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For years, lawmakers in deeply blue, proudly progressive New York City have grappled with a seemingly intractable problem: Its schools are among the most segregated in the nation.
— The New York Times
And so Bill de Blasio, New York’s Mayor, who has been busy running for president, proposes to end the sorting-out system for the “gifted and talented” (G & T) that is theoretically responsible for that segregation. 75 percent of the G & T kids are Asian and white and, according to the school system’s Diversity Task Force, are not equitably distributed among the schools that end up being mostly black and Hispanic.
The proposal stoked a furor among those very “deeply blue and proudly progressive” parents whose G & T kids have been safely sequestered away from the “normals” who grind out their days in schools that only go through the motions of education and who come out years later unable to read or do math.
I’m a product of the New York City school system, so I know a little about it up close and personal, and many of its current features were well underway in the 1960s, when I was there. My primary school, PS 6, on 82nd and Madison Avenue, was almost entirely white because the Upper East Side was entirely white. However, New York was a middle-class city in those days. The hedge fund had not yet been invented. PS 6 released us little inmates to the streets at noon every day — hard to believe now — and I spent many lunch hours in the Metropolitan Museum of Art, which was a block away, and free in those days, and pretty empty on weekdays because all those middle-class adults were at work. Even stock-brokers were middle-class back then, though it might be hard to believe.
My parents had split up rancorously and liked to bludgeon each other over money, so private school was out of the question for me. They were also absolutely not interested in my school career, being preoccupied with their own affairs. So, I was consigned to Intermediate School 167 on 76th and Third. It was now the heyday of desegregation, so the district comprised a thin ribbon through the Upper East Side exploding into a big mushroom cloud in Spanish Harlem. Thus, the school was about 80 percent black and Puerto Rican (as Hispanics in NYC were denoted then). Every day there was like Riot in Cellblock D. The G & T classes were then called “Special Progress” (SP), and I was in them, but between classes we-who-could-write-and-do-math circulated through the anarchic halls where shakedowns and beat-downs were a daily ritual.
I got through it somehow without running away to join the circus and got into one of New York’s so-called “specialized” high schools of which there were four (Brooklyn Tech, Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, and the High School of Music & Art). I went to the last one, M & A. It was perhaps 75 percent white, and quite civilized. The teachers were all various versions of Bernie Sanders. Shakedowns and beat-downs were unknown among kids who had to lug cellos and painted canvases through the halls. I disliked it moderately, though, because it was so far away it might as well have been in Czechoslovakia and the journey back and forth took hours. After that, I fled to college upstate and never came back.
Enough about me. Obviously, the racial shuffle has been going on for decades in the New York City school system, but in these times of white privilege and intersectionality, the escape routes of G & T and SP must be plugged. No extra gruel for you! But I have a remedy for the persistent problem of underperformance, one that has not really been tried: intense concentration, starting in preschool and going forward as long as necessary, in spoken English. Language is the foundation of learning, certainly of reading skill, and too many children just can’t speak English. Without it, they’ll be unable to learn anything else, including math. The reasons for their poor language skills are beside the point. Whether they are newcomers from foreign lands or the descendants of slaves, they need to learn how to speak English and to do it correctly, with all the tenses and correct verbs. They need to be intelligible to others and to themselves to make sense of the world.
The resistance to this idea would be mighty and furious, I’m sure. Some people will always be smarter than others, but the disparities at issue are badly aggravated by poverty in language. We don’t even pretend to want to take the obvious steps to correct this, even though it is obviously correctable. Learning anything puts people out of their comfort zone, so that can’t be used as an excuse. Diversity in language is a handicap, and it does not make you specially abled. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
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I’ve been following the ideological progress of Mayor de Blasio according to On The Issues since he announced his candidacy. For such a notorious liberal, he started off near the right end of the spectrum. Since then, he has moved to the left and is now the median candidate ideologically in the remaining field. That means he’s just an average Democrat.
In other news, mall staple Forever 21 is facing bankruptcy. The Retail Apocalypse rolls on.
De Blasio is only in the presidential race to promote his name – it will result in more income in the future. Politics won’t improve your life but being a politician will. He has exchanged the One True Religion for the One True Polity.
It’s very interesting you should mention education, because I was just re-reading one of John Micheal Greer’s recent posts, and a poster who teaches at a white upper middle class middle school offered up this comment that sheds a grim and harsh light on the reality of our educational system and the social context in which it exists:
If you had asked me ten years ago what my political leanings were, or even three years ago, I would have said very left. Now I find myself bewildered by the left. I am seeing some of those leftist values turn into something really destructive as they spill into my classroom. Over the past ten years, I have seen a worrying decay of mental health in my students (I teach at an upper middle class, mostly white middle school). Anxiety and depression have been on the rise at my school as they have been at most others. Accepted “ideas” for the rise in mental issues are that students are too obsessed with technology and social media (which are both true!). But over the last two years in particular it’s like more and more of my students are feeling personally persecuted by the world. While feeling persecuted, angsty, and depressed has been a badge of honor for many a teenager in the past, lately, it’s taken on a different flavor.
Students often come into my classroom with entitlement issues (clearly learned from their parents. Teachers who do not act sufficiently servant-like can and have gotten my school sued. We have at least 1-3 absolutely preposterous lawsuits/threat of lawsuit going at any single time, and those are just the ones I hear about around the lunch table). But what the teachers at my school are seeing lately is a huge increase in what we’re calling “entitled victimhood.” I have multiple students this year bragging about how high their doses are of anti-depressants, how many times they’ve cut themselves deep enough to create scars, how dare the teacher not use their preferred pronoun again (even though said student changed the preferred pronoun, again, just the week before!). Don’t even think about requiring them to do schoolwork because they will threaten to harm themselves. In fact, I can be berated by parents and threatened with a lawsuit if I don’t let particular students listen to music through their earbuds–while I’m talking!
It used to be I could say that most students did not come in with these sorts of issues. Most students did not have parents who threatened legal action against their teachers at any misstep, most students went through the typical teenage turmoil and came out more resilient in the end. I STILL say that is true, but whereas it used to be that only 5% or less of my students/parents came in with extreme versions of the above outlined issues, that number has crept closer to 10-15% in just a couple of short years. What used to be rare is increasingly becoming the norm. This increase in number of students parallels an increase in severity of their issues. I have never had so many students try to “do something” to themselves as I have over these last two years–cutting, taking pills, actual suicide attempts.
Some of these students absolutely have real issues and need real help, but it also seems like some of these students have subconsciously internalized the left’s values of victimhood as power. The more depressed a middle schooler can prove to others he or she is, the more powerful that student becomes will be catered to by both adults and other students. I’ve actually overheard my students argue with each other over who was more depressed! (Student A: Well, I’m more depressed because I cut myself deep enough to leave scars last night. Student B: Well, I’m more depressed because I took a bottle of pills over the weekend and my parents had to take me to the ER.)
I guess my point in all this is to say that I am seeing the left’s rage and King of the Hill victimhood mentality may be contributing to actual, physically harmful outcomes for their children–right now. More of these students are learning to wield this newfound power of victimhood, wildly and indiscriminately. I would have never thought the next words would leave my mouth because I take mental health issues very seriously, but: physically harming yourself to prove how angsty and depressed you are has become trendy at my school. I daily feel like I’m being held hostage by my students over the threat of one of them harming themselves. It has been the strangest time realizing what’s been happening. I feel so sad for them knowing they will be wrestling with this toxic worldview for years to come.
So while I agree with you about the importance of teaching the ability to properly read, write, and speak the English language, there would appear to be more than one way in which our society’s pathologies would get in the way of that goal. I mean, if this is what “progressive” thinking is supposed to be, I guess I can’t really sit here and be shocked that much of society is becoming more “conservative”. (Though I would note that I also agree with JMG that today’s conservatives have forgotten how to conserve every bit as much as today’s liberals have forgotten how to liberate.)
The JMG post I was reading was After The Shouting, The Silence. I was going to embed the link in my comment but just plain forgot. (Major sleeping-pill-head this morning!)
A general strike by the teaching profession, in Grade-School (K-12) to achieve a Bill Of Rights for the classroom environment?
Cell phones and earbuds checked at the locker room seems high on the list. Behavior habits based on the Golden Rule at top as well. English emphasis #Three. #4 Bullying is a precursor of urder and is definite “Zero Tolerance ” category along with weapons.
Cursive writing as a self control mechanism is optional to individual districts…. The Golden Rule shall be back in the classroom for this new generation: “Do to/for others as you would have them do/for you” The Hippocratic Oath is a scientific version of the Golden Rule.
Comment on the situation: Loosing McGuffy readers, salted with Scriptural verities after the Scopes trial, was more significant than we knew. Scopes replaced Genesis with “From Goo To You Via The zoo, firmly cementing racism. Throwing Judeo-Christian mores and prayer out of the schools circa 1950’s was another step along the way down. Those demanding time and space for the kinder lines of the Qur’an and Buddhism will realize replication of the earlier source.
A crucial factor adults do not consider is: early on as young people realize they have survived the “Killing Field Of The Womb” they are inculcated with a feeling of cheapness of human life. Well aware a teachers’ General Strike will not address the Abortion genocide, we now have infanticide death toll in the tens of millions, and each generation of young are already living with survivor’s guilt.
4014,
In this overheated political environment, your suggestions would have little impact on school administrators who deal directly with parents, the law firms, and the Marxists in the Department of Education.
In my mind, the only solution to a youth not-well-spent is 100% military conscription, thus removing the “children” from the toxic environment they wallow in.
Those generations that grew up without values, or discipline, would learn both at the end of a boot. Ask any former “youth at risk” what he learned in Marine Corps boot camp.
Half measures and Band-Aid fixes will not change the results( an entire generation) of a lifetime of cultural degradation.
Parents ain’t gonna do it. Schools ain’t gonna do it. Churches ain’t gonna do it. If the government can’t do it, then the cause is lost.
Of course, to put these changes into effect, we would need a leader, a strong leader, unfettered by…laws and shit. A corn-pone dictator….
Maybe soon…maybe in our lifetime.
“Maybe soon…maybe in our lifetime.”
At 72 I doubt that it will come in my lifetime, but it’s coming. A system under stress reacts in a direction to relieve the stress.
At 72 I doubt that it will come in my lifetime….
Epicur,
Yeah…about that….
https://i0.wp.com/heartiste.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/bz-5cc2898b3492b.jpeg?w=1021&ssl=1
I agree with Dr. Maurice Berman that a society such as ours that is inherently based on pure selfishness will of course be a total shit-show that can’t possibly have a happy ending. So while your as-of-yet imaginary American Pinochet might possibly succeed in making American school-kids less mollycoddled and neurotic, he would certainly make things even worse in other ways. Like maybe, starting a nuclear war with Russia or China.
So, your solution for illiteracy is for the government to take care of it through the military, I guess that means that we have militarization of education, as in so many other walks of life.
Well, I assure you that if the family cannot manage the education of its children, it will not be done. And that, of course, is exactly what’s happening.
Shotho,
Illiteracy? Values and discipline. Anything else is just a bonus.
Venus,
Get worse? Maybe.
Hey VP,
One of my kids, his wife and all of their children’s teachers seem to have swallowed the idea that climate (and other) apocalypse is imminent. What the hell are their children supposed to think when all of the adults in their life are going bonkers – not to mention their Trump Derangement Syndromes. I try to add a little ballast for the grandkids by pointing out that there is no evidence that supports any reason for paralyzing fear — at least about climate.
The big lesson I draw from this example is that all the emphasis on victimhood promoted by what JHK cheekily calls “Wokesterdom” very certainly does not bring out the best in people. Young people in particular need to be challenged to be more and better than what they were previously, and inculcating a mindset that fosters sadness and weakness and pathos is the exact opposite.
Yeah, let’s keep on hammering into little kids we have only 12 years left before the world burns to a crisp and wonder why they’re feeling nervous and unsecure.
Brh
Are you going to tell them the oil will last forever as well, brh, to keep them feeling secure?
Nice straw man though – watch it doesn’t catch fire.
“If you had asked me ten years ago what my political leanings were, or even three years ago, I would have said very left. Now I find myself bewildered by the left. I am seeing some of those leftist values turn into something really destructive as they spill into my classroom. ”
Sow, reap.
One can not teach those that refuse to learn and right now many believe learning is not cool.
learning is never ‘cool’. It’s just learning for the sake of learning.
venuspluto67, if you’re as wise as your comment indicates, you’ll retire immediately, your life is at stake.
{/shrugs} I have a bad feeling life is going to become awfully cheap in the up and coming decade, so whatevs.
I got into an argument on facebook the other day. I now have a page because I advertise on that site. Someone said that she couldn’t believe she read that men were reluctant to approach women or hire them because of the aggressive Me too movement.
Sorry, I posted before I’d finished. I wrote that in some of the more male-dominated sites I read, I’ve seen grumblings about that. She was extremely offended, because apparently they expect to have their cake and eat it too. The son of a friend of mine, wouldn’t even date American women. He said they were too entitled, too greedy and self-involved, and had no loyalty or commitment. He feared she’d become dissatisfied and force him out of his home and leave him holding the bag for support of his children so she could explore other options for self-fulfillment. He found himself a wife in Eastern Europe. A tall, stunningly beautiful blonde who speaks three languages and has a master’s degree. She worked investigating bank fraud for her country’s version of the FBI. She’s really too god for him. He’s a lucky man. She makes beautiful children, has a management position in a bank, and is extremely grateful to all appearances. One woman said that when she complained of her co-workers she was fired, although she claimed she was the best of them. I indicated that with troublesome people it is easy enough for an employer to find a performance issue. I think woman have also jumped on the victimization bandwagon, and I don’t think its going to take them anywhere they really want to go. Unintended consequences are a bitch.
“She’s really to god (sic) for him.”
The jokes just really tell themselves with this one – the same one who was besides herself with excitement about getting me mobbed off the site.
When women had inferior social status, they secretly deemed themselves at least equals. Once they attained equal status, they secretly or not so secretly deemed themselves superior. Now they believe that they are goddesses far above ordinary men. How dare any approach them!
Thus real equality in the inner sense means keeping women in a subordinate social position. From this ensues far more marriages and happiness for both sexes. And from that stable families, happy children, functioning schools, etc.
Typo, Janos, I meant too good for him, as I’m sure you know. I do agree with you about women. People always push too far. It seems to be part of the human condition. I never was a feminist. I always liked the protections offered by society for women. It made me sad when men stopped offering the little courtesies of opening doors, helping with a package, offering me their seat on the bus (though now that I’m an old lady I get the door opened and that seat on the bus, though the heavily pregnant girl does not). I always enjoyed a masculine hand on the small of my back for a moment to direct me. No man would dare to take such a liberty now. When I was growing up, none of the kids I knew had mothers who worked, none of them lived in single parent homes, unless their mother was a widow, and that was very hard for the woman. It’s not that divorce didn’t happen, but it was a rare and dishonorable thing in my working class town.
You remind me of that picture (dig it up if you can) of the Leaders of Northern Europe (all women) humbly tip toeing into a Mosque with their heads covered. They savaged their own Men and now seek to replace them with Men whom they can’t overpower.
Indeed nothing is more beautiful than feminine humility. Nor more difficult for women. The Sons of God cry out for joy to see it.
For Halloween: Go out with a big cigar, old style glasses, and of course in a White Freudian Slip.
Yeah, I think the women of Europe are going to get the Sons of Allah good and hard. Sadly, nobody wants to see me in my Freudian slip anymore.
“now that I’m an old lady I get the door opened and that seat on the bus, though the heavily pregnant girl does not…”
I’m old but not that old (and a lady) and I give up my seat for pregnant women (as we call them), women (or men) with children, and anyone older or infirm, including frail men. Seems normal to me, although if a man is polite enough to offer me a seat I’ll take it graciously unless he looks frail. I see youngsters behaving in the same way – sometimes they surprise you when they look teenage-surly, but are transformed when they smile at someone they’re helping.
“Indeed nothing is more beautiful than feminine humility. ”
You should post that in the refuges where the battered wives go.
Green Alba, that was only a few years ago. I definitely was one of those for whom you would have given up your seat, if only in self defense to keep me from becoming a dangerous projectile. I’m too short to use the leather handholds without a stretch and my balance is appallingly bad. I did offer that pregnant girl my seat, but she refused it, though she was huge and her discomfort obvious and growing. There were plenty of able-bodied young women who could have given up their seats for her, but apparently, here, equality of the sexes doesn’t extend to such courtesies.
All buses in my city are handicapped accessible with lifts for people who are wheelchair-bound. The long seats at the front of the bus are designated for their use. While others may use them, they are required to give up their seats, if they are needed. The bus driver secures the chairs.
I didn’t mean to criticise you in any way, draupnir. I was rather putting in a good word for most people who, I find, offer a seat to anyone who seems to need it more than they do.
I’ve never seen a pregnant woman standing for more than half a minute, or anyone with a toddler in tow – I find people can’t get up quick enough, apart from a few surly bods.
But it’s always a nice surprise to see the young girl who looks surly and self-absorbed jump up to help someone in need of it. We often misjudge them! (The ones who really annoy me are the ones who sit with their shoes on the seat right under the ‘please don’t put your feet on the seat’ sign. 🙂
For Liberal Whites, subjectively speaking, if you’re not a Victim you’re a Victimizer, a Racist, a Natzi, a Monster who deserves to die. So the young are begininning to opt for the Mental Illness or the Mental Illness of Transgenderism. I don’t think our Tormentors are going to let them escape with this. Nor their Minority clients. But that’s the psychological logic behind it.
Not news, btw. We’ve been warning about this for years now. Greer is a latecomer, one still party to countless liberal illusions. It’s a Death Cult but its members are loathe to leave since they feel they have normal Whites on the ropes at last.
Hell of a read. With each paragraph I celebrate the fact that I and my kids all got through our education before this nonsense reached the tipping point.
Empowerment of victimhood.
I wrestle with the oxymoronic mess that I suspect this to be. (far more than just the usual and typical species of mess and mischief constantly found to be afoot.)
For victimhood in all its variables is all about giving up power – to someone else. It is the antithesis of agency, is it not?
“Can someone else please live my life for me.” Sure.
I strongly suspect though, that in the midst of all this mayhem lurks a strange zeitgeist, of sorts.
Could it be that the jig is up? And that the cracking whip of academia whose sizzling welts that produced a pain hardly felt at all – because of the promised treat provided by a good education. The McMansion, Lexus, 5-star vacation, early retirement and comfortable life…
What if all that’s not true anymore, and the dumbed down students are at least smart enough to have figured that out? What then?
Education for its own sweet sake is a wonderful thing.
But if it doesn’t pay the bills…
In Afghanistan to this very day, girls and women equate the word education with the word freedom. They are both one and the same and completely synonymous. Something to think about.
Another “conservative” has found another way to blame liberals for everything is what I read into this. This is clear observation of reality, tackled back to confirm a performed political conclusion. What crap.
1) Learning hurts .. must be something in the re-arranging of the synapses that makes learning a chore if not painful. Unless a topic fascinates a person, it will always be cauliflower. Which brings me to 2) by the time of high school, lets dispense with the trigonometry and world history and concentrate on topics that apply directly to peoples’ lives and might just “fascinate” them: legal, financial and medical topics, which arent discussed hardly at all in schools.
Speak for yourself, my friend. Especially in the presence of a competent (not brilliant, just competent) teacher, learning is among the greatest pleasures we can experience, and no, it doesn’t have to be a topic that the learner find personally fascinating. I’m sorry you haven’t experienced that, but hopefully you are not at the end of your life and still have the chance to enjoy that most human thrill; the joy and satisfaction of really meaningful learning.
Anonymous:
I too spent years teaching (8-10 y/os, who are blooming into independent- thinking. Wonderful, everyday…) so I couldn’t agree with you more.
But your response was directed at Janos, so while accurate and enlightening, perhaps to others, you were otherwise wasting your time. Janos is either 77 or 17 – you know, the ages at which men already know everything.
JHK, I’m at a loss as to how you can continue to suppose that the purpose of the system you are critiquing is educational. “School” in this country has little or nothing to do with education. (Very much including G & T, which I attended in Fairfax County, VA about twenty years after you and which I experienced exactly as did you.)
School is for sorting and storing; sorting people into boxes labelled “guaranteed useful to power”, “potentially useful to power”, and no, there is no third box labelled “not useful to power”– those kids just get thrown to the floor and swept away to the garbage, aka the streets and eventually prison (another place we like to pretend has a noble purpose but which is also really just for sorting and storing). Then the kids in the first two categories have to be stored for a decade or so (because they cannot stay at home because their parents must both work) until they can be made use of. That’s all. There is neither a purpose nor an opportunity for education in such a process.
To a topic in which you have abiding interest; there is no space for buildings that inspire or connect kids to their cultural inheritance in such a process. But there is a lot of space there for modern techniques of psychological manipulation (aka “curriculum”) to control the habits of lots of people cheaply and ugly concrete bunkers (aka “school buildings”) where you can store lots of people cheaply.
No one will understand what is happening in our schools and why there is literally zero chance of thoughtful and useful ideas like “teach kids to speak English” being taken up until he or she recognizes that the “educational system” has different purposes in mind than is usually claimed and it’s doing reasonably well at its real purposes, insofar as they can be carried out in a declining nation.
John Taylor Gatto has explicated all this very well. I certainly won’t do any better, and I certainly won’t have any more effect on this system than has he. It’s time to walk away.
As a teacher, I can tell you aren’t. You have no idea what you are talking about. Zero.
I’m sorry that you are a teacher (or, if you really are Howard Beale, I’m sorry you are psychotic and fictional). It must be very difficult to try to educate kids in spite of the system around you.
I’m not a teacher. John Taylor Gatto was a public school teacher, one of the best in New York (and repeatedly, officially, honored as such). His analysis is much harsher than mine, perfectly supported by research, and well-published. Please go argue with him and his books.
“School is for sorting and storing; sorting people into boxes labelled “guaranteed useful to power”, “potentially useful to power”, and no, there is no third box labelled “not useful to power”– those kids just get thrown to the floor and swept away to the garbage, aka the streets and eventually prison (another place we like to pretend has a noble purpose but which is also really just for sorting and storing).”
True, but in your analysis lies the misunderstood diagnosis of our doom.
Civilization, such as it is, has never existed without Leviathan. Fantasies about the “worth of every human being” notwithstanding, civilization has always ruthlessly discarded the “not useful to power” when in its youth – that is the cold hard truth. In the past, however, there was not so much of a “storage” problem, emigration, disease and the gallows slowed the accumulation of the “not useful” so that civilizations did not age as rapidly as ours is today, succumbing to the vast excess of the “not useful”.
If you want to call me a “Nazi” for realizing this, please also consider that the Nazis proposed solutions. I have no solution, but I do advise that each individual would be best served by seeing the true nature of the world in which we live.
“The world’s God is treacherous and full of
unreason; a torturer, but also
The only foundation and the only fountain.
Who fights him eats his own flesh and perishes
of hunger; …”
https://www.best-poems.net/robinson_jeffers/birth_dues.html
Who is “civilization”? Seriously, decisions in our world are not made by abstract ideas. They are made by people.
“Who is “civilization”?”
“Civilization” seems to be an emergent property of humans in large groups. From the earliest times it has been associated with the dominance of one group over another (hierarchy). That association is so tight that I believe it is reasonable to assume that the relationship is causal (Occam’s razor).
I am not arguing to “justify” the “decisions” of people, but to understand. Or, you could just keep beating your head against a wall.
“Against the Grain” by James Scott is a good book.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2ukte-je8k
Hello James,
Out there this summer, so haven’t been able to comment on your musings. You quote:
‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.’
Saint John writing his Gospel in Greek used the correct verbiage:
“In the beginning was Logos, and the Logos was with God, and the Logos was God.”
LOGOS is the LOGIC that created the universe, not just a w o r d.
ROOSH V has a great interview where Dr. E. Michael Jones explains this epochal slip of verbiage which has kept us language gulag inmates in the dark for 2000 years:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-dEtQk3-xA
Stay in there and pitch!
PFO
PS – Epicur,
I survived four 1970s years in the public-fool-system exactly as you and James describe it – a finishing school for criminals to keep the gulag economy supplied with slave-labor.
Keep at it!
JFO, tell me more according to the Koine’ Greek text I was taught with (Koine’ Greek being considered the original spoken and written Greek during the time of Jesus and Paul)
“Logos” meaning- (e.g. word; saying; message; teaching; teaching; talk; conversation.
Classical Greek is not a good use for interpretation of what is often called biblical or Koine’ Greek.
Thanks for your attention.
In the end socialism always leads to shared misery. Just more sharing…
https://twitter.com/AntiRa1865/status/1171068577379602432?s=20
If you are correct (I am unfamiliar with the research on the subject, but let’s say for the sake of argument that you are), it seems that you are here pointing out a significant contradiction in progressive thinking. Minorities can, up to a point (and only up to a point), prosper in a segregated society without a common language; local businesses and schools provided economic and cultural resources and created some opportunity for social advancement in European and American ghettos from the Renaissance through the early 20th century without the need to master the majority language. It is also easier to live successfully in a de-segregated society with a common language (it is not even inevitable that that would involve assimilation–witness the videos of Sixties radicals speaking in a dialect that would not be out of place in a network newsroom without, for better or worse, buying into the Establishment ideology). A desegregated society without a common language, however, is next to impossible.
Thanks for the deep background, Jim! The mean streets of NYC were obviously not enough to break you – you’ve done quite well for yourself, I’d say. I’m guessing I’m about 5-10 years behind you chronologically. Never had much use for school beyond the 8th grade or so. I was at one time considered “gifted,” so maybe I just got bored or something, but school felt more and more like a prison camp to me, and my devilish instinct just wasn’t about stand for that. Haven’t been too excited about the whole concept ever since either, especially after completing college at the ripe old age of 47 with an overwhelming feeling of “wait, that’s it?”
Quite honestly, the one thing I took away from all that mess was the economics professor’s assertion that the primary use for education in the employment realm is as a signaling device – a mere credential. In light of that and the fact that I’m sure the kids these days have been told and/or sensed it too, I’m not sure I blame them for their somewhat underwhelming enthusiasm for playing the education game for 16 long years or more. Rote memorization and regurgitation just hasn’t progressed all that much since we were kids, nor has its value to adult life afterward.
My high school years were spent completely on drumming & Punk Rock as I followed The Ramones closely enough to be one of them.
Moreover, I was also an Iggy Pop follower, and a Heartbreakers fan too but I was not into ‘Chinese Rocks’ like Dee Dee was.
English was my only interest in high school but the teachers were extremely uneducated in terms of writing & composition, and they actually knew very little of the history of the English language so I simply ignored them and my quest for high school academic accreditation which merely signified ability to follow the rules which I was averse to given that following the herd meant following the jocks on the football team.
After high school I realized that my band mates were not professional enough to make it to the top of the music world and that’s when I decided that music was never going to be a money maker that would enable me to progress in life financially. My nerd CA father insisted that I had to go to college for a trade instead of adopting my outlook to get a university degree in Music so that I could teach.
Mechanical Engineering in college was most assuredly the biggest mistake of my lifetime in that every individual enrolled in the course was Functionally Illiterate by strict definition of the term. My lament during that course was significant in that I knew that I was enrolled in the wrong course with all the wrong people the whole time I was studying just to keep my father contented that I was being proactive regarding the money making task of life.
If I had any of this to do over again I would have focused on STEM disciplines instead of Arts or Social Sciences other than Economics.
Experimental Psychology was a great degree to attain but unless one is entirely conformist in approach to the orthodoxy there is no room for a heterodox approach.
During my university days the administration deinstitutionalized the Humanities across the board North America which made me realize that tertiary education was strictly a money making exercise and nothing more than that.
RW
I can kind of relate. Was always good in the arts and languages in HS. Hated most everything else, and particularly disliked the regimented nature of everything. My mind was always elsewhere.
Was also into music, but developed my talent more later in life, as my parents wouldn’t pay for a guitar and drums were out of the question due to the unavoidable racket.
The music industry was never a place to make money, unless the stars aligned. Many of the biggest acts weren’t usually composed of great musicians in the classical sense, but they worked well together and could write memorable songs (with the help of a producer in many cases).
Highly skilled musicians with roots in pop/rock usually just end up doing session work, which doesn’t pay too bad. If you were good enough for session work, you could have made it work.
Ottawa did not have enough of a music scene to enable me to do session work but I do agree with you on that avenue of employment. Booker T. & The MGs did quite a bit of session work that parleyed into Rock & Roll Hall of Fame status eventually. My problem back then was the genre of music that interested me more than most other genres. Session musicians have to be highly variable with regard to all genres in order to be employable as a session musician. I was strictly a Punk Rocker back in those days.
Don’t forget that ‘phoney Beatlemania’ had ‘bitten the dust’ by the time Joe Strummer sang about it as the bard of my generation.
RW
Am a punk/indie musician myself (guitar), though I dabble in other genres. Thanks for sharing.
I spent a career in Electro-mechanical engineering Robert, and while I was fortunate enough to be able to parlay my circumstances into eventually owning my own engineering firm and making at least a reasonable amount of money, the field certainly was a dying one no doubt. Most of that can be attributed to the removal of the once powerful manufacturing base that existed in this nation, where engineers mechanics and all sorts of other skilled and talented workers could find productive careers. That ain’t coming back anytime soon is it? Engineering, historically the rock of any successful society will have no future here, unfortunately, and neither will any nation so disposed.
