No, the Truth is objective but discovered by subjects, who are of course very different from each other. A camera records what happened. The eye is a camera, but the mind focuses on the things that interest them and that's what they remember.
No, the Truth is objective but discovered by subjects, who are of course very different from each other. A camera records what happened. The eye is a camera, but the mind focuses on the things that interest them and that's what they remember.
You do not either, so why do you disagree with it? On what basis do you disparage Nuremberg? Because war is hell? Because Sherman said so? Because whatever Israel does it right and if they do it, Germans deserve an apology?
Subjectivities or "people" must train themselves to see truth. Give an Abo a microscope and he will hit another Abo over the head with it or use it to grind grain or berries. As with the Eye of Flesh, so with the Eye of Mind, and ditto the Eye of Spirit. What I'm teaching you know is how to use your Eye of Mind. The Three Eyes are the basis of one school of Medieval Philosophy. So just a Catholic thing? No, all the Traditions have their version of this. The Catholic one is simple, clear, and ours, so I used it.
You're deliberately being obtuse, perhaps because you're a postmodernist. Have you ever heard of the empirical method? You know, like real science? Each time an experiment is done, it varies from what is predicted by a mathematical model. Does that make science subjective? No. Instead, an experiment is performed thousands of times, and the resultants are analyzed according to statistics, from which the objective truth is extracted. This is the same process for individuals viewing a situation. All of their subsequent re-creations are put together, from which the objective truth is obtained.
Meanwhile, postmodernism believes that reality is socially constructed, that objective truth is impossible, and that each person's feelings about something are oh so special, oh so 'authentic'. What a load of crap. Does a tree in the forest make a sound, if nobody hears it when it falls? Does a fact exist about something the woke left doesn't like, if nobody states it or writes about it? The wokusts' answer is тАЬNo, it doesn't exist. And anybody who tries to talk about it is banned for creating hate." The end result of this nonsense is narcissism and nihilism, which is destroying western society for anyone with eyes to see. And the only objective metanarrative that can possibly tie together all the millions of differing 'authentic' subjective viewpoints is raw power applied top-down by a tyrannical state.
The only hope for western civilization and objective Truth is to completely purge wokusts and their postmodernist insanity from society, in any and every way possible. To hell with woke leftism, to hell with wokusts. And if the same shoe fits you, then wear it and suffer the consequences.
~ Creatures Of Infinity & The Vanishing Horizon Of Truth ~
I am unsure we can ever know the absolute truth, perhaps because we can affect the/its outcomes, so it constantly shifts, like a receding horizon, forever beyond reach.
It's about the Uncertainty Principle and, perhaps ultimately, infinity. Infinity cannot resolve. There are no initial conditions. It's turtles all the way down as they say.
That's why I think that, if infinity goes into what makes us who and what we are, that makes us very special. It may be that consciousness cannot even happen without it. It may even hint at absolute free will. It makes us so special in fact that it seems kind of tragic that it might be missed, so preoccupied in the day-to-day mundane minutiae that we can be.
"It makes us so special in fact that it seems kind of tragic that it might be missed, so preoccupied in the day-to-day mundane minutae (sic) that we can be." ~ Strange Bedfellow
Zazzy - this is why the Coffee Shop needs to be a priority. Deep discussion in the wee hours, before a crackling fire, in an intimate setting, is where revelations, and sometimes epiphanies are made.
Well in any case, let's see what we can accomplish in 2025 before (mass-produced global supply-chains, etc.) resources and general socioeconomic stability become such that they, too, recede faster than we can catch up.
The problem with cafes and other businesses in the current, teetering economic model is of course that they risk becoming inviable. This is not to necessarily suggest that some can't readaptively function within a different model/context though, such as one more localized and real-community-driven.
---
"My dear, here we must run as fast as we can, just to stay in place. And if you wish to go anywhere you must run twice as fast as that."
