state – meaning – concept expressing it as “the square root of the word thought”.
    But whereas the theoretical physicist and also the mathematician still has some constraints upon what he can do by some connection, no matter how weak, with the real world, or at least with some possible logic that is somewhat non contradictory and that somewhat still must follow some sense, the metaphysical and philosophical “Inventor” no longer has any constraints whatsoever, is free to investigate anything at all, make up any connections he wants, invent anything he wants, doesn’t have any possible constraint operating upon his tasks. But then items as contradictory and absurd as possible can always be connected to each other or invented, just their existence, their delimitation in our mind, their presence already provides them with a minimum of logical and mathematical structure as in order to exist, in order to contain them in our mind, in order to even speak about them they must at least follow the basic principles of identity and non contradiction..
    BEWARE OF THE MARK OF THE BEAST

  309. 8man March 14, 2012 at 11:02 am #

    From:
    Philosophy has Rendered Science Obsolete
    http://instantsingularity1.blogspot.com

  310. JonathanSS March 14, 2012 at 11:30 am #

    All this talk about heating with wood is discouraging; that’s so 19th century.
    Since we’re stuck with all these cheap stick structures, we can’t easily convert them into something more suitable. But, we can look at passive solar heating. In addition to super insulating the envelope, that would be something to consider.
    There are all sorts of good books & internet sites addressing various approaches.

  311. Widespreadpanic7 March 14, 2012 at 11:31 am #

    RipT & Ozone, how’re enjoying this fine early spring weather? Unbelievable, no? I’m still cleaning up from that storm in October; took a sugar maple down Saturday that had snapped off about 40 ft. up. It was tricky, we used Collins axes. My neighbor is an EPA engineer and luckily knows what he is doing.
    I’m giving up on asparagus. I bust my balls over that asparagus, coaxing into life. After the requisite 2 seasons results not so good. And just yesterday, right at the entrance of the local Shoprite, a square mile of every food conceivable, a large display of tall green stalks of asparagus at .99 c per pound. What’s the point?
    Oh, 8man, what the f–k are you talking about? Give it up!
    –WSP7

  312. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 11:34 am #

    I dont know where you are but Im a walk from Beverly Hills.
    ‘But if they refuse to treat the sick they can be disbarred.’
    Here MDs are many and mighty.
    They are Dermatologists and Shrinks.
    Easiest ways to get rich.
    And they refuse to treat ‘the poor’. So what else is new?

  313. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 11:36 am #

    I exposed yr canard, that Catholicism is the [sic]
    root of all population growth by saying that worldwide population increases are mostly non christian.
    What part of fact dont you understand?

  314. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 11:38 am #

    If you are in LA you can go to free Permaculture Meetings.
    We have happy games and happy disaster scenarios!
    Santa Monica, the ‘sustainable’ city.

  315. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 11:43 am #

    Vlad has stated what the fate of that continent will be, China will rule it and grab its resources.
    I doubt the Chinese Govt and Billionaires need its unskilled labor, as China has 1.5? billion.

  316. greyghost05 March 14, 2012 at 12:11 pm #

    Just wait a little longer the wild asparagus will be up. Right now is still a good time to recon along roads and south facing overpass berms. Asparagus turns a bright school bus yellow when hit by a good frost. Once you find some, you’ll always be able to spot it in your travels. I average about 900 to 1000 pieces every year just checking 3 bridges along US 23 out here. I harvest every other day when it starts coming up. It’s free and good exercise. Use Cutters or Deep Woods OFF for the ticks. You can harvest wild asparagus from 1st up in April to about July 1st. If you google it you will find many websites from various universities on the subject.
    I also have a patch out in the yard that has been there for at least 60 years according to one of my neighbors who remembers it from when he was a kid. He’s 75. It’s not producing as much as it used to though.

  317. greyghost05 March 14, 2012 at 12:32 pm #

    Raised beds 4 sure. Organic Gardening and the Rodale Press were on top of this way back in the 70’s. Before Robert Rodale died. I bought a 7hp “Troy Built” tiller back in 1978 and it came with instructions for wide row and raised bed planting. I’ve used both and the results are great. If you plant Blue Lake 274 bush beans in a 27″ wide(1 tiller width)row and space the seeds 6″ apart for the length&width of the row you will have more then enough to can. Back then we used to have a 25’X50′ garden. We put in green,yellow and some purple ones and used to give away grocrey bags full to our friends. Planting that close helps pollinization and shades out the weeds while holding moisture. It also helps to use grass clippings to mulch the beds and the path between the bed rows. We also used to rake the leaves into the garden in fall and till it all under before the ground froze.

  318. Vlad Krandz March 14, 2012 at 12:51 pm #

    Wrong on all counts. You Klan types always hate Catholics. I’m not against birth control but abortion. As I’ve said many times, I believe in birth control though the Pill is not optimum for various reasons. What I AM saying, is that the Churches shouldn’t be forced to do things or pay for things they don’t believe in. Why is that so hard for you to accept – or even understand? You want some kind of monolithic all powerful state that takes over via health care? Then vote for Obama – AGAIN.
    Christianity has made a huge contribution to the West and America, and I know that’s hard for you lefties to accept that. I know that you sometimes go to a “Church” but as St Paul said, “They will have a form of Religon but without its power”. How well he prophesized of you!
    I know the Church is corrupt. They have accepted Federal Funds, a deal with the Devil. And he who pays the piper calls the tune. And I know they reject birth conrol – which I accept. I admit I’m conflicted, and with the true instinct of the predator you zone right in on that and attack – ignoring my broad minded attempts to reconcile the differening paradigms: Eugenics, over population, Christian Charity, the rights of the unborn, etc. If you don’t want to address my attempt at synthesis, fine. But don’t misrepresent me at least.

  319. Vlad Krandz March 14, 2012 at 12:53 pm #

    Ever go to the Vedanta Temple in Hollywood where Bubba Free John came to Enlightenment? Irregardless of what you think of that claim-the place is pregnant with Power as he said.

  320. Buck Stud March 14, 2012 at 12:55 pm #

    8MAN,
    I get where you’re coming from but I think Bertrand Russell really nailed it:
    ========================
    The value of philosophy is, in fact, to be sought largely in its very uncertainty. The man who has no tincture of philosophy goes through life imprisoned in the prejudices derived from common sense, from the habitual beliefs of his age or his nation, and from convictions which have grown up in his mind without the co-operation or consent of his deliberate reason. To such a man the world tends to become definite, finite, obvious; common objects rouse no questions, and unfamiliar possibilities are contemptuously rejected. As soon as we begin to philosophize, on the contrary, we find, as we saw in our opening chapters, that even the most everyday things lead to problems to which only very incomplete answers can be given. Philosophy, though unable to tell us with certainty what is the true answer to the doubts which it raises, is able to suggest many possibilities which enlarge our thoughts and free them from the tyranny of custom. Thus, while diminishing our feeling of certainty as to what things are, it greatly increases our knowledge as to what they may be; it removes the somewhat arrogant dogmatism of those who have never travelled into the region of liberating doubt, and it keeps alive our sense of wonder by showing familiar things in an unfamiliar aspect.”
    http://www.skepdic.com/russell.html

  321. Vlad Krandz March 14, 2012 at 1:08 pm #

    One of the greatest secrets of Anthropology: the giant brains of some of the Ancient Aristocrats. It’s not just an artistic convention, the skulls are actually shaped this way. Imagine the brain size and IQ they must have had. They seemed to have been centered in Egypt but they have been found other places. They are the ones responsible for the Engineering marvels of Ancient Egypt.
    Were they even human? Or part Alien? Or just a mutation from Neanderthal – who also had a large posterior brain?
    http://www.everythingselectric.com/forum/index.php?topic=179.0

  322. anglo March 14, 2012 at 1:10 pm #

    Just listening to our 5pm news.
    Our “Dave” and your “Barack” are spouting so much gut wrenching bollocks I have had to turn it down.
    Are we Brits alone in finding this stomach churning guff utterly repellent and disgusting ?

  323. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 1:16 pm #

    Ive read that Size does not = Greater Smarts,
    Rather its the neural Connections.
    Yes Ive been to ‘Vedanta Place’ [thats really the street name]. Frank Jones [Bubba] was a Shakti guy
    and the temple is a holy place.
    Pro2, I dont want to fight with someone who I am mostly in agreement BUT where are the biggest families?
    I read its Midlle East and Afrika wuth 7 child families.
    Lowest Birthrates include Italy and France
    [1 child[ DESPITE THE MUSLIMS THERE AND THEIR
    HUGE FAMILIES.
    How many Catholics [read ‘heathens’] do we have?
    What size are their families?
    A Romanian gal is a grandma at 27, her daughter had a baby at age 11. Like mom like daughter.

  324. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 1:22 pm #

    Hows this? from the Sustainable City!!!!
    Santa Monica College to offer two-tier course pricing
    The school’s governing board has approved a plan to offer certain high-demand classes for a higher price when the regular classes have filled up.
    It’s believed to be the first such scheme in the nation.
    [scheme indeed!!!]

  325. Vlad Krandz March 14, 2012 at 1:33 pm #

    Where can I find some Thorium? Is the name related to the Norse God Thor?
    I want my own little reactor to run my appliances and heat my house.

  326. k-dog March 14, 2012 at 2:21 pm #

    No

  327. k-dog March 14, 2012 at 2:28 pm #

    “If all men were well off, if poverty and disease had been reduced to their lowest possible point, there would still remain much to be done to produce a valuable society; and even in the existing world the goods of the mind are at least as important as the goods of the body.”
    Yup

  328. asoka. March 14, 2012 at 2:31 pm #

    Vlad, don’t forget your car. A 250-kilowatt unit (equivalent to about 335 horsepower) weighing about 500 pounds would be small and light enough to put under the hood of a car.
    And because a gram of thorium has the equivalent potential energy content of 7,500 gallons of gasoline, LPS calculates that using just 8 grams of thorium in the unit could power an average car for 5,000 hours, or about 300,000 miles of normal driving.