My CA father read an article in the Globe & Mail [1981] that stated the dire need for skilled trades in Mechanical Engineering
forecasted for the upcoming next few decades of manufacturing in North America but, as soon as I graduated with a two year diploma in Mechanical Engineering Wall Street decided to offshore the entirety of North American manufacturing to Taiwan & China/Mexico et cetera.
My first employment opportunity was an apprenticeship for a tool & die company with a starting wage of $5.00 per hour after two years of college. I was making $10.00 per hour as a house painter before I graduated so I quit that apprenticeship and went back to contracting so that I could make money as an entrepreneur instead of a wage slave employed by a slave driver/task master.
Mechanical Engineering went electro-mechanical right after I graduated so that I was literally forced to update my training for the Electricity portion of the discipline. I was merely a Technician whereas you likely graduated with a P.Eng degree from a university instead of a two year college programme like I attended.
Being an owner of a private company is most assuredly the way to go IMHO. My father always wanted me to be self-employed so that I could be my own boss and not have to take orders for a living.
If I could win the Powerball Lottery I would start a drum manufacturing company and model it after the Chicago Slingerland Drum Company which was the finest of them all in the heyday of percussion where Gene Krupa ruled the roost with Goodman.
Precision Manufacturing is great stuff if one is making the right manufactured products.
RW
I had a few friends who worked at the Ovation Guitar plant in New Hartford. It was a good company to work for, people were proud of the guitars they produced, pay was pretty good. Alas, Ovation closed up about a decade or more ago. It was rather abrupt and no reason was really given.
Brh
I always wondered what happened to Ovation Guitar Company. Ovation is top line stuff that is extremely expensive today. Mass production must have forced their closure as a manufacturer.
China rules the markets today with Lean Manufacturing.
RW
Ovation was decent, but I could never get into the composite/synthetic bodes they used. I think this is what did them in, too. I recall sales being poor after the hair bands died out.
Vintage Gibson and G&L were my bag.
Slingerland made a lot of tenor banjos too. It seems there are a lot of musicians here at CF Nation. Myself included.
Walter,
The management positions at the electric utility that I worked for the 80’s had previously been staffed by engineers (PE’s). Then almost overnight, a sudden seismic shift occurred when an accountants manager took over as the CEO replacing an engineer. Top executive positions and some power plant management positions soon started to be filled by staff with only marketing and business backgrounds. One example, a newly appointed VP of Production (power plants) had only a marketing degree and had never set foot in a powr plant before his promotion. Engineers, once the builders and bulwark of the company, were reduced to being hired hands just like the line crews.
The mantra of the company shifted from customer service to shareholder value. We were told that stock price was all that mattered and employee relations took a backseat.
Now, thirty years down the road, we are now living in the aftermath of the financial boys taking over.
All the hysteria today over climate change caused by carbon dioxide (AGW) I find amusing. Engineers solved this issue more than 50 years ago with zero-emission nuclear power but alarmism, proganda and fear-mongering got in the way.
Whenever real problems arise that pertain to survival on this planet, engineers, if any are left, will ultimately be tasked with solving it.
Well said. The Triumph of Bullshit – using Female HR Managers as their attack dogs.
Reminds me a bit of the auto industry, where nearly everything made seems to have shifted to front-wheel drive shopping carts packed with cheap gizmos.
RW a punker! I just knew there was a bad boy hiding in there somewhere beneath that nerdy academic exterior! Good on ya’, buddy!
Actually, my nerd CA father told me to stay completely out of trouble at the age of 14 so that he would not have to worry about me getting into trouble and breaking the law. He advised me to maintain my honestly throughout my lifetime and to never break the law, ever! He even went as far as making me promise him that I would do as he says.
Immediately after telling me never to break the law throughout my entire lifetime I decided that the only way to rebel against his authority was to purchase a drum kit and practice like I was Krupa himself.
I am almost positive that after enduring the entire house shaking to the very foundation due to my drumming my father must have regretted not advising me to emulate Al Capone instead.
😉
RW
Ahh yes, the eternal question! Are teens not put on this earth solely to torture their parents for having them?
The establishment & local constabulary dispatched municipal Law Enforcement to remind my band at our studio of the Noise Violation Laws after 11:00pm at night on a frequent basis due to the old folks home that was a quarter mile down the road with old geezers that had extra sensitive hearing aids I guess?
The priests & ministers in the church across the way were likely calling the police on us for the 100 Watt Marshall 4×12 double stacks that were turned up to 10 on the volume to make our eardrums ring for another week before we played again. They likely took offense to our antics because they knew we were having big time fun too. I’m certain they must have loved my drumming but our guitarists would hit high notes on full volume that would blow my eardrums out for weeks at a time so the noise was their fault and the priests with good ears must have felt obligated to have LE sanction our guitarists and not moi.
No laws were ever broken and we just assumed that the Bing Crosby folks that were dying down the road would probably like some Punk Rock played appropriately, and at appropriate volume for the neighbourhood, & state Law Enforcement personnel too.
Ah, the good old days back when I had a studio for musical mayhem at peak volume enough to annoy the police, priests, and elderly folks down the road.
Life was good back then. Today, my amplifier is restricted to volume below 5 on the dial of my stereo system that is running 100 Watts & 120 Watts rated for speakers.
RW
You have not mentioned skewed academic expectations in public schools for a long time and you must have forgotten what happened the last time you did. The idea that grades should be earned was taken as an off-color comment and you were accused of executing your white privilege. I hope the reaction is more reasonable this time around. You lost your speaking engagements by asserting the radical notion that learning to grunt was not the same thing as learning English.
I have something today too 🙂
My personal time in the educational system included years of Catholic school as well as four years in public school and were topped off with my time at the Academy. All of those experiences were in places where we did what we were told and order was always maintained because Mom and Dad would not tolerate any other way to behave and yes, a majority of the students were Caucasian. Divorce had not yet become the norm, at least where I was, and parents all seemed to be instructed in the same schools of active parenting.
As a parent myself I was able to be blessed parenting two sets of families, years apart, and being very active in the systems during the course of these periods, I have had much time to observe the vast differences that time has brought.
At first it was easy to blame the teachers and the administrators with their fancy salaries and benefits and of course the megalomaniacal “national system” that commands them all (No Child Left Behind, Head Start, el al). However, anyone with any ability to even slightly critically observe can come to the conclusion that the main reason for the total failure of the educational systems of today is shitty parents. Distracted, uninvolved, self-centered, you can have it all parents are clearly the crumbled foundation that the system is built upon. They are everywhere and in every layer of social strata. Period, end of story and unless they can somehow, miraculously turn it all around and start raising their children well once again, it will only continue to degrade.
And for even one thing to change, everything must change. What you ask means stay at home mothers, which means paying men a living wage again so he alone can earn enough, etc. It means Feminsm must be crushed – and that isn’t going to happen. And it would mean that those behind Feminism and Corporate Capitalism would have to be overthrown – which is most unlikely given their vigilance and police power.
We will be saved by Collapse and/or Natural Disaster. Or a strike by Eurasia and/or East Asia.
We must begin right now to instruct our youth in the necessity of a return to the full Patriarchy & the reinstatement of our women to their proper role in the home. This movement was gaining ground on You Tube until its suppression began at the hands of the jewess CEO of You Tube, Susan Wojcicki, appointed by none other than Mark Zuckerberg.
Gilead. Lazy thinking, is all I can say.
How so?
I worked in a inner city high school for 20 years and the conditions were just as JHK describes, and there were 2 police officers patrolling the halls.
It was my observation that Big Business specifically the text book publishers. Have been trying since the 1990s to destroy the Public School system so they can come in with privately owned and operated for profit Charter Schools.
BTW. A school building and grounds are not bad. Teachers try their best. It is the students that make bad schools.
Yes, it’s not natural most Black and Browns to be in High School. If they can learn to read and write, call it a success and get them working. One should know by then if such a thing is possible. And if it is, it shoiuld have been done already. Many Whites, the same thing. But more Whites could benefit from real High School with the old standards. Of those, a very few could go onto to college if there was some reason for so doing.
Not knowing it at the time I was in a public school Camelot. I did not live where Cadillacs were driven but I did live in a land of Buicks. My father in his Olds barely qualified.
A solid middle class burb on the north end of Minneapolis back in the day when America thought it was great and compared to now, was.
PTA meetings packed the auditorium and our dropout rate was something ridiculous like 2%. After high school I was shocked to find that relative to an Average American I already had the equivalent of what used pass for community college smarts everywhere else in the country. I had been in a place where even white parents valued education as much as Asian parents did. I was a lucky dog.
KD- I have come to the same conclusion; born and raised in Minnesota blessed Education able to take advanced placement classes plus summer school the system would have allowed to graduate after my junior year with some of the core college classes out of the way or able to test out of. Though my experience was out west of Mpls/StP where the prairie begins. But my GPA was average at best with lots of financial and emotional challenges but enable me to get off the floor and make a better life. I have a feeling that there are fair number of “Lucky- Dogs” on this page from the sheer fact of increased survival rate as the population continued to increase.
Yes, back in the day average performance for us was what is considered gifted today. ‘Help’ was available to those who needed focus and improved performance. Usually the threat of ‘help’ was enough to avoid detention.
Question? Would you have wanted it easier? Not me. I just wish I had known I was being turned into a badass. It would have made adjustment to the rest of America easier.
De Blasio is not entirely stupid.His policy is “make the right noises then back off”.
Recently he promised to convert former hotel into homeless shelter on Billionaire’s Row.Everything was going well then some evil Judge blocked this attempt.Them damn racist judges …
De Blasio’s financial backers well never allow the Rising Tide of Color to destroy NYC crown jewel- 8 specialized high schools.
And sorting & selection is everywhere.SAT and Armed Forces ASVAB is just IQ test in disguise.
Thank you for that. IQ is real and real people know it. And the more real still know that it varies on average by race.
“A rose by any other name would smell as sweet”
(William Shakespeare chimed in during the Great IQ Controversy of 1610 🙂 )
Biologically speaking “race” is “subspecies”.For example all dogs belong to the big and presumably happy family – species “canis lupus familiaris”.
Yes,Great Dane may interbreed with a Poodle (but nothing good will come out of it).Yes,Border Collies on average are much much smarter than Chow Chows.Yes Border Collies and Chow Chows share 99.99999999999999% of their canine DNA-so f… what ???
But since scientific facts are the last thing Liberals care about and the word “race” makes them foam at the mouth-lets use the word “ethnicity” instead.Police departments use this term in DNA analysis reports.
In most instances, the parents are to blame for not disciplining their kids when it comes to homework and such. Another thing that should be done, is encouraging the habit of reading, a habit that will benefit you all your life. Just because you no longer attend high school or college, is no excuse to stop educating yourself. You should also encourage kids to think for themselves, and teach them how to reason. People on the far left are just as big a pain in the ass as people on the far right, with both groups having extreme opinions about things which does nobody any good.
Captain,
To paraphrase;
Hard times breed hard parents,
Hard parents breed good children,
Good children become soft parents,
Soft parents breed weak children,
Weak children bring hard times….
This can occur in but a few generations…in our lifetimes, for most.
Good transliteration. Both witty and true. If one analyzes, the good society is mere peak, perhaps a sine wave. Most of the time is spent going up and coming down. We’ve already crossed the x axis, accelerating to the bottom peak and hard times. Read Poe’s Descent into the Maelstrom. Or think of it as a crapper if you like.
Societies stomp up on hob nailed boots and descend in silken slippers as worn by fags and eunuchs. Greer describes the beginning of their reign of terror. Tough guys cucks will gladly do their bidding in order to draw a paycheck and also have the pleasure of hurting people with social approval. It’s hard on some since they may not like fags. But most will adjust their thinking or get their head screwed on straight. Worked for the armed forces, right?
Well elysian, we were always good to our kids, but they learned that no meant no. We were consistent with our discipline as well as with rewards. My kids grew up in the city, and learned to handle themselves from early on. They are both good people, and the oldest one has done a good job raising his two boys as well. I feel that we were successful parents, and passed that on to our kids as well.
Indeed, Capt. As well, you & Mrs. Spaulding probably both had successful parents too. That’s how it works!
Conversely, the undisciplined will breed undisciplined offspring, naturally.
However, there’s still the curious cases where, despite best intentions, an offspring jumps the rails – viz. how many grandparents are raising their grandchildren where the meth/smack/crack has got the better of their own children.
I agree completely about the parents. Though I was a working mom and not actively involved in school activities, my daughters knew I backed the teachers and they were expected to behave courteously, do their homework, earn good grades and there was no TV during week nights after 8 pm. I wasn’t a “tiger mom” but there were rules to help them learn self discipline. Because that’s what, as parents, is our responsibility and not the teachers.
How else do we characterize the degradation of public education other than as yet another elite failure? I mean, who foisted this nonsense anyway? It wasn’t mom and pop, who six or seven long decades ago, having delegated the task of imparting knowledge and skills to the highly educated experts and professionals of the time, were concerned with other matters like making a living and, in my own parents’ case (like millions of others), immersed in the long process of adjusting to a new country.
Or, in JHK’s case, busy fighting one another. Regardless, a corps of educational professionals had long taken shape and become established, and mister and his missus in the workaday world of the middle classes could turn their attention away from what the educrat boffins were up to.
And look at the practical results. As it turns out this parental inattention was costly in the extreme. What mischief they got up to, college trained and indoctrinated theoreticians threw wisdom and sound judgment to the wind, they took the task of presenting chunks of knowledge and messed it up completely and inflicted absurdity on their rosy-cheeked charges.
In my own case, I was in the eighth grade when educational absurdism made itself known in the classroom. Before then teaching was a straightforward thing; the instructor would stand in front of rows of desks, present the day’s lesson, provide examples, and then assign homework to make the lesson stick.
Somehow, until then, the method worked. We learned to read and print and then as our hand and eye-co-ordination improved, we even learned that most laughably back-ward exemplar of unwoke unenlightenment – cursive. Yes, barbarism and racism on the page.
We learned to spell, we learned standard English usage, even in classrooms full of kids from the most war-ruined places on the planet. The violent conflicts we see nowadays, with the throngs of refugees, are small potatoes compared to the murderous rampages of WW1 and 2.
And we learned multiplication tables. I kid you not, we used flash cards to practice, and we were required in our neck of the woods to know it up to the twelve times table at a minimum. And we learned long division. We practiced these skills until they became second nature to us. Yes indeed, rote learning. Trust me, it works.
But what we’ve found is that, for a hundred reasons, elitism doesn’t work. We see it’s many-faceted fuck-ups manifested in daily life, in big ways and small, in education especially.
In broad terms, what is the alternative? Many would point to that dread thing called “populism”. And what is this “populism”? It’s the opposite of elitism. But isn’t populism the problem? Many of the highly educated, expert elite shudder at the prospect. Given the hash they made of things, maybe an anticipatory shudder is in order.
Populism isn’t the problem, populism isn’t even a problem. Populism isn’t an answer, populism is THE answer. Yep, retrograde as it sounds, in this age of incomprehensible jargon and gale-winds of double-talk, what to trust is the plain speech and common sense of the common man. No, seriously, uneducated people like my dad had the clearer take on things, the more practical solutions than his college-addled betters. And education isn’t much more than the application of this common sense to the task of imparting knowledge to little ones. We know how it used to work, and most importantly, we know that it DID work.
Yet you’re against it in the political realm. But they go together. We must increase and you must decrease (paraphrasing John the Baptist). Have you read the New Testament btw?
I’m haunted by a 60 Minutes segment back in the mid-80’s, if memory serves. It featured Marva Collins, a no-nonsense black woman living in Chicago’s South Side. She plucked about 10 black kids from the mean streets of the local neighborhood, each one of whom would have probably been dismissed as future felons by most casual observers. None of these boys and girls were urged upon her by their parents, and by come miracle of indifference they did not interfere with Marva as she took them under her wing.
Her students gathered in her upstairs apartment. She gave them books, real caring and unwavering discipline. By the time the 60 Minutes cameras were trained upon them, the students–around 14-to-15 years of age–were reciting Chaucer and behaving like motivated college freshmen from a top liberal arts school (as they once were.)
Gatto was right. We’re criminally stunting the lives of our children, of whatever color.
People like Marva are the answer, but there are so few of them!
“She gave them books, real caring and unwavering discipline. ”
The discipline is the key. None of us likes it, but complex societies are impossible without it and learned self-discipline is necessary to a stable life within a complex society.
All of us, to one extent or another, are susceptible to fantasies about noble savages or life free of the strictures of civilization, but the truth is that man in a state of nature is a pretty rough customer, and his life no bed of roses.
The fact that our society is headed for collapse is a result of natural processes, but that does not mean that man will abandon civilization. Thinking that we will do so is a dangerous fantasy – dangerous to individual survival.
Excellent point, look at Naked and afraid tv show, “expert” survivalist can hardly survive in raw nature without civilization, imagine what a collapse would do.
No doubt she chose the cream of that miserable crop. As to whether they understood a word of what they were reciting is another matter. Studies show that Black’s memories are just as good as Whites. It’s most of the other things that are the problem.
Janos – you’re just a miserable, withered character. You see only the worst possibilities in anything and always through a nasty racist filter.
These inspirational stories are a perennial favorite of the liberal caste. If any of that stuff was real, then we wouldn’t be living in the world we in fact are living in, would we? Of course not.
I know I know, it’s “structural racism” & all the rest of the latest buzz-words generated by the egghead set that is the problem. Well, at least you liberals are finally getting around to directly blaming white people, specifically white men, for all your black disfunction as it makes it much easier to challenge. the end-game is nigh.
If they no longer teach cursive how in the Sam Hell does a person sign their name?
X
🙂
XX xx. The first two exes are the name. The two smaller ones stand for M.D.
.
We agree at last.
My nephew does a scrawl-print.
I fully agree that cursive writing helps children form their own self identity & spectrum of creativity. That creativity is dangerous to authority is precisely why the establishment does not want cursive writing to be taught in the classroom anymore. They collectively perceive another generational coup not unlike the 60s if they allow the automatons en masse to perceive their own individuality & personality/persona.
Enlightenment is dangerous stuff, eh.
RW
Bingo!
Remember to that cursive matures the mind into a smooth thinking flow instead of a staccato form that printing produces. I wonder.
Is cursive right brained and printing left brained? Maybe that is why the creative elements of our society have disappeared?
Orwellian groupthink has outlawed opposition in all manner a facet of cognition unless it is rule abiding & conforms to authoritarian dictates de jour.
Democrat & Republican groupthink is prevalent most assuredly in contemporary times & electioneering. The ‘party line’ must be well heeled & towed to extreme as Orwell characterized most aptly in Nineteen Eighty Four.
If cursive writing facilitates creativity & the power behind personality & self with respect to political empowerment the establishment types [i.e. Functional Automatons of government]
will want that sort of instruction banished from existence forevermore lest non-conformity & Communism take root to topple so-called ‘Free Market Capitalism’ which is totalitarian in scope when money & assets are concentrated in so few hands of oligopolistic proportion as is the case today with the duopoly of Democrat vs. Republican dialectical materialism.
The Hegelian Death Spiral downwards on metrics & markets is synonymous with the decoupling of equilibrium that Professor Emeritus Benoit Mandelbrot hypothesized just before he died & went to Mathematics heaven.
RW
Cursive writing was as much of an art form as it was a communication device. It was an impressive expression of individualism, the enemy of those who need to control everything, and therefor removed. While I was never very good at it and I personally abandoned it long ago for an architectural form of printed script (instilled upon me by years on the drawing board before AutoCAD) I love it whenever I see those who still can utilize it. Why a picture of a soup can may be consider art of the highest form and cursive writing is shunned by our society baffles me, but then chaos and collapse are the rule of the day aren’t they?
Six Sigma events in the universe of possible & probable events enveloped within systemic control structures like Interest Rates & Debt-to-GDP limits when based upon Fractional Reserve Banking logic are indeed subject to occurrence if the Neoclassical Economic Theory accounts for Debt, Currency, and Deflation whereas in our current modeled system there is no base account for the limits that debt places on consumer ability to consume more debt.
Banks don’t want academics to talk about debt so that few in the population understand the limits of borrowing at the level of personal consumption or collective consumption. Their modus operandi is to get us to borrow intractable debt at intractable limits based upon their short-term view of markets in a financialized 24/7 corporate banking REPO Market for overnight loans at discount.
Corporate borrowers can park their dollars overnight to collect better Interest margin whereas personal individuals have to pay tax at a higher rate than corporate borrowers too.
Chaos for the many that will collapse but it will undoubtedly not be the wealth extracting class that were be touched by the conflagrations that will most assuredly ensue given Central Bank Interest Rates & the lower bound that is rendering even more chaos as they drop Interest Rates even more.
The pendulum of what’s governed as ‘truth’ always swings to be sure. I, for one, don’t think it can swing any farther towards the right-of-center politics or Finance in the future lest we experience yet one more Six Sigma event like 08.
RW
The fact that Americans have allowed themselves to consider debt as income guarantees that fact that sooner or later they will succumb to total loss and/or repossession.
how in the Sam Hell – stelmo
==========
I hope I don’t get my ass in trouble for this but………..
the expression is Sam Hill.
On the economic front seeing more articles like this one:
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/why-the-coming-recession-could-force-the-federal-reserve-to-swap-greenbacks-for-digital-dollars-2019-09-06?siteid=yhoof2&yptr=yahoo
Why the coming recession could force the Federal Reserve to swap greenbacks for digital dollars
“The debate isn’t about whether we need [a digital currency],” Michael Bordo, an economist at Rutgers University and a fellow at the Hoover Institution, the public-policy think tank at Stanford University, told MarketWatch. “It’s about how you do it.”
xxxx
True funny money is just around the corner…
Think about this in the mindset that Jim discusses this week and throw in the “cancel culture” and imagine having your net worth erased at the push of a button because you just don’t think “right”
Bullseye this morning, Mr. Kunstler. My English teachers insisted on sentences with subjects, verbs, and predicates. Even more useful were my older siblings who pounced on grammatical errors with harsh rebuke. Americans have become an inarticulate lot, and oddly proud of it. “We don’t need no book learnin’—we got Walmart and the goodest nukes.”
Bigly yuuuge, nukes, yup!
RW
It ain’t just Americans. Here in Germany, lots of folks older than Generation X also speak quite poorly. German grammar is much harder of course, but I find myself embarrassed for them and German is my second language.
Our language is changing, devolving, becoming more colloquial and dependent on context for meaning. For example, trespassing isn’t just something someone does. It’s also what the police or security do against the trespasser. Thus if you have someone “trespassed out”, that means they can no longer come in. Thus the words charged with or prosecuted for are no longer necessary. “Trespassed out” is used instead in popular parlance at least. Soon the old words will seem utterly archaic, like powdered judicial wigs or something.
They still wear the powdered wigs in the House of Lords I’m sure.
RW
Don’t be, Robert (sure, I mean). 🙂
https://www.ft.com/__origami/service/image/v2/images/raw/http%3A%2F%2Fcom.ft.imagepublish.upp-prod-us.s3.amazonaws.com%2F88ac43bc-56cf-11e9-8b71-f5b0066105fe?fit=scale-down&source=next&width=700
You may be thinking of the judiciary. And they’re probably not powdered.
Many of the Lords are not hereditary peers, but mere mortals who used to sit in the House of Commons.
I was unaware of the mere mortal status of the cohort. I do follow Lord of Cross Harbor Sir. Conrad Black on National Post.
The silver haired ladies & gents can certainly represent the contemporary form of powdered wigs in the grouping that are sitting in the house currently.
Blue hair would count for one powdered wig, methinks.
😉
RW
…and been promoted to their level of incompetence?
“The silver haired ladies & gents”
Yes, it does have the look of a departure lounge of some sort, doesn’t it?
Once on the Upper East Side crosstown 86 Street bus as black teens were getting on after school, I overheard them talk that fractured ebonic. It occurred to me that language is self correcting; after you hear something pronounced correctly which you have been mangling, you automatically correct it.
These kids ‘chose’ to speak that way. And still do.
The smart ones can do both, speak correct English when needed and revert to ebonics with their homies. The dumb ones don’t care.
The thing with the ebonics, when I first started hearing about it, that this was their natural tongue or something like that, I wondered how that could be, as I sat right across from their parents in class, and their parents spoke pretty much the same English I spoke.
@Beryl of Oyl…
in Popeye’s dreams…
~ { Bare Olive Oil } ~
oronyms.
a Black Hawk for Mike Hunt
~toktomi~
Yes, it’s a rebellion against Whites. They don’t really want to join our culture or assimilate. Liberal Whites have to stop and listen for a change, really listen. And stop trying to foist the different races on each other since that is deeply resented by all sides.
These kids ‘chose’ to speak that way. And still do. – Luhrenloup
=================
I used to wonder why blacks speak the way they do. Do they NOT speak standard American English because they CAN’T or because they WON’T? Well, I have concluded, as you have, that they choose to speak that way. They haven’t gotten over the slavery that their ancestors endured and there is no way in hell that they are going to assimilate into the greater culture of their ancestor’s oppressors and their descendants, i.e. you and me.
Picture this, a young Chinese couple arrives in the US barely able to speak a few words in English. They produce a child. They and the child speak mostly Chinese at home. By the time that child is 10 years old he or she speaks SAE (Standard American English) indistinguishable from you or I. Conversely, a 10 year old black child whose background extends as much as 400 years in this country, speaks a language we call Ebonics that is often incomprehensible to the non-black population.
If you can’t, but really want to, then you can
All the late Soviet elite worshiped the United States as an idol, and tried to transfer everything on to the Russian soil, whatever it was.
But the problem is that the American education system in modern Russia cannot take root in any way.
First of all, because the American education system is not self-sufficient and in no way ensured that remarkable scientific and technological progress that happened in the USA in the 20th century.
Moreover, this education system is undoubtedly responsible for the terrible cultural and economic crisis that the United States is currently experiencing and which it exports to all other countries of Pax Americana.
From some point of view, the education system in the USA is simply not there, and students are trained by the same methods as the dogs in the circus.
This is what is called “training”.
I must say that in this way trained specialists are perfectly able to cope with any problems that their preparation allows to solve.
But they simply do not know how to look for problems in the existing system of knowledge, to critically rethink it. These shortcomings are covered by a continuous influx of brains from Europe, shaken by wars and revolutions, minds created by another tradition and a different educational system – “If somebody is the best, we bring him to America.”
European geniuses in the USA get great opportunities for the manifestation of their talents, almost unlimited financial and material resources for introducing their ideas, greedy for new technologies venture capital, American inventive genius and remarkably trained specialists, who are ready to immediately pick up these ideas and bring them to serial production.
This system worked for a long time, but recently it began to fail. After the victory in the Cold War, the Americans imagined that they no longer needed anyone and fallen into frenzied nationalism. First, they ceased to trust European specialists, using them as a rule only in auxiliary work.
Secondly, the United States, seeking to strengthen its cultural influence, began to export its educational methods to the conquered European countries that somehow got into Pax Americana, which severely undermined the sources of brain imports.
In particular, this influence manifested itself already in the late USSR, when under the influence of the USA, who managed to brainwash the late Soviet nomenclatura, the requirements for candidate and doctoral dissertations began to change.
If in Stalin’s time and up to the 70s, the candidate dissertation suggested a significant factor of novelty, and the doctoral creation of a new scientific direction, then in the late 70s and 80s these requirements gradually transformed for a candidate degree into a purely qualifying ability to demonstrate the presence of a certain level of knowledge, and for a doctoral ability to compile and write monographs.
Despite the fact that these negative processes undoubtedly contributed to the slowdown of scientific and technological progress and the crisis of the scientific method on the planetary scale, they simultaneously contributed to the strengthening of the relative power of the United States by weakening geopolitical competitors, which created the effect of positive feedback and the deepening crisis.
From some point of view, the education system in the USA is simply not there, and students are trained by the same methods as the dogs in the circus.
This is what is called “training”.
Looks like your recent brain fog has cleared today, as you’re making good sense here. Of course a certain Zionist influence might have played a part in the planned cultural dumbing down as well – what with we Gentile ‘Muricans being mere cattle and all that – but I wouldn’t expect you to admit to any of that here.
See now what you can do when you just put that pipe down for a bit, you old Russian goat?
The other day, a Zionist stole my wallet.
Here’s a remedy:
birth control or less stipends for those creating more humans, most of them members of the lowest breeding.
If not: vouchers.
Private schools CAN have standards.
I have often wondered why certain groups have education expectations for their kids and others do not. A good current example is the influx of illegals from Latin countries that do not have the inclination to place education as no. 1 priority for their kids.
Then it dawned on me. We have two major groups here right now. Those who come here to assimilate into the American culture and those who come here to change the American culture to their culture. Our country is being split apart by more and more wanting to convert us to them. And yes. The Liberal side in their effort to disassemble the USA, favor and encourage the legal and illegal immigration of the non-assimilators.
My point, education wise, is that non-assimilators want no part of our language or our history, civics, or culture. They enclave themselves, work in lower class jobs, listen to their own cultural BS, and most importantly, do not encourage their kids to excel in OUR education system.
Asians and Whites, (not all), seem to know the values of a solid education and adapt well into our society. Latinos, Blacks, Middle Easterners, (not all), have ethnocentrism as a core to their belief system. Each have organizations (CAIR, NAACP, La Raza) to progress their own cultures here rather than assimilate into the American culture.
The Neo-Libs know this and use it to help maintain power. Their liberal takeover of the public education system over the last fifty years is mind boggling. Their encouragement of the stupidification process has been so successful and hidden, that it has not been even apparent until the last twenty years or so. Now it is in snowball mode and it is hurting this country severely.