"ave you ever heard of the empirical method? You know, like real science? Each time an experiment is done, it varies from what is predicted by a mathematical model. Does that make science subjective? No. Instead, an experiment is performed thousands of times, and the resultants are analyzed according to statistics, from which the objective truth is extracted.
#String theory
#Dark Matter
"The only hope for western civilization and objective Truth is to completely purge wokusts and their postmodernist insanity from society, in any and every way possible. To hell with woke leftism, to hell with wokusts. And if the same shoe fits you, then wear it and suffer the consequences."
Sooo, I am labelled a "Wokust" and should be sanctioned for my heresy. And by what method...boxcar or tumbrel? Your "objective truth extracted"...could that be considered "Settled Science"? You know, like Climate Change and the Holocaust?
Yes, I am deliberately obtuse, or "agnostic", to put it in a less abusive format.
You're being ridiculous. Just as Socrates showed how much an uneducated slave boy knew, I could show you how much you believe in the Truth if I could just get you to answer honestly.
A dog looks for its master. It comes to a triple fork in the road. It sniffs our the first two, nothing. Then it just goes down the third without sniffing. The process of elimination. Elementary reasoning.
If the Abos want to get the straight story in a conflict, they separate the parties involved and torture them. Then they discuss the results to see commonalities. Cops do the same thing sans the torture in most cases.
I want to give you the benefit of the doubt for being as smart as the Abos, but you're fighting me every step of the way.
You deal in absolutes. I keep the absolutes to a minimum, and in my worldview has not been disappointed. To you, Jesus is an absolute, you suggest, but you continue to study fakirs and idolators...blue elephants, et al, seeking...what? Further beliefs to reinforce your believed absolute? Something that should require no further quest?
Maybe you have been degraded by the use of the marijuanas you have suggested I try.
Yes, as Blake said, Eternity is in love with the productions of time. So am I.
The Truth is something to be "realized" not just believed. Philosophy and religion must become one in the life of the seeker.
You live in your abstractions. A Sabertooth is a "Sabertooth". A lathe is not just a metal table, but a "lathe". Etc. They work, thus they have "cash value" as William James said.
If a cat jumps on a hot stove, it will never jump on a stove again? No, because the cat doesn't have that abstraction. It will never jump up "there" (on that stove again). The cat has the abstraction, "dog". They are born afraid of dogs, but will make an exception for dogs they are familiar with in some cases.
Realized not just believed? I prefer "internalized".
Philosophy and religion? What can be more pure truth, a personal truth, than realizing that which you do not know? That you might suspect, or believe is arguable. You are disingenuous to tell someone you KNOW of an event not part of your direct experience? Something you read in a book, or something drilled into you at catechism?
I think, perhaps, that which I believe to some extent is voluminous. That which I KNOW is very little by comparison.
Wm. Blake, I would invite to kiss my big black ass. Blake was a Dissenter, and I would prefer quotes of a more secular viewpoint. They were still burning witches when Blake was in the church.
You KNOW that cats are born afraid of dogs? How do you KNOW that? Are they really born afraid of dogs? Who knows? Maybe. Maybe it is a learned trait. Maybe they compete for the same resources. Maybe Sheer mass has something to do with it. Maybe it is a game.
Yes, much of what we know is relative, partial, through a glass darkly. But before you were claiming it all was. You weren't just agnostic about ultimate reality, you were an atheist about our common everyday reality. In which case, it would be pointless for anyone to ever say anything to anyone since we would have no common ground.
We pulled you in from the brink and now you have backtracked back to some degree of sanity. Thus the utility of the philosophical method is revealed.
No, the Truth is objective but discovered by subjects, who are of course very different from each other. A camera records what happened. The eye is a camera, but the mind focuses on the things that interest them and that's what they remember.
Sooo, the truth is objective but is viewed subjectively? Who will then be the arbiter of truth? With what qualifications?
The Nurenberg trials were filmed. Evidence presented. Truth ordained! Do you believe the objective truth presented? If not, why not?