  329. messianicdruid March 14, 2012 at 3:10 pm #

    “Are we Brits alone in finding this stomach churning guff utterly repellent and disgusting?”
    It may seem so, but no.
    “TODAY is my [Greg Smith] last day at Goldman Sachs. After almost 12 years at the firm — first as a summer intern while at Stanford, then in New York for 10 years, and now in London — I believe I have worked here long enough to understand the trajectory of its culture, its people and its identity. And I can honestly say that the environment now is as toxic and destructive as I have ever seen it. . . .
    The firm has veered so far from the place I joined right out of college that I can no longer in good conscience say that I identify with what it stands for. . . .
    I am sad to say that I look around today and see virtually no trace of the culture that made me love working for this firm for many years. I no longer have the pride, or the belief.”
    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/14/opinion/why-i-am-leaving-goldman-sachs.html?_r=1
    Here is what Bix Weir has to say about it:
    “Holy Cow Batman! It’s the HEAD of European Derivatives for one of the biggest CDS players in the world, Goldman Sachs! He’s running for the hills just days before the settlement of the largest CDS payout in the history of the industry! Lay this fact on top of the retirement of the CEO of the CME and the removal of the CME as a European Derivative Clearing Organization and you have one toxic brew.
    I’ve been doing some research into the settlement process of CDS’s for the Friday Road Trip and from what I can surmise they call it the “Big Bang Protocol” for a reason! What a Cluster #!@*! When the DTCC came out and said this was only a $3.2B issue, they totally left out all the Greek CDS’s that are not purchased to cover any specific bond investments…which is most of the Greek CDS market!
    He is referring to his post yesterday, where the European Derivative Clearing Organization made a very important anouncement–getting out of the derivatives business.”
    The CFTC just released this announcement related to the CME withdrawing as a European Derivatives Clearing House: March 13, 2012
    CFTC Vacates CME Clearing Europe Limited Registration as a Derivatives Clearing Organization
    Washington, DC–At the request of CME Clearing Europe Limited (CMECEL), pursuant to Section 7 of the Commodity Exchange Act, the Commodity Futures Trading Commission issued an Order on March 13, 2012, vacating the registration of CMECEL as a derivatives clearing organization.
    http://www.cftc.gov/PressRoom/PressReleases/pr6208-12
    “Did you catch that the removal of the status was “AT THE REQUEST OF THE CME”?
    There is a RAGING wildfire behind the scenes as the entire $50,000,000,000,000 Credit Default Swap market is imploding due to the Greek default. The losses will come fast and furious once the auction is held on March 19th. The ISDA’s 2009 “Big-Bang Protocol” will be put to the test next week.”
    Give it another week, and we’ll see how this plays out. Supposedly, the Greek default agreement last week was only going to cost the bond insurers $3.2 billion. Bix is saying that their calculations did not include most of the losses, or the even worse condition of Spain. Between this and the resignation of the CEO of Goldman Sachs, I think they are trying to get out of the town before the 2,000 pound bomb scatters their body parts to the four corners of the earth.

  330. k-dog March 14, 2012 at 3:16 pm #

    It takes about twenty horsepower or 15,000 watts to pull an average sized car along at 50 mph. More power is needed for acceleration and hill climbing. Gasoline engines are rated at peak output and ‘horsepower rating’ does not paint an accurate picture of true automobile power requirements. A 20 horsepower electric motor can drive a car because the rating describes continuous output and it can deliver more for acceleration and hills.
    250 kilowatts can keep 16 cars moving along at 50 miles per hour.
    If I was flush with green I’d be making myself an electric pick up that would use about twenty deep cycle golf cart batteries and would have a forty mile range. Accounting for battery depreciation and the increased power bills from over night charging the cost to run it would equal two dollar a gallon gasoline.
    Unfortunately employment in my ‘profession’ (I do have one.) is sketchy and has been since 2008, My dream of building an electric pick up is on hold, probably forever.
    **************************************************
    Update,
    Wow, I just checked and the US president makes $400,000 K a year!!! Twice what I thought.
    It looks like I’ll be able to convert a pick up after all. I’ll have to save money and wait four years before I have time again but the project will only cost about 15K start to finish. I’d better plug my campaign to make it happen. Here goes:
    Join the k-dog write in revolution!!!!!!!!
    An old El Camino with a new paint job might be sweeter. The batteries can go in the bed under a nice looking cover.

  331. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 3:18 pm #

    DOWs at a 12? year High!!!!

  332. k-dog March 14, 2012 at 3:21 pm #

    No Hydraulics in the El Camino, electric vehicles are kept as light as possible. This is one puppy that will not be hopping up and down.

  333. Bustin J March 14, 2012 at 3:38 pm #

    PoC said “wood is a renewable resource, just like the carrots in my garden, although on a longer time scale. ”
    Yes, and it is the time scale which makes the term “renewable” meaningless. We haven’t got the marginal amount of time to make it meaningful. In other words, either an alternative is developed that makes wood obsolete, or wood won’t make a difference. All the precious paper company forests are going to be increasingly threatened by drought, pestilence, and fire.
    “… using renewable wood for direct home heating – is more efficient and better for the Planet (at least marginally) than is burning coal, to produce electricity, to heat homes.”
    I really doubt that, because wood’s energy is largely wasted. Describe your setup- I’ll bet more than 90% of the energy goes right up the chimney. The smoke is a mixture of water and incomplete combustion products.
    Its a pig, and no amount of lipstick is going to change that.
    Where wood is made efficient and clean, I’ll grant your argument creedence.
    Around here they (timber co’s.) are building biomass pyrolysis plants to use all the extra crap left over after a clearcut. That process is much, much more efficient. You take a ton of biomass at a time, shred it and inject it into an airless chamber at several thousand degrees.
    The result is an abundance of electrical power which is far more efficient at the end-use. The total efficiency, system-wide, is many times higher than a typical suburban “roarin’ fireplace”.
    Efficiency is a system-wide parameter. Could wood be more efficient? Yeah- try living in reasonably sized homes, efficiently insulated, with the wood burned and scrubbed using economies of scale, and delivered pollution-free to the end-user as 90% efficient electrical heat. Raise efficiency by shorter transits to the ‘burbs, to higher density living arrangements. This used to be called a “farm”- sometimes several families living side by side, sharing skills and building resources.
    The problem, or, the irony, if it could be called that, is the fact that the “Asteroid belt” of rural existence is still mighty inefficient. The cartoon of country living is still deeply embedded. Rural people have both feet in the modern world, with their ATVs, gas weedwhackers, and iPhones.
    Has anyone every done the cost-benefit analysis on cordwood as commodity? That is, if you are so good at splitting it, why not sell the seasoned wood and let some other fool burn it? Can you not take the cash and invest it in an electrical bill?
    The main problem I see that hasn’t been adapted to is that there is little co-housing among your cohort. You have very large homes, and very few people in them. People talk about the solution being “nicer to the neighbors”- are y’all going to wait until the shit hits the fan?
    All of these plans, the little gardens, raised beds and so forth- its just not good enough. Its still a cartoon of country living. Real country living is a community coming together to raise a barn- and having the wherewithal to assemble all the necessary pieces- the blacksmith, the carpenters, and the tight knit community. I know its nearly impossible to imagine because the rural areas are filled with a hodgepodge of retirees and suburban exiles, commuters and faux farmers. Where is the generational spread that brings youth and energy? Where are the skillsets that make the most of rural resources?
    I’ve been studying the old New England barns. These colonial farmers were constantly building. They made their own tools. People diversified.

  334. Bustin J March 14, 2012 at 3:51 pm #

    I am writing from an urban area. After posting I walk past a guy in a suit at his laptop. On the screen is an shopping page- he is looking at purchasing a chainsaw.
    The problem with America is everyone believes that buying things is a way to solve problems.
    I wonder about the wood problems this guy has.
    For most people I know with wood problems- they aren’t really problems. The real problem is the person- he doesn’t know what to do with himself. In the absence of any constructive vision of what to do with himself, he grabs the nearest tool and commits himself to destruction. The trees are not the problem, the problem is this man has no relationship to the land. He is ignorant of nature, unsure of his place in the world. He responds to the urge to learn by unleashing his spare time and energy finding problems. Instead of learning a fine skill with a hand tool, he wields fossil fuel power in a crude and ignorant way.
    The tree was not a problem, but with the first cut, it becomes one. Once started, he is compelled to finish like a serial killer dismembering a body. At the end of the day he is tired and this convinces him he has accomplished something. Since it is his habit he therefore rationalises some kind of virtue from his actions. This is the way of the suburban consumer, not the self-sufficient steward of the landbase.
    When the shit hits the fan the skillbase will include a large proportion of people who only know how to cut up trees, mostly with fossil fuel power. What good is that, from a community perspective?
    Contrary to popular belief, a tree cut down isn’t “carbon neutral”. A cut down tree does not absorb carbon. It does not bear fruit. It does not provide shade or beauty in a warming world. Its heat is transient, accomplishing nothing in most cases.

  335. IxNoMor March 14, 2012 at 4:50 pm #

    soker: “Glad to see several posters supporting thorium, which I began pushing on CFN several years ago.”
    Gee, !thx! soker – where would we be without your input. Too bad the stockpiles of reactor-ready thorium fuel have been *destroyed*!!!
    energyfromthorium.com/2006/07/07/how-to-throw-away-eight-years-worth-of-electricity/
    Wow, 8 years ago, they buried it all (8 years worth of US consumption)? I’m thinking this doesn’t include the leftovers from Hanford?
    I swear, I thought I saw something, somewhere, about Hanford having a couple hundred years worth of fuel-grade thorium stockpiled, that they were also going to destroy (but can’t find any details – see addendum)…
    http://www.hanfordchallenge.org/cmsAdmin/uploads/2008_12_10_Fall_Newsletter_ONLINE_VERSION.pdf
    (Hanford’s environmental reports do not mention thorium.
    Marco Kaltofen notes, “The appearance of an isolated thorium hotspot at thirteen times the removal standard, coincidentally downstream of an enormous thorium disposal site, should evoke some skepticism from objective officials.”)
    soker: “Thorium is not fissile and does not produce waste which can be used in nuclear weapons”
    (Hanford used thorium in many of its processes, including a classified program to make “mini-nukes” – tactical nuclear weapons with a much smaller energy yield, useful for battlefield deployments.

    Thorium – considered as dangerous as plutonium from a health standpoint – is used in the production of Uranium-233 which was produced for proposed use in tactical nuclear warheads for battlefield nuclear weapons and breeder reactors.)
    Well, apparently there are two mine locations that hold the potential of ~600 years worth of *worldwide* consumption:
    enochthered.wordpress.com/category/thorium/
    soker: “Put the excess electricity to work powering desalination & water purification plants. The world needs pure water more than it needs petroleum.”
    Good point soker, finally! I’d add that the sea salt “waste” can also demand a high premium as table salt, particularly if deemed “organic,” “kosher,” and containing all the right “trace minerals”…
    addendum – Perhaps this is what they’re referring to, as far as the destruction of (ORNL) U-233 used in LFTR:
    thenorthcoast.blogspot.com/2010/01/save-uranium-233.html
    “But the DOE is determined to destroy this precious resource (and we have about 1000 kg of U-233) by mixing it with U-238 and making it worthless for future use. What’s worse, they’re spending hundreds of millions of dollars to make this precious resource into waste!”
    I’m suspecting it is a hell of a lot larger stockpile than 1-2 tons, that Hanford produced (prolly 2-3 orders of magnitude higher)…
    [2nd submission – too many links I s’pose?]