Each generation of teachers is dumber than the last. And more leftist brainwashed. I do not see a solution to this as it is ingrained in the process. Recent changes, Montessori, private schools, charter schools are showing up to try to raise the level of education but are being beat back by Leftist overpowerment. The Left wants no part of an educated public.
BTW, Ebonics is just a language way for the Blacks to separate themselves from the American culture.
The biggest success of the Left is when they enabled multiple languages in the public place and the schools. All in the name of PC. The country has been sub-dividing itself ever since.
“If some Kleagle of the Ku Klux Klan wanted to devise an educational curriculum for the specific purpose of handicapping and disabling black Americans, he would not be likely to come up with anything more diabolically effective than Afrocentrism.” – Arthur M. Schlesinger, Jr., 1992
http://movies2.nytimes.com/books/00/11/26/specials/schlesinger-disuniting.html
While Conservatives where changing America in order to enrich themselves, the Liberals played the long game by indoctrinating our kids. They’ve won, naturally. Now what are they going to do with it besides continue the process of destruction that both sides have contributed to?
Nothing it seems. That’s it. That’s the goal. The shining City on a Hill is just a hilltop Ghetto or Barrio. If they can only get rid of Whites it will all work out though, somehow…..
Knowing a little bit about the NYC public schools myself, one thing I know is that some immigrant groups do surprisingly well in the “bad” public schools.
The same schools where the black and ‘hispanic’ children can’t learn because of “institutionalized racism” or something.
I also know that some of the miigrant groups, most notably some of the Asian ones, eschew the ESL classes as they don’t want their children to waste the value of a free public education, being stuck at the bottom rung.
Mr. de Blasio bemoans the fact that not “enough’ kids of certain demographics apply to the special schools, not that they are excluded.
He could have forced his own damn kids to attend those schools, to even things up; but no, he would rather ruin it for everybody else than admit that some kids just don’t have the interest, and it has nothing to do with racism or segregation.
Someone I know quite well attended Bronx Science, despite being bi-racial like de Blasio’s kids.
In trying to figure out what made him different from the average black student, I realized that both his parents were immigrants. Neither had any idea that science and technology were off limits to African Americans, because they weren’t African American.
BTW, when we are talking about kids for whom learning English is supposed to be such an onerous burden that they can’t be expected to master it in twelve grades, we are talking about the Spanish speakers.
The NYC school system routinely shunts kids with Spanish surnames into the ESL classes, even American born ones.
The special schools for the gifted and talented are not the only excellent NYC schools either.
Institutionalized racism?
The excuse for the Brown society to keep its own kids from assimilating. I will guarantee you, if they had their way, and the money, they would be segregating their kids in a reverse Jim Crow system and speaking their segregated languages in their schools.
Remember their goal, to disassemble this country.
Yes, Black Africa is a Powerhouse of Science and Research. The Truth is being kept from Americans by the Nazi owned Media.
The NY Post does a pretty good job covering what’s going in the NY school system. The problem in NY is that there aren’t enough white kids to go around, only 15% of the total, and most of them are in the gifted program. This is what concerns School Chancellor Richard Carranza, a proud Mexican-American, whose only explanation for such a state of affairs is racism. He sees racism everywhere. His plan is not to abolish the program but to open it up for everybody by eliminating testing to get in, with emphasis on enrolling black and hispanics. This seems to be at the direction of the mayor, who sees racism everywhere too. Of course if the program is opened up to all applicants it would be ‘gifted’ in name only, and would resemble the rest of the dysfunctional schools in the city. The upshot of this racial gerrymandering will most likely be white families will either place their kids in private schools, or move out of the city altogether. Instead of the public schools being 15% white, they will be 0% white.
Whatever I said about the white families above also goes for Asian families. They won’t be hanging around either.
Brh
His description of racism being omnipresent is true. It comes from the households.
Desegregation of the school system will accomplish the socialization of the system. Gee, I wonder who would like that.
Desegregation would work, but under one way. Meritocracy, good students, whatever color or creed, excel and progress. The remainder fail, are allowed to fail, and then remedially worked with. The current method of passing failures along is insanity.
They end up on the street.
Back in the 90’s, my elderly mother and I drove to the NYC, where she grew up. She wanted to see her old neighborhood and visit Julia Richmond High School, the public school she graduated from. After we gain permission to enter the school we had to pass through a metal detector and were required to have an escort because we wouldn’t be safe on our own and could have been assaulted.
That was an educational experience. I wonder if it’s changed?
Great piece, Jim. Thanks for the details of your childhood. It’s inspiring!
Yeah, for a kid pretty much left to his own devices on the streets of NYC, I think JHK turned out OK.
I think IQ has something to do with it.
BRH
Yeah, & Deblasio wants to eliminate G & T. Ho-hum, what else is new in the USSA?
Just Ok? Heresy. Get him boys! Or rather, Get him, boys. For all his many sins, I will not lay that one at this Yankee’s door.
All hail the Comma! Benr, take notice! Please!!!
Ultimate gamma male comment. And max. irony points for unnecessary capitalization.
Winnar. Winnar.
Do they still teach how to diagram a sentence in grade school? It didn’t seem to help a lot of people even back in the day. Those who ‘got it’, got it. Those who didn’t, didn’t. There was no teaching involved, just demonstration.
As bad as you think it is, it is worse than you imagine. Across the land teachers are inept, incompetent and many cannot pass basic exams in their subject matter. “Those who can’t, teach.” We need to be recruiting the best and brightest out of Hong Kong before the commies pick them up with a final solution in mind. One wonders how many medical schools are allowing “lessers” to enroll and are kept there with “special” strategies. Or, maybe in engineering. Does it really matter if Little Johnny doesn’t quite get calculus? I’m sure Boeing has an outreach program to pull him into the business despite shortcomings. As for NYC, let’s blow the bridges and let the island sort out things for themselves. Not sure how one handles Chicago, Portland, San Francisco, LA or Baltimore or Flint, or DC, or Philadelphia, or Atlanta, or Birmingham, or Houston, or, or, or…
Doomed people.
Thinking back on my own days, we started out with around 80 kids in the whole 1st grade, many of us related.
We graduated 12 years later with the same 80 kids, give or take 2 or 3.
I marvel at how stable our lives were back then.
Brh
Yes, think of the sacrifice though: people who bored or even hated each other had to stay together for the sake of propriety or the kids.
As one Jap said to a visitor: it looks effortless to you, just like ducks gliding thru the water. But you have no idea how fast we are peddling.
There were a few divorces, not many.
paddling not peddling.
It will be interesting to ask the question what value and status the English language will have left, come the Long Emergency. As I see it, the many advantages which come with a mastery of the language will evaporate into nothingness, because too many of the avenues to wealth and prestige which require the mastery of this language as a sine qua non are predicated on a way of running things which can be sustained only by an endless supply of cheap fossil fuel. So once (what remains of) humanity reverts to a pre-industrial way of life, no one else besides the native users of the language themselves will bother to learn the language anymore. English will become a provincial language like any other. Frankly, even among the English-speaking peoples themselves the vast majority are likely to more preoccupied with putting food on the table than with Milton and Shakespeare. Few will be left who will still have the leisure to indulge in such things. There will be several thousand (if not several million) Eliza Doolittles for every Henry Higgins.
Contemporary populist retort would likely be that neither Milton or Shakespeare have their pictures on bubble gum cards [see Charlie Brown’s Christmas] and therefore would not be applicable as referents of literary scholarship.
Scholarship & tertiary Education are currently oxymoronic when it comes to attainment of knowledge for knowledge sake. Academia is a commoditized pursuit that is quantified solely via ROI & federal government financial rebate to institutions governed to teach at the tertiary, secondary, or primary levels.
RW
Yes give us Barrabas. Milton Berle not Milton. Shaka Zulu not Shakespeare.
O Magoo (Magog?), you’ve done it again.
“Yes give us Barrabas. Milton Berle not Milton. Shaka Zulu not Shakespeare. ”
Janos,
Yeah, so that we might know them.
That’s funny.
Sextus Empiricus or Protagoras would be a more apt description of my words & intent, Janos. Milton only has reference to contemporary culture through the Animal House flick, and Berle’s last film was It’s a Mad Mad Mad Mad World produced in 1963.
The evolution of tertiary education since the Reagan era of Neoconservativism & Neoliberal Economic Theory of the Chicago School of Economics ushered in Keynesian Economic rule of unchecked deficit spendthrift behaviour of governance we have evidenced short-term investment demand of university courses that have demonstrated financial payoffs for students that enroll in the courses.
The middle class cohorts of up & coming students cannot afford to make choices in terms of their education that will not pay off investment wise in the future. Previous generations could hazard the payoff & bankroll the loss but the current investment culture & climate is to yield a financial payout upon graduation.
Theology degrees do not yield the bucks, Buckaroo. Philosophy boils down to Sextus Empiricus and not Barrabas.
Get real, eh.
RW
I remember an old SF novel called ‘Earth Abides’ where a plague wipes out most people except this one geologist who is up in the mountains with his rock hammer. He comes back to civilization to find it gone. At the end his hammer has become a cult object. Good reading, but I forget the name of the author.
The author is George Stewart. The interesting thing is that the geologists hammer gained in fame, and the wielder was looked up to as a leader. It was the author’s way of showing how myths develop. Good book.
George Stewart in his novel “Earth Abides” illustrates this devolution quite effectively.
Lol, guess I should have refreshed before commenting, youze guys beat me to it.
Ultimately, desegregation of the public schools cannot work in America, or anywhere else where you have stark differences in culture/innate abilities, because the intellectual cream always rises to the top, & that is always disproportionately non-black, non-hispanic. And that result inevitably incites envy. If we could eliminate envy, then we’d be scot-free, LOL.
Yes, all men, or should I say all humans are not created equally as stated in the Constitution. Rather, we are or were committed to offering them equal opportunities. The system certainly has not done that, but even if it did, equal results could only be the pipedream of those that live in alternate realities. How our society was supposed to deal with the resulting inequalities, well don’t ask me, I got no answer.
Was it stated in the Constitution? That comes as news to me. Thomas Jefferson said something about it in the Declaration of Independence, but that was his sloppy adaptation of the statement in the Virginia Declaration of Rights that “all men are by nature equally free & independent.”
Of course we are all created equally! Mr. Sperm meets Miss Egg.
baby results. but not all sperms are equal….
Yes, I stand corrected, it was the D of I, thank you for the clarification.
I believe, Mr. B, that the equality referred to in the Constitution was referring to people’s legal rights, and their human rights. Of course that didn’t apply to slaves, because as everybody knew, they weren’t really people.
My wife teaches at an elementary school. where, often, many of her students, who already have difficulty with grade level reading, math and writing, come to school with their eyes half open and ask if they can nap at their desks. When she asks them the reason for their fatigue, they often say that they were up late playing Fortnite or other video games.This isn’t suprising because this generation has had a screen in front of their face since birth.
Meanwhile, with Identity Politics ruling the day, the Asian-American kids, who work outwork their peers, need to be checked at the gate, otherwise, they would comprise most of the incoming freshmen class at the Ivies, UCal, Stanford, MIT, etc. So say the elite and their henchmen, the unelected social engineers and gatekeepers..
In the good ole USA, meritocracy isn’t dead, because it never really existed (Bonesman Geore W at Harvard?). This explains the audaciuosness of the rich and famous when trying to get their stupid progeny into elite institutions. Even with Identity Politics and the self-serving elitist roadblocks in their way, these kids can’t be stopped.
Watch the Spelling Bee or International Math or Robotics Competition sometime!
Yeah, wow gee whiz, If we had only gone Asian back in the 1800’s just think of how great America would be now!
It’s like I said before, it’s the parent’s responsibility to transmit the requirements to their children that society expects of them. Self discipline, literacy, how to think, the necessity of work, kindness towards kids (not to be confused with tough love, also necessary) in short, how to be good people.
The description of your NYC education was great. There is a bit of a problem with the political argument you make, though: deBlasio has not actually advocated doing away with G&T. It was a recommendation from an advisory panel, and while it’s possible deBlasio and Carranza will take up the suggestion, the odds are likely against it. In case anyone cares.
There’s a whole other thing going on here. My people are French Canadian. When I was growing up in Lewiston Maine the town was 70% French. The language was spoken everywhere, the restaurants, city hall, grocery stores, professional offices. The ruling class was what we referred to as “the blue nose Yankees,” or more politely as Anglos. They were WASP’s.
Coming home from some school event, I was given a ride by my little friend’s (I was 6) family; yes, WASP’s. It was my first experience with what I was later to label, “Americans.” I thought these people very strange, somehow retarded. The grown-ups spoke inanities, greeted each other as if they were strangers. Bizarre, I thought. But why, my people coming from European stock, were not so different after all?
The culture in America, because of its many races, cultures, has been reduced to a melting pot of vapidity, or as Donald would say, politically correct. I say thank god we are moving beyond it.
If I thought the dominant culture was bizarre, you can imagine what a person whose roots are from the continent of Africa makes of dominant American culture. One wants to protect one’s inner truth, one’s reality. And we do that, as I’ve pointed out above, by developing a double consciousness, acting one way with some folks, and then another way with others.
Some people say, no, I won’t do that! What you have to offer doesn’t tempt me.Take me as I am.
Lewiston, Maine
Isn’t that the city where the State Dept shipped thousands of Somali tribesmen? If so, how has it played out? In the first place those winters in central Maine would crush an Eskimo.
Brh
yes, and it hasn’t helped Lewiston at all. Placing the refugees who get quite a bit of help among the working poor is not the brightest move.
Go back to France then, and become a dhimmi. Or if you’re willing to wait a bit longer, Quebec will suffice for the same thing.
Oh Janos! Did I say I was unhappy here? I’m merely stating facts. I don’t deny them; I don’t rage against them. It’s what’s happening. Is it right, is it wrong; I leave that to others to decide. We all have our particular path to travel, I am thankful mine has been rich with interesting turns, and conundrums, and even the painful ones that have made me strong and multifaceted.
The French are doomed. Do you even care? Or have you no loyalty to them either?
Read Camp of the Saints by Jean Raspail and tell me what you think. The man was a Prophet. One morning he went down to the beach for his walk and he “saw” them in his mind’s eye.
People in different European Cities report that one day the Muslims simply appeared in their public squares. Really not just in their mind’s eye.
Raspail is what the Koran calls a “Warner”, much as Jonah or Noah were.
I would call Raspail a Cassandra, because he warns of disaster, or predicts doom. Cassandras are not usually held in high regard. Not that they are disbelieved, but because of the unfortunate fact that no one wants to face a hard truth. Kinda like climate change, y’know? What did Gore call it? Oh yeah, “An inconvenient truth.”
Here’s what I’m able to get a hold of through inter-library loan:
Welcome Honorable People, published in 1960
Who Will Remember The People, 1988
Blue Island, 1991
which do you recommend?
The fiends have suppressed it, obviously. You’re going have to buy it. Amazon has probably banned it too, but there are other venues – like Book Finder, Barnes and Noble, Good Will Books, etc.
“The fiends have suppressed it, obviously. You’re going have to buy it. Amazon has probably banned it too”
Why do you persist in your dishonest paranoia?
There it is, on Amazon. In French, so Luhrenloup can read it in her native language.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Camp-Saints-Jean-Raspail/dp/2221123964/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=camp+of+the+saints&qid=1568218136&s=gateway&sr=8-1
And in English for those who can’t manage the original.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Camp-Saints-Jean-Raspail-ebook/dp/B00QKNDV9S/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=camp+of+the+saints&qid=1568218248&s=gateway&sr=8-2
I prefer not to promote Amazon, but I prefer even more to respond to spreaders of disinformation.
Janos
You bust people’s balls just for the sake of it.
The man has probably never been to France and his family has most likely been in N America for 350 years. He lives in Maine for krissake. What the hell does he have to do with France?
In some of Jack Kerouac’s books he says much the same thing as Luhrenloup is saying here.
Brh
I believe the Coneheads would say much the same thing, and they come from France as well.
Kerouac was a French Canadian like our friend Luhrenloup here, grew up in a French speaking neighborhood in Lowell, Mass, spoke French at home and didn’t learn English until he got to 1st grade.
What I like about Kerouac is that he wasn’t always hammering the country, didn’t sympathize with communist countries like a lot of writers and intellectuals did back then, and, like John Steinbeck and John Dos Passos, generally supported US efforts in Viet Nam. (Besides writing some good books)
Brh
Veldar used the cover of France as his birthplace when questioned under duress. Terrestrial Coneheads originated in the USA if the script was here to verify, methinks.
Veldar’s progeny was hot too.
RW
You’ve admitted that this treatment is making you better, stronger, faster. Just like your drill Sarge. Would you deny this benefit to
Lupgarou?
Kerouac was a fucking American Patriot, much to the amusement and disgust of the other Beats.
“Go back to France then…”
Ya, he really wrote that.
Let’s save it for his headstone.
Okay, I think that we are done here. Have a ball, y’all!
~toktomi~
Lafayette, I am here. I’m fighting for the real France, the Eldest Daughter of the Church.
Believe it or not, the much hated AR-15 rifle was developed in Hollywood, LA, California, in a little company called Armalite, a subsidiary of Fairchild Aircraft Company. The American assault rifle comes from Hollywood, ha!
Speaking of LA, with millions of rats living on the streets amidst tens of thousands of vagrants, fears of typhoid fever and bubonic plague epidemics, yes, but now leprosy outbreaks are being spoken of too. LA has gone medieval.
Governor Newsom and Mayor Garcetti can add leprosy to their resumes in any future presidential run.
Brh
“Speaking of LA, with millions of rats living on the streets amidst tens of thousands of vagrants, fears of typhoid fever and bubonic plague epidemics, yes, but now leprosy outbreaks are being spoken of too”
BRH,
I fear for the rats. They are not being served up positive examples. I fear the rats will soon become indolent, taken to crapping in the streets and homosexual behavior.
Add to the issue that rats do rarely have positive male presence in their nests…raised by their mothers with little adult-male input.
Trump to the Bahamians: Come on in, Boys. But none of those fake Bahamians or a few bad apples. So how many are left? A mere two hundred thousand, perhaps?
Didn’t they use to be part of the Commonwealth? Shouldn’t they be going to Canada or Britain? Why do we always get all the enrichment?
You lost the plot. Again.
There
Is
No
We
“…there is no ‘we'” – particularly so when Janos is spouting forth.
” For years, lawmakers in deeply blue, proudly progressive New York City have grappled with a seemingly intractable problem: Its schools are among the most segregated in the nation. ”
Who would have thought that the schools originally presumably set up for the benefit of the working class , have subsequently pretty consistently proven to nickle – and – dime the working class ?
While the well – to – do basically get the same deal as before , only now with subsidies —- said subsidies at least in part coming out of the pockets of the working class ?
For …. well …. for forever , parents either home – schooled their kids , hired private tutors , or sent them to private schools.
Of course , this was true primarily of parents who were already pretty well set up , already white collar.
this circumstance was most telling in college.
College was little more than finishing school for the already predictably successful.
At least 90% of any college graduating class consisted of the ALREADY well – to – do , the ALREADY entitled , the ALREADY connected , the ALREADY wired in.
Given that , what did a college degree really demonstrate ?
It demonstrated only that if you de – legitimize one scheme of subordination , you only very soon replace it with another , more likely worse , scheme of subordination .
Likely worse , because it is more obliquely dishonest , less obvious or frank.
College degrees were titles of nobility ( which , by the way , by the late Middle Ages at least , were also purchasable. )
by another name.
” …. meritocracy isn’t dead, because it never really existed (Bonesman Geore W at Harvard?). ”
And so it has been a hundred different times , in a hundred different ways .
You will not get equality , peasant.
You will get the rhetoric of equality , which might end up enslaving you worse than blunt tyranny ever did.
The cuckservative cop-out “Build your own platform” has turned into “build your own web hosting,” “build your own servers,” and “build your own banking system.”
Will this end with “build your own country”?
— James Kirkpatrick
Hopefully ,
Yes.
…And learn to code goddamnit!
It’s gone terminal at ‘build your own Wall ‘
“Me Tarzan.”
Who taught Tarzan English? Tarzan’s pronunciation is ok, but his grammar is atrocious.
Didn’t Jane teach Tarzan English? Was Jane trying to dumb Tarzan down in order to belittle Tarzan and to control him?
Chita taught Tarzan the English language before Tarzan could figure out that Jane was going to control him & his life’s work in the jungle with her use of the English language.
Chita neglected to read Theology before teaching Tarzan English.
RW
Bingo.
Cheetah bit me whenever he could. The [Tarzan movie] apes were all homosexuals, eager to wrap their paws around Johnny Weismuller’s thighs. They were jealous of me, and I loathed them.
Maureen O’Sullivan [played ‘Jane’]
However, anyone with any ability to even slightly critically observe can come to the conclusion that the main reason for the total failure of the educational systems of today is shitty parents.
Surely Alfred Kinsey and Adolf Hitler would agree , and I suppose a great many others have forgotten , overlooked , or overtly discarded the basic truth of the concept of original sin , in the wake of such lights as these ?
Anyway , I say this is otherwise bullshit.
Distracted, uninvolved, self-centered, you can have it all parents ARE CLEARLY THE CRUMBLED FOUNDATION THAT THE SYSTEM IS BUILT UPON .
( Emphasis added )
— And the above is true.
From the state ( quite late in the day by the way ) getting into the education business , supposedly for the benefit of the people and the kiddies ,
to social workers and physicians bound by no professional ethic of confidentiality , or moral seal of the confessional , but instead obliged by law to serve as police informants ,
to a never – ending parade of TV shows , overtly presented as entertainment , but not at all subtly consistently trotting out the theme that if you do not subscribe to the world view presented then you are nothing less than deviant and a general threat ,
Parents and family units today possess NO MORE authority than that which they can BUY.
This is by design.
And all and sundry , on the right as well as the left , no less in the USA than in the DDR ,
will say this has been for the sake of a virtue.
A God damned lie.
It has been for the sake of power , for the sake of control.
Shitty parents are the natural and unavoidable consequence .
You cannot have responsibility without authority.
Period.
Call it whatever you may , to give someone responsibility , but without the authority that necessarily must go with it , is chattel slavery.
” Kesa,
You neglect to consider prioritization…resource allocation is not necessarily a high priority to feed and house populations, resources that can command their obedience, however, are a government priority…a primary one. ”
I think the contrary , not least because I was specifically thinking of the circumstance of the German 6th Army at Stalingrad when I wrote that essay.
Surely Germany had a quite compelling interest in keeping the 6th Army adequately supplied with manpower , petrol , ammunition , and , yes , housing and food.
But that simply didn’t happen. Not because OKW or OKH were indifferent or incompetent.
But because the means simply were not there.
And after the Soviet offensive , once the 6th Army was enveloped and cut off —-
To this fucking day people bitch that Paulus should have ordered a break out , and was stupid not to.
( This ” logic ” drives me up the fucking wall. )
NONSENSE.
To organize an orderly retrograde movement of a division , let alone an entire army group , requires more than a few minutes or few hours preparation.
WITHIN 24 HOURS of encirclement the 6th Army simply no longer possessed enough petrol , lubricants , and spare parts to retreat 20 miles ,
much less to retreat 100 miles over open steppe during a blizzard to prepared defensive positions that didn’t exist anyway.
Paulus , and his 300,000 German and Romanian troops , WERE ….JUST ….. PLAIN ….. FUCKED.
Stalingrad was a rare example of unanimity .
The consensus opinion at OKW and OKH , — no , not just Hitler’s stubbornly stupid opinion this time — was that the 6th Army should hold in place.
Zeitzler Thought so. Manstein and Guderian Thought so. Richthofen thought so. Every fucking body thought so.
Yes , that meant doom . But , hopefully , a drawn-out doom , not an IMMEDIATE doom.
As it was , they managed to hold out a surprising four months , which was enough time to shore up the rest of the front.
( A front which , at the time of encirclement , had completely dissolved , for a distance of 600 miles ! )
Anyway , people think the state is a magical thing , possessed of a magic wand the ordinary Joe does not have.
More often than not , this is shear , unadulterated myth and fantasy.
” “You folks are not the prize you think you are.”
I don’t think we’re a prize at all. We’re a small post-imperial nation struggling to …… ”
I was talking about , “free” , ” democratic ” Westerners in general.
What a beautiful post Mr K. It’s breathtaking, yet not surprising, that the Social Justice true believers are shocked to learn that no one and nothing is safe or sacred when it comes to dismantling “white privilege”. I think there will be much more dismay to follow for our less melanated Social Justice true believers as they realize that not only their assets but also their livelihoods are on that redistribution for reparations menu. For so long they had hoped to escape the fate of their less fortunate brethren. But the hour draws near. Eventually, the price for the new Original Sin must be paid in full, before its abolished altogether of course.
Ah , one of my two favorite pieces of scripture ;
Recall the occasion when the rich young man came to Christ , and asked how he might more surely get into Heaven.
And Christ replied , ” Obey the commandments. ”
And the rich young man replied , ” I’m doing that. ”
So then Christ said , ” OK , give away all your wealth , and follow me. ”
At that the rich young man went away , and did not come back.
Now the Bible does not say so , but I suspect that it was not that the young man worried , ” If I give away my wealth , how will I pay the grocery bill tomorrow ? ”
For one thing , homeless ascetics who ate out of garbage cans or via random charity were a commonplace then , and not particularly stigmatized , but were even admired.
The mortal fear of being locked up for vagrancy was not quite then what it is now.
No , I suspect what he feared was losing the status.
I have long suspected that the money is not really the most important thing.
And those who preach egalitarianism will most often be the most wroth when they actually get it.
I agree with you Kesa. Though money, and the gain thereof, is quite often the means to status, the real thrill for many at the top appears to be the pure power and control they can exert. Basically that ability validates their status. Humans in reality have very little control over the world around them, or within them often times, so the need to attempt to exert control and influence is understandable to a point. They would have been better off being honest about their desires from the beginning. But embracing Social Justice as a means to power will only lift the status of those who can affect to be the most aggrieved victims. This is a natural death for those who have benefited from the existing power structures. That they don’t see this or don’t get it enough to know better just goes to show that those who appear wise are often fools.
” Why can’t you go back? I presume it relates to why you were there in the first place, but if you’ve stated your citizenship details it must have been one time I wasn’t here. ”
Loooonnnggg story.
Like my family is actually American . My father is a white Southerner , and my mother is a black Southerner.
As I understand it though , in the 1960’s interracial marriage was either flatly illegal in the Southern United States , or such a hassle as to be , in practice , impossible.
But then my parents met in Europe.
My mother was a rare bird for those days ;
— A college – educated Black.
— A college – educated Black female .
— A college – educated Black female engineer.
Given all of that , and the fact that my parents wound up on the other side of Iron Curtain for near fifteen years , you might assume they were Leftists ?
No , my parents would call themselves , ” conservatives. ”
But , really , more like anti – social right – wingers I would say.
For example , the first Presidential candidate my mother ever voted for was Barry Goldwater.
How they wound up in Eastern Europe was they were both engineers , and they went to work for a consortium of American power companies in Eastern Europe studying , and assisting in building , Eastern European power grids.
( One reason , right from the start , I took Western Cold War propaganda with a very large grain of salt ,
was because I didn’t have to read Encyclopedia Britannica articles , but knew first – hand and personally , that the Soviet’s Number One Sugar Daddy was its supposed Western adversaries. )
My parents won’t say so , But I surmise too that in the 1960’s being an interracial couple in America , in the South , was a decided negative.
But , likewise , at the time , being “conservative ” was no positive either. In those days , for example , Veterans coming back from Vietnam were at least stigmatized , or even openly spit upon.
So a double or triple negative. So I surmise they were at least subtly looking for an alternate place of residence.
And I think it no coincidence that when they did return to the United States it has always been to reside in the most remote , rural areas they can find.
The sort of places where you can drop your pants and urinate in your front yard , because only the trees and hedgehogs are present to see it or pass judgement on it.
Anyway , as I said , my family is American.
So no relatives , cousins , grandparents , no social support network , to go back to.
Secondly , and based not just on surmises , but on lived experience in this country subsequently ,
I doubt Merkel’s Germany is quite the same as the German Democratic Republic.
I grew up utterly hating , loathing , despising , and in no way trusting , West Germany , anyway.
And , indeed , I doubt , for that matter , that Germany is Germany.
The United States , after all , is not the United States.
The United States , for example , of 2019 , is a very different place from the United States of 1977.
In 1977 , many of the things I say now I would have myself in 1977 considered grossly negative , gross hyperbole .
That’s a long story itself . So I will proffer just one example .
I doubt the following popular song could even be written now , simply because the world view it expresses simply doesn’t exist , on either the right or the left ;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08QH3rVqokw
Oh , the feminist and sexual revolution rhetoric is alive and well.
But the BASIC , OFF-HAND IDEA , that how you raise your children is NO ONES God damned business but the parents ?
That would be an extremist idea now. Such an attitude would doubtless bring you under scrutiny.
And the practical reality of the law has for a very long time been , if not commonly previously in practice , that you are innocent until you are investigated.
As for 2019 — Well , I get the impression that I am quite the minority on Clusterfuck Nation in thinking that things are NOT really THAT bad.
For example , as I have said before , I suspect that , given this nations size , and population , 30 years of mass shootings might not add up to a single bad week in Syria ?
If you can’t necessarily believe positive propaganda , does it follow that you can necessarily believe negative propaganda ?
I sure have heard a lot of negative things about the German Democratic Republic that are plain horse shit.
I spent 25 years in North Carolina .