Intelligent men can disagree, and, perhaps, without fault, both be correct in their own minds. Subjective.
You do not either, so why do you disagree with it? On what basis do you disparage Nuremberg? Because war is hell? Because Sherman said so? Because whatever Israel does it right and if they do it, Germans deserve an apology?
Subjectivities or "people" must train themselves to see truth. Give an Abo a microscope and he will hit another Abo over the head with it or use it to grind grain or berries. As with the Eye of Flesh, so with the Eye of Mind, and ditto the Eye of Spirit. What I'm teaching you know is how to use your Eye of Mind. The Three Eyes are the basis of one school of Medieval Philosophy. So just a Catholic thing? No, all the Traditions have their version of this. The Catholic one is simple, clear, and ours, so I used it.
Lugh,
I do not disparage, but rather decry the certainty you develop from faith. I did not see overwhelming truth from the trials. That is my point.
I have more than once said that the more I study, the less I know. I have learned not to trade in absolutes.
You're deliberately being obtuse, perhaps because you're a postmodernist. Have you ever heard of the empirical method? You know, like real science? Each time an experiment is done, it varies from what is predicted by a mathematical model. Does that make science subjective? No. Instead, an experiment is performed thousands of times, and the resultants are analyzed according to statistics, from which the objective truth is extracted. This is the same process for individuals viewing a situation. All of their subsequent re-creations are put together, from which the objective truth is obtained.
Meanwhile, postmodernism believes that reality is socially constructed, that objective truth is impossible, and that each person's feelings about something are oh so special, oh so 'authentic'. What a load of crap. Does a tree in the forest make a sound, if nobody hears it when it falls? Does a fact exist about something the woke left doesn't like, if nobody states it or writes about it? The wokusts' answer is тАЬNo, it doesn't exist. And anybody who tries to talk about it is banned for creating hate." The end result of this nonsense is narcissism and nihilism, which is destroying western society for anyone with eyes to see. And the only objective metanarrative that can possibly tie together all the millions of differing 'authentic' subjective viewpoints is raw power applied top-down by a tyrannical state.
The only hope for western civilization and objective Truth is to completely purge wokusts and their postmodernist insanity from society, in any and every way possible. To hell with woke leftism, to hell with wokusts. And if the same shoe fits you, then wear it and suffer the consequences.
~ Creatures Of Infinity & The Vanishing Horizon Of Truth ~
I am unsure we can ever know the absolute truth, perhaps because we can affect the/its outcomes, so it constantly shifts, like a receding horizon, forever beyond reach.
It's about the Uncertainty Principle and, perhaps ultimately, infinity. Infinity cannot resolve. There are no initial conditions. It's turtles all the way down as they say.
That's why I think that, if infinity goes into what makes us who and what we are, that makes us very special. It may be that consciousness cannot even happen without it. It may even hint at absolute free will. It makes us so special in fact that it seems kind of tragic that it might be missed, so preoccupied in the day-to-day mundane minutiae that we can be.
---
No Horizon
youtu.be/rGSrW8L_Lik?si=7kPDg2NN2HUT7KN3
"It makes us so special in fact that it seems kind of tragic that it might be missed, so preoccupied in the day-to-day mundane minutae (sic) that we can be." ~ Strange Bedfellow
Zazzy - this is why the Coffee Shop needs to be a priority. Deep discussion in the wee hours, before a crackling fire, in an intimate setting, is where revelations, and sometimes epiphanies are made.
Well in any case, let's see what we can accomplish in 2025 before (mass-produced global supply-chains, etc.) resources and general socioeconomic stability become such that they, too, recede faster than we can catch up.
The problem with cafes and other businesses in the current, teetering economic model is of course that they risk becoming inviable. This is not to necessarily suggest that some can't readaptively function within a different model/context though, such as one more localized and real-community-driven.
---
"My dear, here we must run as fast as we can, just to stay in place. And if you wish to go anywhere you must run twice as fast as that."