  336. Laura Louzader March 14, 2012 at 5:08 pm #

    You have it just right on burning wood- that it is not a renewable resource given the rate at which we’d burn it if most of the population tried to depend on it for heat.
    Both of your comments are absolutely on target.
    As for the “danger” of the thorium fuel cycle and of nuclear in general, I can’t help but be struck by the fact that people bring up Three Mile Island (killed no one), Chernobyl (31) and Fukushima (1 worker, of a heart attack)… but nobody talks about the worst industrial accident of all time, the Union Carbide chemical leak in Bhopal, that killed 3,700 people immediately and another 3,000 within the next few weeks, leaving over 550,000 injured.
    There is no industrial process that can be made totally risk-free. Dangerous materials are just part of the deal. We have lost dozens of people and an entire San Fran neighborhood to gas explosions. Never mind car accidents.
    However, if we compare the death toll from all of the above to that which will surely result from rapid de-industrialization due to lack of food, clean water, vaccines, heat, sanitary facilities, emergency medical care, advanced medical care for catastrophic illness and injury, and the loss of many of our common comforts, the combined death toll of every industrial process or product of the past 200 years is going to look trivial by comparison. Figure about 85% of the population.
    We will be nostalgic for the days when an event like event like Fukushima was the disaster de jour.
    We can’t afford to NOT take the risks associated with nuclear, as even our coal production approaches its global peaking.

  337. k-dog March 14, 2012 at 6:06 pm #

    There are places where trees grow like weeds and I live in one of them. I’m in the wood for fuel crowd but it should be limited in scale and done with intelligence. Never said it was going to solve all problems.
    Concerning energy storage. The nickel iron or Edison battery can last more than twenty years and is super tolerant of abuse. It is not very efficient but good enough for the application. There is only one place in the world where the batteries are still made and that plant may be closed by now. I read a few years ago that China had bought the last remaining factory from Germany and shipped it home.
    To stabilize wind and solar power these batteries would be ideal.
    While the American auto industry and our government waits for battery technology to ‘catch up’ its good to recall that this battery was invented in 1901.
    Best for stationary applications this battery has been used in cars.
    1909 Baker Electric

  338. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 6:10 pm #

    Good Post, Also the commercial forests are GMO trees.

  339. k-dog March 14, 2012 at 6:39 pm #

    Yes,
    “The tree was not a problem, but with the first cut, it becomes one. Once started, he is compelled to finish”
    Great insight into the human condition I agree, a literary trail which merits a sojourn but from a practical matter where I live trees can be problems. If you don’t keep them clear of your roof you can have issues with homeowners insurance. They can fall over and kill people in their beds, diseased ones need to be taken out. When trees grow four feet a year they can be problems.
    I looked it up and the Douglas Fir is said to grow two feet a year. I’ve got one that’s doing at least four and is giving my three foot thick a bit over twenty year old Coast Redwood a run.

  340. Vlad Krandz March 14, 2012 at 7:00 pm #

    There has been found a robust relationship bewtween brain size and IQ and brain size and head size. Theoretically what you say is true: our hand helds are better than room size computer of yester year. But Mother Nature may not that be efficient and she seems to require actual room to work in.
    The White Brain is both larger and more convoluted than the Black. And these ancient Supermen were easily as far ahead of us as we are to Blacks – if not more so.
    These Egyptian men were either White or Caucasian. But Boskop Man of Africa had the huge brain too – and he was not Caucasian at all, but somehow related to the modern Bushmen. So this mutation can occur to any race.
    The Science Fiction man of the future has already lived and died off. We are his stunted descendants. Hopefully he will come again somdeday, “when the Stars are right”.

  341. progress2conserve March 14, 2012 at 7:06 pm #

    “You have it just right on burning wood- that it is not a renewable resource…” “LL, to BJ-
    Laura, you and Bustin are parsing the definition of “renewable,” to far beyond reasonable limits.
    So let’s take a look at the definition:
    “Renewable Resource –
    any naturally occurring, theoretically inexhaustible source of energy, as biomass, solar, wind, tidal, wave, and hydroelectric power, that is not derived from fossil or nuclear fuel.”
    Wood is a form of biomass. It is renewable. That should end the parsing of the definition, in an ideal world as represented by CFN. hah!
    I’ve been involved in the management of forests for timber and pulp since I was five years old and could follow my granddad around in the late 1950’s – and I’ve been doing forest management ever since. I can practically guarantee you that I know more about “wood as a renewable resource” than you and Bustin put together.
    With that said, I will attempt to put this matter to rest by saying that I agree with you and BJ when you add the words:
    – wood… “is not a renewable resource given the rate at which we’d burn it if most of the population tried to depend on it for heat.”
    That’s true enough, LL and BJ. Which brings us back to – TOO many people on Earth as the source of all our problems. Which brings us to the inexplicably EVIL way that TPTB in control of US immigration policy continue to PACK ‘EM IN – beyond all logical analysis of the American landmass to support human life post-peak-oil.
    I made it ’till Wednesday.
    https://www.numbersusa.com/content/
    ALL of CFN should be proud of me for this.
    Even you, a.!

  342. progress2conserve March 14, 2012 at 7:17 pm #

    “Good Post, Also the commercial forests are GMO trees.” -as-
    Sorry, antiS – we need to parse more definitions.
    I have been researching this area of interest, right NOW, and my own money is on the line, so I’m pretty sure I’ve got it right.
    I can buy some version of these things
    http://www.arborgen.us/index.php/supertree-seedlings
    They are supposed to grow out to timber in 15 years instead of 29 years. They can be planted at lower densities and require fewer “pulp wood cuts” for thinning. They cost at least 5X conventional pine trees.
    But AntiS, these things are NOT Genetically Modified Organisms. GMO’s.
    Which is to say that they have not been modified by any processes of “genetic engineering.”
    They have just been “selectively bred,” using the same non-GMO processes that have produced mini-poodle dogs and St. Bernard dogs.

  343. progress2conserve March 14, 2012 at 7:33 pm #

    “I admit I’m conflicted, and with the true instinct of the predator you zone right in on that and attack – ignoring my broad minded attempts to reconcile the differing paradigms:”
    -vlad-
    Thanks, Vlad. I do have predatory instincts, from time to time.
    Beyond that, I hone in on your areas of logical weakness in an effort to teach – you or anyone else.
    That’s where real personal growth occurs.
    And that’s where Mika and Bill were finding themselves unable to grow – over the past few weeks.

  344. k-dog March 14, 2012 at 8:06 pm #

    The right to breed plants and animals for useful purposes the old fashioned way should be in the constitution as a right. We used to have a large department in every land grant university in the country dedicated to the ancient tried and true process of selective breeding. The activity provided work for many people and could again. Growing trees for lumber need seedlings that will grow straight and true. Seedlings which would wind up as fodder in a commercial scale EPA approved power plant may have different requirements. The whole GMO crop thing has always mystified me. We had universities which gave us the plants and animals we needed just fine and gave work to the many and not the few.

  345. k-dog March 14, 2012 at 8:15 pm #

    Hey P. I’ve been to the the ArborGen site. I like what I see. Done the old fasioned way, the best way.

  346. k-dog March 14, 2012 at 8:16 pm #

    fashioned

  347. progress2conserve March 14, 2012 at 8:42 pm #

    Hey, K –
    I concur that Arborgen looks OK, and I certainly concur that standard “old-fashioned” plant propagation and breeding techniques are the best.
    I did probe deeper into the Arborgen website just now and find this page
    http://www.arborgen.us/index.php/technology/biotechnology
    They appear to be “playing around?” with genetic engineering – or maybe it’s just Arborgen Public Relations, so far.
    ==========================
    I don’t think any forest land manager with any sense at all would buy GMO trees, at this stage of the game. Hell, man – I won’t even buy the non-GMO “supertrees.”
    I’ve seen too much marketing, in my days.
    And when your time span to success is 15+ years
    And you’re already 55 –
    There’s no margin for error.
    ===========================
    On a practical note –
    we have, literally, millions of acres of planted loblolly pine trees in the Southeast. I’ve planted my share of the things.
    Some of these plantations are beginning to exhibit the early stages of failure. The jury’s out as to why. It could be too much monoculture and too many Southern Pine Beetles. It could be drought induced by “climate change.”
    Regardless of the reasons – many landowners are going back to the tried-and-true, but slower-growing, and definitely-ecosystem-adapted, Longleaf Pine. Definitely non-GMO.
    That’s the direction I’m leaning.

  348. rippedthunder March 14, 2012 at 9:15 pm #

    Howdy doo, WSP. I had ‘sparagaus fer s few years.It never produced thst well. Possibly the soil. Up the CT. valley in Hadley is the best asparagus grown in the world. They are famous for it.http://www.yankeemagazine.com/issues/2007-05/food/asparagus

  349. rippedthunder March 14, 2012 at 9:26 pm #

    The King of Vegtables, even though it is just a sprought.How is it that you eat this stuff and your pee stinks within ten minutes? Something here is strong. I found a patch down a back road that still produces. I’m gonna go check it soon. A coupla weeks and thd shoots should be up.

  350. James Hansen March 14, 2012 at 9:37 pm #

    I do not know where you get your fatality statistics concerning nuclear disasters but they are ludicrously low. It is well documented that the Russian military suffered thousands of deaths cleaning up Chernobyl. The numbers of the stillborn, terminally deformed and the multitudes of cancers resulting from Chernobyl is immense. The estimate of deaths is about one million in many of the articles I read. The genetic damage is on going and increasing,you can look up some disturbing pictures if you care to.
    They tested three thousand children in Japan and one thousand had tumors on their thyroid. But since Tokyo has ten to twenty five times the radiation levels as the Chernobyl evacuation zones, the casualties will be in the millions if they do not evacuate.
    It might take two or three years for the news blackout to fail and the true dimensions of Fukushima to come out, unless the 3 sixty five ton molten blobs come in contact with enough water hundreds of feet down in the ground. That will be the end for reality as we know it.

  351. scott March 14, 2012 at 9:48 pm #

    I read one of Jim’s posts to my mom about 5 years ago and she said, “he’s way too smart to be tilting up windmills, he needs to get a place in the country and retire.”

  352. scott March 14, 2012 at 9:50 pm #

    I bet that pisses him off real good!

  353. charliefoxtrot March 14, 2012 at 9:53 pm #

    stuck to the side of a table or something within reach of your usual spot- when you find another tick, and you will, just stick em to the tape…voila, captive audience…i ll tell you what, though, we had a dozen chickens last year, and i doubt i got a dozen ticks all summer…previously it was more than a dozen per day…goldang weasels…not looking forward to this year, what with no winter and two chickens left…

  354. messianicdruid March 14, 2012 at 10:01 pm #

    http://worldnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/14/10684063-in-highly-unusual-move-marines-asked-to-disarm-before-leon-panetta-speech?
    “In a highly unusual move, around 200 U.S. Marines were asked to leave their weapons outside the tent where U.S. Defense Secretary Leon Panetta was set to speak during his trip to Afghanistan on Wednesday.
    Although the military said the order was not given in response to Sunday’s shooting of 16 Afghan civilians allegedly by an American soldier, it possibly underlined how high tensions were running after the incident.
    “You’ve got one of the most important people in the world in the room,” Major General Mark Gurganus told reporters at Camp Leatherneck, dismissing concerns related to the shooting. “This is not a big deal.”
    He said he had given the order because the two dozen Afghan soldiers also there were unarmed and he did not want to treat them differently.