I have spent 13 years in Eastern Tennessee , part of the infamous Appalachia.
Notice that North Carolina and Tennessee are right next door to each other ? And part of the same country , and part of the South ?
So they must be very much alike ?
No , they are as different as night and day.
North Carolina has an economy that has been running red hot for 30 years or more now. It went from being a state no one ever heard of , to today a state Hollywood commonly chooses to go make movies in.
Eastern Tennessee is part of Appalachia , and all the stereotypes you may have heard about Appalachia are true ;
It is very poor , very corrupt , and backward generally.
But I came to East Tennessee voluntarily , by choice.
North Carolina today , generally , is a shit hole where everyone hates and mistrusts each other.
Wealth has not improved the place , but made it into a gilded Hell.
East Tennessee yet remains a bit like what was best in America in 1977.
For example , you leave your doors unlocked , and even your windows rolled down , when you park your car outside the grocery store , and you do that even after stuff has been stolen out of your car , Because after all , a few bad apples will exist even among the most decent of folk.
It’s a place where people commonly live in campers or in dirt – floored shacks. But , that also seems to mean that living in a camper or a dirt floored shack doesn’t make you total fucking dirt.
Wasn’t East Germany a police state ?
Wasn’t East Germany a Communist regime , an extreme Leftist regime ? Yes . They gave the Order of Karl Marx to Angela Davis for Christ’s sake.
Wasn’t it utterly hostile to Christianity ?
Yes , but then I wasn’t a Christian then , and it isn’t as if that is any sort of gold star on a resume here , now , today , either.
I was born in , and spent the first ten years of my life in , The German Democratic Republic.
The love of your childhood is unlike any love you ever have .
And I loved East Germany.
That’s one thing. Surely it is not rational to a large extent.
On the other hand , as I tried to convey above the differences between Tennessee and North Carolina , and between the United States in 1977 and in 2019 ,
Realities on the ground are often a far cry from seeming objective facts , and from voiced rhetoric’s or overt policies.
What’s the difference between East German and American police ?
Well , East German police dressed better. 😛
What’s a police state ?
After I got really sick of working at a sweat shop factory for wages that wouldn’t even pay rent , one of the things I tried was filling out a job application at Wal Mart.
Part of that job application was to fill out a psychological questionnaire.
Never , never , in ten years of life in the DDR , was I ever subjected to such a crass , insulting , degenerate indignity.
And nothing I did in three years as a call girl compared to that bluntly , cynically , manipulative and exploitative humiliation.
I filled out that questionnaire as insultingly as it merited . And to this day , Wal Mart can go fuck itself.
What , indeed , is a police state when people think shit like that is OK ?? !!
You write very well and express much wisdom. Looks like late night/early morning in the place to hang out here.
Thank you. I didn’t mean to pry – I thought previously that one of your parents might have been East German.
” Pardon the impertinence of asking, obviously, from a whore, fraud, condescending bitch, witch and species of reptile. ”
But all those things can still add up to an equal .
” But it’s always the same illogical, maniacal accusation, with the same demented insults, ….. ”
And as I have pointed out before , the magic wand of psychology is a thousand times more insulting , demeaning , dismissive , contemptuous.
It’s the pretense of a concern for human rights , when you don’t really give a quite fundamental fuck about human rights.
I can’t help your interpretations, Kesa. You consider that a person can’t give a fuck about human rights unless they believe in an afterlife, which is not a position that makes any sense to most people. People very clearly do care about human welfare and human rights without believing in an afterlife. You are, thankfully, not the arbiter of that truth, although you clearly do take yourself as such.
Your insults make you both pathetic and ignoble. You once weren’t a Christian – I once was (or thought I was). Presumably you thought you were a species of reptile for not believing – if so, fair play to you, but most people – including Christian people – don’t think like that.
It’s unfortunate that you believe anyone who doesn’t agree with your beliefs needs to be insulted. Psychology doesn’t need to be insulting, demeaning, dismissive or contemptuous – sometimes it provides insights and healing. But your view that you hold the truth only stands for you. If you look down your nose at those who don’t share your personal view of the truth, then you would qualify as a ‘condescending bitch’ as well. I prefer not to use the term but I certainly see that attitude in you.
I have no wish to convert anyone to my lack of theism – even most of my own family have no knowledge of my views. And, as with Q-Shtik, it’s a subject that practically never comes up in any context but this one, where a non-religious website has been commandeered to a large extent by proselytising Christians who talk incessantly about their beliefs and look down their nose at those who haven’t ‘seen their light’. Others are entitled to talk about theirs too, even if they’re going to be insulted for it.
This site has been commandeered by proselytizing Christians? Hmmm, I don’t get that sense at all. That would be an interesting analysis because I really doubt that claim. Perhaps the secular should not look down their noses either when hearing a viewpoint different from their own as well. Of course you don’t wish to convert anyone to your lack of theism. I assume that is because you are not completely convinced of it enough to energize you to proselytize. Fortunately for you, your opinions on the matter are the dominant opinions of the day that often rule with an iron fist. Can children read the Bible in Scottish classrooms or has the Bible been outlawed as hate speech? So I guess I can understand why you have a lack of enthusiasm for the worldview you have adopted.
“I don’t get that sense at all. “
Of course you don’t. If you ate garlic all the time, you wouldn’t smell it on other people either.
The secular don’t look down their noses (well some of them might, but so do you). At least you don’t seem to need to fling insults like Kesa – you settle for smugly telling people they can’t see the truth that you can see, but hopefully they will one day, which is par for the course with religious people. Fair enough.
Non-religious people would beg to point out that if people believe something for which there is no evidence, those people should perhaps be a bit more modest about talking about it as if it were self evident.
“I assume that is because you are not completely convinced of it enough to energize you to proselytize.”
You assume entirely wrongly. It is generally better to ask than to assume, although you and Janos so often prefer the second.
I choose not to proselytise about it because it’s not a belief system. It’s something that rarely gets mentioned by people who don’t hold to a theism of any kind because it’s not the point of their lives, which is generally to promote the welfare of their children and other family members, friends and others, and to generally take part in work, community and society in the way they see fit. Which might mean something entirely different for one non-theist than for another non-theist, because – I repeat – it isn’t a belief system. I don’t proselytise about not liking coffee either. I just get on with drinking tea.
“Can children read the Bible in Scottish classrooms or has the Bible been outlawed as hate speech?”
Where do you get this stuff from? Children here study Religious Education’ in secondary school. In that context they will study parts of the bible, parts of the Koran and parts of other religions. If they are from a religious Christian family they will go to Church and Sunday School, as my children did. School is for learning ABOUT religion, not for indoctrinating children into a religion, which is the job of the Church or mosque.
For you, the opposite of reading the Bible in class is outlawing it as hate speech. Either you are totally devoid of logical thinking or you have a post-graduate qualification in the manipulative use of speech.
So I guess I can understand why you have a lack of enthusiasm for the worldview you have adopted.
Clearly you haven’t. Because you still consider it a world view. I don’t have a lack of enthusiasm for not liking coffee either. I just don’t like coffee. But only a few people know that – family and friends who have repeatedly offered me coffee.
I mentioned to you before the former Episcopalian Bishop of Edinburgh, Richard Holloway. He is a quietly charming, deep-thinking family man who used to be the head of what is basically the Anglican Communion in Scotland. I never heard him preach but I went to a couple of his open talks, while he was still Bishop and I was still Christian.
After he resigned his post, because he found he could no long believe what he had preached all his life, he wrote a number of books. I read Looking into the distance – the human search for meaning, which is a short but beautifully written book.
I intend to read a few more from his writings:
Waiting for the Last Bus: Reflections on Life and Death;
Doubts and Loves: What is Left of Christianity;
Leaving Alexandria: A Memoir of Faith and Doubt;
A Little History of Religion;
Godless Morality;
On Forgiveness: How Can We Forgive the Unforgivable?.
Perhaps Kesa, if she met this gentle, thinking, sincere man, would call him a species of reptile to his face. Who knows?
I don’t imagine you’d ever read one of his books, but you’d be the better for it even though it would not change – and would not even aspire to changing – you basic beliefs. But it would add to your understanding, which is always a good thing.
I also choose not to proselytise about it because what people believe is their own business – I don’t ask them and they don’t ask me, on the whole. I make an except for what, I repeat, is an adult website where there is much discourse, from Christians, promoting Christianity and bewailing the fact that so many people don’t follow it. And that’s in a country where the vast majority of people- even ‘liberal’ people – claim to believe in a deity.
Regarding the Bible and hate speech, you would recall, if you cared to recall, that I told you my grandson’s school – like every other primary school in the country, I imagine, has a Christmas Carol service at the end of the autumn term. The littl’uns sing both religious and folk carols. And the Muslim kids sing ‘Away in a manger’ and ‘Little town of Bethlehem’ along with the rest, while their mums sit smiling proudly in the audience, sometimes wearing a hijab, just as often not.
Nobody gets in a fankle about it. Maybe in England it doesn’t work like that, but I’m glad it works like that here.
Sorry, some wrong bits got italicised in the post about Richard Holloway.
Over here, Atheists have churches, summer camps for kids, proslyetize, etc.
It may be different over there, but I wonder. You Alba obviously hate Christianity – just like most Atheists. As I have said before, agnosticism is the pov of the rational mind per se. You can’t prove God doesn’t exist. To use a mathematical analogy, Agnosticism is Zero, Atheism is in the negative numbers. If you were a ten as a Christian, you are now a ten or more as an Atheist, your rage or feelings of betrayal making you more devout in the negative than you ever were in the positive.
Note: Some people don’t find what they want in Christianity and go in search of Wisdom in the East. Perhaps they are more serious than you ever were?
“You Alba obviously hate Christianity ”
I don’t hate it in the slightest – stop talking nonsense. I get very annoyed at people who insist it’s it self-evidently true in terms of the metaphysics. It’s a belief, and people aren’t mad or malign for not believing it. Christian values, for the most part, are the same as mine – I just think they are human values. The ones that aren’t are the ones I disavow (like people being dispatched to hell for honest disbelief in the metaphysics, which is a sick idea).
Of course agnosticism is the POV of the rational mind. We just don’t use the same definition of agnostic. I used it to mean not believing something for which there is no evidence – you mean it as a halfway house between belief and disbelief. I don’t have a positive belief in there being no God – I think it is highly unlikely therefore I have a negative belief in theism, which makes me an non-theist. I think you mean what might be called a ‘positive atheist’, which is more along the lines of Richard Dawkins.
I have no rage in the matter, so don’t bother projecting your wishful thinking on to me.
“You can’t prove God doesn’t exist.’
Of course you can’t. That’s why I’m an agnostic and a non-theist. Not a ‘positive atheist’.
“Note: Some people don’t find what they want in Christianity and go in search of Wisdom in the East. Perhaps they are more serious than you ever were?”
I’m not into the shopping mall approach to religion. You can find your truth on your own doorstep or it’s not truth..
And I don’t go looking for ‘what I want’ in Christianity. Christianity was there, always. I found I didn’t believe in the metaphysics. End of.
You can’t decide whether you are an agnostic or an atheist. But at least you admit that Agnosticism is the rational pov and that your atheism is your prejudice or even your wish – the latter being bizarre in the extreme.
You refuse to understand the meanings of words because of your extreme biases. Witter away.
Janos
“You can’t decide whether you are an agnostic or an atheist.”
I have told you quite clearly what I am. I am both an agnostic AND a non-theist. I won’t use your word ‘atheist’ because you have chosen to use the more recent meaning it has acquired and I choose to use its older established meaning of being the opposite of a non-theist.
“But at least you admit that … your atheism is your prejudice or even your wish – the latter being bizarre in the extreme.””
I ‘admit’ no such nonsense. Your prejudices are your own, with the illogic they may necessarily entrain.
*the opposite of a theist*, sorry, with an entirely negative connotation, as opposed to ‘positive’ atheism, which I leave to others. Opting out rather than opting in.
Where can you say that I looked down my nose at anyone? Of course I will encourage others to believe what I do. What could be more natural for anyone if they feel that they sense the truth? And I just don’t see how telling someone that maybe one day they will understand is immodest or smug. I suppose that may come across when you cannot read my emotions with my words. But in no means do I intend smugness. I have seen people grow and change – in both directions. So I believe that people can change. So it is always possible that maybe one day you or anyone else may see something the way I do. There is also a chance that maybe one day I will see something the way you do too. I am not averse to reading literature that attempts to debunk or otherwise nullify Christianity. I have mentioned before that I read the Koran to understand Islam. I have also read about other religions and for heavens sake I dabbled in Wicca for several years myself. I am not a perfect Christian. I guess you must not get the sense that I struggle quite a bit but I do. Any Christian will tell you that its a day to day struggle, if you’re for real. Sometimes minute by minute depending on what you have going on. Anyhoo, I don’t disrespect your beliefs or discount your experience. I simply do not understand it as you don’t necessarily understand mine. When I told you that I have indeed experienced very real phenomena that I have no explanation for you told me that it was an issue of neurons firing or some sort of trick of the brain, etc. So that right there tells me you would never really believe me. Not that I expect people to. But if I give you the benefit of the doubt. Give me some benefit of the doubt. And I just really do have a hard time believing that it is so easy to discuss Christianity in Scottish schools but I will take your word for it. It is just very strange because as Janos points out we have very antagonistic and activist atheists who literally appear to be out to remove God and the Bible (only Christian symbols and sentiments by the way) from any and all public spaces, including schools. They are just now getting legal pushback because Christians have had enough and are lawyering up. That’s their only recourse in our legalistic system even though their is a Constitutional right to free speech and freedom of religion. I never would have thought Scotland was a beacon of freedom. Maybe you should provide us with asylum :-).
“I never would have thought Scotland was a beacon of freedom.”
I don’t know what you mean by that.
‘Schools’ here don’t have any animosity to Christianity – only individuals could, if they chose, have animosity to Christianity (and many individuals do, as a result of having it shoved down their throat for a lot of their life).
Scotland has an established church, although only a minority of people are regular attenders. When I was young, kids studied RE/RI, but parents always had the right to withdraw their children if they wished. I don’t know anyone who did – back in my day you didn’t even learn about other religions than Christianity at school. Now they’ve broadened the curriculum so that it’s not ‘Religious Instruction’ as it kind of was back then.
My understanding is that over your way you have the separation of church and state, so I’m not clear why you want religion brought into schools – you’ve got the family, your friendship circle and the church for that – school is for learning other things.
Incidentally, there was a time – and not that long ago – when any self-respecting Catholic would have told you you were going to Hell for not being in the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church. A Catholic girl in my class at school was terrified of stepping into our Church. I think she thought the devil might grab her. And I had a friend of the Protestant Evangelical persuasion who thought (and probably still does) that Catholics weren’t real Christians. There’s no accounting for people’s beliefs.
A Good Girl can only be sexy if it is obviously a struggle for her.
I get the feeling Alba has never had any spiritual or even strange experiences. Perhaps that’s what makes her so strange.
“I get the feeling Alba has never had any spiritual or even strange experiences.”
I actually mentioned on here that I had. But I know what the brain can do.
Well if I am recalling somewhat correctly Alba I thought you had mentioned your experience was due to an illness. You know, scientists don’t really fully understand the brain or conciousness so they don’t have all of the answers. I don’t either. And yes, I do realize that peoples’ beliefs are all over the map. That doesn’t mean there isn’t a True North. You have said that people generally believe in things which validate their pre-existing worldviews. I can’t really see where that wouldn’t be the case generally. But I believe there are those who are willing to go outside of their comfort zone in search of Truth.
The school should reinforce the values of the parents, the family, and the Church. The fact that it doesn’t. The fact that school is for “learning other things” is exactly why society is crumbling (or at the least one of the big reasons). You know many of the oldest universities in the US started out as seminaries. Really bizarre how all of those religious fanatics were so into the scientic method. Or how seemingly one-track mind Jesus freaks were able to preserve and cherish secular literature for future generations. There is no such thing as separation of Church and State in any of our founding documents that I am aware of. So that phrase is totally misunderstood and often taken out of context. I think it actually came from the constitution of the Soviet Union.
“Well if I am recalling somewhat correctly Alba I thought you had mentioned your experience was due to an illness.”
No, no illness involved.
Although I’ll be under the knife early next week, so I promise faithfully to let you know if I have any out-of-body experiences while anaesthetised, or long-tunnel-with-light-at-the-end, and we can discuss their meaning. 🙂
Re the institutions of learning, of course they had religious origins. It was the same in Europe and the UK. Given that wealth tended to be concentrated in royalty or the Church, who else would be building universities?
And schools in Scotland were pioneered by the Church so that children could be enabled to read the Bible.
The thing is, in those days, everyone pretty much believed the same thing and if they didn’t, they’d be well advised to keep their mouth shut to avoid social pariah status. Or at some times and in some places, much worse. Now people are allowed to think for themselves, although I’m sure you’d rather their thoughts were more regimented.
(Potted history here of Oxford University:
http://www.localhistories.org/oxuni.html
Despite its pursuit of all kinds of learning, it wasn’t until the 1850s that you could even study there if you weren’t a member of the Church of England!! And its secularism (in the sense of tolerating different religions) was bumpy. After the civil war it was purged of royalists among its staff; then after the restoration it was purged of puritans. Nothing new under the sun, even in higher institutions of learning! I love the little nugget, which I hadn’t heard before, that Bailliol College was built by Bailliol as penance for insulting the Bishop of Durham.)
Getting back to schools… I think Christian values are generally good values, but if you’re basing your values on something you insist has divine status, you’re going to get some problems too, when it comes to people who don’t fit the mould, through no fault of their own.
I once asked you what you would do if one of your boys turned out to be homosexual (I know they won’t – this is entirely hypothetical). Janos thinks anti-gay therapy, which is almost always a choice made for religious reasons, is acceptable, despite the fact that it is known to cause distress and depression among those who are made to undergo it, and it leads to an increase in suicides. (It doesn’t work either.) I asked you if you would consider it, knowing those consequences, and you chose not to respond.
So, again, if one of your boys was a quiet, unassuming, well-behaved, clever young lad, but happened to be homosexual, and you were satisfied that he hadn’t turned out gay just to spite you or to acquiesce to pressure of some sort or other, and he just wanted you to love him as himself, as your son, would you be happy for him to have to sit in RI lessons or ‘guidance’ classes where he was instructed that he was a freak, a pervert, and destined for perdition if he couldn’t force his manly bits to respond to a woman instead?
And please don’t divert it into a discussion about loud-mouth transgender rights or whatever, it’s just a simple question about a hypothesis that represents reality for a whole lot of good parents. The vast, vast majority are like my brother and his family, who just accept their child for what he is and wish him peace and happiness as they do their other children.
“Really bizarre how all of those religious fanatics were so into the scientic method.”
It isn’t bizarre at all, not that I’d have described them as ‘fanatics’ anyway.. What is regrettable is that so many aren’t now.
Well I have to disagree with you regarding what is referred to here in the US oftentimes as “conversion therapy” which is obviously toned automatically in a negative way I think. You do realize that there are adolescents who initiate the interest in seeking therapy to try to rid themselves of same sex attraction? It isn’t all the time just helicopter parents coming in and begging therapists for help to prevent their children from turning gay after all. It would be very hard to accept Alba. I don’t necessarily believe it is something that is innate like skin color. It is more like a behavior that can be changed. At least that is the case for some people it seems. I know two women who were in a relationship for years. Now, they are split up and both are now married to men. So you tell me how it is that they were together and so convinced of their love for one another and so in everybody’s face about how happy and wonderful they were together. Only to find our a few years later that they apparently both like men again enough to be get married to them. Maybe for others it is something that isn’t so changeable. I guess my point is that I would be open to considering therapy if this was something going on in one of my sons’ lives. I would not just accept it as “oh well, I am so glad you know who you are”. Of course you love your children no matter what, but behaviors obviously don’t likewise need to be embraced or accepted even when they insist you must. Especially self-destructive behaviors. Plus they would have to deal with their dad. It is kinda funny thinking about it. One of my friends who is a bit older was telling me a few months ago that she was really concerned about her 19 year old because he wasn’t out chasing girls like her other two boys. She even laughed and said “God I hope he ain’t gay!” She was heartened to know several weeks later that he had found a girlfriend. The thing with him is that he had always had a more reserved personality and is just naturally quiet, organized, neat, and clean. But there was a little secret celebration when she found they were dating lol.
“Well I have to disagree with you regarding what is referred to here in the US oftentimes as “conversion therapy” which is obviously toned automatically in a negative way I think. ”
It’s ‘toned’ in a negative way because it observably does harm to people’s mental health.
And I’m willing to bet that most of the youngsters who initiate it themselves come from religious families they know won’t be accepting of them as they are. There have been homosexuals forever – they didn’t arrive on the scene with liberal politics. And they exist everywhere – even in countries where they have to hide to avoid being lynched by religious er… enthusiasts.
Also, regarding your women who ‘changed’, that’s not that unusual, including in the opposite direction after being married. Some people are bisexual and attracted to either sex. And with some people I agree it seems like an affectation.
I knew someone as a student who only visibly dated young women (including a friend of mine) but he later settled into the homosexuality that was clearly who he was, for the rest of his life.
People who change horses midstream aren’t the majority. The majority are people like my nephew and happily partnered or married men who are perfectly stable and whose lives are just like other people’s – no different in their outcomes as regards a ‘family-friendly’ society from heterosexual couples who, despite years of trying, just can’t have children.
My nephew isn’t engaging in ‘self-destructive behaviour’ – he’s just living his life as who he is. Not that I have a clue about his personal life or remotely want to – that’s his business. Destructive behaviour is conversion therapy that we know causes mental distress and an increase in suicides.
Of course young men brought up in restrictive, judgemental circumstances may try to change who they are to try to please society or their families. And escape the Hell to which their families and their church may have told them they’re headed. What a nightmare life to have.
Conversion therapy is being outlawed in some places – the most “liberal”! What does that word even mean anymore if you can choose the therapy you desire?
“Conversion therapy is being outlawed in some places – the most “liberal”! ”
So is FGM. Shock, horror…
FGM and sex selective abortions are essentially legal in the United States if not for anything else due to a lack of action or will. Sort of like the same hypocritical phenomenon as extreme Progressives who fully embrace Muslim migration into Western nations. Progressives who allegedly embrace Feminazism and total sexual liberation love to make alliances with Muslims who believe in throwing Gays off of buildings and burning women who don’t submit alive with their children. So the constant talk of how Western Christians are so “dangerous” seems sort of asinine to me given the realities of the world.
” In England in the Middle Ages, before the State was much of a thing and the Church, the feudal lord and people’s consciences ran things, the rate of homicide in England was ten times what it is now. ”
And the average life expectancy , for lord and peasant alike was 35 , stabbing or no stabbing.
I suppose that must have been the fault , too , of the Church , frank hierarchies , and peoples consciences ?
( If peoples consciences are such a negative , you would think that would be anything but a recommendation for democracy , but , never mind ! )
And , surely , Ipods , air conditioning , automobiles , and antibiotics are all thanks to the state and its ideologies?
We must say ideoloGIES because in many parts of Europe people have within a single lifetime seen three , four , or more , of those and their associated regimes come and go.
But never mind that either.
” Homicides started to decline with the growth of the state and proper judiciaries, but I’m sure we’ll get back to the golden age of the ubiquitous knife …… ”
The magic words are : COMPARED TO WHAT ?
Most everything you say sounds reasonable and legit , that is , until one asks , compared to what ?
In this case ; compared to the golden age of AK – 47’s , and the genocidal / suicidal nuclear weapon ?
” That would be the farmers who all believed in heaven and hell. ”
Again , compared to what ?
Compared to all those millions of ditch – diggers scarcely any better off now than they were then , who certainly will never live to see the Star Trek world you are presumably offering them ?
As sure as Hell not if energy once again ceases to be cheap ?
Or have I mistook you , and you are actually offering them NOTHING AT ALL ?
And calling that , somehow , a good something ?
” I think I’d be just as fine with a couple of non-believers and a small claims court, but that’s just me. ”
Heh , I’ll copy paste here what I observed to a friend of mine just a few days ago —
One sure way I know of to put yourself to sleep is to read books on the subject of religion.
On the other hand , THE surest way I know of to induce complete despair , and a catastrophic loss of faith in your fellow man , is to pick out a law book at random , any specialty will do , and read 50 pages of it.
My friend is a lawyer . And she did not argue with that statement.
I would be tempted to say that you are a fucking wackoo , living full time in fucking Disney Land .
But that really would be insulting.
“I suppose that must have been the fault, too , of the Church , frank hierarchies , and peoples consciences ?”
No. What a bizarre suggestion.
“( If peoples consciences are such a negative , you would think that would be anything but a recommendation for democracy , but , never mind ! )
I didn’t say they were ‘such a negative’. I have a conscience myself, which prevents me from stealing, killing, cheating, being unfaithful, lying, and a host of other things without believing in an afterlife. But it is clear to me from the most summary observation that human consciences overall have not sufficed to keep human behaviour good or perfect in pretty much any place, even when pretty much everyone believed in an afterlife. So sometimes you need civil penalties to keep things civil.
“The magic words are : COMPARED TO WHAT ?”
I compared the homicide rate in Mediaeval England to the homicide rate in contemporary England, nothing else. If society collapses the situation will be different from both the current situation and the Middle Ages, because there are many times more people and there will be nothing for most of them to eat.
” That would be the farmers who all believed in heaven and hell. “
Again , compared to what ?”
Compared to those who don’t. All I’m saying is that believing in heaven and hell clearly has never stopped people from killing their fellows or stealing from them or cheating on their wives or much else.
“Or have I mistook you , and you are actually offering them NOTHING AT ALL ?
And calling that , somehow , a good something ?”
Why do you keep coming up with this nonsense about what I am ‘offering’ people? I’m not ‘offering ‘anyone anything or taking anything away from anyone. People make up their own minds what to believe, whether they want to believe it or wish they didn’t. I’m just expressing my own views on an adult website, for which you repeatedly insult me.
I ‘offered’ my children, in addition to taking them to Sunday School, both Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy. I believed I was doing the right thing in offering them (or rather forcing on them) what they got from Sunday School, but I knew that when they believed in Santa and the Tooth Fairy that I was lying to them when I offered them that fantasy.
My daughter also has a law degree, although she wasn’t lucky – or unlucky – enough to get a traineeship. I’m sure we’d both agree with you about the law book. The sentence wasn’t to be taken too literally. A German Shepherd owned by an irresponsible eejit recently attacked our greyhound, which cost us £450 to patch up.
The normal remedy would be a small claims court, but since (a) we didn’t know where this semi-socialised person lived, as he moved away, and (b) it was going to cost about £150 to register the claim with no great likelihood of getting the £450 back, we didn’t bother. But I still think it’s better overall that small claims courts (and other courts) exist than that they don’t.
“I would be tempted to say that you are a fucking wackoo , living full time in fucking Disney Land.” But that really would be insulting.
It’s fine, I’ll take it as read. I also consider that you aren’t quite right in the head in the way you react to people who don’t share your beliefs, and in the way you concentrate on one of them in particular when there are others who think exactly the same on the same website. So we’ll just have to settle for a mutual wackoo-in-Disneyland diagnosis. I won’t be losing any sleep over it and neither will you.
Perhaps the others please you more by keeping their mouths shut in the way you prefer,in response to the endless inaccurate jibes about the nature of non-belief and non-believers.. My compatriot responded to one of your disparaging posts to me about the ‘omnipresent being’, in a way that entirely accorded with my views, but you didn’t reply to him – you continue to focus your efforts on me. Help yourself. I have my own theories as to why you are more Catholic than the Pope, and why you feel the need to spit out the insults, but I won’t insult you with the lay psychology.
Other than that, there are quite a few of your posts where I enjoy your insights – they tend to be the historical ones, rather than the religious ones, unsurprisingly.
Re the eejit with the German Shepherd, legal channels weren’t the first channels used. He promised to pay. His unofficial landlord offered to pay on his behalf, but then didn’t. He scarpered. The police knew him. The landlord of the pub on the corner, of which he was a patron, offered to pay, but we didn’t think that was right. So we went the neighbourhood route before considering the legal route, then just putting it down to ‘these things happen’. The law can’t always offer justice, only the law. And usually at a price unless you’re poor enough to qualify for Legal Assistance.
Legal Aid, sorry.
And it wasn’t even that we desperately wanted the money back – we just thought the eejit should be made aware that owning a dog is a responsibility.
“I also consider that you aren’t quite right in the head”. Hmmm that sounds really familiar. I guess that must be standard for those who don’t fit within behavioral and conversational expectations. Then again isn’t that to some degree human nature? To attempt to discredit one’s opponent by questioning viability/vitality/health? I think you actually brought up a good point btw in your post above. I think part of the issue is that people not only have different beliefs and viewpoints, but also different levels of intensity and feeling on subject matter. And then again, communication is the key. Haven’t you ever met someone before who naturally shouts when they talk or always seems grumpy as a general disposition? Perhaps there is some misinterpretation here. Maybe someone is trying to reach you and understands best how to really get your attention. How’s that for some psychology on a Tuesday morning :-)!
““I also consider that you aren’t quite right in the head”. Hmmm that sounds really familiar. I guess that must be standard for those who don’t fit within behavioral and conversational expectations. ”
No. It’s entirely an entirely inadequate quid pro quo for someone who doesn’t even know me but has called me a fraud, whore (!!), condescending bitch, species of reptile, etc. etc. for not sharing her beliefs. AT NO POINT did you intervene to comment on any of these insults, so I’m totally indifferent to your comment on my diagnosis because I see exactly where you’re coming from and you don’t get my respect for it. Sorry.