~ Lewis Carroll, 'Alice In Wonderland'
Happy New Year Zaz! Your longitude will ring in before we do.
What is your location?
...Anyway, thanks and Happy 2025 to you too! Catch you then!
I'm not in Kansas anymore.
"ave you ever heard of the empirical method? You know, like real science? Each time an experiment is done, it varies from what is predicted by a mathematical model. Does that make science subjective? No. Instead, an experiment is performed thousands of times, and the resultants are analyzed according to statistics, from which the objective truth is extracted.
#String theory
#Dark Matter
"The only hope for western civilization and objective Truth is to completely purge wokusts and their postmodernist insanity from society, in any and every way possible. To hell with woke leftism, to hell with wokusts. And if the same shoe fits you, then wear it and suffer the consequences."
Sooo, I am labelled a "Wokust" and should be sanctioned for my heresy. And by what method...boxcar or tumbrel? Your "objective truth extracted"...could that be considered "Settled Science"? You know, like Climate Change and the Holocaust?
Yes, I am deliberately obtuse, or "agnostic", to put it in a less abusive format.
You're being ridiculous. Just as Socrates showed how much an uneducated slave boy knew, I could show you how much you believe in the Truth if I could just get you to answer honestly.
A dog looks for its master. It comes to a triple fork in the road. It sniffs our the first two, nothing. Then it just goes down the third without sniffing. The process of elimination. Elementary reasoning.
If the Abos want to get the straight story in a conflict, they separate the parties involved and torture them. Then they discuss the results to see commonalities. Cops do the same thing sans the torture in most cases.
I want to give you the benefit of the doubt for being as smart as the Abos, but you're fighting me every step of the way.
Lugh,
You deal in absolutes. I keep the absolutes to a minimum, and in my worldview has not been disappointed. To you, Jesus is an absolute, you suggest, but you continue to study fakirs and idolators...blue elephants, et al, seeking...what? Further beliefs to reinforce your believed absolute? Something that should require no further quest?
Maybe you have been degraded by the use of the marijuanas you have suggested I try.
Agnosticism...so easy an Abo can do it....
Yes, as Blake said, Eternity is in love with the productions of time. So am I.
The Truth is something to be "realized" not just believed. Philosophy and religion must become one in the life of the seeker.
You live in your abstractions. A Sabertooth is a "Sabertooth". A lathe is not just a metal table, but a "lathe". Etc. They work, thus they have "cash value" as William James said.
If a cat jumps on a hot stove, it will never jump on a stove again? No, because the cat doesn't have that abstraction. It will never jump up "there" (on that stove again). The cat has the abstraction, "dog". They are born afraid of dogs, but will make an exception for dogs they are familiar with in some cases.
Lugh,
Realized not just believed? I prefer "internalized".
Philosophy and religion? What can be more pure truth, a personal truth, than realizing that which you do not know? That you might suspect, or believe is arguable. You are disingenuous to tell someone you KNOW of an event not part of your direct experience? Something you read in a book, or something drilled into you at catechism?
I think, perhaps, that which I believe to some extent is voluminous. That which I KNOW is very little by comparison.
Wm. Blake, I would invite to kiss my big black ass. Blake was a Dissenter, and I would prefer quotes of a more secular viewpoint. They were still burning witches when Blake was in the church.
You KNOW that cats are born afraid of dogs? How do you KNOW that? Are they really born afraid of dogs? Who knows? Maybe. Maybe it is a learned trait. Maybe they compete for the same resources. Maybe Sheer mass has something to do with it. Maybe it is a game.
Yes, much of what we know is relative, partial, through a glass darkly. But before you were claiming it all was. You weren't just agnostic about ultimate reality, you were an atheist about our common everyday reality. In which case, it would be pointless for anyone to ever say anything to anyone since we would have no common ground.
We pulled you in from the brink and now you have backtracked back to some degree of sanity. Thus the utility of the philosophical method is revealed.
Another successful cure, partial but substantial.