    According to reporters at Camp Leatherneck, the Marines were waiting to hear Panetta’s speech when they were abruptly told by their commander to get up, leave their weapons, including M16 and M-4 automatic rifles and 9 mm pistols, outside and return unarmed.
    “All I know is I was told to get the weapons out,” Sergeant Major Brandon Hall told The New York Times. Asked why, he replied, “Somebody got itchy, that’s all I’ve got to say. Somebody got itchy; we just adjust.”
    Itchy is as itchy does.

  355. DeeJones March 14, 2012 at 10:13 pm #

    Aw, someone mentioned asparagus above for $.99
    The same would cost $8.00 here in CR.
    There are some things I do miss, but will get used to it.
    So, Jim, thinking about a still? Might come in handy in the future. Or just make some home brew beer.
    OK, until you get it down, you will have some exploding bottles in the cellar or garage, but hey, gotta break some eggs for an omelet, eh?
    Good luck, Dee

  356. Buck Stud March 14, 2012 at 11:35 pm #

    The below “Eyesore Of The Month” might be one of the most depressing things I’ve ever read or witnessed here on CFN – and that’s saying something. I also see that JHK is now terming certain architects as “Staritects”…speaking of the spectacle.
    http://www.kunstler.com/eyesore_201007.html

  357. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 11:36 pm #

    Thanks, I read long ago that in USA after Chernobyl
    THOUSANDS DIED!!!
    More old folks dying, more Leukemia, etc.
    What do you know on this?
    Also Japan, due to abortion and low fertility
    is dying anyway. I once read a statistician plotted what year [350? years from now] that the last Japanese child would be born.
    Guess he was off. Fuk-ushima maybe cuts that 350 years in half!!!!!

  358. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 11:38 pm #

    Thanks. What about Bamboo [a grass]. Its super fast growing, yes?
    Someone here posted once about GMO Eucalyptus in
    Arkansas ‘messing things up’. I dont know much about.

  359. anti soak March 14, 2012 at 11:42 pm #

    $$$$, are you making or losing?
    Just wondering.
    Tripp, I think is losing. Maybe not [Macon and now
    where he planted and worked]. Never plant trees on someone elses land!

  360. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 12:25 am #

    I have some family like that, also. All dead now of old age. They were some tough old birds, and I think of that everytime I get discouraged. My grandmother (whom I loved dearly) was Anglo-Irish and credited her success in raising her nine children, none of whom died young, to her giving them potatoes as snacks every day. No conception of Vitamin C back then, but she somehow knew what to do. Don’t know what her kids thought of getting a raw potato instead of a cookie, but it worked. She was rather famous in their pioneer area for not losing any children because so many parents did lose some or all of their progeny. Not from abortion, but from starvation, disease, malnutrition and the associated diseases and work accidents. She also made crocks and crocks of sauerkraut which has multiple vitamins. Wish she were still here so I could ask her what to do. She also was a good shot, drove a car and supervised a two acre garden which seemed to be sufficient to feed eleven people along with the odd relative down on his luck. I have much more respect for her than today’s whiny liberal woman who hates men, the church and unborn children.

  361. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 12:33 am #

    Anyone ever heard of Lake Techa? It’s worth a gander, if just to see the mutant humans that were created there. Back in the mid 90’s, I always thought it was the result of a Russian attempt at creating a lake within the same-named river using a nuke, with future damn projects to create a reservoir. Yes, I did assume they were that stupid. Apparently, over the past ~15 years or so, most of the truth has leaked (Mayak plutonium production site)…
    http://phys4.harvard.edu/~wilson/publications/pp747/techa_cor.htm
    And let’s be honest about the GMO crop mutation shit. If they’ve planted a GMO variant over the past 3-4 years, odds are it has crossbred with the “clean” variants. There are interesting studies showing how North American/North Mexican GMO corn cross-contaminated South American native species, in just under 5 years… So, if all foodcrops have GMO variants that have been around for at least 5 years (wheat/rice/corn/potato/etc), be sure that the “pure” non-GMO crops have been tainted. Same goes for trees, flowers, *mammals*, etc (LOL)!!!

  362. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 12:36 am #

    Or watch “Life AFter People”, one of the more depressing TV series I’ve ever come across. I will miss the days of Happy Motoring which was so much fun for our family. We went to Colorado every year for a month in summer. After the typical Oklahoma summer, you needed to get away to some coolness before it dried out your soul. We’ve been all over the U.S. and think it’s been beneficial for our children, plus fascinating for my husband and me.
    Somehow, I doubt that the Kerrys and Obamas of our world will stay home and eat out less. Mega Butt can’t bear to go more than six weeks without requiring an expensive vacation on our tab, and her tastes are prodigious. Do the Obamas pay taxes on the benefits they grift from the tired taxpayer? I don’t understand the willingness to stroke the powermongers while they step all over us. I don’t appreciate it at all. We should give up everything while they do the Henry VIII sthick.
    Also, Obama’s blatant attempt to rile up the Lib women may have backfired among those of us who are sane. His standing with women is falling. Most of us who have carried children and given birth are in no hurry to abort a child, and none of us appreciate having to pay for what we consider to be a sin by other women. He’s running up against hormones and the usual girl child desire to marry and have children. You can’t make a carnal circus in fifty years, which is how long this has been going on. Hormones are hormones.

  363. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 12:46 am #

    Thanks, Vlad, for defending the church. I’ve worked at our Catholic hospital for years, and also volunteer. It would be short sighted and cruel to shut down such a compassionate resource.
    By the way, as I stated earlier, Obama is losing many women who don’t want abortion, don’t want to pay for others’ abortions and also hate Obama Care, as do I. Think he was amazed to find that so many women don’t support him in his more lunatic efforts to change the nature of women.
    Also, don’t worry. There are many of us out here who are normal. After seeing Pelosi, Clinton and the other shrews of the left, I can see why you’re discouraged. We are, too. However, most young girls, including teens, still want a husband and baby(ies) which is an atavistic drive. Even Obama can’t change nature in this amount of time. He’s fighting centuries and centuries of hormones, and the hormones will win.
    BTW, we may not be normal by liberal standards, but I don’t care. Their standards are so low they would have to be retreived by post hole diggers, and a culture based on death will always fail.

  364. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 12:56 am #

    Yes, a novel written by W. R. Flynn, full title is “Shut Down, A Story of Economic Collapse and Hope.” Fair to poorly written, but a gripping premise which I can see happening. It’s littered with tall, beautiful kick-ass chicks who can shoot and there is an awful lot of luck, but some of his background material is worth pursuing.
    Have you read “One Second After” by William Forstner? My second favorite book after “Earth Abides”, copies of which I have sent to all of my children and friends who still have their heads out of the sand. Do you have any recommendations for me?
    I have “The Stand” by Steven King, as well, but it’s been years since I read it. Since gardening time is approaching, I’ll re-read it in winter.
    You might also give “The Unit” a try. Author unknown since I lent it to a friend and can’t remember the author’s name. I HATED the heroine and was glad when she died. Other than that, it has a lot to interest the reader.

  365. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 1:08 am #

    If you’ll note in my original post, I already spread Nitrogen over all my wood chips and the compost. I’m a farmer’s daughter and have helped farm, or done it all myself. Everywhere else, it’s worked fine, but Ohio is such a challenge.
    However, I appreciate a polite and helpful post without sarcasm, rare on this site. We have a septic system since we live outside of the Village and imagine I could finagle something, although probably not to the satisfaction of the Ohio EPA.
    We’ve hauled rocks and pebbles out of our apx two acre garden area and manually transferred the dirt from “Goose Poop Pond”, the wetlands, to the gardens. Surprisingly, it also tests “dead” in nutrients and I’m wondering what’s going on. We have so many birds coming and going that it should be a treasure store (or a landmine, depending on bird flu.) Horse manure gave us the biggest crop of Velvet Leaf I’ve ever seen, so we are relying on chicken manure. Even it it’s “hot” it ought to help somewhat.

  366. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 1:11 am #

    You also can’t fight genius. Someone has to be the prophet, and obviously Vlad has run into the old truism that a prophet will not be honored in his own country.

  367. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 1:34 am #

    Who are you and what the hell did I ever do to you? My mother always told me not to argue with the deranged and to remain a lady which is harder to do than she thought.
    Yes, I’m sure my brain is wired correctly, but I have serious reservations about yours. Any reason for your vicious attack on a total stranger??? Can’t imagine what I said to upset you, but am sure I’ll say it again, so for your own peace of mind and mental health, please don’t read anything I post and I’ll be more than happy to reciprocate.
    Here’s to remaining strangers….

  368. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 2:13 am #

    Anyone who replies to Vlad, or “someone” who replies to Vlad, over and over? Ahahaha!!! JuletteOfOhio is a Vlad sock-puppet.
    Sounds about right, they both got the same racist shit going on.
    Sounds about right, they’re both about totally clueless, yet spam poasts liek they’re Hitler’s first progeny.
    Sounds about right – analysis of their grammar/spelling shows the same continuity.
    And here Asoka is thinking, “WHUT?!?”
    The *circle of sock puppets*… You have been *BUSTED*.

  369. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 2:21 am #

    “DO
    NOT
    FEED
    THE
    GUM’MINT
    TROLLS!”
    Im
    Poss
    IBLE!!!
    They crawl outta da woodworks, at *NIGHT*… AHAHAHA!!! At least you and me, we’re the *SAME*!!! (Hehehe, “FALLING DOWN”)
    We got our *girl*, Eliza… (If’n I didn’t know any better, you seem to be ranting my agenda for the past couple weeks!!!) Don’t be *yet* another soker puppet. plz?!…

  370. Pucker March 15, 2012 at 3:32 am #

    Can any of you CFNers out there confirm the rumor that “ant farming” is making a big comeback?

  371. Pucker March 15, 2012 at 3:36 am #

    Further to the issue of whether society has generally gone off the deep end, did you know that talking to oneself is not only “normal”, it’s also actually good for you? (Please see the links below.) I understand that the ancient Greek philospher Socrates was often seen talking to himself in public.
    This little bit of research actually got me thinking about this issue. I mean, if everyone has an internal dialogue, then why isn’t everyone
    talking to themselves?
    My guess is that everyone IS talking to themselves, but that they’re just repressing it in order to conform. It is the person who is
    talking to himself/herself that is “normal” and the repressed conformists who are not normal.
    http://healthmad.com/mental-health/talking-to-yourself-is-it-normal/
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1314434/Is-talking-sign-madness-No-good-say-scientists.html

  372. Vlad Krandz March 15, 2012 at 4:05 am #

    Ah, my first follower. You must be very strange too! Some have said that the Mid West produces the strangest people of all – hidden underneath their bland smiling exteriors. Indiana is supposed to be the worst/best. Hoosiers – the ultimate Grand Falloon.
    One Second After – is that the one about the EMP strike and its effect on a family in North Carolina? That was excellent if the one. A real great oldie: “Lucifer’s Hammer” by Jerry Pournelle. A comet strikes the Earth and ends Civilization focusing in on a group of inter-related people in California. I think you’d like it.
    Do you subscribe to The Remnant – the Traditional Catholic Newspaper? They do great work and know alot about the Conspiracy. They’re great teachers since I’m too young to remember Real Catholicism -my parish fell early. The head Priest was very proud of his liberalism and the text books were pure pablum. I’m reading about The Camino – the Pilgramage to the Church of Saint James the Moor Killer in Spain. Saw a nice movie about it a few months back – with Martin Sheen. Not much Catholicism per se, but the Catholic Context provides the vehicle for an emotional awakening to the Mystery of Life. Alot of pious Catholics skip this psychological stage and never really grow in their Faith because of it.