Well with all due respect when did you ever intervene when I was insulted here? And quite honestly, I have received far more insults than you have. You are often the subject of praise. Even your debate opponents for the most part have respect for you, even as they disagree with you. That is not the case with me or Kesa if you care to go back through posts and actually review the content. Now, do I think the insults are meaningful? Well no. As I told you before, no one here, unless they know you personally, can really say anything about you besides what you choose to post and what they gather from those posts. I don’t believe you are any of those things and would never know the difference if you were. I wasn’t necessarily commenting on your diagnosis and I am not looking for your respect. I was simply trying to provide some insight into the dynamics going on here as I saw them. I doubt Kesa dislikes you personally. How could she know you? I gathered that she dislikes your posts and that is about the extent of it. And your attention is here so it did work.
“I doubt Kesa dislikes you personally. ”
The word she used was ‘despise’. 🙂
And I’ve never seen you called a whore or a reptile or anything that could be compared with that – people do call one another ignorant, stupid, deluded and so on, which is par for the course if people are trading views on politics, I suppose.
Mostly really personal insults aren’t tolerated on here, but Kesa manages to get away with it, because her florid prose is appreciated (and has been much praised too). I quite like her style, in many ways.
And I never had any wish for you to intervene regarding insults batted in my direction – why would I? I can deal with insults sent my way just fine. I just find it odd that you take exception to my ‘diagnosis’ which was simply a tit-for-tat response to me being called a ‘fucking wackoo living full time in fucking Disneyland’. To say you are selective in your umbrage would be the understatement of the century. 🙂
All I can say is that you must have missed several posts which is fine. They were worthy of missing anyway. And that’s how life is. Not that I care for that. But people are always treated differently and viewed differently. It’s just one of those things that no one can stop or do anything about. I understand the Disneyland remark in my own way. Sometimes if one affects (or is perceived as affecting) to live an almost perfect life with perfect reactions to every little situation it sometimes comes off as “Disneylandish” to those who cannot share in that sentiment themselves within their own lives. Again, we are dealing with impressions. Not necessarily reality. So I am not trying to say you have a perfect life, etc.
“So I am not trying to say you have a perfect life, etc.”
Well, thank goodness for that. Since I’ve never had one – quite the opposite in fact, although I have nothing to complain about. Nor do I aspire to one. I’m enduringly grateful that I have a roof over my head, have never gone hungry, and have never had to watch any tragedy befall my family. And that water comes out of my taps without me doing anything. Anything else is a bonus, and both perfection and security are chimeras.
“Maybe someone is trying to reach you and understands best how to really get your attention”
Nope. Not even remotely. So no marks for Tuesday morning psychology.
The Father of our Country, George Washington: Few men, and only those highly educated and strangely formed, can be good without belief in God.
Now you may be one of these. But the peace you have found in morality and social justice will not suffice for most as per his comment. And the hatred you obviously have for us shows that the passions of your lower self are still very much alive. So to that extent, it’s not working for you either.
And again, I agree with you that the followers of the Abrahamic Religions are problematic with their my way or the highway attitude. That’s why I searched in the East because I hate that stuff and it supposed end result of eternal hell. Returning from my search, I was able to rejoin the West at a high level, appreciating my own Tradition for what it had, despite its faults and limitations.
Hinduism and Buddhism aren’t going to save the West, but a reborn Christianity might.
“But the peace you have found in morality and social justice will not suffice for most as per his comment. “
Who said I’d found peace? Or even look for it? People who think a lot (even if you totally disagree with their thoughts!) rarely find peace, except sporadically. I don’t deal in social justice – I just get on with my life in my tiny circle of influence, which doesn’t go much beyond my family, and my friends and colleagues. They don’t need to ‘deserve’ anything I do for them, so there’s no justice involved. And I donate a bit here and there for far better people than me to do useful things for people suffering outside my sphere of influence.
The hatred stuff is just nonsense, although I do try to respond to yours. Mostly it’s just not worth it.
I don’t in the least deny (most of) the values of what is still ‘my’ tradition – I just don’t think they are divinely inspired. If they were they’d be a darn sight clearer in the supposedly ‘inspired’ set of books that are full of contradictions. And there’d be a lot less smiting, slaughtering and raping of ‘enemy’ women and children who didn’t happen to have the same religious tradition, all endorsed by the divine one.
Interestingly, people who’d surprise you are embracing the ‘socially useful’ view of Christianity, which must be a bit of an insult if you believe in its inerrant truth (and it can indeed be socially useful, if people aren’t fighting wars over it). Even Orlov, who used to wax lyrical about the foolishness of believers, recently opined that your life could improve if you just pretended to believe it. It was ever thus, in many ways.
And anyway, I totally disagree with you that people have to be highly educated to be moral. The basics of morality are simple. Everyone isn’t required to show the wisdom of Solomon.
Sounds like there’s a vacuum of faith in Europe, and the muzzies are stepping up to fill it. The first country to fall will be Belgium. Globalist buttpounders at EU headquarters in Brussels will be on TV assuring everybody everything is under control, meanwhile, in the background, minarets will be visible jutting into the sky, the Call to Prayer will be heard broadcast thru out the city, and Parliament will be on fire.
Perhaps when the last Cathedral is burning Europeans will be on the sidelines, cheering.
Brh
Because Christianity is “socially useful”. That is not all its intended to be obviously. However, virtues like self-discipline, honesty, loyalty, and dedication have many good social uses for even a secular society so I understand the attraction. If that is how someone finds their path home so be it. At least they made it home right?!
“Because Christianity is “socially useful”. That is not all its intended to be obviously. ”
Many of the Christians on here argue that Christianity is socially useful. They don’t use that phrase but that’s what they’re saying. They also claim that societies where everyone believes the same thing gain in stability – most people would accept that was true. It was true for the Ancient Romans, but it wouldn’t make you believe that their beliefs were ‘true’ as opposed to ‘useful’.
A belief can be both true and socially useful – the terms aren’t of themselves mutually exclusive.
“However, virtues like self-discipline, honesty, loyalty, and dedication have many good social uses for even a secular society so I understand the attraction.”
Well, indeed, that’s pretty much the argument.
“If that is how someone finds their path home so be it. At least they made it home right?!”
They won’t have found their path home, to put it in the terms of your worldview, just because they’ve embraced it as socially useful! Embracing it as socially useful doesn’t involve any metaphysics.
All systems of morality are ‘socially useful’ – it’s because we’re social animals that we’ve evolved them. Most of morality refers to morality in our relations with other people.
Hi Jim,
I agree with your analysis.
Language is a tool, and it shapes our culture. Different languages shape those cultures in different ways. And it takes an incredible amount of practice with the tool of language before one can claim any sort of mastery. However, all of the tools that we have at our disposal are subject to the ‘practice makes perfect’ principle.
So, as you’ve quite correctly observed in the past, if a person has to say: “Know what I mean”, then it is very likely that the intended audience may not in fact, know what the speaker means.
The predicament is that people who are unable to utilise the tool of language may in fact revert to other tools with which to express their opinions. One such tool is violence. Another is frustration. Occasionally I see it expressed as anxiety, and some of the comments here are hinting at that possibility. Emotions are like an open tube of toothpaste and if squeezed, they’ll escape from the package regardless. Know what I mean! 🙂
The author George Orwell covered this matter in his book: ‘Nineteen Eighty Four’. Some of my darker thoughts lead to me believe that there are sections of the community that may feel that this book was a ‘how to’ manual.
Mind you, looking back upon European history with a very critical eye, the tool of breaking the bonds of a culture has been in long use. If the cultural bonds break, the culture suffers and declines. The tool has sometimes been referred to as a ‘divide and conquer’ strategy, but the details of the tool are far uglier than those words can express.
As a general note to yourself, I’m in my forties now, however as a child and youth, the English education I received was woeful. Fortunately, I had a love of reading, which I still indulge in. Books have taken me to times and places that I would never otherwise have been able to visit.
Cheers
Chris
I do give de Blasio a lot of credit for picking up the phone and asking to appear on Tucker Carlson, after Tucker had done nothing but bash him, for months, as the worst mayor in the country. I was surprised that de Blasio sounded pretty intelligent, with some interesting ideas, and, IMO, he totally defeated Tucker in their confrontation.
Mayor Joe took a page from Andrew Yang regarding the threat of automation on jobs, without resorting to Yang’s contention that we need to put millions of permanently obsolete white guys (with AK-47’s) on the UBI dole so that they will not start a revolution. Bottom line, I no longer think that de Blasio is a complete joke, especially compared to his second-rate opposition. I kind of buy his line that running the biggest city in the USA is good preparation to become POTUS. It’s certainly better training than being 1 of 100 useless blowhard senators who only vote the way that party leadership tells them to vote. I’d vote de Blasio over senile Biden, ancient socialist Bernie, know-it-all Warren, and insufferable hack Kamala any day.
The belief that a (any) political or religious agenda is worth destroying the essence of a child and throttling all hope of attaining the pinacle of that childs natural abilities is false.
Debasing the future for today’s pleasure is the crown prince son of the father of lies.
Make it shiny, make it cheap. Place a value in a fiat currency.
Some human beings have a better tool kit than others. The only appropriate use of such tool kits is to disadvantage and plunder the efforts of those with a lesser toolkit.
How wonderful a concept to base your superiority complex on.
The are producers and there are consumers. Producers manipulate physical reality, if you do not interact physically with the transfer of energy from on state to another in the form of useful physical objects you are a consumer.
The producers are the slaves of the consumers. There is nothing to manage without a producer.
THE KEY TO GROWTH IS ASSURING THE SLAVERY OF MASSES OF THE HUMAN POPULATION.
All those in favor of the status quo say “AYE”.
Read right on this platform how well the education “system” actually works.
“OH MY GOD, MISSLES IN TURKEY”?. PT109 and all that……
Unless you were never born you have not lived a single day without a politically supported lie as a foundation of your world view.
The children are stupid, YES WE ARE!!!!!
Kesa-Anna I hope you will always have abundant strength to accompany your courage. thnx
I enjoyed this week’s offering, laughing at some of JHK’s memories. I recall a movie from 1965, Up the Down Staircase, dealing with a new teacher in NYC. What you notice is most of the school is still white, but blacks and PRs were moving in fast, and Sandy Dennis, our new teacher, had to deal with all of this. What was poignant was a black mother who saw no need for her kids to go to school and told Dennis, and then a middle class white mother gushes with all kinds of stories of her son.
We were meant to dislike the white, but really, to so many blacks, education means nothing to them. But again, it might mean more if there was discipline, which this movie had (tenuously), but probably doesn’t exist anymore.
For 1965, it was pretty downbeat. A student tries to rape Dennis.
Also, a fat girl has a crush on one teacher, an embittered novelist, and when she writes a love note, he calls her in to correct her grammar, and that’s all. She despairs and jumps out a window. The school then had a policy of all empty classrooms being locked and windows closed, and that reminds me of our new laws designed to stop school shootings. Everything is after the fact.
I also an essay by Norman Podhoretz., My Negro Problem, where he recalled being a student in NYC. The blacks were always praised and to be pitied, but he remembered they were the ones always being disruptive in class, stealing everything, and robbing him for his lunch money. He said a problem with Jewish activists was they had to get over ignoring bad behavior and insist all groups submit to discipline.
Also, when you have one or two troublemakers in a school, they can be dealt with, but when you get swamped, the system can’t respond.
Then, school busing destroyed many schools and order. People tried to fight it, but in the 70’s it was busing-busing-busing…sounding like those drums on the slave galley ship in Ben-Hur.
My high school was way out in the country, and out of a student body of 500 we had one black student. I was pretty bored with HS, and am dealing with our 50th reunion. I never went to one, never really cared to see any of my classmates again, and although I liked some parts of HS, didn’t really blossom until I got into college. I think a lot of people are like this. Certainly the special arts college JHK had did this for him. Like he said in Home From Nowhere, high school is essentially transferring factory life to children. I still recall the ringing bells, tramping from one class to another, and the crappy gym classes where we had dodgeball and upperclassmen bullying the younger kids. Whew. Glad that’s over.
De Blasio seems to be against excellence, which is typical of the liberal/socialist thinking, or at least its end result. But also there is the conflict of dealing with what the semi-educated majority are capable of absorbing.
When I went to my university, they had a special class originally designed for exceptional students to help them advance…but it soon became remedial studies, since hundreds of students came in with poor language and math skills. A lot of kids in college can barely think or express themselves, but this has been going on for awhile. I remember Robert Kennedy addressing a high school class, talking to them, annoyed at their ignorance. ‘Don’t they teach you anything?’ He shot back.
I remember something someone attributed to Confucius, and that was to take over a country you need to corrupt the currency and control the language.
I often wonder if our educational system purposely wants dumb people…sort of like cerebral inflation.
Yes, we need a higher humanity than our factory schools can create. They are just producing cheap consumer “products” who will consume material products. The Wickedly Wise have realized they aren’t needed anymore in such numbers and have vowed to cut production. Actual machines are better than human imitations after all. Better at being machines that is.
Childhood is unnnatural. Children should be seen as silly little adults and treated as such, working as soon as possible. In factories? No, around the home and farm, supervised by those who love them. And of course, letting them play a bit too.
As Lao Tzu said, close the schools. The people will benefit a hundred fold.
That is very wise. Humans naturally have a long maturation process which sets us apart from most other animals. So in that sense a normal childhood the way we typically envision it does seem unnatural in the greater scheme. The home (and farm) is the best place for children. Caring parents will always take care of their children better than anyone else and are the most heavily invested in their growth.
“The home (and farm) is the best place for children”.
What, even better than government housing projects where “it takes a village …”?
Surely you don’t mean that, SSL.
BRH
I’m afraid the villages are flunking the test Brh! So now instead of a village they will say, “it takes a drag queen story hour..”.
SSL:
“Caring parents will always take care of their children better than anyone else and are the most heavily invested in their growth.”
Would that it were universally so, as you stated it.
But why do you express your thoughts as such full-on positives or negatives?
You leave little room for nuance though still manage to sometimes stumble into a puddle of contradiction & equivocation.
What nuances would you care to discuss? Certainly there are some parents who don’t appear to care for their children. And likewise, some other guardians may be awesome parents. But what specfic issues are you looking to talk abut in this regard? I agreed with a statement that I found to be mostly positive. I am not sure how that is full-on positive. More like an acknowledgement of reality.
There are two distinct and competing strategies at play here.
The Left’s strategy to dealing with generationally poor students—let’s just call them poo for short—is to smear poo around everywhere until it seemingly vanishes. Hence busing.
The conservative strategy is to isolate and contain. Poo is a fact of existence. All we can do is keep it as far away from us as possible, so as not to contaminate everything else with the odor.
I would argue that the second strategy has prevailed as the winning one. Spreading a thin layer of poo everywhere simply makes everywhere smell like poo. It doesn’t actually make the poo vanish at all.
The first floating nuclear power plant in the world, Academician Lomonosov, arrived in Pevek ahead of schedule!
Arrival was expected in the second half of September, but 4,888 km from the pier in Murmansk were passed much earlier.
Difficult mooring at the pier is due to the characteristics of the port in Chukotka, as well as due to the large size of the power unit. The coastal systems of the FNPP are a grandiose hydraulic structure with a length of more than half a kilometer. Heat and electricity will be transferred from the station to the shore via berth communications.
A floating nuclear power plant is the pride of Russian modern science in general and nuclear energy in particular. Experts from all over the world look at her with admiration (and some with envy), since it can turn the economy of hard-to-reach and energy-deficient regions, the development of the North and not only
=====
And now lets hear the Western moans of envy about the fucking Chernobyl!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRjYxWHbwgw
High fives all around, Finca.
That’s what call ‘gettin’ her done’!
Just wait until next year when we have a new Dem president — probably president Warren — and she sends two ricketty windmills on a barge down the mighty Mississippi River towed by a tugboat, headed to Houston to power up the city after the use of fossil fuels are abolished. It’ll be the dawn of a new age. I feel cooler just thinking about it.
Did you Russians get a good laugh last week when you watched the Dem climate change debate on CNN, and every candidate announced they would phase out oil, coal, natgas and nuclear power as a source of energy? Or were there just a lot of sideglances at the absurdity of all of it.
Brrh
What, no Affirmative Action Crewmembers?
No drag queens, no nose rings, no face tatts?
You’ll be hearing from the UN High Commissioner on Human Rights sooner rather than later.
Brh
A brief overview of the balance of forces after Epstein’s “suicide”. P 3.
In the first post of this series, “A brief overview of the balance of forces after Epstein’s “suicide ” I wrote that it was already clear to almost everyone in American politics that the struggle for Brexit in England and the struggle of Trump with Hillary Clinton (aka Bastinda) in the USA are actually the same historical process, which without exaggeration can be called a struggle for the existence of Anglo-Saxon civilization, and the defeat of any part of this civilization automatically means the death of another.
And for those days that I was busy working on my new idea of Probability Action in discrete Manhattan Space, in the good old England, a grandiose battle broke out between the Prime Minister and the Queen on the one side and the Parliament and the City of London on the other.
The Queen, at the suggestion of Boris Johnson, dissolved the parliament for 5 weeks, so that parliamentarians would not prevent Boris Johnson from negotiating with the European Union about the new Brexit conditions, and parliamentarians in the remaining time were able to pass two laws that practically disarm Boris Johnson, depriving him of the last levers of pressure on the European Union, so that the latter changes the enslaving conditions of Brexit, which the active opponent of Brexit and the agent of influence of the European Union in the British government Theresa May, also who also used to moonlight as a Prime Minister of United Kingdom in her free time of spying against her own Nation, had achieved.
The first law prohibits him from leaving the EU without an agreement at all – the so-called “hard Brexit”, and the second law prohibits him from calling new elections before October 31 – the date by which the UK will leave the EU automatically, regardless of the fact of a deal with the European Union or its absence. Moreover, opposition leader Corbin does not hide the fact that the goal of his policy is to annul the result of a referendum on secession from the European Union.
And today, parliamentarians went home, and Johnson, by law, can call new elections no earlier than November, which OBLIGE him to send a letter to the European Union asking for another postponement for negotiations on a new deal.
And although he swears his commitment to the deal, the parliamentarians are already worried that he will write such a letter to the European Union – he, he I would love to be able to read it uncensored! – that the European Union will refuse the deal, and Boris Johnson will achieve his goal without violating the laws that the parliamentarians have passed.
Moreover, during the discussion of this law they came up with the question of the possibility of the existence of a constitutional monarchy in a country where there is no constitution, and now after the Queen signed the law banning the hard Brexit, the European Union, agreeing to new negotiations with Boris Johnson, will fulfill her will and all these Beneluxes will recognize themselves as vassals of the English crown.
In short – long live the Hundred Years War 2.0, and you, European muzerfuckers, will still have to answer for the Albigensian Crusade!
Moreover, I’m sure that the Fourth Reich, insisting on the conditions of Brexit that its agent Theresa May imposed on the good old England, can easily play through the new Entente Cordiale minus Macron, and I’m sure that Johnson will actively use the Trump Card of possible friendship between UK and Russia, despite all his Russophobia, to conclude a new deal with the European Union, and we will not see anything about what I wrote here.
Well, ladies and germs;
The BBC, this PM, reports that Donald Trump has fired John Bolton as his National Security adviser.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-49655279
Thank you sweet Jesus! At this very moment I am but one piece of burnt toast with the image of Jesus from becoming a believer….
Maybe there is a God after all?
Hallelujah, Hallelujah!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDnW5XxjwI8
“The BBC, this PM, reports that Donald Trump has fired John Bolton as his National Security adviser.”
And isn’t it good to have something that all sane people of ALL political stripes can get behind?!
A hawk with its wings clipped. The words ‘national security’ and ‘John Bolton’ should never be seen in the same sentence. I’m much happier to hear that news than I was to see him and Boris Johnson cosying up hardly any time ago.
Boris, pay attention.
JS: Daily Mail with commentary by Anglin. This is the kind of thing that Sean Coleman is right about. Thus vindicated, he then clings to his vindication as if was a magic ticket making him right about everything every time. The clinging is what gets us.
A Netflix producer who claims Harvey Weinstein raped her several times sent the disgraced producer hundreds of affectionate emails, it’s been revealed.
Alexandra Canosa, who worked as a producer at the Weinstein Company for 10 years, is suing the mogul for sexually attacking her repeatedly from 2010 to 2017.
However, emails obtained by The New York Post show that less than two weeks after she says Weinstein forced her to perform oral sex on him in 2011, she sent an email to him writing: ‘Miss you too. Love to you and the girls‘.
And in another 2010 email she writes: ‘I’m thinking about you‘. This email was sent just one day after she claims he raped her.
Yes, she was thinking about the rape that he performed on her, you bigots — that’s what she meant.
She was processing what happened and when she realized it, she denounced it. Victims take their time to realize that they’re victims.
Canosa is one of scores of women who have come forward accusing Weinstein of sexual assault.
She suing Weinstein, 67, for unspecified damages.
Canosa, who produced the Netflix series Marco Polo, addresses Weinstein as ‘love’ and signs off with ‘love, Ally’ in several messages.
The emails go as far as 2017, when Canosa sent Weinstein a condolence message after his mother died.
‘I know how much she meant to you and how deeply loved and respected she was and I can only imagine how proud she must have been of all you have created and contributed to, throughout your life,’ she wrote.
A 2013 email shows Canosa wrote: ‘You have been my mentor and friend for many years now and have never failed to give me the right advice. I am trying to figure out what my next step should be for my career as a whole and I trust your guidance completely.’
Translation: “I’m willing to do the sex for opportunities thing again if you’re up for it and I mean, any kind of sex is okay. I’ll do whatever you ask.”
The Post reports that Canosa tried to keep the messages out of the courtroom and then blasted Weinstein for refusing to agree to her request.
‘Weinstein and his counsel are trying to manipulate and misuse these emails out of context to taint the Jury pool by creating a false impression that there was a consensual sexual relationship when there was only a consensual business relationship,’ Canosa’s lawyer Jeremy Hellman wrote in a letter to the judge last month.
It was indeed a consensual business relationship. She gave him sex, he gave her connections and job opportunities or whatever.
Last week, the judge denied the motion, citing that that the emails ‘are not properly designated as confidential’.
Thomas Giuffra, another one of Canosa’s lawyers, said Sunday: ‘The defense has thousands of emails between Miss Canosa and Harvey Weinstein. They’re choosing to cherry-pick five or six of those emails to attempt to show some kind of consensual relationship between the two.’
Thousands of emails between them and they cherry-pick five or six? Then it will be easy to combat those five or six emails by showing the other 994 or 995 hate emails sent between them.
Weinstein’s lawyer Elior Shiloh said: ‘The truth was finally coming out’ after Canosa ‘desperately tried to hide her own emails from the public as they completely undermine her claims.’
Shiloh added: ‘The lawsuit is a slap in the face to actual victims of sexual violence’.
Canosa claims Weinstein sexually assaulted her for the first time in 2010 at the Tribeca Grand Hotel.
The alleged abuse continued until September 2017 and took place in New York, Los Angeles and overseas in Malaysia and Budapest.
She says he threatened that she would lose her job and he’d blackball her if she denied his advances.
Exactly. The content of these emails doesn’t mean that he didn’t rape her, you bigots. She could have been raped and enjoyed it in the moment because she didn’t know it was rape, but then she realized it was rape and knowing she was raped brought all the pain of the rape — all at once — that she’d have felt back during the rape if she knew she was getting raped.
Women can’t say no in the moment, they can’t even — they literally can’t even — and so after some time, they muster the strength to say something and come out to bravely do so. This is why we must believe women no matter what. (JS: Anglin is a fanatic on this issue, seeming not to believe in rape at all. As if women never say no. I disagree with him on this because he’s speaking too absolutely).
Believe Alexandra Canosa (JS: picture of a very hot Canosa – a fine piece of ass if ever there were).
Weinstein is a disgusting hand-rubbing pig, but that doesn’t change the fact that women are using their holes as tools to advance their careers in some way.
They’re known to do this.
Women do this because they know they have nothing else to bring to the table. They can’t really compete with men in men’s areas doing men’s stuff, so they work around competition by using their Ace of Spades.
The only card they need is the Ace of Spades.
The few women appearing to have something interesting to say or to contribute are mimicking the greatness of a man by parroting his ideas.
“Behind every great man there’s a great woman” doesn’t mean that the woman has any credit to take for that man’s greatness — it means that she appears to be great because she mimics the greatness of the man.
For Godssake, outer pace is 457 degrees below zero F, and earth is speeding thru it at 67,000 mph. At the same time our planet is spinning at 1080 mph … you don’t think suface temperature is going to fluctuate a little bit? How can it not? How stupid do you think we are?
brh
Don’t pay too much attention to their postmodern bullshit, brh, it’s a circus and everybody knows that.
They’re just fucking demoralizing the population by running their GW crap.
Haha, brh. That’s a good one. One thing about you guys is that you are endlessly resourceful with those shovels of yours.
Dems are turning LA into a shithole
Notes of an eyewitness:
Living in Los Angeles is Becoming Surreal Nowadays
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1OKA9ZeGX8
I’ll tell you that much: for my 33 years living in the Soviet Union I saw bums, alright, but I never seen anything like that.
Building a Hell on Earth, one bum, one junkie at a time…
Finca, thanks for the video of the floating nuke power plant. Pretty impressive.
We used to boldly build big projects at one time in the US too.
Imagine trying to build the transcontinental RR in 2019, it would take 25 years just to get the EPA permits, and instead of Sioux Indian raids it would be protesters with purple hair and rings in their nose laying across the tracks.
brh
Soros is a Big Hillary supporter….
Billionaire liberal financier George Soros offered some rare praise of Donald Trump’s policies in a Wall Street Journal op-ed Tuesday, but said he’s worried the president will undermine his own strategy.
Soros called Trump’s policy on China, “coherent and genuinely bipartisan” as well as “the greatest — and perhaps only — foreign policy accomplishment of the Trump administration.”
Biden campaign operative “Penny Lee” says that gaffes aren’t automatically bad. Look at the current holder of the office, she says with a little laff. As if we voted for Trump because of his gaffes or absurdities.
You’re confused. More Penny Lane than Penny Lee.
Joe grabbed a woman’s hand the other night and wouldn’t let go. She felt uncomfortable. Penny: He’s so human! Well said, Pen. Only humans should be allowed to run for office. No slugs or octopie.
For every Kaju (giant beast) there must be a Jaeger (hunter). Orban is just such a Jaeger, fighting the beasts of Globalism. If only there were more like him! He actually is what people thought Trump was – both his fanatical supporters and his fanatical enemies. Both are wrong.
” Mostly really personal insults aren’t tolerated on here, but Kesa manages to get away with it, ”
Hmmm.
Well ……..
I suppose , then , that the thing to do is to really insult the shit out of our host !
” Clusterfuck Nation ”
Is that some sort of endearment ?
Granted , I suppose , strictly speaking , the United States isn’t a person , with feelings , so………
Granted , near as I can tell , Kunstler is something of a cheerleader for the United States , at least in a general sense.
What archaically they once called , ” A Yankee Doodle Dandy ”
Still , CLUSTERFUCK doesn’t SOUND ……..
Well , fudge !
” Golden Gollum of Greatness ”
Well , I suppose , strictly speaking , it’s unlikely the man himself hangs out in our little groupie section .
So I guess that isn’t really any kind of personal insult or anything……
Somehow I kinda doubt Elizabeth Warren would appreciate the pet name , ” The Harvard Pocahontas ”
But , then , I suppose Mr. Kunstler isn’t fishing for a date.
And , again , I kinda doubt Elizabeth Warren hangs around here hoping to get propositioned by our host.
So I guess that isn’t really insulting either.
I get the impression , but maybe I have really misunderstood him ,
that Mr. Kunstler commonly suggests that some people , while they say one thing overtly , covertly or obliquely mean the exact opposite.
He is then , essentially , calling them liars , calling them frauds.
And , while , commonly enough he does not seem to specify exactly who they are , not uncommonly he does give specific names.
But perhaps those aren’t personal insults either .
“, The Harvard Pocahontas ”
Rather “Pokerhaunches”?
That’s it? Don’t you want in on this? It’s not funny how you and Kesa don’t talk anymore….
Janos,
Well, my apologies…but I have an excuse. I cannot see anything in our nation’s future but failure. I have, in essence, embraced the train wreck. Our culture is being assaulted on a number of fronts, and some of the assaults will be successful. I just cannot seem to become emotionally involved in these failures, but rather view them with contempt and a bit of amusement.
Am I playing the short game? Yes. Kesa wields a rapier of a tongue…Who can argue her viewpoint? Hers is as valid as yours or mine.
Will I surrender my values and viewpoint? Will I embrace this degenerate culture and it’s assault on our lifestyles? Will I succumb and forgive Jane Fonda or Bettina Apthecker her treasons?
Yes…when the Jews forgive Hitler….
I might forgive Bernadette Dohrn, but only because she was hot….
” I just find it odd that you take exception to my ‘diagnosis’ which was simply a tit-for-tat response to me being called a ‘fucking wackoo living full time in fucking Disneyland’. ”
I don’t find it at all odd , but rather par for the course ,
That on the same page where anyone can easily look up what I wrote , you brazenly re – write what I wrote.
” …. to me being called a ‘fucking wackoo living full time in fucking Disneyland’. ”
Nooo , I said something very very different.
I’ll re- state what I did write , in slightly different words .