  373. Vlad Krandz March 15, 2012 at 4:06 am #

    You are just Ozone after a few drinks.

  374. old69 March 15, 2012 at 4:08 am #

    From:
    http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=178385
    [quote=”fuse”] But I will have always been a part of the great procession. That is an absolute. And I can play my part in the grand procession however I see fit. What will I make of it! No deception or delusion necessary, but pure excitement at the possibility of creation. [/quote]
    No one or nothing is Keeping Score, there is no Eternal and Objective Memory “Remembering” your events and your subjectivity, nay, memory degrades and disappears also, so it is as if you never were, and in fact you or me or anything or anyone never was, never is and never will be, even history is false, even history doesn’t remember itself, even after the fact it is false, it “Never Happened”, it is unknown and doesn’t exist…(or will it happen over and over again forever and become ever more real forever ? a nightmare ?)…
    From:
    http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=177834
    “But even more important, determinism of this universe is really not operating at all: no matter how many combinations you express, it will never really cover all of possible reality, every moment of existence of Mass Energy is a wild guess, the next is truly totally indeterminate, not related in any way with the previous, the laws of physics as the pattern decoding our mind executes is always an illusion, a joke upon itself, the initial conditions of each particle is infinitely precise, so nothing can contain infinity, nay, nothing can contain all the possibilities of reality, not even after the fact is it established, not even the laws of physics know, not even if you know it do you know it, not even if it is history do you know it and is it real, history is a lie, not even god knows it, nothing knows anything, each new path is a one time quirk, a unique new universe and big bang, never to be seen again, never could have been predicted, so unique and one time that it becomes vanishingly small in the combinational space, totally unrelated to anything, etc.”
    and
    “The discrepancies: the three body problem has no analytical solution (no precise solution in mathematical terms), the differential equations describing mathematical physics have very rarely precise, closed form analytical solutions, initial conditions must be imposed but are always iffy, random, not sure and not precise, non linearities abound, chaotic systems discovered, the butterfly effect ? and mostly look around you, can you give me the equation and precise solution that determined a given design of a given mountain ? can you precisely predict the exact shape of the next waveform of an ocean wave ? can you tell me exactly where the next raindrop will fall ? (but then again nature operates by simply yes and no and some intermediate state, it doesn’t need precision, it doesn’t care about precision, nature is very approximate, likes to make rough approximations like it will rain today or it will not, it doesn’t even know or have within itself the precise capability to know, care or even imagine where the exact next raindrop will fall, it knows it only after the fact, nay, not even after the fact, not even history is true, nay, it doesn’t and will never know, nothing will ever know, not even knowing itself knows…). These are all the walls of the reference system science is boxed up in, its perfect mathematical viewpoint breaks down as soon as you exit its reference system: in that case only the interaction and measurement and observation gives you some information, but information that rarely can be built upon to create a prediction as in : Thought is the Sickness, Measurements and Observations are the Cure.”

  375. old69 March 15, 2012 at 4:08 am #

    and
    http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?style=1&f=3&t=175621
    “Like in the Total Metaphysical Insecurity that states that the universe or physics is or could have been or could be or will be or has been anything at all, even as bad as possible since it is an external fluke, as is there could be a hell without a god, and an ever worse hell for no reason at all, the next state that the system of Mass Energy of people and machines and manipulations as this thin fluid of Matter on the surface of the earth transitions to could be anything at all, even infinitely different from what we see now, and even all in a jiffy, for no reason at all, even god wouldn’t know or couldn’t predict the reason or the next state, even the laws of physics couldn’t predict the next state, even after the fact, even the history is not determined, nay, never determined, is a lie, never happened, or always happened, total chaos, confusion, unknown, go on man, go on forever, break it all, kill everything. I prefer nothing, nothing is my friend, nothing is always better than anything, even better than itself as nothing is something, but I want a less nothing, so another infinite recursion (or regression), there I go again…”
    Happiness is an Assignment: just assign yourself as happy…

  376. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 4:13 am #

    You are solely douche-bag. Carry on, *TALKER*!!!
    Give us a reason to take your douche-baggery to the *NEXT* level!!!

  377. Bustin J March 15, 2012 at 4:13 am #

    Cute, Vlad. Very cute.

  378. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 4:15 am #

    Seriously? s’if I aint been *CONNED*…

  379. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 4:16 am #

    Xmas is merely spread *EAGLE*… Zoinks!!!

  380. old69 March 15, 2012 at 4:16 am #

    Also from:
    http://instantsingularity1.blogspot.com
    and
    http://instantsingularity3.blogspot.com
    THE APE HAS TALKED AGAIN

  381. old69 March 15, 2012 at 4:18 am #

    Not even Knowing “Knows Itself”…

  382. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 4:19 am #

    You are a fucking sock puppet *GALORE*. You asshole racist, I wish I could face you in a duel…
    I seriously wish I could face you in a duel… You sh!t head a$$hole demon.
    Come forth to me, let’s duel…

  383. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 4:20 am #

    You fucking cry-babby pansy – no duel – I figured as *MUCH* – DOUCHE!!!

  384. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 4:22 am #

    So you’re not willing to go head to head – so *QUIT BEING A FUCKING SPAMMER*. PLZ?

  385. Bustin J March 15, 2012 at 4:23 am #

    PoC said “”Renewable Resource –
    any naturally occurring, theoretically inexhaustible source of energy, as biomass, solar, wind, tidal, wave, and hydroelectric power, that is not derived from fossil or nuclear fuel.””
    Pick one, PoC. Inexhuastible or naturally occuring. Because the 2nd law still holds. Nothing is inexhaustible. So it is a matter of degree. I think its possible to burn wood for a long time, even exclusively. But not forever, and the way there would be a lot of forest management jobs that, from space, might resemble turning N. America into a tree farm.
    Other versions of the ‘burning biomass’ theme include corn ethanol, which looks like turning the midwest into a cornfield.

  386. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 4:24 am #

    this cries gutless wanker/crybaby

  387. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 4:25 am #

    Oh yeah, that poc crybaby was morning some sh!t about CO2…
    FUCKING DOUCHE.

  388. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 4:27 am #

    I prefer to burn my *LOGS*… that way, they instantly *DISAPPEAR*.
    Ass opposed to letting my logs compost for 205 years, and big chunks left *BEHIND* – ahahaha!!!
    It was *NICE*!!!

  389. IxNoMor March 15, 2012 at 4:28 am #

    sorry typo!!! (MY BAD)

  390. dzsz998611 March 15, 2012 at 4:34 am #

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  391. Pucker March 15, 2012 at 4:44 am #

    I recall from the educational video on Orlov’s website several weeks ago that it’s estimated that 10,000 nuclear reactors would have to be built to replace the equivalent energy value of current oil consumption.
    So, with regard to the frequently-raised Thorium-reactor-solution, even assuming that the technical obstacles could be solved in the short-term making Thorium reactors possible, is it realistic to expect that the financing and organization would be available to scale up Thorium energy within a short period of time?
    If not, shouldn’t we stop waving the Thorium weenie in public?

  392. Pucker March 15, 2012 at 4:47 am #

    Today, March 15th is the “Ides of March”, the date when a cabal of Roman senators stabbed Caesar to death on the floor of the Roman senate. Since the senators wore white robes it must have been quite a spectacle.

  393. Vlad Krandz March 15, 2012 at 4:58 am #

    How did the Temple get so “charged up”? Do you think Prabhavananda was a Saint?

  394. Pucker March 15, 2012 at 5:38 am #

    Is it legal to import poppy seeds to grow poppies post-collapse? Thanks.

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  396. charliefoxtrot March 15, 2012 at 8:33 am #

    …or ohio…

  397. Casual Observer March 15, 2012 at 10:18 am #

    Fungi! The planet is rich with fungal diversity right beneath our feet just waiting for us to harness it’s power. http://www.fungi.com/front/stamets/index.html

  398. gkmcbylp March 15, 2012 at 10:33 am #

    Work also for two months my stomach is getting quite the walk also walk to see pregnant women most envy I know is very hard for a mother my future mother better

  399. rippedthunder March 15, 2012 at 10:33 am #

    I think in the future auto conversions might be a good trade to get into.
    http://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2010/01/wood-gas-cars.html

  400. tegmark March 15, 2012 at 10:46 am #

    Interpretations ?
    So JHK shows us an old manufacturing city of NY etc. Well he only sees a part, only the part he wants to see in http://www.kunstler.com/Greenwich%20Winter.html, for every force going in a given direction, there is an equal force going in the opposite, sometimes stronger and sometimes weaker (or anyone can assign which is stronger or weaker, etc.), for every dying maufacturing city in the US there is another one being born in the US, or more importantly, there are 10 being born worldwide and such.
    For every interpretation of reality, there is an equally justified and correct and opposing interpretation (and it is anyone’s guess which is the correct one, but the truth is there are no true interpretations, just subjective interpretations fighting to make believe they are general and true: or trying to achieve the largest consensus possible amongst people so as to become the “Correct because Dominant” interpretation of reality and such (when the interpretations are simply not just a command language, a subtle programming language used to program what people think and do and act and behave: case in point, the “Hard Work” myth forces people to work hard and invent hard work even when it is not necessary and force others to do the same by creating ever new tasks and goals and interactions and creates a consensus culture to create a never ending list of tasks and interactions amongst people (and expectations and goals, projects) and interactions amongst groups to enforce and create and justify the “Hard Work” myth, and since all behave and are programmed in such a way, it becomes the norm, the invariant, the interpretation of reality, when it is an arbitrary assignment and programming of people to act and interact in a given way) or when the interpretations are not hiding a personal interest and personal gain of an interpretation against another (as in political debates wanting to impose certain political programs against others but really hiding a personal interest: more welfare because I want to freeload and such or less taxes for my company so I can gain but make believe that I will generate jobs) or justify a personal guilt complex such as society doesn’t generate enough jobs so I can keep on not working, but subtly trying to justify it through imaginary structural reasons when I am just lazy and such).
    So what is the correct interpretation ? there is none, my take on it is the following:
    1) The USA, EU and JAPAN are destined to remain low economic growth economies for many years because all of the past reciprocal conditions, quirk conditions of technology level, cultural atmosphere, psychological atmosphere, lesser globalization from (once) 3rd world countries, etc. are no longer operating, the configuration of forces and combinations that created that growth are no longer operating and present, just like the weather changes day to day, so does it change on larger scales and longer time spans and in endeavors as complex as economy.
    2) It will be increasingly harder to justify paying more for manufacturing in the first world when you can get the same labor for 200 or 300 dollars a month in Indonesia and India, etc. as opposed to 1,000 to 3,000 dollars a month in the USA, EU and JAPAN.
    3) Even the Services and Intellectual, Information Economy jobs being paid more in the first world are not justified much anymore, nay, in these sectors the justification is even less because Information Economy workers are everywhere at any price worldwide thanks to the Internet and technology and such. And especially, in theory, Information Economy workers have a huge amplification of power and effects, a huge economy of scale as information chunks properly configured can even further optimize and eliminate the needs for further jobs (especially in the information economy as we are saturated with information, free information from the Internet and such) but even this interpretation may be completely false or better irrelevant, it doesn’t matter or it could be a justification for being lazy and not working (as in being subject to another will power commanding you ? but that is what everyone seek, only to fight it back, but need the fight anyways ? contradictions abound).
    So, what is the truth ? There is no truth, it is a vain endeavor to search any truth or create any theory: things were, are and will be anything at all according to the collective forces of many millions of will powers assigning things to be in any way at all as Man is the Infinitely Programmable Machine.
    In other words, anything goes, any interpretation, any political position anything at all, no matter how wrong, how absurd how far out, how impossible etc. So we can say that today the USA has never been so rich, that it is a complete Utopia on earth as all 300 million live in a paradise on earth and it is exactly 100 % true. Or you can say the exact opposite and that too, is 100 % true. AMEN.
    We are only the value the reciprocal people we interact with give us in the end (and in a sense), we are only the program the reciprocal environment we find ourselves in forces us to play out, no matter what.
    Check out:
    http://247wallst.com/2012/03/14/american-cities-where-manufacturing-is-booming/3/
    THE APE HAS TALKED ONCE AGAIN

  401. tegmark March 15, 2012 at 10:48 am #

    Correction:
    http://www.kunstler.com/Greenwich%20Winter.html

  402. Dr_Snooz March 15, 2012 at 10:50 am #

    Jim, you need to do some better reading on Greece. We’ve seen this scenario enough times to know what is going on: a sovereign nation takes on too much debt and suffers a financial crisis, whereupon the IMF, World Bank and various Western corporate interests swoop down and extract resource concessions and force the country to “reform” and “open” its economy (ie: break unions, strip environmental protections and suspend all government benefits for the poor and middle class). There is nothing happening in Greece that hasn’t happened over and over again, first in Latin America and South America, then in the Middle East, followed by Asia and now, apparently, in First World Europe. Greece is being brought under the control of the corporatocracy. There won’t be any derivative implosion because the biggest players are all on the same side of this bet. Only suckers are going to lose money on this deal. The banks, as usual, will come out smelling like roses.
    I agree, however, that it is time to build our own homesteads. The coming “new world order” is only going to benefit the 1%, so the rest of us have to learn to do for ourselves. Leave the cities and go back to the land. Learn to raise your own food. Live in small communities of shared values and shared resources.
    May God have mercy on us all.

  403. tegmark March 15, 2012 at 10:54 am #

    Beware of the word ALL:
    “the spectacle proclaims the predominance of appearances and asserts that all human life”
    That has created many philosophical errors, never use all, but “a lot”, or “much” or “many” since you cannot see ALL of anything and be sure…

  404. 8man March 15, 2012 at 11:26 am #

    also check out old:
    http://instantsingularity.blogspot.com/

  405. balkan March 15, 2012 at 12:34 pm #

    “One Second After” was an interesting read for me, topic that is.
    Audio book version had a intro by intellectual giant (pumpkin head) Newt G.
    Theme, setting and play of characters in survival situation was well done. However one think bothered me. Man in charge of the ugly situation (forgot his name) every time that he would propose some nice cooperative action, he would follow it with: “….because…we are Americans?” After reading that fraise for about 758 times one starts to look for the base of such a statement. Well, all it takes to recall after Thanksgiving shopping stampede I could not help but to wander how those people would behave in real life or death situation?
    Most heartless photo that I’ve seen recently is a bunch of Wall Street goons on the balcony, with drinks in their hands, watching W.S. Occupiers below. Smug smiles, one was commenting something to a college shielding her mouth with backhand….aaggggh.
    All political/corporate/financial characters that brought as where we are now are on H-1 Visa?
    My recent real favorite read is “Pillars of the Earth” by Ken Follett. When I was told about the book and that story is taking place in England’s 1200’s, I had my eyebrow raised as a cartoon Pluto, wandering if I long passed the time to be entertained with King-Arthur-like anything.
    Boy that I was wrong! Quick change of medieval wardrobe and settings and it is a timeless story of human condition. No matter what society, ..ism that people live in, we all, as on queue, fill in our assigned roles based on skills and character. For his following book, what a surprise title: “World without End” I did not need any persuasion.
    James introduced a new theme to his writings this week. That brought a new line of posters, not that I am calling myself the one due to my infrequency.
    You build it and they will come:).

  406. Vlad Krandz March 15, 2012 at 1:21 pm #

    Confucius say, “One picture worth a thousand words. Behold! Feminist Kelly Cogswell:
    http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5081/5191464432_c32955553f_z.jpg

  407. Vlad Krandz March 15, 2012 at 1:49 pm #

    Good article by Thomas Sowell about the Obama Administration playing the Race Card in the Schools by pandering to Black Thugs. “The Promise of Equal Outcomes” – even though different groups act differently and get different grades.
    http://www.wnd.com/2012/03/obama-team-protects-black-thugs/

  408. Vlad Krandz March 15, 2012 at 2:24 pm #

    Three paratroopers shot in France, two fatally. Another one was shot earlier this week. No more information is forthcoming yet, but my guess is that the Jihad has just entered a new stage.

  409. Cabra1080 March 15, 2012 at 2:38 pm #

    Reply to Old69: There is a ‘solution’ to the jobs dilemma and it is found in Orwell ‘1984’. To keep the population ‘gainfully employed’ the Party kept a continuous state of war going. It was a ‘limited war’ always being waged either against Eurasia or Eastasia, nobody knew for sure which one but possibly Big Bro.
    The whole purpose of that ‘war’ was to continuously destroy the products of industry so there would be a need to forever keep all able bodies hard at work producing more armaments, battleships, aircraft, ammo, etc and continuously rebuilding what was bombed. Population was also kept in check by this manner. Not what I would recommend of course…

  410. Buck Stud March 15, 2012 at 3:01 pm #

    Great point, Tegmark; and I’m sure Kuspit would agree as well.

  411. Buck Stud March 15, 2012 at 3:09 pm #

    Of course you can take a leak anywhere, if you’re willing to risk the consequences such as an evil feminist film the dirty deed and pass it on to law enforcement.
    I admit I exaggerated; the laws should be in place to detour creeps from soiling the family picnic at a neighborhood park. And yet the drunk young man out on the town who takes a leak behind an alley dumpster risks a permanent mar on his record. Imagine the young prospective male elementary school teacher trying to explain a urinating in public ticket to a Gloria Steinem like administrator.He might as well go work at Burger King.

  412. Bustin J March 15, 2012 at 3:49 pm #

    Pucks said “I recall from the educational video on Orlov’s website several weeks ago that it’s estimated that 10,000 nuclear reactors would have to be built to replace the equivalent energy value of current oil consumption.”
    Orlov is entertaining. But he is also an opportunist. Americans are easily impressed by foreigners and their “wisdom”. I don’t think his perspective is accurate. His forecasting is even worse. I appreciate his approach. I like the image of him as the Gorton’s fisherman, bobbing on the seas off the coast of Newfoundland, assembling his powerpoints and reliving the collapse of the USSR and then using that as a general template for all situations.
    “…assuming that the technical obstacles could be solved in the short-term making Thorium reactors possible, is it realistic to expect that the financing and organization would be available to scale up Thorium energy within a short period of time?”
    Well, no. Because Obama and China went to the Climate summit and said, effectively, we’re not changing course. Realistic, feasible, possible, plausible, its all these.
    We are in the thrall of our masters. Avoiding the climate change bullet takes a higher order of imagination and foresight, modesty and precaution, not to mention up-front costs.
    We’ll spend a trillion dollars this year in America on advertising and marketing alone.
    “If not, shouldn’t we stop waving the Thorium weenie in public?”
    Explain this sentiment.
    The “man in the street” has to push the agenda. Of course, he is not an expert, and doesn’t know who to trust. He also has little or no direct knowledge or appreciation of nature or an appreciation of its fragility. He is politically emasculated.

  413. Bustin J March 15, 2012 at 3:57 pm #

    Enlightenment is what is needed for the man in the street. Looking at the crowds in Egypt, or the middle east, you see the wild-eyed, group-think and mental turpor of illogical, religious instinct.
    The only thing that separates these mobs from America’s mobile infantry of consumers is a shower, a shave, and dental work. We are just as stupid as they are, just as confused, just as powerless.

  414. Bustin J March 15, 2012 at 4:07 pm #

    JUOh said “We’ve hauled rocks and pebbles out of our apx two acre garden area and manually transferred the dirt from “Goose Poop Pond”, the wetlands, to the gardens. Surprisingly, it also tests “dead” in nutrients and I’m wondering what’s going on. ”
    It tests dead, it is dead.
    Many people make the mistake of thinking fresh shit in the ground (yer stinkin’ fish as fertilizer) is going to make the plants push up.
    What happens is it locks up the nutrients in microbial biomass, keeping it from your plants. In addition, other products of that digestion inhibit plant root formation.
    You just fucked your soil by dumping that shit in it.
    Way to go farmer girl.

  415. anti soak March 15, 2012 at 4:16 pm #

    If she had made a diluted ‘tea’ from the muck would that have worked?

  416. messianicdruid March 15, 2012 at 4:17 pm #

    “Only suckers are going to lose money on this deal.”
    http://www.hypertiger.blogspot.com/

  417. anti soak March 15, 2012 at 4:19 pm #

    I disagree. I say USA and its people are better.
    Better treatment of women, children and animals.
    UK now has halal meat, all of it is halal.
    USA Muslims dont kill over a cartoon.

  418. Bustin J March 15, 2012 at 4:33 pm #

    Laiura says “We can’t afford to NOT take the risks associated with nuclear, as even our coal production approaches its global peaking. ”
    Laura, I don’t like your opinion. It doesn’t make me feel good. Second, it implies I might have to make sacrifices.

  419. bossier22 March 15, 2012 at 6:03 pm #

    there are a number of similar novels out lately. some are better than others. here’s my recent list;
    Dark Grid
    77 Days in September
    Half past Midnight
    Holding their Own
    What Came After
    Three Mokes East
    Happy dystopian reading.

  420. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 6:05 pm #

    I like Vlad. What’s wrong with my spelling and grammar? When have I ever posted anything racist? I think you’re just in a shitty mood and have nothing on which to base this attack. If you don’t like them, don’t read them. I’ll avoid you as well.