It still may constitute a slap in the face to , for example , be called a , ” whore ” —
— Though , by a person who , more than once , has stated that , in their view , they don’t perceive any known way of paying the grocery bill that does not necessitate some degree of prostitution.
— Indeed , furthermore , by a person who, frankly , admits their occupation once consisted literally of sucking dicks and the like.
Never the less , yes , something of a slap in the face.
But compare that to the insinuation , or assertion , of mental illness.
In a practical , real life , not at all ambiguous or abstract sense , in a legal sense ,
( And what is ” legal ” precisely ? To cut the bullshit for a second , we are talking about men with guns and cages . )
Mental illness means the same God damned thing as 5 years old .
Means the same God damned thing as mentally retarded.
It means , to cut out the bullshit , that you are not entitled to any fucking rights.
You’re damn right I compare you to Janos.
The only difference is that he is incrementally less euphemistic and sophistic.
If being called a whore is a slap in the face ,
then being called crazy is an attempt to slit someones throat.
Gee , I wonder which one is a Hell of a lot worse than the other ?!
That is what I said.
And none need believe in me. They need merely give their finger a work – out and scroll up the page and read what I wrote , and compare it to how you characterize it .
Make of it what you will. ‘Not right in the head’ and ‘diagnosis’ are as figurative as ‘whore’ and ” a fucking wackoo, living full time in fucking Disney Land”.
I get that you want a special dispensation so that your figurative is less serious than my figurative, so feel free if that’s your sense of entitlement.
But since my figurative offends you particularly, I will withdraw it in any case. Your insults may stand. I’m fed up arguing with you.
The European Union, insisting on the conditions of Brexit, which was imposed on the good old England by EU agent Theresa May, can easily overplay its hand and bring to existence a new Entente minus Macron.
And I’m sure that Johnson, despite his Russophobia, will actively use the trump card of the possible friendship of UK with Russia to conclude a new deal with the European Union, and for not having the opportunity to blackmail Juncker with a “hard” Brexit, he will blackmail him with the possibility of rejecting Russophobia.
And this blackmail, no doubt, will be no less successful than the caricature parade of Russophobes, which was organized by Trump supporters last week.
“insisting on the conditions of Brexit, which was imposed on the good old England by EU agent Theresa May, ”
Your ‘EU agent’ nonsense is madness, but leaving that aside, how was it imposed? It was presented to Parliament and they rejected it*. You seem to think the EU has a duty to offer the UK a cherry-picked deal that it likes. It has no such obligation.
But I’m waiting earnestly for Boris’ magic deal. Fingers crossed, eh…
*Note we have a parliamentary democracy. That has advantages and, to some, disadvantages. You may recall that Gina Miller went to the Supreme Court to argue that Parliament should be able to ratify or reject any Withdrawal Agreement negotiated on our behalf, according to constitutional law.
The Court upheld her view. Interestingly, though, had Parliament been deprived of its rights with regard to Brexit legislation, as many Brexiters would like, the Withdrawal Agreement would simply have passed into legislation, without parliamentary let or hindrance. Ah, the irony…
Correction to the above: the court case was about the right of Parliament to approve the triggering of Article 50.
But the point remains that if the rights of Parliament had been removed, as many would currently like, the Withdrawal Agreement would have passed unhindered into legislation and we’d have left the EU in April.
You seem to think the EU has a duty to offer the UK a cherry-picked deal that it likes
Of course not, are you kidding?
On the contrary, EU wants to make an example of UK for breaking the ranks and exiting the Fourth Reich,
And the primary motivation for Crown’s decision to exit EU was existential state security, not economic reasons.
The “no-deal” Brexit would give Boris more leverage in the future to negotiate more favorable economic terms.
If that’s not going to fly, the only tool remains for Boris is to threaten continental alliance with Russia – the Fourth Reich eternal enemy, and trans-Continental with Trump’s America – essentially new Entente (minus Macron’s France).
Which actually proves my point that at the critical moments of History – and we are definitely in one now – the Anglo Saxons and Russians invariably end up on the same side of the front line!
And that would be only a paradox for those who reject the religious motivations of the current War of the Roses and want to mask them with purely economic ones.
Scottish and Russian people have strong links, and I hope they continue to do so. That’s a different thing entirely from approving, without discrimination, the current Russian state and its practices, as personified by Putin and his henchmen.
“And the primary motivation for Crown’s decision to exit EU was existential state security, not economic reasons.”
The Crown had no part whatsoever in the decision to exit the EU. The Referendum was the result of 40 years of Tory party bickering.The Queen doesn’t even get a vote, so is lower than the least of her fellow citizens in that particular regard. She is, on the contrary, thought to be favourable to EU membership (remember the fuss of The Hat?!), although her official position has always to be to remain above and beyond normal politics.
The Queen doesn’t even get a vote, so is lower than the least of her fellow citizens in that particular regard.
“Her fellow citizens” have not enough brains or education to appreciate the threats, thanks God they have enough instinct to follow their Queen.
The Queen isn’t leading them out of the EU.
Good morning CFN, on 11 Sep19, eighteen years later. Here’s a little experiment that anyone who accepts the official storyline should perform. Take a couple of empty 12 ounce soda or beer cans and a few 24 ounce cans as well. Set them one at a time on a hard surface and then try to drop a bowling ball on top of them in such fashion as to collapse the cans into their own footprint. The smaller cans can pretty much be done without much failed attempt, but the reverse is true for the tall boys. That is because in order for the column to be crushed within its own footprint, the forces applied to the structure must be evenly distributed for that to happen along a much longer length of structure. If any resistance to the weight from above is applied by the structure below, the top of the can (or the top of the building) shoots off to the side where resistance is less.
After completing this little experiment we should all feel REALLY sorry for the victims shouldn’t we?
The puffs of dust that zipped down all four corners ten times faster than anything falling were very prominent in the original footage. Every puff was the same length too. Cognitive dissonance prevents it from being remembered. The power of the puffs were the same as if identical thermite charges were used to blow the corner supports ahead of the pancake.
Called squibs and that can also be attributed to air being blown out as the structure collapses.
Blown out of what holes in the skin exactly?
Where does air go when under pressure Walter?
Path of least resistance.
Air is compressible and will not blow holes in concrete. It will however, blow out the holes that are made by explosive charges.
Seems like your prone to believe in conspiracy theories, KDog.
I don’t like to give people born in different decades labels — boomers, millenials and all that — but I recently read an article by a self indentified ‘millenial’ that made fun of boomers belief in conspiracy theories, mentioning specifically the Kennedy assassination and 911. I could go back further, the Mckinley assassination, Pearl Harbor, and my favorite, WW1 was the result of arms manufacturers instigating war to increase profits. Even Hemingway believed that one. The only proven conspiracy that was actually uncovered and prosecuted was the plot to murder Lincoln.
You should look inside yourself to find out why you believe 911 was the result of a plot hatched by Americans, pols, kdog.
Honestly when Eisenhower said beware the military industrial complex people should have taken note.
https://www.npr.org/2011/01/17/132942244/ikes-warning-of-military-expansion-50-years-later
What I have issues with on the 9-11 conspiracy theory is that any American would be willing to do such a thing.
Something is fishy and our government knew of the plot from captured jihadist training manuals.
Once a human being acquires enough power and wealth, they transcend nationalism and become man-gods. As such they can use, abuse, and destroy life as they see fit. Ever heard of World Wars?
Actually BRH, the Kennedy assassination WAS determined to be the result of a conspiracy by the Church Commission:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_Committee
I understand that many people love Magic, but bullets are not magic, they are simply lead.
Additionally, FBI operation CAMTEX recorded an actual confession by Carlos Marcello to Jack Van Laninghak as to his arrangement of the hit and is part of the official record.
You may be heckling from the back row my friend, but I can assure you that behind the closed doors, we elected officials conspire in executive session, twice every month. If it happens to the extent that I see it here in my tiny municipality, denying it at the national level is simply ridiculous. Sorry.
That’s interesting because many millennials are conspiracy theorists. Conspiracy theories have always been and will always be because we live in a world of dishonesty and facades. It has been structured that way intentionally. Oops see, there is a conspiracy!!!!!
Those who deny conspiracy are either simple, stupid or living in the fear that they are being played and cannot handle the fact. Denial of conspiracy is a clear and concise statement that those who make such denials believe that those in power only deal openly and in our best interest, that there are no illicit gains to be had by manipulating circumstances, and that the more power a group or an individual acquire, the more honest and open they are. Heck, even Barney the Purple Dinosaur is not that retarded.
If only the world were that innocent huh Walter. I wish it were true but unfortunately and especially in the realm of politics you just can’t take anything at face value. There is likely always a “plan” behind every word and action and not just a response or reaction as it oftentimes seems. And be careful. You know Kamala had to apologize for laughing when the words “mentally retarded” were used in a recent campaign event she was at. She apologized but said that she was not reacting to those words but simply the jovial environment around her or some such BS.
“Those who deny conspiracy are either simple, stupid or living in the fear that they are being played and cannot handle the fact”
Walter,
Is there no room for honest debate, then between the stupid and our betters? Human perception, being what it is (RASHOMON!), can leave much to the imagination.
Consider, that with audio/visual manipulation at the current state of the art, there could be actual video of YOU shooting Lincoln, and who would believe your lies? Innocent, indeed!
“I seen it…it was Walter…shot the president in the back of the head, and then exposed himself to the crowd before jumping onto the stage….”
Enough talk about video on the Internets.
Actually ef, I watched the Towers both collapse in real time as it actually happened and although my observations were through the medium of television, I have many co-workers that watched in person from the roof of our distribution center across the river in Jersey City. Honest debate among those who want to argue who was responsible for this treason, I agree should go on, but foolish statements that fly in the face of the laws of physics certainly get my goat. Sorry but I have very limited patience for total foolishness.
Oh yes ef, there absolutely NO room whatsoever for any discussion as to whether conspiracy does or does not exist, because it does and it always has and it always will exist. It’s existence cannot be argued and anyone that would do brings the level of any discussion that they enter into down to kindergarten level. I do not know about anybody else, but I have no desire to argue with kindergarten children. .
Walter,
That conspiracies exist there is no doubt….
Even the mainstream media reported about the dancing Israelis having a party on a nearby building – and the smug satisfaction in Israel while the real West mourned wit us.
Oh, you don’t like it? Too bad about you. Your dislikes are no criterion of Truth.
So, in the Kennedy assassination, for example, the thousands of people it would have taken to murder the president and cover it up, in 6 decades not one person has stepped forward and announced, yes, I was part of a govt conspiracy to kill the president of the US, and heres proof?
Same goes with 911. You mean nobody in the Obama administration, if they had the goods on the Bushes, wouldn’t have brought it out into the light of day. Or was Obama in on the conspiracy too?
Apparently a conspiracy exists on anything that has ever happened, and everyone is in on it, except me. And, according to Janos, Israel is behind all of it.
Brh
Perhaps you missed my post above BRH but,
FBI operation CAMTEX recorded an actual confession by Carlos Marcello to Jack Van Laninghan as to his arrangement of the hit and is part of the official record.
There have been many deaths attributed to this even my friend:
https://spartacus-educational.com/JFKdeaths.htm
And how about Jack’s brother Robert? Another coincidence theory perhaps?
There is another point worth making BRH and that is that if Carlos Marcello was indeed responsible for setting up the hit on JFK, even if this involved hundreds of other organized crime participants, why would anyone think that they could not STFU? Hey if the Mafia was real somebody would have come out to testify against it, right? Ha. ha really. And though we will never know for sure, Jimmy Hoffa disappeared quickly and without a trace after he started bragging didn’t he? Or do you think he is living in Argentina with Adolph Hitler?
A dying Jedburgh admitted to assassinating General Patton on orders from above. Did you believe him?
The Rich Dead Man who spurned righteous Lazarus: Lord, let me return and warn my brothers of the fire that awaits them unless they repent. The Lord: No. If they did not believe Moses and the Prophets, they will not believe you either.
Indeed Janos, the Dancing Israelis:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOiCMMMeXE8
One of the things that deniers fall easy prey to is that over time as evidence gets pulled from the boob tube, people start quickly forgetting. Control the media, control the minds Dr.Goebbels would be proud.
Sept 11th gives me religion. It makes me think of burning bushes.
As in George Sr. and Jr.?
Don’t you find it simply amazing that none of 911 conspiracy theories names Clintons as main culprits, although, after losing 2000 election of their protege El Gore, they had the biggest stake in the game?
Sort of tells you where most of these theories are coming from.
I am unaware of any Clinton connection to the events of 11 Sep 01. My “theories” of the impossible collapses are strictly based upon my schooling and professional training as a structural steel designer. Anyone, and I realize that there are few, that has taken and passed any strength of materials or structural steel analysis and design courses can only buy into the official line of shit if they are paid to do so.
Or the same issue that plagued the titanic also plagued the twin towers.
The unsinkable Titanic had bad steel in the rivets among other things.
The Trade Center steel structure was welded construction. “Bad” steel would bend, not collapse into itself straight down, sorry.
Stop making sense, Walt!
@walter
Bad steel as in brittle and sheers.
Whole lot of paying going on.
That would be shear benr, but the failure was in compression, not shear. Compression failure is almost an impossibility for steel. Cheese perhaps can fail under compression, steel – not.
Short intermission of our regular programming
I wanted to start the day today with a post concluding a series of posts on the alignment of forces after Epstein’s “suicide”, but yesterday, President Trump either demanded or agreed to the resignation of John Bolton.
Which of course affects the balance of power after Epstein’s “suicide”, whose arrest according to theory of World Projects was Trump’s response to Hillary Clinton’s attempt to kill Vladimir Putin by organizing a fire on the deep-water nuclear submarine AS-31, also known as Losharik.
Moreover, it is not so much the fact of resignation that affects it – Trump has long been in conflict with Bolton, claiming that his national security adviser is ready to drag the United States into a dozen wars, and Bolton even made excuses, claiming that he only advises, and decisions are made by the US president – as the timing for this resignation.
Namely, Bolton’s resignation occurred on the eve of the anniversary of 911 – the date when the worst blow in their history hit the USA on September 11, 2001 and when American motorcyclists in memory of the victims of 911 with the explicit and secret assistance of US President Barack Obama did not allow Hillary Clinton to start Syria bombing in 2013, which would be more likely to lead to a nuclear war.
Which actually was the beginning of the Great Trump Revolution, and I must say that the Black World Project, then led by Hillary Clinton, now no longer wants a nuclear war, most likely impressed by the arrest of Epstein, and then Bolton was one of the few figures in the Black Project who objected quite loudly to the bombing Syria.
https://www.politico.com/story/2013/09/john-bolton-syria-vote-096195
And in this regard, it must be remembered that, initially, General Michael Flynn was supposed to be Donald Trump’s National Security Adviser, who at the 2016 Republican Convention publicly supported the republican cry “Hillary to jail!!!”, with which Republican delegates welcomed each speaker.
As a result of the first coup attempt made by Hillary Clinton after losing the election in 2016, General Flynn was under investigation and almost ended up in jail, and Trump’s national security adviser was openly appointed by Hillary Clinton a week after General Flynn was forced to resign.
In the course of the investigation, the General was officially charged with obstructing Barack Obama’s plan to turn the expulsion and arrest of Russian diplomats into a nuclear war before Trump became president.
In fact, Barack Obama did not give such orders and in the last week it turned out that the struggle between Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton will be reduced to John Durham’s ability to prove that after November 25, 2016, Hillary Clinton gave orders on behalf of Barack Obama.
And the appointment of John Bolton as national security adviser took place on April 9, 2018, becoming the first after Flynn’s resignation Trump’s own appointment, who chose Bolton six months before the Big Bargain as a member of the Bush clan and the person who objected to the aforementioned failed bombing of Syria in 2013.
But it was already too late and on April 14, the United States, Britain and France launched a missile strike on Syria, prepared by Hillary’s appointee General McMaster and Secretary of Defense Mattis, of which Russia, unlike Trump’s previous attacks on Syria, was not warned.
During this attack, 105 missiles were fired, of which 46 were intercepted (at first it was reported that 71 missiles), and Russia said on the eve that if it strikes its troops in Syria, it will not only intercept missiles, but also sink ships, from which they are released.
Unlike previous bombings, there was no live broadcast of the war, and General Mattis who very vigorously told Congress about the execution of 300 or 400 Russian soldiers (mercenaries) in the illegally occupied Eastern Syria, in response to a question about the losses of the American army, according to rumors simply horrific, turned pale like death and stopped the press conference.
The next day, the UK said that it wanted to add a dozen more Tomahawks to the 105 missiles launched, but the ultra-quiet Russian submarine, which suddenly surfaced next to the British submarine preparing for the salvo, brazenly interfered with these plans, forcing the courageous British sailors to urgently dive.
After that, Bolton went to Moscow, and although he did not bring the wreath of peace in the clutches of the American Eagle, they clearly liked each other with Vladimir Putin.
No less clearly they agreed on something, while not provoking another hysteria from the US Deep State and Bolton’s accusations of spying on Russia, which proves one more time that it’s better to lose with a smart person than to find with a fool.
Thus, Bolton’s resignation on the eve of the 911 anniversary can only mean one thing – that Epstein’s “suicide” ended the split in the Bush clan, which was the result of George W. Bush’s “betrayal” of the Black World project, and John Bolton ended up in that part of the clan that on December 2018 refused to follow the “living testament” of its head, and remained faithful to the Black Project.
And this happened because, as a result of the arrest of Epstein, the Black World project handed Hillary Clinton over to Trump, along with her plans to provoke a nuclear war.
Quod Erat Demonstrandum
More details to follow in the final post of this series and in the posts on the War of the Roses of the 15th Century, as George Bush Sr., who obviously sent a black world project to go fuck itself in a rude and cynical form, thus repeated the spiritual feat of his ancestor Henry I Beauclerc, who founded the dynasty of Plantagenet.
Hitler is said (by Rudolf Steiner) to have been a reincarnation of Henry the Bird Catcher, so why not? You obviously have an inside track on this stuff too.
You may well be a disciple in the school of Rasputin if not Hillel.
A major task for those who would instill in our youth the ability to communicate in spoken English will be eradication of what our host has called the ‘like-like” dialect.
“Like” is a word expressing fondness for or affection for something, or similarity to something. I often hear a young person say, “I was like, what’s going on?” (Or something similar.) I believe we should start asking these young people questions like, “In what way were you similar to ‘what’s going on?’ ”
We may be accused of linguistic harassment or ignorance abuse (or maybe wordism). Well, it’s a tough job, but somebody’s got to do it!
the ‘like-like” dialect. – sprawl
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OMG, this is one of my pet peeves. My otherwise very bright son, Thom fills every spoken paragraph with so many ‘likes’ that it drives me like up a friggin’ wall. At 42 years old it seems unlikely he’ll ever get a grip on this affliction.
Thanks, Q.
And . . . I missed hitting the shift key, so the left quotation mark was single, where it should have been double. Should be “like-like”.
As has been noted, these comments are rough copy; we have no copy editor.
What’s the latest vernacular? Is it, ‘He goes,…” or is it “He’s like…”?
I’m like, I don’t care.
Went to see an orthopedic surgeon today. He goes, “How old are you?”
“69.”
He’s like “we don’t usually see these types of injuries in anyone over 50.”
What’s the latest vernacular? Is it, ‘He goes,…” or is it “He’s like…”? – Tate
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When I hear an actual conversation like the one you simulate – and I have heard thousands of them – the hair on my neck and arms stands on end. I have a similar reaction when seeing a 55ish year old woman chewing gum with her mouth open.
55-ish, Q? She’s practically a late teenager! Certainly st least 2 generations removed. My youngest sibling is 12 years my junior (with six more between us) and it’s almost 3 generations in experience, attitude & worldview.
. intense concentration, starting in preschool and going forward as long as necessary, in spoken English.
. and too many children just can’t speak English
. they need to learn how to speak English and to do it correctly – JHK
==============
Above are verbatim excerpts from JHK’s blog essay. Please note that Jim ONLY mentions SPOKEN English, not written English. Perhaps he doesn’t want to poke a stick into a hornet’s nest seeing as how there are so many errors in the written comments on this site and someone like me, an admitted spelling, grammar and usage nazi, would jump right on the opportunity to correct commenter’s writing to my heart’s content.
Most text one sees in print — hard copy and electronically — is filtered thru experienced copy editors and proofreaders. There are rewrites, corrections, copy taken out, copy inserted etc. On this roll its just raw typage, why wouldn’t there be errors in spelling and grammar? Like I mentioned once before, Q, this comments section isn’t a term paper at MIT.
Brh
Some of us read and post a response as you said this is not a school paper but a message board.
I know. Did you realize your every post is graded?
Most text one sees in print — hard copy and electronically — is filtered thru experienced copy editors and proofreaders. – BRH
==============
Actually, among the first to go in the downsizing and near extinction of print media, with pubs like the NYT barely hanging on by their fingernails, were the proof readers.
We commenters need to proofread our own shit before we click submit.
“would jump right on the opportunity to correct commenter’s writing to my heart’s content.”
Let me help you out, Q. I think you meant: commenters’ writing. 🙂
Although, admittedly, you didn’t mention punctuation!
LOL – The English professors are correcting each other ;-). It’s a good day!
Information Theory dictates that a piece of writing should be judged by the amount of accessible information it contains.
http://www.whatabeginning.com/ObDec.htm
“Sept 11th gives me religion. It makes me think of burning bushes.”
…a perfect example.
I agree to a large extent, MD – except where poor writing inhibits comprehension. Sometimes even punctuation can cause you to have to read something a couple of times before the penny drops. Not in the case above, obviously, which I wouldn’t have dreamt of commenting on except for the irony. 🙂
Very interesting post MD!
I think you meant: commenters’ writing. – GA
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Well, obviously I inserted that error on purpose to provide someone the pleasure of nailing me. 😉
No doubt Bldg 7 was blown because it was the headquarters for the entire operation. Who had the insurance on that one? I never heard that Lucky Larry did, no doubt much to his chagrin.
I used to needle Danny about missing out on the whole thing. He never even tried to resist. The Truth has its own claims – and they are the biggest of any and all.
What do you mean, no doubt?
Your whole statement is absurd.
Brh
Bldg 7 is the reason the conspiracy theories live on. I’ve never heard a satisfactory explanation. Have you?
Well I can’t link to article at Unz review here. Is it now viewed in the same light at the Daily Stormer, B R Hecklestein, lol.
Here’s the title of the article:
“The Dancing Israelis: FBI Docs Shed Light on Apparent Mossad Foreforknowledge of 9/11 Attacks”
Just another clue as to what went down on that fateful day.
“as the Daily Stormer”
Donald John Trump does not speak English well and does not pronounce words properly. Jimmy Fallon has a game segment in which people guess how they think DJT will mangle the English language and then Fallon shows Trump misspeaking.
Donald John Trump does not use English well and is often unable to communicate clearly. In spite of all this, we don’t seem to have any trouble understanding what he likes and what he dislikes. Nor did Trump’s lack of competence in English prevent his apparent success in business and government.
“I mean, 40 Wall Street actually was the second-tallest building in downtown Manhattan, and it was actually before the World Trade Center the tallest, and then when they built the World Trade Center it became known as the second-tallest, and now it’s the tallest.”
— Donald J. Trump
Capiche?
Did Trump bring down the towers so his building would again be the tallest? Is that what he is saying?
No, that’s crude but pretty clear. Trump is a liar and a con man, but a very good communicator, especially to the masses whom he bamboozled.
Janos, you amaze me. You have done a complete 180 on Trump and show not an iota of shame.
I see you have also done a 45 or a 90 on Catholicism. You have frequently trashed Pope Francis, for example. Eventually it will sum up to a 180.
If you want to surprise someone with a birthday party, you don’t tell them about it. It’s a surprise! Thus you and your fellow party givers are in Conspiracy, you breath together (con-spire), but not against the birthday boy, but for him.
Conspiracy is how the world works. And yeah, it’s negative far more than it’s positive. Satan is Rex Mundi after all.
Obviously the malicious powers that be don’t want us to understand how they attained power – or how they can be overthrown. Were not the Founding Fathers, Conspirators? Of course they were.
Thank you. That makes sense. Conspiracy is not always a bad thing as I had sort of implicated above. Secrecy can be a good thing depending on what it is and for.
Yes, take three people, a,b, and c. A and b will be in conspiracy against c. C and a against b. And C and b against a – sometimes one combination and sometime others. Or all of them all of the time.
Three people is the basic unit, not two. Any two need a third to be against or to define themselves as other than. Maybe this is why Adam and Eve had kids only after they fell. All of this pertains to the fallen nature.
This is brilliant, O worthy one!
A little too negative, and after I expressed the contrary just above. But Life is mostly negative so I was more right than wrong. We should all be wearing black veils representing our secret sins. We are far worse than we imagine and far worse than how most others imagine us.
It sounds complicated but I think I understand what you are getting at.
What many forget about the failed liberal experiment colloquially known as “busing” is that it didn’t merely involve transplanting degenerates to functional schools (in the same way, perhaps, that smallpox-infested blankets were once distributed to the natives). No—busing also involved transplanting functional students into hellish neighborhoods and the schools they created for themselves.
While one might argue that a small amount of pox (i.e., denegerates) could easily be contained and subsumed by the larger organism’s immune system, it’s quite another thing to argue that a healthy cell stands a chance when thrown into a cesspool. Or that it’s somehow for the healthy cell’s benefit—a win-win.
Those good students bused to bad schools were sacrificed—plain and simple—for the greater good of minorities. They had the privilege of exposing minority “students” to what Dems nowadays unabashedly call “whiteness”, in return for which they had to run a gauntlet both coming and going. Great sport for the animali; not so great for the white victims of busing.
Yes, if it worked at least it would have been a lateral pass, a robbing Peter to pay Paul; or White victims for Black success. But there’s no evidence it actually helped them, but it sure hurt White people – and thus it was a success by the criteria of the Satanic Elite.
Of course, Affirmative Action helped Blacks at White expense too. But at least the sporting element of physical abuse is absent.
Please use the other ‘s’ – “bussing”
Comfortable white liberals absolutely must get their children schooled with Blacks and other minorities. Perhaps then they will see that their world of ideas is a total fantasy.
What it is like to teach black children. This is an interesting essay read out loud on YT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPfHgECOVn4
He makes HJK’s point that they should learn to speak English but will not.
I remember a discussion between Colin O’Flaherty (I think) and YouTuber ‘DailyKenn’ where they said that as a white boy you simply could not use the school toilets ever because there was always a black gang in their waiting to beat you up. Flaherty considers White parents who knowingly send their children to such schools as guilty of child abuse. (I would link to the video but his YT channel was deleted for some specious, trivial reason.
Oh yes, Howard Stern had a lot to say about that. Once. He experienced it up close & personal because his parents were fanatical adherents of “the Narrative” & accordingly they sent him into the maw of the public school Beast. He’s softened his tone of late because it doesn’t accord with “the Narrative.” And with few exceptions, the Tribe must align their views with “the Narrative.”
The fact is American education is atomized into millions of stories like Mr. Kunstler’s.
Each provincial district offers a unique structure and intricate function, for better or worse, in the lives of students.
But how many, without respect to conventional educational customs, enroll their children in fundamentalist religious homeschooling?
How many, in various “voucher” schools?
And so it goes; in places where there is a mosque or a temple or a creation museum, there are places where children are being indoctrinated, circumcised, and incubated, until their eventual legal emancipation.
Life in all likelihood is an extremely rare occurrence. Our planet may be the only planet on which Life exists in our entire Milky Way galaxy, consisting of 100 billion star systems. It (Life) is about as ubiqitious as any spontaneously-generated time-piece discovered on a sandy shore can be.
Did Our Lord deign it such, or was Life “created”? It’s a distinction without a difference. GreenAlba may call Him a fleeing or retreating God or whatever she wishes to call Him but she is simply parroting the Line she hears on the BBC & reads in the Guardian & similar organs of state propaganda.
Don’t think this is without purpose. GA’s puppet-masters’, that is.
People that are so impressed with their own egos cannot comprehend something bigger than themselves. A constant battle as they believe they are so wonderful that they cannot believe that something or someone is bigger or better than themselves.
One of the things that comes with leaving religious faith is a recognition of your smallness and insignificance in relation to pretty much everything. It’s not even that difficult to come to terms with. At the same time, you feel part of the larger whole, past, present and future.
Its very interesting that you needed to leave religious faith to recognize these things. Given the vastness of the universe I sort of wonder who doesn’t think that they are not small and insignificant in relation to everything else. And feeling a part of the larger whole past, present, and future? Well that is somewhat irrelevant since we are so insignificant I would imagine. But really, I just don’t get why one must leave religion to feel part of the larger whole. I rather think that people who have religion feel themselves to be part of a larger whole. My personal reaction to these words is that I find it sad that you had to lose faith to sense these things. But since there is so much deception within mainstream Protestantism I suppose I am not altogether surprised.
“Its very interesting that you needed to leave religious faith to recognize these things.”
Not really. Previously I knew I was really small and insignificant but the universe was not supposed to indifferent to me. Now I know it’s indifferent to me, so that makes me smaller and even more insignificant!
“But really, I just don’t get why one must leave religion to feel part of the larger whole.”
You don’t. Not remotely. I didn’t say you did. I merely meant that you can feel part of the greater whole even though you are infinitesimally small and unimportant and even though you’re not religious. Presumably you feel you’re are infinitesimally small by not unimportant, which is good, for you. I’m fine with not being important. 🙂
“My personal reaction to these words is that I find it sad that you had to lose faith to sense these things.”