  421. k-dog March 15, 2012 at 6:31 pm #

    Ripped T – That is some cool shit, I just peeked. I’ll get back to it latter for sure.
    Whew – Quite a while getting the learn on for me so that I can host podcast at k-dog. There is a bunch of information that gets sent to you computer when you download a file but that’s all right now because I have it going on. Such a simple task I thought, and it is if you think 100 lines of code isn’t much.
    But enough of that boredom. The night before last PUCKER’s curiosity caused me to go to CLUBORLOV and I discovered Joseph Tainter. I had not known about him before and it turns out he believes exactly the same things I do. I found a good podcast he made and it can be listened to or downloaded from the doghouse.
    The man knows that our existing regime will do anything to maintain the status-quo just like a housing development that get named after missing displaced animals the Obama presidency founded on a promise of change does everything it can to keep things the way they are as we ride like Thelma and Louise off a cliff.
    He also knows that the other Republicrat is even worse. Whoever that one turns out to be will maintain the status-quo by oppressing the poor. With that one the empire might actually last longer, and the inevitable crash will be worse.
    But any crash is bad, dead is dead and Tainter explains how our country will rapidly balkanize if food or energy supplies are interrupted on the podcast.
    I’m thinking Joseph Tainter should be Secretary of Energy in the k-dog regime.
    Only change can save us.

  422. k-dog March 15, 2012 at 6:36 pm #

    A direct link to the podcast.

  423. k-dog March 15, 2012 at 6:41 pm #

    Maybe VP if he can dance.

  424. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 6:46 pm #

    Not yet, but I hear they’re coming. Being from the Great Plains area, I know the serious damage they do. I used to have “coyote watch” during lambing season and am still afraid of the dark. My two brothers, my father, and I took one night each, in rotation, and sat at the top of the sheep pen listening for coyotes with a rifle over our knees. (Know this is weird for all of you urban types, but yes, that’s how we handled it.) Sheep have to be the most stupid domesticated animal next to chickens, so they were never cooperative when you were trying to keep them from being killed.
    If it gets much warmer, we’re going to get the odd armadillo as well, and they’re much harder on gardens than groundhogs, as well as being totally inedible.
    Don’t know how well coyotes will adjust up here. It’s a much better climate for everything and at least we had the coyote population go up and down. We’d be knee deep in rabbits and coyotes, then a plague or a drought would hit and they’d both go back to manageable levels.

  425. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 6:55 pm #

    Discouraging, how? Honey, it looks more and more like you’re going to be living in that time, irrespective of your desires.
    As stated earlier, we have a passive solar house which is useless because the sun doesn’t shine in Ohio in the winter. (No, we bought it from the original owner/builder. I’m not so stupid that I would have missed the correct angle. We’re not from here and missed a lot of things that a native might have noticed.)
    We have a woodlot and a catalytic stove which produces very little smoke and burns cleanly. It does take quite a lot of effort to harvest our downed timber, but the days of everything you want coming easily are probably coming to an end.
    Technology is often amazing, but you’re still believing that we’re going to engineer our way out of this mess. I don’t believe that, but you may be right, of course.

  426. k-dog March 15, 2012 at 7:02 pm #

    Good Stuff:
    “If the energy required to mine, transport and refine oil is also taken into account, however, then wood gas is at least as efficient as gasoline. And, of course, wood is a renewable fuel. Gasoline is not.”

  427. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 7:23 pm #

    I think so, but be careful to get the correct variety. Ask Jim. Crucial plot points in “The Witch of Hebron” revolve around opium poppies, so I assume he would know. Don’t call your state officials and ask.

  428. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 7:41 pm #

    All of our part of Ohio is converted (drained) swamp which resurrects in a rainy year. Most of it is decent farm land. Ours isn’t, but I’ll find a way to make it work. Except for your last and really snotty remark, I’ve enjoyed your replies.
    I was a farm girl in Oklahoma which is night and day from Ohio. I can make red clay produce, but not gray-black clay, YET. The locals call our place “Blueberry Hill”, which I assumed, in my innocense, meant the ground was acid. It isn’t, so I’m left to think it’s where teenagers found “their thrill”, in other words, a Lover’s Lane. You have to be my age to get it.

  429. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 8:07 pm #

    Hooray for you! I feel the same and remember all the innovations from both Kansas State and Oklahoma State Universities. Don’t know what happened to them or to their goals. K-State used to have the most beautiful pecan groves outside of Chetopa, Kansas, and the last time we visited, the groves had gone to wrack and ruin. All of the K-State signs are gone so either it went to a careless private owner or to some corporation that didn’t find pecans to be a sufficiently huge profit generator.
    Some of the best ranchers have left their private stock to the universities to maintain the breed. We can only hope they buy into this gift and we don’t end up with Herefords with the head of a giraffe. Speaking of Herefords, even though I come from a family who raised Angus, Herefords are the most pleasant of the bovines and a joy to have around.
    Hope this isn’t one too many posts. I log on when I get off work and answer those whose posts I find interesting, beginning with Vlad. Also find myself defending what I say, more than on other sites. What is it with Liberal snarkiness? I was raised to be a gentlewoman (one word, look it up. It basically means “lady”) and it’s often difficult to deal with the “Got’cha” mentality. Even your idol, the Obamanation, has called for more civility. He doesn’t mean it, but it sounds good to him, I guess. The worst was one reply to something I had worked hard to formulate. That reply was “Yur (Liberals can’t spell well) an idiot.” Have you ever grasped the concept of civilized discourse?

  430. Vlad Krandz March 15, 2012 at 8:22 pm #

    Soylent Green? No, Pink Slime. As Gurdjieff said, America will be destroyed by bad food and weird sex – and the diseases which come from these.

  431. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 8:34 pm #

    Re: Growing carrots: You may not care for our method, but it has been successful for us. Like all real farming, it’s a lot of work. We dug a trench, like one you’d dig for asparagus, and filled it with dirt from the bar ditch running beside one of the better fields up here. We asked permission, and got five pick-up loads after a particularly hard soaker. Lots of topsoil ran off and it’s been amazing. We layered the topsoil with sand and compost mixed with chicken manure and can produce lovely carrots and beets, which we can’t do in the main garden. OTOH, you get a lot of interesting weeds and the odd rusted beer can. Still better than what we have. Best wishes and remember that nothing in farming succeeds like dumb luck. We got the dirt just before the landowner sprayed pesticide and herbicide. Even with a long half-life, we had good results.

  432. charliefoxtrot March 15, 2012 at 8:49 pm #

    @juletta- try composting your food scraps (except meat) including any vegetable ends etc, with either horse, cow, or chicken manure- or any mix thereof…start with layers of scraps, manure, and any straw (not hay, which has seeds) leaf or grass clippings you might have…and cover the pile with at least a piece of ply wood, or a garbage can lid, or something…once it starts to cook- starts to break down- chop it and stir it with a spade, then about every week when you add more to it…this does all assume you have just a compost pile on the ground- strategically located near the garden, probably…of course there are various tumblers on the market, and they are quite convenient of course you can spend some cash, so i guess it depends on how serious you are about it; and how much compost you need…remember to keep the pile moist in event of sustained drought- don t let the compost dry out, whatever you do…hope this helps…

  433. progress2conserve March 15, 2012 at 8:56 pm #

    “Pick one, PoC. Inexhuastible or naturally occuring. Because the 2nd law still holds. Nothing is inexhaustible.”
    -bj, continuing to parse words-
    Look, bustin, I just posted a definition. Now you’re starting to argue with dictionary.com, instead of with me. OK.
    And as long as the sun shines, at a suitably appropriate output, some form of life on Planet Earth will be inexhaustable. I choose trees, as my favorite organism. Maybe I was a Druid in a previous life.
    Even your pink fungal slime will be inexhaustable, bustin – when it comes to that.
    Even at LOW figures and with no management, a southern field replenishes itself with pine seedlings/timber at a rate of 2 tons per acre per year. That’s renewability.
    Coal has less than double the energy density (BTU/ton) than does wood. Coal is definitely non-renewable, right?
    Every $240.00 on your coal-fired electric bill represents a ton of coal burned and gone forever.
    ==========================
    This debate of ours is taking on overtones of a recent discussion that asoka. and I were having.
    “Wood represents a renewable resource, given sufficiently long time scales and low enough human population densities.”
    -p2c-
    “For living humans on Earth, there is a limit to the number of people we can love.” -p2c-

  434. charliefoxtrot March 15, 2012 at 8:59 pm #

    …one more thing: you might try mycorrhizae (think that s correct) to get the funguys working in the soil- something about the symbiosis between the roots and mycorrhizae- the fungus breaks the soil down into nutrients for the plant in return for sugar…anyway, it s why people do no-till gardening, so as not to break up the action…oh, and having read your last post since i wrote that one^, i see you at least know compost…still hope this all helps…

  435. progress2conserve March 15, 2012 at 9:02 pm #

    “$$$$, are you making or losing?
    Just wondering.”
    -anti-S-
    I make a little money on pulpwood and timber, antiS. Given enough time and paid-for land, it is almost impossible not to make a little money*, with reasonable luck.
    *Money or other assets. Until the collapse of global ecosystems and the death of all trees in the South – standing timber will have value.
    That’s what I’m going with, anyway –
    For the lack of a better plan.

  436. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 9:12 pm #

    Proud to be so! I don’t think either one of us is strange, although we must appear so to the other commentators. I prefer to be the way we are, and I’m not a mid-westerner….Was born and matured in Kansas/Oklahoma which is an entirely different scenario. We’re certainly not the standard east or west coast liberal which seems to infest this site. I like James Kunstler’s writing so much, but find the comments on here to be far beyond the range of civility. No PC for us, I guess.

  437. k-dog March 15, 2012 at 9:16 pm #

    Could be that pecans are a bad choice for the area. A pecan tree needs 150-250 gallons per day for a fully mature tree. But that makes our point does it not. If a vibrant social institution existed something appropriate and beneficial to the people would be under development there.
    Lifting water out of the Ogallala Aquifer is very energy intensive and the level goes only down. Pecans orchards have been destroyed in the central valley of CA because their water also goes away. The farmers cut them down because they can’t get the water.
    And you are right; corporations exist only for profit and can’t be counted on to be responsible stewards of our future. In their place fine, out of it total disaster. Out of place the influence of corporations causes ignorance dysfunction and pestilence to flourish leading ultimately to the extinction of mankind.

  438. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 9:22 pm #

    Thanks for the suggestions! I’ve about run out of Doomer Porn. I’ve read “Holding Their Own” but none of the others, so will hit up Amazon tonight. Thanks again!
    Does your screen name indicate you’re power-mad, or that you’re from Louisiana?

  439. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 9:35 pm #

    What helped was the charm of the response, for which I thank you. We have a good sized compost pile with lots of banana peels and egg shells and coffee grounds, carrot tops plus chopped straw. It got hot enough that it started to smoke a few times. It sits next to the farm valve, which is fortunate, and I water it like I do my crops. I’m about ready to buy a container since it’s now confined in a chicken-wire circle. The weeds around it are just enormous, so know it’s good stuff.
    Thank you for the post. It’s obvious you know what you’re talking about.