So you don’t need to be sad, because you merely misunderstood. Or I didn’t say it clearly enough. Blog sites are not the best medium for every kind of communication.
But I know you mean well. 🙂
‘*but* not unimportant’ sorry.
I read my post again and yes, I did express myself poorly! I can see why you thought what you did.
I type very fast. Sometimes I type more quickly than I’m thinking. Mea culpa…
We don’t know that there is no other life, or even other intelligent life. Christianity lacks the Cosmic breadth that the Ancient East has. Even Islam called God, “the Lord of the Worlds”.
Janos
God is in everything, is everything, whatever is the controller of the universes is defined as God by us mere mortals.
My question has always been, what is it about human earth dwellers that He would even want to deal with our idiocies?
We don’t know that there is no other life, we don’t know that there is either. It’s extremely unlikely. Life is the Cell. The Cell is Life. Let me know when they figure out how this Rolex generated itself by itself.
Nothing I said denied God. How does life being widespread throughout the Universe equate to the non-existence of God?
It does only in a demographic sense perhaps, as in the kind of people who are interested in the Cosmos, Science, and Science Fiction are a different demographic than the Religious. And even this is very vague since many Scientists are believers or at least agnostics.
This is one of those issues that deserves a long essay. But briefly:
You’re correct, you didn’t deny God, but you cheapened His creation. Do you really believe that life is that plentiful & widespread?
I could be wrong. Maybe there are a series of steps, such as the ‘RNA world’ hypothesis, under which life began its ascent & culminated in what we now define as ‘Life.’
It would be totally not unexpected to me if scientists eventually detect tantalizing signs of life on some other planetary bodies, maybe even within our own solar system. “Simple”, unicellular life could be fairly common in the universe. But I have to say, I have my doubts even on this score.
Moreover, that would be a far cry from life that is self-aware of its own existence in the way that we are, & which contemplates God.
If God peppered the universe with self-aware technologically advanced beings, then that just strengthens the belief in His non-essentiality but if He seeded life on only a few worlds — & that not even self-aware, but in primitive forms — then faith is strengthened & so is denial, & that seems to be /His plan\.
” she wishes to call Him but she is simply parroting the Line she hears on the BBC & reads in the Guardian & similar organs of state propaganda.”
Do feel free to provide a list of the BBC’s pronouncements on religion, Tate.
While you’re writing it up, you could listen to the BBC’s Songs of Praise’ It’s very popular with your age group.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006ttc5
Next Sunday, don’t miss In a special episode, Kate Bottley visits the sacred Christian site of Lourdes in France and meets a British man who believes he was miraculously cured there.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0008khl
How many of the separatist organizations, such as CAIR, are breeding incubators for the future anarchists in the country?
So are you suggesting that conventional educational customs are working? Judging from the general lack of even basic reading comprehension, science, and math skills that seem to be a prevalent outcome among so many public education wards it seems hard to believe they are.
Tucker had a few choice words to say about ‘McCain’s Ghost’ today, who claims he ‘resigned.’ I laugh at Bill Cristal’s & Max Boot’s tears.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=372&v=8-1-iz80u6s
Hey, all you Trump haters, what the heck happened to your big recession? Dow Jones back up over 27000 again.
Maybe the American public is starting to finally realize what a crock of BS the media et al really are and are ignoring it.
People in the know realize that the ups and downs of the stock markets are money creating exercises,
Just hang in there, baby.
Hey, all you Trump haters, – JAZ
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I got a chuckle when it was reported today that Trump said the Feds were a bunch of ‘boneheads’ and the interest rates should be 0 or less.
Remember Trump is a builder and hates having to pay interest on anything.
The Fed is to control interest rates (monetary policy) to enforce the Phillip’s curve, ie balance out inflation vs. unemployment to keep a happy medium. Well, Trump’s economy just blew the Phillip’s curve apart. Low unemployment AND low inflation! The economy is slowing down, maybe, and really good things happen with really low unemployment. If inflation is low, below Fed targets, they should be lowering interest rates to enable even mor growth inside the US.
Gee, low interest rates might even offset some of the effects of tariffs and cause USA growth instead of China growth.
What a thought.
There’s yor ACTUAL problem…Trump’s complete lack of understanding if how an economy functions, and his revealing in his own ignorance.
There’s yor ACTUAL problem…Trump’s complete lack of understanding if how an economy functions, and his revealing in his own ignorance. – Majella
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Quick question, Majella, when you type a comment do you read what you’ve written before you submit it? And if you spot something wrong do you just say “fuck it, they’ll figure it out?”
Insert these words where appropriate:
your
of
reveling
It isn’t until recent years that I have come to realize how dumb I actually am… and this is not false modesty. I am highly educated (K-12, college, and grad school) but whatever success I achieved was the result of persistence rather than innate brains.
Unlike many of you I can’t say that I had a favorite subject. I just plugged away at whatever classes I was assigned to take. I was not distracted by rock n’ roll if it even existed in those days. (Elvis’s career began in 1954-55. I graduated HS in ’58). I WAS distracted by the game of pool beginning around age 13-14 but never in all my years of schooling did I receive a failing grade. I still possess every report card to prove it.
I once took a course in slide rule which was given after regular school hours. I disliked it because I just couldn’t ‘get it.’ I still have the slide rule I bought for that course.
People assume that a person with an MBA in Finance would be good at math but, in my case, not so. Likewise with all electronic devices.
If I lose my internet connection, as I did yesterday, I can not begin to correct the problem myself and must call on friends or neighbors who understand these things intuitively.
In a way I look forward to the day I croak when expectations about my smarts or lack thereof will disappear. I will pass into oblivion with people none the wiser on that score.
So you basically majored in pool.
Well, in the sense that it was my favorite thing to do, yes.
No, Q, you are perfectly normal. The specialty educated folks such as MDs or attorneys are a small minority of the population. Most people either spurn learning or like to learn about everything.
Q-Shtik
“In a way I look forward to the day I croak when expectations about my smarts or lack thereof will disappear.”
Maybe you suffer from Impostor Syndrome. 🙂
I think I’ve always suffered from it in the first five years in any job!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impostor_syndrome
I have come to realize how dumb I actually am – Q.
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As a followup to the confession above I’d like to tell you about today.
I mentioned about having lost my internet connection. I also lost my telephone service which comes via cable and my printer wouldn’t print. A friend, a tenured professor of micro economics (don’t ask him anything about macro…he doesn’t know) at Rutgers came over and got my internet and phone up and running again but couldn’t fix my printer problem. He’s Jewish and I’ve never seen him without his beanie on. I assume he takes it off to shower. That was yesterday. I still needed my printer badly. I arranged for an Optimum technician to come to my house.
He arrived, all 6’4″ of him, and black. Every tech who has come to my house has been black and every one has solved my problem. How do they do this with their inferior IQs? He had an odd accent, possibly Jamaican or some other Caribbean Island. I shook his hand and asked his first name…Anderson. His hands were huge and so were the loosely laced boots on his feet. The SOB was probably hung like a horse…dammit. He got to the crux of my problem in 10 minutes. I don’t begin to understand what the problem was.
” The SOB was probably hung like a horse…dammit. He got to the crux of my problem in 10 minutes….
Q,
…Your post is becoming embarrassing….
P.S. …The crux of your problem notwithstanding…did he fix your printer issue?
A grandfather was talking to his grandson after his first semester of college and listening to all the liberal tripe he had been fed.
He said, very quietly, I want to tell you a story.
I think to be fair, you should give up your A’s and B’s that you got to some of the poorer students so that you will all get C’s, that is only fair.
The grandson, greatly agitated, said, why should I give up my hard work to get those A’s and B’s to people that did not work as hard or not at all?
The grandfather, smiling, said,
Welcome to the Republican Party!
JohnAZ, that is not the way I heard the story: A young woman was about to finish her last year of college before hopefully landing a job as a teacher. Like so many others her age, she considered herself to be a very liberal Democrat and favored a more equitable tax system.
She was deeply ashamed that her father was a rather staunch Republican, a feeling she openly expressed. Based on the lectures that she had participated in, and the occasional chat with a professor, she was surprised that her lower-middle class father would vote against his economic interests.
One day she was challenging her father on his opposition to higher taxes on the rich. He responded by asking how she was doing in school.
She answered that she had worked very hard to get a 4.0 GPA, in spite of working nearly 40 hours a week waitressing in order to pay for school because her father was unable to contribute anything toward her schooling. She didn’t even have time for a boyfriend, and didn’t really have many college friends because she spent all her time studying.
Her father listened and then asked, “How is your friend Audrey doing?” She replied, “Audrey is barely getting by. All she takes are easy classes, she never studies, hasn’t worked a day in her life at a job and she barely has a 2.0 GPA. She is always going to parties, dressed to the nines, and frequently misses classes the next day because she is hung over.”
Her wise father patted his daughter’s arm and said, “Don’t worry. I’m sure reality will hit when she graduates, and she will have to take personal responsibility for her lack of hard work. She’ll surely struggle to get a job because of her low GPA, and she no doubt will have a mountain of debt to pay back.”
The daughter, far from assuaged by her father’s naïve assumption that America is a true meritocracy, angrily fired back, “She has no debt because her parents pay for her living expenses and tuition. Heck, the mortgage deduction on their second home and the money they save on the low 15% capital gains tax on their stock market portfolio is enough to pay Audrey’s bills. And, she already has a $60,000 job lined up working for a friend of her father who golfs with him at the country club.”
Her father, who barely made ends meet doing manual labor, exclaimed, “That isn’t fair! You have worked really hard for your grades, invested a lot of time, and a lot of hard work! Audrey has done next to nothing toward her degree but she’s got a job and will be making twice as much money as you?
The daughter slowly smiled, winked and said gently, “Welcome to the Democratic Party.”
Until Audrey’s boss figures out she is a dunce and fires her and hires someone with the 4.0 and work ethic.
The gimmes of the Democratic Party, the ones that vote for free everything, are not 4.0 hard working folks. Your story is phony.
In a video on his Twitter account, Beto says that wealthy people and the underclasses should be forced to live in the same neighborhoods in cities “close to where they work.” Why can’t they just leave people alone? Crazy…. Make Bernie Sanders live in Spanish Harlem…..
Beto, that God Damned, Trust Fund Baby, Cock Suck’n Sonuvabitch wants to make me eat corn meal and to live on a God Damned Reservation! Ain’t happening President Grant!
Simple, Beto wants to control everything you do, because he is divinely inspired and so much smarter than you. Just like all the other yahoos on the Democratic dais.
Easy solution, vote them into oblivion.
Beto and Chaz Buttigieg have that school-teacher mentality, always telling a bloke what to do ostensibly because “it’s good for him.” In fact, I think that Chaz is a former school teacher. It takes a certain kind of sick Sonuvabitch to be a school “mom”….
Ok. The EU in Brussels has created some top offices, updating old offices and positions.
Commissioner for a Stronger Europe in the World
Commissioner for Institutional Relations and foresight
Commissioner for an Economy that Works for People
And this is a big one, my favorite:
Commissioner for protecting our European way if life
I shit you not, this is real. The commissioner for protecting our European way of life is in charge of bringing muzzy and african migrants into Europe. Orwell couldn’t have thought this shit up! Hes also in charge of building the new EU army, which will be ‘Gender balanced, welcoming and inclusive.’ Holy Sh#t Putin must be shaking in his boots at the thought of facing off with this EU army. Now are any of you surprised UK wants out of this snakepit? Aha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha aha haha!!
Brh
I wonder how much support for the EU comes from the Globalist network? Remember, the Rothschilds destroyed the Bank of England not too long ago. The U.K. is a prime target for the Globalists, just like the US. They cannot beat these two partners by force, so just take them over by infiltration. I hope we are not stupid enough to fall for the Liberal tripe.
And Putin understands all of this as he knows that Russia is their next target.
‘Gender balanced, inclusive and welcoming’
Sounds like the foundations of a formidable army.
General Pershing, when asked what he’d be looking for in the first AEF units engaged on the Western Front. “Fighters. I want fighters!”
Brh
How do you like it now, gentlemen?
Tariffs are expected to cost American households more than $2,000 per year in 2020, according to a recent report from the National Foundation for American Policy (NFAP).
“When adding the tariffs in effect and the tariffs set to go into effect by the end of 2019, the costs of the tariffs to consumers will be $259.2 billion,” the report stated. “That is, the tariffs will cost the average household $2,031 per year, and will be recurring so long as the tariffs stay in effect.”
That’s just propaganda foisted on the innocent voters by the liberal media in their never ending attempts to make our fearless leader look bad. These people don’t have the clarity of vision or the foresight to look down the road, and see the prosperity that awaits us all under the beneficent gaze of our leader, and the Republican party. We’re only a few more rounds of deregulation, combined with tax cuts, away from prosperity. Recession? You mean like the one we went through after W and the Republicans had their way with us last time? Forget about that (most people did). We don’t need a bunch of doom and gloomers out here trying to piss on our prosperity, and keep us from the life we deserve. Hey, it’s my turn to drive the golf cart!
Let’s change the name of the populist movement to the Constitution Party and leave all the RINOs behind. This is not the GOP any more.
The GOP has never been the “GOP”. There already is a Constitution Party. You’ve never heard of it? Maybe because they have no money for ads and the media wouldn’t take their ads even if they did.
Capt… you do so irony SO well, so DRILY, i would only be a little surprised if you came out as a Pomgolian.
I’ve learned a new word from the Urban Dictionary, thanks, Majella. 🙂
So what do we do about huge trade deficits with China, and the offshoring of our industrial base (largely to China).
If I recall correctly it was part of the Dem platform in 2008 to deal with this issue, but not much was done about it.
Brh
And
We are winning the trade war with China.
Those are good questions, and as far as what to do about the trade deficits, I don’t really know. As far as the offshoring of jobs, I think that once the third world educated itself, and achieved the ability to manufacture, the fact that somebody could produce as good a product as you could in the US and do it at a fraction of the cost, meant that the work would flow in that direction. It’s the old story of evolution, we were replaced by someone who could do the job for a tenth of our wages, and at that point, all things being equal, the only way we could compete would be to work as cheaply as them, and for the most part that’s not doable.
I suspect that with the advent of robotic manufacturing, it may become a moot point as to where things are made. Robot manufacturing would impact China just as badly as it would here, and come with the creation of it’s own set of social and economic problems.
I shouldn’t do this, but I have been pimping a book on here a few times, and I suppose I might as well do it again. The name of the book is “Rise of the Robots”, subtitled: the threat of a jobless future. Written by Martin Ford. I find it to be a profound book with a lot of insights and implications, and after recommending here several times, I’m surprised that nobody has mentioned it, so I assume nobody picked it up. Do yourself a favor and read it, you won’t be sorry you did.
I will. Thanks for the tip, Captain.
Robots replacing people on the jobsite is an issue I never took seriously, but it looks I ignored it at my own peril.
Brh
Exactly – which is why Capitalism is a nightmare ultimately, just a race to the bottom, the bottom being some Calcutta filled with street people. The Sabbath (the Economy) was made for Man, not Man for the Sabbath. Any idea who said that, Cap?
OMG, do I hear a Dem complaining about increasing taxes. Aren’t you the one that wants to tax the hell out of everyone to afford all the ridiculous spending being proposed. BTW, the debate is on tomorrow night, everyone ready for a good laugh.
Sorry, just because I mock Republicans doesn’t mean I’m a Democrat. I don’t much care for most of their members either. I don’t want to pay any more taxes than you do, I just hate seeing corporations, financial or otherwise, and their owners, get away with the things that they do. Most people here seem to agree that Wash. DC is corrupt, so who do you think that that corruption benefits? You or me? If the billionaires and corporations aren’t saving billions on their taxes, they must be more stupid than I thought. They buy the legislation they want, including tax givebacks.
Go ahead and watch the debates, those people are just as bad as those pricks on the Republican side. As far as I’m concerned, anybody who believes any of these guys are honest is a fool.
Was not aimed at you, aimed at pkrugman
So, you’re a big fan of China and think we should be doing business with a nation that is clearly trying to kill us by flooding us with fentanyl?
The recent bust in Mexico had enough fentanyl to kill 5 billion people. You read that right. 5 billion.
Their human rights record is abysmal, and that’s an understatement, but your insane hatred of Trump has twisted your little mind so much that you have aligned yourself with a murderous regime.
” I get that you want a special dispensation so that your figurative is less serious than my figurative, so feel free if that’s your sense of entitlement. ”
If anyone wants a special dispensation , it is you.
Typically , I don’t come here every day , sometimes not even every week.
But , when I return , it is to find that seemingly every day , or close to it ,
you have been here to insult , ridicule , and to all appearances, to de – legitimize and marginalize, the religious.
( Indeed , so much so , that one would have to work to some significant degree to overlook it or not notice it. )
You want a special dispensation to not have to justify doing so.
You don’t want to have to present a coherent and good reason as to what possible greater goal there could be in doing that.
You don’t want to have to explain what , ” Good ” means when you say , ” Good ” , or what , ” bad ” means when you say , ” bad ” .
Or , finally , on what premise or premises are based your , ” justice ” , when you say , ” justice. ”
You want to set yourself up as Grand Inquisitor or prosecutor , and the other as defendant , where you get to make all the accusations and get to ask all the questions , and the other only gets to — and it is to be assumed , a priori , is obliged to — provide answers.
Well , any Kindergartner knows , or should know , how that arrangement always works out ;
( And if Kindergarten wasn’t sufficiently explicit enough , there is always Sun Tzu’s , ” The Art of War ” to fill you in on the explicit mechanics of it. )
The defendant loses.
Naturally.
By design.
Granted , there is no shortage of those who want such a dispensation. Far , far more , than not.
Unfortunately for you , I am prepared to give Fascists and Communists some slack.
I am prepared to give Blacks and Whites , Yellow’s and Semites some slack.
I am prepared to give Protestants , Jews , Moslems , and Pagans some slack.
But Atheists , Secular Humanists , and one occupation ; Police , will get no slack from me what so ever.
You are the defendant in my book . Not some Medieval Bishop.
You damn well are obliged to explain what it is exactly you are offering to people.
And what is fucking nonsense is your suggesting that it is nonsense to suggest your policies need offer anything , or explain anything.
You won’t get to say that your belief is not a belief , and then get to come here daily and trot out a hell of a lot of pronouncements that sure as hell do look like they would be reflective of some kind of belief.
Mr. Kunstler has never once addressed me directly. Let alone have we had any heart – to – heart talks.
So I have no idea why he hasn’t dropped the ban hammer on me.
I have only a guess .
And my guess is that he and I share one outlook ; That what is good for the goose , is good for the gander .
Not unusually , or infrequently , do you come here to insult and ridicule the religious , and to suggest , not subtly either , that their motives , propensities , and goals are criminal.
My guess is that he feels that if you can dish it out , then you can take it.
” I’m fed up arguing with you. ”
Sure .
You could drop the cute comments about religion , and especially since supposedly you don’t think religion is of much significance or account anyway.
And , in an instant , I would be gone. Beating horses that are already dead isn’t one of my favorite hobbies.
The British Empire isn’t quite dead yet apparently . Like the United States , your claim or insinuation is always and ever that someone else started it !
” I’m fed up arguing with you. ”
No , you are fed up with my not turning the other cheek .
You are fed up with my not laying down to be ass – fucked.
By the way , the latest round of cat – fighting began a week or so ago , not because I have any interest whatever in your soulless – nothing – is – there – supposedly – self.
I was quite miffed with SoftStarLight.
I think we are well past the point where , ” turn the other cheek ” does any favors to anyone , or is appreciated.
Kesa, I have two beefs with this comment of yours:
1. I can’t figure out who you are talking to or about.
2. Your leaving of a space between the last letter of a word and a comma. Seriously, pick up any book or newspaper and see where the comma is placed. Do you think they are wrong? Do you think they accidentally forgot the space? These are rhetorical questions. Ditto for all these spaces you are inserting associated with quotation marks such as ” I’m fed up arguing with you. ”
Right. Where to start. Maybe with the idea that I come on here to annoy religious people. So let’s look at the topics in my comments under one single post, where you took exception.
Opening ceremony of the Gotthard Tunnel
Schizophrenia/psychopathy
Brexit/EU
Pre-collapse prepping
Souls (started by a non-religious friendly jibe to Finca,
which, naturally, SSL and Janos had to jump in on, when no
discussion was necessary or sought).
Dementia
Aristocracy/universal suffrage/democracy
Hong Kong/China (for which I got a gold star from Exscotticus, no less!)
The Sacklers
Antisemitism
Crimes of passion
Dating sites
Homicide rates UK/US
Reduced Muslim fertility rates
Rotherham grooming gangs
And then, a comment from Janos:
“Atheism is a quasi religion in its strident belief in no God.”
Now that’s a conversation I didn’t start and didn’t want to start, but if Janos keeps coming up with this stuff, I’m entitled to respond and your sensibilities don’t remove that right. This thread eventually included musings by Christians on the anticipated joy of watching honest disbelievers fry.
I’ve told you before that I don’t discuss religion with people in my offline life (here am I justifying myself to you, as if you were God, wtf!!!) – unless it’s brought up by someone else and that’s an absolute rarity. And I NEVER criticise their beliefs, in the unusual case that they have any – I just smile and let them talk. I did once have to pretty much admit to my kids at one point very late in life why I didn’t go to church any more. I didn’t volunteer the information and would rather have kept it to myself, because their conclusions should be their own, but if they ask, they ask. One had long since abandoned any religious beliefs although she says she’s glad I took them to Sunday School.
I already told you that my daughter who lives nearby has a son she’d have liked to take to Sunday School (she’s not religious enough to have continued going to church beyond her teens). His father was adamant that he wasn’t going to have his son indoctrinated into anything religious and I did my level best to encourage him to let her take him because a few years in a crèche/Sunday School wasn’t going to indoctrinate him and he’d be able to make up his own mind in due course. He seemed to accept my suggestion and then didn’t, which is his way. And you think fathers should take precedence always so there we are.
Now, your issue with values. I have values. Everyone I know has values. Most of the people I know are either not religious at all or have some vague belief that there’s something but not enough belief to do anything active about it, like go to church. And I didn’t choose them for that. They’re all just friends acquired entirely independently of my knowledge about their beliefs (why would I ask?). Friends acquired because I worked with them, studied with them, or lived across the road from them.
You refuse to accept that morality can exist without religion, yet it patently does, just not to your satisfaction. I would suggest that the human search for ethical meaning is one of the things that has given us religions in the first place. That and our inability to get our heads round our own mortality. That doesn’t mean that a lot of people aren’t amoral or immoral, but that’s always been the case even in more religious times, and arguing numbers doesn’t change that.
I don’t have any difficulty at all in normal everyday life in distinguishing between good and bad. Or between injustice and justice (which I don’t equate with what goes on in courts, although quite often they are happily synchronised when thieves, murderers and rapists end up in clink – other times all you have to be is poor or mentally ill).
You can get definitions of ‘good’ from any number of moral philosophy sources, so you don’t need an unoriginal, clumsy one from me. But generally I think we can distinguish between a genuinely moral act grown of empathy and a ‘moral’ act for which you expect a heavenly reward or hope to avoid a hellish punishment. But even flippin’ kindergarten kids don’t have that much difficulty in learning that whacking your classmates or refusing to share toys isn’t good, simply because their parents have told them so, without reading any moral philosophy or religion at all, and they’re learning empathy because that’s mostly the context in which their parents teach them such things (‘you wouldn’t like Tommy to do that to you, would you?’). The complicated stuff can wait till the age of reason.
And religion isn’t that much help with vexatious moral issues. An example (if you can invoke Ted Bundy, I can invoke something blessedly rare too).
Let’s consider a 12-year-old girl raped by her father (and we can bear in mind your axiom that no-one but no-one has any right to interfere with the right of parents to bring up their children as they wish, if that is your preference). Let’s say this girl is impregnated by daddy. Let’s say we can’t involve teachers or social services because you despise them both. And probably doctors too. Let’s consider that the mother thinks you shouldn’t force a child to have a baby when she’s been raped by her father, but mothers are supposed to STFU and submit to fathers.
Now, I can quote you one good, public Catholic, Jacob Rees-Mogg, who’s never so much as changed a nappy on any of his six children but will tell you this child should be made to have her father’s baby. Because Catholic dogma. Jacob doesn’t think rape is an excuse for choosing not bring a child into the world, even if you make that decision when it’s an embryo you can hardly see.
Me, I look at it from a moral point of view, rather than a dogmatic point of view, which means including context. And I say that, morally speaking, this girl’s situation isn’t remotely the same as Billie Jean King having an abortion so that she could carry on playing tennis. And I say the girl should be allowed to have an early-term abortion as soon as she finds she’s pregnant, if that’s what she wants, because anything else would be monstrous, from more than one point of view.
I don’t know which you agree with, but I don’t think you’ll find the answer in Scripture particularly. And making her give birth to the product of her father’s rape wouldn’t be ‘justice’ either. I’d hope I wouldn’t have to explain that.
But rest assured that I don’t give a f*ck about you not ‘turning the other cheek’ because that’s not what it’s about. And rest equally assured that I intend to avoid the subject as much as possible, because that’s what I prefer. You may take that as capitulation if you will – if you’re happy, I’m happy. But I will not ignore comments with my name in them as provocation or where commenters slag off people in general because they don’t fall in with their religious beliefs and blame them for all of society’s ills. Society’s ills are a lot more complicated than that.
And I should add that if my grandson had gone to Sunday School and eventually became a Christian, I wouldn’t have put him off that either. It made my mother happy and if it were to make him happy too that would be fine. I’d just hope he never asked me what I believed myself, as I wouldn’t want to put him off whatever is his own road.
Do not confuse God and his Word with the Man contrived creation called religion. All Christian religions are bastardized editions of what Jesus espoused in his ministry. Folks need to choose their own interpretation of what God intended. Even the Bible was written by Men.
Every time I look up at night and contemplate the majesty of the heavens, I dream of a wonderful God who is responsible for everything.
I have a lot of sympathy with that way of looking at it, JohnAZ.
So basically this is just a big embrace of the relativism that characterizes this Age. Essentially you suggest that everyone should believe in everything and nothing at the same time. Whatever feels good or right in ones on mind. I can’t help but remember the verse in the Bible that describes the hearts of men in the last days. That was one of the big characterizations of the society of the last days too. Every man would pursue his own hearts desire and his own beliefs despite Truth and Eternity.
Here you go again. I’m not saying what anyone else should believe. I’m telling you what I believe.
If you want to believe in the inerrancy of a set of books that aren’t even internally consistent, that’s your right, SSL.
I could give you a list of exactly contradictory exhortations from the Bible, but I’m not going to waste my time, yours, or anyone else’s.
But if someone tells me I’ve got a religious belief in the opposite of religious belief, I’m going to put them right. 🙂
Hopefully I won’t need to for a long while, or maybe I’ll practice tolerance to calumny and straw men.
What’s your view on the dilemma of the unfortunate 12-year-old, then? My guess is you’ll be a relativist on the matter, in which case I applaud your morality.
And what makes you think doing something you know is the right thing always feels good? That’s more religious straw-man nonsense. Doing what feels good is hedonism, not morality.
And maybe you could think about it as being the embrace of relativism that characterises being a moral adult.
Unless you think Billie Jean King and the raped 12-year-old require the finely tuned thinking of a robot who’s read the Bible.
Well my comment was actually directed to John but your points provide fodder for those you don’t wish to hear from or tire of hearing from. My points were specific to John’s call for everyone to embrace spiritual relativism. I just tire of you always suggesting the someone like me approaches every single situation with the same exact solutions when all situations are different. As if because I believe in God or that there is a purpose that somehow that traps me into specific sets of behaviors even though everything changes every second of the day. Eternal principles are just that. They supersede the moment. But each moment has its trials and one must exercise wisdom in approaching them. I am getting the impression more and more that your idea of religious people in general is just generic and you just automatically believe they operate in unison like a borg hive mind or something. The reality is that everyone is different and whether or not there are eternal truths most people do what they want anyway.
“I am getting the impression more and more that your idea of religious people in general is just generic and you just automatically believe they operate in unison like a borg hive mind or something..”
I absolutely don’t think they’re generic – anything but. If they were generic they wouldn’t have been arguing with one another for centuries. And worse.
My parents were tee-totallers. Drink was bad; pubs were bad; even playing cards was bad – even if no money was involved! We weren’t allowed to play outside on a Sunday. And I got the evil eye because I won a set of playing cards one time.
And at the same time my husband’s Catholic family (those that were still Catholic or still compliant) would step straight out of the church and into the pub.
Different strokes for different folks. But you didn’t tell me your thoughts about the unfortunate 12-year-old’s dilemma. So I’m guessing you agree with me really!
And I didn’t ‘do what I wanted anyway’ – I did what I thought I should, almost always. The imprint was deep – and still is. 🙂
Well that’s because the scenario you describe is extreme.
And by the way, Kesa, I know you know that families like that exist.
I once did a replacement job teaching (I know, another set of reptiles – I’m quite the Venn diagram) in a school where one of my classes included a little boy who stood out a bit because he was always a bit grubby and smelly, and his fingernails were always mucky.
I knew nothing more about him when I attended a parents’ evening and met his father and ‘mother’. The father looked like someone from the 1940s and a bit severe, although he was perfectly civil. The ‘mother’ looked a lot younger, but very frumpish.