  440. vagturena6 March 15, 2012 at 9:40 pm #

    At some point in the distant past, the might have been popular. But not anymore – the is clear, but beyond that, the last have used illegal drugs. So why do we still put hundreds of in steel cages for pot-related offenses? Well, there are many reasons, but one of them is, of course,
    Some of the groups who want to keep the drug are police unions that want more members to pay more dues. One of the primary sources for cash for more policing activities are Federal grants for penalizing
    Lovell managed the opposition campaign against Prop 19 . He that he was pushing against the initiative because, >
    But Republic Report reviewed lobbying contracts during the Prop 19 fight, and that Lovell’s firm was paid over $ 386,350 from a wide array of police unions, including the , he has constructed an entire predicated on
    The of many officers. For example, (

    The Federal anti-marijuana honeypot might have dried up if Prop 19 had passed. Legalizing would have generated billions in reveal that Lovell worked on a number of issues, from advocacy against Of course,cheap herve leger dress, By

  441. vagturena6 March 15, 2012 at 9:41 pm #

    Do you sleep with music in the background on purpose?

    These are just examples how you could fit into this group. I personally could answer all questions with ; and I’d like to find out, who else enjoys music in such a way from time to time.

    After the br /> Don’t be afraid to use the forum!

    Don’t forget the journals! It’s very hard to keep them uptodate, but you’ll find tons of free music made by our very own members there! Also some literature, helpful links … whatever sounds interesting or personal. And there will be no frickin games or score calculations or whatever (Stop posting that guys,herve leger on sale!)

  442. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 9:57 pm #

    I notice the phrase as well, but think it was a way for him to maintain a hold on normalcy. I guess being patriotic would do that for some people. (His name was John Matherson, BTW) I’ll give the book you mentioned a read and appreciate all suggestions. Thanks!

  443. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 10:05 pm #

    Actually, it’s always been a good area for pecans since it’s in eastern Kansas which gets much more rain than the western side. However, all of Kansas, Oklahoma and Texas have suffered drought equivalent to the 1930s and nothing much will make it through intact.
    Like you, I find it appalling that the Ogalalah is being depleted. It runs from northwest Texas through western Oklahoma and Kansas and ends in extreme southern Nebraska or extreme northern Kansas, depending on who is talking. We’re from the area between the Flint Hills (best cattle country in the US) and the Red Hills. Kansas is really pretty if you get off the interstate. It also is in dire distress as are all the southern plains. Nice to talk to someone who knows about that area.

  444. JulettaofOhio March 15, 2012 at 10:28 pm #

    You really are a sweetheart! I use innoculant for beans and peas which is some type of microphage (not sure of spelling) assistant. It seems to help with yield.
    I’ve tried low-till in everything but the area where I planted corn in a particular year. Ohio has a problem with corn borers overwintering, so I move the corn to a new spot every year and till all of the area where it was planted. This was such a mild winter that who knows what’s lurking just under the surface.
    I appreciate all advice since I certainly don’t know everything. We’ve moved around so much that I know a little about a lot of different states, but not a lot about any particular one, except Kansas.
    Thanks again!

  445. asoka. March 15, 2012 at 10:54 pm #

    Three paratroopers shot in France, two fatally. Another one was shot earlier this week. No more information is forthcoming yet, but my guess is that the Jihad has just entered a new stage.
    When the Jihad was operating out of Afghanistan we bombed Afghanistan heavily and then illegally occupied Afghanistan.
    [sarcasm on]
    Now France is allowing the Jihad to operate in France. Should we bomb France back to the Stone Age and send a hundred thousand troops to occupy France?
    [sarcasm off]
    The Jihad is in 60 countries and there is no military solution because terrorists are criminals who should be subjected to police action, not military action.
    Law enforcement has arrested, tried, and imprisoned hundreds of terrorists in these last few years. The military has tried less than a dozen terrorists. The military has failed.
    The military isn’t even able to maintain security in the green zone in Kabul to prevent terrorist attacks there. The military is a hammer and everything looks like a nail to them, but they only make things worse and endanger our national security.
    The counterinsurgency strategy developed by General Petraeus is a failure. No hearts and minds are being won over in Afghanistan.
    To the contrary the Afghans are furious at us, and with good reason. USA soldiers are ignorant barbarians who assassinate people at wedding parties via drone bombers, torture prisoners, piss on Taliban cadavers, stupidly burn the Qu’ran, and murder civilians at will.
    Afghanistan is being occupied by American barbarians, but the game is up. The Taliban has the position of strength and has called off face to face talks with the USA. They will force us out.
    Karzai (our corrupt puppet) is calling in USA troops from the countryside and considering cancelling any kind of SOFA agreement in response to our barbarous behavior.
    IOW, we should get the hell out of Afghanistan.
    If Obama had any intelligence he would jump at this opportunity and have the troops out by Easter Sunday. But Obama won’t do that… unless we raise a ruckus and force him to withdraw the troops, instead of allowing the throwing of more taxpayer money at a war that is not winnable.

  446. James Hansen March 15, 2012 at 11:25 pm #

    Thank you Mr. Kunstler!

  447. progress2conserve March 15, 2012 at 11:49 pm #

    -ecosystem succession?-
    -concerning ticks, coyotes, deer, pigs, etc.
    It has been my sustained privilege to closely watch a particular patch of eastern Georgia land for over half a century, now.
    The first deer ever killed in this section, was killed by one of my kin by marriage, ’round about 1962. He was bird hunting (that always meant quail, back in that day) when a little button buck had the misfortune to flush out of a thicket in front of him. That deer must have been very close, or very small – because it was killed by two loads of #8 birdshot. It was tasty and tender, in my memory.
    Over the next 25 years, I watched as deer came to completely DOMINATE the ecosystem, around there. Farmers died, no one took over. Farms grew up. Deer took over. At one time, our place held a “renewable” (hi Bustin) population of at least 25 deer. It didn’t last.
    We had a fearsome, nasty infestation of “seed ticks” down there in the early ’80’s. For about two years, if you went in the woods, you came out covered with 10 to 100 of the stupid things. That didn’t last.
    In the early and mid 90’s, coyotes took over. Deer populations crashed. Rabbits and quail became nonexistent. Cats, even wild-ass nearly feral cats, vanished from the barnyards of the neighbors – those who still had barnyards. Coyotes didn’t last forever, either.
    After the coyote population crash came a wild pig population explosion. We had two+ herds of about 30 individuals roaming around. Talk about renewable, BJ. You literally could not shoot, trap, or otherwise kill the sum’bitches fast enough. Whatever you did, there were always more of the damn things – in spring, summer, or fall, anyway.
    The pigs didn’t last forever, either. Now we appear to be in some sort of “balance.” Deer have made a slight comeback. There are a few pigs around, and a couple of coyotes.
    I even saw a covey of quail, two years ago.
    And the coyote scat has plenty of rabbit hair in it. My closest neighbor has cats around her old dairy barn, again, so the mice and rats are back under control.
    Nature is dynamic.
    Nature is renewable.
    You just have to watch over a long enough time scale. And you have to be willing to adapt.

  448. JonathanSS March 16, 2012 at 12:01 am #

    Thanks for your response. No need to get defensive. I was just hoping that there were some posters on this site that could add some of their own personal experiences with active and/or passive designs. Of course, it won’t work for all climates. In OH, most designs cut heating BTU’s by half. To do better than that in your climate, in addition to excellent passive solar, you need state-of-the-art envelope sealing with R60 or better insulation and an active approach with solar collectors and a storage tank. It might not be cost effective for most.
    By the way, I’m living in a mild climate where I don’t have to heat my house unless I want to take the chill out. The coldest it ever gets inside with no burning of NG is 58 degrees. I could improve upon that with better attic and under floor insulation.

  449. anti soak March 16, 2012 at 12:19 am #

    ‘What is it with Liberal snarkiness?
    I was raised to be a lady.’
    Maybe they were raised to be Libs, arrogant.
    Ever hear the term ‘red diaper baby’?

  450. Pucker March 16, 2012 at 12:19 am #

    “Make’n a list…
    Check’n it twice…
    Gonna find out who’s naughty or nice….”
    http://blog.fema.gov/2012/03/announcing-creation-of-fema-corps.html
    Along with our partners at the Corporation for National and Community Service (CNCS), we announced the creation of FEMA Corps, which sets the foundation for a new generation of emergency managers. FEMA Corps leverages a newly-created unit of 1,600 service corps members from AmeriCorps’ National Civilian Community Corps who are solely devoted to FEMA disaster response and recovery.

  451. Pucker March 16, 2012 at 12:25 am #

    “White Man speak with forked-tongue….”
    http://www.ready.gov/indian-country
    “Good preparations today can decrease fear, reduce losses, and speed recovery in a time of disaster or emergency. FEMA, which is part of the federal government, has a nation-to-nation relationship with Alaska Native and tribal governments as reflected in our Tribal Policy. FEMA works with tribal officials to help communities be prepared before an emergency and recover after disaster strikes.
    The goal of Ready Indian Country is to collaborate with tribal governments to build emergency management capability and partnerships to ensure continued survival of Tribal nations and communities. Visit FEMA’s Emergency Management Institute for additional information on training for Tribal Representatives.”

  452. Pucker March 16, 2012 at 1:56 am #

    According to a bloke that I know who served in Afghanistan, “cob” is not only warm in Winter, and cool in Summer, it is also excellent for absorbing bullets.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cob_(material)

  453. truthteller March 16, 2012 at 2:06 am #

    Wow, Laura L. bringing it on like Donkey Kong! 🙂 I have to admit, I agree with just about everything you said, up close and personal. I wouldn’t go so far as to label people as “breeders” in a contemptuous way, though, Laura. Most people are just doing what nature and evolution programmed them to do. It takes some fortitude to resist the genetic pull to procreate, in my opinion. I’ll likely catch hell for this, but I’ve even taken advantage of Roe vs. Wade once in my life, when BC failed me back in the day. I was waaaaay too young at the time, and CONTRARY to popular opinion and some of the bullshit they try to feed women about such things, especially on the far right, I DON’T regret it one bit . . . I was not in a place or a time to be having a kid, and if the kid was here looking this world in the face today, he/she might be inclined to agree 🙂 All that crap about women suffering mental illness and psychosis from having an abortion, is simply that . . . bullshit.
    Thanks for your reasonable and rational points of view, they are sorely needed in this world.

  454. Pucker March 16, 2012 at 2:22 am #

    I’m trying to get my post-collapse fire power requirements sorted out. Having grown up in the Deep South of the U.S., I know quite a bit about firearms. The basics I’ve got down: a high-powered rifle for long range, shotgun for medium range, pistol for close shots. Some assault rifles have short, medium and long range capabilities, etc., etc.
    But the problem is that I’d prefer not to kill other people, even though that I recognize that there a lot of crazy people out there. In any event, are there any CFNers out there who have any experience shooting other people with rock salt? Thanks.

  455. Pucker March 16, 2012 at 2:48 am #

    Post collapse do you think that there will be a demand for such unique skill sets as snake handlers? Thanks.
    http://www.snakehandlingcourses.com.au/