I found out, after mentioning them to colleagues (because they definitely came over as odd) that the ‘mother’ was actually the daughter of the father. They lived together as man and wife while the actual wife (her mother) lived in the house with them and the little boy. I don’t know who was the boy’s actual mother and I don’t suppose anyone in the school did either. Nor do I know if, in the absence of any actual proven harm being done to the boy, Social Services knew anything about them. All I could see was that he wasn’t very bright and was abnormally reticent. And had no friends.
So when I hear someone say no-one should ever interfere with the right of parents to bring their children up the way they want to, I have rather more misgivings than you.
Yes, children should be raised by the State, with lots of volunteer help from Trannies and Gays. Your example proves it.
Sorry, are you approving a family set-up, free from state interference, where the father is fucking his daughter and presenting her as his other child’s mother?
Are you actually, genuinely off your trolley?
I’d give you the Straw Man Award of the Year, but I know how full your mantelpiece is already.
My words were ‘rather more misgivings’, i.e. it’s not clever to make blanket assertions. You don’t know how much of this kind of thing goes on and certainly went on when kids were isolated from any potential help and parents could do whatever they wanted.
Alba you seem to be going off on a tangent a little but I think you understand him perfectly well. Unfortunately their are abusive parents in the world. There are myriad examples. And there are abusive actions at all levels of society at all points in time. It sucks that each instance can’t be prevented and never will be. But you are also talking about intervening in families so naturally that is cause for concern. The specific examples you are bringing up are no brainers in terms of the need for intervention. Ideally, that would be the job of the extended family and local community and not the State. Families are the building blocks of society . No family is perfect or the same and an empowered and entitled State may desire to intervene in families who adhere to unpopular religious traditions or political beliefs and not just those where there is clear evidence of abuse.
but not enough belief to do anything active about it, like go to church. – GA
================
My father-in-law said church was for people with nothing better to do, like maintain his home, property and car, which he did obsessively.
He said the same thing about people who sat in recliners and read books and magazines.
He was also turned off by people who went to a gym when there was so much at home that they could get their exercise doing.
My mother used to tut about neighbours washing their car on a Sunday instead of going to church – she’d harrumph about it being their ‘religion’!
I don’t see anything wrong with being comfortable when reading a book. 🙂 One of life’s quiet joys.
You are so lazy.
Seems like you inherited your OCD (in your case grammar) from your Father in Law.
That was wonderful humility above where you said you weren’t very smart. Probably a bit excessive and of course you nihilism is unfortunate. You have good commonsense about ordinary things of life. You are a brick in the Wall against the Coming Night and the creatures thereof.
Orban, the great Jaeger
https://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/viktor-orban-among-the-christians/
Stray thought, we may get China’s social credit system? Is that really so alien to us? Isn’t our already well established “credit score” something like that? As well as as our extreme credentialism, needing “degrees” to do anything?
You really can’t do anything without your credit score now and if its not good and/or your Instagram posts offend you probably won’t be able to get a job. And even a lot of blue collar jobs require certifications, etc. So perhaps we developed China’s social credit system for them.
Could be. In any case, bureaucrats and commissars all think alike. Obsessed with the control of other human beings; social engineers who desire to use their wrenches and screwdrivers on our beings. And they employ those who would use them on our bodies if need be.
Here you go…. Beto, what an Asshole….
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LgY55Hz7JRg
Is this the appropriate place to insert this little gem, on the anniversary of the Remember the Maine excuse me Yellowcake excuse me again Tonkin Gulf pardon me once more – ah, 9 / 11 festivities?
http://www.todayscatholicworld.com/mossad-agents-911.htm
And for the reading-impaired, the following audio-visual clarification:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r-GppBpUeYg&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR1YHvQHTvMEajsuk1YmWw293IbiTbAVmWg6aAdLhBj4EkRhENvx7tvfwXs
It is written in the Koran that Allah is the Lord of the Worlds. But this isn’t a revelation unique to Islam. This knowledge was given to us before the advent of Islam.
KJV Hebrews 1:1-2 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
KJV Hebrews 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
I can’t say that this is definitive proof that we are not alone in the universe, however, I personally believe that it is highly unlikely that we are in fact alone. There very well could be vast numbers of worlds teeming with life.
Cool. Missed that. Maybe I haven’t hung out with the King James enough. That’s the kind of thing translators change for no good reason. I think it’s important.
If you like the idea, read the C.S Lewis Trilogy “Out of the Silent Planet” (also the title of the first book I believe). I tried to get you to read it before, but I know you have a lot on your plate.
Nigerians are Sub-Saharans. Sub in this case simply meaning below or south of the Sahara. It is semi-official way of referring to the Negro Race. But yes, ethnicity and nationality are important, not just race. Whites of very close culture and ethnicity savaged each other in the 20th Century – i.e Britain and Germany.
Hitler loved England because he felt it was at least as Germanic as Germany!
Yes, I do have Perelandra and I’ve been meaning to read it but I always have distractions. I’m glad you reminded me and I’m going to make a point to.
Great. When you were (briefly) defeated by Volodya and I came to your defense, I was reminded of the book again. I felt like “Ransom” (the protagonist) who debated the Unman who was trying to corrupt the Queen of Perelandra with his intricate arguments and guile. If he had succeeded, that Planet would have fallen just as Earth did.
Odd situation in South Africa; nativist violence against immigrants — mostly immigrants from Nigeria — continues. Turns out, black SAfricans consider themselves a cut above and seperate from the rest of sub Saharan Africans, saying Nigerians are ‘from Africa’, implying their SA homeland is removed and elevated, while Africa itself is to be looked down on.
It reminds one of the Liberian Colony in the 1840s, when American blacks, many but not all former slaves themselves, lorded it over the native African population for 140 years, holding all the nations wealth and top political positions, and forcing Africans to work on their vast plantations for no pay (virtual slavery) Apparently they considered their African hosts unworthy of citizenship or recognition.
Brh
Nigerians though are not sub-Saharan so is it possible that the SA Blacks feel like Nigerians are a different ethnicity altogether? It is a bit of a strange thing but if anything it seems to show how important ethnicity and culture really are. And its just more evidence that mixing is just not a good thing.
It goes without saying, these black Americans who founded Liberia, some very wealthy, some of mixed race, were not what you would call ‘Woke’, in fact they had a low opinion of the native black Africans they found on the continent. (To begin with, there was a tribe of cannibals that needed to be cleared out) There were battles, in which American blacks, with superior weaponry, western tactics and advanced engineering, prevailed.
Brh
Wow! Are you suggesting that repatriated Blacks had an advantage over the native Africans? I know when I mentioned hypothetical repatriations on past posts I was told that I was a supporter of crimes against humanity. Even though it was all just a hypothetical discussion. And you are saying that in the real world the repatriated, at least in this cast, must have been able to bring with them some of their material belongings, etc. Which I totally supported in my hypothetical comments before.
You were proposing (hypothetically) repatriation NOW, SSL. I recall asking you which current African populations you would choose to displace to make room for them and how it should be managed logistically, in terms of existing jobs and homes. I didn’t get a reply.
Well Alba how do you expect me to put a detailed plan for such a large venture that requires so much consideration together in such a short amount of time? Since the hypothetical was condemned so quickly I am not sure it was even worth moving to the R&D stage :-).
The logistics were only the secondary issue – the first is really about your right to foist millions of people on populations that aren’t familiar with them and vice versa, and haven’t been asked (possibly).
I remember reading a rather trite statement one time that said “If it’s a problem, it has a solution; if it has no solution, it’s a fact and it just has to be faced’.
So I reckon some of your overarching issue will eventually be found to be ‘problems’, amenable to solutions (even if they’re not obvious or acceptable now) and other parts will be found to be facts that you’ll just have to live with.
And when I say not ‘acceptable’ now, I’m not talking about some of your more outlandish solutions, but just about people eventually taking responsibility and divesting themselves of some of the victimhood. That can only come from within their community.
But I’m reminded of how many times I’ve seen classes of black children in African countries – classes with many more children per teacher than is the norm here, and with hardly any facilities or equipment. And they’re sitting, behaving, interacting and eagerly learning.
Primarily because they see it as a privilege, not coercion. Which, for them, it is. So it’s not about skin colour.
I don’t mean that to sound like a cliché representing the whole of Africa as one undifferentiated blob. I mean village schools in not particularly well off areas.
Alba: By what right do you people seek to replace the Native Peoples of Europe with Africans, Middle Easterners, and Asians?
And it IS happening. Western Europe will be majority non-White by the next century. And in some places, well before.
Janos, I was limiting myself to your African American community, which isn’t an immigration issue, but born of a white Christian population who imported slaves.
I don’t condone endless immigration into your country and have said so many times.
So who the actual f*ck is ‘you people, you ignoramus?
“Progressives”
Ok so White Christians imported slaves. That was bad so you called it out and that’s all good too. Now I personally find it to be curious that we are not going to talk about all the parts and pieces of that trade because I am fairly confident it involved slaver Africans and Arabs too. Not to absolve Whites of course. But just a point to keep in mind when you are looking to blame a people group for some dysfunction in society allegedly due to the Atlantic Slave Trade.
Why do you keep doing this, SSL? We’ve discussed the multi-faceted slave trade before. We all know who was involved, on multiple continents. I pointed out the difference between immigrants and your black former-slave community in terms of why they are there, as a response to Janos’ ridiculous accusation that in discussing your black community I’m defending mass immigration. My country (of white Christians, as opposed to benighted black slavers and evil Muslim traders) is guilty too. It’s OK to point out that that’s not the same as your current immigration woes. Or it should be.
Which is merely t say the obvious, which I shouldn’t have had to say to Janos, that it’s not their fault they’re there. Or the fault of any other cabal you’re fond of blaming.
Other slaving nations have their own consequences to deal with. This happens to be your heritage. I’m not smug about my nation’s involvement – our then elite got away with a lot because they didn’t bring that many of the slaves back to the UK – they made their fortunes from them in the West Indies. But if you go to Bristol, which was a massive slave-trading centre, you’ll find a Whiteladies Road and in London a Black Boys Lane. The evidence remains, even if the slave descendants don’t.
Your ancestors are the same as my ancestors – there’s no smugness coming from me on the matter. Facts are facts.
““Progressives”
Well that wouldn’t be ‘you people’, then, it would be ‘those people’.
Yeah, it was a whole movement, SSL. By the 1840s there were tens of thousands of free black people in the US, many of them quite wealthy and successful. Also it had the backing of the US govt, which provided logistics i.e. ships, funding, farm implements, weapons and so on.
One unfortunate circumstance is that black Americans did not adapt well to the African climate or the African diet, and many died. Initially the mortality rate was high.
Then again, the 20,000 or so ‘Confederados’ — ex Confederates who left the US after the Civil War to establish a colony in Brazil — had a rather high mortality rate too.
Brh
The Blacks and Browns if they triumph over us may end up deporting us all to Brazil. If they are even that kind.
Captain Spaulding, thank you for the book recommendation. Entrepreneur Andrew Yang’s presidential campaign directly addresses unemployment due to robots replacing humans. Yang is gaining support. I would vote for him if he is the nominee.
Negative. His universal basic income of $1000/month could just as easily be $1,000,000/month. He could turn us all into millionaires overnight and refuses to do so!
One million a month would be an onerous cruel problematic sum to spend locally. It is much easier to spend one thousand dollars in one’s own community. Yang’s UBI proposal shows his compassion through realistic investment in local communities. Businesses would boom because people would not have a manageable amount of monthly basic income.
LOL. You clearly didn’t catch my point. The amount makes no difference. You can’t create wealth out of thin air. He’s either stealing it, borrowing it, or printing it—none of which is sustainable.
There are about 200 million adults. His subsidy would require 200 trillion a month. And this will come from where…?
Even the terminology demonstrates a lack of understanding. Basic income? An income is something you EARN. What he’s talking about is welfare for all.
Yep!
>>> One million a month would be an onerous cruel problematic sum to spend
LOL. Definitely the quote of the week. I’m gonna tell this to every poor person I meet.
That’s a typical janet riposte.
You still have the major problem of :
Where are you going to get the wealth, the capital pool to pay everyone UBI.
Also, what is the value of something built by robots and algorithms. Is the net value zero due to no human involvement?
If the goal is to just print dollars and give them to everyone, the value will be zero.
Might as well mail out a valued credit card at the beginning of every month,
Or better yet, just give everyone a house, two cars, food, a TV, a computer, all the same.
Just visited Denver, Colorado. It’s landscape is starting to look like what I just described. It is a Mecca for Millennials.
Apartments after apartments after apartments, all the same. It reminds me of propaganda pictures of Moscow in the fifties bragging on the US as a nation of private ownership.
That is what the Libs are really after with UBI. The end of private ownership ie Communism.
Yang is a typical nerd from the high tech industry who does not have a clue what is in the real world. I understand these folks because I used to work with them.
California is made up of these people, they are the power in California. That explains a lot.
Well the planet is limited in space and resources. Christians don’t get that – nor do most traditional people anywhere and of any religious persuasion. Following the command in Genesis to be fruitful and multiply is simply a recipe for destruction at this point. But yes, Whites need to have more babies. People with two digit IQ’s will think there is a contradiction here. Those with three digits will be able to see that there is not.
Would you rather the people be out in the streets than in their identical units? As if the suburbs and all those houses is some kind of aesthetic wonderland. But yes, it is nice to own one’s own if possible.
Is there enough food and energy to feed and warm all Americans? Yes. This is real economics. After everyone is taken care of, then we can worry about who gets more via the economic competition known as Capitalism.
Needless to say, the more people we bring in, the less all will have. Not to mention the social chaos and societal disruption caused by racial and religious strife.
Capital centralizes and therefore wealth as well. Marx was right, obviously. Even Capitalists don’t disagree with the obvious, they love it! They must be checked and controlled, but not destroyed – for the good of all.
Unfortunately he believes in very little border enforcement and unceasing immigration (illegal and legal) of millions (or billions) so I doubt UBI will help anyone once the entire system is tapped out by unlimited newcomers demanding all of the benefits of citizenship as soon as their first foot hits American soil.
Robots replacing humans
This goes along with my theme that the US — as it actually exists — seems less and less a place built for human beings to live in.
Brh
I agree with you Brh. In your own way you are reaching the same conclusion that others of us have come to from different points of view and different issues. Our society isn’t for Us anymore.
You may well be a disciple in the school of Rasputin if not Hillel == Janos
A simple search in google
https://www.google.com/search?q=Bush+dinasty+plantagenet&oq=Bush+dinasty+plantagenet&aqs=chrome..69i57j33.14054j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
brings a ton of articles linking the Bush dynasty to Plantagenets.
Family Relationship of
Edmund Plantagenet
(1244/45–1296)
20th Great-grandfather to
George W. Bush
43rd U.S. President
Bushes are actually Earls of Percy, Earls of Northumberland, most directly associated with the Plantagenet dynasty, one of which through his biological father is Prince Harry.
And there are very serious reasons to believe that the marriage of George W. Bush with Barbara Pierce (Americanized Percy) is the result of a conscious and strangely successful effort of the clan to unite the two branches of this genus, which broke up after one of them, Thomas Percy, became a member of the gunpowder conspiracy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunpowder_Plot
For the Anglo-Saxon world no less important is the connection between the Bushes and, accordingly, the Percy clan with the Plantagenets through the founder of the second generation of earls, Percy Jocelyn de Louvain, the closest ally of the English king Henry I Beauclerc, whom the Black World Project still considers the most terrible traitor in its history.
And the split in the black world project that George H. W. Bush arranged before our eyes is very reminiscent of the wedding of the son of William the Conqueror (Bastard) Henry I with the great-great-granddaughter of Yaroslav the Wise, the granddaughter of the last Anglo-Saxon king from the Wessex dynasty Edmund Ironside, and the daughter of Saint Margaret of Scotland and Malcolm III of Scotland whose history is dedicated the Shakespeare tragedy “Macbeth”.
Meanwhile, the Vikings (2013 TV series) and The Hollow Crown (TV series) going through different channels in all countries of the world where there are a large number of Anglicans or Orthodox Christians, in combination with the “Games of Thrones” show that the Norman theme and the War of the Roses are recognized as the main ideological factor in the modern World War Roses not just by me.
And the fact that the Bush clan has been involved in this war for many centuries gives a split of the black world project a truly world-wide historical significance.
Assuming each descendant of Mr. Edmund Plantagenet had two children…
The total number of descendants alive today would be 2^23 or 8.4 million people.
Are you assuming that each offspring would live forever?
F for your math.
Ex, we have the money and the right to give it away. Perhaps you missed my point that Yang is gaining support, beating Donald Trump by EIGHT points in a recently released survey from Emerson Polling.
According to this poll, Yang has a better chance of defeating Trump than Bernie Sanders, Kamala Harris and Elizabeth Warren.
>>> Ex, we have the money and the right to give it away.
Dude, math is your friend. We can’t even pay off our 20+ trillion dollar debt, but you think there’s some Uncle Sam piggy bank jar that can pay out 200 trillion a month?
Dude, 2016 is calling and they want their fake polls back.
As everybody knows, the slaves weren’t really people, as one commenter above wrote sardonically. That is the common view of how the writers of the U.S. Constitution saw their negro slaves. (In other words, the lot of them were irredeemable white supremacists.) But should we judge these men on the basis of what they knew, how they saw the world, & its practical problems, or on the basis of what we know now?
Both James Madison & Alexander Hamilton were both very well acquainted with the ways of the African, the former being a Virginia slave-owner, the latter having been born & raised in a Caribbean-island slave society. If most whites were disenfranchised, why shouldn’t the negro be? This kind of thinking that we should judge the founding generation of Americans by our standards leads directly to the tearing down of the statues of the giants of our national history. Ingsoc would be happy.
Stacy Abrams, former candidate for governor of Georgia, said that Stone Mountain, Georgia is on her hit list to be sandblasted into oblivion & most of the pundits on the MSM talk shows enthusiastically agree. You ever seen the copy of the Constitution at the Library of Congress? You can snake by it like at Lenin’s Tomb, but the writing is long gone. It’s just a brittle parchment-looking thing so why not dishonor it as well?At best, it’s a tourist attraction, like the parchment-looking Lenin.
Who could have ever predicted the destiny of the American Nation rested in the hands of an overweight negro lady with an IQ of 80?
Brh
Ha ha ha! Thanks for the laugh. In truth, it’s quite a scary thought.
Wikipedia:
UBI = Euthanasia of extra population while transferring the state resources to drug dealers in employ of Dem political machine.
Some years ago Theodore Dalrymple had an excellent piece on these same issues of language: “The Gift of Language”, from 2006 I think.
In addition to identity leftism’s violent allergy to any notion of a common culture, common language, or general excellence, Dalrymple notes that a lot of the linguistic relativism JHK finds so baleful has roots in ideas from evolutionary psychology, often associated with Pinker and Chomsky.
Their argument in a nutshell is that language of *any* sort is already so fantastically intricate that the value of spelling, grammar, or eloquence is of minuscule-to-zero significance alongside the sheer evolutionary marvel represented by language’s bare existence. (Though Chomsky, at least, is skeptical of how language could have evolved by any means now understood.)
Since this implies that the distance between the muteness of animals and the ability to express and receive simple wishes in some primitive pidgin language is immensely larger than the distance between said pidgin and, say, Tolstoy, it has become very fashionable on the Left: anyone who demonstrates, let alone values articulateness of speech or writing is now simply an elitist or pretender who does not care about what “really matters” in language.
And what “really matters”, apparently, is just the bare minimum or least common denominator.
So here we have the elevation of mediocrity (or sub-mediocrity, or “solidarity”) above articulateness, capability, and care. Dalrymple’s arguments are more subtle though, and worth reading.
This love-of-mediocrity or mediocrity-as-genius notion goes right along with the “empowerment of victimhood” which also got brought up here (so to speak). Even more than mediocrity, victimhood, weakness, and woundedness are rapidly becoming the coin of the realm, the preconditions of “genuine experience”. Another diabolical inversion, and another aspect of the Slave Revolt in morality, although now conveniently rendered fully God-free and principle-free. (Thus does the beast throw asunder all remaining puny restraints.)
Yes, the simple gruntings of a Greta Thunberg are treated as Revelations by these degenerates. She is their Autistic Idiot Goddess.
How’s your colloquial Swedish, Janos?
That’s not to say that Life isn’t Suffering – it is as so many Great Men have said. All seeds and skin as Ramakrishna said. But suffering doesn’t make one a hero per se. Even the beasts suffer. Those who suffer more aren’t more holy by any means for the most part. Great suffering can make one more empathetic – or it can make one into a monster of selfishness. Your Choice.
Those who eschew luxury and convenience to live as ascetics are the real Heroes at the existential level. As long as they do so in search of Truth and not just to show off or be anti-social. Diogenes lived outside and radiated like a god. Those who tried to imitate him ended up looking like bums.
As the Greeks said, A man alone is either a god (small g) or a beast. I’m afraid it’s easier to go downhill into beasthood then upwards into godhood.
“Diogenes lived outside and radiated like a god.”
Was that after he’d urinated, defecated and masturbated in public or before?
“Those who tried to imitate him ended up looking like bums.”
Well, yeah…
Haha, too funny…
But where was the poor soul supposed to have defecated, urinated & (well, he didn’t have to masturbate)? He was HOMELESS!
Maybe the Way emanates from the dregs of the streets of San Francisco?
He could have gone round a quiet back street, at least. And he was only partly homeless. Didn’t he sleep in a ceramic urn or something? Not that you’d want to pee in that obviously, but he didn’t need to do it in the main street in front of everyone. They must have had bushes here and there, even in Ancient Rome. 🙂
Not Rome, Athens. Duh…
In fairness, my greyhound radiates a bit once she’s done her business too. She almost does a hop, skip and a jump. 🙂
Well, that’s why they called his school of thought, the Cynics, meaning ‘dogs.’
To complete the thought, he lived with dogs in that barrel or urn or whatever. Thus his ‘school’ was known as the ‘cynics’, greek for ‘dogs’.
We didn’t really hear as much about Greta Thunberg as I thought we would, figuring the media would be all over her during her time in NY. David Hogg’s fame lasted at least a full month, backed as he was by Bloomberg $$$.
Brh
Hey BRH, what was the name of that little lady who was on the lady’s USA soccer team? And what was she famous for? The mind wearies. Even more recent than David Hogg’s fame, famous for some sheite move or another.
‘wahmen’s’ not lady’s. Excuse me.
That’d be Megan Rapinoe.
And she’s not totally forgotten. Yes, she successfully fulfilled her assigned mission, which was to do her part in embarrassing the President, then fade away. But last week we all went for a last dinner before the women in the household took off for Europe (wont see them til Thanksgiving) sitting next to us was an obvious lesbian couple, each wearing a ‘Rapinoe’ T shirt. This was a joint that had a dress code and a collared shirt was at least required, but apparently nobody dared asked these dykes to leave. You kidding me, who needs the trouble?
Brh
sitting next to us was an obvious lesbian couple, each wearing a ‘Rapinoe’ T shirt. – Tate
=============
with short hair and no jewelry.
You forgot ‘comfortable shoes’, Q.
So it begins…
DOJ rejects Andrew McCabe’s appeal to avoid prosecution
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gW-6H9LMXB4
Uh oh
California has passed a rent control scheme.
This means the ‘homeless crisis’ — tens of thousands of vagrants living on city streets — is about to get worse. Much worse.
Brh
You know, economics is not *just* about predicting the past perfectly.
It’s also about predicting the future imperfectly.
You’ve hit the sweet spot.
Homeless problem is going to get worse, but not because of the rent control scheme (which I totally oppose). Most of the homeless are addicts and I see them all the time. I can’t even walk parks and trails as I used to because they are scary and have trashed everything. This is in San Diego which is closely following SF and LA.
The rent control scheme is no surprise. The state has been angling for this and when it gets on the ballot it fails. Of course, this time voters didn’t have any say. It is disgusting to say the least. Just another nick in the armor on the way to full blown socialism.
He’s going to be out before transition.
I’m really excited by the Dem lineup. 2020 is a game of sacking the quarterback.
Expect to see coalitions form before our very eyes
Joan of Arc, ladies and gentlemen.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpptVrll-bo
For something entirely different, a wonderful surprise is The Ralph Nader Radio Hour podcast, which is fast paced, featuring intelligent people (that’s high IQ), and scintillating subjects. Check out episodes 284-287.
Joan of Arc?
You think she’s a little evil satanic witch?
That’s what William Shakespeare thought of real Joan of Arc.
Witches are howling in impotent rage feeling that their millennium rule is coming to an end.
Is that Amy Goodman? Hard to believe she’s still around.
Somebody needs to ask Greta some science based questions, hard ones, like ‘Do you know how electricity is made?’ or ‘How do people in the north country heat their houses in the winter?’ and ‘How long will it take for people to freeze to death in their houses if the temps drop to 0 and no fuel is available to keep warm?
Then move on to questions about the laws of thermodynamics.
Brh
But those aren’t hard questions, they’re stock for high school these days I think.
No, both Amy Goodman and young Greta are similarly driven and are the opposite of quitters. Greta will one day stand on ramparts and give the command that blows up a thousand dams…
Where were her handlers during the interview? You notice she has them everywhere she goes. Hillary had prompts on a screen on her podium while debating Trump. But that was for a different reason (wine.)
And why hasn’t Amy Goodman dyed her hair blue yet?
In terms of the host’s central thesis, imagine a world where adults spoke as clearly and intelligently as this child.
Remarkable and frankly electable.
For SSL & the others who rant about ‘illegals’:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxK-N0pVVgg
Yes without illegals, who would be stealing identities, illegally voting and such…?
Senegalese man pleads guilty to decades-long identity theft of dead U.S. citizen
And isn’t it strange that this news item doesn’t appear in the NYT or WaPo or SnackPack’s other “scintillating” news sources.
“He a good boy. He did not do noTHING!”
(Spoken with Senegalese clipped erudition.)
…but was he working for a Trump property? Probably not, because he appeared to have citizenship.
…and Brexit myths exploded.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HDFegpX5gI
There’s no myth that the EU has “evolved” from a free trade zone to something far more insidious.
The UK has lost control of its borders, which is the most fundamental aspect of any nation.The UK has lost control of its courts, with distant EU courts now the final word on the limits of UK freedom.
The fact that withdrawing from the EU is so politically difficult is a sure sign of the EU’s ever-expanding control over its member states. Note how easily the USA was able to renegotiate its trade agreements with Mexico and Canada. No fuss, no muss, no world-will-end drama.
So my question is. If illegal aliens are such a wonderful and integral part of society then why does it matter that Trump employed them? Isn’t it the contention of these people that it’s a human right that a person just be allowed to walk right across the border and get a job anywhere? If Trump didn’t employ illegals then he would be a racist. Oh but that’s what he supposedly already is even though he is obsessed with improving the lot of Blacks and Hispanics and allowing for increased legal immigration.
White New Jersey Parents Sue Fertility Clinic After Noticing Their IVF Child Had Developed ‘Asian Features’
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/New-Jersey-Fertility-Clinic-Mix-Up–Baby-560101391.html
Reminds me of a joke:
Negro child with two heads
Pregnant woman in a white suburban neighborhood for a month wakes her husband at night screaming, and then complains that she had a dream in which she gave birth to a little Negro with two heads. The poor husband is exhausted to the limit, and now comes the time of birth, the husband running from corner to corner in the hospital, and the nurse finally comes out with a strange expression on her face and says:
– Congratulations you have a son!
– Negro?
– Negro!
– With two heads?
– No one.
– Oh…. Thank God!
Uh, never mind.
Janos – your perspective?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5_mNm-tzuM
Trump isn’t a racist – and that’s just sad since that’s why we elected him. But of course, racist means one who loves their own race in our book, you know, just like normal people do. Like the Maori do. Why is that alright for them but not for us?
That’s the crux in a very few words. Concision is a sign of genius after all.
Watching the Dems last nite — do any of them realize a big bad world exists outside our borders, and none of them much care about our identity politics and how much free stuff will be given away to voters and illegals alike? What’s their foreign policy going to be? Have they thought about increasing Chinese hegemony in Asia, a resurgent Russia, a hostile Iran? And why isn’t the media asking questions about it? “I’m against war”, and “Climate change is our biggest enemy” isn’t a foreign policy.
Brh
The Dems are a bevy of children. They live in an isolated world where fairies flit and unicorns trot freely about. Everything they try to do turns into BS because they are so immature. Nadler with his I’m gonna get him no matter what, and not knowing when to quit, every single candidate acts like they do not have a clue what is really going on in the world. Number one is their belief that an infinite pool of capital exists that can be spent in a myriad of ways to create votes. Never mind any solid solutions to the growing list and scope of problems that face the USA and the world. Can you even imagine one of these children across the table from Un, or Putin or Xi.
I keep remembering who the source of this is, the globalist neo-Liberals that are trying to make the US into a namby pamby country. This group of nincompoops is exactly who they want to be running.
Yes they’re infantile, and go wherever the baby carriage is pushed. These days, lacking any coherent leader, it’s the MSM and far Left that seem to be doing all the pushing. A media saturation bomb on the evils of paper towels would have every Dem in the land clammering for common sense laws banning them.
bevy of children or betrayers of them?
pizzagate.
yr first line says what is sooo true about
libs
the rich
those born to so called privilege
albas
Homicide rates UK/US
Reduced Muslim fertility rates
Rotherham grooming gangs
to be continued?
I’m almost looking forward to watching President Warren dealing with hard, steely eyed nihilists and Machavellians like Xi and Putin, as she gives them schoolmarmish lectures on tolerance, the evils of capitalism, and being nice to one another, as they listen and look on incredulously.
Brh
Forget about Warren. She ain’t gonna make it.